23" Apple Cinema Display... Disapponting!

[Zoowatch]

today, my university department received our 23" ACD batch order and all of us were so excited about brand new screens, larger working space...

but the initial excitement soon turned into disappointment as we discovered that 4 out of 5 displays we received had an obvious "pink cast"... especially when we looked at shades of grey / metallic scheme of Mac OS X. We tried software and hardware calibrations but the pink cast remained. To confirm this, we compared them to the PowerBooks, eMacs and 20" ACD... we even borrowed a 30" ACD from another staff and placed each of them next to the 23" ACD. It is a truly disappointing quality from Apple.

secondly, all 5 had faint grey vertical bands (about 1 pixel wide). These bands were quite obvious towards the centre of the screen. We tried viewing vector images with curves and solid colour lines on these displays. They did not look as good as ones on the 20" or 30"ACD because the grey vertical bands somehow 'distorted' these line when we examined closely (hard to describe in words, but the output was definitely inferior to Dell 24" monitor.

lastly, when we tried watching DVDs, switching off all lights in the room, the display backlight was quite uneven (backlight bleeding at the edge of the screen) in 3 out of 5 (the other 2 were acceptable). We used Pixel Check to show solid black image in fullscreen and the backlight bleeding seen in a dark room made the 23" ACD look really ugly.


we initially expected some dead / stuck / hot pixels. All of them did not have any dead pixel as far as we could see. But we concluded that the 23" ACD is the worst among all of Apple displays (except for the eMac CRT and 15" PowerBook).

All 5 displays has been rejected and we will claim a refund from the supplier.

Sorry for making this sound like a rant.


If you are looking for a 23" ACD... i would urge you not to buy it until the display has been updated.

[Zoowatch]

Also, we observed another strange phenomenon on these 23" ACD...

(by the way... all of the ACDs are connected to the Dual PowerMac G5)

we opened Photoshop and created a new reasonably large image containing only a single dark solid colour (dark brown, dark blue, black etc.)

we opened a Finder window and placed the Finder window directly behind these dark images. Then, we switched back to Photoshop.

These dark images were supposed to be opaque, but we could faintly see the grey outlines of the finder windows behind it.

we didn't bother to find out why, just assuming that Apple's quality control is poor for the 23" ACD...

that's when we knew we had to pick up those beautiful boxes and start wrapping up these displays. we never had so many rejected items in a single order before.

[terrorbite]

We've got those displays at our uni, and they are fine. Maybe yours were part of a bad batch or something.

I'm sure there would be more complaints by now if it was a common thing.

[EricNau]

I've heard of similar complaints. (mostly the pink-ish coloring)

[dejo]

Also, we observed another strange phenomenon on these 23" ACD...

(by the way... all of the ACDs are connected to the Dual PowerMac G5)

we opened Photoshop and created a new reasonably large image containing only a single dark solid colour (dark brown, dark blue, black etc.)

we opened a Finder window and placed the Finder window directly behind these dark images. Then, we switched back to Photoshop.

These dark images were supposed to be opaque, but we could faintly see the grey outlines of the finder windows behind it.

we didn't bother to find out why, just assuming that Apple's quality control is poor for the 23" ACD...

that's when we knew we had to pick up those beautiful boxes and start wrapping up these displays. we never had so many rejected items in a single order before.

Hmm, this sounds strange. I would think that this would indicate a problem with the graphics card or, more likely, the OS screen rendering, when stuff that's supposed to be opaque is not. The display is still only 2D. It has no idea there is a Finder window behind a black space unless it is being told so.

[danny_w]

I'm afraid that the pink cast is a very common complaint on these displays. Several people have said that it has been resolved in the latest batches, but apparently not from your experience. I've never heard of this problem with the 20" or 30" displays, only the 23" for some reason.

[Jon'sLightBulbs]

Yikes. I am about to open up a new ACD 23. This is forbidding news. There must be some way to determine how recently the display was produced by looking at the box. Hopefully the newer ones are better.

[Iyan]

I bought one during Thanksgiving last year. It looked great. However, mine was showing very obvious uneven backlight. Two areas were brighter than others, like there were two bulbs right behind the screen. I returned it to Apple Store next day and exchanged a 20-inch one. Since then I have great experience with it.

[Zoowatch]

have anyone used the 24" Dell monitor before?

do they work with Power Mac just as well as Apple Displays?

just would like to know this as an option...

considering that Dell is fast catching up with Apple in terms of displays
(the 30" Dell looks promising!)

[p0intblank]

have anyone used the 24" Dell monitor before?

do they work with Power Mac just as well as Apple Displays?

just would like to know this as an option...

considering that Dell is fast catching up with Apple in terms of displays
(the 30" Dell looks promising!)

Apple and Dell both use the same panels (Samsung I believe) for their monitors, so the quality is excellent either way, except for the 23" in your case. I have a Dell 2005FPW (20.1") on my Windows machine and love it. Gaming on it is great and best of all: I got it for a little over $500. You can find them for around $400 even. As far as their 24" models go, which is the 2405FPW, I've heard they are fantastic as well. You can get one for around $900 or so with coupons, maybe even $800 (not sure about this one). The only reason I don't have a Dell monitor hooked up to my PowerBook is because I am eventually getting a Cinema Display. I'm one of those people who have to have their gadgets match. But as far as Dell's displays go, I say jump for them. They're excellent quality and very cheap.

[danny_w]

I also have a Dell 2005fpw 20" hooked to my Mac mini and I love it! I haven't seen their 24" though. The benefit of the Dell (besides the lower price) is the inclusion of VGA, DVI, Composite, and S-Video inputs, and a USB hub. The case does not look as nice as the Apple, but it is really not bad. And 1/2 the price!

[Zoowatch]

Also, we observed another strange phenomenon on these 23" ACD...

(by the way... all of the ACDs are connected to the Dual PowerMac G5)

we opened Photoshop and created a new reasonably large image containing only a single dark solid colour (dark brown, dark blue, black etc.)

we opened a Finder window and placed the Finder window directly behind these dark images. Then, we switched back to Photoshop.

These dark images were supposed to be opaque, but we could faintly see the grey outlines of the finder windows behind it.


i found this out today from Apple discussion board by BSteely

this is what he said:




The problem of a phantom image of a previous screen sounds like image sticking, or image retention, which is a known issue with IPS technology, which is the underlying technology of the LCD screen in the 23" ACD. Basically what happens is that an electric charge gets trapped within the pixel, like static electricity, and charge is what the LC material responds to. So even though the pixel is no longer being driven, the stuck charge causes a phantom image to appear. It looks a lot like phosphor burn from the bad old days of CRT monitors, but it is a completely different phenomenon.

Fortunately, it's not permenant, and the stuck charge will eventually bleed off. But if your monitor is badly afflicted with the problem, and if you are under warranty, I'd be tempted to get a replacement.

[electronboy]

Apple and Dell both use the same panels (Samsung I believe) for their monitors, so the quality is excellent either way, except for the 23" in your case... But as far as Dell's displays go, I say jump for them. They're excellent quality and very cheap.

YUCK! I could not imagine a Dell display attached to my PowerMac! Just get a samsung 214T or 204T in silver.

[Morn]

Dell 24" is not the same panel as the apple 23" (err, different size too) apple has a LG panel, Dell samsung.

[Zoowatch]

from Apple Nova forum:

"Just a quick note for those suggesting color calibration:A good percentage of the 23" apple displays are permanetly pink. This is a well known and documented problem which no amount of calibration will ever remedy.

Granted, there are people that have a slightly pink display that can be fixed by calibration. Yet, this is of no help to those with one of the defective displays.Do a quick google on pink apple display problems and you'll turn up a billion reports. It really is astounding that there hasn't been a recall. I'm not one to scream the sky is falling, but in this case, the product has a widespread, major defect."

this is the pink cast i am talking about

http://www.sonofsylvanus.homechoice.co.uk/images/pink_hue1_large.jpg

[Dreadnought]

Let's hope the new displays will be better, because I want one and am waiting for MWSF for an update! 4 days and counting!

[MacTruck]

I don't know why people shell out extra bucks for the apple monitors. You can get a larger dell for cheaper. I got my 24" dell 2405s for $740 each after discount codes applied. That was when they FIRST came out too last year and these monitors are absolutely the best.


Why buy a dell over an apple?

- The dell are almost half the price.
- They are a whole 1 inch larger.
- The come with the VESA wall mount already.
- They have attachable speakers.
- They have 5 inputs. (component, composite, VGA, DVI, S-Video)
- They have a USB HUB onboard.
- They have a built in memory card reader.
- They are better quality.


The only reason people have bought the apple is either out of loyalty or they think the aluminum looks better. Now thats just plain stupid.

Dell monitors rock. I will be getting the Dell 30" very soon.

[jaduffy108]

have anyone used the 24" Dell monitor before?

do they work with Power Mac just as well as Apple Displays?

just would like to know this as an option...

considering that Dell is fast catching up with Apple in terms of displays
(the 30" Dell looks promising!)


>>>After reading the review at barefeats.com, i bought the Dell 24 instead of the Apple 23. Very happy with the Dell's performance. Very. The Dell works like a charm with Power Macs. The issues with the Apple 23 you experienced are discussed in the barefeats.com review.

peace

[EricNau]

I don't know why people shell out extra bucks for the apple monitors. You can get a larger dell for cheaper. I got my 24" dell 2405s for $740 each after discount codes applied. That was when they FIRST came out too last year and these monitors are absolutely the best.


Why buy a dell over an apple?

- The dell are almost half the price.
- They are a whole 1 inch larger.
- The come with the VESA wall mount already.
- They have attachable speakers.
- They have 5 inputs. (component, composite, VGA, DVI, S-Video)
- They have a USB HUB onboard.
- They have a built in memory card reader.
- They are better quality.


The only reason people have bought the apple is either out of loyalty or they think the aluminum looks better. Now thats just plain stupid.

Dell monitors rock. I will be getting the Dell 30" very soon.
People buy Apple displays because they look much better. I'm not saying I would spend the extra money for one, but they definitely look better next to your Powerbook or Powermac.

[MacTruck]

People buy Apple displays because they look much better. I'm not saying I would spend the extra money for one, but they definitely look better next to your Powerbook or Powermac.


Well thats what I said.

[chaosbunny]

- The dell are almost half the price.

That is just wrong. Where I live the 20" dell costs 750 € compared to 820 € for the 20" apple cinema display. That is not half the price if you are able to calculate. Maybe they are half the price where you live, but dell has some very different prices for different countries and to make such a general statement like you did is "just plain stupid".

Also you can't call people stupid who like a display that looks good standing around. And the aluminium apple displays look far better than the black dell plastic ones.

That said I've won a 21" eizo monitor a couple of weeks ago, like it says in my sig. I can only recomend this display over both apples and dells. It is priced between the 20" acd and the 24" dell. In terms of color and illumination it blows both the apple and the dell display away, even at 90% brightness. It comes with all cables, usb hub and even has a build in kvm switch.

[danny_w]

In the US at least, coupons are routinely available for Dell products that can bring the price down dramatically. For instance, the Apple 20" sells for $799 USD, and the 20" Dell for $579 USD (recent price drop?), but coupons can quite often bring the Dell down to $389 USD or less. So yes, in the US at least, the Dell can be had for less than half of the Apple price. However, there is also something to be said for the aesthetics of the Apple displays (they are really beautiful), and to some people this is worth the extra price. Different people have different priorities, which is fine.

[p0intblank]

YUCK! I could not imagine a Dell display attached to my PowerMac! Just get a samsung 214T or 204T in silver.

You failed to quote the part of the my post where I mentioned I like to have my gadgets match...

MacTruck, how is wanting to spend the extra money just because you want it to match stupid? People, like myself, are willing to spend the extra. Also the Dell displays do not have a FireWire hub, and I could really benefit from the one on Apple's.

[MacTruck]

You failed to quote the part of the my post where I mentioned I like to have my gadgets match...

MacTruck, how is wanting to spend the extra money just because you want it to match stupid? People, like myself, are willing to spend the extra. Also the Dell displays do not have a FireWire hub, and I could really benefit from the one on Apple's.


For the price of one 23" apple display I was able to purchase two 24" Dell displays. Right now I am using them on a G5 and its great. I click on the mode button and am playing xbox 360 on the left one, switch it again and am back to the mac. I'm sorry for saying the decision to buy an apple was stupid. I will just say buying a Dell is smarter. :)

[combatcolin]

Very happy with my big Dell.

[mklos]

For the price of one 23" apple display I was able to purchase two 24" Dell displays. Right now I am using them on a G5 and its great. I click on the mode button and am playing xbox 360 on the left one, switch it again and am back to the mac. I'm sorry for saying the decision to buy an apple was stupid. I will just say buying a Dell is smarter. :)

What did you do, get a buy one get one free deal or something? I would never put any kind of Dell crap on my Mac. Thats just what I want, I spend $2500 for a Mac and I have to sit there and look at a stupid Dell logo. Yeah, right!

Dell=CRAP!!!!!

My 20" Aluminum Display doesn't look any worse than the 20" Dell one and isn't that much more. I would go for the Apple one in a heartbeat. Who cares about all of the extra crap thats on the back of it. Its just useless stuff that you'll never use.

[wheezy]

I wouldn't say it's OCD...but, it's kinda OCD. I like things to match, look clean and all that. Not saying a Dell couldn't match my desk setup, but, for the now, the plastic bulk stands are just not as good looking to me as the aluminum CD. I wouldn't call someone stupid because they want that look over the dell look, yes, the monitors perform the same, but for some there is more than performance that they want. They want style, and, Apple kills everyone else in terms of style. Sometimes it IS form over function.

There is so much mocking and fighting on this stinkin website...welcome to MOCKRUMORS, where my dad can beat up your dad. Leave the playground!

[hrfforlife]

i found this out today from Apple discussion board by BSteely

this is what he said:




The problem of a phantom image of a previous screen sounds like image sticking, or image retention, which is a known issue with IPS technology, which is the underlying technology of the LCD screen in the 23" ACD. Basically what happens is that an electric charge gets trapped within the pixel, like static electricity, and charge is what the LC material responds to. So even though the pixel is no longer being driven, the stuck charge causes a phantom image to appear. It looks a lot like phosphor burn from the bad old days of CRT monitors, but it is a completely different phenomenon.

Fortunately, it's not permenant, and the stuck charge will eventually bleed off. But if your monitor is badly afflicted with the problem, and if you are under warranty, I'd be tempted to get a replacement.

My 23" Apple display is 6 mos old. The first day I used it I had the same ghosting problems. I considered taking it back, but after the first day of use the ghosting stopped. The color has been fine, but the contrast is not as good as most dell's that I have seen and used.

[MacTruck]

What did you do, get a buy one get one free deal or something?



You could say that. Just the monthly Dell coupons brought the price down from $1200 to $700. Find that kind of deal on an Apple display.

I don't understand how people can say the dell is ugly. ITS A BEZEL, its just black instead of Silver. Hey but if thats worth spending over twice as much for an inferior monitor, go for it.
:p

[Morn]

Not impressed with the view angle on my 24" Dell. And the color reproduction for darker shades can be patchy and poor. Which is the most annoying in movies, night scenes etc.

[kingcrowing]

man, that sucks, I've only seen one 23" ACD at smalldog and it was great, I didnt use it much, but it looked great, I hope you can get some replacement ones that work better!

[Morn]

Apple does replace monitors with this problem, so I've heard from people who've had it.

[liquidh2o]

I also ended up going w/ a dell over an apple display. Got the 2005fpw (20" widescreen) dell for about $390. Quite a bit cheaper than the $700 price tag for a refurb'd 20" apple display. And AFAIK they both use the same lcd panel, so it all comes down to preference of aesthetic design and price. Price was the determining factor for me.

[combatcolin]

What did you do, get a buy one get one free deal or something? I would never put any kind of Dell crap on my Mac. Thats just what I want, I spend $2500 for a Mac and I have to sit there and look at a stupid Dell logo. Yeah, right!

Dell=CRAP!!!!!

My 20" Aluminum Display doesn't look any worse than the 20" Dell one and isn't that much more. I would go for the Apple one in a heartbeat. Who cares about all of the extra crap thats on the back of it. Its just useless stuff that you'll never use.

Cut down on the coffee or switch to de caff.

Your heading deangerously into the realm of the Mac Zealot my friend, of which there is no return to subjective or free thinking.