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gmbaker44
Sep 25, 2013, 04:23 PM
So there are some rumors that Apple might release a new hardware update for Apple TV along with new iPads. What possible changes could they make? New design? A7 Processor? 802.11ac Wifi? I want to buy an Apple TV but not sure if I should wait until the October event.



dumastudetto
Sep 25, 2013, 04:28 PM
Buy now and upgrade in October if necessary. You can never have too many Apple TV's in your home IMO. They are the best home entertainment systems around.

Sgtarky
Sep 30, 2013, 06:47 PM
. They are the best home entertainment systems around.

roku would love to have a word with you lol

dumastudetto
Sep 30, 2013, 07:38 PM
roku would love to have a word with you lol

Roku is a cheap toy in comparison to the genius of Apple TV.

Sgtarky
Sep 30, 2013, 08:14 PM
Roku is a cheap toy in comparison to the genius of Apple TV.

apple tv has airplay that. is . it!

dumastudetto
Sep 30, 2013, 08:45 PM
apple tv has airplay that. is . it!

Airplay is huge nothing else compares to it. And Apple TV is connected to the world's largest store of digital content and has iCloud playback functionality. Incredible.

Joeymac1
Sep 30, 2013, 08:52 PM
Lol Apple TV is a joke

**edit... I have an iPad and an iPhone5 by the way so I am in no way a "hater" or "fanboy" or whatever new term you jokers are using.

Sgtarky
Sep 30, 2013, 08:59 PM
Lol Apple TV is a joke

**edit... I have an iPad and an iPhone5 by the way so I am in no way a "hater" or "fanboy" or whatever new term you jokers are using.

I love my Macbook pro, will never get an iPhone or iPod. I hate Itunes. I do have an apple tv,but I use the roku much more.

makebeatz
Oct 1, 2013, 12:31 AM
Each box has its own use. Roku would collect lots of dust in my household. AirPlay/HBO Go/Watch ESPN are the only reasons why the apple tv get a ton of use. WD TV live is everything else. As a college student siphoning parents cable tv subscription, Slingplayer for connected devices is awesome

LaunchpadBS
Oct 1, 2013, 06:13 AM
apple tv has airplay that. is . it!

Agreed.

I recently upgraded the telly, bought a samsung smart TV simply because it was the best value for money.
Samsung's smart hub has come VERY FAR, wow I'm actually impressed.
I've used my Apple TV once since getting this new TV and that was for airplay.
My sammy plays DLNA stream movies from my NAS box without the need for a hack. My ATV2 is a JB but still doesn't come close to the smart hub.
Time for Apple to step up, Airplay isn't enough to justify buying an ATV these days.

Sgtarky
Oct 1, 2013, 02:30 PM
Agreed.

I recently upgraded the telly, bought a samsung smart TV simply because it was the best value for money.
Samsung's smart hub has come VERY FAR, wow I'm actually impressed.
I've used my Apple TV once since getting this new TV and that was for airplay.
My sammy plays DLNA stream movies from my NAS box without the need for a hack. My ATV2 is a JB but still doesn't come close to the smart hub.
Time for Apple to step up, Airplay isn't enough to justify buying an ATV these days.

yeah I like the smart hub, I wonder if the APPLE TV will be as good as the samsung

brentsg
Oct 1, 2013, 04:09 PM
Smart TVs are great, but few manufacturers will stay on top of updates. More often you're stuck with whatever it ships with. Far better to get a STB from a vendor that will maintain the software for a reasonable amount of time, then replace it when necessary.

Donka
Oct 4, 2013, 08:02 AM
I have a feeling we will see an app store for Apple TV sooner rather than later. Bluetooth game controllers were quietly advertised at WWDC but there has been no mention since. Nothing at the iPhone event and they must be getting held back for a reason. ATV supports Bluetooth and I suspect we will see game controller support for the ATV at some point. This would obviously point to games being available and judging by the quality of some of the iPad retina games, a game running at 1080p on ATV would be of a very high standard. Add in the game controller and you have a very capable games console with an already highly established developer base and games already available that could be converted for the ATV relatively quickly.
The talk of Amazon also releasing a set top box with third party apps means Apple need to do this to remain competitive in this area.

WilliamLondon
Oct 4, 2013, 08:46 AM
Lol Apple TV is a joke

**edit... I have an iPad and an iPhone5 by the way so I am in no way a "hater" or "fanboy" or whatever new term you jokers are using.

It's the actions that define someone as a troll, not the products they own. There are plenty of trolls on this forum who own Apple products.

If the Apple TV is a joke then I'm someone who finds utility in a joke that is so great that it's one of the top devices I own and use on a daily basis in my home and have for the past 6+ years, a device that is such a joke that it allowed me to cut the cable cord 6 years ago. There's a lot of laughing going on in my household, but it's directed at those cable company extortionists who haven't received one penny from me in all those years.

I'm not expecting an update to the AppleTV quite yet, but if they do, the one feature I want is an AppStore.

Sue De Nimes
Oct 4, 2013, 10:01 AM
I have an Apple TV3. Here in the UK I can pretty much SFA with it. Airplay doesn't support 5.1 sound. The choice of channels in the UK is really poor. Netflix is the only one that I could imagine people wanting.

I did have an XBMC box alongside the AppleTV. I used that for playback of my media from my homeserver. When PlexConnect became available I was happy enough with it to get rid of the XBMC box. Since Apple forced a firmware change I haven't been able to get Plex working.

Yesterday my wife wanted to watch something while I was gaming in Bootcamp on my iMac. She couldn't access my iTunes library unless I booted back into OSX. Getting iTunes working on a windows server is just unbearable.

Today I ordered an ACER Revo which I will install OpenELEC on. Apple TV is getting sold. I have just had enough of it. Unless you buy your content from Apple it really isn't worth a damn.

I don't buy any video content from Apple because (a) the prices are too high and (b) the quality is too low.

priitv8
Oct 4, 2013, 11:18 AM
Airplay doesn't support 5.1 sound.How come? All my movies play with DD5.1 sound. Or from which source do you want to get the surround sound?Unless you buy your content from Apple it really isn't worth a damn.How come? I use it daily to listen to my ripped CD-s and watch my ripped DVD/BD-s. Occasionally I use it as my 2nd screen for the laptop, if I'm to demo something.

Sue De Nimes
Oct 4, 2013, 11:42 AM
How come? All my movies play with DD5.1 sound. Or from which source do you want to get the surround sound?`

Anything I play with Airplay only gives me stereo.


How come? I use it daily to listen to my ripped CD-s and watch my ripped DVD/BD-s. Occasionally I use it as my 2nd screen for the laptop, if I'm to demo something.


It won't play any video from a network share. Any media has to be in iTunes. That means having to reencode the media I have. Also, the iTunes interface on the Apple TV3 sucks for large media collections. I have about 600 movies ripped on my home server along with loads of TV shows. As I mentioned earlier you also need to have your computer turned on to play stuff in the iTunes library.

Mr. McMac
Oct 4, 2013, 11:53 AM
Roku is a cheap toy in comparison to the genius of Apple TV.

Really? I love my Roku 3's . It does so much more than an Apple TV. BTW, I've had 2 Apple TV's so I'm not talking out my butt...

bobr1952
Oct 4, 2013, 12:01 PM
Really? I love my Roku 3's . It does so much more than an Apple TV. BTW, I've had 2 Apple TV's so I'm not talking out my butt...

All the streaming tools out there have their good points and bad--I use my ATV the most but also use streaming on my blu ray and my earlier version of Roku--nothing wrong with Roku. Would be nice if one tool had all the apps necessary--but since two of the most popular (Amazon and iTunes) are in direct competition with each other, I don't see that happening anytime soon. But I have a lot of Apple infrastructure in my home and use iTunes (my music and video library, the store, Match, and Radio) as well as AirPlay for entertainment, so ATV is still my best bet. :)

institute
Oct 5, 2013, 03:34 AM
Apple TV plus Airplay plus Plexconnect gives me far more options then I would ever need. Sorry to hear that some can't get Plexconnect to work.

priitv8
Oct 5, 2013, 04:18 AM
Anything I play with Airplay only gives me stereo.I wonder what media and in what way do you play?
From below I reckon, your media lib has to be mkv? In that case, you need to try Beamer, which will stream AC3 directly and re-encode DTS into AC3 on the fly. AirPlay most def supports surround sound, but just in AC3/DD5.1 streams.
It won't play any video from a network share. Any media has to be in iTunes. That means having to reencode the media I have. Also, the iTunes interface on the Apple TV3 sucks for large media collections. I have about 600 movies ripped on my home server along with loads of TV shows. As I mentioned earlier you also need to have your computer turned on to play stuff in the iTunes library.Netshare -True. iTunes - True.
I use Beamer (for non-m4v clips I don't care to convert and keep) or iTunes server to play from NAS share. I keep my server turned on anyway (WWW, VPN serving etc), so it's no additional load to serve media up from the same machine.
MKV and MP4 are quite on par features-wise, but I really prefer the rich metadata in MP4 that makes the media so much more accessible and organisable in iTunes (true, MKV has the same capabilities, but show me a good MKV-librarian?). And iTunes per se is a good handler of a large media library. I have 160GB worth of music, 1200GB movies and 90GB TV Shows. No problem to maintain this library. Navigating it on aTV screen is another story, but there are ways to get things organised (smart playlists, search function, filters like genre/unwatched etc).
Regarding need to reencode - this really depends. As long as your stuff is in HD, it is most prob also in AVC/H.264 already (except for occasional BD rips which have VC-1). Those don't need to be reencoded, just repackaged into MP4 container, which takes not more time than file copying.
For the rest (SD avi files, divx, xvid and other by now not relevant formats), there really are only 2 options: reencode or use Beamer (or the like).
Satellite rips in m2ts format are a PITA in itself, but Beamer can stream them as well.

mylop
Oct 5, 2013, 04:19 AM
So there are some rumors that Apple might release a new hardware update for Apple TV along with new iPads. What possible changes could they make? New design? A7 Processor? 802.11ac Wifi? I want to buy an Apple TV but not sure if I should wait until the October event.

I would buy one tomorrow if it was also a PVR. I think it'd be great if it could record off-air and also sync those shows to an iPad/iPhone.

Sue De Nimes
Oct 5, 2013, 05:40 AM
I wonder what media and in what way do you play?
From below I reckon, your media lib has to be mkv? In that case, you need to try Beamer, which will stream AC3 directly and re-encode DTS into AC3 on the fly. AirPlay most def supports surround sound, but just in AC3/DD5.1 streams.


Yes, most of it is in MKVs with multiple audio streams and subtitles. Great to have stuff ripped along with commentaries etc. I have tried Beamer but to be honest it is a clumsy option. It involves having to be in OSX to use. (So if I am gaming in Bootcamp someone else can't watch something). You also can't use it to browse your media from the sofa.


Netshare -True. iTunes - True.
I use Beamer (for non-m4v clips I don't care to convert and keep) or iTunes server to play from NAS share. I keep my server turned on anyway (WWW, VPN serving etc), so it's no additional load to serve media up from the same machine.
MKV and MP4 are quite on par features-wise, but I really prefer the rich metadata in MP4 that makes the media so much more accessible and organisable in iTunes (true, MKV has the same capabilities, but show me a good MKV-librarian?). And iTunes per se is a good handler of a large media library. I have 160GB worth of music, 1200GB movies and 90GB TV Shows. No problem to maintain this library. Navigating it on aTV screen is another story, but there are ways to get things organised (smart playlists, search function, filters like genre/unwatched etc).
Regarding need to reencode - this really depends. As long as your stuff is in HD, it is most prob also in AVC/H.264 already (except for occasional BD rips which have VC-1). Those don't need to be reencoded, just repackaged into MP4 container, which takes not more time than file copying.
For the rest (SD avi files, divx, xvid and other by now not relevant formats), there really are only 2 options: reencode or use Beamer (or the like).
Satellite rips in m2ts format are a PITA in itself, but Beamer can stream them as well.

Both Plex and XBMC are fantastic ways to manage a large media collection. Using either of them will show just how poor the Apple TV is in comparison.

Using either you just point them at your media library and they will organise it for you. They will play anything you have without having to do anything. They will download cover art and fan art making everything look fantastic. You can browse everything from the sofa. Beamer does a job but having to go into another room to select what you want to watch really isn't ideal. And again it requires you to have another computer running OSX at the time.

As you say navigating large media collections on the Apple TV really isn't a satisfactory experience. I am not saying that the Apple TV isn't without any benefits at all. It is just so unsatisfactory compared to other options.

AaronM5670
Oct 5, 2013, 03:46 PM
So would anyone get an Apple TV now? Bearing in mind I already can stream my photos, music and movies etc. from my iMac, iPhone and iPad, is it really worth waiting for a new one considering I can get a refurbished model on the Online Store for £75?

AaronM5670
Oct 5, 2013, 05:30 PM
Smart TVs are great, but few manufacturers will stay on top of updates. More often you're stuck with whatever it ships with. Far better to get a STB from a vendor that will maintain the software for a reasonable amount of time, then replace it when necessary.

Very true, I've got a 2 year old Samsung D7000 and whilst updates were plentiful at first, they dried up after a year or so and I haven't seen one since February.

xArtx
Oct 5, 2013, 09:36 PM
Pretty much, all it is could be replaced with an adapter that doesn't need to be connected to a router.
It doesn't do anything you couldn't already have done with your iPad/iPhone plugged into your TV.
It sure offers convenience being plugged into your TV all the time, but that doesn't make it great.

Donka
Oct 6, 2013, 01:40 AM
So would anyone get an Apple TV now? Bearing in mind I already can stream my photos, music and movies etc. from my iMac, iPhone and iPad, is it really worth waiting for a new one considering I can get a refurbished model on the Online Store for £75?

All depends on whether Apple open it up it third party apps. If not then the current model is all you currently need with Bluetooth support and 1080p output.

priitv8
Oct 8, 2013, 08:06 AM
Yes, most of it is in MKVs with multiple audio streams and subtitles. Great to have stuff ripped along with commentaries etc.Indeed, luckily AppleTV/iTunes can handle this as well. Natively.
I have tried Beamer but to be honest it is a clumsy option. It involves having to be in OSX to use.True. But I use it only occasionally. I don't mind having all my media library in a single format. The QC i7 converts FullHD in real time (1h of video in 1h or at about 24fps), so no biggie. And nowadays, you can pretty much get anything already prepped in AppleTV format.
Both Plex and XBMC are fantastic ways to manage a large media collection. Using either of them will show just how poor the Apple TV is in comparison.

Using either you just point them at your media library and they will organise it for you. They will play anything you have without having to do anything. They will download cover art and fan art making everything look fantastic. You can browse everything from the sofa.I tried XBMC (And NitoTV) on my jailbroken AppleTV 1st gen, but it is nowhere a lean solution. The windows-like UI and networking bothered me even more. So I gave up.
Never tried Plex yet, will be checking it out.

Crazy Badger
Oct 8, 2013, 08:11 AM
I've been toying with the an upgrade to my aTV2 (now that PlexConnect can be used instead of a jailbreak) as 1080p would be nice along with keeping the device updated, and not running older version to keep the jailbreak.

If they added 801.2ac I'd be on one in a shot and might be able to do away with the powerline adapters

Donka
Oct 8, 2013, 09:10 AM
I've been toying with the an upgrade to my aTV2 (now that PlexConnect can be used instead of a jailbreak) as 1080p would be nice along with keeping the device updated, and not running older version to keep the jailbreak.

If they added 801.2ac I'd be on one in a shot and might be able to do away with the powerline adapters

Never had any problems streaming 1080p over wifi with my ATV3. 801.11n should be more than quick enough.

Sue De Nimes
Oct 8, 2013, 12:04 PM
Indeed, luckily AppleTV/iTunes can handle this as well. Natively.
True. But I use it only occasionally. I don't mind having all my media library in a single format. The QC i7 converts FullHD in real time (1h of video in 1h or at about 24fps), so no biggie. And nowadays, you can pretty much get anything already prepped in AppleTV format.
I tried XBMC (And NitoTV) on my jailbroken AppleTV 1st gen, but it is nowhere a lean solution. The windows-like UI and networking bothered me even more. So I gave up.
Never tried Plex yet, will be checking it out.

I have media that I have already ripped at high bitrates. Beamer struggles to transcode some of it (on a 3.4ghz i7) which means having to re-encode. For a large media collection that is just too much of an ordeal.

The Apple TV would be usable IF it could play directly from a NAS or other network share AND the codec support was better.

mic j
Oct 8, 2013, 12:16 PM
I have media that I have already ripped at high bitrates. Beamer struggles to transcode some of it (on a 3.4ghz i7) which means having to re-encode. For a large media collection that is just too much of an ordeal.

The Apple TV would be usable IF it could play directly from a NAS or other network share AND the codec support was better.
Sounds like you should be either using PlexConnect on aTV3 or Roku3 or WDTV or maybe Popcorn Hour. There are scads of them that play multiple file types over NAS.

Sue De Nimes
Oct 8, 2013, 01:07 PM
Sounds like you should be either using PlexConnect on aTV3 or Roku3 or WDTV or maybe Popcorn Hour. There are scads of them that play multiple file types over NAS.

Since Apple forced a firmware change that made the trailers app connect over https I couldn't get it to work.

I am back to using XBMC. I am running via OpenELEC on an Acer Revo RL80. It cost me £129 for that. It plays back every single file I chuck at it. It even streams HD audio to my receiver.

It also has AirPlay.

It just kicks the AppleTV so far into touch it isn't funny.

OpTic Jayex
Oct 8, 2013, 01:13 PM
I hope there are new Apple TV's. I'd LOVE a new Apple gadget to play with!

Crazy Badger
Oct 8, 2013, 04:21 PM
Never had any problems streaming 1080p over wifi with my ATV3. 801.11n should be more than quick enough.

I was struggling with 720p over wifi!

Donka
Oct 8, 2013, 05:10 PM
I was struggling with 720p over wifi!

What kind of router do you have?

paulrbeers
Oct 8, 2013, 05:56 PM
Pretty much, all it is could be replaced with an adapter that doesn't need to be connected to a router.
It doesn't do anything you couldn't already have done with your iPad/iPhone plugged into your TV.
It sure offers convenience being plugged into your TV all the time, but that doesn't make it great.

Awesome I'll point my wife to your post when I drag a 20' cable from behind the tv to the couch so she can watch a video from her iPhone (not to mention the fact that it will completely make her phone useless for any other task but playing said video). And when my 2 year old daughter trips over that 20' cord and brings my tv with it, I'll be sure to remember your advice!

No xArtx, we don't all live in a small studio apartment that makes a "dongle" in anyway convenient.

----------

I have media that I have already ripped at high bitrates. Beamer struggles to transcode some of it (on a 3.4ghz i7) which means having to re-encode. For a large media collection that is just too much of an ordeal.

The Apple TV would be usable IF it could play directly from a NAS or other network share AND the codec support was better.


I thought there was already another work around for 5.2 or later....
https://github.com/plexinc/PlexConnect/tree/new-movie-sections

xArtx
Oct 8, 2013, 07:08 PM
And when my 2 year old daughter trips over that 20' cord and brings my tv with it, I'll be sure to remember your advice!


I didn't offer any advice.

.. also...
If you want to use a 20 foot cable for your daughter to trip over, and smash your TV,
that's entirely up to you, but the cables are actually pretty small:
http://p.globalsources.com/IMAGES/PDT/B0359197645/AV-HDMI-Adapter.jpg

If you want to 'invent' a problem to make ATV useful, well,
I have both, the cable was cheaper, ATV doesn't offer anything additional.

powerman
Oct 8, 2013, 11:09 PM
I would love to see an update to the Apple TV. Something that uses bluetooth 4.0 and better sound connections. I think with the A7 chip and bluetooth 4.0 the slight delay in airplay may be fixed to allow for gaming to be a possibility. The sound aspect is a no brainer.

I do not see an app store until the apple tv stops being a hobby and starts to be a focus for Apple. Steve Jobs had an idea for the living room so maybe it is close at hand.

Crazy Badger
Oct 9, 2013, 02:06 AM
What kind of router do you have?

I did have a 5th gen AirPort Extreme, but I've now got a 6th gen :D

To be fair, I haven't even tried the aTV over wi-fi since upgrading as the powerline adapters work fine and given the aTV2 is still only 801.2n didn't expect any improvement.

Sym0
Oct 9, 2013, 02:14 AM
I was struggling with 720p over wifi!

Wireless-N here and no prob streaming 1080p, and running timemachine to the same capsule, downloading torrents at 1MB/s all at the same time.

I can transfer at about 50MB/s to the time capsule over wifi and that is only a fraction of the N bandwidth.

Donka
Oct 9, 2013, 04:57 AM
I would love to see an update to the Apple TV. Something that uses bluetooth 4.0 and better sound connections. I think with the A7 chip and bluetooth 4.0 the slight delay in airplay may be fixed to allow for gaming to be a possibility. The sound aspect is a no brainer.

I do not see an app store until the apple tv stops being a hobby and starts to be a focus for Apple. Steve Jobs had an idea for the living room so maybe it is close at hand.

Something I would love to see but the issue with the delay in on the source end i.e. iPhone or iPad. It has to compress the video and audio signal for sending over Wifi and this is where the lag comes from. Not an issue with movies but an issue with anything needing realtime input such as games. real racing 3 would be superb over Airplay if they could lose the lag. It also affects the new lightning HDMI connector as the signal needs to be compressed to be sent over the lightning port from what I have read.

----------

I did have a 5th gen AirPort Extreme, but I've now got a 6th gen :D

To be fair, I haven't even tried the aTV over wi-fi since upgrading as the powerline adapters work fine and given the aTV2 is still only 801.2n didn't expect any improvement.

I don't use an AirPort Extreme so can't comment on that specifically but I don't see any physical reason why you can't get 720p never mind 1080p over Wifi. May be worth trying a different channel number to avoid interference.

paulrbeers
Oct 9, 2013, 05:17 AM
I didn't offer any advice.

.. also...
If you want to use a 20 foot cable for your daughter to trip over, and smash your TV,
that's entirely up to you, but the cables are actually pretty small:
Image (http://p.globalsources.com/IMAGES/PDT/B0359197645/AV-HDMI-Adapter.jpg)

If you want to 'invent' a problem to make ATV useful, well,
I have both, the cable was cheaper, ATV doesn't offer anything additional.


Alright, let's talk about your "cheaper" alternative...

The Lightning to HDMI adapter is $50! You can get an AppleTV refurb for $75!.....

Let's talk about what that $25 difference nets you:

Watching Netflix/Hulu/Youtube:
1. AppleTV plays them back directly from Apps with your iOS device free to do whatever you want with it (make calls, text, surf the net).
2. Your iOS device is directly connected to your TV and if a call comes in or what not, everyone has to stop and wait for the phone call to be over to continue to watch the movie.

Win: AppleTV

Showing pictures and videos from a recent event you attended to family and friends:
1. You simply Airplay them wirelessly from your chair 20 feet from the TV from the AppleTV
2. You either get up constantly from the chair to start the next video or you have to stand next to your tv the entire time to constantly flip thru videos and pictures.
3. You still use the dongle but get a 20' cable so you can share from your chair except now that 20' HDMI cable costs you a lot more and you might as well have bought an AppleTV

Win: AppleTV

Amazon Prime
1. You airplay from your iOS device to your AppleTV
2. You playback the video directly connected TV using the dongle

Push since both mean the iOS device is unusable for anything else


So in three "Real life" scenarios the AppleTV wins in 2 and push's on the other. Is that really NOT WORTH $25 more?!?!

How much do you think these things are? Who on god's green earth can't see a $25 advantage with going with an AppleTV? Even if that is all you want to do?

xArtx
Oct 9, 2013, 06:13 AM
So in three "Real life" scenarios the AppleTV wins in 2 and push's on the other. Is that really NOT WORTH $25 more?!?!

How much do you think these things are? Who on god's green earth can't see a $25 advantage with going with an AppleTV? Even if that is all you want to do?

It sounds like a happy ending, but then your Daughter takes the same photo
presentation to show her bosses at work, along with some other great ideas
she has for the company, they set aside the standard hour for her presentation,
but she arrives with an iPhone and ATV, and finds that the ATV connects to the
monitor ok, but your Daughter doesn't have the key for the company router,
and wastes time sorting that out,
and later when the company bandwidth leaks, your Daughter is fired,
and you're left paying for her car.

There are as many hypothetical situations as you want to make up.
Still, you have a device you need to plug in, connect to a router,
to do what a cable can do. All I said is it's not great
(and acknowledged convenience of wireless connection).
For me it is the most underwhelming Apple product, at least that I've used.

pojo1806
Oct 9, 2013, 06:59 AM
It sounds like a happy ending, but then your Daughter takes the same photo
presentation to show her bosses at work, along with some other great ideas
she has for the company, they set aside the standard hour for her presentation,
but she arrives with an iPhone and ATV, and finds that the ATV connects to the
monitor ok, but your Daughter doesn't have the key for the company router,
and wastes time sorting that out,
and later when the company bandwidth leaks, your Daughter is fired,
and you're left paying for her car.

There are as many hypothetical situations as you want to make up.
Still, you have a device you need to plug in, connect to a router,
to do what a cable can do. All I said is it's not great
(and acknowledged convenience of wireless connection).
For me it is the most underwhelming Apple product, at least that I've used.

Think you have gone off the track there mate LOL.

paulrbeers
Oct 9, 2013, 07:24 AM
It sounds like a happy ending, but then your Daughter takes the same photo
presentation to show her bosses at work, along with some other great ideas
she has for the company, they set aside the standard hour for her presentation,
but she arrives with an iPhone and ATV, and finds that the ATV connects to the
monitor ok, but your Daughter doesn't have the key for the company router,
and wastes time sorting that out,
and later when the company bandwidth leaks, your Daughter is fired,
and you're left paying for her car.

There are as many hypothetical situations as you want to make up.
Still, you have a device you need to plug in, connect to a router,
to do what a cable can do. All I said is it's not great
(and acknowledged convenience of wireless connection).
For me it is the most underwhelming Apple product, at least that I've used.

Umm, you said not to use hypothetical, so I gave you REAL world and you respond with some crazy hypothetical situation my 2 year old daughter might be in in 20+ years? I hate to point out to you, but by then TV's, iPhones, etc. could very well be irrelevant and most likely cables to and from devices will definitely be irrelevant. Heck we are on our way to wireless charging at a distance....

From a work standpoint, absolutely the cable makes more sense in fact I have one for presenting (VGA though because in the busines world more is done from VGA via projectors than HDMI) from my iPad, because only one person controls the content and one person controls the "experience". In a home environment, multiple people sit in front of a television at a give time and multiple people control the content/experience. That is why in a home environment where multiple people live (and we aren't talking about a Bachelor/studio apartment) that the AppleTV rules over the (almost) as expensive Apple HDMI dongle.

xArtx
Oct 9, 2013, 07:42 AM
My original post was a reply to another post in here, perhaps should have quoted.

The Lightning to HDMI adapter is $50! You can get an AppleTV refurb for $75!.....

Let's talk about what that $25 difference nets you:


You mad it one or the other there, not both.
I'm saying it's not great, nothing special about it,
additionally, it could be much more with no extra hardware.

It's not a hypothetical situation, I was just relating a possible story.
I did a presentation at work with iPad via HDMI.
If it was one or the other (adapter or ATV)
it just happens I think the adapter is better value,
but that's not the point I was initially trying to make.

"buy the adapter instead of the ATV"

It's more like:

"The ATV is, in my opinion, uninspiring","it offers nothing a cable can't do".


Umm, you said not to use hypothetical, so I gave you REAL world and you respond with some crazy hypothetical situation my 2 year old daughter might be in in 20+ years? I hate to point out to you, but by then TV's, iPhones, etc. could very well be irrelevant and most likely cables to and from devices will definitely be irrelevant. Heck we are on our way to wireless charging at a distance....

From a work standpoint, absolutely the cable makes more sense in fact I have one for presenting (VGA though because in the busines world more is done from VGA via projectors than HDMI) from my iPad, because only one person controls the content and one person controls the "experience". In a home environment, multiple people sit in front of a television at a give time and multiple people control the content/experience. That is why in a home environment where multiple people live (and we aren't talking about a Bachelor/studio apartment) that the AppleTV rules over the (almost) as expensive Apple HDMI dongle.

paulrbeers
Oct 9, 2013, 08:42 AM
My original post was a reply to another post in here, perhaps should have quoted.


You mad it one or the other there, not both.
I'm saying it's not great, nothing special about it,
additionally, it could be much more with no extra hardware.

It's not a hypothetical situation, I was just relating a possible story.
I did a presentation at work with iPad via HDMI.
If it was one or the other (adapter or ATV)
it just happens I think the adapter is better value,
but that's not the point I was initially trying to make.

"buy the adapter instead of the ATV"

It's more like:

"The ATV is, in my opinion, uninspiring","it offers nothing a cable can't do".

I'm also going to point out, you are the in the AppleTV / Home Theater section.... bring up usefulness in a business setting is contratry to this sub-forum. That's more in line with the Peripheral section below.

Next time you want to argue about usefulness, it helps to keep your audience in mind. :)

Ghostbusters
Oct 9, 2013, 08:47 AM
My original post was a reply to another post in here, perhaps should have quoted.


You mad it one or the other there, not both.
I'm saying it's not great, nothing special about it,
additionally, it could be much more with no extra hardware.

It's not a hypothetical situation, I was just relating a possible story.
I did a presentation at work with iPad via HDMI.
If it was one or the other (adapter or ATV)
it just happens I think the adapter is better value,
but that's not the point I was initially trying to make.

"buy the adapter instead of the ATV"

It's more like:

"The ATV is, in my opinion, uninspiring","it offers nothing a cable can't do".
At the end of the day this argument is pointless. Everyone knows that the Lightning to HDMI adapter is dead on arrival and useless for home use. The reason for this is all the reports of the poor quality of the adapter. People claim that not only is there a max limitation of 720p resolution but also there are artifacts (distortions) in the picture quality. Google it if you don't believe me. That and certain apps are known to have issues or incompatibility with these adapters whereas Airplay over Wifi is becoming a standard for the majority of app devs. IMO you are ultimately best off paying even $25 or even $50 more for an AppleTV.

I understand for the workplace however you do need a wired connection so as to avoid technical difficulties. But perhaps there is a way to adhoc your mobile device to the AppleTV using Wifi or Wifi Hotspot? Either way, a data plan would be needed to ensure and guarantee web and cloud service capability.

xArtx
Oct 9, 2013, 09:34 AM
That and certain apps are known to have issues or incompatibility with these adapters whereas Airplay over Wifi is becoming a standard for the majority of app devs.

Apps don't have access to ATV, only through media player framework.
The only way an App works, is it plays media through it.
The reason for any App issues through the HDMI adapter is likely
because they haven't handled an external display, or it's rotation properly, or at all.

That's a whole seperate issue.
I felt ripped off that third party devs aren't allowed in,
because third party Apps could make it a lot more than it is.

paulrbeers
Oct 9, 2013, 10:18 AM
That's a whole seperate issue.
I felt ripped off that third party devs aren't allowed in,
because third party Apps could make it a lot more than it is.

So you bought an AppleTV without doing even an ounce of research? Any review would tell you that 3rd party apps are not allowed yet (and may never be). Sounds more like your anger and disappointment should be aimed at yourself and not the AppleTV. Now you just sound really whiny.

I drive a Ford Escape w/ 1.6L engine, I'm really pissed off at Ford because it doesn't do 0-60 in 3 seconds.... /sarcasm

----------

Apps don't have access to ATV, only through media player framework.
The only way an App works, is it plays media through it.
The reason for any App issues through the HDMI adapter is likely
because they haven't handled an external display, or it's rotation properly, or at all..


P.S. Just about any of my apps that don't have Airplay support, do support Airplay Mirroring to my AppleTV. Just saying....

mic j
Oct 9, 2013, 10:19 AM
You know a thread has run it's course when you end up with 2 people just doing the tit-for-tat argument. :rolleyes:

Ghostbusters
Oct 9, 2013, 11:11 AM
Apps don't have access to ATV, only through media player framework.
The only way an App works, is it plays media through it.
The reason for any App issues through the HDMI adapter is likely
because they haven't handled an external display, or it's rotation properly, or at all.

That's a whole seperate issue.
I felt ripped off that third party devs aren't allowed in,
because third party Apps could make it a lot more than it is.

My friend, I am in agreement with you that the adapter may be worth it for certain scenarios, majority business. I understand too that some apps do not use it properly if at all due to whatever reasons you mentioned. I'm not saying it's perfect or imperfect. I am saying that for home use, the AppleTV is a better value based on testimonials regarding the cable's performance.

Believe me, I too would grab the cable over the AppleTV had the cable been able to provide 1080p output and consistent quality in performance. :(

Mockenrue
Oct 9, 2013, 03:27 PM
I'd be curious to see two polls: Apple TV vs. Roku for people who own Apple TV only and Apple TV vs. Roku for people who own both. I'm in the second category (latest model of each) and I'd vote Roku hands down. Both have a lot of room for improvement, but Apple TV's lack of apps and functionality is the most frustrating.

mic j
Oct 9, 2013, 03:59 PM
I'd be curious to see two polls: Apple TV vs. Roku for people who own Apple TV only and Apple TV vs. Roku for people who own both. I'm in the second category (latest model of each) and I'd vote Roku hands down. Both have a lot of room for improvement, but Apple TV's lack of apps and functionality is the most frustrating.
What is "functionality"?

linds15
Oct 9, 2013, 04:56 PM
I'd be curious to see two polls: Apple TV vs. Roku for people who own Apple TV only and Apple TV vs. Roku for people who own both. I'm in the second category (latest model of each) and I'd vote Roku hands down. Both have a lot of room for improvement, but Apple TV's lack of apps and functionality is the most frustrating.
i dont have a roku, but i also know i dont want one. it has a bunch of apps, almost all of which i dont use. ATV is perfect for me because i stream my itunes content, but most importantly airplay NFL gamepass and NBA leaguepass. thats the key for me

Mockenrue
Oct 9, 2013, 05:33 PM
What is "functionality"?

Off the top of my head, here are a few examples that matter to me:

Much better mobile app support: The Roku remote app works across across platforms, but no Android app for Apple TV. Also, why can't I use an ATV app on my iPad without setting up home sharing, which is useless to me since I don't use iTunes for content management?

Roku Search: ability to search across Netflix, Amazon Instant Video, VUDU and HBO GO (plus some that I don't use like Hulu Plus and Crackle).

Local USB playback: I like the option to play media from an external hard drive.

Headphone jack on the remote: I thought for sure this would be a gimmick, but it's actually really cool for late night viewing. Also: no line of site required for the remote.

Speedtest app: this is great for checking connection speeds via WiFi and my powerline adapter.

There are other features that I don't care about like motion control for gaming and the MicroSD card slot. But those might appeal to some.

I want to like Apple TV more, trust me. But AirPlay is the only real feature of value to me since I don't have any content in iTunes. If I could keep only one, it would be Roku, hands down. I hope they both step up their game... there is SO much more potential here.

And just to be clear, we have plenty of Apple devices in the house: Macbook Air, two iPads, two iPhones, iPod touch, iPod nano, etc. I'm by no means an Apple hater.

linds15
Oct 9, 2013, 05:45 PM
Off the top of my head, here are a few examples that matter to me:

Headphone jack on the remote: I thought for sure this would be a gimmick, but it's actually really cool for late night viewing. Also: no line of site required for the remote.


i really wish i could do this with an ATV, don't know if id actually use it (deep sleepers in this family) but i could see it being amazing if your SO was a light sleeper.

ATV remote doesnt need line of site. Mine is ziptied to the back of my tv bracket and the remote works when i point it at myself

mic j
Oct 9, 2013, 07:50 PM
Off the top of my head, here are a few examples that matter to me:

Much better mobile app support: The Roku remote app works across across platforms, but no Android app for Apple TV. Also, why can't I use an ATV app on my iPad without setting up home sharing, which is useless to me since I don't use iTunes for content management?

Roku Search: ability to search across Netflix, Amazon Instant Video, VUDU and HBO GO (plus some that I don't use like Hulu Plus and Crackle).

Local USB playback: I like the option to play media from an external hard drive.

Headphone jack on the remote: I thought for sure this would be a gimmick, but it's actually really cool for late night viewing. Also: no line of site required for the remote.

Speedtest app: this is great for checking connection speeds via WiFi and my powerline adapter.

There are other features that I don't care about like motion control for gaming and the MicroSD card slot. But those might appeal to some.

I want to like Apple TV more, trust me. But AirPlay is the only real feature of value to me since I don't have any content in iTunes. If I could keep only one, it would be Roku, hands down. I hope they both step up their game... there is SO much more potential here.

And just to be clear, we have plenty of Apple devices in the house: Macbook Air, two iPads, two iPhones, iPod touch, iPod nano, etc. I'm by no means an Apple hater.
That's why there are multiple products on the market. One meets one person needs, other meet others and we're all different. We can all wish for one unit that would satisfy everyones needs without being glitchy and difficult to use (I am putting the wife factor in there). At this point, I am pretty happy with what the aTV offers me. But my needs differ from yours.

surroundfan
Oct 9, 2013, 08:34 PM
...
If they added 801.2ac I'd be on one in a shot and might be able to do away with the powerline adapters

If you're having to use powerline adaptors now to get reliable transmission of data, 802.11ac will almost certainly offer no advantage whatsoever over 802.11n. Indeed 802.11n will probably be what's used anyway because it operates on 2.4GHz (which has greater range and penetration), while 802.11ac only operates at 5GHz.

As such, the only advantage of Apple incorporating 802.11ac would be to enable shuttling of huge amounts of data from a computer to the ATV, something that is simply not needed for HD video streaming...

Donka
Oct 10, 2013, 05:02 AM
I have both ATV3 and a couple of Roku's. The ATV is for the master bedroom so I can use Airplay to stream from my livingroom Mac Mini things such as Internet sports etc as well as Plex. The Roku's are in a couple of the other bedrooms for access Plex. The Roku is an excellent Plex client and gets as much use as the ATV.
If Apple opened up the ATV to third party apps then I would have ATVs all round as I would appreciate a true Plex client as well as the other functionality.
Without Plex, I wouldn't use the Rokus to be honest but like I say they area great low cost client for that system.

netdog
Oct 10, 2013, 05:05 AM
Airplay is huge nothing else compares to it. And Apple TV is connected to the world's largest store of digital content and has iCloud playback functionality. Incredible.

Actually Chromecast compares to it.

rusty2192
Oct 10, 2013, 05:44 AM
Actually Chromecast compares to it.

Actually it doesn't. Maybe if all you ever use is netflix or YouTube then Chromecast may actually be superior with its cross-platform and the ability to use the phone/tablet for other stuff after starting the video.

However, if you want to do any of the myriad of other things airplay can do then you are out of luck. Let's see you cast a video of your kid that you took with your phone for your family. How about full display mirroring from any iPhone, iPad, or Mac (in all fairness, the must be fairly recent, my old 2008 MacBook can't do it) and no, chrome tab casting doesn't count since it's only 1 tab from a computer only and is kludgy at best. And let's not forget the thousands of apps that have airplay support built right in.

I have both and the chromecast is good for what it does. We have moved to using it almost exclusively for netflix. But I would never say it comes near the Apple TV. Not yet at least.

paulrbeers
Oct 10, 2013, 10:45 AM
Actually Chromecast compares to it.

Have you actually used a Chromecast.... Google touts it as comparable, but it is certainly not. A great $35 device, but if you are a Mac user the $75 (refurb) AppleTV is a much more capable device since it can mirror your entire desktop.

I'm not saying the Chromecast isn't neat and might be just as good, but in its current state it is limited.

iapplelove
Oct 10, 2013, 06:57 PM
Roku gets no love in my house either. Apple TV best thing I bought in a long time .

xArtx
Oct 10, 2013, 09:02 PM
What is "functionality"?

You'd find out if you jailbroke your ATV,
or used any similar device that wasn't made by Apple.


I drive a Ford Escape w/ 1.6L engine, I'm really pissed off at Ford because it doesn't do 0-60 in 3 seconds.... /sarcasm

I'd be pissed too, if it was manufactured capable of the accelleration,
but was deliberately retarded by the manufacturer at considerable cost and effort.


So you bought an AppleTV without doing even an ounce of research? Any review would tell you that 3rd party apps are not allowed yet (and may never be). Sounds more like your anger and disappointment should be aimed at yourself and not the AppleTV. Now you just sound really whiny.


Absolutely. if I've already got the $1000 iDevices, Mac, and Apps in the Store,
then it makes sense to spend the $109 AU without doing any research
just for the sake of knowing what it's all about.
The result is not anger, it is disappointment all round.

The thing the company calls a hobby is the thing that should be most likely
be flexible.
If the ATV is a business on the other hand... let's make it a lock box.
It occurs to me the hobby is actually all about testing the market.

I wouldn't be any more disappointed had I purchased the thing, or not.

cynics
Oct 10, 2013, 11:08 PM
I'm kind of disappointed by the channel selection of an Apple TV vs a Roku. There are only 4 channels that interest me on my Apple TV.

I can't really find a use for AirPlay. I had a buddy over and we used it to watch Vines...but that's about it. Shared photostream is cool for a screen saver but nothing that amazing.

I definitely think Roku is a much better cable replacement.

Now that my less then one month old Apple TV is bricked I'm going to try to get a refund.

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1652709

If I can I'm gonna get a Roku, if not no biggy I'll probably get one anyway and just have both. :)

aced411
Oct 11, 2013, 06:29 PM
Roku is a cheap toy in comparison to the genius of Apple TV.

LOL riiiiiiight
Buying our 4th Roku this weekend. Meanwhile both of our Apple TV's collect dust. When you don't have cable/OTA like we do it's nice being able to watch CBS, ABC, ABC Family and use continuous play for our personal library with Plex. Dedicated PBS/PBS kids channels and a bluetooth remote with a headphones jack doesn't hurt either.

charlituna
Oct 12, 2013, 10:46 AM
I would buy one tomorrow if it was also a PVR. I think it'd be great if it could record off-air and also sync those shows to an iPad/iPhone.

They aren't likely to ever PVR the Apple TV as that would eat into their store sales. Best you could get is more of these apps like HBOgo. And with luck better terms of sale in the iTunes stores. If they could clean that act up folks wouldn't need a PVR because iTunes would serve the same basic functions

Izauze
Oct 13, 2013, 05:37 AM
I work for one of the tech companies that has an app on both the Roku and the Apple TV. I also have both devices at my home along with a samsung blu-Ray and a wii. Obviously the wii is a joke at this point, with the legacy samsung not far behind. The Roku is a fairly stable product and we do recommend it to some folks - especially those on a budget (entry $50), but the only one I use and the only one my coworkers take very seriously is the Apple TV. Thy Roku certainly has it's selling points, but I just never use it.

P.s. Do yourself a favor and never buy a vizio :)

2crazy
Oct 13, 2013, 02:04 PM
LOL riiiiiiight
Buying our 4th Roku this weekend. Meanwhile both of our Apple TV's collect dust. When you don't have cable/OTA like we do it's nice being able to watch CBS, ABC, ABC Family and use continuous play for our personal library with Plex. Dedicated PBS/PBS kids channels and a bluetooth remote with a headphones jack doesn't hurt either.

There is not much LOL involved. Everyone favors different services. All the ones you mentioned are irrelevant to me personally. I have 4 ATVs and 1 Roku. I used the Roku to watch Amazon Prime, but since you can now Airplay it, it's just collecting dust. Most people here might also have decent iTunes libraries. Plus I also discovered that the picture quality of movies and tv shows from iTunes is much better than any other streaming service. But then again, what matters to me probably doesn't matter to you. Nothing to be laughing at :-)

----------

Never had any problems streaming 1080p over wifi with my ATV3. 801.11n should be more than quick enough.

This really shouldn't be a problem. I can stream to 3 ATVs in 1080p at the same time on my N network. You probably have some other issues that is causing lag or low transmission speeds on your network. That being said I also had massive issues in the past and replaced my wireless router. It's all good since then.

But AC network may become important for 4K video in the future.

AaronM5670
Oct 13, 2013, 05:05 PM
My high school has just been kitted out with an Apple TV in every classroom - all for the purpose or AirPlay mirroring and nothing else. Seems like a bit of a waste of money considering there are about 50 classrooms and each one has a an ATV in it costing £100 a pop, and every teacher has an iPad 4 costing £479 each. As our school WiFi is so slow, the mirroring is very laggy so it makes it ridiculously slow - it's pointless.

I wonder how long it'll be before one of us students realises we can swap the mirroring to our iPhones (most students have a 4S/5/5S) and then wreak havoc on every lesson - it's completely unsecured... :rolleyes: :eek:

Back on topic...I'm probably going to order a refurb ATV 3 for £75 as soon as I have the £££. Seems worth it even if a new one comes out later this month. I'll just use a powerline Ethernet connector which I already have in my living room. My WiFi is far too slow especially seeing as I'll have 2 iPhones, an iPad, an iMac and a PC all hooked up to my router at once - at least all those devices make the ATV worth it! :D

I went in my local entertainment exchange store and they were trying to sell a used ATV 2nd gen for £140. I don't think any old unsuspecting buyer will realise that you can get a brand new 3rd gen straight from Apple for nearly half that. What a rip off. :eek:

Donka
Oct 14, 2013, 02:39 AM
I went in my local entertainment exchange store and they were trying to sell a used ATV 2nd gen for £140. I don't think any old unsuspecting buyer will realise that you can get a brand new 3rd gen straight from Apple for nearly half that. What a rip off. :eek:

That is the going rate for an ATV2 because they can be jail broken. I sold mine for a good bit more actually.

rusty2192
Oct 14, 2013, 05:36 AM
That is the going rate for an ATV2 because they can be jail broken. I sold mine for a good bit more actually.

Yep. Just sold mine for $200 and probably could have gotten more. Sometimes it pays to procrastinate on updates :D Untethered jailbreak FTW.

I decided I didn't need the jailbreak anymore, so I figured I would make a little cash. Now I'm just biding my time until the 22nd to see if they do come out with anything new. If not, I'll pick up a refurb ATV 3.

Donka
Oct 14, 2013, 05:49 AM
To be honest, unless they open up to third party apps - the ATV3 is all you would need at the moment. Performance is fine for 1080p and it has Wifi n & Bluetooth included. Not sure what any potential upgrades (Wifi AC or faster cpu) would give the end user to be honest.

excommie
Oct 14, 2013, 08:10 AM
I have both (Roku 3 and Apple Tv 3).
I think you need both if you want to cut cable (as I did). It's a small price to pay for both, if you're saving $60 a month by not having cable bills.

Roku 3 for:

- Amazon Prime Stream
- Nextflix (I still find Netflix buggy on Apple TV)
- Pandora - once we started using Pandora - who cares about iTunes?
- HBO - quicker interface than Apple TV
- Plex - great interface, easier to stream and maintain than iTunes.

Apple TV for:
- Slideshows from iPhoto with background music - nothing on Roku is even close
- Disney channels using cable authentication - exclusive to Apple TV.
- Airplay, but personally I don't use it much

Menel
Oct 14, 2013, 08:34 AM
I'm doubtful.

1. 802.11ac update?
That's possible. It might be that Apple wants to move forward with entire product line. Asuming, big assumption, that iPad and Airport Express get an 802.11ac update as well.

2. A6 or A7 single core update from the A5?
Possible. But not needed for their 1080P content. I only see this happening if they move forward with opening an app store, and push gaming and controller support *please please please please* Apple could wipe Nintendo off the map for entry level gaming, kid targetted etc.

3. 4K UHD support for AppleTV and iTunes.
H264 would have huge file sizes.
H265 was only recently finalized.
A6 doesn't support either in hardware. There's no sign that A7 supports that high of bitrate for H264 hardware, unless it was just conveniently omitted from iPhone 5S . H265 is possible, since Apple TV has dedicated power, they could run it in software decode on an A7 without battery drain concern. But it's too soon for them to have a large library moved over to H265 anyway...

I don't see anything interesting they can do with AppleTV unless they do number 2. Which seems to make all sorts of sense! But it has for years and Apple has shunned that business angle.

BuddyRich
Oct 14, 2013, 10:27 AM
Wishes for a future ATV

1. Direct NAS/SMB share access without coming from an iTunes Server Home Sharing.

2. MKV container support. Though MP4 isn't bad and offers tagging for metadata vs. some sort of database for metadata that MKV would need.

2.5 Added this one after to go along with MKV. Better subtitle support with an option for forced subtitles only. This is what MKV excels at. Mp4 supports srts but PGS subs need to be "burned-in" whereas MKV supports them as a separate file. The ATV video player would also have to be updated to know what to do with them.

3. VC-1 codec support

4. Lossless 7.1 HD Audio in both major formats (Dolby TruHD and DTS-HD/MA)... Even just expanding lossy support to also include Lossy DTS 5.1 to go along with DD AC3 would be an improvement so it could play the core of both types of HD tracks at least.

5. Higher than L4.0 H264 Profile support. Say L4.1 or L5.1... As it is, some of my Bluray Rips stutter on playback, not due to network but do to higher than 25Mbps bitrate which is the max of L4.0. I only have a rev1 ATV3 though, so perhaps the rev. with the A6 fixes this?

6. Gigabit Ethernet port. In theory 100Mbps should be enough, with protocol overhead, you can come close to having issues streaming the 54 Mbps max of raw bluray (though the A5 struggles with processing high bitrates anyway this is only necessary if there is a bump in H264 profile support).

7. More of a nice to have for future use but wireless AC support

8. 3rd party apps via app store necessitating more flash on ATV say 16 or 32 GB of flash.

9. Remote app update that allows a coverflowesque way to play media on ATV rather than simply emulating the up-down-left-right of the remote. The fact that it allows this on a normal itunes library would mean it wouldn't be much to implement for ATV.

10. On the 2.0 audio side FLAC support, and bit perfect output via HDMI or optical. Right now 16/44 is output as 16/48. And 24 bit anything is downsampled, never mind hires stuff.

Despite that long list of wishes I love my Apple TV. As a settop streaming device, it is unrivaled. It is also dead easy to use so it has a high WAF going for it. Its netflix quality is superb, and the streaming apps it does have are all high quality in their streams. MLBTV and NHLGC in particular are awesome. It would be perfect if it also had a native NFL Gamepass app for everyone outside of US where you can get that service. Only thing that compares quality-wise is PS3 Netflix and MLB apps (I like both the UI and quality on it better), but the PS3 NHL app sucks in comparison. Its all the same services, but some devices have access to better streams or have better buffering built in the apps that makes all the difference across these streaming devices. Add in Airplay/Mirroring and sharing things like photos and videos from my iphone is great. Better photo sharing would be nice as I am a dSLR user and use Lightroom to catalog my serious photography which can't be shared easily.

That being said, an ATV for the living room TV is one thing but it would have to incorporate many of those wishes above to displace XBMC on a SFF PC on Win8 in my HT. It requires more tinkering (not much mind you) to get working right but with xbmc plugins for all the same services that the ATV supports, except netflix I am not missing anything, except a rental library. Vudu for PC isn't bad but lacks surround sound. Which is the reason why I say go with Win8. The Win8 netflix app has access to DD+ 5.1 audio and the SuperHD 1080p stream and is high-quality. Only thing is you need to use a mouse or a trackpad to navigate. Bonus is since its a PC you can do some gaming on it as well with Steam BPM or various emulators with direct plugins for XBMC.

adbe
Oct 14, 2013, 10:35 AM
I'd be pissed too, if it was manufactured capable of the accelleration,
but was deliberately retarded by the manufacturer at considerable cost and effort.


This truly makes no sense. In what world did Apple go to considerable cost and effort to *not* develop an API, AppStore, marketing, and developer tools for the AppleTV?

benji888
Oct 15, 2013, 02:27 AM
I don't see anything interesting they can do with AppleTV unless they do number 2. Which seems to make all sorts of sense! But it has for years and Apple has shunned that business angle.
This truly makes no sense. In what world did Apple go to considerable cost and effort to *not* develop an API, AppStore, marketing, and developer tools for the AppleTV?
The reason is clear if you've been following Apple TV rumors for the past few years. The set top box will not see any major upgrade and will never open to API or do games, an A5 single core can handle 1080p streaming, but, that's about it.

What Apple is up to in "secret" from what I've read of rumors and quotes from interviews w/senior execs and patents they've applied for: they plan to overturn the entire TV experience...similarly to the way Apple took over music with the iPod and iTunes (who buys and collects CDs anymore? Who goes to record stores anymore?)...Apple is developing a new TV (TV, remote, service & box) that will be internet based (no cable/satellite service needed) and compete directly with cable/satellite companies, eventually overtaking the market and, in the process innovate the "smart TV" and set-top boxes, adding a social aspect as well. It will also be the center screen for multiplayer gaming, interacting with multiple iOS devices. There will be a new way for glasses-free 3D as well, though, not sure this will be in the first iteration. It will blow everything away. And the earliest we will likely see this is a year from now.

Sorry, but, adding a little App store for developers to add apps to the Apple TV is just not going to happen. That little single core A5 can't handle intensive gaming, it's just good enough for streaming video, that's all.

To see where I'm coming from: http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=18057931&postcount=206

StinDaWg
Oct 15, 2013, 03:53 AM
The only thing I want is higher quality video that rivals Blu-ray, whether that is increased bitrate encodes or H.265 support. I'm so disappointed in their 1080p offerings. They are using better compression but only increased the bitrate 1 Mbps, because of this most shows/movies actually look better in 720p.

priitv8
Oct 15, 2013, 02:06 PM
The only thing I want is higher quality video that rivals Blu-ray, whether that is increased bitrate encodes or H.265 support. I'm so disappointed in their 1080p offerings. They are using better compression but only increased the bitrate 1 Mbps, because of this most shows/movies actually look better in 720p.Seems, like you are complaining about iTunes movie store, not the Apple TV?
The aTV 3 can play back also 1080p H.264@10Mbps+ movies, as can be read in this forum.

StinDaWg
Oct 16, 2013, 04:05 AM
Seems, like you are complaining about iTunes movie store, not the Apple TV?
The aTV 3 can play back also 1080p H.264@10Mbps+ movies, as can be read in this forum.
I'm complaining about the movie and tv shows apple sells in 1080p, the majority look worse than their 720p counterpart because of lack of bitrate.

priitv8
Oct 16, 2013, 04:30 AM
I'm complaining about the movie and tv shows apple sells in 1080p, the majority look worse than their 720p counterpart because of lack of bitrate.I see. However, this has no relation to aTV piece of hardware.
It's even strange that they offer TV Shows in 1080, because I have the impression, studios produce them in 720p and all 1080p versions I've seen have been plain upscales.

aced411
Oct 16, 2013, 07:52 AM
There is not much LOL involved. Everyone favors different services. All the ones you mentioned are irrelevant to me personally. I have 4 ATVs and 1 Roku. I used the Roku to watch Amazon Prime, but since you can now Airplay it, it's just collecting dust. Most people here might also have decent iTunes libraries. Plus I also discovered that the picture quality of movies and tv shows from iTunes is much better than any other streaming service. But then again, what matters to me probably doesn't matter to you. Nothing to be laughing at :-)

All I'm LOL'ing at is the comment about Roku being a toy. I won't get into the debate about which device is better. I agree, different strokes for different folks. I could easily be one update away from using ATV as my primary device again. I also have a decent amount of purchased iTunes content so in reality I wish they'd get their act together and put out an App Store.

aced411
Oct 16, 2013, 10:24 AM
Sorry, but, adding a little App store for developers to add apps to the Apple TV is just not going to happen. That little single core A5 can't handle intensive gaming, it's just good enough for streaming video, that's all.


Who cares about games on Apple TV? I want video streaming apps like iPad has. Give me History, ABC, Nat Geo, PBS, Plex, Amazon Instant, Vudu, Crackle and so on. What about Pandora, Spotify, MOG, Rdio etc? They're missing a huge opportunity. Yeah airplay works fine but I'm certainly not going to pull out a tablet everytime I want to watch TV. Roku gets it. Meanwhile Apple is obviously more concerned with protecting their precious iTunes ecosystem.

dgalvan123
Oct 16, 2013, 12:01 PM
I have both (Roku 3 and Apple Tv 3).
I think you need both if you want to cut cable (as I did). It's a small price to pay for both, if you're saving $60 a month by not having cable bills.
. . .
Apple TV for:

- Disney channels using cable authentication - exclusive to Apple TV.


If you cut your cable. . . how are you using Disney channels with cable authentication?

StinDaWg
Oct 16, 2013, 05:09 PM
I see. However, this has no relation to aTV piece of hardware.
It's even strange that they offer TV Shows in 1080, because I have the impression, studios produce them in 720p and all 1080p versions I've seen have been plain upscales.
Yes, it does, because if the new apple tv has H.265 support they can keep the bitrate the same and double the quality. H.265 is twice as efficient as H.264.

As for your tv shows question, almost every network/cable show today is filmed in at least 1080p, and has been for years. Some are moving towards 4K support.

flatfoot99
Oct 17, 2013, 10:50 AM
If you cut your cable. . . how are you using Disney channels with cable authentication?

good question!

r3m1
Oct 17, 2013, 12:32 PM
T

What Apple is up to in "secret" from what I've read of rumors and quotes from interviews w/senior execs and patents they've applied for: they plan to overturn the entire TV experience...similarly to the way Apple took over music with the iPod and iTunes (who buys and collects CDs anymore? Who goes to record stores anymore?)...Apple is developing a new TV (TV, remote, service & box) that will be internet based (no cable/satellite service needed) and compete directly with cable/satellite companies, eventually overtaking the market and, in the process innovate the "smart TV" and set-top boxes, adding a social aspect as well. It will also be the center screen for multiplayer gaming, interacting with multiple iOS devices. There will be a new way for glasses-free 3D as well, though, not sure this will be in the first iteration. It will blow everything away. And the earliest we will likely see this is a year from now.


I hear you but I am afraid that the movie studios have learned from their audio brethren - unless Apple is going to strike a massive deal with the content providers than there would be no chance for this to take off.

But ... what would be the incentive to make Apple distributor? On a global scale and in emerging economies iTunes is looking bleak in terms of available content and the offered quality.

priitv8
Oct 17, 2013, 01:17 PM
Yes, it does, because if the new apple tv has H.265 support they can keep the bitrate the same and double the quality.OK, now I get your point! I'm sure Apple will up the decoder to H.265 as soon as reasonable hardware becomes available. H.265 is just in the very early phase of it's market penetration IMHO. I also think that FullHD will not be driving force behind it. 4K will be. But that requires other parts of infra to become ready as well.

StinDaWg
Oct 17, 2013, 07:30 PM
OK, now I get your point! I'm sure Apple will up the decoder to H.265 as soon as reasonable hardware becomes available. H.265 is just in the very early phase of it's market penetration IMHO. I also think that FullHD will not be driving force behind it. 4K will be. But that requires other parts of infra to become ready as well.
Phones like the Samsung Galaxy S4 can already decode H.265 video. Apple could do it right now if they wanted to. I just hope they don't save it for 4K content, because that's still such a small niche at the moment.

http://www.pcworld.idg.com.au/article/456443/samsung_galaxy_s4_has_next-gen_video_codec/

priitv8
Oct 18, 2013, 12:11 AM
Phones like the Samsung Galaxy S4 can already decode H.265 video.I know. But ain't that also the lone specimen at the moment? So we can't really say H.265 decoding hardware is available en masse.

StinDaWg
Oct 18, 2013, 01:13 AM
I know. But ain't that also the lone specimen at the moment? So we can't really say H.265 decoding hardware is available en masse.
Galaxy S4 came out 6 months ago. A company like Apple could add this feature without any issue.

priitv8
Oct 18, 2013, 08:11 AM
Galaxy S4 came out 6 months ago. A company like Apple could add this feature without any issue.Even if it's a Samsung proprietary chip?
And despite H.265 standard being published this June and approved in July?
http://www.itu.int/ITU-T/newslog/ITUT+H265+Now+Available+For+Download.aspx

excommie
Oct 18, 2013, 08:16 AM
If you cut your cable. . . how are you using Disney channels with cable authentication?

Paying my brother for Disney and HBO access.

CairnsRock
Oct 19, 2013, 01:44 PM
Paying my brother for Disney and HBO access.

Sorry, that means that you haven't cut your cable.

ajiuo
Oct 20, 2013, 02:45 AM
There might be a hardware update.. I think the next big change with ATV will be software based... And I think a big part of it will be the IOS remote app... It will probably get a lot more interactivity.. I suspect that you will be able to brows, select, and play content 100% from the ios device.

ezekielrage_99
Oct 20, 2013, 06:19 AM
Lol Apple TV is a joke

**edit... I have an iPad and an iPhone5 by the way so I am in no way a "hater" or "fanboy" or whatever new term you jokers are using.

The only reason why I purchased the Apple TV was for Airplay.

sarakn
Oct 20, 2013, 07:25 AM
Full story (http://wallstcheatsheet.com/stocks/did-amazon-just-drop-an-apple-tv-clue.html/?ref=YF)

If you’re thinking about buying a new Apple TV, you may want to wait a few days. As first reported by Apple Insider, Apple’s (NASDAQ:AAPL) digital media receiver product was briefly out of stock on both the French and German versions of Amazon’s (NASDAQ:AMZN) website. While normally this would simply be an indication that Apple TV is selling well in Europe, both sites also happened to list an expected availability date of October 23.

As noted by Apple Insider, October 23 is the day after Apple’s upcoming media event on Tuesday, when the company is widely expected to unveil the fifth-generation iPad, the second-generation iPad mini, and an upgraded MacBook Pro. However, the October 23 availability date listed on some of Amazon’s online storefronts suggests that the event may also feature an Apple TV hardware refresh.

On the other hand, Amazon’s French and German webpages have since updated their Apple TV inventory status as “in stock,” so it’s quite possible that the October 23 availability date was a coincidental error. However, this is not the only Apple TV hardware rumor that is currently circulating.

megfilmworks
Oct 20, 2013, 06:45 PM
The new ATV is H.265, 4k,
It has a 3d Printer, Popcorn machine and a
time portal for viewing the Real History Channel.

scapegoat81
Oct 21, 2013, 10:50 AM
If you cut your cable. . . how are you using Disney channels with cable authentication?

good question!

Prob the same way I am. Shared login from a family member ;)

dgalvan123
Oct 21, 2013, 11:40 AM
Prob the same way I am. Shared login from a family member ;)

So then. . . you are still relying on cable. (doesn't exactly fit the definition of "cutting cable".)

scapegoat81
Oct 22, 2013, 05:13 AM
So then. . . you are still relying on cable. (doesn't exactly fit the definition of "cutting cable".)

Ok. Whatever u say bud.

whsbuss
Oct 22, 2013, 01:23 PM
Well no ATV update today.

gmbaker44
Oct 22, 2013, 01:29 PM
Well no ATV update today.

:mad:

tonyr6
Oct 22, 2013, 01:30 PM
Well no ATV update today.

Should I buy one then? It will be used mainly for Netflix. I have been waiting all summer and nothing.

mic j
Oct 22, 2013, 01:31 PM
Should I buy one then? It will be used mainly for Netflix. I have been waiting all summer and nothing.
Yes, you should buy one.

2010mini
Oct 22, 2013, 01:31 PM
Well no ATV update today.

$#$%^&&*!!!!!!

whsbuss
Oct 22, 2013, 01:41 PM
Should I buy one then? It will be used mainly for Netflix. I have been waiting all summer and nothing.

Yes definitely. ATV has the best Netflix interface.

dewthedru
Oct 22, 2013, 01:42 PM
Well no ATV update today.


well crap

Risco
Oct 22, 2013, 01:43 PM
Yup no hardware update, no iOS gui update and no new Mac Mini!

OpTic Jayex
Oct 22, 2013, 01:44 PM
Well, I guess I'll buy a 3rd Gen Apple TV then!

bwsteg
Oct 22, 2013, 01:45 PM
Well, I guess I'll buy a 3rd Gen Apple TV then!

Me too...

mic j
Oct 22, 2013, 01:45 PM
Just to keep this thread going....I'll start the rumor that a new aTV will be introduced spring 2014!!! :D

Tilpots
Oct 22, 2013, 01:48 PM
Just to keep this thread going....I'll start the rumor that a new aTV will be introduced spring 2014!!! :D

Srsly? I'm waiting!

tonyr6
Oct 22, 2013, 01:54 PM
Okay I ordered a refurbished Apple TV off the Apple store. Anyone that got a refurbished ATV. How was the condition? Also is it actually a ATV3 and is it a Rev A? Thanks.

jaysue
Oct 22, 2013, 02:13 PM
They mentioned iMovie Theater for Apple TV, so there must be an update coming right? or has this been there?

mic j
Oct 22, 2013, 02:22 PM
They mentioned iMovie Theater for Apple TV, so there must be an update coming right? or has this been there?
Yes, probably will be an update. Sort of like the one that added iRadio. Don't expect much more than a new icon.

rusty2192
Oct 22, 2013, 02:31 PM
Like others, I just placed my order for a refurb ATV 3. I was still holding out hope that it would be updated, but didn't really expect it. I'm just ready to have an Apple TV again after selling my ATV 2 about a month ago.

cynics
Oct 22, 2013, 02:42 PM
Okay I ordered a refurbished Apple TV off the Apple store. Anyone that got a refurbished ATV. How was the condition? Also is it actually a ATV3 and is it a Rev A? Thanks.

Speaking from one of my friends experiences.

Like new, yes and yes.

Don't know if they are all like that.

gmbaker44
Oct 22, 2013, 03:23 PM
Like others, I just placed my order for a refurb ATV 3. I was still holding out hope that it would be updated, but didn't really expect it. I'm just ready to have an Apple TV again after selling my ATV 2 about a month ago.

Just bought a refurbished ATV3 too. Can't wait any longer.

JuanC
Oct 22, 2013, 03:27 PM
I'm also waiting for the new Apple TV....

I'm very disappointed :mad:. Now what? Would be a new Apple TV soon?

tonyr6
Oct 22, 2013, 03:29 PM
Since my primary viewing will be Netflix and Youtube I should be fine with current ATV? Right.

2010mini
Oct 22, 2013, 03:49 PM
Since my primary viewing will be Netflix and Youtube I should be fine with current ATV? Right.

Yes

musio
Oct 22, 2013, 04:10 PM
Nearly 600 days until the last refresh. Something has to be coming, this is the longest time yet

charlien
Oct 22, 2013, 04:18 PM
I installed PlexConnect on my three ATV 3s and couldn't be happier. I really could care less if they update them or not. In a way, I hope they don't cause I suspect it will break my set up. And I'm usually the guy standing line to buy the latest and greatest.

priitv8
Oct 23, 2013, 09:44 AM
I installed PlexConnect on my three ATV 3s and couldn't be happier.How did you do that? By hijacking the Trailers app or some other trick?
I've given me same thought, but as our :apple:TV 3 can't be jailbroken, and iOS 7 broke the Add Site workaround, I'm currently at loss on how to approach this.

charlien
Oct 23, 2013, 09:53 AM
How did you do that? By hijacking the Trailers app or some other trick?
I've given me same thought, but as our :apple:TV 3 can't be jailbroken, and iOS 7 broke the Add Site workaround, I'm currently at loss on how to approach this.

Hijacked the trailers app. It's pretty easy to do. Apple made it a little harder about a month ago when they moved to secure certificate but I followed an online guide and installed my self signed certificate on all three units in less than an hour - the first one took about 30 minutes. The are all ATV3 with IOS 7.

priitv8
Oct 23, 2013, 10:59 AM
Hijacked the trailers app. It's pretty easy to do.OK, I'll check this out.

institute
Oct 23, 2013, 01:59 PM
Plexconnect works really well. Highly recommend it.

xArtx
Nov 3, 2013, 09:07 PM
I'd be curious to see two polls: Apple TV vs. Roku for people who own Apple TV only and Apple TV..

What is the purpose of a poll from ppl who don't know what they are missing?

This truly makes no sense. In what world did Apple go to considerable cost and effort to *not* develop an API, AppStore, marketing, and developer tools for the AppleTV?

The same world where many more services exist that are offered in the ATV menu,
and action has been taken to disable services when methods were found to accommodate one or more of them.

I'd be curious to see two polls: Apple TV vs. Roku for people who own Apple TV only and Apple TV..

What I'd be interested in, is the kind of poll from people who own an ATV,
and no other Apple product, and the ATV was the first experience with any
Apple product.

Crazy Badger
Nov 4, 2013, 02:52 AM
Plexconnect works really well. Highly recommend it.

+1

I've managed to move my Plex Media Server and Plexconnect across to my FreeNAS box which already had all my media stored. Can now access from any device (OSX, iOS, aTV, Web) without my iMac running :D

And Plexconnect works with any aTV (no need to jailbreak) so will be looking to replace my aTV2 with a newer version shortly. Would be nice if it was just after Apple release a aTV4...

Mockenrue
Nov 4, 2013, 10:26 AM
What is the purpose of a poll from ppl who don't know what they are missing?

That would be the point of such a hypothetical poll. I've seen a number of threads where people assert ATV's superiority and seem to know exactly what they're missing, despite not owning a Roku. Those of us with both tend to prefer Roku (but acknowledge that both have a lot of room for improvement). There tends to be more passion from those who stick with one ecosystem. Vendor-agnostics like me tend to shrug and buy what we think is best without a rooting interest.

KhunJay
Nov 5, 2013, 05:22 AM
Guys, I need to decide within a week whether to get a Roku3 or ATV3.

Have read up on the capabilities of both.

I'm not tuned into tech stuff that much but would any of you know if either roku or apple tv is set for some significant updates.

Last time I bought a Macbook Air, they released the haswell version just 2 months later and I was gutted. Dont want to repeat this.

Donka
Nov 5, 2013, 05:31 AM
Guys, I need to decide within a week whether to get a Roku3 or ATV3.

Have read up on the capabilities of both.

I'm not tuned into tech stuff that much but would any of you know if either roku or apple tv is set for some significant updates.

Last time I bought a Macbook Air, they released the haswell version just 2 months later and I was gutted. Dont want to repeat this.

No word on an Apple TV refresh. Roku just went through a refresh in the last couple of months over here in the UK.
What are your needs as that will be the main deciding factor?

dgalvan123
Nov 7, 2013, 02:30 PM
I installed PlexConnect on my three ATV 3s and couldn't be happier. I really could care less if they update them or not. In a way, I hope they don't cause I suspect it will break my set up. And I'm usually the guy standing line to buy the latest and greatest.

Does PlexConnect give you access to Free Hulu streaming via a Plex add-on? Or is PlexConnect only useful for streaming non-iTunes videos stored on your computer?

I have jailbroken ATV2's running XBMC. I've found the only jailbroken feature I really use is the free Hulu access via the Hulu add-on for XBMC. If I could get that feature via PlexConnect, that would be the last straw and I would sell my ATV2's and get ATV3's.

KhunJay
Nov 8, 2013, 04:13 AM
No word on an Apple TV refresh. Roku just went through a refresh in the last couple of months over here in the UK.
What are your needs as that will be the main deciding factor?

I dont use itunes for movies and music. I want netflix, hulu basic and some private news channels. That's it for now.

Everything points to a Roku 3 unless atv is on the cusp of releasing something significant.

cynics
Nov 8, 2013, 08:03 AM
I dont use itunes for movies and music. I want netflix, hulu basic and some private news channels. That's it for now.

Everything points to a Roku 3 unless atv is on the cusp of releasing something significant.

No one knows for sure but most think not.

Go with what works best for you now. If something significant does come out sell the Roku and get an ATV. These devices aren't all that pricey.