Why I think Apple Comps are great deals

[Peyton]

Imagine; me and a couple friends shopping for furniture for my new place.

I want modern, cool, black/silver/white furnishings with colorful artwork to make it all pop. OK, so I go to a nice store (I love to spend money I think is actually of value and is EXACTLY what I want; conversly, I hate spending money on things that 'will work' but not quite what I had in mind.)

Anyway. I went to my local Drexel Heritage (http://www.drexelheritage.com/index2.asp) and bought a bed (http://www.drexelheritage.com/collection/item.asp?id=3385&rnd=197299930) two sofas (http://www.drexelheritage.com/collection/item.asp?id=2201) (all in black), a bookcase (http://www.drexelheritage.com/collection/item.asp?id=2462) among other things (end tables, coffee table, dinning table)

and realized I could have got an amazing Mac for that much. Take the bookcase, it looks much better in person, but it costs more than the 17 inch iMac by about $300.

When I think about all the time and meticulous energy put into the iMac (OSX, software, hardware design etc) Apple comps look like incredible deals.

Especially because it can really change your life (or perspective at least) when my book case will sit there and look cool.

I know a lot went into the bookcase too, but I just really felt like Macs were actually cheap when paying for the furniture.

Any luxury car owners? $700 for a heated seat package. Basically the same thing as a heated blanked ($50) and put into a chair. Still costs about as much as a mini.

Anyway, just my opinion, just a different perspective.

[lamina]

Very interesting perspective indeed. I am thinking a lot like you are, except that I'm still in university. When I go out drinking, I think to myself "instead of going out and getting drunk tonight, I could have bought a sweet wireless mouse".

Which is why I'm somewhat of a hermit lately.

The worst though is my tuition bill. "Jeez... instead of spending $15,000 this year on school, I could have bought myself a totally souped-up quad-core PowerMac with 16GB of memory, huge hdd, etc"

Of course there is no need for such a computer (for me anyway), but it kinda puts everything in perspective. Perhaps there should be a universal currency called Macaroons, outlining how many mac products you can get for a certain amount of 'real-world' money.

I think I drank too much coffee this morning.

[Josias]

Ha!:p

I like your opinion.

[katie ta achoo]

The worst though is my tuition bill. "Jeez... instead of spending $15,000 this year on school, I could have bought myself a totally souped-up quad-core PowerMac with 16GB of memory, huge hdd, etc"


my train of thought:
I could spend $15k for my bachelor's at university of Houston, then $15k/year somewhere else for my grad school, then take that education, earn a 7-figure income, and buy several souped-up PowerMacs. :):)

[Compatiblepoker]

If I knew what I know now I would never have gone to college. Sad but true in my case. I don't know how much college actually helped my do anything except for how to live in the "real world"

[miloblithe]

So Macs are great deals because they cost less than things that are extremely expensive?

[QCassidy352]

So Macs are great deals because they cost less than things that are extremely expensive?

my thoughts exactly. :confused:

katie, just curious - what do you plan on doing that pays a 7 figure income?

[katie ta achoo]

my thoughts exactly. :confused:

katie, just curious - what do you plan on doing that pays a 7 figure income?

CFO of large technology related company.

[Demon Hunter]

If I knew what I know now I would never have gone to college. Sad but true in my case. I don't know how much college actually helped my do anything except for how to live in the "real world"

Yeah. Higher education isn't what it used to be. With my degree in Psychology, I'll be qualified to flip burgers.

That's why I'm going to grad school, but when I'm done with my Bachelor's... that's 60k. Yeah.

[coffey7]

the Macs are way over priced but since I'm rich I don't care.

[itcheroni]

my train of thought:
I could spend $15k for my bachelor's at university of Houston, then $15k/year somewhere else for my grad school, then take that education, earn a 7-figure income, and buy several souped-up PowerMacs. :):)

So what will you use in the mean time?

7 figures! How you doin?

[DaveP]

Katie, let us know where you get that sweet $1,000,000+ job out of school. We'll all forward our resumes.

Though I will say college is very much a good thing. However, a lot of people get liberal arts degrees because they don't know what they want to do. And a liberal arts degree generally isn't very career oriented, as opposed to engineering for example.

[TheMasin9]

the Macs are way over priced but since I'm rich I don't care.
wish i was in your boat...

[p0intblank]

the Macs are way over priced but since I'm rich I don't care.

Well you're an open-minded person!

[GyroFX]

wow 7 figure income straight outta college? you must be on something...maybe after 15+ years going through all levels of AR/AP...maybe then, if you're lucky enough, you might get paid 450k -600k...in a HUGE company, and it's gotta be a fourtune 500 at least. I don't see how any company will dish out 1 mil + to someone straight outta grad school...let alone 100k. You need the experience these days, need to be trusted, need to have connections, need to be good at what you're doing. If the average jane/joe can get 100k jobs straight outta college, then damn...i don't know what to say. In any case, best of luck to you, it's not easy out there, unless your family is running the firm/company etc.

[miloblithe]

A lawyer from a top school can make over $100,000 straight out of college.

Back to the original post though, it's also important to consider that high-quality furniture is meant to last for 20, 50, 100 years. A computer is lucky to go strong after 4.

[GyroFX]

ooops, i meant 1 mil straight outta college. yeah, the really good lawyers can get 100k outta college but they've gotta be really good and out of a good college. I know lawyers that get paid 3 mil + yr...but they've been doing it for a while and made partner



A lawyer from a top school can make over $100,000 straight out of college.

Back to the original post though, it's also important to consider that high-quality furniture is meant to last for 20, 50, 100 years. A computer is lucky to go strong after 4.

[QCassidy352]

A lawyer from a top school can make over $100,000 straight out of college.

A lawyer can make $125K (base salary before a [substantial] bonus) straight out of law school at pretty much any major firm in a big city. By definition a lawyer can't be "straight out of college." :p

It is certainly possible to make 6 figures straight out of college, however. I have several friends who went in to investment banking (JP Morgan) and are getting paid over $50,000 first year. Oh yea... that's over $50,000 in bonuses. As in, not including base salary. So we're talking waaay over $100,000 right out of undergrad.

Of course, that also involves working six and a half days a week and selling your soul, so on balance, it doesn't seem like all that hot a deal.

[Peyton]

Back to the original post though, it's also important to consider that high-quality furniture is meant to last for 20, 50, 100 years. A computer is lucky to go strong after 4.

VERY good point. Although I don't tend to like to look at the same furniture for years and years on end, I get what you're saying.

My point was, the engineering/design/R&D hours FAR out paces the bookcase price.

And to the poster that said 'so they are cheap when comparing to something more expensive' ... well, yes, but as a functional perspective, bookcases aren't exactly that functional. I mean, the floor can hold whatever I wanted to put in the bookcase.

I don't know, it just seems that one big turn off to Apple products to some people is that they seem too expensive, and over the weekend I've learned that really, relatively, functionally, they aren't.

[Jon'sLightBulbs]

My Powerbook was a terrible deal compared to my Ikea!

[miloblithe]

...Although I don't tend to like to look at the same furniture for years and years on end, I get what you're saying...

Your parents are very generous.

[Peyton]

Your parents are very generous.

Well, they are, but I pay for most everything myself now. Including furniture:cool:

[dmw007]

An interesting perspective Peyton.

I tend to think about the same thing every year when I cut a check for my car insurance. :rolleyes: ;) :)

[ddrueckhammer]

A lawyer from a top school can make over $100,000 straight out of college.

Back to the original post though, it's also important to consider that high-quality furniture is meant to last for 20, 50, 100 years. A computer is lucky to go strong after 4.

Lawyers who make over $100,000 out of law school also have to have very strong GPAs from Ivy League or at least the top Tier 1 schools. Also, most of these people work close to 80hrs/week.
If you take into account the hours they put in, they aren't making any more money than a lot of graduates. This is part of the reason I will never be a Lawyer or a Doctor. Good luck to those of you who have those aspirations but I find Engineering far more interesting with the potential of being more lucrative than most fields...

[Peyton]

Interesting there is so much talk about lawyers here,

my dad is a lawyer, has been for 20 years, and he immediately went into private practice, works about 6 hours a day (9AM-3PM) some times till 5PM if theres a depo or something, and has never made less than 100k. many times more in fact so its not unbelievable, and no, he didn't go to an ivy league law school. Private practice doesn't really require a great GPA either.

Before you start to think he must have had a rich dad or something, well he did, but he took out a loan after college to pay for his office etc and did it himself. (he also has a partner which helps.)

And before someone starts thinking I'm a spoiled kid who doesn't know the value of a dollar, like my dad, I work for every dollar I get. I'm not trying to come off preachy, I just know how some skepics* around here work

[katie ta achoo]

wow 7 figure income straight outta college? you must be on something...maybe after 15+ years going through all levels of AR/AP...maybe then, if you're lucky enough, you might get paid 450k -600k...in a HUGE company, and it's gotta be a fourtune 500 at least. I don't see how any company will dish out 1 mil + to someone straight outta grad school...

key word being earn. I'm aware that I'll be living on $25k/yr for a while.

Mmm.. economics.
(and a little bit of hyperbole)

[iHeartTheApple]

my train of thought:
I could spend $15k for my bachelor's at university of Houston, then $15k/year somewhere else for my grad school, then take that education, earn a 7-figure income, and buy several souped-up PowerMacs. :):)

7 figures?! :confused: :eek: Tell me what your major is so I can switch...I'm finishing up grad school this year and I won't be making anywhere near that...

Stupid aerospace engineering...:mad: :p

For the OP: A very interesting perspective. I like it and I agree. :)

[dmw007]

And before someone starts thinking I'm a spoiled kid who doesn't know the value of a dollar, like my dad, I work for every dollar I get. I'm not trying to come off preachy, I just know how some skepics* around here work

I know where you are coming from Peyton- my dad also makes a six figure income, but I too work for my money and subsequently understand the value of the dollar. :)

[QCassidy352]

Lawyers who make over $100,000 out of law school also have to have very strong GPAs from Ivy League or at least the top Tier 1 schools. Also, most of these people work close to 80hrs/week.

You're right about the 80 work weeks, but wrong about what it takes to make that right out of school. Those jobs are not exceptional and do not require either terribly high GPAs or an Ivy League law degree. $125K before bonus (which might be half that again) for a first year associate at a large firm in NYC/DC/Chicago/Boston/SF/LA etc. is standard. There was an article in the NY Times just a few days ago saying how hard it is for firms to attract young lawyers these days, so those rates are actually on the rise.

I'm a law student, so this is a topic of keen interest to me. :)

[jadekitty24]

If anyone can make $100,000 straight out of college I'm figuring Katie can. For a girl so young she has a good head on her shoulders so can we please get back on topic?

Interesting perspective indeed. Whatever I spend money on I can't help but think "I could buy a BT keyboard with this" , etc. My buddies make fun of me because I refuse to go out clubbing or bar-hopping. I could drop $100 (minimum) in one night, including a meal and vast amounts of liquor, have to worry about having a designated driver, worry about what I'm going to wear, blah blah. Or I could buy a $10 bottle of wine, $10 max to make dinner at home, and have $80 to blow on whatever Mac accessory I think I "need". They joke that I buy my wardrobe (consists of jeans, t-shirts, flannels and the occassional hoodie) at Walmart, but in the right financial circumstance I wouldn't hesitate to drop $2000 on a Mac. It's all a matter of opinion. Would I like snappy furniture? Yes. But not as much as I'd like a new Mac :D

[kozmic stu]

Or I could buy a $10 bottle of wine, $10 max to make dinner at home, and have $80 to blow on whatever Mac accessory I think I "need"

Christ you spend that much on making yourself dinner at home?! Me and my girlfriend figured out our evening meal rarely costs more than £1.50 (that's about $2.50) for the two of us (and our little daughter, but she's still breastfed so it doesn't really count...)

Of course I can't seem to spend money on computers anyway - despite the fact that I recently quit smoking (a big deal in the UK, 'cause a pack of cigarettes costs upwards of $10) AND I haven't had a night out in months, I still can't seem to find the ready disposable income required to buy gadgets - it took 2 months to gather the nerve to buy an iPod Shuffle.

The thing with the furniture is not really comparing like for like. Furniture costs a lot more to build than computers. Apple hardware stands on it's own for value, just very few people give it a fair judgement, prefering to think that people pay 'for the Apple badge' or 'for the design' rather than paying for the fully equipped machine with built in WiFi, Bluetooth, webcam, gigabit ethernet, etc, etc, etc, ad nauseum

Strange, really

Stu

[QCassidy352]

If anyone can make $100,000 straight out of college I'm figuring Katie can. For a girl so young she has a good head on her shoulders so can we please get back on topic?

Interesting perspective indeed. Whatever I spend money on I can't help but think "I could buy a BT keyboard with this" , etc. My buddies make fun of me because I refuse to go out clubbing or bar-hopping. I could drop $100 (minimum) in one night, including a meal and vast amounts of liquor, have to worry about having a designated driver, worry about what I'm going to wear, blah blah. Or I could buy a $10 bottle of wine, $10 max to make dinner at home, and have $80 to blow on whatever Mac accessory I think I "need". They joke that I buy my wardrobe (consists of jeans, t-shirts, flannels and the occassional hoodie) at Walmart, but in the right financial circumstance I wouldn't hesitate to drop $2000 on a Mac. It's all a matter of opinion. Would I like snappy furniture? Yes. But not as much as I'd like a new Mac :D

I don't understand why people are so resistant to topics changing direction if the new direction is interesting... but anyway.

I think nearly everyone spends money on things that they don't "need," and is cheap about other things. What's funny is that we all think people whose extravagances don't match our own spend foolishly. I don't understand people who need expensive clothes or 20 pairs of shoes, but then again a lot of people don't understand why I like upgrading computers every year when the old one works just fine.

[MIDI_EVIL]

This thread has made me cringe, it is nothing more than a brag about where the OP does their furniture shopping and how much everything they own is worth...Nothing more!

Comparing everything you buy to what you could get if it were a Mac is kinda petty, considering you could probably give several people in developing countries a good chance at a better way of living. Surely that should cross your mind when you spend so much on a bookcase as opposed to a Mac?

Oh, and i don't think it's polite or appropriate to discuss what your father earns,...Does modesty mean anything these days?

Rich.

[Peyton]

This thread has made me cringe, it is nothing more than a brag about where the OP does their furniture shopping and how much everything they own is worth...Nothing more!

Comparing everything you buy to what you could get if it were a Mac is kinda petty, considering you could probably give several people in developing countries a good chance at a better way of living. Surely that should cross your mind when you spend so much on a bookcase as opposed to a Mac?

Oh, and i don't think it's polite or appropriate to discuss what your father earns,...Does modesty mean anything these days?

Rich.

Well, first, I make it a point to donate half (50%) of everything I earn to charity. OK? so do I think about other people around the world? Yes.

Why did I bring up the salary thing? Well it was in context of what other people were already off topic thinking about. And no, if we were ever face to face (any of the MR members) I would never just say that, I never talk about money with friends/family, but on a basically anon forum, I figure it doesn't matter and it would benefit the discussion.

So thanks for assuming I want to brag, don't care about other people, and want to talk about what my dad makes, but none of that is true.

[MIDI_EVIL]

Well, first, I make it a point to donate half (50%) of everything I earn to charity. OK? so do I think about other people around the world? Yes.

.

If this is true then i apologise profusely.

As for the rest, i've made my mind up.

Rich.

[technicolor]

A lawyer from a top school can make over $100,000 straight out of college.

Back to the original post though, it's also important to consider that high-quality furniture is meant to last for 20, 50, 100 years. A computer is lucky to go strong after 4.
And they will also have 100K in debt

[bah-bah'd]

And they will also have 100K in debt

some people already have money, so no debt...

Oh, compare more that two things people. Computers & furniture? Sheesh. Try adding car, house (or just rent), nicest outfit, cheapest outfit, home appliance or TV to the list before you start comparing price/lifespan. Oh, and try adding amount of usage into the equation too... My computers are constantly on and inuse, which making my 'cost per day' less than I smoke a day. go figure.

[technicolor]

some people already have money, so no debt...

.
i dont deal in exceptions
the fact of the matter is
most ppl who go to law school leave with debt
and large amounts
i know how law schools work and how they offer their fianancing

[jadekitty24]

I don't understand why people are so resistant to topics changing direction if the new direction is interesting... but anyway.


Sorry, I guess that did come across as a bit snotty. And no, I'm not resistant to topic change when it is interesting, just a bad mood that spilled over into the forums. :o

[ddrueckhammer]

You're right about the 80 work weeks, but wrong about what it takes to make that right out of school.

My girlfriend has applied to Law School for the Fall and been doing a lot of research concerning the schools she applied to. While I think that it is certainly possible to make six figures out of school, I think as you stated, it must be in a large city (and those firms are at least a little competitive).

Check out the US News & World Report's statistics on average salaries by school and you will see that there is a large gap in starting income depending on what school you attend. For instance, the average starting salary for the University of Florida is like $60k. (I'm quoting from memory so I may be a bit off...) While Southern Methodist University in Dallas is like $120k. There are many factors that cause one school to have a larger average starting income such as; specialization ranking, and social networks.

This is where I was coming from. I may have been a little off but I still think it is difficult to get that kind of money out of school unless you know someone or have a very nice resume'.

Thanks for the interesting discussion...