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MacRumors
Mar 30, 2006, 04:40 PM
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ThinkSecret reports (http://www.thinksecret.com/news/0603iphone.html) that Apple's cell phone project has been placed on hold due to "significant technical hurdles" in developing the product.

According to the rumor site, Apple had wanted to develop the cell phone "from the ground up" rather than improving on existing designs. The process, however, was met with technical problems in interfacing the various cell components.

ThinkSecret predicts that the Apple cell phone will not likely come until at least 2007, if not later. This is in the face of numerous (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2006/03/20060319140832.shtml) predictions by analysts that an Apple iPhone is expected in the next 12 months.

EricNau
Mar 30, 2006, 04:47 PM
I'm not surprised. I never really expected one that soon (if at all).

Leoff
Mar 30, 2006, 04:48 PM
I'd rather have them late to the party and have it done up right than throw some crap out there in a hurry.

Ayre
Mar 30, 2006, 04:51 PM
Good riddance. The iPhone concept was horrible to begin with.

bluebomberman
Mar 30, 2006, 04:52 PM
Yeah. No more ROKRs, please.

The first Apple phone needs to blow everybody else away.

hyperpasta
Mar 30, 2006, 04:55 PM
I think Apple will probably NOT introduce an iPhone... but I don't really trust ThinkSecret either way...

Atlasland
Mar 30, 2006, 05:02 PM
Let them take their time, so that they can produce a great product.

wkhahn
Mar 30, 2006, 05:04 PM
guess I'll be keeping my ROKR for a while yet.

supermacdesign
Mar 30, 2006, 05:07 PM
I just don't see any reason Apple needs to produce a phone. How does this sell more iMacs or Computers. Can anyone think of a reason?

SaddY
Mar 30, 2006, 05:20 PM
THE ROKR WAS NOT BY APPLE !!! ITUNES WAS !

having that said.. I didn't expect a Apple Phone any time soon...
I do however hope to see a Blackberry killer announced for the pro market by apple as I posted before.. RIM is in trouble.. (even though they settled), Palm is taking advantage right now.. and Apple could jump in..

Besides all that I could buy the motivation of this story but let's not forget that none of the things ThinkSecret predicted past year have come true.. Almost like Apple is pulling the strings upthere.. or maybe it's just stock manipulation..

Peyton
Mar 30, 2006, 05:20 PM
Well, I guess I'll get a razr... and wait it out.

Peyton
Mar 30, 2006, 05:24 PM
I just don't see any reason Apple needs to produce a phone. How does this sell more iMacs or Computers. Can anyone think of a reason?


Actually I don't know either. I think anything that makes money and that gets Apple's name out there and familiar (as a strong brand even among PC users) may make it even easier for switchers.

There are so many people I know that will never used an Apple because of how they 'were'. (Always incompatable, always shutting down, pre OSX) that's THEIR opinion by the way so don't burn me.

I think the iPod has brought on switchers, why not a phone?

p0intblank
Mar 30, 2006, 05:26 PM
Eh, not a big deal... if they need to take their time, then that is what they'll do. The whole iPhone concept never had me that excited from the start anyway.

JZ Wire
Mar 30, 2006, 05:29 PM
Hmm, too bad because I would love to see a cell phone from Apple but its just a rumor right? Maybe hes dead wrong but if he is not id like for Apple to take all the time they need to make that phone perfect. :)

fabsgwu
Mar 30, 2006, 05:30 PM
Apple should just buy some Korean phone maker and be done with it. Hire some bi-lingual engineers and have a phone within 6 months. Easy ;)

waveman216
Mar 30, 2006, 05:30 PM
Who cares?

Cell phones have been around for a while now and unless Apple can figure out some "revolutionary" new way for us to use the PHONE, not play music on it cause I doubt most people want to do that, than honestly, who gives a crap?

sinisterdesign
Mar 30, 2006, 05:31 PM
meh, i would love to see apple do something really innovative (b/c i haven't seen anything innovative in the mobile market in a while), but i honestly won't be broken if they never get into that market. it's a crowded, crazy market.

EGT
Mar 30, 2006, 05:37 PM
As much as I'd love to see an Apple produced phone, I think they should concentrate on the Mac and OS X for now.

Maybe next year.

shigzeo
Mar 30, 2006, 05:42 PM
well, it is an interesting idea, but i cannot really even figure why i would use one. im not a user here in north america at least so... but it just seems that apple may be spreading themselves out a bit too much. id rather a much better macbook or powermac or something than a decent phone and a decent computer. now, if dell made phones, then apple needs to do it too! ;)

Billy_ca
Mar 30, 2006, 05:47 PM
Don't they already have an iTunes Phone? I see ads for them on the subway.

How is this not already an "iPhone"?

sam10685
Mar 30, 2006, 05:50 PM
I just don't see any reason Apple needs to produce a phone. How does this sell more iMacs or Computers. Can anyone think of a reason?

i'm sure Apple will figure out a way. ;)

sam10685
Mar 30, 2006, 05:51 PM
Don't they already have an iTunes Phone? I see ads for them on the subway.

How is this not already an "iPhone"?

Motorola makes it.

cafc:mac
Mar 30, 2006, 05:57 PM
For people who don't see how an Apple phone connects to the Mac strategy, what if the phone was a mobile phone that could do all of the things 'regular' mobiles do, but run iTunes (Music, video clips), sync with Mail (send/receive email?) and Address Book, control Front Row (remote) and, most innovative of all, connect with iChat to provide VOIP services.

Krevnik
Mar 30, 2006, 06:02 PM
I just don't see any reason Apple needs to produce a phone. How does this sell more iMacs or Computers. Can anyone think of a reason?

There doesn't need to be a link between an iPhone and selling computers. The iPod did not start out as something to sell Macs with (considering it was Mac only)... and an iPhone could be the same thing. It could be that Apple sees what other companies see that the phone is potentially where your PDA/etc converge in the future. PDAs replaced by smaller devices in a phone-ish form factor, designed to let you access your PC's data remotely via cellular networks. I actually agree that this is a possible direction for the market to take, and if Apple has been waiting for a chance to get back into the mobile market after the Newton, this would be THE chance to make the same sort of splash that the iPod did.

interlard
Mar 30, 2006, 06:02 PM
The iPhone is indeed a horrible idea. I'm convinced that Apple's intention was to make the iPod wireless. Voice capability is just a simple add-on.

And yes, the way cellphones work here on Earth, it's WAY too hard to pop out a new product in a short time. The service providers have a strangle-hold on the entire market.

If the service providers just made the infrastructure (and competed to provide the easiest in-roads to separate phone providers), the whole thing would move much more quickly.

Perhaps Apple can shake things up, like they did with iTunes.

rockthecasbah
Mar 30, 2006, 06:14 PM
honestly, ITS JUST A CELL PHONE! It's like the one tech product that Apple shouldn't have to venture into (that and toasters :) ). Well i hope this never comes. It will be very expensive, probably disapointing, and get too many complaints that it does compliments. Just leave making cell phones to the other companies, please.:rolleyes:

Krevnik
Mar 30, 2006, 06:15 PM
The iPhone is indeed a horrible idea. I'm convinced that Apple's intention was to make the iPod wireless. Voice capability is just a simple add-on.


A wireless iPod is not much better than what many see as what the iPhone would be. Unless you are on 802.11n, transfer speeds would be pretty poor for anything but streaming content onto or from the iPod. While this would be an interesting feature, it is also hard to justify that one feature for the added price it would require, and the extra bulk to get reception beyond 30 feet. Oh, and forget about having reasonable battery life in an iPod with that. 1 hour streaming video, 4-5 hours streaming music if you use 802.11, simply because Bluetooth EDR isn't widespread enough to rely on for better battery life, and about 16KB/sec is a minimum for streaming a 128kbit MP3.

As someone who actually works in the field of mobile devices, I personally see an iPhone as being more likely right now. While what is currently on the market isn't that great, multiple companies, including my own have some really polished stuff in the pipe. If the market goes where we think it is going, then it would be a great chance for Apple to get into the PDA/Phone market as it combines and other companies are still working out how to do it right, and essentially drop a bomb onto the market before someone like MS does.

MacGuy88
Mar 30, 2006, 06:25 PM
I'm still wondering if the iPod and iPhone are one and the same.
Perhaps Apple is, if they can get the ball rolling again, going to create a peice of hardware that does it all. Cell Phone, Media, PDA... who knows.. maybe it will be called the iBerry.

bluebomberman
Mar 30, 2006, 06:41 PM
Apple should just buy some Korean phone maker and be done with it. Hire some bi-lingual engineers and have a phone within 6 months. Easy ;)

But not necessarily good.

MrCrowbar
Mar 30, 2006, 06:41 PM
Remember Steve saying the 5G iPod won't do video? So I say: April 1, touch screen iPod with phone and iChat built in. Boom! :D

ChrisA
Mar 30, 2006, 06:46 PM
This is good news. It means they are NOT doing something that is easy. It implies they are breaking some new ground.

What I figure it is is a combo WiFi-VOIP phone and standard cell phone with a full 20GB or more iPod inside.

bluebomberman
Mar 30, 2006, 06:54 PM
The cell phone market looks to me like what the MP3 player market would be right now if the iPod was never introduced: crowded, filled with crappy inferior products, and competing for pocket space with other digital devices.

There is definitely opportunity. Just look at how many people get a Treo and then grow to hate it afterwards due to hardware and interface problems.

I also don't see what's all the whining about how phones have nothing to do with computers. Playing music and videos, sending text messages, sending email, using Internet hotspots, syncing with your computer's contacts, even using VoIP: this is all where cell phones are heading. The day may come in the distant future when a separate MP3 player like the iPod is laughable.

Maac
Mar 30, 2006, 06:55 PM
I'd like to see an iPhone come out to replace my old Nokia7110. I can't wait any more.

BWhaler
Mar 30, 2006, 06:57 PM
Good riddance. The iPhone concept was horrible to begin with.

You've got to be kidding me.

Because there are so many great phones on the market?

Please...

Dropped calls...
Crappy battery...
Functionality that only the carriers want...
Impossible to figure out (easily) the phone's functionality.
The terrible operating systems that ship with most of them (Sony Ericsson is not bad, but not great either.)

And my favorite...the 400 "branding opportunities" carriers shove down our throats. If I have never have to look at a Cingular logo again, I'll be happy.

I think the problem is, and why you posted what you did, is we have all gotten used to bad cell phones. It's happened with the MP3 player, and why all of the "experts" wrote off the iPod. The couldn't understand the value proposition that Apple brought to the table.

Come back when Apple releases their phone, and we'll see what you think...

Maac
Mar 30, 2006, 07:08 PM
Once I met the Motorola V70 in the market, I fell in love with it because "it" was designed by "someone" from Apple(right? I thought there would be nothing better that).For some "battery" reason I didn't get it. But it was amazing, isn't it?

My wife persuaded me to change my cell with some "cool" and "colorful" one, I said I will wait my Apple one.

fatfish
Mar 30, 2006, 07:27 PM
I just don't see any reason Apple needs to produce a phone. How does this sell more iMacs or Computers. Can anyone think of a reason?

I don't think many could see the reason for an ipod back in 2001. I'd buy an iphone simply because it would integrate seemlessly with ical, address book etc. unlike many of the phones out there now that are supposed to.

It would be cool and simple to use as well, the same factors that sell the ipod.

boncellis
Mar 30, 2006, 07:30 PM
I think this "news" from TS is more of a commentary on them than a rumor about Apple. Sure, Apple owns the name "iPhone" but that could be just to keep some other manufacturer from branding its product with the distinctly Apple-esque "i" as to avoid consumer confusion (see the Apple Corps v. Apple Computer thread).

I have read so many things about the alleged iPhone coming soon from Apple that they don't even faze me anymore--yet here is another rumor about how it will be either delayed or nonexistent. TS may have manufactured "news" about a rumored product that no one was sure would exist in the first place.

Is it just me, or does that seem off?

EricNau
Mar 30, 2006, 07:35 PM
You've got to be kidding me.

Because there are so many great phones on the market?

Please...

Dropped calls...
Crappy battery...
Functionality that only the carriers want...
Impossible to figure out (easily) the phone's functionality.
The terrible operating systems that ship with most of them (Sony Ericsson is not bad, but not great either.)... ...
You can't blame dropped calls on the phone - it's usually the carrier.

Lepton
Mar 30, 2006, 07:38 PM
Yoiks. I'm sure they'd make a swell phone but they don't necessarily have to make the phone themselves! It's complex and not squarely in their field, so for a first model - there are a number of existing phones they could have used as a blank slate and customized to make their own. I've said this here before.

Consider just as one example one of Moto's own phones, not released in the US yet. The Moto e680. (http://www.howardchui.com/modules.php?name=Sections&op=viewarticle&artid=186) (Follow link for a review.) It runs Linux and has a great array of hardware: GSM, touch display, MP3 decoder, video decoder, big bright screen, plays video in landscape mode, Bluetooth, FM radio, voice recognition, text to speech, speaker phone, Samba, Telnet, lots of Unixy things.. It even looks a little iPodian. They could dump all the UI software and implement their own. They could even go down to the Linux kernel and make the thing VERY OSX. It could be iPod, phone, AND video player. This phone hardware is already manufactured, debugged and in the field. Don't like Moto? There are other possibles.

The key is not so much the phone, but the UI in the phone and especially the total integration with the phone company. This is easy too, as you can partner with a company like Cingular and use their air in your own virtual phone company. There are examples of this, Virgin is one. Apple will absolutely need to do this to integrate downloading of tunes and so on without interference from a third party cellular provider.

fatfish
Mar 30, 2006, 07:51 PM
Apple simply has to enter this market.

The forecasts are huge for d/l on moby's and apple will need to be part of it if it wants to keep it's lead in digi music.

The key will be simplicity and coolness, the market will be hard to break into, but well worth it, the numbers are huge. Nokia expect to sell 100m this year, if apple can sell 25m in 5 years, it will be as big as the ipod for them.

Seasought
Mar 30, 2006, 07:56 PM
I just don't see any reason Apple needs to produce a phone. How does this sell more iMacs or Computers. Can anyone think of a reason?

You're right. Sort of like how a portable MP3 player from Apple didn't really help them sell computers.

...

bluebomberman
Mar 30, 2006, 08:32 PM
You're right. Sort of like how a portable MP3 player from Apple didn't really help them sell computers.

...

It helps keep Apple in business.

BornAgainMac
Mar 30, 2006, 08:43 PM
All phones today remind me of the MP3 players before the iPod. A ton of improvement is overdue.

iMeowbot
Mar 30, 2006, 08:49 PM
I just don't see any reason Apple needs to produce a phone. How does this sell more iMacs or Computers. Can anyone think of a reason?
"If I were running Apple, I would milk the Macintosh for all it's worth and get busy on the next great thing. The PC wars are over. Done. Microsoft won a long time ago."

(L)
Mar 30, 2006, 08:58 PM
Well, yeah, making a phone has it's pros for Apple.

1) Entering an arena where everybody else isn't doing all that great on the ease of use, gui streamlining, music delivery, synchronization, etc. Apple, at least, can make a good phone, at least technologically. (Of course there are complications, like the service aspect, and this sort of alleged problem rumored recently.)

2) The iPod effect. Apple experimented with the "cool" factor. Apply that to phones, not forgetting the ease-of-use factor. I wish someone would do that in Japan (we have phones that have all kinds of features but are essentially crappy in ease-of-use, and others that are so simple they couldn't be hard to use if you were a hundred years old). In other words, Apple can both make a decent phone and get attention for it, IF they have the service side in line and without annoyances.

3) To some degree, switchers. Then again, my guess is that Apple phone users would be likely Mac users and/or iPod users, so there's much duality there. Unless they can make it get 75% market share like the iPod. Which, umm, despite all those improvements Apple could make, is still a difficult feat. Not like those other companies will sit on their hands - they'll start copying as soon as it looks somewhat successful, while people are still like "Apple? Apple has a cell phone service? My provider's fine, I might want a new model though."

4) Staying in business. This seems important. Yup.

5) If MS can be lured into this business, it might give Apple a chance to embarass them again. This is probably not on Apple's mind though. Nobody whittles at a giant by embarassing him.

In the end, my opinion is that if Apple can afford to design and engineer a phone, they should be focusing more creativity in what they can do with the Mac OS to beat the crap out of Windows and capture more market share. Starting with businesses. How to get the businesses....

BWhaler
Mar 30, 2006, 09:14 PM
"If I were running Apple, I would milk the Macintosh for all it's worth and get busy on the next great thing. The PC wars are over. Done. Microsoft won a long time ago."

That was in the mid-90's before open source started to set-in and Microsoft stopped executing.

Don't get me wrong. There is still some truth there. Apple will not take an Office in a serious way in the next 5 years because of the power of the Monopoly. Nor will Apple try to unseat MS in the broad business market. That's going to be up to Linux.

But it's a different ballgame today. For no other reason than MS really can't execute anymore.

(L)
Mar 30, 2006, 09:17 PM
"If I were running Apple, I would milk the Macintosh for all it's worth and get busy on the next great thing. The PC wars are over. Done. Microsoft won a long time ago."

I forgot who you are quoting. Anyway, good thing there's things like comeback, revenge, niche.

If Microsoft made Windows Works-Perfectly-Fine-and-Looks-Great-Doing-It Edition, which they can't as long as they keep 50 million lines of old crappy code nobody dares to and few (not at Microsoft) are able to untangle, the Macintosh would go down in a blink of the eye. Apple could go out of the hardware business and muscle in on the OS like MS for Windows, and conceivably gain much market share...but then the OS would not be as good, Apple, a hardware company, would have to bear a huge shift, and probably have other complications Jobs would be concerned about.

I'm thinking, steal the guys who designed XBrite or whatever tech that makes Vaio screens look good. Work on areas people will have difficulty following your trail, like new interface concepts (touchscreen has been one). Redefine laptop design like desktop design has been to some degree, what with no tower in the iMac (but far more radically). This is a bit out of the ballpark, but imagine a <1 lb computer that utilizes virtual keyboard, virtual track pad, and choice in size of touchscreen with built in crystalline memory, nanotech molecular hardware (cpu and board, etc), for $2000, when everyone else has itty bitty conventional hardware and plastic conventional design, slower speeds, less memory, for the same price. Yeah, I'm talking about a difference in hardware so big a Windows fan boy would not think twice about switching. Is it possible now? Of course not. Some of the technology isn't there yet. Can it be made possible early enough by Apple to make the above scenario come true? Well, that depends on the employees at Apple. A feat like that amounts to accelerating innovation so far it appears you have arrived from the future with products that cannot be rivaled. 2015. At the latest. After that, it'll probably be too hard to get enough of a difference to kick Windows out of the arena.

mugwump
Mar 30, 2006, 09:21 PM
Apple is absolutely missing out on the mobile marketplace -- the future of computing for many emerging markets.

Apple Mobile OS -- there's already Windows, Linux and Palm, with Palm no longer since it was snapped up by a Japanese firm.

The palm treos are everywhere, the stock is shooting through the roof, and Apple could've been there with any bit of vision. Sheesh, Jobs had to be forced into the mp3 market, but apparently all he saw were PDA's and never realized the phones were getting smarter.

Mobile darwin, iCal, Mail, iChat, Safari, Pages, iTunes -- it's all there and ready for a mobile OS -- where is apple?

It's not about phones, it about mobile computing -- multitasking, multithreaded with a low voltage Intel core dual, mobile spotlight searching.

WHERE IS APPLE FOR MOBILE COMPUTING?

My treo does everything, but is all single tasking with hideous searching. Otherwise, it's a laptop replacement -- the same way the first powerbooks were desktop replacements, though no one realized it for quite some time.

iMeowbot
Mar 30, 2006, 09:28 PM
I forgot who you are quoting. Anyway, good thing there's things like comeback, revenge, niche.
Steve Jobs said that, and that is exactly what he is doing. Mac manufacturing has already been farmed out to low bidders, and now hardware development has been shifted to rely mostly on Intel reference designs. This all frees up working capital to be spent on developing other products.

skwert
Mar 30, 2006, 09:49 PM
It would be cool and simple to use as well, the same factors that sell the ipod.

absolutely. the thought of a phone that looks like my ipod gets me giddy. apple has already made a huge fashion hit with the ipod...they could definitely ride that popularity wave with a similar iphone.

BWhaler
Mar 30, 2006, 09:57 PM
All phones today remind me of the MP3 players before the iPod. A ton of improvement is overdue.

I strongly agree.

After just going through the "buy a new cell phone" experience and dealing with poorly designed products and the scumbags at the carrier stores and their Machiavellian deals and terms, I think the market is ripe for Apple to enter and make a huge dent.

I think the problem before was the carriers. But now Apple has good relationships with Cingular and Orange, the environment has changed.

I think the cell phone market is a smart next move for Apple. Here's why:

1. It's an enormous market.

2. The products that exist today are poorly designed (in general)

3. The products today are overly complex and hide their functionality

4. MS plans on attacking the iPod via the phone. This could be some basic risk mitigation.

5. A re-think of what is possible with a phone is entirely possible and enables Apple to once again change the game with a "why didn't we think of that" moment." Carriers dictate too much functionality to handset manufacturers, and the manufacturers don't control the OS. But by Apple having the power to look at the picture holistically, I think we will see some exciting innovations.

I for one think Apple can cause a major re-birth of the mobile phone market, and, while I would like something now, I am excited to read Apple is taking their time and re-thinking everything.

AidenShaw
Mar 30, 2006, 10:22 PM
Apple is absolutely missing out on the mobile marketplace -- the future of computing for many emerging markets.

Apple Mobile OS -- there's already Windows, Linux and Palm, with Palm no longer since it was snapped up by a Japanese firm.

The palm treos are everywhere, the stock is shooting through the roof, and Apple could've been there with any bit of vision. Sheesh, Jobs had to be forced into the mp3 market, but apparently all he saw were PDA's and never realized the phones were getting smarter.

Mobile darwin, iCal, Mail, iChat, Safari, Pages, iTunes -- it's all there and ready for a mobile OS -- where is apple?

It's not about phones, it about mobile computing -- multitasking, multithreaded with a low voltage Intel core dual, mobile spotlight searching.

WHERE IS APPLE FOR MOBILE COMPUTING?

My treo does everything, but is all single tasking with hideous searching. Otherwise, it's a laptop replacement -- the same way the first powerbooks were desktop replacements, though no one realized it for quite some time.
If the Macrumours moderators were smart, you would be promoted from "newbie" to "demi-god" based on this post alone.

William Henry Gates III knows that mobile computing is the next big thing, and has been pushing MS for years to be the lead player in this space.

Today, while at work, I saw a CNN story about a special on TV tonight. Looked very interesting, so I wanted to make sure that my TiVo caught it (I have to go into the city tonight for a business dinner, so I couldn't do it after I got home (even if I remembered)).

I could have gone to TiVo's central website to program my home TiVo to grab it (my TiVo's on the home 802.11 LAN and regularly phones home to the TiVo servers for instructions) - but no need.

I have a Slingbox (http://www.slingmedia.com) connected to the TiVo, so I opened my cellphone (Samsung i730 from Verizon with 700 Kbps EVDO internet connection) and connected directly to the Slingbox. A couple of clicks here and there, and I added tonight's show to the TiVo "grab" list.

On the way, however, it happened that the TiVo was tuned to the Weather Channel. The few seconds of Weather Channel that I saw when the phone connected showed a dark band of thunderstorms moving into the area.

After telling TiVo to record the special, I went back to the weather channel. Looked like bad news, big rainstorm moving in during the evening commute.

That was a pretty ugly prospect, so I changed my plans to take Caltrain into the city (if you live in the Bay Area, "the city" is San Francisco proper - and if you live in Silicon Valley, going into "the city" during an evening commute thunderstorm is not a pleasant thought). Much better to take the commuter rail (Caltrain) into the city.

But I didn't know today's Caltrain schedule, so I opened Internet Explorer on my phone, and typed in the Caltrain URL.

A few clicks on the touch screen, and I saw that the northbound "bullet" trains were at 4:58, 5:37, and 5:58. The 5:37 would be perfect. (I mentally kicked myself for not having the current PocketPC schedule already on the phone.)
___________________________

This is how *I* used Windows Mobile on my cellphone *today*.

Apple is *nowhere* on the exploding growth of connected devices. Nowhere. The train left the station....

mgauss
Mar 30, 2006, 10:29 PM
There is no question in my mind that the iPhone is the most important product Apple can address now.

If Apple delays the iPhone and Windoze comes up with a reasonably good wPhone, Apple will never capture the "smart device we all will carry."

The Treo with its 25,000 programs is the main threat. Cheap to buy, PalmOne can go either way.

The Palm OS is buggy, but nice and simple. A few Mac OSX "screens" make one feel at home.

findpankaj
Mar 30, 2006, 10:42 PM
Who cares?

Cell phones have been around for a while now and unless Apple can figure out some "revolutionary" new way for us to use the PHONE, not play music on it cause I doubt most people want to do that, than honestly, who gives a crap?

I agree, who the hell cares about apple phone. But, hold on, we have seen quite a surge with Windows based phones and they are quite handy. If apple has an idea to come out with a mac based phone, it will surely be a hot gadget in the market. We know how apple sells the idea of "user friendly".

One thing is sure...it will be white with "phone isight camera", "itunes" on it...:D

NEENAHBOY
Mar 30, 2006, 10:52 PM
maybe it will be called the iBerry.

As if the in-house legal counsel needs more to do... :rolleyes: ;)

AidenShaw
Mar 30, 2006, 10:53 PM
If Apple delays the iPhone and Windoze comes up with a reasonably good wPhone, Apple will never capture the "smart device we all will carry."
The wPhone is here today. Yahoo! for "Windows Mobile 5"...

(and look at my post a few higher)

thejadedmonkey
Mar 30, 2006, 11:50 PM
I'm sure once Apple does release something it'll be amazing. Until then...*Yawn*

hansen
Mar 31, 2006, 12:31 AM
ThinkSecret reports that Apple's cell phone project has been placed on hold due to "significant technical hurdles" in developing the product.

It's funny. I have the excact same problem with my energy-creating perpetual motion machine.:eek:

Kelmon
Mar 31, 2006, 01:44 AM
There is no question in my mind that the iPhone is the most important product Apple can address now.

If Apple delays the iPhone and Windoze comes up with a reasonably good wPhone, Apple will never capture the "smart device we all will carry."

The Treo with its 25,000 programs is the main threat. Cheap to buy, PalmOne can go either way.

The Palm OS is buggy, but nice and simple. A few Mac OSX "screens" make one feel at home.

Yeah, this is my thinking too. I'm really surprised by the number of people who either don't think an iPhone is bad idea or don't think it to be interesting. The first phone that is able to provide the same features and simplicity as an iPod will clean up the phone market, plus take a lot of the MP3 player market. Pretty much everyone has a mobile phone these days and would like MP3 player functions but it's a pain to have to carry and manage multiple devices. If Apple is able to produce a phone that works as well for playing music as an iPod, plays nicely with OS X and provides good qualities as a phone then I would absolutely buy one rather than those produced by the competition.

"...One ring to rule them all..."

50548
Mar 31, 2006, 02:05 AM
If the Macrumours moderators were smart, you would be promoted from "newbie" to "demi-god" based on this post alone.

William Henry Gates III knows that mobile computing is the next big thing, and has been pushing MS for years to be the lead player in this space.

Today, while at work, I saw a CNN story about a special on TV tonight. Looked very interesting, so I wanted to make sure that my TiVo caught it (I have to go into the city tonight for a business dinner, so I couldn't do it after I got home (even if I remembered)).

I could have gone to TiVo's central website to program my home TiVo to grab it (my TiVo's on the home 802.11 LAN and regularly phones home to the TiVo servers for instructions) - but no need.

I have a Slingbox (http://www.slingmedia.com) connected to the TiVo, so I opened my cellphone (Samsung i730 from Verizon with 700 Kbps EVDO internet connection) and connected directly to the Slingbox. A couple of clicks here and there, and I added tonight's show to the TiVo "grab" list.

On the way, however, it happened that the TiVo was tuned to the Weather Channel. The few seconds of Weather Channel that I saw when the phone connected showed a dark band of thunderstorms moving into the area.

After telling TiVo to record the special, I went back to the weather channel. Looked like bad news, big rainstorm moving in during the evening commute.

That was a pretty ugly prospect, so I changed my plans to take Caltrain into the city (if you live in the Bay Area, "the city" is San Francisco proper - and if you live in Silicon Valley, going into "the city" during an evening commute thunderstorm is not a pleasant thought). Much better to take the commuter rail (Caltrain) into the city.

But I didn't know today's Caltrain schedule, so I opened Internet Explorer on my phone, and typed in the Caltrain URL.

A few clicks on the touch screen, and I saw that the northbound "bullet" trains were at 4:58, 5:37, and 5:58. The 5:37 would be perfect. (I mentally kicked myself for not having the current PocketPC schedule already on the phone.)
___________________________

This is how *I* used Windows Mobile on my cellphone *today*.

Apple is *nowhere* on the exploding growth of connected devices. Nowhere. The train left the station....

As usual, William Gates, III gets a little help from his friend Aiden Shaw...

No, the situation is not as obvious as you perceive; in fact, the mobile market is NOT up for grabs as some of you may imply.

I am truly happy that Apple did not start this crazy iPhone adventure, and I am sure they have more than a thousand reasons not to.

1) In terms of devices, the mobile market is clearly shared by a few makers; it's a sort of oligopoly between Nokia, Motorola, Samsung and Siemens. The rest is the rest, catching scraps on the floor of a saturated scenario. It's a similar situation as with the digital download market. Apple totally dominates, and 2 or 3 niche players barely make money with the remaining 25% of the market.

2) Apple has NO expertise in mobile phone industry, and as TS showed, it would again delegate "powers" to another maker/designer. This means that, as with the ROKR/STNKR, Apple would have limited say in the final delivery of the product. The content would be the key; but honestly, few people care about OS-driven features that have been there for YEARS, such as calendars, phone book, syncing, mp3 and games. You want something else? Buy a laptop.

As for Treo or Blackberry supporters, I can only loathe those little things full of buttons and superfluous capabilities. Sure, Treos seems to be doing fine in some markets, but that doesn't mean Palm is in wonderful shape...they have a proportionally paltry revenue, trading today at around 22 and having a higher P/E ratio than Apple.

People need simplicity, and Apple IS about simplicity. However, the mobile market ALREADY has its simple models and Apple would add nothing to that, apart from a nice white design by Ive.

3) Mr. Shaw then gives us a long, wonderful display of how to use a complicated device; surely for tech-savvy people like him, Windows Mobile seems like a good proposition. But he seemingly forgets that MUCH simpler alternatives exist. His 3 actions were:

a) I wanna record a show;
b) I check the weather;
c) I need to see the train schedule.

on a), I could have done it from my computer at work; on b) I usually check weather right after entering and before leaving office; on c), I can send a SMS to SBB (the train company) in Switzerland, and get all the next schedules for my intended destinations.

Now tell me, which alternative is cheaper...1 quick browse for free PLUS one SMS, or a lengthy small-screen Internet session on the mobile phone?

4) Handheld makers fight a sorry battle, as shipments fell almost 20% in 2005; fortunately, Apple doesn't make these mistakes again...they ONLY enter a market when they KNOW they will make clear money. And the handheld market is far from being attractive right now, no matter how enthusiastic savvy users might look.

5) Those that advocate Apple's entry into this market have no clue about the crazy mish-mash of network operators, incumbents and content providers. You may say that Apple's difficulties in getting music and videos for iTunes can be multiplied by 100 in the mobile market. Where would they make money if content, interconnection fees and exclusive deals make revenue go elsewhere? No, iPhone fans don't answer that.

I am HAPPY that Apple is not joining this crazy loss-making war. Keep making Macs and iPods...it's a much safer bet.

bigandy
Mar 31, 2006, 02:33 AM
I don't think many could see the reason for an ipod back in 2001. I'd buy an iphone simply because it would integrate seemlessly with ical, address book etc. unlike many of the phones out there now that are supposed to.

It would be cool and simple to use as well, the same factors that sell the ipod.

i agree. nothing syncs perfectly and i'm sure an "iPhone" would..

and to back up the first paragraph there, go see the legendary thread 500 (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=500)

mugwump
Mar 31, 2006, 02:39 AM
Lawyer: Just because you don't see any benefit to mobile computing doesn't mean that the rocket ship hasn't already launched, fueled by Windows Mobile and Linux.

Who gives a flip about mobile networks? In the US, Virgin simply leases network activity from Sprint and does quite well with it.

Where are the profits for Apple? Why in the hardware sales to it's ever expanding and loyal customer base. Sure it's hard to get the world to change from Microsoft OS to "something different", but it's a heck of a lot easier to get them to do so with a mobile X phone.

You know, they could leverage the billions of net revenues they are raking in with iPod sales to tackle the mobile computing market. Surely it's easier than music, video, and movie worldwide distribution.

Macnoviz
Mar 31, 2006, 02:42 AM
If I remember correctly, the iPod was the first product in a line of products for digital lifestyle. Maybe the iPhone will just be the second step. I don't think Apple will try to push all mobile devices around in an iPod, but you never now.
What I do find interesting is that Apple will begin from the ground. Does this mean they won't just take an existing cellphone and Appleing it or does this mean they will come up with something unseen in cellphone history before and shake the entire market like they did with the iPod?

Peak101
Mar 31, 2006, 02:45 AM
Nokia has predicted that the mp3 players will fade away in a few years because of everyone buying mobile phones with music players. A few years ago Nokia predicted that nobody will soon buy cameras any moore, since every phone has one. And indeed Agfa an Konica Minolta have reported that they will withdraw from the camera markets.

It may be that Nokia is wrong and the mp3 players are here to stay, but if they are right it would be quite stupid from Apple to not enter the mobile markets.

iPie
Mar 31, 2006, 03:27 AM
4) Handheld makers fight a sorry battle, as shipments fell almost 20% in 2005; fortunately, Apple doesn't make these mistakes again...they ONLY enter a market when they KNOW they will make clear money. And the handheld market is far from being attractive right now, no matter how enthusiastic savvy users might look.



I am not sure I would be investing in a company ONLY entered markets when they KNEW that they were going to make money. To be more precise ex-ante knowledge and not the ex-post variety...

If Apple really has adopted the strategy of only launching the 'sure thing', their P/E is way to high (and I never would have had the opportunity of owning an Apple II).

I think the point is to come up with a product/service offering that 'could' change the market (to Apple's advantage). Seems to me that if Apple does not innovate in the 'mobile computing/communications' market somebody else will. That could be bad news for portables and iPods (of the audio, video, or whatever variety).

rish
Mar 31, 2006, 04:47 AM
What ever the situation is with Apples future entry in the mobile market, I'd be happy to wait it out. I think as someone has already mentioned that it would be far better to create a superior product rather than one thats inferior. Also the mobile phone market has no brand or provider loyalty, and this is true for me as I know that I have been disatisfied with not only my mobile phone device but also the provider for a multitude of reasons. If Apple can deliver a superior product with a far superior service/services then not only will I very quickly switch but so will others. This new product could tie in nicely with iLife, iCal as well as mobile versions of iTunes and not least pages for on the go document editing/creation. Right now there is no product nor a service provider that does this or could do this as seamlessly as Apple.:)

Regards

djdarlek
Mar 31, 2006, 05:21 AM
I just don't see any reason Apple needs to produce a phone. How does this sell more iMacs or Computers. Can anyone think of a reason?

Probably the fact that the mobile market is relatively huge, even compared to that of the iPod. And everyone has a problem with their mobile, regardless of brand - due to overcomplication and poor design. In my mind, it would seem a perfect time for Apple to make some gorgeous hardware and most importantly a serously easy to use OS that syncs well with both Macs and PCs. There is no competition for simplicity, and I think Apple could do well at it.

phelix_da_kat
Mar 31, 2006, 05:38 AM
I am not commenting on whether there is, should be or when there will be an iPhone.. but in my opinion what an "analyst" (at a bank) predicts is usually driven by a different agenda.

While there are many rumour sites which talk about new products - an analyst is under some what pressure to be "positive" and emphasise the up side of many products and companies.

For example, it is common knowledge that there are usually many more buy recommendations than sell - even though recently they have split the roles of research from the actual banks.

chriscorcoran
Mar 31, 2006, 05:46 AM
Hey guys,

I can't wait until the "iPhone", because trust me it's gunna be amazing! I mean how can it not be? I was giving it some thought and I am not sure it is such a bad idea as some people say.

I mean lets just go through it logically. Jobs is definatly ready for it, I am sure he sees that the market has matured to the point that he would feel comfortable entering it. I say this because Apple is never really first into the market, Jobs always waits until the market for a particualr product matures and consumers are really ready to hop on. I mean look at the iPod, Archos had a hard drive based player for years before and what about Intel? Jobs gave that market plenty of time to mature before he entered it. So right now I think Jobs is really just waiting right now.

What is he waiting for? Well I suspect that Apple has until now built it's prototypes on current GSM networks. I point to the current iTunes phone for Cingular's GSM network and the seemingly close relationship Apple has with Cingular. I mean it would seem most logical that Apple's MVNO would be based on a network from Cingular which would mean their phone would have to be GSM.

Now if you look at these two ideas you get the feel that something isn't right. First off the cell phone market it overlly matured, I mean most average people basically want the Motorolla RAZR becuase it looks cool and pay little attention to their phone. So that's it right there, the average person has a cell phone so why would Apple enter the market? Well I submit that they are not going to enter the cell phone market under present technologies, I think they have delayed this product to stop and redesign for a phone that will handel 3G and GSM standards.

I mean look at the market for 3G phones, in the comming months providers will complete rollouts of 3G networks. This will be followed by releases of those cool 3G phones like the ones in Norway and South Korea that we all keep hearing about. So as people start seeing these new phones and the amazing new services they provide the market will grow and mature, then Jobs with his amazing timing will at MacWorld or the WWDC will unvail this amazing new phone.

So what will this phone look like?

I though about Apple, the iPod and what are wrong with traditional phones and what Apple might release...

First off support for 3G and GSM networks, I mean you can't leave it up to the cell providers to provide complete coverage.

Secondly bluetooth and airport extreme (wifi), I see this as the way it will fit into Jobs idea of the digital home. You use bluetooth to interface with your mac(ie. iLife [iTunes, iPhoto, FrontRow] controller) and wifi to allow for applications they may need more bandwith then the traditional cell network can provide. I see some sort of collaberation app coming up around it or maybe further intergration into the digital home. The bluetooth is also a neccesity to support all those cool bluetooth headsets.

Now lets look at hardware... I see flash memory any where from 512 MB to 2 GB. Plenetly of room for you to carry your music with you, weither your not that interested in it (512 MB) or really like the idea (2 GB). I also see a really amazing large lcd screen to sort of fix the convention of tiny cell phone screens. Most definatly a camera, because well duh!

So the "iPhone" I imagine will come with phone versions of the iChat (AV?), iTunes, iPhoto, Safari, Mail and iCal. I am not sure about iChat AV, I think Apple could do something really cool if they took the camera phone to the next level by allowing people to video conferance from their camera phone. I was also thinking if they included a high qualilty microphone they could include a Garageband port for those of us who are prone to "spontanous creation".

Well I have to head to class now, so I have to cut my rambling short, tell me what you guys think.

-Chris

AidenShaw
Mar 31, 2006, 08:07 AM
As usual, William Gates, III gets a little help from his friend Aiden Shaw...
And Mr. Lawyer chooses to start his post with an oblique attack against the author....


3) Mr. Shaw then gives us a long, wonderful display of how to use a complicated device; surely for tech-savvy people like him, Windows Mobile seems like a good proposition.
Running Internet Explorer on my Windows phone is no more complicated that running IE on my desktop. Type in a URL, click Go. Click on links, etc.

Running SlingPlayer on my Windows phone is likewise almost identical to running it on my desktop.

Since my phone runs Windows, using the applications on the phone is quite similar to using them at the desktop. My training on the "complicated" device on the desktop applies to the phone.

on a), I could have done it from my computer at work; on b) I usually check weather right after entering and before leaving office; on c), I can send a SMS to SBB (the train company) in Switzerland, and get all the next schedules for my intended destinations.
Had I been at my desk, I could have used my desktop.

Had I been at a hot spot, I could have used my WiFi laptop.

Since I almost always carry the phone, I could do it from anywhere.

Now tell me, which alternative is cheaper...1 quick browse for free PLUS one SMS, or a lengthy small-screen Internet session on the mobile phone?
I pay about $20/month for unlimited data (at 700Kbps speed) on the phone - which is a typical charge for a home internet connection that's required for your "free browse".

Lengthy, hardly. Very convenient is a better description. For a weather check, I'll use the phone and be done in the amount of time that it would take to get my laptop out of the bag and connect to the hotspot. (And if I'm at Starbucks or Migros, I can do it while standing in line.)

And, of course, I can watch video and listen to music on the phone - either locally (multi-GB) or streaming.

Convenience. One device, not several. Leave the laptop at home more often.

thejadedmonkey
Mar 31, 2006, 08:30 AM
You guys, tomorrow's the big day.

All we have so far are rumors about what's not coming out.

What gives?

(L)
Mar 31, 2006, 08:41 AM
You guys, tomorrow's the big day.

All we have so far are rumors about what's not coming out.

What gives?

No kidding. I want rumors about the anniversary presents. Where are those hoax people now? At least some hoaxes to entertain me. Please? I might be nicer on them this time around....

Seriously. The silence is creepy...like Apple is being really careful...new iPod seems likely with such silence? Or are they not giving such a leak a chance?

26 hours or so left?

I'm in Japan. If they announce a new product on 4/1 at 10:00 AM (or whenever) California time, we in Japan are some 16 hours ahead (I think), or 2:00 AM of 4/2. If I go to the Apple store at 10:00 AM of 4/2, will they have the new products (assuming they announce them on said time in US)? I know Jobs often says you can pick it up in the stores today sort of thing.

Whistleway
Mar 31, 2006, 08:45 AM
Apple is not the magic bullet for all your personal problems. Apple that. Apple this. Leave them alone to make some good computers and that's all. Thanks.

ijimk
Mar 31, 2006, 08:52 AM
just curious if anyone here has a Razr through verizon? Does it sync with isync (via bluetooth or even USB)?

bretm
Mar 31, 2006, 09:13 AM
I just don't see any reason Apple needs to produce a phone. How does this sell more iMacs or Computers. Can anyone think of a reason?

One could say the same about the iPod but since they're approaching doubling their market share since the iPod came out...

Brand name recognition and marketing. I like my iPhone. Wait, they make a computer too? And it runs windows? :)

ijimk
Mar 31, 2006, 09:20 AM
One could say the same about the iPod but since they're approaching doubling their market share since the iPod came out...

Brand name recognition and marketing. I like my iPhone. Wait, they make a computer too? And it runs windows? :)

Check mate :cool:

bretm
Mar 31, 2006, 09:21 AM
I strongly agree.

After just going through the "buy a new cell phone" experience and dealing with poorly designed products and the scumbags at the carrier stores and their Machiavellian deals and terms, I think the market is ripe for Apple to enter and make a huge dent.

I think the problem before was the carriers. But now Apple has good relationships with Cingular and Orange, the environment has changed.

I think the cell phone market is a smart next move for Apple. Here's why:

1. It's an enormous market.

2. The products that exist today are poorly designed (in general)

3. The products today are overly complex and hide their functionality

4. MS plans on attacking the iPod via the phone. This could be some basic risk mitigation.

5. A re-think of what is possible with a phone is entirely possible and enables Apple to once again change the game with a "why didn't we think of that" moment." Carriers dictate too much functionality to handset manufacturers, and the manufacturers don't control the OS. But by Apple having the power to look at the picture holistically, I think we will see some exciting innovations.

I for one think Apple can cause a major re-birth of the mobile phone market, and, while I would like something now, I am excited to read Apple is taking their time and re-thinking everything.

Yes contracts are horrible. But did you know it takes about a year to a year and a half before cingular, verizon, etc. makes ANY money off a new customer?

First they give you a couple hundred dollar phone for free. They may get the phone for $200 and it may retail for $300, but you get it for free with your contract.

Then they charge you say $50 a month. It'd pay for that phone pretty quick if that was all profit, but obviously it isn't. There's stores, advertising, network, employess, etc. of course. What's a good margin? 5 or 10%? Ok, so say they make $10 a month profit. That's fair. It takes them over 18 months to pay for that free phone. And if they're only making $5 a month, which is probably more realistic, it takes years.

Of course some people ring up enough texting and or overages in their first month to pay for it. But others never pay at all or break their contract.

peharri
Mar 31, 2006, 09:24 AM
The only surprising aspect to this entire thing is that Apple even considered (supposedly) creating the phone in the first place.

They'd have been better off getting Nokia or Motorola to put together the innards, and just put their own case and software on it. For a company with no experience in the area to think, right now, just as your average mobile phone needs to support GSM, GPRS, UMTS WCDMA, EDGE, and a whole other bunch of convoluted standards, is a great time to enter the market, is remarkable. If mainstream mobile phone manufacturers who've been in this business for eons are having problems with just the implementation of the standards (forget UIs/user-experiences, which is about the only area Apple can bring its skill set to the table), how on Earth can Apple do it?

They'd have found it easier to design their own PowerPCs, to be honest.

AidenShaw
Mar 31, 2006, 09:30 AM
Did Avie get Steve'd because of this fiasco?

BillHarrison
Mar 31, 2006, 10:12 AM
Well, I really do hope apple broadens its horizons, and comes out with a nice PDA/Phone. And as posted above, I use my windows mobile phone ALL the time, grab news, catch up on posting, play some games, watch some movies / tv shows, listen to music.

Really, I love OS X. And apple has some damn nice hardware, in the looks, fit/finish department. I have an ibook, which I use frequently just to "Knock about on the web" meaning internet / email / work (Which mostly involves internet and email :P)

BUT:::::

Microsoft is still where the vast majority of my daily life lies. I wake up, courtesy of the alarm in my windows mobile phone. Sit down at the pc, and check out some stuff online. Use the 360 to stream media in HD to my bigscreen. Listen to streaming music, and play some halo. Setup some shows to record, all from the 360. Go to someplace, bored in line, so I jump on the forums to check out the news on my phone.

This is the kind of integration I want to see from apple one day. Bring it all together, and make it work with other devices. Its a wholistic approach. Having one device work with the others. Between my home pc, xbox 360, and smartphone, I am always connected, and able to have the best of what I want. Whether its a southpark episode on the smartphone, or the latest movie in HD streamed from the 360, I have what I want where i want.


I do love os x though, its just so stable, and I like competition, makes microsoft work harder :D

Nemesis
Mar 31, 2006, 10:22 AM
ThinkSecret predicts that the Apple cell phone will not likely come until at least 2007, if not later.

When they start babbling like that, it can only mean that iPhone is just around the corner. Typical smoke screen, to cover the real intentions.
Plus, ThinkSecret works for Apple's sake -- it's not a rumor site anymore. Apple bribed them well, ages ago.

thejedipunk
Mar 31, 2006, 10:41 AM
-snip-

I like what you said about business. If Apple can successfully lure in business oritented markets, their market share will go up significantly. Disregarding the fact that this is a Windows world, I still can't grasp why business haven't jumped ship and gotten ahold of Xserve. Tons of jobs would be lost however.

-snip-

You made some good points here. Remember back when Jobs announced the switch? He did say that they still had some "great, amazing" PowerPC products up their sleeve. Perhaps this iPhone or even an iPod cell phone PDA is what he meant. Of course, my eyes have been taken to hell and back with all the rumors and speculation of an Apple branded cell phone. D:<

AidenShaw
Mar 31, 2006, 10:59 AM
Remember back when Jobs announced the switch? He did say that they still had some "great, amazing" PowerPC products up their sleeve.

Perhaps this iPhone or even an iPod cell phone PDA is what he meant.
Not likely.

Much more likely that Intel's PDA chips (XScale, etc http://www.intel.com/design/embeddedpca/applicationsprocessors/302302.htm) were part of the reason for the switch.

budugu
Mar 31, 2006, 11:42 AM
Actually I don't know either. I think anything that makes money and that gets Apple's name out there and familiar (as a strong brand even among PC users) may make it even easier for switchers.

There are so many people I know that will never used an Apple because of how they 'were'. (Always incompatable, always shutting down, pre OSX) that's THEIR opinion by the way so don't burn me.

I think the iPod has brought on switchers, why not a phone?

It is one of the 100 different was to milk the already loyal customer base (read screw the fanatics who willingly will throw money at them!). Starting from scratch is totally stupid. THere are tens of platforms on which they can start. THis is just apple being apple!
:rolleyes:

glui2001
Mar 31, 2006, 12:22 PM
Actually I don't know either. I think anything that makes money and that gets Apple's name out there and familiar (as a strong brand even among PC users) may make it even easier for switchers.

There are so many people I know that will never used an Apple because of how they 'were'. (Always incompatable, always shutting down, pre OSX) that's THEIR opinion by the way so don't burn me.

I think the iPod has brought on switchers, why not a phone?

Good point, a reason for the iPhone that I've read could be because of the threat that all these analysts say that come from the continued evolution of smart phones. How these smarts phone will one day have improved audio and video playback that might provide a "real" challenge to the iPod. And the iPhone would be Apple's hedge against this supposedly. Although I'm sure Apple wouldn't approach a phone in a reactive way, but more of an proactive innovative way.

peharri
Mar 31, 2006, 01:55 PM
You made some good points here. Remember back when Jobs announced the switch? He did say that they still had some "great, amazing" PowerPC products up their sleeve. Perhaps this iPhone or even an iPod cell phone PDA is what he meant. Of course, my eyes have been taken to hell and back with all the rumors and speculation of an Apple branded cell phone. D:<
Alas, no, I don't think this is the case.

There were some "great, amazing" PowerPC products launched after that keynote. Chief among them were the last G5 based iMac, which included home media integration, and the dual-core G5-based PowerMacs. I don't think anything Steve said about PowerPC products refered to the long term.

Which is a crying shame.

SaddY
Mar 31, 2006, 02:08 PM
honestly, ITS JUST A CELL PHONE! It's like the one tech product that Apple shouldn't have to venture into
With apple something is never JUST a computer or JUST anything...

How the hell do you know ? As I said many times before maybe it's the PDA Phone and tablet rumors all in one ?

quigleybc
Mar 31, 2006, 02:24 PM
The iPhone could be a fantastic idea..

People that think it is dumb, just wait until it comes out before you think that.

Total OSX and iLife integration....front row remote.....the possiblities are looking great imo.

I for one really want them to build it, and build it well. So I don't mind if they take there time. I still got a year and half of contract time on my razr to kill....

pjkelnhofer
Mar 31, 2006, 02:36 PM
I know that a lot of people's top complaints with their cellphones has to do more with their cell phone service than their actual phone.

Even if the Apple released an iPhone, is there any reason to think that they would become a wireless telephone company? It would be more likely that Apple branded phones were designed exclusively for Cingular (with whom Apple already has a relationship). I don't think many people would switch carriers just for a new phone. I know that were I live I get good reception on my Verizon phone, but people who live on the same block and have Cingular have trouble getting a signal at their homes. That isn't going to change because the phone is made my Apple vs. Motorola.

madmaxmedia
Mar 31, 2006, 03:00 PM
Who cares?

Cell phones have been around for a while now and unless Apple can figure out some "revolutionary" new way for us to use the PHONE, not play music on it cause I doubt most people want to do that, than honestly, who gives a crap?

Ummm...I think that is the point for Apple, to introduce something that significantly improves on existing products. Worked pretty good for the Mac and the iPod...

Now maybe they can and maybe they can't. Maybe they're not even really working on a phone (but I think they are.) But you think SJ knows enough that if Apple releases a phone, it will be something they are convinced is significantly better?

madmaxmedia
Mar 31, 2006, 03:04 PM
Yes!! One difference is that the cell phone market has achieved far greater penetration than what the mp3 player market might have reached without the iPod.

But...regardless of what people think of today's cell phones. Apple's not going to release their own unless it is significantly different. It's NOT going to be just a phone + iPod, the Motorola phones with iTunes basically accomplished that already.

The cell phone market looks to me like what the MP3 player market would be right now if the iPod was never introduced: crowded, filled with crappy inferior products, and competing for pocket space with other digital devices.

There is definitely opportunity. Just look at how many people get a Treo and then grow to hate it afterwards due to hardware and interface problems.

I also don't see what's all the whining about how phones have nothing to do with computers. Playing music and videos, sending text messages, sending email, using Internet hotspots, syncing with your computer's contacts, even using VoIP: this is all where cell phones are heading. The day may come in the distant future when a separate MP3 player like the iPod is laughable.

MrCrowbar
Mar 31, 2006, 03:04 PM
In one hour it's April one in Western Europe...

I was just wondering how an apple phone would ring. The boot up apple chime is too short and get unnoticed when you work in a place with lots of Macs around (...well, I guess you don't hear that sound so often since most people reboot once every 2 months or so...). Apple ringtones (I mean the record label here) are off limits, too :D
Most Likely you would be able to play songs from your iTunes Library.

I'd love to see Steve show off the video iPod talking about the specs of the thing and then at the end of th specs list:
"rrrring" Steve looks on the screen
"Oh, it's Phil!" He turns the device to the audience and you can see Steve waving on the display. Then Steve adds the last item on the specs list:
"Full featured phone and iChat"

That would be so awesome. Truly worth a 30th anniversary :)

madmaxmedia
Mar 31, 2006, 03:06 PM
I largely agree. I mean some people might switch, but not THAT many.

OTOH, let's say it is Cingular. I think after buying ATT Wireless they are the nation's largeless wireless provider. That's a huge potential market as-is. If the phone is successful, I would expect it to gradually become available on other carriers as well.

The arguments regarding wireless carriers (not yours, but in general) would also apply to a company like Palm, who is not only successful selling Treos, but is basically migrating their entire company to smartphones. Obviously it hasn't stopped them.

I know that a lot of people's top complaints with their cellphones has to do more with their cell phone service than their actual phone.

Even if the Apple released an iPhone, is there any reason to think that they would become a wireless telephone company? It would be more likely that Apple branded phones were designed exclusively for Cingular (with whom Apple already has a relationship). I don't think many people would switch carriers just for a new phone.

wkhahn
Mar 31, 2006, 03:27 PM
...

I'd love to see Steve show off the video iPod talking about the specs of the thing and then at the end of th specs list:
"rrrring" Steve looks on the screen
"Oh, it's Phil!" He turns the device to the audience and you can see Steve waving on the display. Then Steve adds the last item on the specs list:
"Full featured phone and iChat"

That would be so awesome. Truly worth a 30th anniversary :)

The only problem here is that there has not been any news to suggest that there will be a 30th anniversary event.


Nokia has predicted that the mp3 players will fade away in a few years because of everyone buying mobile phones with music players. A few years ago Nokia predicted that nobody will soon buy cameras any moore, since every phone has one. And indeed Agfa an Konica Minolta have reported that they will withdraw from the camera markets.

It may be that Nokia is wrong and the mp3 players are here to stay, but if they are right it would be quite stupid from Apple to not enter the mobile markets.

Wouldn't it just be easier to partner with someone like Nokia on a new, from the gound up, phone rather than trying to reinvent it themselves. They could brand them as "Apple-Nokia" phones. Nokia has already done some work with WebKit and has the expertise in incorporating standards. It also has the distribution channels already.

HumanJHawkins
Mar 31, 2006, 03:35 PM
I just don't see any reason Apple needs to produce a phone. How does this sell more iMacs or Computers.

A lot of people have cell phones that are pretty good MP3 players as well. None of these people can use iTunes to buy music, and Apple currently is not making any money off of them because they aren't buying iPods either.

If Apple releases a really good iPhone, these people will have an option to switch to Apple products for their music. Theoretically, this could expand the "halo effect" where people who own and like Apple music products give Apple's computers another look too.

jonharris200
Mar 31, 2006, 04:27 PM
In one hour it's April one in Western Europe...

Feels like the night before Christmas. Except none of us knows if Christmas is happening this year. ;)

MrCrowbar
Mar 31, 2006, 04:34 PM
True, true...
I just went over the 500th thread (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=500)

Seems like everybody hated the iPod back then. I think the apple phone will recieve the same response when (before) it comes out.

PS: Is the time in this forum Cupertino (California) time?

direzz
Mar 31, 2006, 04:56 PM
can we have some news about the 30th aniversary now,... lol sorry but this post about the iphone is really boring.

c'mon, give us som news :D

MrCrowbar
Mar 31, 2006, 05:17 PM
I agree theat thread is getting boring. Let's just talk about more interesting stuff. I just noticed the battery status function of the iPod Shuffle is not very accurate. When I press it multiple times in a row, it lights up orange (half full) and red (nearly empty) randomly :rolleyes:

jonharris200
Mar 31, 2006, 05:21 PM
PS: Is the time in this forum Cupertino (California) time?
Speaking of time zones etc, I just thought I'd check out the Apple Australia (http://www.apple.com/au/aprilfool) website in case of an early surprise and... THERE'S A MAJOR ANNOUNCEMENT ON THERE!!!

Why didn't anyone spot this earlier?!

MrCrowbar
Mar 31, 2006, 05:46 PM
<not serous> OMG. Page not Found. So they will announce something. OMG OMG OMG OMG...</not serous>

We all know what it looks like when they update the store/homepage. I guess the forum here will cover that. Or did you find something on that aprilfool's page that was removed when I looked? If not: You fooled me :)

Rocketman
Mar 31, 2006, 06:13 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

ThinkSecret reports (http://www.thinksecret.com/news/0603iphone.html) that Apple's cell phone project has been placed on hold due to "significant technical hurdles" in developing the product.

According to the rumor site, Apple had wanted to develop the cell phone "from the ground up" rather than improving on existing designs. The process, however, was met with technical problems in interfacing the various cell components.

ThinkSecret predicts that the Apple cell phone will not likely come until at least 2007, if not later. This is in the face of numerous (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2006/03/20060319140832.shtml) predictions by analysts that an Apple iPhone is expected in the next 12 months.

One of the alleged technical problems seems NOT to be acquisition of a turn-key worldwide telco facility part and parcel with IPTV capability.

Rocketman

jonharris200
Mar 31, 2006, 06:44 PM
If not: You fooled me :)
Hehe... happy April 1! :D

MrCrowbar
Mar 31, 2006, 06:57 PM
Hehe... happy April 1! :D

Lol.

BornAgainMac
Mar 31, 2006, 07:18 PM
That was a good April Fools joke. The sad part was that I fell for it even more because I thought Apple took the site down before I had a chance to see the announcement. At least until I saw the URL.

jonharris200
Mar 31, 2006, 07:29 PM
I am feeling quite smug! But I know I would probably have clicked it without thinking if someone else had posted it first. :)

ebunton
Mar 31, 2006, 07:52 PM
Apple is absolutely missing out on the mobile marketplace -- the future of computing for many emerging markets.

Apple Mobile OS -- there's already Windows, Linux and Palm, with Palm no longer since it was snapped up by a Japanese firm.

The palm treos are everywhere, the stock is shooting through the roof, and Apple could've been there with any bit of vision. Sheesh, Jobs had to be forced into the mp3 market, but apparently all he saw were PDA's and never realized the phones were getting smarter.

Mobile darwin, iCal, Mail, iChat, Safari, Pages, iTunes -- it's all there and ready for a mobile OS -- where is apple?

It's not about phones, it about mobile computing -- multitasking, multithreaded with a low voltage Intel core dual, mobile spotlight searching.

WHERE IS APPLE FOR MOBILE COMPUTING?

My treo does everything, but is all single tasking with hideous searching. Otherwise, it's a laptop replacement -- the same way the first powerbooks were desktop replacements, though no one realized it for quite some time.

I think you're on the right track but still haven't seen a greater and more paradigm-shifting potential.

-------------------------------------

The future is in a portable device which is able to store everything about your life. (not the 'mobile computer' in today's sense)

-------------------------------------

The mobile phone is almost ubiquitous (vastly more so than the iPod). It is seen in the industry as the practical solution for the 'life' device mentioned above.

Apple is visionary enough to see this (as well as many other visionary people) and is taking the necessary strategic steps to be the number one producer of that 'life' device (iPod).

iPod isn't just meant for music. Think different.

MrCrowbar
Mar 31, 2006, 08:23 PM
I think you're on the right track but still haven't seen a greater and more paradigm-shifting potential.

-------------------------------------

The future is in a portable device which is able to store everything about your life. (not the 'mobile computer' in today's sense)

-------------------------------------

The mobile phone is almost ubiquitous (vastly more so than the iPod). It is seen in the industry as the practical solution for the 'life' device mentioned above.

Apple is visionary enough to see this (as well as many other visionary people) and is taking the necessary strategic steps to be the number one producer of that 'life' device (iPod).

iPod isn't just meant for music. Think different.

Amen.

AidenShaw
Mar 31, 2006, 09:57 PM
Mobile darwin, iCal, Mail, iChat, Safari, Pages, iTunes -- it's all there and ready for a mobile OS -- where is apple?
IMO it would be a mistake for Apple to try to build the whole stack - porting Darwin to XScale architecture and mobile hardware would be a huge undertaking. They'd be starting from scratch in a very different world from the hardware that is currently under Darwin.

It would be much smarter, simpler and faster (again, IMO) to transplant a subset of the Carbon/Cocoa frameworks on top of an embedded Linux that already runs on smartphone hardware. A market leader in this space is Monte Vista (http://www.mvista.com/products/mobilinux/features.html).

OSX is layered on a Unix-like foundation, layering MOSX (Mobile OSX) on a proven mobile Unix-like foundation would make more sense (except to certain Egos) than trying to start from scratch.

generik
Mar 31, 2006, 10:31 PM
Considering TS' recent track record... get ready for an iPhone tomorrow!

nathan2301
Apr 1, 2006, 12:01 AM
Sorry if this has been posted somewhere else

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3168733759916419298

Yes I know its not real, looks kinds cool though.

rdowns
Apr 1, 2006, 04:16 AM
For people who don't see how an Apple phone connects to the Mac strategy, what if the phone was a mobile phone that could do all of the things 'regular' mobiles do, but run iTunes (Music, video clips), sync with Mail (send/receive email?) and Address Book, control Front Row (remote) and, most innovative of all, connect with iChat to provide VOIP services.

Sounds great but that wouldn't make it a success. Unless they provide the same functionality for Windows, it will be a marginal success like the iPod was before Windows compatibility.

rdowns
Apr 1, 2006, 04:28 AM
Dropped calls...

Apple would have the same problems. Do you think they will use their own network (insanely expensive to build) or use an existing one?

Crappy battery...

Long battery life is not exactly Apple's forte.

Functionality that only the carriers want...

Didn't Apple invent this? They are famous for crippling certain products to move demand to higher end ones.

Impossible to figure out (easily) the phone's functionality.
The terrible operating systems that ship with most of them (Sony Ericsson is not bad, but not great either.)

Apple would indeed shine here.

And my favorite...the 400 "branding opportunities" carriers shove down our throats. If I have never have to look at a Cingular logo again, I'll be happy.

Apple would do the same.

I don't see a lot of positives for Apple entering this very crowded market. Just too expensive to build their own network. If they use an existing one, do you think the carrier would allow Apple to offer everything but the kitchen sink and leave their products in the dust?

If Apple were to enter the market, I'd like to see them do it as a OS provider for all takers.

Tupring
Apr 1, 2006, 05:05 PM
I just don't see any reason Apple needs to produce a phone. How does this sell more iMacs or Computers. Can anyone think of a reason?It comes will Bill Gates' phone number on speed dial, for easy pranking. :D

Compatiblepoker
Apr 2, 2006, 04:35 PM
Personally Im glad its taking a long time. That means they are doing it right. I hate my nokia / cingular phone and hope this product is worth the wait.

needthephone
Apr 4, 2006, 07:50 AM
Apple simply must bring out an iphone, they don't really have a choice. Unless they want to throw away it all.

I am disspointed in all the mobile makers and they all have basically products which don't work properly. One thing which has always impressed me about apple is the fact that their stuff always works, the way it says so on the box. I have one of the new generation of mp3 player phones (a nokia) but quite frankly its laughable compred with itunes and as a bonus it doesn't work properly as a phone either.

I think a tie up with motorolla is wrong as in my opinion they are one of the worst offenders in the mobile market. What we need is a a new imaginative, well engineered, well de bugged apple iphone.

Its quite refreshing for a manufacture not to cynically use the market place to debug their products. Like many people I would gladly wait if they bring this thing out without any glitches.

Its not if, its when its released.I WANT ONE!.

elephanttrainer
Apr 4, 2006, 04:54 PM
Sorry if this has been posted somewhere else

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3168733759916419298

Yes I know its not real, looks kinds cool though.

This is awesome. Thank you for posting, because I have not seen it before, it would definately fall under the concept of building a phone from the ground up, despite the fact that the technology is available in other products. I'll buy two.

:)

BTW- I'm cruising with an expired two year contract with AT&T wireless waiting for Apple to put out a phone. Hopefully they will go with AT&T/Cingular so I can renew my contract with a new phone.

needthephone
Apr 5, 2006, 06:24 AM
Apple need this now. I was going to buy an ipod but when I upgraded my mobile I went for a nokia 6280 which also has a 2megapixel camera, a radio and an mp3 player. the sound is excellent but the mp3 software is woeful-its quite frankly an embarresment to nokia. From using itunes on my PC I know how good it is and its obvious how bad the nokia is. But they will get better. I don't want the itunes music store, all I want to do is convert my cd's to mp3's and put them on a player. It does me fine and apple have lost a sale-I'm not the only one though I'm sure. Apple for your own sake get this phone out.

tcsmith822
Apr 7, 2006, 05:40 AM
Apple will not compete with Disney unless it folds on the phone service.

Disney has phones and plans for launching phone service this June. Apple will finish a better phone (1 year later) that for some reason Disney will sell - and rightfully so because it will be the best phone anyone has ever seen (*).

Steve Jobs is my hero - someone who can set aside the past, allow others to compete and still come out far beyond anyone's expectations.

Apple will make a phone for their service if anything - 2 models or lines - iPhone pro and iPhone (assuming the Mac Book will be the lower end line of Mac Book Pro)

This is the last bit of my god-given gift of insight/understanding I will ever share about Apple's future with anyone unless you are any of the 2.99 men named Steve. I am going to become a full apple developer and going to go through all apple certification training programs and invest in thousands of apple computers (and their stock).


I'm sorry for this, but it has to be said after reading apple's mild boot camp comments...

* unless you still like windows, in which case you'd prefer the "L337 XPh0n3" where every program has it's own bad implementation of a mail reader, web browser, address book, spell checker, calendar, etc due to a misunderstanding of the whole purpose of the device and a lack of good API's. It's best features include a decent game back-end that everyone was tricked into supporting, internet exploder, 100+ open source backdoors (note to paris hilton - stay away), sync'n'pray and last but not least the BSOD on your no-longer-supported-phone to be rendered into a paperweight - causing you to budget for a iPhone (no XPh0n3 emulation needed this time). Please flame me privately if you must do so.

jvicinanza
Apr 13, 2006, 08:52 AM
I suggest you visit www.iphone.org.

cheers

Jason

needthephone
Apr 14, 2006, 02:55 AM
interesting, it will happen

thecheda
Apr 14, 2006, 03:03 AM
I suggest you visit www.iphone.org.

cheers

Jason

can somebody explain to me whats going on? wont apple register a bunch of names just in case they will release in the future? this doesnt necassarily mean that they will be releasing a phone anytime soon does it?.......

frinky23
Apr 17, 2006, 08:02 PM
can somebody explain to me whats going on? wont apple register a bunch of names just in case they will release in the future? this doesnt necassarily mean that they will be releasing a phone anytime soon does it?.......

No, it doesn't... But, it's expensive to register trademarks that you aren't using and you have to renew the "intent-to-use" every six months. After the first extension, you have to "show cause" for the application to be extended. And then you only get 4 more opportunities (for a total of three years) before you have to start over and all your competitors know how and what you think about.

Generally, corporations don't like to register trademarks they never intend to use. But as we all know, Apple doesn't act like most corporations.