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gopher
Jan 23, 2003, 11:28 AM
http://www.cube-zone.com/

That would be amazing!

Not that I believe it, I don't. All the rumors before I heard was not till September at the earliest.

Ambrose Chapel
Jan 23, 2003, 11:36 AM
Well it just said 'new hardware...' I think an iMac update is more likely, to coincide with the iLife release. I wonder if this reported iLife delay will have any effect on that?

MacsRgr8
Jan 23, 2003, 11:46 AM
"IBM is also supposed to make announcements the same day"

Maybe they will announce that the PPC 970 will be installed in future Macs?

Dont Hurt Me
Jan 23, 2003, 12:08 PM
Originally posted by MacsRgr8
"IBM is also supposed to make announcements the same day"

Maybe they will announce that the PPC 970 will be installed in future Macs? Just wondering how you know Ibm is supposed to be making anouncements the same day. I think the imacs will get bumped up and 133 bus to go with it but as far as the 970 goes if it is used at all will more likely be late summer. It sure would be fantastic though if apple told moto to stick it and went with Ibm in a crash program-- lets get it to market! Heck I would love to see the 970 in a Imac thats all i would need But i dont think that will happen either. Look for the usual itsy bitsy tiny winy moto bumps untill 970 shows it self! One more thought though remember when early imacs were g3 only then did apple come out with g4 towers, well now we have g4 imacs so probably the 7457 g4 might be introduced as a g5??? and god how many years has it taken motorola to go from what i think 350 mhz g4 to our 1 gigs 3 or 4yrs?? and please dont mention 1.25 ghz cause we all know apple has clocked those 1 gigers up and thats why the wind tunnel.

steveg56
Jan 23, 2003, 12:15 PM
I think Apple will keep Moto and the G4 around for ibook, emac and possibly the imac and go with 970 for the Powerbooks and Powermacs. I think it will be the same approach as with Intel and the celeron and pentium class...what do you guy's think!

jrv3034
Jan 23, 2003, 01:11 PM
Originally posted by steveg56
I think Apple will keep Moto and the G4 around for ibook, emac and possibly the imac and go with 970 for the Powerbooks and Powermacs. I think it will be the same approach as with Intel and the celeron and pentium class...what do you guy's think!

Absolutely. They'll need a distinction between iProducts and PowerProducts. It would be awesome if the PPC970 comes out in Jan or Feb, but I doubt it.

Here's hoping!:D

wormy
Jan 23, 2003, 01:37 PM
I highly doubt Steve would proclaim it the Year of the Laptop, and then bust out the PPC970 a month or two later. I would bust a log in my pants though if he does. ;)

pgwalsh
Jan 23, 2003, 01:52 PM
Originally posted by wormy
I would bust a log in my pants though if he does. ;) Promise?

MacsRgr8
Jan 23, 2003, 02:20 PM
Originally posted by Dont Hurt Me
One more thought though remember when early imacs were g3 only then did apple come out with g4 towers, well now we have g4 imacs so probably the 7457 g4 might be introduced as a g5??? and god how many years has it taken motorola to go from what i think 350 mhz g4 to our 1 gigs 3 or 4yrs?? and please dont mention 1.25 ghz cause we all know apple has clocked those 1 gigers up and thats why the wind tunnel.

I don't think Apple can name these 7457 G4s new G5s. Maybe if the 7457 does support FSB and BSB DDR, then maybe Apple could sell them as G4+ or something... with Moto calling these procs the G4s, I don't think Apple can name them differently.
I agree with you about the 1.25 GHz thing... even Moto doesn't show these speeds on their roadmap!
And by the way, I copied-pasted my remark about IBM having something to announce from the original "cube-zone" article... (it's gone now, or was I dreaming???)

MrMacMan
Jan 23, 2003, 03:16 PM
Apple/IBM might say they have a partership for newer chips, but saying flat out that the 970 is coming would really deflate all the hype.

Apple likes people to keep on guessing, I don't think apple will (if) give much of a hint. Anyway the newer Powermacs are supposto come out around Feb. So maybe this is the late-january annocment.

well atleast I hope.

Catfish_Man
Jan 23, 2003, 04:52 PM
..., for the last time, the 1.25GHz G4 is not overclocked. I've seen pictures of it, it's got "1250" stamped on the chip. Overclocking != heat. High clockspeed == heat. The 7457 had better not be called the G5, since the only things it does are boost the cache and bus speed, low the power usage, and boost the clock frequency a bit (similar to the 7400 -> 7410 transition, which most users knew as the G4 -> slightly faster G4 transition). As for the 970 coming out in January; IBM has PUBLICLY ANNOUNCED that it's coming out in the second half of 2003. Last time I checked, January wasn't in the second half of the year.

Dont Hurt Me
Jan 23, 2003, 05:28 PM
I would like to see those pictures of the chip, I know my 7450 chip sure didnt mention it was a 733. I know this because when i clocked it up to 800 it still said 7450 on the outside! And if this was so why all those wind tunnel fans and complaints we have heard? They had dual 1 gigs in the quicksilvers they couldnt put 1.25 in them?? I had understood they were 1 gig chips told to run at 1.25 in a wind tunnel hence the latest powermac cheese grater. If this is wrong i apologize but i have not seen anypost where motorola says they are making a 1.25. I think this is just their best 1 gigers and so they tell apple they can handle it in the tunnels and here we are waiting on the 970. If iam wrong please educate me. Anyways the 7457 is probably what we will see and maybe the 970 in summer. Dont we love those itsy bitsy tiny winy motorola bumps?

GeneR
Jan 23, 2003, 09:10 PM
One word (if they DO come out with the 970 at the end of January):

YEEEEEHAAAAAAAAA!!!!

Three words if this is just poopaganda/hype (like it very well be):

Cruel and Unusual.

RE: Wormy.
I don't think you'll be the only one "busting a log" in their pants if the 970 does come out at the end of January. The sound of elation from Mac users (from sea to shining sea) rising through the stratosphere would be, well, interesting to say the least.

What's that expression? "The Earth shook. The Angels weeped?" Hmmm. Good line, though. I think you've probably introduced a new slang expression that will permeate our culture. Wow. And I was here to witness it! :D

MrMacMan
Jan 23, 2003, 09:17 PM
Originally posted by Catfish_Man
..., for the last time, the 1.25GHz G4 is not overclocked. I've seen pictures of it, it's got "1250" stamped on the chip. Overclocking != heat. High clockspeed == heat.
Overclocked = Current PowerMac chips.
Heat = Super Fans we have in current PowerMacs.
Highclock speed normally means heat but not always, if you make the size smaller it reduced the heat, awww you don't care.

Catfish_Man
Jan 23, 2003, 09:26 PM
Originally posted by Dont Hurt Me
I would like to see those pictures of the chip, I know my 7450 chip sure didnt mention it was a 733. I know this because when i clocked it up to 800 it still said 7450 on the outside! And if this was so why all those wind tunnel fans and complaints we have heard? They had dual 1 gigs in the quicksilvers they couldnt put 1.25 in them?? I had understood they were 1 gig chips told to run at 1.25 in a wind tunnel hence the latest powermac cheese grater. If this is wrong i apologize but i have not seen anypost where motorola says they are making a 1.25. I think this is just their best 1 gigers and so they tell apple they can handle it in the tunnels and here we are waiting on the 970. If iam wrong please educate me. Anyways the 7457 is probably what we will see and maybe the 970 in summer. Dont we love those itsy bitsy tiny winy motorola bumps?

Strangely, the dual 867 is also noisy (I have one), does that mean it's overclocked? No. It means it has a big fan and an XServe style power supply with whiny fans (to save space). A 1.25GHz G4 will ALWAYS run hotter than a 1GHz G4 when made on the same manufacturing process. Currently, Moto is not publicly selling 1.25GHz G4s, but there is absolutely no reason to believe they aren't selling them to companies like Apple. Also, if Moto DID release a 1.25GHz 7455 publicly, then guess what: It would be an overclocked 1GHz G4. All CPU speed bumps within a chip model are "overclocking". Since the base speed of the 7455 is 667MHz, everything above that is "overclocked" to run at higher speeds. The reason why it's not called overclocking is because the manufacturer does it. Overclocking is when a user takes a CPU rated at one clock frequency and tries to run it at a higher one. Bumping the speed is when a manufacturer does it. The difference is that manufacturers can test it to make sure it runs properly at that speed.

Catfish_Man
Jan 23, 2003, 09:27 PM
Originally posted by MrMacman

Overclocked = Current PowerMac chips.
Heat = Super Fans we have in current PowerMacs.
Highclock speed normally means heat but not always, if you make the size smaller it reduced the heat, awww you don't care.

Yes. The reduced size G4 is called the 7457. It's not out yet. Also, fans don't produce heat. They get rid of it.

cr2sh
Jan 24, 2003, 12:34 AM
Originally posted by Dont Hurt Me
I would like to see those pictures of the chip, I know my 7450 chip sure didnt mention it was a 733. I

Mine did. Right on the top of the chip.

ddtlm
Jan 24, 2003, 01:47 AM
Dont Hurt Me:

And if this was so why all those wind tunnel fans and complaints we have heard? They had dual 1 gigs in the quicksilvers they couldnt put 1.25 in them?? I had understood they were 1 gig chips told to run at 1.25 in a wind tunnel hence the latest powermac cheese grater.
Dual processor (up to) 1.2ghz G4 upgrades that work just fine in quicksilvers:

http://www.powerlogix.com/products2/pfdualg4133/index.html

Conlcusion: heat is not an especially large problem. It remains to be seen if these upgrades are overclocked or actually made from 1.2ghz chips.

Sol
Jan 24, 2003, 04:22 AM
Most of the rumours surrounding the next Apple announcements are about LCDs and iMacs. I do not think that 970s in January is a realistic proposition, especially since IBM announced the chips' availability for the 2nd half of 2003.

The G4 seems to have one last generation on the Mac before Apple signs a new chip supplier. It would be great to have quad-processor PowerMacs but somehow I doubt desktop systems will ever have that many CPUs.

I wonder how the only Macs that still use G3s, the iBooks, will fit into all this.

benixau
Jan 24, 2003, 05:40 AM
G4s in currrent systems work like so (MDD)

DDR RAM means each processor gets full SD RAM speed. G4 chips are not really meant to go in DP configs. QP congif would kill it.

wait for the 970. then we will hopefully, all crossables crossed, see a quad config.


oh well, have to wait and see.

wwworry
Jan 24, 2003, 07:07 AM
I think Apple knew they were going to a 1.8 GHz. 970 a couple of years ago. They also knew that even if it has vastly superior speed that a similarly clocked G4 they could not replace a higher clocked G4 with a lower clocked 970 because of marketing.

So Apple had to time their G4 updates with smaller increments spaced further apart in order for the 970's indroduction to seem faster.

It seems a little too pat don't you think?
1.0 GHz. G4
1.2 GHz. G4
1.4 GHz. G4
1.8 GHz. 970

That is, of course, if we really do get a 1.8 GHz. 970 this summer. We are missing a 1.6 GHz. G4.

Dont Hurt Me
Jan 24, 2003, 12:42 PM
Originally posted by Catfish_Man


Strangely, the dual 867 is also noisy (I have one), does that mean it's overclocked? No. It means it has a big fan and an XServe style power supply with whiny fans (to save space). A 1.25GHz G4 will ALWAYS run hotter than a 1GHz G4 when made on the same manufacturing process. Currently, Moto is not publicly selling 1.25GHz G4s, but there is absolutely no reason to believe they aren't selling them to companies like Apple. Also, if Moto DID release a 1.25GHz 7455 publicly, then guess what: It would be an overclocked 1GHz G4. All CPU speed bumps within a chip model are "overclocking". Since the base speed of the 7455 is 667MHz, everything above that is "overclocked" to run at higher speeds. The reason why it's not called overclocking is because the manufacturer does it. Overclocking is when a user takes a CPU rated at one clock frequency and tries to run it at a higher one. Bumping the speed is when a manufacturer does it. The difference is that manufacturers can test it to make sure it runs properly at that speed. Sounds reasonable looking back at my notes i noticed the PLL could tell my cpu to run from 733 -800-867-933+but then that chip is certified by moto to run at that level! Just glad i have had no issues at 800 mhz and its on all the time and hard core gaming! DID apple ever make a dual 667? if not i wonder why?:confused:

Dont Hurt Me
Jan 24, 2003, 12:52 PM
Originally posted by Sol
Most of the rumours surrounding the next Apple announcements are about LCDs and iMacs. I do not think that 970s in January is a realistic proposition, especially since IBM announced the chips' availability for the 2nd half of 2003.

The G4 seems to have one last generation on the Mac before Apple signs a new chip supplier. It would be great to have quad-processor PowerMacs but somehow I doubt desktop systems will ever have that many CPUs.

I wonder how the only Macs that still use G3s, the iBooks, will fit into all this. Not really sure but interesting about IBM's talk of that newer g3 they were working on but that could be for a newhand held or something or other. I would expect to see the g4's in the Imacs for a long time and the ibook to be discontinued considering the new 12" PB but then again the ibook has been a hit so who knows a new g3 for the ibook? seems kind of strange thinking about all this but 1 thing for sure is that the powermac line seems to be holding back the rest!

Dont Hurt Me
Jan 24, 2003, 01:00 PM
Originally posted by wwworry
I think Apple knew they were going to a 1.8 GHz. 970 a couple of years ago. They also knew that even if it has vastly superior speed that a similarly clocked G4 they could not replace a higher clocked G4 with a lower clocked 970 because of marketing.

So Apple had to time their G4 updates with smaller increments spaced further apart in order for the 970's indroduction to seem faster.

It seems a little too pat don't you think?
1.0 GHz. G4
1.2 GHz. G4
1.4 GHz. G4
1.8 GHz. 970

That is, of course, if we really do get a 1.8 GHz. 970 this summer. We are missing a 1.6 GHz. G4. Macaddict had reported that the initial release was to be 1.4 & 1.8 then scaling up. I would like to see this ( here we go again ) dual 1gig base, 1.25 med, new 1.4 970 high end, say sometime 2ndhalf, then use the 7457 g4's in the imac line and powerbook line which history shows the imacs following the powerbooks. Then 7457 replacing all 7450's and 970 filtering down and replacing all dual machines.

GeneR
Jan 30, 2003, 11:58 AM
Oh, well... what a bummer. But then again, it sounded kind of impossible to me (of course, I have the advantage of saying that now -- who really knew? I sure didn't, but it makes me sound smart. :D)