iLife, Mac OS X 10.2.4 - This Week

[MacRumors]

MacFixIt (http://www.macfixit.com/) confirms a previous report (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2003/01/20030123172422.shtml) that Mac OS X 10.2.4 will be coming this week:

There are now well over 100MB of updates to be applied after an install of Jaguar, currently culminating in Mac OS X 10.2.3. In the next few days, Apple will release Mac OS X 10.2.4, again increasing the total amount of updater material. Not to mention all of the individual iApp and security updates.

Meanwhile, iLife is due at the end of the week per all reports (:"http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2003/01/20030123082155.shtml").

[Freg3000]

I cannot wait for iLife. Especially iDVD 3!

[MrMacMan]

Sweet. More 100+ MB downloads for all of you 56k'ers!

;)

anyway I hope this gives some nice bug fixs and upgrades.

[bobindashadows]

Well I for one can't wait for this. Maybe there'll be something cool in it (like fixed window buttons). I guess we'll wait and see...

[Freg3000]

Originally posted by MrMacman
Sweet. More 100+ MB downloads for all of you 56k'ers!

I'm not sure, but I don't think it means that the 10.2.4 update will be 100 MB. I think it meant that the cumulative size of 10.2.1 thought 10.2.4 updates would well exceed 100 MB. I doubt Apple would ever release a 100 MB update. Like you said, it's too hard for people to download without broadband.

[Codemonkey]

Originally posted by Freg3000

Like you said, it's too hard for people to download without broadband.

However, according to people's griping even half that size is apparently unacceptable.

New Apple tag line:

Apple. If We Stop Including Modems Will You Stop Using Dial-Up?

At any rate, not entirely sure what they can include with the .4 update except the obvious non-standard gui buttons. And maybe an update to Safari... to go along with the iApps... :)

Ta ta!

[psxndc]

What a week for my iBook to go belly up. Please Apple, ship her back to me quickly. :-(

-p

[ChicagoMac]

Hopefully this also means new computers for this new os upgrade! I'm getting tired of waiting! Bring it on!

[cgmpowers]

The St. Louis Apple Stores have already installed iLife on their computers to demo it. I got to play with newest version of iMove, iPhoto and iDVD...

I didn't think to check the version of the OS but will do that tomorrow. I work in the same mall as the Apple Store and frequently visit to shop, surf the Internet and pester the staff. :)

Christopher

[rainman::|:|]

what, apple's supposed to not make updates because people still use dialup? what they should do is issue CD's you can buy for a couple of bucks (cost of printing and mailing) with an update on it that you can order... but overall, i like getting updates, regardless of size :)

pnw

[Sonofhaig]

It's like Christmas.......:) :D

[MacKid]

Originally posted by ChicagoMac
Hopefully this also means new computers for this new os upgrade! I'm getting tired of waiting! Bring it on!

Actually, the new PowerBooks use 10.2.4.

[TyleRomeo]

i want iChat 2.........soon

Tyler

[MacKid]

Originally posted by paulwhannel
what, apple's supposed to not make updates because people still use dialup? what they should do is issue CD's you can buy for a couple of bucks (cost of printing and mailing) with an update on it that you can order... but overall, i like getting updates, regardless of size :)

pnw

Actually, some people were complaining that even upgrades to iApps should be free (which 3/4 are). So, unless the upgrade CDs are totally free or are like $1.00, not a whole lot of budget conscious people will buy them (though I may not be one of them!:D)

[nickgold]

apple does sell upgrade cds... they are 20 bucks though.

[MacKid]

Originally posted by nickgold
apple does sell upgrade cds... they are 20 bucks though.

Well then!;)

[pimentoLoaf]

Gee, another download.

Just got Super Nisqually the other day, picked up Jaguar-compliant HP print drivers this afternoon, and will have to update both Netscape 7 and SkyChart III sometime this week.

Wish T1-Lines cost $21.95 a month like my Earthlink dial-up... :(

[Abstract]

Originally posted by Freg3000


I'm not sure, but I don't think it means that the 10.2.4 update will be 100 MB. I think it meant that the cumulative size of 10.2.1 thought 10.2.4 updates would well exceed 100 MB. I doubt Apple would ever release a 100 MB update. Like you said, it's too hard for people to download without broadband.


From the original quote, it sounds like there are 100 MB of updates available after the installation of Jaguar. I don't quite understand why there are so many updates. They are coming too quickly, because 100 MB worth of updates within a couple of months seems like too much in such a short time.

Ah well, at least I don't have dial-up. :D

[pourhadi]

Actually, the new PowerBooks use 10.2.4.

Sorry, I just got my new 12" Powerbook and it came with 10.2.3.

[DannyZR2]

I wonder though if they will ship iLive to those who pre-ordered it to be delivered "in time" for the release date... i mean... that is the point of pre-ordering things isn't it?

When braveheart finally came out on DVD, I had preordered it and got it a couple days before the actual release date!

I wonder when I'll get it... I can't wait for the export of iMovie to iDVD! So easy now to open ANY movie in quicktime, export to DV (if iMovie 3 still accepts only .DV files), then make chapters in iMovie and move over to iDVD and burn! NO MORE double export!!!!

btw, has anyone heard if new iMovie3 will accept other format video? other than DV?

[sparkleytone]

i am becoming less and less a fan of journalists that are only interested in sensational sounding things. sensationalism needs to die. the total update size for a fresh install X.2.0 to X.2.3 is 59.7 MB. NOT 100MB. Its called a Combo Update. Anyone who would reboot three times and download each update individually is not the brightest crayon in the box. In fact, I think Software Update would only give you the Combo Update anyways.

[nickmcghie]

alrite partner, keep on rollin' baby, u know wut time it is... it's time for iLife!! yay!! i can't wait :D

[FredAkbar]

Originally posted by sparkleytone
i am becoming less and less a fan of journalists that are only interested in sensational sounding things. sensationalism needs to die. the total update size for a fresh install X.2.0 to X.2.3 is 59.7 MB. NOT 100MB. Its called a Combo Update. Anyone who would reboot three times and download each update individually is not the brightest crayon in the box. In fact, I think Software Update would only give you the Combo Update anyways.

Were they perhaps factoring in other software updates (such as QT, iPod, and Airport) as well? QuickTime (version 6.1) is about 20 MB, and iPod, Airport, iTunes (3.0.1) updates might total up to another 20 MB in size. I'm guessing that the total combined size of all software updates (not just the system software) is fairly close to 100 MB. Then again, you might be right--they could just be talking about system updates, but counting each update (10.2.1, 10.2.2, etc.) separately.

[t^3]

Just to clear things up, the 12" pBook comes with 10.2.3, and the 17" will come with 10.2.4.

[Abstract]

You also didn't factor in this 10.2.4 update. Who knows how big it is. :)

[Wes]

Originally posted by Abstract
You also didn't factor in this 10.2.4 update. Who knows how big it is. :)

Last time I checked, around 57 megs.

[FredAkbar]

Originally posted by W-_-W


Last time I checked, around 57 megs.

Remember, these updates (such as the 10.2.4 one) really have 2 sizes. There is the update to go from 10.2.3 to 10.2.4, and there's the Combo update (which is much bigger). Is that 57 MB for the small update (.3 to .4), or is that the size of the Combo update?

[Abstract]

So 59.7 MB + 57 MB is greater than 100 MB. Does this satisfy everybody?
Also, don't you think its awful for SJ to presume that everybody has high-speed internet? Sure, I don't have a problem, but that doesn't mean that people with dial-up don't want OSX updates. I'm sure most people can tolerate 3-5 MB updates, but 100MB is quite a lot.

[t^3]

So 59.7 MB + 57 MB is greater than 100 MB. Does this satisfy everybody? No, I wasn't satisfied. 59.7MB is the size of the combo update to 10.2.3, and we are assuming 57MB is the size of the 10.2.3 to 10.2.4 updater. Since this has gone on far enough, I looked up all the past OS X updates I could find - point updaters (for lack of a better word) and combo. Here are the results:

10.2->10.2.3: 59.7MB
10.2.2->10.2.3: 50.1MB

10.2->10.2.2:28.5MB
10.2.1->10.2.2: 23.3MB

10.1/.1/.2->10.1.5: 45.1MB
10.1.3/4->10.1.5: 21.4MB

10.1/.1/.2->10.1.3: 38.4MB
10.1.2->10.1.3: 16MB

10.1->10.1.2: 34MB
10.1.1->10.1.2: 29.3MB

10.0->10.0.4: 19.3MB
10.0.3->10.0.4: 12MB

It looks like that the combo updates aren't usually that much bigger than the point updates, so even if the point update is 57MB, the combo will probably be around 65MB. Even if the size turns out to be outrageously big, the file could always be split for the 56K users.

[NicoMan]

Originally posted by pourhadi


Sorry, I just got my new 12" Powerbook and it came with 10.2.3.
How good is that puppy?

NicoMan

[NicoMan]

Originally posted by t^3
Just to clear things up, the 12" pBook comes with 10.2.3, and the 17" will come with 10.2.4.
Any idea why?
Is that because one started shipping before 10.2.4 was seeded?

NicoMan

[iAlan]

Originally posted by NicoMan

Any idea why?
Is that because one started shipping before 10.2.4 was seeded?

NicoMan

I am guessing it might be iDVD compatability for hte 17" Super-drive (12" does not have SD as basic)

[mikeh123]

Who cares what size the update is. If it needs fixing and is an improvement give me all the data you want.
Yes I have ADSL so don't care if it's 200MB and yes I did used to have dial up but I would still say the same. A lot of people have DSL or a fast connection at work, if you don't then buy the CD or do without.

Apple shouldn't worry about size of updates because people still use dial up ( I know not everyone has it available) but hey should Apple have kept the floppy disk.

Just give the improvements, I heard there were some Nvidia improvements in this one, great for us gamers with any luck.

[iAlan]

Why did Apple stop including update software on the CD's included with Apple-related magazines (Mac User, etc). Including the update on these CD would be a good think for those who do not have high speed connections (mind you , waiting an extra month or more to get the CD with a mag is a bummer), and if Apple want to require registration on the web to unlock the CD, so what.

I have ADSL and it cruises, but many don't.

[Nermal]

Originally posted by pimentoLoaf
Wish T1-Lines cost $21.95 a month like my Earthlink dial-up... :(

Wow, that's expensive! Is that pretty much a normal price for dialup in the USA (I guess that's where you are)? Over here they're about $10-$12.:D

DSL, on the other hand, is incredibly expensive here - $33 for 128k, if you want it any faster than that you have to pay 11c a meg:eek: Fortunately, they're rebuilding the entire price structure from the ground up in a few months (they're introducing TV over DSL and currently it's about $100 for an hour of TV!)

</rant>:p

[mac4life]

:confused: Why can't apple release smaller updates more often, as opposed to large downloads. I'm on cable now, but when I was on dial-up, get Apple's OS updates was a nightmare. And considering I updated as they came out, I ended up doing that 100 mb crap over time. N E ways... what is the prob with "non-standard window buttons". What exactly are you referring to? My window buttons look normal.

[NicoMan]

Originally posted by mac4life
:confused: Why can't apple release smaller updates more often, as opposed to large downloads.
I believe that it is a lot more difficult for Apple to release plenty of different patches: for each patch, they have to do thorough user tests and regression tests. So unless it is a vital security patch, like they have produced in the past 2 or 3 times with OSX, they wait for enough material to constitute a worthwhile update, i.e. to run the patches through extensive regression tests. Just fixing a small UI bug does not constitute an upgrade important enough to warrant a patch on its own, for example.

NicoMan

[iTry]

The UK education apple store is being updated as I write...

What are they up to...?! New products? I hope so!

[peterjhill]

Originally posted by NicoMan

Any idea why?
Is that because one started shipping before 10.2.4 was seeded?

NicoMan

10.2.4 is needed to support the supercool light up keyboard

[Ambrose Chapel]

The UK education apple store is being updated as I write...

The US regular store is runnin' fine. However, all the iMac models are shipping 5 days at the earliest, 3 weeks at the latest. I really want to see an update when iLife and .4 come out, as I have a switcher itching to buy... :)

[jMc]

Originally posted by iTry
The UK education apple store is being updated as I write...

What are they up to...?! New products? I hope so!

Normal UK store is down too - with the international holding page ('We'll Be Back Soon' followed by international call numbers).

This is most odd - I've never seen it down independently of US store before...

Actually it appears all European stores are down... Maybe, being 'Old Europe' now they're gonna upgrade the iMac G3s...

jx

[cgmpowers]

Dialup prices went up a few years ago, I am actually surprised its still that price and not higher--because I find for the dollar...high speed in my area is such a better deal.

Christopher

[Bifrost]

The Apple Education online store in the US is also "closed for remodeling". Maybe Apple is going to give education buyers a massive discount on iMacs to clear out remaining stock of the old models before they introduce new ones this/next week. That's wishful thinking coupled with wild speculation, but hey - that's what we're here for isn't it?

;)

[Bifrost]

Apple's regular US online store is now also closed, with the "We'll be back soon" sign.

[Tiauguinho]

Here it comes guys! Goodies on the way!

[jMc]

Guys - it might just be iLife... or do they not need to update for that?

[ntg]

New G4s have just been updated, including FW800 and Bluetooth included in the 1.42GHz

Nig.:D

[ntg]

Fast
$1,499.00
1GHz PowerPC G4
1MB L3 cache
256MB DDR266 SDRAM
60GB Ultra ATA/100
Combo drive
NVIDIA GeForce4 MX
64MB DDR video memory
FireWire 800
56K internal modem
Bluetooth Ready

Faster $1,999.00
Dual 1.25GHz PowerPC G4
1MB L3 cache/processor
256MB DDR333 SDRAM
80GB Ultra ATA/100
Combo Drive
ATI Radeon 9000 Pro
64MB DDR video memory
FireWire 800
56K internal modem
Bluetooth Ready

Fastest $2,699.00
Dual 1.42GHz PowerPC G4
2MB L3 cache/processor
512MB DDR333 SDRAM
120GB Ultra ATA/100
SuperDrive (DVD-R/CD-RW)
ATI Radeon 9000 Pro
64MB DDR video memory
FireWire 800
56K internal modem
Bluetooth Ready

Custom:
$3,799.00
Dual 1.42GHz PowerPC G4
2MB L3 cache/processor
2.0GB DDR333 SDRAM
120GB Ultra ATA/100
SuperDrive
NVIDIA GeForce4 Titanium
128MB DDR video memory
FireWire 800
56K internal modem
Bluetooth Included

[groundhog troll]

The Download is BIG. As big ass your mother inlaw:D

[MacKid]

Originally posted by iAlan


I am guessing it might be iDVD compatability for hte 17" Super-drive (12" does not have SD as basic)

But iDVD 3 only requires 10.2.2 or something.

I think. . .
:rolleyes:

[lazyrighteye]

Anyone know if iMovie will work natively in a 16:9 aspect ratio?
I know you can work 4:3 and export to 16:9... but it's so much better to edit in the aspect ratio of the final product. That always bugged me about iMovie.

And not everyone has high speed, BTW. The lines in my hood are too old. Have been wanting high speed so bad... for soo long...
Some of the Software Updates are brutal for us 56.6 (which is actually topps out at 28.8 - right?) suckers.
I considered moving out of the neighborhood, but short of the broadband issue, it's perfect (Denver, CO). But on a bright note: I received word (last week), that lines are being updated, and I'll have an AT&T Broadband option by March (which means August I'm sure) - cable TV by February (not interested - like I need MORE distractions).

And closing my unimportant reply, anyone bitching about Apple's upgrades being too frequent.... that makes zero sense. Maybe even negative sense. I'm all for as many updates, as often as possible, any size. I support progress.

lazyrighteye

[MacKid]

Originally posted by mac4life
:confused: Why can't apple release smaller updates more often, as opposed to large downloads. I'm on cable now, but when I was on dial-up, get Apple's OS updates was a nightmare. And considering I updated as they came out, I ended up doing that 100 mb crap over time. N E ways... what is the prob with "non-standard window buttons". What exactly are you referring to? My window buttons look normal.

1) It's to satisfy people. If they ended up going to 10.2.9.9.7, people would complain like they do with XP, that there's always some new security patch and they're always having to download something new. Plus, you wouldn't notice much of a change with one update concerning iTunes stability, would you?

2) All of the new iApps have the buttons on, instead of floating over the toolbar, but all other apps have the floating over, instead of on, style of close/minimize/maximize buttons.

[shadowfax]

Originally posted by TyleRomeo
i want iChat 2.........soon

Tyler


YES YES YES! ichat... what an adequate program. innovative in a few ways, and grossly lacking in some of the most basic ways. i think apple underestimates its importance. iChat is almost as important to my digital life as iTunes, and easily as important as browsing, which Chimera had more than covered anywhere. every single AIM chat program i have tried on a mac is absolutely anemic compared to the windows versions. less intuitive, screwed up with basic features like viewing away messages, and really ubelievably poor profile support are just a few of the problems.

Apple, hurry and fix that stupid thing, i'll love you twice as much when you do!

[sturm375]

Originally posted by lazyrighteye
Anyone know if iMovie will work natively in a 16:9 aspect ratio?
I know you can work 4:3 and export to 16:9... but it's so much better to edit in the aspect ratio of the final product. That always bugged me about iMovie.

And not everyone has high speed, BTW. The lines in my hood are too old. Have been wanting high speed so bad... for soo long...
Some of the Software Updates are brutal for us 56.6 (which is actually topps out at 28.8 - right?) suckers.
I considered moving out of the neighborhood, but short of the broadband issue, it's perfect (Denver, CO). But on a bright note: I received word (last week), that lines are being updated, and I'll have an AT&T Broadband option by March (which means August I'm sure) - cable TV by February (not interested - like I need MORE distractions).

And closing my unimportant reply, anyone bitching about Apple's upgrades being too frequent.... that makes zero sense. Maybe even negative sense. I'm all for as many updates, as often as possible, any size. I support progress.

lazyrighteye

Is this the first time AT&T has told you their expected delivery date? If so, count on 4 years of waiting. They told me 3-4 Months I'd have cable broadband, 4 yrs later, they are finally getting around to putting in the cableing in my neighborhood.

Enough b!tching about broadband, I too think Apple ought to offer a CD (for a fair price, less then $20) for these service patches. M$ seems to make it pretty easy to get these for less than $10 including S&H.

[mac4life]

Why in the hell don't they just make "software update" downloads RESUMABLE. So, you could stop a download, and continue where you left of later. I was trying to download an update a while b4 I had Jaguar, and it was 35 megs I think. N E ways, I got disconnected before it was downloaded 4 TIMES!!! , and had to start ALL THE WAY OVER. I'm a semi-satisfied AT&T broadband customer now. (I get between 280 and 320 k bandwidth most of the time) My friend to the north gets over 500k. Why is this?

[mac4life]

Apple just released a 20 inch cinema display, and lowered the price of the 23 inch to $1,999 in addition to introducing new dual-1.42 GHZ machines!!! HE HE HE ;-)

[Nermal]

Originally posted by lazyrighteye
Anyone know if iMovie will work natively in a 16:9 aspect ratio?
I know you can work 4:3 and export to 16:9... but it's so much better to edit in the aspect ratio of the final product. That always bugged me about iMovie.

Sorry, I've got no idea. But while we're on the topic, does anyone know why Apple's widescreen LCDs are in 16:10 aspect rather than 16:9?

[BigJayhawk]

Originally posted by Nermal


Sorry, I've got no idea. But while we're on the topic, does anyone know why Apple's widescreen LCDs are in 16:10 aspect rather than 16:9?

As I recall, the 16:10 is so you can view/edit 16:9 content and also have the menu bar across the top of the screen so you don't have to toggle between full screen and regular view.

[Nermal]

Originally posted by BigJayhawk


As I recall, the 16:10 is so you can view/edit 16:9 content and also have the menu bar across the top of the screen so you don't have to toggle between full screen and regular view.

Makes sense. I've been wondering about that for a while, good to know that there's a good reason for it!

[centauratlas]

So I would expect the download to be available soon too.

[MacKid]

Originally posted by mac4life
Why in the hell don't they just make "software update" downloads RESUMABLE. So, you could stop a download, and continue where you left of later. I was trying to download an update a while b4 I had Jaguar, and it was 35 megs I think. N E ways, I got disconnected before it was downloaded 4 TIMES!!! , and had to start ALL THE WAY OVER. I'm a semi-satisfied AT&T broadband customer now. (I get between 280 and 320 k bandwidth most of the time) My friend to the north gets over 500k. Why is this?

They are resumable, you just can't quit the app or shut down the computer before you try to do it again. In fact, in CoreServices (or something like that), there's a cache file that activates whenever you start to update.