Which PowerMac - Big Question ...

[Blong]

Hello

Newbie to this forum - hope I can get some help with this. I've been agonising for a long time over which PowerMac to buy.

Basically, I do a fair amount of photoshop work (but I am not a pro) - I shoot in RAW and may take 200 shots in a day. Many projects that I work on require in the range of 50 or more layers - my old 1.4GHz PC just doesn't cut it anymore.

Will probably also look at using Aperture.

I'm really looking for longevity and don't want to spend extra $$$ for a new machine to just keep me happy until the Intel PowerMacs come out, photoshop runs natively on Intel and the bugs are sorted out.

My question is whether I should get a 2.0GHz Dual Core and bump up the hard drive to 250MB, add 2GB RAM (not from Apple) and add Geforce 7800 256MB video card ...
.... or go straight to the 2.5 Quad and only bump up the RAM by 1GB and then add a better video card much later (if at all - it will already have the 6600 256MB card) ....
... or go middle ground and go for the 2.3GHz Dual core with a similar setup to the first one.

I have already made the decision that I'll be getting the 24" Dell display.

The price difference between the 2.0 and Quad set up as above (with edu discount) is in the range of AUS$1219.

I hope someone can give me some advice on this.

Rob

[Glenn Wolsey]

Personally, I am waiting for Intel, I recommend you do that too.

[sintaxi]

i am also waiting so I picked up a referb iMac G5 (isight).

the final straw was the fact that the powermac only comes with half gig Ram. It is hard enough to part with $4000 cnd for a computer but to then invest in another $500-$1000 in Ram hurts.

it is so unreasonable for someone to run 512mb Ram in a $4000 Quad machine. It just bothers me so much that they dont at least start at 1 gig. For heavens sake, a iBook comes with 512mb.

[QCassidy352]

I have a friend who is a professional photographer. he has a quad, but only 1.5 GB RAM and the stock video card. He says that according to system profiler, he does not need more RAM than that even when the processors are all maxed out, and that the graphics card has very little effect on his (2d) work.

So my advice, based on what he's told me, would be to get the quad, bump up the memory when you can, and don't worry about the video card at all.

[adk]

i am also waiting so I picked up a referb iMac G5 (isight).

the final straw was the fact that the powermac only comes with half gig Ram. It is hard enough to part with $4000 cnd for a computer but to then invest in another $500-$1000 in Ram hurts.

it is so unreasonable for someone to run 512mb Ram in a $4000 Quad machine. It just bothers me so much that they dont at least start at 1 gig. For heavens sake, a iBook comes with 512mb.


3rd party RAM is a lot cheaper than apple ram. I welcome apple to put in 256 stock memory and i'll buy RAM at New Egg for a fraction of apple's price.

[THX1139]

i am also waiting so I picked up a referb iMac G5 (isight).

the final straw was the fact that the powermac only comes with half gig Ram. It is hard enough to part with $4000 cnd for a computer but to then invest in another $500-$1000 in Ram hurts.

it is so unreasonable for someone to run 512mb Ram in a $4000 Quad machine. It just bothers me so much that they dont at least start at 1 gig. For heavens sake, a iBook comes with 512mb.

Uh, your complaint doesn't make sense. You can get 2GB of Samsung ram from OWC for less than $200. It's the same ram spec that Apple uses. To complain about installing ram in a high-end machine...well, that's like buying a Hummer and bitching about gas prices.

[Blong]

Okey dokey - we have one for the quad and one for the intel.

Glen - waiting for intel. Hmmmm. I've read a bit about this in this forum and find myself teetering on the brink. Will the intel powermacs have a speed jump or just a bump? Judging by the speed jumps with the Macbook pro and intel iMac, there is great potential, but are there processors out there that will better the quad? Also, when is photoshop going to be universal? What about plug-ins and drivers for printers and such? Also, there seem to be little bugs popping up here and there with the intel machines (could be nitpicking). I'm not sure about about new technology and would prefer "tried and true".

Wouldn't a current powermac last a long time into the future?

Buying RAM from a third party was already in the equation.

Thanks for the comments guys - however, still dunno ...

Cool.

Rob

[FFTT]

My best friend is a graphics professional running a standard REV B 2.0 (8DIMM) G5 just like mine with 2 GB RAM and the stock 64 MB video card.

She runs the entire CS2 suite all day long without a hitch.

Adding a 2nd internal seagate 250GB SATA would be a good idea
for holding all your data.

You would be fine running CS2 on a dual core 2.0, 2.3 or Quad and would not have to wait for Adobe to upgrade to Universal Binary.

Buy guaranteed Apple compatible 3rd party RAM from OWC (macsales.com) or datamem.com or Crucial.
OWC sells factory original Samsung RAM.

If you can afford to wait till this summer, then the Intel based towers may be your best choice in longetivity, but if you need something right now
that will last 4 years plus, then you're perfectly safe with a PPC model.

Adobe should easily transfer your licence for a nominal shipping fee for the
OSX version as long as you are a licensed owner.

I have no idea how much they might charge for their UB upgrade.

[SmurfBoxMasta]

Unless you plan to get into video &/or 3D modeling, for strictly 2D PS work, do NOT waste money on a top of the line the video card, it wont make ANY difference in the speed of your workflow or the system. As long as you have 64 or maybe 128mb of vram, you will be fine.

Spend the cash now on a DP machine, and maxing the ram + big, fast HDD's.....PS will love you :p

According to Adobe's latest statements, PS will not be UB until the next MAJOR version (CS3??) is released. And intellimac towers wont be out for a good while either (WWDC/August ??), so that would dictate waiting a while to go that route IMHO.......

[iGary]

Unless you plan to get into video &/or 3D modeling, for strictly 2D PS work, do NOT waste money on a top of the line the video card, it wont make ANY difference in the speed of your workflow or the system. As long as you have 64 or maybe 128mb of vram, you will be fine.

Spend the cash now on a DP machine, and maxing the ram + big, fast HDD's.....PS will love you :p

According to Adobe's latest statements, PS will not be UB until the next MAJOR version (CS3??) is released. And intellimac towers wont be out for a good while either (WWDC/August ??), so that would dictate waiting a while to go that route IMHO.......

If you plan on using Aperture you won't be wasting a cent on a good video card, but don't go through the roof with one, either. If you can afford the 7800GT, get it, otherwise, you'll prolly be OK. Aperture is wicked heavy on the graphics card. My X800 XT is away at ATI being replaced/fixed/whatever, and let me tell you, I can sure feel the sluggishness in Aperture using my old stock (256MB) card.

Since you already have Photoshop, and since Aperture will be a UB this month, I'm always of the opinion of buying as much machine as your wallet can bear.

I wouldn't play around with a Revision A Power Mac, personally.

My .02

[FFTT]

I would buy a 2.0 Dual G5, add 2 GB of 3rd party RAM and an additional HD.

This is more than enough machine for what you're doing even if you go pro.

The first Intel Tower Macs will be attractive, I'm sure, but the current 2.0
will hold you quite well untill we see those quad core processors and all the
applications have gone universal binary as mainstream.

Figure the 2.0 dual core should hold well through 2008 and longer.

The Dell 24" is an amazing display, but you'll be glad that the improved graphics cards can handle a second display for checking color corrections.

Things are changing SO fast in the next 2 years.

I would get a system that covers all your actual daily needs with a bit of room to spare without going overboard.

If you can take advantage of education discounts, all the better.

[Keebler]

I would personally get a dual core, but not necessarily a quad. my understanding of the quad is if you need multiple apps working at the same time. sounds like you'll have maybe 2? if so, then a regular dual core would be great with a bunch of ram (maybe 4 GBs?).

This talk of waiting for intel schmintel - it's driving me nuts - Here's the dilly - it sounds like you do this for a living? if so, then get a powermac now. if it makes your workflow more efficient and fast, thus allowing you to focus on acquiring new business instead of stressing out that your current machine can't hack it, then buy it now. It will be well worth it. Allow it to MAKE you money. By the time intels are out (august is the rumour), then you'll probably have enough to buy another one if you really need too. If you don't, you still have an amazing machine. I simply don't buy the entire intel excitement. I can't believe Apple would stop their support of powermacs for at least another 3 - 5 years. who knows what the computing world will have by then.

If it's a hobby, then wait for an intel.

best of luck,
Keebler

[Platform]

Go for Quad or wait....get 1GB+ RAM too ;)

[combatcolin]

Wait for Intel

[asencif]

If you need a machine now that will increase your productivity and your business then buy now. Waiting is for people that can truly afford it, have the time, and hobbyists. The PPC G5 is a very powerful chip 64-Bit chip that is now being undermined because Intel is here. Apple didn't praise this chip the past two years because of it being slow. It's true of it's power and many apps weren't optimized yet for DP usage nor 64-Bit during it's beginnings. You can get one now and it will do the job for at least the next 2-4 years. If you want the system that will have the most life, power, and is available now then go for the Quad. That's if you can afford it. A 2.0 and 2.3 would be fine too. RAM is important of course. If you don't need a DC model than you can buy a refurb 2.5 or 2.7 model which are very fast production machines.

[THX1139]

Wait for Intel


Yeah..that's good advice. Then when your done waiting for Intel, you can wait some more for your software to be ported to Universal binary. Then wait awhile longer while they work the bugs out. Then wait some more because of revision B machines are "just over the horizon." Then wait some more because you read a rumor that dual intel quad core machines are coming out "soon." Meanwhile, how much time has gone by and what have you gained by all the waiting?

What if you do decide to wait...and the new intel power macs suck compared to current line? Could happen you know, they may change the form factor (black plastic cases?) or drastically increase the price for the Pro-line. Then you just flushed all that waiting when you have to go buy a discontinued PPC machine. The thing is, waiting is risky because you can't be sure of what you are waiting for. When you know exactly what is available and have the need, then buy it NOW. The only caveat to all of this, is that it is worth it to wait until April 1st to see what Apple announces on their anniversary. Don't be surprised if they give one last speed bump to the PowerMac line. The reason they would do that is to keep the line alive until Intel can produce Conroe in volume and release the intel power macs the first quarter of 2007 (Macworld), while coinciding with Photoshop Universal Binary release.

[zap2]

Get the Quad, it faster then any Mac if the history of Apple:eek:

[Blong]

Thanks everyone for the advice - many differing opinions, all good.

Just to clarify, I am a hobbyist, and will not be using the machine for work. However, with a cannon 20D and shooting in RAW, i'd consider myself to be more of a "pro-sumer" in this area.

In terms of how many apps open at anytime, I would generally have normal stuff open - iTunes, Firefox, Photoshop - but generally not too much more - I suppose either Aperture or Lightroom as well when I get to it.

Starting to lean towards the 2.0 or 2.3 with nvidia7800 video card and as much RAM as I can get.

Anyone think I would be better off in the long term with the quad?

Thanks again

Rob

[TangoCharlie]

If your main concern is logevity, then wait for the Conroe based InteliMac. You shouldn't have that long to wait... August (i.e. September!) seems to be the punters' current bet... but it may be as soon as June. You'll have to wait a little longer for the CS3 apps, but again, it should still be 2006 not '7.

I'm afraid to say, if you buy the G5 now, you'll regret it in the long run.....

To start another thread.... what do you think the intel Macs will be called? My bet is simply the "Mac Pro". OTOH I think the XServes will stay "XServe", but the "X" now stands for x86!!

The other question is... will the "Mac Pro" come with a "desktop" CPU, or a "server" CPU? Currenly intels "desktop" CPUs can't do Multi-CPU configurations, whereas the server CPUs (Xeons) can.

Whatever happens, you can bet your bottom dollar that the Macintels will seriously out-perform the current G5s!! :D

[~Shard~]

Conroe Intel PowerMacs will be announced in August and shipping a couple months afterwards. All pro apps are moving to Intel, so if you buy a PPC PowerMac now, you might be potentially handcuffing yourself for future apps. I'm sure UBs will be around for a while, but still, personally, I'd prefer to be on the new technology side of the coin as opposed to the old technology side of the coin. ;) :cool:

For what you need, the quad is probably overkill - or at least, you will never fully realize its potential. That leaves you with the other models, which will get smoked by the new Conroe systems.

I'd wait for Intel. If you can't wait for the fall, look into a solution to get you by, as I wouldn't want to invest a lot of $$$ in a new PPC PowerMac right now. :cool:

[bodeh6]

If I were you I would get the DC 2.3 with the 7800. Then stick in 2-3 GBs of RAM and get a 23" ACD or 24" Dell 2405. That should be a great system for years to come. Get the biggest HD because with the sound of your work it will probably end up getting filled up. Why have 6+ more months of slow production when you can speed it up now? Mac Pros are likely to be announced in August and could ship either that afternoon or a month later. Plus you have to wait for Adobe CS3 to come out. Aperature will already universal though.

[~Shard~]

If I were you I would get the DC 2.3 with the 7800. Then stick in 2-3 GBs of RAM and get a 23" ACD or 24" Dell 2405. That should be a great system for years to come. Get the biggest HD because with the sound of your work it will probably end up getting filled up. Why have 6+ more months of slow production when you can speed it up now? Mac Pros are likely to be announced in August and could ship either that afternoon or a month later. Plus you have to wait for Adobe CS3 to come out. Aperature will already universal though.

Good point - it's anyone's guess when Adobe will actually release CS3. :rolleyes:

[combatcolin]

Yeah..that's good advice. Then when your done waiting for Intel, you can wait some more for your software to be ported to Universal binary. Then wait awhile longer while they work the bugs out. Then wait some more because of revision B machines are "just over the horizon." Then wait some more because you read a rumor that dual intel quad core machines are coming out "soon." Meanwhile, how much time has gone by and what have you gained by all the waiting?

What if you do decide to wait...and the new intel power macs suck compared to current line? Could happen you know, they may change the form factor (black plastic cases?) or drastically increase the price for the Pro-line. Then you just flushed all that waiting when you have to go buy a discontinued PPC machine. The thing is, waiting is risky because you can't be sure of what you are waiting for. When you know exactly what is available and have the need, then buy it NOW. The only caveat to all of this, is that it is worth it to wait until April 1st to see what Apple announces on their anniversary. Don't be surprised if they give one last speed bump to the PowerMac line. The reason they would do that is to keep the line alive until Intel can produce Conroe in volume and release the intel power macs the first quarter of 2007 (Macworld), while coinciding with Photoshop Universal Binary release.


Am i detecting a slight touch of something...?

:)

Anyway, while others might need a ne Mac now, i can most certainly wait 6 months.

[turtlebud]

Thanks everyone for the advice - many differing opinions, all good.

Just to clarify, I am a hobbyist, and will not be using the machine for work. However, with a cannon 20D and shooting in RAW, i'd consider myself to be more of a "pro-sumer" in this area.

In terms of how many apps open at anytime, I would generally have normal stuff open - iTunes, Firefox, Photoshop - but generally not too much more - I suppose either Aperture or Lightroom as well when I get to it.

Starting to lean towards the 2.0 or 2.3 with nvidia7800 video card and as much RAM as I can get.

Anyone think I would be better off in the long term with the quad?

Thanks again

Rob

Hey Rob,

I'm kind of in the same boat as you are - I'm into photography and shooting with the 20d. I haven't gotten into shooting in RAW yet, but I am seriously considering playing around with it at some point. Lightroom and Aperture are possibilities, but for the time being, I'm making due with iPhoto.

The cliche, "get as much as you can for as little as possible" applies here. I want to get a machine that can last as long as possible too, but I want to spend as little as possible getting it. That being said, I'd go for the dual core 2.0 right now. The reason being the only major differences between the 2.0 and the 2.3 is the 0.3ghz and the bus speed. Unlike earlier G5's, this "low-end" G5 is NOT crippled. The RAM slots are the same, the RAM type is the same, the expansion slots are the same, etc. The only differences are the video card and the HD size. I could be wrong, but I have a feeling you won't notice the difference between the two machines. Plus, I just always feel that in 3 or 4 years, I'm going to want to upgrade again and this way I would have saved more money upfront.

Cost wise, if you're buying from the retail store, a similarly equipped 2.0 (assuming graphics card upgrade to 7800GT and HD upgrade to 250GB) will save you $375+tax. You can save yourself some money ($75) and stick with the stock 160gb HD, the add a second HD yourself. I think 300gb SATA OEM drives run around $130+tax. But that all depends on how much space you think you need now.

Good luck and let us know what you decide on!

[Blong]

Cool - thanks for the comments guys. Prolly not going to wait for intel though - one of those situations where it seems like I've been waiting and waiting for ever to get a PowerMac - I think i've been waiting for the "next big thing" since the first mac mini was released. I've had enough of it and my wife has had enough of me telling her about it - she wants me to buy something and keep quiet...:D

About to plunge soon, but ... decisions, decisions ...:confused:

Hey Rob,

I'm kind of in the same boat as you are - I'm into photography and shooting with the 20d. I haven't gotten into shooting in RAW yet, but I am seriously considering playing around with it at some point. Lightroom and Aperture are possibilities, but for the time being, I'm making due with iPhoto.


Good luck and let us know what you decide on!

Thanks for the comments turtlebud - try RAW for sure - that's all I shoot now (with the 20D as well) - you never know when a snapshot will turn into a cracker of a shot and there's just that little bit more control when post processing. Dynamic range tends to be better in RAW as well as the ability to set the white balance right if you didn't in the first place.

If you start shooting in RAW - invest in some more memory cards - I can squeeze around 130 or so (I think) shots onto a 1gig card with the 20D. Then I have a few 512 cards as back up. Thinking about getting another 1gig card - prices in Oz have dropped a fair bit over the last few weeks.

iphoto is OK, but give photoshop a go (CS, CS2 or Elements) - the RAW converter plug-in is fine. I'm looking at checking out Aperture and Lightroom as soon as I get this machine.

Looks like the final decision is leaning towards the 2.3GHz and 7800 video card. Additional RAM and Hard Drive will be third party .... I think i'll have a decision by the weekend.

[THX1139]

I'd prefer to be on the new technology side of the coin as opposed to the old technology side of the coin. ;) :cool:


That's a fun place to be...if you can afford it. It's fairly common knowledge that leading edge mean bleeding edge. But hey, someone has to be the early adopter for the rest of us!


For what you need, the quad is probably overkill - or at least, you will never fully realize its potential. That leaves you with the other models, which will get smoked by the new Conroe systems.

I'd wait for Intel. If you can't wait for the fall, look into a solution to get you by, as I wouldn't want to invest a lot of $$$ in a new PPC PowerMac right now. :cool:

The Quad will give the best shelf life and will be a great computer way past the transition to Intel. As for Conroe's smoking PPC...well, new computers are usually faster. However, all of the pro-line computers are fast, so what's the point? Please allow me to give you a metaphor. If the "old" PowerPC's were like, oh let's say "Corvettes" and the new Intel's turn out to be like "Lamborgini's" and you need to drive 100 miles, which car is going to make a difference in your trip? One will get you to your destination a bit sooner...but either one will get you there fast enough. However, the "Corvette" is for sale right now and has a proven track record. Oh, and by the way, the "Lamborgini" needs a special type of fuel that's not available yet. :rolleyes:

[Danksi]

That's a fun place to be...if you can afford it. It's fairly common knowledge that leading edge mean bleeding edge. But hey, someone has to be the early adopter for the rest of us!



The Quad will give the best shelf life and will be a great computer way past the transition to Intel. As for Conroe's smoking PPC...well, new computers are usually faster. However, all of the pro-line computers are fast, so what's the point? Please allow me to give you a metaphor. If the "old" PowerPC's were like, oh let's say "Corvettes" and the new Intel's turn out to be like "Lamborgini's" and you need to drive 100 miles, which car is going to make a difference in your trip? One will get you to your destination a bit sooner...but either one will get you there fast enough. However, the "Corvette" is for sale right now and has a proven track record. Oh, and by the way, the "Lamborgini" needs a special type of fuel that's not available yet. :rolleyes:

Like the Tortoise and the Hare - only the Hare's forgot his running shoes? :)

[~Shard~]

Like the Tortoise and the Hare - only the Hare's forgot his running shoes? :)

Exactly. ;)

[combatcolin]

That's a fun place to be...if you can afford it. It's fairly common knowledge that leading edge mean bleeding edge. But hey, someone has to be the early adopter for the rest of us!



The Quad will give the best shelf life and will be a great computer way past the transition to Intel. As for Conroe's smoking PPC...well, new computers are usually faster. However, all of the pro-line computers are fast, so what's the point? Please allow me to give you a metaphor. If the "old" PowerPC's were like, oh let's say "Corvettes" and the new Intel's turn out to be like "Lamborgini's" and you need to drive 100 miles, which car is going to make a difference in your trip? One will get you to your destination a bit sooner...but either one will get you there fast enough. However, the "Corvette" is for sale right now and has a proven track record. Oh, and by the way, the "Lamborgini" needs a special type of fuel that's not available yet. :rolleyes:


The Quad is a waste of money unless you are running very heavy apps.

If you think you need it, the you don't.

If you do need it, its because the work that you will perform on it will pay your Rent/bills/credit card bill for the Quad.

[Blong]

Everyone - thanks for the opinions, advice and info.

Now comes the hard part - the decision.

I've ordered the Dell 24" monitor. As luck would have it, the discounted price dropped by another $60AUS the day after I parted with my money. Oh well ... :rolleyes:

Looks like i'm leaning towards the Dual Core 2.3GHz and 7800GT video card. With an additional 2gig RAM (2.5 total) I reckon that it should last me a good long time.

Thanks again everyone.

Cool

Rob

[combatcolin]

Enjoy the big Dell, it will change your life.

(In a small but pleasent way)

And you can hook your games consoles/2nd computer up as well.

[zerolight]

Get a refurb'd Dual 2.7Ghz Power Mac G5. It's a performance bargain, comes in less than a dual core 2.0. They generally come with 1GB of ram, but you can add another 2GB from Crucial for not very much money. It's a very fast machine.

[Blong]

Get a refurb'd Dual 2.7Ghz Power Mac G5. It's a performance bargain, comes in less than a dual core 2.0. They generally come with 1GB of ram, but you can add another 2GB from Crucial for not very much money. It's a very fast machine.

Maybe I haven't looked hard enough, but in Australia, refurbed Dual 2.7GHz Powermacs are still more expensive than a new Dual Core 2.3GHz Powermacs.

Also, there don't seem to be that many refurbed Dual processor G5s around.

Anyone from Oz tell me any different?

Thanks.

Rob

[w8ing4intelmacs]

The Quad is a waste of money unless you are running very heavy apps.


Couldn't you say that about every PowerMac (even the Intel PowerMac that'll eventually come out), since PowerMacs are made to run heavy apps?

200 shots of RAW images a day edited in Photoshop. Since PS won't be universal until 2007 (an eternity), the Quad is a great buy and will last for years. Have fun!

[beatzfreak]

Get a refurb'd Dual 2.7Ghz Power Mac G5. It's a performance bargain, comes in less than a dual core 2.0. They generally come with 1GB of ram, but you can add another 2GB from Crucial for not very much money. It's a very fast machine.

This is simply not true that the 2.7 comes in less than the 2.0.

Macconnection has the 2.0 for $1,994. with $100. rebate. No tax, free shipping.
And iLife 06 for free.

Refurb 2.7 with 512 ram is $2,149 plus tax (about $200 for me).

Also, it's seems the refurbs aren't an option in Oz.

To Blong, my friend works at a huge graphics co. and they just replaced all their computers with 2.3's and are very pleased with the results.

While the quad is an awesome machine, I'm not sure it's worth the investment considering the transition to Intel. We really don't know how long there will be support for PPC. Infact, one of the music apps I like to use recently announced that the next update for Mac will be Intel only.

Anyway, just some thoughts. Have fun with your new Mac.

[combatcolin]

Couldn't you say that about every PowerMac (even the Intel PowerMac that'll eventually come out), since PowerMacs are made to run heavy apps?

200 shots of RAW images a day edited in Photoshop. Since PS won't be universal until 2007 (an eternity), the Quad is a great buy and will last for years. Have fun!

NO.

YOU CANNOT

Check the price between an entry level Powermac and a Quad.

A lot of people buy Powermacs because they want something with expandability and a removable graphics card.

If Apple ever offered a machine along the specs of the iMac but without the screen and a removable graphics card sales of the entry level Powermac would be a lot lower.

[Blong]

A lot of people buy Powermacs because they want something with expandability and a removable graphics card.

If Apple ever offered a machine along the specs of the iMac but without the screen and a removable graphics card sales of the entry level Powermac would be a lot lower.

That was a huge part of my decision to look at PowerMacs over the iMac. At first look, the iMac looks like great value for money (and it looks real nice too), but then you are limited to 2gig RAM and not as good video cards.

It's the expandability of the PowerMac which has convinced me that's the way to go - i.e, as apps become more RAM hungry, then add a bit more RAM etc. Also, once it's time to get a new one, you already have a monitor ...:)

Correct me if i'm wrong here.

Rob

[combatcolin]

ENTRY LEVEL POWERMAC

GRAPHIC CARD UPGRADE

ANOTHER GIG OF QUALITY RAM

BLUETOOTH OPTION + BT KEYBOARD

EDU DISCOUNT + EGG MONEY CARD

best solution job done!

:)

[zerolight]

Maybe I haven't looked hard enough, but in Australia, refurbed Dual 2.7GHz Powermacs are still more expensive than a new Dual Core 2.3GHz Powermacs.

Also, there don't seem to be that many refurbed Dual processor G5s around.

Anyone from Oz tell me any different?

Thanks.

Rob

I assumed that the refurb store was a worldwide store, given that the stock comes from China.

My Dual 2.7 with 1GB of RAM and a Mighty Mouse was £1299. A dual core 2.3 is £1799. And a Quad is £2299. The 2.7 is fractionally slower than the Quad and a fair bit faster than the 2.3.

UK refurb 2.7... (http://store.apple.com/Apple/WebObjects/ukstore.woa/6164040/wo/gg1YtC2IyVQn2akdUXi11W2izFE/3.0.0.19.1.0.8.7.3.5.1.1.8.1.5.1.0.5.0)

[zerolight]

This is simply not true that the 2.7 comes in less than the 2.0.

Macconnection has the 2.0 for $1,994. with $100. rebate. No tax, free shipping.
And iLife 06 for free.

Refurb 2.7 with 512 ram is $2,149 plus tax (about $200 for me).

Also, it's seems the refurbs aren't an option in Oz.

To Blong, my friend works at a huge graphics co. and they just replaced all their computers with 2.3's and are very pleased with the results.

While the quad is an awesome machine, I'm not sure it's worth the investment considering the transition to Intel. We really don't know how long there will be support for PPC. Infact, one of the music apps I like to use recently announced that the next update for Mac will be Intel only.

Anyway, just some thoughts. Have fun with your new Mac.

I'm in the UK. Even if it was a little more than a 2.0 in price and similar to a 2.3, it's a lot faster than both. That said, as I said a moment ago, in the UK at least, a refurb'd 2.7 is cheaper than the current crop of PowerMacs. I love mine.

[turtlebud]

That was a huge part of my decision to look at PowerMacs over the iMac. At first look, the iMac looks like great value for money (and it looks real nice too), but then you are limited to 2gig RAM and not as good video cards.

It's the expandability of the PowerMac which has convinced me that's the way to go - i.e, as apps become more RAM hungry, then add a bit more RAM etc. Also, once it's time to get a new one, you already have a monitor ...:)

Correct me if i'm wrong here.

Rob

Rob, you & I seem to be thinking on exactly the same lines - this is why my past two desktops have been powermacs - expandibility. When Apple introduced their last g5 iMacs, I thought, "Wow, that's a great value." You have your built in isight, better screen, front row + remote, all for the same price as the previous imac. But the main drawback is that everything you expand (except the RAM - which you're pretty limited on as well) will have to be external. I like to have that flexibility of being able to add a second hard drive or more RAM now and later as my needs change - and yeah, I'm planning on getting the 7800GT as well.

[THX1139]

Like the Tortoise and the Hare - only the Hare's forgot his running shoes? :)

Uh, yea sure...if you think changing the analogy around to animals helps you understand the concept. But Tortoise and Hare are NOT the same as "Corvette" and "Lamborgini" so the analogy falls apart. But I did note your sarcasm. ha ha.

[THX1139]

The Quad is a waste of money unless you are running very heavy apps.

If you think you need it, the you don't.

If you do need it, its because the work that you will perform on it will pay your Rent/bills/credit card bill for the Quad.

Duh? Buying ANY PowerMac is a waste of money unless you can justify needing the power. I was assuming the poster needed the power. The reason I recommend the Quad for pro application - over any other PowerMac- is that you get the longest shelf like while transitioning to Intel over the next couple of years. A Quad is going to outlast a dual and is not that much more $$ considering what you get compared to the other machines. An Intel machine is going to sit around depreciating while waiting for Adobe. But why am I explaining this to you? I'm probably wasting my time try to help you get a clue.

[combatcolin]

Duh? Buying ANY PowerMac is a waste of money unless you can justify needing the power. I was assuming the poster needed the power. The reason I recommend the Quad for pro application - over any other PowerMac- is that you get the longest shelf like while transitioning to Intel over the next couple of years. A Quad is going to outlast a dual and is not that much more $$ considering what you get compared to the other machines. An Intel machine is going to sit around depreciating while waiting for Adobe. But why am I explaining this to you? I'm probably wasting my time try to help you get a clue.

SO WHY DO YOU ASSUME I AM AIMING AT YOU?

The point i am trying to make is best made by the kind of posts that ask:

"Should i buy a Mac Mini or a Quad?"

Understand now?

Peace out and try to understand.

[Squareball]

I just got the quad.

Here are my reasons.

Right NOW, Photoshop does not run native on Intel macs. When it does, I have little faith it'll be stable (see the grabbing a slider issue in CS2 on PPC). Adobe has been churning out some really unstable stuff lately IMO.

Right now my powerbook isn't doing me much good when working with these large files in photoshop.

The macbook pro is out because the intel issue.

So it was a question of 'what desktop' for me. I already have a 24" dell LCD so I didn't want to get the G5 iMac.

So it came down to powermac. Dual or Quad. I decided that for a little extra money I can have a machine that has twice the processing capability and will last pretty long.

Just look how long the Dual 2.5 Ghzs have been the 'top' of the line.

Now what I really look for isn't 'is this the fastest one' but, is it FAST for what I need?

The quad is the fastest machine I've owned. It blows me away how quick it is. I have 2.5 gigs of ram and it just screams. Apps open instantly.. (photoshop is pretty quick to open as well) and even doing everything i do, I barely ever use its full potential.

I figure this machine will last me around 12 to 18 months and that I'm perfectly happy with. It could last me longer (3 years?) but I tend to get new hardware all the time and really am waiting for the next Intel powerbooks and Adobe to be universal and stable before I jump back to using a notebook as my fulltime machine.

[THX1139]

SO WHY DO YOU ASSUME I AM AIMING AT YOU?

The point i am trying to make is best made by the kind of posts that ask:

"Should i buy a Mac Mini or a Quad?"

Understand now?

Peace out and try to understand.

In my opinion, you are spreading mis-information and bad advice. This is a public forum and I'm not going to sit back and let it go by when my experience tells me otherwise. For the record, the poster asked the following question:

"My question is whether I should get a 2.0GHz Dual Core and bump up the hard drive to 250MB, add 2GB RAM (not from Apple) and add Geforce 7800 256MB video card ...
.... or go straight to the 2.5 Quad and only bump up the RAM by 1GB and then add a better video card much later (if at all - it will already have the 6600 256MB card) ....
... or go middle ground and go for the 2.3GHz Dual core with a similar setup to the first one."

Of which you replied, like you do in one of your many anti-Powermac threads, that the Quad is a waste of money OR "wait for Intel". The question of "should I get a mac-mini or Quad?" wasn't even part of the discussion. Go back and read the original post.

In fairness, you did post one recommendation for him to get and entry level Powermac, but I'm not sure how or why you came-up with that recommendation.

Anyway, I'll just ignore your posts from now on since we don't agree on much. I just pity the person who takes your bad advice. I wonder what experience you have with Macs that qualifies you to be handing out advice? Is it because you own an iPod and you bought your sister an eMac?

[combatcolin]

OK, 1st i think you should cut down on the caffine eh? ;)

My point is that the Quad is not the ideal Mac for everyone, it costs £2300 and unless you are expecting to make money with that £2300 you are better served with the entry level machine which is £900 cheaper.

I bought my 1st gen iMac the week it was released (and bought an extra 4MB VRAM module and got 64MB RAM free), and prevous to that had a 6500/250, so i've been a Mac fan for almost 10 years.

A lack of funds and buying 2 homes in 3 years has delayed my re-entry into the Apple fold, but together with my Mum i bought an emac for my sister and her young sons.

This is a forum, and people are encouraged to express theres views, opinons and experience.

And let me say this again, the Quad is a incredibly powerful computer - but it is not for everyone, if you want to disagree with me expresing this opinon then that is fine, but please do not insult me.

Thank you.

[Blong]

Okey dokey

Finally bit the bullet and did it.

Ordered a 2.3GHz Dual Core PowerMac, 7800 GT video card, stock hard drive (250mb), and an additional 2gig RAM (2.5 gig total).

Bought from a re-seller, who offered to match the price of RAM I found from another third party. Happy with that.

The Dell 24" will be here soon.

Cool.

Rob

[trogdor!]

im personaly waiting for the new intel powermacs.

[eXan]

Okey dokey

Finally bit the bullet and did it.

Ordered a 2.3GHz Dual Core PowerMac, 7800 GT video card, stock hard drive (250mb), and an additional 2gig RAM (2.5 gig total).

Bought from a re-seller, who offered to match the price of RAM I found from another third party. Happy with that.

The Dell 24" will be here soon.

Cool.

Rob

You have made the right choice about buying dualcore 2.3. I only have doubts about the usefulnes of 7800. As I remember you will be doing Photoshop work (2d), so the "latest and greatest" graphics card wont help you AT ALL. You could have invested money wasted on GeForce into getting more RAM. You said that you take 200 RAW photos/day, so 4 GB + RAM is minimum for Photoshop & Aperture, especially if you want to run those at the same time.

But anyway, what is done cannot be undone. Enjoy your PowerMac! :)

[bilbo--baggins]

Okey dokey

Finally bit the bullet and did it.

Ordered a 2.3GHz Dual Core PowerMac, 7800 GT video card, stock hard drive (250mb), and an additional 2gig RAM (2.5 gig total).

Bought from a re-seller, who offered to match the price of RAM I found from another third party. Happy with that.

The Dell 24" will be here soon.

Cool.

Rob

Unless you're doing the most complex stuff in Photoshop the 2.3 will give good performance. As for waiting for the Intels - if you were in no hurry and prepared to wait a year or 2 then that would be a good choice. Personally I think an Intel would be good as your NEXT mac, once the transition is complete, all software is made for Intel, and all the initial teething problems are sorted out.

I'm thinking of getting a new Intel laptop, but only because I don't need much software to run on it - if I needed it for Photoshop etc then I would wait. Also I think the new Intel PowerMac's will probably see much smaller performance gains over the current G5's compared to the huge jumps from the Powerbook G4 to the MacBook Pro.

[combatcolin]

Okey dokey

Finally bit the bullet and did it.

Ordered a 2.3GHz Dual Core PowerMac, 7800 GT video card, stock hard drive (250mb), and an additional 2gig RAM (2.5 gig total).*

Bought from a re-seller, who offered to match the price of RAM I found from another third party. Happy with that.

The Dell 24" will be here soon.

Cool.

Rob


Have to agree with eXan that the 7800 GT is wasted on Photoshop, however if you ever play any games, (BUY WOW!!:p ) then you can run then at 1920*1200 60FPS with all the effects on your new Dell 24".

Now that would be stunning indeed!

[Blong]

You have made the right choice about buying dualcore 2.3. I only have doubts about the usefulnes of 7800. As I remember you will be doing Photoshop work (2d), so the "latest and greatest" graphics card wont help you AT ALL. You could have invested money wasted on GeForce into getting more RAM. You said that you take 200 RAW photos/day, so 4 GB + RAM is minimum for Photoshop & Aperture, especially if you want to run those at the same time.

But anyway, what is done cannot be undone. Enjoy your PowerMac! :)

Hmmmm - I understood that Aperture was fairly hungry in terms of video ram, so I gave that a push up. Was I wrong? I will most likely also go for a few games now as well (shhhh - the wife thinks I need the card for photoshop).

Also - doesn't photoshop only "see" 2 gig RAM - OK better for more ram to have other apps running, but why 4 gig?

(Today I only came home with approx 100 shots in the city - just a few "snaps".)

I'm happy - the wife is happy because I'm happy - it's all good in la la land.

Cool.

Rob

[Blong]

Have to agree with eXan that the 7800 GT is wasted on Photoshop, however if you ever play any games, (BUY WOW!!:p ) then you can run then at 1920*1200 60FPS with all the effects on your new Dell 24".

Now that would be stunning indeed!


Mr Combat - sorry just read your post - I mentioned above, isn't Aperture heavy on the video card? I thought the major consensus was that Aperture was no good with stock video card. Anyway - some games will be had - see message above.

Cool.

Rob

[combatcolin]

Gaming and photoshop are differnt, but your card will give you a big big boost.

Lots of RAm is always good, and your sorted there.

Don't want to bang on too much about WOW, but it will be amazing on your system!

[~Shard~]

im personaly waiting for the new intel powermacs.

You'll have to wait until August at the earliest, hope that's alright. ;) Jobs will be announcing them at WWDC, however whether they will be shipping immediately or a few months afterwards remains to be seen. It depends on the true availability of Conroe.

Hmm, a top-end Woodcrest PowerMac sure would be nice as well to compete with the quad... perhaps Apple will do what they did with the MBP line and not release all the machines in the line at once, waiting for better technology - that could be alright... ;) :cool:

[asencif]

You'll have to wait until August at the earliest, hope that's alright. ;) Jobs will be announcing them at WWDC, however whether they will be shipping immediately or a few months afterwards remains to be seen. It depends on the true availability of Conroe.

Hmm, a top-end Woodcrest PowerMac sure would be nice as well to compete with the quad... perhaps Apple will do what they did with the MBP line and not release all the machines in the line at once, waiting for better technology - that could be alright... ;) :cool:

Seems very possible. The Quad is a very powerful beast that only Woodcrest chips can match or beat. Conroe chips can't do quad processing, so again Intel has tons of chips they rollout before the one that will be common and have a longer life is released. ex. Pentium D, Intel CD...The one's who will have more stay is Merom and Woodcrest, since they are 64-Bit and can do Quad or more.

[MIDI_EVIL]

Congratulations on an incredible machine! We use this machine in my University for Video, and it's effing fast!

The graphics card was a good choice, you should always buy the better option if you can afford it and intend to use it at some point.

Photoshop does only see 2 gig, and you'll be fine with 2 gig for a good while. Maybe get a second internal HD to store your photos on, and work from that.

Enjoy your machine! Congratulations.

Rich.


Hmmmm - I understood that Aperture was fairly hungry in terms of video ram, so I gave that a push up. Was I wrong? I will most likely also go for a few games now as well (shhhh - the wife thinks I need the card for photoshop).

Also - doesn't photoshop only "see" 2 gig RAM - OK better for more ram to have other apps running, but why 4 gig?

(Today I only came home with approx 100 shots in the city - just a few "snaps".)

I'm happy - the wife is happy because I'm happy - it's all good in la la land.

Cool.

Rob

[~Shard~]

Seems very possible. The Quad is a very powerful beast that only Woodcrest chips can match or beat. Conroe chips can't do quad processing, so again Intel has tons of chips they rollout before the one that will be common and have a longer life is released. ex. Pentium D, Intel CD...The one's who will have more stay is Merom and Woodcrest, since they are 64-Bit and can do Quad or more.

Either that, or throw some sort of dual Conroe in the top end, making it a quad... But yes, Woodcrest would be much better in this situation. The only question is, what is Woodcrest's timeline for release compared to Conroe's, and if PowerMac users are having to wait a while for their Intel PowerMacs as it is, will they be happy about having to wait even longer for the top-end model! ;)

Perhaps Apple will simply release an all-Conroe line of PowerMacs in August, and then come MWSF '07 or shortly thereafter, we'll start seeing Kentsfield PowerMacs, or <gasp> Cloverton! :eek: ;) :cool:

[turtlebud]

Mr Combat - sorry just read your post - I mentioned above, isn't Aperture heavy on the video card? I thought the major consensus was that Aperture was no good with stock video card. Anyway - some games will be had - see message above.

Cool.

Rob

On top of that, isn't it probably true that future applications will likely push more work to the video card and the better your card, the faster the app will run (aperture is one of the first non-gaming applications that do this, but I believe we'll see more in the future). Adding more RAM is easy and since you have 8 slots, you have plenty of room to expand, but it might be a while before you can upgrade the PCI-E graphics card and you'd have to swap out your current card if you did that.

[bodeh6]

I think that the graphic card is a great choice. I am sure that you might not notice it now in PhotoShop, but future programs will. Look at iGary, he had to send in his X800 for repairs and went back to the stock ATI 9650 and he saw a huge performance decrease in Apeture. So if you are doing Apeture, then you made the right choice.

[asencif]

Either that, or throw some sort of dual Conroe in the top end, making it a quad... But yes, Woodcrest would be much better in this situation. The only question is, what is Woodcrest's timeline for release compared to Conroe's, and if PowerMac users are having to wait a while for their Intel PowerMacs as it is, will they be happy about having to wait even longer for the top-end model! ;)

Perhaps Apple will simply release an all-Conroe line of PowerMacs in August, and then come MWSF '07 or shortly thereafter, we'll start seeing Kentsfield PowerMacs, or <gasp> Cloverton! :eek: ;) :cool:

The Kensfield is just out of this world, but I don't see that till mid 07, however who knows. All this uncertainty about which chips will be in the Intel PM's makes me want to hold off and just wait till Summer of 07. Wouldn't want to get a Conroe Mac with just 4-5 months of life when Woodcrest or maybe even Kentsfield is placed all across the line in MWSF 07. That's going through too many chips in short period of time which is different then going through different speed. Speed bumps I understand, but not different chips in such a short time. I'll probably end up getting a Quad to tie me over till Fall 07 or even MWSF 08 until the Intel PM line is more settled and just going through speed bumps.

[~Shard~]

The Kensfield is just out of this world, but I don't see that till mid 07, however who knows. All this uncertainty about which chips will be in the Intel PM's makes me want to hold off and just wait till Summer of 07. Wouldn't want to get a Conroe Mac with just 4-5 months of life when Woodcrest or maybe even Kentsfield is placed all across the line in MWSF 07. That's going through too many chips in short period of time which is different then going through different speed. Speed bumps I understand, but not different chips in such a short time. I'll probably end up getting a Quad to tie me over till Fall 07 or even MWSF 08 until the Intel PM line is more settled and just going through speed bumps.

I hear what you're saying, but keep in mind that if you play the waiting game, you'll always be waiting. ;) After Conroe and Kentsfield there will be something else, and even if the proc is there that you want, you'll want to wait just a couple more months for some new Blu Ray drive, or 802.11n support, or a new OS, or whatever, so there's always that next thing you could wait for - it's an easy trap to fall into. ;) Sounds like you have a good handle on what you want and when though, which is a good thing. :cool:

[jhu]

Hello

Newbie to this forum - hope I can get some help with this. I've been agonising for a long time over which PowerMac to buy.

Basically, I do a fair amount of photoshop work (but I am not a pro) - I shoot in RAW and may take 200 shots in a day. Many projects that I work on require in the range of 50 or more layers - my old 1.4GHz PC just doesn't cut it anymore.

Will probably also look at using Aperture.

I'm really looking for longevity and don't want to spend extra $$$ for a new machine to just keep me happy until the Intel PowerMacs come out, photoshop runs natively on Intel and the bugs are sorted out.

My question is whether I should get a 2.0GHz Dual Core and bump up the hard drive to 250MB, add 2GB RAM (not from Apple) and add Geforce 7800 256MB video card ...
.... or go straight to the 2.5 Quad and only bump up the RAM by 1GB and then add a better video card much later (if at all - it will already have the 6600 256MB card) ....
... or go middle ground and go for the 2.3GHz Dual core with a similar setup to the first one.

I have already made the decision that I'll be getting the 24" Dell display.

The price difference between the 2.0 and Quad set up as above (with edu discount) is in the range of AUS$1219.

I hope someone can give me some advice on this.

Rob

if all you're doing is photoshop, why not just get a quad intel/amd machine?

[combatcolin]

Mr Combat - sorry just read your post - I mentioned above, isn't Aperture heavy on the video card? I thought the major consensus was that Aperture was no good with stock video card. Anyway - some games will be had - see message above.

Cool.

Rob

Simple way to explain.

Your Graphics card is VERY good at Photoshop.

Your Graphics card is VERY VERY good at gaming.

Now stop reading this and go out and buy WOW. :p

[Blong]

if all you're doing is photoshop, why not just get a quad intel/amd machine?

The simple answer here would be because I want Mac OS.

Cool.

Rob

[turtlebud]

Rob, I'm happy to say that I bit the bullet too and ordered my powermac g5. I went a step down from yours and ordered the dual core 2.0 with the 7800GT & bluetooth/wireless upgrades. I just got delivery of the 250gb sata drive that I ordered last week to add to the stock 160gb drive and will order 2gig of RAM at soon.

All in all, the total for the system came out to $1998 + tax. The HD + RAM will add another $260 or so and I'm waiting to see if Apple blows me away with their next revision of their ADC. For the time being, I'll make due with my 19" CRT.

Oh, and I took your advice and started shooting in RAW. For the most part, I didn't need to utilize the RAW file in most of the pictures, but for a few of them that were overexposed or the color was really weird, the RAW file saved me. RAW processing does take quite a bit more processing power though and my trusty 867mhz quicksilver just can't cut it. Started playing around with Aperture in the Apple store as well as Photoshop Elements. May take a look at PSE 4.0 when they have a demo available and will probably play around with Lightroom a bit more. Can't wait to see how all these programs run on the dual core.

[Blong]

Rob, I'm happy to say that I bit the bullet too and ordered my powermac g5. I went a step down from yours and ordered the dual core 2.0 with the 7800GT & bluetooth/wireless upgrades. I just got delivery of the 250gb sata drive that I ordered last week to add to the stock 160gb drive and will order 2gig of RAM at soon.

All in all, the total for the system came out to $1998 + tax. The HD + RAM will add another $260 or so and I'm waiting to see if Apple blows me away with their next revision of their ADC. For the time being, I'll make due with my 19" CRT.

Oh, and I took your advice and started shooting in RAW. For the most part, I didn't need to utilize the RAW file in most of the pictures, but for a few of them that were overexposed or the color was really weird, the RAW file saved me. RAW processing does take quite a bit more processing power though and my trusty 867mhz quicksilver just can't cut it. Started playing around with Aperture in the Apple store as well as Photoshop Elements. May take a look at PSE 4.0 when they have a demo available and will probably play around with Lightroom a bit more. Can't wait to see how all these programs run on the dual core.

Cool!

I received my Dell 24" on Monday and plugged it into my iBook. OK, well I'm not utilising the full resolution or wide aspect of the screen, but gee it's nice and BIG.

Didn't order the bluetooth/wireless upgrade - I don't have a need for the bluetooth and the airport extreme card I will buy seperately in the next few days.

Even though it may be a bit of overkill, I virtually shoot in RAW all the time - even for happy snaps. I'm still at that point in my photography where there is a fair amount of luck involved and I never know when I will accidently capture a really good keeper.

Not only is RAW good for fixing white balance and over or under exposed pics, but it allows just a little bit more dynamic range. If you are shooting in RAW and jpeg, compare the two images and you will see a little more detail in the shadows and highlights of the RAW image. Also, you can use it in low light situations by purposely underexposing and then bumping up the exposure in the RAW converter - just like "pushing" with film.

I'm really getting impatient with the delivery of my PowerMac - it's only the fourth working day since I ordered it and they said 5-7 days. Aaaaargh!

Cool.

Rob

[milo]

Yeah..that's good advice. Then when your done waiting for Intel, you can wait some more for your software to be ported to Universal binary. Then wait awhile longer while they work the bugs out. Then wait some more because of revision B machines are "just over the horizon." Then wait some more because you read a rumor that dual intel quad core machines are coming out "soon."

Nah, just wait for intel towers.

Or if you're OK with rosetta performance for photoshop, just get a mini duo now to tide you over. Especially since Aperture should be universal any day now.


Infact, one of the music apps I like to use recently announced that the next update for Mac will be Intel only.

Which app?

[combatcolin]

Cool!

I received my Dell 24" on Monday and plugged it into my iBook. OK, well I'm not utilising the full resolution or wide aspect of the screen, but gee it's nice and BIG.



Rob

It should work.

A 32MB card should run a 1920*1200 display, just don't overdo the 3d work

[Blong]

While I'm happily using my iBook with my Dell 24" monitor, I'm getting more and more impatient with the delivery time for the PowerMac I ordered.

I ordered it on 24 April (Saturday here in Aust, so I'm not counting that as a day) - so now it's 5 days later and the re-seller who I ordered it from says that Apple hasn't even given it an order number yet (or something like that) which means that it hasn't even been built yet. Aaaaargh!

Then there's still shipping time from Singapore.

I'm trying to be patient, but the thing is that I assume that there is not a huge demand for PowerMacs at the moment, so what's the delay? If I had ordered an MBP, I would expect a longer delay.

[turtlebud]

While I'm happily using my iBook with my Dell 24" monitor, I'm getting more and more impatient with the delivery time for the PowerMac I ordered.

I ordered it on 24 April (Saturday here in Aust, so I'm not counting that as a day) - so now it's 5 days later and the re-seller who I ordered it from says that Apple hasn't even given it an order number yet (or something like that) which means that it hasn't even been built yet. Aaaaargh!

Then there's still shipping time from Singapore.

I'm trying to be patient, but the thing is that I assume that there is not a huge demand for PowerMacs at the moment, so what's the delay? If I had ordered an MBP, I would expect a longer delay.

That does seem like a long wait - how long did it would take say on the reseller site? I can understand your feelings - this must be one of the few times that I can't wait to see a $2k charge on my credit card, cause that means the g5 is shipping soon. It's only been 2 days since I ordered, yet I go back every day to see if this shipping status has changed. If it helps, I ordered my CTO powermac from apple on 3/28 and their estimated ship date is 4/3. Hopefully your system will ship soon.

[turtlebud]

I got notification that my powermac shipped on 4/1 and should arrive on 4/4. I thought it was going to ship from China, but apparently it ships from Fullerton, California. Guess not all the systems are built overseas.

[Blong]

I got notification that my powermac shipped on 4/1 and should arrive on 4/4. I thought it was going to ship from China, but apparently it ships from Fullerton, California. Guess not all the systems are built overseas.

Cool! I was just notified today that my machine started shipping on the 31st of March. However my reseller couldn't tell me whether it was going to arrive today or in a few days. It's Tuesday on this side of the world, so I'm happy if it gets here before the end of the week. If not ... hmmmm ... someone may be pushing MBPs in front of other things.

[Rodion]

I got notification that my powermac shipped on 4/1 and should arrive on 4/4. I thought it was going to ship from China, but apparently it ships from Fullerton, California. Guess not all the systems are built overseas.

Hi Turtlebud,

I also ordered a Powermac G5 Dual Core 2.0 from Apple on 3/31 and estimated ship date is 4/6. I wish it would ship sooner. Congrats Turtlebud, and Blong on your new powermacs. I wonder if my was going to ship from Fullerton also? It shouldn't take to long from Southern California to Reno, NV.

[turtlebud]

Hi Turtlebud,

I also ordered a Powermac G5 Dual Core 2.0 from Apple on 3/31 and estimated ship date is 4/6. I wish it would ship sooner. Congrats Turtlebud, and Blong on your new powermacs. I wonder if my was going to ship from Fullerton also? It shouldn't take to long from Southern California to Reno, NV.

Rodion, did you add anything to the machine? (ie, graphics card upgrade, wireless/bluetooth). If it's a stock machine it should ship out faster than an upgraded machine. Either way, my experience from apple is that they tend to ship out on time or earlier than their estimated ship date. One way to know for sure is when you see that big charge authorization on your credit card, then you know it's getting ready to ship. That happened to me on 3/31 and sure enough it shipped out on 4/1 (2 days early).

[supremedesigner]

3rd party RAM is a lot cheaper than apple ram. I welcome apple to put in 256 stock memory and i'll buy RAM at New Egg for a fraction of apple's price.

haha I remembered few years ago that Apple used to charge you like $40 to install each rams. :rolleyes:

[Blong]

Finally I am now the proud owner of a Dual Core 2.3GHz powermac with a GeForce 7800 GT 256mb video card and a total of 2.5gig RAM.

All I can say is fantastic! Totally no comparison with the G4 iBook i've been using or my old 1.4GHz PC.

Being originally a mac person in the early 90's, then moving to PC, and now back to Mac, I was pleasantly surprised with the "feel" of the keyboard - memories came flooding back.

Just ran a quick test by "eyeballing" how long it would take me to run a noise filter in PSE4. My PC would do it in 40 to 50 seconds, the Mac - 9 seconds!

The only thing that I feel a little sad about is that now it looks like the Intel Macs will be able to run XP and Mac OS side by side, not requiring a reboot to use the other OS. I'd love to be able to use AutoCad on the Mac.

Anyway - no regrets - I still think that I made the correct decision by buying now rather than waiting until the end of the year, then waiting even longer for universal Photoshop, and sorting out bugs along the way. I'll be ready for intel in a few years time.

Cool.

Rob

[combatcolin]

Boot Camp has changed the playing field.

[Blong]

Boot Camp has changed the playing field.

Yeah, but why not get a PC then? Won't there be an issue with viruses? What about stability?

Sure I feel a little regret in the fact that I don't get this new feature, but hey, I'm working on tried and true equipment here.

However, I'm hoping that this doesn't mean that there will be less software developed for the PPC ... :o

[asencif]

Yeah, but why not get a PC then? Won't there be an issue with viruses? What about stability?

Sure I feel a little regret in the fact that I don't get this new feature, but hey, I'm working on tried and true equipment here.

However, I'm hoping that this doesn't mean that there will be less software developed for the PPC ... :o


I wouldn't worry. Many are excited because now they can run the OS they all love to trash. If Windows was such a necessity than why not just have a cheap PC laying around or no Mac at all. I have used both for years and hate the term they each have its benefits. Well no...Windows only became must for many because it has every software company behind it and not because technologically it is better. For me if I need a Windows app then Virtualization like Parellels would be a better option since I can just open up an app run it in a window and close it, and not be fully booted into it.

As for gaming, why is this always such a huge deal? Gaming consoles for years have been now dominating the market. They are getting the games first mostly as well. Get a gaming console if you want to game so badly. If you factor in that you have to buy an Intel Mac then purchase your own copy of Windows then Anti-Virus, all it's software plus games you are looking at probably spending more than a Mac plus Xbox 360 or Revolution. So much excitement to run Windows after the main reason many stated that they switch is because they want to escape Windows. I'm probably just ranting, but I do worry about too much windows excitement and not Mac OS X and all it's features. MS must be so excited that they now get to sell Windows to the whole Mac market. More money for them which is more than Apple would make selling one mac.

Back to the topic...If you need to run non-UB apps then PPC is still great and there's nothing out there than can beat a Quad yet either. Your machine is not going to run slower or stop working. Right now is a good time to get a deal on a Refurb or from anyone that's selling a PM.

[Alone2Gether]

Boot camp has definitely changed the playing field.

I was thinking of building a custom PeeCee next year when Vista releases but with the release of Boot Camp, I might just wait for the Intel PowerMac (maybe it will be called Mac Pro).

Imagine running Pro/Engineer and AutoCAD on a PowerMac...:eek:

[jhu]

As for gaming, why is this always such a huge deal? Gaming consoles for years have been now dominating the market. They are getting the games first mostly as well. Get a gaming console if you want to game so badly. If you factor in that you have to buy an Intel Mac then purchase your own copy of Windows then Anti-Virus, all it's software plus games you are looking at probably spending more than a Mac plus Xbox 360 or Revolution. So much excitement to run Windows after the main reason many stated that they switch is because they want to escape Windows. I'm probably just ranting, but I do worry about too much windows excitement and not Mac OS X and all it's features. MS must be so excited that they now get to sell Windows to the whole Mac market. More money for them which is more than Apple would make selling one mac.

real-time strategy, first-person shooter, and mmporg all work better using a keyboard/mouse combination, which can't be done as well on consoles.

[combatcolin]

Lan partys at least will be intresting.

[milo]

Yeah, but why not get a PC then?

Because it doesn't run mac software?

If Windows was such a necessity than why not just have a cheap PC laying around or no Mac at all.

Because it's not a necessity, it's something that's nice to have handy for that 5% of the time you need to fire up a windows app. Even a cheap pc costs more than a software install and takes up more space. Obviously it has no appeal for you, but it makes sense that people might be happy about not having to buy a second machine.

[asencif]

Because it's not a necessity, it's something that's nice to have handy for that 5% of the time you need to fire up a windows app. Even a cheap pc costs more than a software install and takes up more space. Obviously it has no appeal for you, but it makes sense that people might be happy about not having to buy a second machine.


I have no problem with that 5% of the time, however people were partying like it will be 60% of the time and cutting into OS X usage. For me Virtualization would be better as you still are using OS X and just minimizing the Windows OS. Also, there is that factor of how many will end up being on the Apple Wintel side and forgetting about OS X. Only time will tell. Hopefully, Leopard will include features so one only needs to boot into Mac OS X.

[Blong]

Because it doesn't run mac software?


Well, if you need to reboot to use windows software I would think that would be more of a pain than anything else. And then of course reboot to get back into Mac OS - oh, then I forgot something, reboot back into winows etc.

OK, as I said before, it would be cool to have AutoCad running on the PowerMac, but I want everything else to run like a mac, not like a PC.

For me Virtualization would be better as you still are using OS X and just minimizing the Windows OS. Also, there is that factor of how many will end up being on the Apple Wintel side and forgetting about OS X. Only time will tell. Hopefully, Leopard will include features so one only needs to boot into Mac OS X.

Yeah - so you can have your mac running like a mac with a windows app in a window. But as long as the windows apps run at full speed.

[leekohler]

Finally I am now the proud owner of a Dual Core 2.3GHz powermac with a GeForce 7800 GT 256mb video card and a total of 2.5gig RAM.

All I can say is fantastic! Totally no comparison with the G4 iBook i've been using or my old 1.4GHz PC.

Being originally a mac person in the early 90's, then moving to PC, and now back to Mac, I was pleasantly surprised with the "feel" of the keyboard - memories came flooding back.

Just ran a quick test by "eyeballing" how long it would take me to run a noise filter in PSE4. My PC would do it in 40 to 50 seconds, the Mac - 9 seconds!

The only thing that I feel a little sad about is that now it looks like the Intel Macs will be able to run XP and Mac OS side by side, not requiring a reboot to use the other OS. I'd love to be able to use AutoCad on the Mac.

Anyway - no regrets - I still think that I made the correct decision by buying now rather than waiting until the end of the year, then waiting even longer for universal Photoshop, and sorting out bugs along the way. I'll be ready for intel in a few years time.

Cool.

Rob

I just got the dual core 2 Ghz myself w/ the same a mount of RAM as you. Do these things kick butt or what? I love mine. It's cut my freelance work time in half.

[THX1139]

If Windows was such a necessity than why not just have a cheap PC laying around or no Mac at all.

In your limited view, you are forgetting the professional creative industry. With the option to boot into Windows I get access to another set of applications that are not available on the Mac. This means I will only need to buy one high-end workstation instead of two to run my applications of choice. For example, I can have OSX for Final Cut Studio and using the same machine, be able to run XSI (or run Maya more efficently). Being a free-lancer, I don't have the cash flow to maintain multiple machines and that limits what software I can use. Not to mention that most 3d software runs faster on Intel/AMD (due to driver issues). With Boot Camp and IntelMacs, I will have more software options for a lot less hardware cost.

[asencif]

In your limited view, you are forgetting the professional creative industry. With the option to boot into Windows I get access to another set of applications that are not available on the Mac. This means I will only need to buy one high-end workstation instead of two to run my applications of choice. For example, I can have OSX for Final Cut Studio and using the same machine, be able to run XSI (or run Maya more efficently). Being a free-lancer, I don't have the cash flow to maintain multiple machines and that limits what software I can use. Not to mention that most 3d software runs faster on Intel/AMD (due to driver issues). With Boot Camp and IntelMacs, I will have more software options for a lot less hardware cost.

I think about how productivity will benefit in a production environment, so dual-booting will not be very beneficiary as one has to keep shutting one down. Having both available at the sametime benefits greatly. So the only true argument of not stopping your flow and working on all apps simultaneously on one machine is really virtualization. I have been in enviroments where it was not an option at all to shutdown at all. These businesses will benefit from someting like Parelles which one could run all apps at once with both OS on and not shutdown time at all. So maybe my view was limited in a sense, I just wasn't thinking about the consumer that occasionally boots up to one OS. For me I need instance access multiple systems at once.