360 Crashes and the death of MS

[chicagdan]

OMG, have you guys been reading the reports of widespread XBOX 360 crashes?

http://www.xbox-scene.com/xbox1data/sep/EEFkZkkkyEHasmrPqu.php

The hopeless MS apologists at C|Net have even declared the honeymoon over for the 360 http://news.com.com/2060-11199_3-0.html?tag=nefd.aof

... and rumors of recalls are circulating.
http://www.techimo.com/forum/t157004.html

It's not surprising that this has happened -- MS is not a hardware company. In their hubris to beat Sony to market, they brought out a machine that wasn't fully tested. After the three year overdue fiasco that is Longhorn/Vista, MS needed a quick-to-market victory in the console market. But unless they quell these PR fires fast, they may lose the release date advantage, giving Sony an opportunity to kill the XBOX for good in 2006.

This is a time for Apple to think big and get aggressive. MS is a company in deep trouble. Google, Linux, Sony and Apple are all nibbling away at them ... the time may be ripe for a frontal assault.

[clayj]

How many threads have we had on this subject so far? :(

[Lacero]

Microsoft is dying.™

The reports of Xbox 360 crashes are overblown. Microsoft has known of the problems since October, but they decided to release it anyway. That tells me the problem is low enough for them that not releasing it would mean lower profits than a recall.


Here's to the Crazy Ones http://forums.macrumors.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=35452 (http://www.uriah.com/apple-qt/movies/think-different.mov)

[chicagdan]

Microsoft is dying.™

The reports of Xbox 360 crashes are overblown. Microsoft has known of the problems since October, but they decided to release it anyway. That tells me the problem is low enough for them that not releasing it would mean lower profits than a recall.

If true, that could be a fatal mistake for MS. Look, it doesn't matter if the crash reports are overblown ... image is everything in a product release. MS needs early adopter orgasms over this product, not problems and rumors of recall. If they knew this was a problem and went ahead anyway (and this gets out into the press) MS is going to have a PR disaster of epic proportions on its hands.

[0s and 1s]

Zzzzzzzz.......

[chicagdan]

How many threads have we had on this subject so far? :(

Where are they? I searched the site and found none before I started the thread. Point them out to me, please.

[risc]

Yeah Microsoft are screwed! There is no way Apple would release any buggy products, imagine what would happen if Apple released an iPod that scratched too easily, or a PowerBook with lines running across the TFT? Good bye Microsoft you've gone too far this time! :rolleyes:

Seriously what is it with trolls when it comes to video game consoles?

[buryyourbrideau]

Yeah Microsoft are screwed! There is no way Apple would release any buggy products, imagine what would happen if Apple released an iPod that scratched too easily, or a PowerBook with lines running across the TFT? Good bye Microsoft you've gone too far this time! :rolleyes:

Seriously what is it with trolls when it comes to video game consoles?

The crashes have only been with 2 games I believe.

It shouldnt be happening anyways

[risc]

It shouldnt be happening anyways

I agree but lets be honest how many technology companies don't release broken stuff? I work with tier 1 computer hardware and we get DOA stuff all the time, but the amount of stuff I actually look at means the actual percentage of machines with problems is very low, and unless the problem with Microsofts console can be reproduced on every single one this is nothing more than a few (maybe more than a few) DOA boxes getting to market. The same thing happened with the PSP launch, it has happened with the recent 15" PowerBooks, etc, etc, etc.

To name a thread "... the death of MS" is completely over the top, Microsoft will survive this, who really thinks something like this will hurt them?

[Yvan256]

Microsoft is dying.™

The reports of Xbox 360 crashes are overblown. Microsoft has known of the problems since October, but they decided to release it anyway. That tells me the problem is low enough for them that not releasing it would mean lower profits than a recall.

I've heard reports (from distributors, who kind of know their numbers) that there's a 20% return rate.

It that's true, it means that one in five Xbox 360 is defective.

I wouldn't call that "low enough". But you know Microsoft. Their operating system "have less viruses than Linux". They even have "3rd party" research prove it. :rolleyes:

[Yvan256]

To name a thread "... the death of MS" is completely over the top, Microsoft will survive this, who really thinks something like this will hurt them?

It could hurt Microsoft in the gaming world. Consumers have to buy the thing for Microsoft to be successful.

[buryyourbrideau]

I agree but lets be honest how many technology companies don't release broken stuff? I work with tier 1 computer hardware and we get DOA stuff all the time, but the amount of stuff I actually look at means the actual percentage of machines with problems is very low, and unless the problem with Microsofts console can be reproduced on every single one this is nothing more than a few (maybe more than a few) DOA boxes getting to market. The same thing happened with the PSP launch, it has happened with the recent 15" PowerBooks, etc, etc, etc.

To name a thread "... the death of MS" is completely over the top, Microsoft will survive this, who really thinks something like this will hurt them?

Yea I know that a lot of these things. But throughout MS testing, Im sure they knew about this problem, I mean they had to test a lot of boxes and had to see the problem, I doubt none of the boxes they tested had the problem. But of course they didnt hold the launch, because everyone would have been mad, and in the end it would have been a better idea to hold the launch and release a better product. A way better idea then releasing a bad box to people just to get it to them on time.

I got a 360, and I love it.

It hasnt crashed at all. So I guess im one of the lucky ones.

[risc]

I got a 360, and I love it.

It hasnt crashed at all. So I guess im one of the lucky ones.

Why does that make you lucky? The people with broken ones are just unlucky you just got something that works fine, like all of the other 360 owners on this forum.

[G5Unit]

Well I am going to buy 1 no matter what. Just set the PSU on top of a box and it never overheats.

[buryyourbrideau]

Why does that make you lucky? The people with broken ones are just unlucky you just got something that works fine, like all of the other 360 owners on this forum.

Yea thats true.

I guess I just said I was lucky because I have seen a lot of these crashing reports. I have also heard of a lot of overheating issues, however I wouldnt be surprised if this was by user fault, and they didnt place the 360 in a well ventilated area.

[chicagdan]

To name a thread "... the death of MS" is completely over the top, Microsoft will survive this, who really thinks something like this will hurt them?

The thread topic heading is purposefully provocative ... don't you understand the concept of headlines? Of course MS will survive this, but there's no question that it's a company on a major losing streak, still riding high off innovations of the 1980s. They have two cash cows -- Windows and Office -- and a handful of moderately successful products (XBOX has been a major money loser for them.)

If a rocky XBOX launch leads to Sony winning this round of the console wars decisively, the XBOX likely won't have another generation, meaning that MS has failed once again to expand on the Windows/Office cash generation machine. And given the MS failure to deliver Longhorn/Vista in a timely manner and big questions about consumer adoption of the new OS (many will choose to stay with XP for a long time) MS could have begun its long, slow decline, making this a good time for major strategic competitors like Apple to make dramatic moves.

I'm sure there are some game console freaks willing and able to discuss strategic business issues.

[Verto]

Seriously what is it with trolls when it comes to video game consoles?

Since the PS3 won't be out for a while, and will pale in comparison to the 360, they have nothing else to do but blow things out of proportion.

[GFLPraxis]

The whole 360 crashing thing is being blown way out of proportion. It's just that the few people that have the problem are understandably being VERY vocal about it on boards.

However, the OP is correct that it will hurt Microsoft's PR, even if it is very rare.

I was just going to leave it at that, but then I read Verto's comment.

Since the PS3 won't be out for a while, and will pale in comparison to the 360, they have nothing else to do but blow things out of proportion.

ROFL! BWAHAHA!

[chicagdan]

Since the PS3 won't be out for a while, and will pale in comparison to the 360, they have nothing else to do but blow things out of proportion.

I love posts like this ... pretend to be the voice of reason, then say something completely insane like the PS3 will pale in comparison to the XBOX 360. Let me try it out ... Iraq War critics are blowing the casualty numbers way out of proportion and George W. Bush is the best President ever. Yeah, that's about analogous to your comment.

[Josh396]

Since the PS3 won't be out for a while, and will pale in comparison to the 360, they have nothing else to do but blow things out of proportion.
Well at least you're upfront about it.

[raggedjimmi]

It hasnt crashed at all. So I guess im one of the lucky ones.

I hate the way peoples attitudes are getting with hardware. "i must be one of the lucky ones" so what? its a gamble is it? You pay godly amounts of money for a gaming system only to be entered into a prize draw? chances are you'll win but its still a gamble.

There should be a watchdog set up for crappy hardware rollouts, get the PowerBook, PSP and 360 in there. show the companies that we don't want a gamble. we've paid enough money as it is.

Reminds me a bit about the world cup tickets. my cousin lives in germany and was trying to get my dad some tickets. but apparently you pay for the ticket, and you may not even get one... with no money back. its a gamble! and will probably scare off a lot of potential customers.

[Will Cheyney]

http://forums.macrumors.com/image.php?u=48399&dateline=1133124907
Oh dear...

[Poff]

Where are they? I searched the site and found none before I started the thread. Point them out to me, please.

Try searching for "360 crash", I got several results.. :)

Revolution is cool anyways, but let people enjoy their 360's. :)

Peace

[Symtex]

Are we done here with the "The X360 / I hate Microsoft" Thread ? I know this is an apple website but I've seen hundreds of thread here of Apple computer being shipped with defective components. Of course Microsoft is the company to hate so every single little details is blown out of proportion.

Every single company that ships millions of units is bound to have a certain percertage of defective units. I remember Apple had it's fair share of defective Ipod and G5.

Is there defective X360 unit out there ? Yes. 20% of them are defective ? Hell no.

[Lord Blackadder]

Anybody predicting the end of M$ over this has forgotten the numerous times that Apple's obituary has been prematurely written.

Still, I must say that had I spent my money on a 360 that didn't work I would be cursing M$ right now - I know I was mad when I had to replace my PS2 because of DREs - three times. :mad:

[OutThere]

Maybe it's Microsofts way of further limiting the release...I mean, they didn't want to have a lot of them available in stores at release time, so what's wrong with making them even more rare by having 1 in 5 of them not work at all. ;)

[Compile 'em all]

If true, that could be a fatal mistake for MS. Look, it doesn't matter if the crash reports are overblown ... image is everything in a product release. MS needs early adopter orgasms over this product, not problems and rumors of recall. If they knew this was a problem and went ahead anyway (and this gets out into the press) MS is going to have a PR disaster of epic proportions on its hands.

The XBox division in MS has been losing millions of $$ even before the 360
and they still do. So the whole fatal/screw thing because of the 360 issues is
absurd.

[electronboy]

I find any M$ misfortune amusing but can someone please tell me how this relates to the category of Mac gamming? :mad:

[punkmac]

If true, that could be a fatal mistake for MS. Look, it doesn't matter if the crash reports are overblown ... image is everything in a product release. MS needs early adopter orgasms over this product, not problems and rumors of recall. If they knew this was a problem and went ahead anyway (and this gets out into the press) MS is going to have a PR disaster of epic proportions on its hands.


What, just like Apple and the 15" Powerbook?

[jessica.]

OMG, have you guys been reading the reports of widespread XBOX 360 crashes?

This is a time for Apple to think big and get aggressive. MS is a company in deep trouble. Google, Linux, Sony and Apple are all nibbling away at them ... the time may be ripe for a frontal assault.

Well, there is nothing like a little assumption! MS is hardly in trouble or doomed for that matter. You're forgetting that this blunder, if it is a blunder at all will not really set them back at all. You're forgetting that MS just like Apple (yes I said Apple) can survive this and cash in on other successes. Did you also start a thread when users were complaining of Nano screen scratches or PowerBook screen lines or even iPod battery issues? I bet you didn't. Apple will never be as big as MS. MS and Apple will always be around and nothing, I mean nothing would ever take MS down. They survived trials and failures. When the first XBox came out there were issues, then a power supply recall, now the 360. Things will work out no matter what.

If you did some research on credible sites you'd also be able to read about blunders by GM, Firestone, BMW, VW, Toyota, Dell, Toshiba, etc. And believe it or not, all of those companies are going strong.

[benpatient]

um....GM isn't exactly "going strong."

I know 30,000 people who will back me on that, too.

[Don't panic]

um....GM isn't exactly "going strong."

I know 30,000 people who will back me on that, too.

you KNOW them?? Man, you gotta be the most powerful jinx ever ;)

[natehan]

Anybody predicting the end of M$ over this has forgotten the numerous times that Apple's obituary has been prematurely written.

Still, I must say that had I spent my money on a 360 that didn't work I would be cursing M$ right now - I know I was mad when I had to replace my PS2 because of DREs - three times. :mad:

Let's not forget that PS2 had a serious problem with disc read errors.

My xbox360 came defective with a huge chunk of plastic in the power cable. Sucks to be me.

[mrzeve]

We get it, you all hate Microsoft. Geez

[TheGimp]

Neither I nor four friends who bought a 360 the same time I did experienced any problems whatsoever with the 360. Several have played original xbox games without hitch and most of us have used the 360's media center functions, including viewing and transferring photos stored on a digital camera connected to the 360 via USB 2.0, ripping music, and downloading trailers and demos directly to the 360 via broadband.

The only slight cavil I have about the 360 is the fan noise, which makes the unit sound about as loud as my dual G5. I hardly ever notice this, however, since I'm too immersed in the games themselves and often use noise-isolating Shure headphones anyway.

So I have nothing against Microsoft regarding this product, but (now think Chris Rock re: cracker wife and kids) if there ever was a revolution, I'd kill them first!

[raggedjimmi]

Neither I nor four friends who bought a 360 the same time I did experienced any problems whatsoever with the 360. Several have played original xbox games without hitch and most of us have used the 360's media center functions, including viewing and transferring photos stored on a digital camera connected to the 360 via USB 2.0, ripping music, and downloading trailers and demos directly to the 360 via broadband.

The only slight cavil I have about the 360 is the fan noise, which makes the unit sound about as loud as my dual G5. I hardly ever notice this, however, since I'm too immersed in the games themselves and often use noise-isolating Shure headphones anyway.

So I have nothing against Microsoft regarding this product, but (now think Chris Rock re: cracker wife and kids) if there ever was a revolution, I'd kill them first!

I dont get that part of the 360 :o Why not just link up your TV with your Mac and do all your viewing there? As soon as I get my HDTV I'm ditching my Xbox Media Centre, cut out the middleman, just hook my PB up to it.

[TheGimp]

I dont get that part of the 360 :o Why not just link up your TV with your Mac and do all your viewing there? As soon as I get my HDTV I'm ditching my Xbox Media Centre, cut out the middleman, just hook my PB up to it.

Actually I don't plan to set up any media center, unless you count using my Powerbook with the iPod, which is occasionally hooked up to the stereo, as a media center. I mainly tried a few of the xbox media center functions out in order to see how well they worked.

The only 360 media feature that I see myself using is the high def photo display from the camera. As far as I know, my Powerbook will not display iPhoto photos to an HDTV such as the 23" Sony Trinitron LCD HDTV (720p/1080i) owned by my girlfriend. Up until now, the only way to output photos directly to a TV from the Canon Powershot SD camera has been through the Canon's composite video cable (the cheap yellow rca phono plug). Using the 360 connected via component HD to the TV, and then simply plugging the Canon into one of the three USB 2.0 ports, we were able to view photos in stunning detail on her TV instead of seeing them somewhat "washed out" on her older G3 ibook. Of course this particular media feature alone wouldn't sell either of us on the 360, but it was nice to see it work so well. Maybe in a year or two, if and when the 360 drops in price to $250 or less, such media features (along with the second generation games) will help make the 360 a compelling purchase. As it stands now at $399, I still think the 360 is a steal. At least to a mac user who almost (rather stupidly) spent $500 on a certain video card last spring in order to enjoy a select few games in high res.

[2nyRiggz]

well i dont care...my 360 is running smoothly.....and until mines freak out....whatever.


Bless

[mkubal]

Funny how all the MR members seem not to have had any problems (unless I missed a thread somewhere). Coincidence? I think not. I think John Dvorak summed it up pretty well in the latest tWiT episode: all the consoles seem to have rabid fanboys who will do anything to besmirch the competitors console. Even say find some pole online that asks if they're having problems with the 360 and clicking yes despite not having one.

I really believe the failure hype is a combination of those fanboys and few very vocal people who have had problems. I know if I had a working XBOX 360 I sure as hell wouldn't be online looking for polls to say that my console was working great--I'd be busy playing that sucker.

[LethalWolfe]

If someone mentioned it in the thread already I apologize for missing it, but don't people remember the BSD's and, IIRC, recalls during the first 3 months or so of the original Xbox launch?

Why is anyone surprised by a rev A product w/problems, and why are people calling this some sort of "death knell" flaw by MS?


Lethal

[Tommyg117]

I don't think it is a death knell problem. I just feel that with all the hype around it, it should work. I might sound a little cynical, but what happened to expecting a product to just work. I understand, with this level of hardware, there are bound to be problems, but I just don't like the fact that I have to consider whether something will work or not before I have to even consider whether I want to save up the money and get it. I am going to get the 360, so I'm not a fanboy of any kind, I just wish that we didn't expect problems and let them slide when they happen. Does anyone know how the return policies are working out? If there is a good return policy for defective units, it would put my mind at ease about getting one.

[LethalWolfe]

I don't think it is a death knell problem. I just feel that with all the hype around it, it should work. I might sound a little cynical, but what happened to expecting a product to just work. I understand, with this level of hardware, there are bound to be problems, but I just don't like the fact that I have to consider whether something will work or not before I have to even consider whether I want to save up the money and get it. I am going to get the 360, so I'm not a fanboy of any kind, I just wish that we didn't expect problems and let them slide when they happen. Does anyone know how the return policies are working out? If there is a good return policy for defective units, it would put my mind at ease about getting one.

Just wait a few months before you buy it to let the bad production run to get off of store shelves. It doesn't matter if it's a new car, new house, new computer, or new console anything that is "rev A" is more likely to have kinks in it.


Lethal

[RandomDeadHead]

Just wait a few months before you buy it to let the bad production run to get off of store shelves. It doesn't matter if it's a new car, new house, new computer, or new console anything that is "rev A" is more likely to have kinks in it.
Lethal

House?

Yes, I'll take the new rev B cape cod please. Anything but that damn rev A ranch.

[GFLPraxis]

You know, it's sad that engineering has gotten so bad that people can assume that the first products will always be defective. :(

[jdechko]

House?

Yes, I'll take the new rev B cape cod please. Anything but that damn rev A ranch.

HAHA.

I wouldnt be surprised if there are several people with defective 360's, but I'm sure that its a lot less than 20%. Its probably more like >1%. But it could come from a concentrated area of the country and make it seem like more. In any case a recall of the 360, complete or limited, wouldnt be the death of Microsoft, nor would another $4bn loss. Microsoft has massive amounts of cash from Windows and Office that can cover losses in other departments. Its why diversification is good when you already have established a cash cow (windows/office)

[Symtex]

You know, it's sad that engineering has gotten so bad that people can assume that the first products will always be defective. :(

Does that apply too Apple IPod generation 1 who shipped with bad battery and G5 with bad ram or it only applies to Microsoft ?

[kuyu]

This is overblown hype. I've been asking around on Live for 4 days about this. Guess how many people out of the hundreds I've talked to have had a problem with crashing? None. Not one. One guy said he talked to someone whose 360 crashed once.

20%? Not likley. This is fuel to the zealot fire. There is nothing wrong with 99.5% of the 360 out there. However, I can think of another company who would stand to gain if there was a perception of 20% faulty 360's. Five points to anyone that can guess that one:rolleyes:

[bokdol]

This is overblown hype. I've been asking around on Live for 4 days about this. Guess how many people out of the hundreds I've talked to have had a problem with crashing? None. Not one. One guy said he talked to someone whose 360 crashed once.

haha but wouldn't the people on live be the people that do not have the crashing problem..... sorry i am being an ass..... :D

[GFLPraxis]

Does that apply too Apple IPod generation 1 who shipped with bad battery and G5 with bad ram or it only applies to Microsoft ?

It applies to Apple, Microsoft, Sony, and almost everyone else.

However, it's a bigger deal with consoles. Look at the past. NES, SNES, N64....those systems were WORKHORSES. All of mine still work, even 20 years later in the case of th eNES.

[raggedjimmi]

It applies to Apple, Microsoft, Sony, and almost everyone else.

However, it's a bigger deal with consoles. Look at the past. NES, SNES, N64....those systems were WORKHORSES. All of mine still work, even 20 years later in the case of th eNES.

How strong were Sega consoles compared? whats the chances of them breaking? I can imagine the CD-based systems to be quite faulty. Even though my DC is running strong, and my Mega Drive.

[kuyu]

I've yet to own a gaming console that didn't bite the dust. Let's recap:

NES
Eventually the "blow and jam up and down" technique stopped working. Fun while it lasted.
Genesis
Again, the "blow" technique stopped working after a while.
N64
Anyone noticing a trend with cartridge based consoles? Blow until it dies.
PS2
I'm on my second. The first died of "disc read error" syndrome. The second is effectively dead from obsolescence.
Gamecube
Anyone want to venture a guess as to what part of the gamecube quit working? Award yourself 2 points if you wrote down "disc drive broken." Award yourself 1 point and the cynic trophy if you wrote down "Nintendo." (cheap shot, I know)
Xbox
Again, the first one died of MS's version of the dreaded "disc read error" disease. Luckily I won a second one from my school. It's still working, but will probably never get turned on again.

I will be amazed if the actual 360, PS3, or Rev I buy at launch make it to 2010. I never abused any of these console. They sat peacefully in the entertainment center next to the TV, stereo, and DVD player. All those still work great. Go figure.

Maybe I should buy stock in disc drive manufacturing companies...

[Abulia]

However, it's a bigger deal with consoles. Look at the past. NES, SNES, N64....those systems were WORKHORSES. All of mine still work, even 20 years later in the case of th eNES.And notably, all cartridge-based...

[raggedjimmi]

And notably, all cartridge-based...

I've yet to have a cartridge based system break on me. I've regularly played my NES since 1989 (i was THREE! my dad would draw characters from Mario and I'd colour them in!) and thats now sitting ontop of my Xbox playing the best games ever made :)

I cant think of any systems that have just broke for me. I've had mates with broken PS2's, PS1's, DC's but all my systems are fine. if only I could FIND my PS1...

[XNine]

I've yet to have a cartridge based system break on me. I've regularly played my NES since 1989 (i was THREE! my dad would draw characters from Mario and I'd colour them in!) and thats now sitting ontop of my Xbox playing the best games ever made :)

I cant think of any systems that have just broke for me. I've had mates with broken PS2's, PS1's, DC's but all my systems are fine. if only I could FIND my PS1...

I know where my original PSX went. To my ex. If there's one thing I wish upon her is that that damn thing explodes and kills her. Not likely since I've never had trouble with a console before...

My current GF's NES is stillw orking fine. I'me sure if I puleld the SNES out of storage somewhere it would too. The PS2 still works like a charm after blwoing it out internally when it had disc read errors.

[.Andy]

I've yet to own a gaming console that didn't bite the dust. Let's recap:
........
I will be amazed if the actual 360, PS3, or Rev I buy at launch make it to 2010. I never abused any of these console. They sat peacefully in the entertainment center next to the TV, stereo, and DVD player. All those still work great. Go figure.

Maybe I should buy stock in disc drive manufacturing companies...
Maybe you should just purchase a vacuum cleaner and clean your room a bit more often :p ;)

[GFLPraxis]

Interestingly, I've yet to have one of my consoles break on me- all my Sega and Nintendo systems work great. My sister's PS2 on the other hand has troubles playing DVD's.