X360 is not Next-gen ? I think not

[Symtex]

This is a few picture of PGR3 taken in-game.

http://img516.imageshack.us/img516/6715/americanmuscle7fo.jpg
http://img373.imageshack.us/img373/8539/11250507575yh.jpg
http://img373.imageshack.us/img373/381/11250507590uz.jpg
http://img373.imageshack.us/img373/246/11250508111hf.jpg
http://img373.imageshack.us/img373/2520/11250508149zj.jpg

[Eidorian]

Everything is really shiny? I've noticed that on a lot of Xbox 360 games. It's either too shiny or plastic coated.

Other than that, they're screenshots. It's a racing game. How much different is 3 compared to 1 & 2? I mean the gameplay.

[raggedjimmi]

Cars are easy to look realistic. hell the GT games impress me. now, if something can render a sunset over the Pennines then i'd be impressed. :)

[Vader]

Do you have to drive in that view all the time?

[clayj]

Do you have to drive in that view all the time?No, there are a number of different camera views you can toggle through. And you can swivel the camera while you're driving using the right thumbstick.

PGR3 and CoD2 are in close competition for my favorite 360 game so far...

[AP_piano295]

...Besides the cars doesnt look that great to me.

[Symtex]

...Besides the cars doesnt look that great to me.

Open you eyes. The car model are the best ever. It put GT4 to shame. Each car has 80k polygones. I have GT4 at home and the car model doesn't compare.

[AP_piano295]

Open you eyes. The car model are the best ever. It put GT4 to shame. Each car has 80k polygones. I have GT4 at home and the car model doesn't compare.

yes but the images look blurry and pixilated
edit: Pixilated is wrong I think its just blurry

[Symtex]

yes but the images look blurry and pixilated
edit: Pixilated is wrong I think its just blurry

It was taken with a digital camera. It's not even a direct capture. Of course it's going to be blurry. Do yourself a favor, go to Best Buy, take the X360 controller at the kiosk and pop-up the PGR3 trailer. You are going to understand what i'm saying.

[shadowmoses]

Its total rubbish when people say 360 isnt next gen, i saw it in store today and it is very much next gen, the graphics are outstanding and that is saying something, as if you ask me the xbox still looks pretty damn good, games like Halo 2 and Doom 3 look unbelievable for a machine from 2001,

Shadow

[raggedjimmi]

so to be next gen then it has to have good graphics? in that case my desktop PC has been next gen for over a year now :P

Next gen to me means good graphics (bottom of the list, im a gameplay whore), new controller features, medium can store more than previous gen medium.

[munkle]

Looks pretty impressive to me...but my idea of gaming is sudoku.

[Symtex]

Looks pretty impressive to me...but my idea of gaming is sudoku.

You have to try the little game called Hexic HD. Made by the guys who created Tetris. Went to bed way to late to play that game.

[dubbz]

Camera shots of console games always look like shiat to me, regardless of how they look in person. So, meh.

Besides, the truth about the graphics power of this (or any of the other consoles) won't be known until later in its lifetime. That's how its always been.

[RobHague]

Well, seems pretty impressive to me. Though i didnt really doubt that the X360 didnt have much graphical Oooomph.

We'll see how it goes... I think i might wait for the PS3 and REV to arrive and then pick a console. :)

[iGav]

the first pic looks good, and the in car from the McLaren looks amazing... :eek: the others though... look... look like computer games.

[GFLPraxis]

As I've been saying; most of the 360 launch titles are PC/current gen ports (Call of Duty 2, King Kong) or games that started development on GameCube or XBox (Kameo, Perfect Dark). That's why it doesn't look so good. Games that were ground-up designed for 360 are the ones that will look next gen. Like PGR3.

[2nyRiggz]

if the 360 aint next gen...then its doing a great job pretending to be one....have u guys seen COD2?.....point blank for a early cycle game its wonderful....imagine whats to come....


Bless

[TheGimp]

I have PGR3 and can attest to the above screeenshots falling well short of what one can expect to see on even a mid-level 23" HDTV. One of the most outstanding things to me about the tracks is the variety of detail which is crammed into every stretch or turn of every street in every city. Of course this is tastefully done, for there are several stretches with more sparsely distributed architecture, such as those of the Nuerbuergring.

PGR3 has some next-gen gameplay features, but my time spent here addressing unfounded arguments would be better spent actually playing the games.

I just returned the $29 foldup chair which I bought at the sporting goods store next to the Best Buy where I camped out monday night, and applied that money to the purchased of Condemned, which is about to be ripped open the minute after I hit "post".

[2nyRiggz]

you will enjoy that game....it great. make sure use the signs....you will really feel it when u smack the crazy people with it.


Bless

[eva01]

Those images make my head hurt. Too bright :(

[Counterfit]

the first pic looks good, and the in car from the McLaren looks amazing... :eek: the others though... look... look like computer games.
http://www.macdesktops.com/index.phtml?Picture=1680&res=TRUE

Does anyone know what kind of Caddy that is? My guess is a Cien ;)

I didn't like PGR (oversteer in a F/F Mini? riiight :rolleyes: ), and I didn't even try 2. I'm waiting for Forza 2 :D Man, I still love that game.

[AP_piano295]

It was taken with a digital camera. It's not even a direct capture. Of course it's going to be blurry. Do yourself a favor, go to Best Buy, take the X360 controller at the kiosk and pop-up the PGR3 trailer. You are going to understand what i'm saying.

sry didnt know thought it was just an ingame didnt know it was with a camera.

[noelister]

You have to try the little game called Hexic HD. Made by the guys who created Tetris. Went to bed way to late to play that game.

Yeah, I find myself playing that game more than I thought:)

[maya]

None of the demos in store can even do the X360 justice as it would shine in HD, and I am not sure a store like Best Buy or even WalMart would have this demo on an HDTV set for consumers to try out before buying. I could be wrong though. 1080i, HDMI and widescreen crazy. ;) :)

Some of these issue might hinder the post-processing of the game to look cheesy. :)

[GFLPraxis]

None of the demos in store can even do the X360 justice as it would shine in HD, and I am not sure a store like Best Buy or even WalMart would have this demo on an HDTV set for consumers to try out before buying. I could be wrong though. 1080i, HDMI and widescreen crazy. ;) :)

Some of these issue might hinder the post-processing of the game to look cheesy. :)

Best Buy and GameStop have the demos (King Kong, Call of Duty 2, and Kameo) on HDTVs, 1080i.

[buryyourbrideau]

As does wal-mart. the store by me has a sign above the demo TV that says you are watching the games in HD.

[illegalprelude]

i dunno. call it what u want but the 1st Xbox graphic wise was inpar with PS2 generation and GC generation and if anything more advanced (although imho, it lacked any quality games minus a few) but 360 so far is not so much next gen. I dunno. From what ive seen, its just not so next gen when compared, read this article Next Gen Comparison (http://ps3.ign.com/articles/668/668446p1.html)

[Scipio]

Talk about a fanboy. PS3 will crush this in terms of power, games, features, and overall performance.

[buryyourbrideau]

Talk about a fanboy. PS3 will crush this in terms of power, games, features, and overall performance.

umm that was a fanboy comment you just made. haha.

the 360 hasnt even shown its potential yet, as a lot of the launch titles were PC ports. give it some time, it will show its kahones.

[Scipio]

Ha ha, not so much. I don't own any consoles. But looking at the specifics in terms of raw power, features (Blu-Ray, 7 wireless controller support), and future-proofing technology (1080p for those of us who already have the HDTV's to support it), not to mention full backwards compatibility with all other PS and PS2 games gives the PS3 a very solid reign as king over the X-Box 360. That's not to say the 360 isn't a decent console. But obviously Microsoft rushed this release (crashing, overheating, lack of truely next-gen games, not to mention reports from developers of the console itself who say it was released when it wasn't ready). It's also obvious that none of the games out there take advantage of what 360 has to offer (which is pathetic in and of itself considering the time that they've had to develop these games) And by the time they do...PS3 will be making all the buzz and the 360 will be forgotten in the media spotlight. If only Sony had the XBox live infrastructure, then they would make a serious killing.

[raggedjimmi]

Ha ha, not so much. I don't own any consoles. But looking at the specifics in terms of raw power, features (Blu-Ray, 7 wireless controller support), and future-proofing technology (1080p for those of us who already have the HDTV's to support it), not to mention full backwards compatibility with all other PS and PS2 games gives the PS3 a very solid reign as king over the X-Box 360. That's not to say the 360 isn't a decent console. But obviously Microsoft rushed this release (crashing, overheating, lack of truely next-gen games, not to mention reports from developers of the console itself who say it was released when it wasn't ready). It's also obvious that none of the games out there take advantage of what 360 has to offer (which is pathetic in and of itself considering the time that they've had to develop these games) And by the time they do...PS3 will be making all the buzz and the 360 will be forgotten in the media spotlight. If only Sony had the XBox live infrastructure, then they would make a serious killing.

Hehe you make out the PS3 to be the be-all end-all gaming machine. backwards compatible with 2 generations? cummon the rev is mustering up backwards compatibility going back to the 80's.
If you're taking developers rumblings seriously then perhaps you should look at all those developers dropping support for the PS3 and picking up support for the Rev?

As for me. I'll criticise and judge what I know about the PS3 and Rev all I want but I'm reserving final judgement. but from what is going on in the real world, PS3 *will* have the worst online experience (non-centric etc) and less support than the Xbox (who have seemingly picked up a lot of dev studios) and Nintendo's offering.
*fanboy-proofing; if the PS3 is good and has a nice price then i will get one, ditto if the Xbox gets free online and more games in my taste*

[Scipio]

The be-all end-all gaming machine would be a console that plays every game from 1980 to 2015, have 16 wireless controllers, play games at 64x FSAA, 2000 fps, at UHDTV resolutions AND have free online gaming. Then again, I'd rather have one of those holodecks from Star Trek.

As for "the Rev" (which I assume means Nintendo Revolution)...I can already play any nintendo game on my Treo 650...so that negates that for me. I can play the SNES and N64 games on my computer...so big whoop there. That being said...I still do play those games because I love them. I think Nintendo is great, but it can't compete with either the XBox or PS on any level right now. I don't know what Nintendo has in store for "the Rev" so I can't comment on it. All I know is what I've read and heard about the PS3 and the 360. That being said...backwards compatibility with 4 bit games and backwards compatibility with one of the largest (if not THE largest) 32/64 bit game libraries are completely different things (seeing as you're comparing NES to the original Playstation).

[GFLPraxis]

The be-all end-all gaming machine would be a console that plays every game from 1980 to 2015, have 16 wireless controllers, play games at 64x FSAA, 2000 fps, at UHDTV resolutions AND have free online gaming. Then again, I'd rather have one of those holodecks from Star Trek.

As for "the Rev" (which I assume means Nintendo Revolution)...I can already play any nintendo game on my Treo 650...so that negates that for me. I can play the SNES and N64 games on my computer...so big whoop there. That being said...I still do play those games because I love them. I think Nintendo is great, but it can't compete with either the XBox or PS on any level right now. I don't know what Nintendo has in store for "the Rev" so I can't comment on it. All I know is what I've read and heard about the PS3 and the 360. That being said...backwards compatibility with 4 bit games and backwards compatibility with one of the largest (if not THE largest) 32/64 bit game libraries are completely different things (seeing as you're comparing NES to the original Playstation).


Wow, you're really behind the times about the Nintendo Revolution, aren't you? We're talking about backwards compatability with every NES, SNES, N64, and GameCube game, and on top of that the possibility of Sega games as well.

He's not comparing NES to Playstation, he's comparing N64 to Playstation and GameCube to Playstation 2.


And on top of that, please don't brag about illegal emulation, thanks ;)

I think Nintendo is great, but it can't compete with either the XBox or PS on any level right now. I don't know what Nintendo has in store for "the Rev" so I can't comment on it.

...what?

For the Revolution; have you seen the controller on that thing?
And what do you mean can't compete on any level right now? The GameCube outperforms the PS2 easily.

[Spock]

As for "the Rev" (which I assume means Nintendo Revolution)...I can already play any nintendo game on my Treo 650...so that negates that for me.

I would really like to see Your Treo play some Gamecube games You should post some screenshots. I think Microsoft is doing just what Sony did with the PS2 they released the 360 first and they are going to have a game base when Sony and Nintendo come out. Also i like Nintendo, they focus more on gaming than anything else.

[GFLPraxis]

I would really like to see Your Treo play some Gamecube games You should post some screenshots. I think Microsoft is doing just what Sony did with the PS2 they released the 360 first and they are going to have a game base when Sony and Nintendo come out. Also i like Nintendo, they focus more on gaming than anything else.

LOL!

Actually, he very well could try to post something like that. I saw a guy who posted a video of his GameBoy Advance playing Super Mario Sunshine at about 2 FPS. I suspect it was probably done by loading a video of him playing Super Mario Sunshine onto the GBA and playing it from there.

I'd like to see the N64 and SNES games run, too. If he has a really fast model he might make SNES emulation, but the screen's resolution is lower than the SNES's so it'd be very compressed.

[AP_piano295]

Of course in the end revolution isnt in HD which means that graphicly the revolution cant compete. Also dont give me the I dont care about graphics I care about the gameplay, hate to break it to you but in many cases graphics are what push gameplay by opening new abilitys and options. If the revolutions controler works out to be hugely popular and sucessful than they might take the market. I just dont think the controler thing is going to work out, I think it will be fun untill the novelty wears off which wont take long. Then nintendo will be left with a system that is, no matter how you slice it not next gen. Because in my opinion none of the systems are next gen without HD.

(im not sure if the reports that rev is not HD are true I just dont see how nintendo could be that stupid, then again their last system didnt even have internet so I might be overestimating them)

[harveypooka]

Can we get some more pics of non-racing games?

[GFLPraxis]

Of course in the end revolution isnt in HD which means that graphicly the revolution cant compete. Also dont give me the I dont care about graphics I care about the gameplay, hate to break it to you but in many cases graphics are what push gameplay by opening new abilitys and options. If the revolutions controler works out to be hugely popular and sucessful than they might take the market. I just dont think the controler thing is going to work out, I think it will be fun untill the novelty wears off which wont take long. Then nintendo will be left with a system that is, no matter how you slice it not next gen. Because in my opinion none of the systems are next gen without HD.

(im not sure if the reports that rev is not HD are true I just dont see how nintendo could be that stupid, then again their last system didnt even have internet so I might be overestimating them)



But for those of us that don't have HDTV's, the Revolution will look great. And it does have 480p, which looks pretty good from what I hear. Yes, it's not HD, but not everyone has a HDTV.

And the GameCube not having online actually makes sense when you think about it. NES had an online network. SNES had an online network. N64 had an online network with betas and demo downloads, email, chat, streaming music, an online magazine, file sharing, downloadable content, etc, etc.

All of them bombed out.

Then Nintendo and Sega came out with a broadband adapter and Phantasy Star Online, an online game. It didn't really take off. Therefore Nintendo made the logical conclusion that online gaming wasn't ready yet.

Unfortunately for them, it would become big by the end of the console cycle.


As for the controller's novelty wearing off; if it's good, then when the novelty wears off, it will become standard and using a 360 or PS3 controller will feel old fashioned.

[Counterfit]

umm that was a fanboy comment you just made. haha.

the 360 hasnt even shown its potential yet, as a lot of the launch titles were PC ports. give it some time, it will show its kahones.
It's cojones :p

[illegalprelude]

IMHO, i think the Revolution will be the last thing Nintendo puts out. More handhelds, sure councole? the end.

We already know its going to be the cheapest so reason #1 we know it wont compare. Its none HD, its not going to support HD or Blue-Ray. The controller, IMHO is a gimmick. Just like the DS. "Touch to Playyyy" omg, my PDA is touch based, woopdy and slap me in the face. The new controller...how the F am I gonna play my Racing game with that or an FPS. I need more then 7 freakin buttons. Will it work cool with In house games that Nintendo pushes? sure. the avg. studio is gonna be like "lets just design it for the regular controller". So I think thats just already dead.

Maybe to be, I love high tech stuff so the PS3 offering HD, 2 outputs, eliet surround sound support, Multia Media features via, diff. Card Inputs and such is a huge deal what Nintendo isnt offering me that.

You say backwords compatibility, I dont own an HD tv and surround sound to go play Star Fox or Pong from SNES but Final Fantasy 10's backwards compatibility and Socom 3 will still be sweet on the PS3. Even if I didnt own an

[GFLPraxis]

IMHO, i think the Revolution will be the last thing Nintendo puts out. More handhelds, sure councole? the end.

Not gonna happen. Again, Nintendo is like Apple. Even though they have the smallest marketshare, they are also the most profitable. The GameCube is the most profitable of the current gen systems, because
A) The system is sold at a profit, versus the XBox and PS2 that are sold at a loss
B) Most of the games sold are first party, which nets more profit

Nintendo had more profitable quarters than Sony and Microsoft put together.

As long as the Revolution is profitable, EVEN IF it gets third place, Nintendo will be fine.

We already know its going to be the cheapest so reason #1 we know it wont compare.

HOWEVER; the GameCube was $100 cheaper than the PS2 and launched one year later. It was more powerful. The Revolution is cheaper than the 360. It will launch as much as a year after. It might be pretty close, especially since it won't have to support HD, and won't have to have Blu-ray like the PS3 because not having HD means less space needed on the disk.


Its none HD, its not going to support HD or Blue-Ray. The controller, IMHO is a gimmick. Just like the DS. "Touch to Playyyy" omg, my PDA is touch based, woopdy and slap me in the face. The new controller...how the F am I gonna play my Racing game with that or an FPS. I need more then 7 freakin buttons. Will it work cool with In house games that Nintendo pushes? sure. the avg. studio is gonna be like "lets just design it for the regular controller". So I think thats just already dead.

You need to think ahead more. This is the perfect FPS controller. Nintendo already demoed it running Metroid Prime (which uses quite a lot of buttons).

Firstly; the Revolution controller has 8 buttons, an analog stick, and a D-pad if you count start and select and don't count Home. Use the D-pad as buttons like in Metroid Prime, and you have 12 buttons.

The sensors allow for 360 degrees horizontally and vertically for tilt, doubling as two analog sticks, plus detects where on the screen you point and whether you move it closer or further.

Secondly, and more importantly; GESTURES. For example; instead of needing a reload button, point it in the air and pump to reload. Instead of a melee button, thrust the controller forwards.


Someone mapped the controls from Halo to the Revolution controller; if you make Melee attack a gesture, it doesn't even use all the buttons!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/deathbyanyname/haloonrev.jpg

For comparison:

http://www.the-nextlevel.com/news/0405/Halo2_E3/Halo2_demo_pix/Halo2_E3demo17.jpg


FPS is definitely playable.

Racing? A button for accelerate, analog or D-pad for steering, B to decelerate, Z1 and Z2 for sliding if required. Alternatively, tilt the controller for steering. Anyone who has to ask how you can play a racing game on the Revolution...that kind of a question is just ridiculous.

[michaelltd]

Also dont give me the I dont care about graphics I care about the gameplay, hate to break it to you but in many cases graphics are what push gameplay by opening new abilitys and options.

And the Revolution is not going to have great graphics?

The Revolution will have a graphic boost over GameCube. Nintendo has said that it is a given. They are doing more than that on top of it.

Sure, the Revolution will most likely not be as graphically powerful as the other two systems, but the difference will be extremely moot when it comes to gameplay-pushing graphics.


The controller, IMHO is a gimmick. Just like the DS.

Many have felt that the DS was a gimmick before it came out, but it has really taken off and there have been some great games to come out for it.

Yes, we will see some gimmicky games that use the input device, but there are also going to be some great ones.

[raggedjimmi]

And the Revolution is not going to have great graphics?

The Revolution will have a graphic boost over GameCube. Nintendo has said that it is a given. They are doing more than that on top of it.

Sure, the Revolution will most likely not be as graphically powerful as the other two systems, but the difference will be extremely moot when it comes to gameplay-pushing graphics.




Many have felt that the DS was a gimmick before it came out, but it has really taken off and there have been some great games to come out for it.

Yes, we will see some gimmicky games that use the input device, but there are also going to be some great ones.

Nintendo has said the Revolution will be powerful, Developers are saying the Rev is just as powerful as the 360 and the PS3. Nintendo also said the Rev has 'monitor output'. monitors these days have a minimum of 1024*768. Maybe im putting 2 and 2 together and coming up with 10 but meh. If I'm playing games that look better than Metroid Prime then I will be intensely happy. I'm a gameplay person after all. Hell I'd probably play more retro games than Rev games (perhaps. we haven't seen Rev games yet, at all) because of their sheer brilliantness.

Yes the DS had gimmicky features. I remember over the summer I was desperate for games like Nanostray and Kirby to come out. Whilst being good games they just do not compare to Advance Wars, Mario Kart, Sonic Rush etc. from a desperate summer to a glorious winter.

heh and Scipio. playing Roms does not count as playing games. I tried some legal roms (games i already own) on my PowerBook and my Xbox and they just had no soul to them at all. the exact thing that made them classics in the first place. Also, nintendo have said that the retro games will play better than before. nothing has been officially announced yet but there will huge graphical updates with no change in gameplay, the same effect can be applied to any game and is not something simple like an upscaling graphical filter. the old games also have updates like new characters, new features. So whilst your playing games on your, Treo was it? having what could be the worst experience of playing classic games, us Rev players will be discreetly saluting Nintendo for bringing back games that are still unparalleled in gameplay and all round brilliantness.

[savar]

Its total rubbish when people say 360 isnt next gen, i saw it in store today and it is very much next gen, the graphics are outstanding and that is saying something, as if you ask me the xbox still looks pretty damn good, games like Halo 2 and Doom 3 look unbelievable for a machine from 2001,

Shadow

Yeah, I agree. I saw Call of Duty 2 on HDTV at Target, and I had this argument in the back of my mind. While the up-close textures weren't particularly impressive, nor were the interior environments (the typical running-through-hallways-doom-quake-marathon-map), some of the exterior environments had much more detail -- i.e. many more polygons. The difference was definitely noticeable.

But given the other areas where the difference is negligible, I can see why some are disappointed. Its certainly not as radical a jump as, say, NES to SNES, or SNES to N64, etc.

Part of the problem IMO is the tedium of generating huge amounts of 3d content. It seems to me that before most games take advantage of the huge increase in polygon count, we are gonna need smarter tools for designing 3d worlds. A tool where rather than place a table in a room and then stock it with 3d objects such as placemats, silverware, glasses, etc. you click a button that runs a dining room script which intelligently adds a table thats the right size, a china cabinet if there's space, etc.

The biggest problem with 3d games is the fact that so many areas are "out of bounds": doors that never open, trees that are too thick to pass through. I think it would be much smarter to make all those things available and let the player use context to decide where to go. Use scripts and smart tools to populate hundreds of areas that would take level designers months to do by hand, and also write an algorithm for outdoor areas that will create random new areas for you to walk through if you leave the edge of the predefined map. There doesn't even have to be anything out there -- just make it possible to leave the beaten path. The CPU has gotta be there now...I'm hoping gamemakers take it to the next level.

[harveypooka]

Hmmm, the idea of out of bounds areas is interesting but would be a little pointless. If you're playing a story driven game you needs bounds - otherwise people could wander for hours thinking they're going to find something. It would make games a little too realistic I think!

[calyxman]

I don't think Nintendo is going anywhere; they're at the bottom in marketshare and they're still making a profit on their console.

But what worries me is when we talk about next gen, some of us are not thinking of next year, but 2, 3, 4 and maybe even 5 years ahead. Isn't the current console life cycle expected to last 6 or 7 years? A lot can happen during that time so it's better to be prepapred.

That's why I'm keeping the PS3 option open, although I'm also holding a favorable view towards the Revolution.

My other concern about the revolution is the controller. If this thing becomes glitchy or people get frustrated out of using it because it's not as easy as the standard analog controllers of the competitors, then big N may take a big hit in the eye as a result.

That's why I'm waiting until all fighters get in the ring, kind of like watching the Royal Rumble.

[harveypooka]

That's why I'm keeping the PS3 option open, although I'm also holding a favorable view towards the Revolution.

Same, I can't wait for the PS3 as it'll be my first console ever! And the possibility of installing various OS's is very cool. The Revolution is going to be a step in a different direction, it's the only way they can compete. Let's hope we get something different that people still want to buy!

[illegalprelude]

Nintendo has said the Revolution will be powerful, Developers are saying the Rev is just as powerful as the 360 and the PS3.


unfortunatly friend, I dont think you could be farther from the trouth. Nintendo has already established that theirs wont be able to compete with 360, let alone the PS3. There is yet no true test between PS3 and 360 so I dont member reading a single thing about dev. coomparing the two.

From Nintendo Nintendo told the newspaper, "It's not all about having 'turbo power.' Sources (http://www.gamespot.com/news/6125078.html?q=Nintendo%20Revolution) indeed I do provide them :)

In his interview with Morris, Fils-Aime also reiterated that the Revolution will not support high-definition televisions.
"Value has been a key card for us this generation, and we'll continue to play it," Fils-Aime told Morris. "Do I expect us to be at a lower price point than our competition? Yes, I do. Have we determined a price yet? No, we haven't." Sources (http://www.gamespot.com/news/6139583.html?q=Nintendo%20Revolution)

Again, im sure the Revolutin will be a fun toy but I dont see it a next gen system and to me, im a person who likes to push technology and use it for all it has to offer and Revo just isnt offering me that. It will be like my Gamecube, I bought it for Final Fantasy and I own Smash Brothers too. Besides that, I have never touched it. it just offered me nothing.

[GFLPraxis]

unfortunatly friend, I dont think you could be farther from the trouth. Nintendo has already established that theirs wont be able to compete with 360, let alone the PS3. There is yet no true test between PS3 and 360 so I dont member reading a single thing about dev. coomparing the two.

Not true at all. Nintendo never said that they won't be able to compete; quite the opposite. As your quotes state, they said graphics isn't their top priority- heck, they said the same thing about the GameCube, and it was no less powerful.
http://www.joystiq.com/entry/1234000320065895/
In the interview, Jim addressed one question that has been in the back of the minds of many a Nintendo fan. How good will the graphics be with the Nintendo Revolution?

The answer: a “difference will not exist” between the Revolution and its competitors in terms of graphical ability.

While Nintendo has said that graphics is not the most important thing on their console, they have said that it is on the same level as the competition multiple times.

The things Nintendo has said don't really give us a good judgement of how powerful it will be, but "graphics isn't the most important thing" doesn't mean it will be vastly inferior. We'll have to wait and see.


Again, im sure the Revolutin will be a fun toy but I dont see it a next gen system and to me, im a person who likes to push technology and use it for all it has to offer and Revo just isnt offering me that. It will be like my Gamecube, I bought it for Final Fantasy and I own Smash Brothers too. Besides that, I have never touched it. it just offered me nothing.


Well, at this point I just feel sorry for you. You've ignored almost every good game on the platform. So, did you just never look in the GameCube section of a store, or do you just own one so you can tell people that you have one any never play it?

Seriously. Resident Evil 4, Metroid Prime 1 and 2, Zelda: Wind Waker, F-Zero GX, Paper Mario 2, etc? This is offering you nothing? Have you even tried any of the good GameCube games?

EDIT: Just want to make sure you realize I'm not trying to insult you here. I honestly don't understand the mentality. I'm something of a cheapskate; I agonize for hours or days over large purchases, whether or not it will be worth it. I simply can't understand the mentality of spending 100+ dollars for a system, playing two games on it, and locking it in a closet.

[buryyourbrideau]

I totally agree.

Gamecube was able to compete in the game department and the graphics department in some ways.

The Revolution might not step it up all the way in the visual department, however I think their gameplay will be outstanding, along with the library of games they will probably have.

However, for now I am definitely happy with my 360. As you can obviously see in my avatar! :p

[Piarco]

However, for now I am definitely happy with my 360. As you can obviously see in my avatar! :p

Sweet!:D
I'll know by Friday if I get mine in the first wave....

[G5Unit]

I remember reading that the Rev. will look a LOT better than the 360 and PS3. This is because since it will not do HD, the processor can spend more power on graphic detail and textures, along with nicer polygons.

[illegalprelude]

Seriously. Resident Evil 4, Metroid Prime 1 and 2, Zelda: Wind Waker, F-Zero GX, Paper Mario 2, etc? This is offering you nothing? Have you even tried any of the good GameCube games?

EDIT: Just want to make sure you realize I'm not trying to insult you here. I honestly don't understand the mentality. I'm something of a cheapskate; I agonize for hours or days over large purchases, whether or not it will be worth it. I simply can't understand the mentality of spending 100+ dollars for a system, playing two games on it, and locking it in a closet.

well, GC didnt offering anything to me. If I wanted RPG, PS2 had Xeno Series, Final Fantasy, Suikoden, Dragon Quest, Breath of Fire, etc. It has "all" of the Resident Evil Games and such. Plus I have my ultime favorites, Grand Turismo, Socom, Devil May Cry, Tekken, etc. So it didnt really do it for me. Online play is also huge to me.

As far as buying for the two games, at the time, I was at a good job hence I own all the current Gen Councles, games, surround sound and bunch of other stuff that I prolly didnt need.

No longer am I in the same situation, thus holding off on my purcahse and seeing what system will offer me the Most bang for my buck, and thus waiting for the PS3

[GFLPraxis]

Ah yes, found the quote.
http://www.gamestop.com/product.asp?product%5Fid=909073
The Nintendo 64 was a highly advanced piece of hardware. However, because it had such superior capabilities, developers probably felt as if it was a "challenge" for them to produce for it. Because of this, along with complicating software development, N64 gained a reputation of being a difficult system on which to develop games.

Additionally, in response to the demand for new types of entertainment from users in the game trade, the scale of games became larger, and frequently special adjustments to software had to be made. This came back to haunt the developers in the form of development costs and it would not be an exaggeration to say that it made software development more challenging.

This type of problem, if not solved, could have a dramatic effect on the succeess of the game business.

Nintendo decided to focus on solving this issue by creating the Gamecube with the purpose of realizing the highest level of performance and to enhance the productivity of software development. This was Nintendo's vision of what a next generation game machine should do.

Instead of going for the highest possible performance, which does not contribute to software development, Nintendo created a developer-friendly next generation TV game machine that maintained above-standard capabilities.

In order to accomplish this, Nintendo has painstakingly removed the "bottlenecks" which hinder an efficient system. They also introduced 1T-RAM technology, which has a minimum of delays, into the main memory and the Graphics LSI Mixed Memory. Also, secondary cache memory with a large capacity was implemented in the MPU. With this combination Nintendo succeeded at creating reliable functionality that can be used with actual games.


Unfortunately, Nintendo's bad third party support and virtual lack of online support killed off many third party relations.

They actually admitted their mistakes...
http://cube.ign.com/articles/591/591150p1.html

Reggie Fils-Aime, executive vice president, sales and marketing, Nintendo of America: The GameCube as a system has taught us more about the home console market than nearly any other of our systems. We're proud of several of the features including the best wireless controllers on the market and innovative new ways to play including GBA connectivity. As you know, we also have had several award-winning top-selling games, including Zelda, Smash Bros., and Mario Kart, and several more are yet to come.

We're always looking to make our systems unlike any other in the industry. We want to inspire creativity among game designers and game players, and we feel we accomplished it with GameCube. As always, there are always lessons learned. One thing the GameCube taught us is the importance of pleasing as many different types of gamers in the market as possible. For example, the physical design of the hardware itself was a bold attempt by us to do this -- to make a system that is stylish in its own way and that will fit in well with a family living room. In hindsight, the color choice and box design may not have been as helpful in achieving that goal.

Sony and Microsoft both aimed the design of their systems toward the one-color scheme with a purely masculine feel. But with that came their own issues, including constant comments about the size of the systems -- especially the Xbox, which for some time, was teased as being as big as a tea table for consumers in Japan. So, lessons learned for all, I think.

And finally, in speaking directly on what Sony and Microsoft did well -- Sony launched aggressively with a strong third-party line-up, and Microsoft nurtured community with its Xbox Live service.

So Nintendo notes for mistakes;
1) Bad color choice for GameCube, design didn't fit as well in living room
2) Microsoft's XBox Live was really good, they missed out on online
3) Sony had much better third-party support


Looks like they're trying to correct them this time :) Lacking HD may be the new mistake; however, we'll see. So far, it does look like they're internally divided on the issue. And it may not even be a big deal; progressive looks good enough on HD screens that those with them might settle for it, and those without won't care.

[GFLPraxis]

well, GC didnt offering anything to me. If I wanted RPG, PS2 had Xeno Series, Final Fantasy, Suikoden, Dragon Quest, Breath of Fire, etc. It has "all" of the Resident Evil Games and such. Plus I have my ultime favorites, Grand Turismo, Socom, Devil May Cry, Tekken, etc. So it didnt really do it for me. Online play is also huge to me.

To the contrary; GameCube had Resident Evil 4 for a full year before it came out on PS2, and the GC version looks noticeably better.

Seriously, I'd recommend trying out a few more GameCube games. Get some older ones used. What've you got to lose? Metroid Prime is $5 nowadays and is second only to Zelda 64 for the best Adventure game I've ever played. Baiten Kaitos is fairly cheap IIRC and is a good RPG. Fire Emblem is supposed to be very good.

No longer am I in the same situation, thus holding off on my purcahse and seeing what system will offer me the Most bang for my buck, and thus waiting for the PS3


Waiting is probably the best decision for someone with a budget at this point. PS3 is the most likely canidate for my second console, though I'm looking at XBox 360 too if Sony ends up charging $500 or something crazy.

[Symtex]

This place crawls with Nintendo fanboys. Stop hijacking my thread. Nintendo revolution is certainly not next-gen at all. So Nintendo will make yo buy old game you've already baught in the past..lmao !

When NES and SNES was popular, I was playing Sega or Sega Genesis. Even though I enjoyed a few NES / SNES title, I was always a Sega fan at heart.

[MacRumorUser]

So Nintendo notes for mistakes;
1) Bad color choice for GameCube, design didn't fit as well in living room
2) Microsoft's XBox Live was really good, they missed out on online
3) Sony had much better third-party support


1) But the Panasonic Q is a classy beast. Why they didn't release it in Europe or the states. I love mine :D
2) Xbox live surprised everyone, just by fluke they hit a momentum just as people were looking for one (afterall the Dreamcast tried to do it sooner).
3) True. Somthing I don't think will change with the revolution unfortunetly. I will get one mainly for the first party games. I didn't think the DS was anything special until I got one, the new way of interacting with a system really does add to the immersion, hopefully the revolution will maintain this. :)


This place crawls with Nintendo fanboys. Stop hijacking my thread. Nintendo revolution is certainly not next-gen at all. So Nintendo will make yo buy old game you've already baught in the past..lmao !

Chill! What's your definition of Next Gen? It's a subjective statement, a new way of interacting with the screen is just as revolutionary as improved HD graphics.

When NES and SNES was popular, I was playing Sega or Sega Genesis. Even though I enjoyed a few NES / SNES title, I was always a Sega fan at heart.

Arghhhhh so after flaming people because the subject moves to Nintendo briefly, your inert 'SEGA FAN BOY' personna creeps out.

FanBoy behaviour is PATHETIC regardless of which bias it takes. All next-gen systems will have strengths and weakeness - just as current gen machines do. A great game is great regardless of what system it is on.

FANBOYISM is for the insecure who feel the need to legitimise their purchase by putting down others.

An allegiance to any one manafactuer is pathetic, your just one person on the bottom of an endless consumer chain, they dont care about you personally so why be so up their backsides?

I hope to get my 360 this weekend but i'm not hopeful even though its been on pre-order since MAY. But I will also get a PS3 and Revolution for the great first party exclusive games that come out for them.

[7on]

Ah yes, found the quote.
Unfortunately, Nintendo's bad third party support and virtual lack of online support killed off many third party relations.


However, after unveiling the controller many 3rd party devs have been clamoring for the Revolution. I think Iwata is a different president than what Nintendo has had before. Keep in mind that he's only been on-board since 2002. I think Iwata knows Nintendo needs the 3rd parties. Notice how many 3rds are releasing for the DS as opposed to the PSP? Iwata has also made himself more public than the other presidents. I couldn't name any other Nintendo presidents before him even.

Companies aren't entities, it's the companies' leaders that make the company successful. The N64 didn't have the Sony CD drive because the then president made a decision not to have one. Nintendo didn't have a vote among all their employees on the CD. And the lack of the CD cost them Square - and ultimately most of the 3rd parties.

Remember, EA has been quoted that their sports titles will be the first to make use of the Revolution controller.
The Xbox360 is as much next-gen as the DC is current gen. When you have next-gen games also coming out on current gen hardware - not next gen console isn't really nextgen.

[GFLPraxis]

Agreed, I think Iwata will change things for the better. This is Nintendo's first console launch with Iwata as CEO. Hopefully we'll have better third party support.

[Symtex]

Agreed, I think Iwata will change things for the better. This is Nintendo's first console launch with Iwata as CEO. Hopefully we'll have better third party support.

Do you believe in fairy tale ? I think 3rd party support will far and between. no offense intended. The controller is too different. It means company will have to spend more $$ to convert the game to play on Revolution. I salute Nintendo for taking a different approach but taking radical road has been nothing but bad move. (ex N64 with cartridge, Gamecube with proprietary DVD format).

[Sutekidane]

it's a video game. Calm down.

[Symtex]

1) But the Panasonic Q is a classy beast. Why they didn't release it in Europe or the states. I love mine :D
2) Xbox live surprised everyone, just by fluke they hit a momentum just as people were looking for one (afterall the Dreamcast tried to do it sooner).
3) True. Somthing I don't think will change with the revolution unfortunetly. I will get one mainly for the first party games. I didn't think the DS was anything special until I got one, the new way of interacting with a system really does add to the immersion, hopefully the revolution will maintain this. :)




Chill! What's your definition of Next Gen? It's a subjective statement, a new way of interacting with the screen is just as revolutionary as improved HD graphics.



Arghhhhh so after flaming people because the subject moves to Nintendo briefly, your inert 'SEGA FAN BOY' personna creeps out.

FanBoy behaviour is PATHETIC regardless of which bias it takes. All next-gen systems will have strengths and weakeness - just as current gen machines do. A great game is great regardless of what system it is on.

FANBOYISM is for the insecure who feel the need to legitimise their purchase by putting down others.

An allegiance to any one manafactuer is pathetic, your just one person on the bottom of an endless consumer chain, they dont care about you personally so why be so up their backsides?

I hope to get my 360 this weekend but i'm not hopeful even though its been on pre-order since MAY. But I will also get a PS3 and Revolution for the great first party exclusive games that come out for them.

I have all 3 consoles at home so before tagging me as a fanboy you need to relax. I always prefered Sega's console. I never said I hated NES/SNES.

[GFLPraxis]

Do you believe in fairy tale ? I think 3rd party support will far and between. no offense intended.

So far, I've heard nothing but praise from developers.

The controller is too different. It means company will have to spend more $$ to convert the game to play on Revolution. I salute Nintendo for taking a different approach but taking radical road has been nothing but bad move. (ex N64 with cartridge, Gamecube with proprietary DVD format).
Not really; with the controller shell or GameCube controller ports, you can keep the traditional style. If a developer wants to be lazy but not use the shell, they can map analog stick 1 to the Revolution's analog stick, analog stick 2 to the tilt-sensor (which works like a mouse), and map all the buttons to their equivilants.

It's supposed to be the easiest and cheapest to develop games on, as well.


I have all 3 consoles at home so before tagging me as a fanboy you need to relax. I always prefered Sega's console. I never said I hated NES/SNES.
Owning a GameCube that you keep locked in your closet does not make you immune to being a fanboy. You've stated in your own words that you are "Anti-Nintendo", and take every opportunity to bash them. Ease up, man.

[Symtex]

So far, I've heard nothing but praise from developers.


Not really; with the controller shell or GameCube controller ports, you can keep the traditional style. If a developer wants to be lazy but not use the shell, they can map analog stick 1 to the Revolution's analog stick, analog stick 2 to the tilt-sensor (which works like a mouse), and map all the buttons to their equivilants.

It's supposed to be the easiest and cheapest to develop games on, as well.


Owning a GameCube that you keep locked in your closet does not make you immune to being a fanboy. You've stated in your own words that you are "Anti-Nintendo", and take every opportunity to bash them. Ease up, man.

I have to admit that nothing I have hear regarding revolution interest me. I think the controller is a gimmick and will bored me real fast. I will not buy revolution. I will probably endup with my X360 and PS3.

I'm keeping my Gamecube so I can play Zelda next year but that's about it.Once I was done with RE4, There was never anything I really wanted to play.

[raggedjimmi]

Do you believe in fairy tale ? I think 3rd party support will far and between. no offense intended. The controller is too different. It means company will have to spend more $$ to convert the game to play on Revolution. I salute Nintendo for taking a different approach but taking radical road has been nothing but bad move. (ex N64 with cartridge, Gamecube with proprietary DVD format).

just to back up what Praxis was saying and to add my own news... The Rev has more 3rd party support than the PS3. that much is known. we KNOW that the PS3 has lost a lot of support and continues to do so. we KNOW that the Rev has been picking up a hell of a lot of 3rd party support. What happened with Gabe Newell or that Unreal 3 guy? he was the first (and I think only) developer to slag off the Rev controller. so Nintendo rang him up and offered him a dev kit and now he's rolling in delight with it. I forget who it was but its a nice story nonetheless :)

I forgot who it was but somebody here said along the lines of "I like RPG so i didn't get a GC".
thats funny. what was touted as the best RPG since FF7 was a GC release (Tales of Symphonia), with Skies of Arcadia, Batten Kaitos, Paper Mario 2. I'm no RPG gamer but the Cube had a lot of unusual and very popular RPGs. my RPG obsessed girlfriend just cried over ToS. claiming it to be one of the best games she has ever played.
If you like RPG's then I also guess you own a GBA? RPG heaven.

[clayj]

I remember reading that the Rev. will look a LOT better than the 360 and PS3. This is because since it will not do HD, the processor can spend more power on graphic detail and textures, along with nicer polygons.No hi-def on the Revolution?

Oh, dear. Don't they know that this is the year of HD? Or are they just targeting the kiddie market who only have standard def TVs in their bedrooms? No hi-def will be the kiss of death among sophisticated gamers who have very nice home theatre setups.

[Lacero]

If Nintendo is going to sell the console for under $200, something like HD will have to go. I don't see the penetration of HD TVs that great just yet. There are still many many people who have SD sets. And I'm sure Nintendo did their market research.

360 and PS3 tout HD because the consoles are really geared towards the 16-30 crowd, more so than the stable of kiddie games that appeal to Nintendo 5-14 year olds.

Here's to the Crazy Ones http://forums.macrumors.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=35452 (http://www.uriah.com/apple-qt/movies/think-different.mov)

[benpatient]

and future-proofing technology (1080p for those of us who already have the HDTV's to support it)

I can't help but call you out on this. What TV do you have that accepts a 1080p input?

[benpatient]

nicer polygons

Oh my.

that's probably the best silly phrase I've read in months.

nicer? wow.

[xli_ne]

well i would hope that the 360 would have better graphics than anything out right now.

But until they have a game title, a "system seller," that makes me want to go out and buy it, I'll keep playing my ps2 and 'cube. The xbox never had that game for me. Halo was good, but I was able to play that on my PC. And right now the 360 doesn't have that game, and nothing coming up really looks all that great either.

[Fukui]

Lacking HD may be the new mistake; however, we'll see. So far, it does look like they're internally divided on the issue. And it may not even be a big deal; progressive looks good enough on HD screens that those with them might settle for it, and those without won't care.
I don't think they'll cut out HD, they'll just limit it to 720i, just watch. I think they've made enough mistakes!

BUT, just to be fair, most people I know have thier game systems on regular T.Vs (these are not "hard core" people that can monopolize thier family's HDTV), and the average gamer would probably not care, but it would be a nice surprise when they do hook it up. I think a middle path in terms of HD is a good way to go...

[MacRumorUser]

I don't think they'll cut out HD, they'll just limit it to 720i, just watch. I think they've made enough mistakes!

BUT, just to be fair, most people I know have thier game systems on regular T.Vs (these are not "hard core" people that can monopolize thier family's HDTV), and the average gamer would probably not care, but it would be a nice surprise when they do hook it up. I think a middle path in terms of HD is a good way to go...

Especially when a lot of cube games support 480p - although didn't they take the component output out of the new gamecube hardware so maybe they really dont think supporting HDTV is viable.

[takao]

Oh, dear. Don't they know that this is the year of HD?


since they launch in 2006, they are out of the "year of HD" ;)


if you wan't to talk about kiss of death: xbox live requires a credit card ... there goes the german speaking online market ...

[Symtex]

since they launch in 2006, they are out of the "year of HD" ;)


if you wan't to talk about kiss of death: xbox live requires a credit card ... there goes the german speaking online market ...

not anymore. Xbox live is now credit card free. You can buy an subscription for a year at your local retail store.

[GFLPraxis]

Especially when a lot of cube games support 480p - although didn't they take the component output out of the new gamecube hardware so maybe they really dont think supporting HDTV is viable.

Well, Nintendo has already stated that they will support 480p on the Revolution for sure. And it seems that Nintendo is internally split on the HD decision.

Hopefully they'll give the system the capability, even if they don't support it or use it. But even if they don't, I'll settle for 480p.

To be honest, I hardly know anyone (not counting you fellow tech-nerds) in real life that actually owns a HDTV and uses HD service. And most of the people I do know that have HDTV's don't actually hook their systems up via component, ironically.

[Will Cheyney]

Everything is really shiny? I've noticed that on a lot of Xbox 360 games. It's either too shiny or plastic coated.

Other than that, they're screenshots. It's a racing game. How much different is 3 compared to 1 & 2? I mean the gameplay.
YES! Exactly. Apart from a little more gloss, this is just the X-Box repackaged. It doesn't offer anything ground-braking or new!

[technocoy]

clayj,

I would hardly call the standard TV market "kiddie" ALOT of people don't have HDTV, and in the bracket that buys the most games (early teens to mid twenties) i would bet even fewer do. I watch 480p on my hdtv all the time and i don't think it's that bad, really. Granted HD would be nice, but regardless, if it's the only system playing metroid, zelda, mario, etc, it WILL be bought, period. Also, nintendo is in a sweet spot this cycle, we are at the point where the next gen games systems (after 360, rev, etc) will easily have photorealistic graphics engines, so, in my opinion, nintendo is smart to preemptively begin researching NEW and easier ways to interface with games and creating new gameplay options. in 7 years, they will have a HUGE head start when the graphics capability becomes moot and people start to look for other ways to interact with games. more depth and such will be added through new interfaces and such. I also see VR making a huge come-back now that the graphics are capableof true immersion.

don't EVER underestimate nintendo... they have more profit for pushing their games than any other company.

That being said, i think the 360 looks great, but i'm waiting for the PS3 and the Rev. I am very tempted though.

[combatcolin]

Give it a year and HDTV's will be a lot cheaper - and commonplace.

Its spot the CRT time in Dixons, next year there won't be any.

[GFLPraxis]

360 and PS3 tout HD because the consoles are really geared towards the 16-30 crowd, more so than the stable of kiddie games that appeal to Nintendo 5-14 year olds.
Or are they just targeting the kiddie market who only have standard def TVs in their bedrooms?

...

Please explain to me how the various games that are or have been GameCube exclusives are kiddie.

Namely, how are these games kiddie:
Super Smash Bros Melee (top selling GameCube game)
Resident Evil 4 (GameCube exclusive for over a year)
Metroid Prime
Metroid Prime 2: Echoes
Fire Emblem
Tales of Symphonia
Baten Kaitos
Either Zelda game; Wind Waker (and don't give me this "cartoony" crap; X-Men Legends was cel-shaded too, and no one complained) or Twilight Princess


If you explain to me how those games are kiddie, I won't speak up when people call the GameCube kiddie anymore. :rolleyes:

Nintendo is wrongly given this image because they design the games so that it doesn't have the blood, gore, and cussing, and thus can be played by all ages. I applaud them for this. The games are usually SUPERIOR to the competitors that throw in the blood, gore, and cussing as gimmicks, but people complain "OMG IT HAS MARIO, IT IS TEH KIDDIE!"

Sigh. Sorry for the rant. One of my pet peeves.


No hi-def will be the kiss of death among sophisticated gamers who have very nice home theatre setups.

How much of a percentage of the population are the sophisticated gamers with very nice and expensive home theatre setups? Let me give you a hint; it's pretty low. The majority of people are casual gamers, who play games on their normal TV with the system they purchase.

[Will Cheyney]

I wrote this a few months ago, soon after the 360's unveiling:

Boring, unimaginative and ultimately shallow and short sighted. I believe that for a console to be a step-forward, someone needs to somehow re-think/re-invent the basics of control and user input - an area of game mechanics that is sorely overlooked. Nintendo is the only innovator in this respect with the introduction of shoulder buttons, vibrating controllers and the analogue stick. Others obviously followed suit. Rumor has it that the 'Revolution' is to have some form of 'smart touch-pad'. The next development has to be blindingly obvious, just overlooked.
The customisation of the power light is stupid and pointless as well as a pathetic attempt at promoting a form of "personalisation". It doesn't enhance the gameplay experience or anything important for that matter. Did someone actually think this idea would be "cool"?

The console itself doesn't look too bad, although aesthetically, I think the ") (" shape is a mistake. I'd square it off if I were in-charge. The new 'silvery' logo looks disgusting however... It looks like the mouth of a creature best suited to the Resident Evil series.

Unfortunately, this will just be "another console" in my opinion. It does nothing that people can't imagine being possible and does nothing innovative. Infact, it is purely generic and exactly what any average-Joe would envisage as "the next thing".
Microsoft will still manage to pawn it off though by flashing high specifications in consumers faces.

[raggedjimmi]

not anymore. Xbox live is now credit card free. You can buy an subscription for a year at your local retail store.

pay... for... playing online??

*sorry I had to say it. infact this post has nothing to add to the thread only Microsoft should get a grip and stop charging for online play. I play Counter Strike for nothing, I keep in contact via Messenger, some folk have MySpaces.
Apart from the cost of the machine and the broadband (like the Xbox 360) I do not pay for playing it online :)

[Fukui]

Give it a year and HDTV's will be a lot cheaper - and commonplace.

Its spot the CRT time in Dixons, next year there won't be any.
Yea, I think CRTs are gone for good... I think HDTVs are gonna start selling more next year, but I wonder how common 1080i/p will be... I have a feeling most individuals who use an HDTV in thier own room aren't gonna be buying the 32" 1080 monsters...

[e²Studios]

Yea, I think CRTs are gone for good... I think HDTVs are gonna start selling more next year, but I wonder how common 1080i/p will be... I have a feeling most individuals who use an HDTV in thier own room aren't gonna be buying the 32" 1080 monsters...


Keep in mind a Hitachi CRT RPTV can do 1080p (HDMI), CRT isn't out, in fact i would rather have a DLP or CRT projection large screen HDTV than a plasma that will begin to lose its life after 3 years. My friend has a 3.5 year old Pioneer elite series plasma it is quite dim right now compared to when he purchased it. He is going to replace it with a DLP set soon. CRT isn't going anywhere, they are quite capable of HD and in some cases better quality than a plasma can put out. There is this general consensus that plasma always = better, thats the furthest from the truth as i've seen some CRT RPTV's blow lcd/dlp/plasma sets out of the water in quality.

As far as games go, no way in hell a game will touch my plasma, CRT based rear projection TV, or LCD TV why would you risk burn in, and yes it happens more often and quicker than you think.. the only HDTV technology that doesn't suffer burn in is DLP, LSOS, and good ol reliable CRT tube.

Coming from someone that is a huge home theatre buff i really don't care if my game system is in HD, i care that i enjoy playing it. Furthermore since id never risk ruining my main HD monitor by using games on it (it voids every warranty from any manufacturer or extended warranty company if it causes burn in) I'll probably go to the Revolution and stick to playing it on my 34" Widescreen Sony Wega CRT Tube that i use to play console games.

Ed

[themacman]

The xbox 360 does not look impresive at all. Come on youve had like what 4 years to come up with something and this is all you got.

[Symtex]

pay... for... playing online??

*sorry I had to say it. infact this post has nothing to add to the thread only Microsoft should get a grip and stop charging for online play. I play Counter Strike for nothing, I keep in contact via Messenger, some folk have MySpaces.
Apart from the cost of the machine and the broadband (like the Xbox 360) I do not pay for playing it online :)

Xbox live is something you have to experience once in your life. It's the epiphany of online gaming. There is no online services that is remotely close to compare to Xbox live.

[Fukui]

Keep in mind a Hitachi CRT RPTV can do 1080p (HDMI), CRT isn't out, in fact i would rather have a DLP or CRT projection large screen HDTV than a plasma that will begin to lose its life after 3 years.
Yea, plasmas can go dim after some time, and I'm not disagreeing that CRT is brighter and has better color, but I think most consumers (not pros) would prefer something flat and thin, so in terms of sales, CRT is becoming less and less. Again I'm not disagreeing...

[takao]

not anymore. Xbox live is now credit card free. You can buy an subscription for a year at your local retail store.

except if you are living in the german market where they don't offer _that_

i know that they have thosr prepaid cards in the US but somehow they don't offer them over here..neither in germany or austria ..which is kinda irritating since so few people have credit cards over here

[mj_1903]

PGR3 looks utterly boring as in fact does all the 360 lineup. Flashier graphics, oh yay, I want fun not how many polygons it can render a guys eyebrow in.

I will be buying the revolution simply because it is different, unique and will most definitely introduce new methods of game-play.

[raggedjimmi]

Xbox live is something you have to experience once in your life. It's the epiphany of online gaming. There is no online services that is remotely close to compare to Xbox live.

Right. so Xbox Live is better than using a PC with MSN, Skype, online stat saving services (I know UT has this)? With the added ability to play games in a much higher resolution than HDTV (I was just playing HL2 online yesterday at 1600*1200, lets see 1080 do that). No online services close to Xbox Live? yea. course.

the PC has no limits to what you can do online. the Xbox has.

[Symtex]

Right. so Xbox Live is better than using a PC with MSN, Skype, online stat saving services (I know UT has this)? With the added ability to play games in a much higher resolution than HDTV (I was just playing HL2 online yesterday at 1600*1200, lets see 1080 do that). No online services close to Xbox Live? yea. course.

the PC has no limits to what you can do online. the Xbox has.

You never played xbox live haven't you ? go play it and then you can make comments about it.

[raggedjimmi]

PGR3 looks utterly boring as in fact does all the 360 lineup. Flashier graphics, oh yay, I want fun not how many polygons it can render a guys eyebrow in.

I will be buying the revolution simply because it is different, unique and will most definitely introduce new methods of game-play.

aye its like the Xbox is bringing; HDTV, paid internet service... overpriced everything infact, wireless controllers and HDD if you get the right model, same gameplay from before, arcade service, sketchy but enhanced backward compatibility to 2001/2
PS3; messy online service, HDTV, BluRay, same gameplay from before, 7 controllers, HDD, backward compatibility to 1995.
Rev; games that can only be played on the Rev (and will play games from PS3/360 with shell), new gameplay/interaction, enhanced backward compatibility to 1985, free expansive online system, portable.

[Symtex]

aye its like the Xbox is bringing; HDTV, paid internet service... overpriced everything infact, wireless controllers and HDD if you get the right model, same gameplay from before, arcade service, sketchy but enhanced backward compatibility to 2001/2
PS3; messy online service, HDTV, BluRay, same gameplay from before, 7 controllers, HDD, backward compatibility to 1995.
Rev; games that can only be played on the Rev (and will play games from PS3/360 with shell), new gameplay/interaction, enhanced backward compatibility to 1985, free expansive online system, portable.

You keep talking on how nintendo is doing something different but yet what they have offer over the last decade over 250 mario games. The remote control is a gimmick similar to Eye toy. It's fun once, twice it's ok, third time is meh.

HDTV for me is really important. I have an HDTV and a really good sound system at home and I want my console to take advantage of that. It's part of the game experience.

[takao]

saw CoD2 on demo unit today (didn't get to play it since two 12-13 year old were blocking it for like 20 minutes will go back to store tommorow in the morning)

impressions:
nice light effects ... but borderline of overdoing it sometimes
fog: looks good but still problems on sharp edges
outside of building the graphics look _way_ better than on the inside
grenade indicators: were they in the other call of duties or are they difficulty setting specific ? found them pretty lame
somehow the german uniforms looked wrong especially the color

overall: looks ok and seems to exactly like the older call of dutys:
a heavy scripted WW2 shooter
personally i would wait for further versions of the game with more impressive graphics.. i wasn't going "uhhh ahhh" in front of screen and i was standing way closer to it than i would at home.. i wasn't expecting a huge jump in graphics (after seeing kameo in august) but i was expecting more than i saw on screen


it's not far beyond PC graphics 6 months ago if not on the same level

[Sdashiki]

Give it a year and HDTV's will be a lot cheaper - and commonplace.

Its spot the CRT time in Dixons, next year there won't be any.

CRT does not mean SD nor does it mean HD.

ignorance like this is why HDTV is still not yet a standard.

HDTV is a standard of broadcast and is not limited to Plasma, LCD or CMOS etc.

Just because you think CRTs are bulky and ugly, doesnt mean they will not be HDTVs. A Computer Monitor is capable of doing HD resolutions and yet its a CRT. So in the end go ahead and buy your Plasma screen with the 90 degree or less viewing area, horrible color representation and no true black, have fun with that one. LOL.

HDTV is only higher resolution TV, thinner TVs are a luxury and an OPTION. Monkey boy.

I mean just because something is NEW and EXPENSIVE, doesnt make it great. Plasma sucks, LCD sucks and CMOS, DLP sucks, when you compare it to a nice HIGH RESOLUTION CRT.

I mean digital is awesome, but in the end, gradients are truly ANALOG when it comes to how color is represented. If you break a gradient into 20 colors, you get 20 BANDS of color. If you do this in analog, they get blended, giving you a better more natural picture.

Buying a THINNER and LIGHTER television is a sweet thing. But if you are gonna argue HD is higher quality, then get off your soap box and realize that every film produced is cut and viewed (if done digitally like we are talking) on a CRT.

[Sdashiki]

You keep talking on how nintendo is doing something different but yet what they have offer over the last decade over 250 mario games. The remote control is a gimmick similar to Eye toy. It's fun once, twice it's ok, third time is meh.

no its called progress. the controller is a very very awesome way to interact with a game.

just cuz u dont like it, doesnt make it a fad. People gawked at the N64 controller cuz it had 3 horns, and yet it looks perfectly fine, cuz it worked great.

so please, stop being fanboys FOR or AGAINST Nintendo. The Rev is a year off and already people say its a piece of crap! AND, another thing, this is all based on lots of specs Nintendo hasnt released!

HDTV for me is really important. I have an HDTV and a really good sound system at home and I want my console to take advantage of that. It's part of the game experience.

HD being important to you is great, but in the end, what are you watching in HD? 20 channels and maybe your precious 360? Spending a grand on a TV was a ludicrous idea 10 years ago, and it still is today. $1000+ to watch a few things, and the rest in SD, what a waste.

[Symtex]

no its called progress. the controller is a very very awesome way to interact with a game.

just cuz u dont like it, doesnt make it a fad. People gawked at the N64 controller cuz it had 3 horns, and yet it looks perfectly fine, cuz it worked great.

so please, stop being fanboys FOR or AGAINST Nintendo. The Rev is a year off and already people say its a piece of crap! AND, another thing, this is all based on lots of specs Nintendo hasnt released!



HD being important to you is great, but in the end, what are you watching in HD? 20 channels and maybe your precious 360? Spending a grand on a TV was a ludicrous idea 10 years ago, and it still is today. $1000+ to watch a few things, and the rest in SD, what a waste.

I disagree. I'm a big football fan and HDTV is bring the football experience to a whole new level. FOXHD or ABCHD offer 720p broadcast with DD 5.1 sound for each football game. You can't beat that. I have my xbox1 and my X360 that takes advantage of my HDTV. I don't call this a waste at all. I love my TV. I wouldn't have it any other way. Are you trying to convince yourself not to buy a HDTV because you can't afford one ?

I'll wait till May 9th but I already know by the video that was showned that I have no interest whatsoever in have another remote control at home. period.

[Lord Blackadder]

HD is definitely the furute but it is still not mature; eventually medium-sized HD flat panels will be as cheap as similar sized CRTs, but until then buying an HD capable console doesn't do me any good.

Those car models in PGR3 are pretty sweet. I can't wait to see what GT5 has in store...

[GFLPraxis]

You keep talking on how nintendo is doing something different but yet what they have offer over the last decade over 250 mario games. The remote control is a gimmick similar to Eye toy. It's fun once, twice it's ok, third time is meh.

HDTV for me is really important. I have an HDTV and a really good sound system at home and I want my console to take advantage of that. It's part of the game experience.

You're talking about something that will be used in almost every game, that gives you a keyboard-and-mouse functionality, and offers completely new things. Yes, it offers gimmick games like the EyeToy; but it also offers a new, more precise way to control every single game on the system. Once you get used to it and it becomes normal, controllers will feel outdated. "Similar to the EyeToy". LOL.

[floyde]

Well, those screenshots DO look great, but still... I won't buy this whole next-gen crap until I'm presented with something truly innovative like holographic displays and crazy s@$t like that. Seriously though, how is this different from upgrading my graphics card and adding more RAM to my gaming PC (if I had one)? And the same goes for all 3 next-gen wannabes:cool: I remember the shift from SNES to N64. Now _that_ was a big leap.

[Symtex]

Well, those screenshots DO look great, but still... I won't buy this whole next-gen crap until I'm presented with something truly innovative like holographic displays and crazy s@$t like that. Seriously though, how is this different from upgrading my graphics card and adding more RAM to my gaming PC (if I had one)? And the same goes for all 3 next-gen wannabes:cool: I remember the shift from SNES to N64. Now _that_ was a big leap.

The leap will be less this generation. 80x more power doesn't means 80x better graphics. It's an exponential type of equation. So in order to have something out of this world (FF: Spirit Within type of graphics), you are going to have to wait another 5-10 years.

[XNine]

CRT's are definately better than LCD or DLP, or even plasma. Ever hook up a high-end A/V theater? No? Yeah, then you can't even fathom how a CRT projector (especially if it's a rear projected, mirror using projector) kills other other types.

Same with TV's. CRT is god, and cheaper than any plasma or LCD, and very much capable of true HDTV.

Sure, it's larger, it doesn't hang oon your wall. So what? Build your wall around it.

I think it's funny that people are already judging the PS3 as having very little new in the way of games and online play. Do you people who say such stupid things even read? Sony has dedicated itself to completely rebuilding their online experience. They saw how XBL kicked their asses (and yes, XBL beats Skype, AIM/MSN, and one single game's tracking record), and are now willing to do something about it.

Console gaming is awesome. Those who feel like PC/Mac gaming is the only way are elitists, and should be ignored while we play better games and not have to worry about shelling out 400+ bucks for the newest graphics card to play a single game. If they like it, fine, but don't trump on consoles when you know nothing about them or what they offer.

Further more, the 360 will offer more and more compatibility for all older Xbox games. It will take time. They have to create emulation profiles for each game. SO, yeah, it'll take some time. big deal.

The Rev is, well, not going to be anything I want to own personally. I'm sorry, but I'm tired of Zelda, Mario, and horrible Metroid FPS. Gimme a 3rd person Metroid and now we're talking. The controller? I can care less. I've played just about every type of controller out there, from guns, to gloves, to dance pads, to giant arcade style, etc. It's just another controller to me, nothing fancy. But that's jsut me, I guess.

[G5Unit]

Yeh, well I'm bringing back an old thread:
http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/9153/dscn08167jr.th.jpg (http://img509.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn08167jr.jpg)
http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/5600/dscn08110db.th.jpg (http://img509.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn08110db.jpg)
http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/9228/dscn08089di.th.jpg (http://img509.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn08089di.jpg)

The top 2 are from Halo 2 and the bottom one is PGR 3. My friend brought over his 360 and I was blown away! Now I have never played Xbox 1 but I had a gamecube and the leap in quality was amazing! Anyone who says this isn't next gen is, well...

EDIT: The pics dont look to well for some reason.

[raggedjimmi]

I dont think its completely next gen :) Prettying up Halo is a no brainer. the PC and Mac have had the ability to change resolution and add FSAA since day #1 (well, FSAA in the late 90's or whenever)

I wasn't bowled over by PGR3 either. I had a play on that whilst taking my UK GB Micro back (getting a US one soon) and even my original Xbox loving mate thought it looked painfully average. He was driving around in some red car and I thought it looked like Gaurand shading (or whatever its called). just a block of red. the lights looked a little square-ish too, the same thing the Gamecube/PS2 had with shadows.

[GFLPraxis]

The buildings and environment on PGR3 impressed me. Nothing else really did. The cars looked a little better while playing. In fact I started just turning the camera to look at the scenery. It was okay, but not a system seller or anything- more like a game that'll be in the bargain bin in two years.

[raggedjimmi]

The buildings and environment on PGR3 impressed me. Nothing else really did. The cars looked a little better while playing. In fact I started just turning the camera to look at the scenery. It was okay, but not a system seller or anything- more like a game that'll be in the bargain bin in two years.

Aye it does feel that way. Not really saying it sucks but in the 360's defence I can imagine some far greater racers hitting the Xbox in the coming years.

[GFLPraxis]

I agree. I'm just saying that I'm not that impressed with PGR3 other than the buildings.

I expect later titles will impress me more.

[JDOG_]

Console gaming is awesome. Those who feel like PC/Mac gaming is the only way are elitists, and should be ignored while we play better games and not have to worry about shelling out 400+ bucks for the newest graphics card to play a single game. If they like it, fine, but don't trump on consoles when you know nothing about them or what they offer.

I totally agree. I am so over the Console vs. PC argument (sorry I rarely ever hear the merits of Mac Gaming vs. Console gaming). I hear it all the time, yet the approachability of a PC for gaming isn't there for the normal consumer. Console gaming is a great way to get them in with a fairly low start-up cost and livingroom hookup.

I think the 360 has some really great things in the pipeline to differentiate itself from the PC, it will be interesting to watch in the next 3-6 months.

By the way, Gears of War looks freaking awesome.

[MacRumorUser]

I totally agree. I am so over the Console vs. PC argument (sorry I rarely ever hear the merits of Mac Gaming vs. Console gaming). I hear it all the time, yet the approachability of a PC for gaming isn't there for the normal consumer. Console gaming is a great way to get them in with a fairly low start-up cost and livingroom hookup.

I think the 360 has some really great things in the pipeline to differentiate itself from the PC, it will be interesting to watch in the next 3-6 months.

By the way, Gears of War looks freaking awesome.

Well as of today I'm over it too. As a new year's gift I gave away my gaming PC as I simply wasn't using it. Last game I bought, I installed and never got round to playing...

[combatcolin]

Aye it does feel that way. Not really saying it sucks but in the 360's defence I can imagine some far greater racers hitting the Xbox in the coming years.

PRG is the one game in the 260 line up that i would actually buy, simply becasue it is a fantastic racer if you take a way the shiney graphics.

Never seen PGR 2 much 2nd hand, which is a testament to its quality.

[raggedjimmi]

I think it's funny that people are already judging the PS3 as having very little new in the way of games and online play. Do you people who say such stupid things even read? Sony has dedicated itself to completely rebuilding their online experience. They saw how XBL kicked their asses (and yes, XBL beats Skype, AIM/MSN, and one single game's tracking record), and are now willing to do something about it.

I suppose thats good if you're interested in tracking records and all, but nothing beats the functionality of a computer online. not even an Xbox with its paid subscription service.

Console gaming is awesome.

I'm undecided about which is the best, console or PC. FPS on the PC is just my cup of tea. I don't play them much but legends like HL2 and Doom 3 just work better for me. Since my consoles and gaming PC now share the same monitor it all feels a little better for the PC. its no longer cold and confined to the Study. I cannot play QuakeX over my OSX version of Quake, but I can play Duke3D on my Xbox. all to do with the aiming.
but games like Metroid and Zelda just wouldn't work on a PC.
but yea, right now all my gaming comes from my 2005FPW monitor and my Teleton dual-mono amp being fed into 2 Wharfedale Modus speakers. my mac, PC, Gamecube, Xbox and NES. its much nicer when your PC is using the same setup. just makes everything cosier.

The Rev is, well, not going to be anything I want to own personally. I'm sorry, but I'm tired of Zelda, Mario, and horrible Metroid FPS. Gimme a 3rd person Metroid and now we're talking. The controller? I can care less. I've played just about every type of controller out there, from guns, to gloves, to dance pads, to giant arcade style, etc. It's just another controller to me, nothing fancy. But that's jsut me, I guess.

I've owned a dance mat, light gun, arcade stick, gyroscopic PC controller as well as the regular traditional controller that Nintendo practically invented... but I dunno. You honestly think that Sony and Microsoft will not be using gyroscopics in gaming consoles in the years to come? Its as inevitable as they copied everything else. yes it will take on a more conventional shape but so CAN the Revolution (Shell controller). effectively all Nintendo has done was create a gyroscopic controller, stripped it to the core (the 'wand') but also added the ability to be used as a regular controller too (the 'shell'). They win on every level. new features on a controller with an optional traditional shape.
That sounds a little anti-Nintendo. Mario is a fun platformer, Zelda is an epic lots-of-people adventure game, Metroid is an epic solo first person adventure game. They hit on 3 very different bases. you're saying you hate all of them? fair play if you don't. but thats coming across as a "Nentindo r teh kiddie"-esque comment.