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MacRumors
Apr 29, 2006, 11:14 AM
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In a time when many game publishers and studios are taking a wait and see (http://www.macworld.com/news/2006/04/07/gamerreax/index.php) approach to Mac games since Apple's Boot Camp software was released, Destineer (http://www.destineerstudios.com/) has announced that it has secured USD$12 Million in private-equity investment (http://www.destineerstudios.com/press/press_releases/exxel_announce.html), which will help enable the gamemaker and publisher to continue development of Macintosh-native games.

In an interview (http://www.macworld.com/news/2006/04/28/destineer/index.php) with Macworld's Peter Cohen, Destineer's president Peter Tamte explains how they are in a unique position to make profit since they are both game developer and publisher.

In a traditional game industry setup, the developer creates the game and gives away a huge chunk of revenue to the publisher in order to get their game on store shelves — publishers often keep 80 percent of the revenue...

Destineer also re-affirmed that the Mac remains a pillar of their business, and gamers can expect them to continue to not only bring the latest hits from the PC world to Mac, but also bring more original releases to market.

"The MacSoft business has been a pillar of our organization since we incorporated in 2001,” said Tamte. “It has provided us with stable and growing profits. And we’ve turned that cash into product development for our core technologies — that’s being used now to create games for a whole bunch of platforms, including simultaneous Mac releases.”

This doesn’t mean that MacSoft will stop porting high-profile Mac games, said Tamte, but he said that gamers will see a shift in Destineer’s portfolio from licensed titles to original titles.

Destineer is the parent company of MacSoft and Bold, which have brought hit titles such as Halo: Combat Evolved and Zoo Tycoon 2 to Mac. Destineer has also recently developed an original title, Close Combat: First to Fight, which saw a simultaneous release for PC and Mac.

paddy
Apr 29, 2006, 11:15 AM
Does this mean more PPC games are what?

Gurutech
Apr 29, 2006, 11:19 AM
Nice...
I want to see more mac games!!

sbrhwkp3
Apr 29, 2006, 11:22 AM
This is great news. Mac does have a future in the game department.

MrCrowbar
Apr 29, 2006, 11:31 AM
Meh...

Hope they will run under x86 ;) . Rosetta is just too slow for 3D gaming. :cool:

p0intblank
Apr 29, 2006, 11:31 AM
Awesome! :) No one better vote this a Negative...

Platform
Apr 29, 2006, 11:31 AM
Just...................thank you :cool:

jzeiders
Apr 29, 2006, 11:32 AM
That's great news. I was worried about the implications of Boot Camp with game developers - but if people continue this investment and pronounced support of Mac games, then I see a bright future, especially as power is becoming more affordable for Macs.

Marx55
Apr 29, 2006, 11:33 AM
Destineer, way to go!

longofest
Apr 29, 2006, 11:37 AM
The interview with MacWorld doesn't talk about PPC vs. x86, but just about "Mac" games.

I think in today's modern world, you can assume that Destineer will be going Universal Binary from here on out. That's not any kind of inside info, but just an assumption...

bilbo--baggins
Apr 29, 2006, 11:44 AM
The interview with MacWorld doesn't talk about PPC vs. x86, but just about "Mac" games.

I think in today's modern world, you can assume that Destineer will be going Universal Binary from here on out. That's not any kind of inside info, but just an assumption...

Good assumption. With the Mac community in the middle of a transition from PPC to Intel the developers cannot afford to exclude a proportion of the Mac community. Universal Binary is the only way to go.

For how long this will be the case is difficult to say though, because it wont be long before cutting edge games are too demanding for todays PPC Macs and so it will become unnecessary to make them PPC compatible.

Kingsly
Apr 29, 2006, 11:46 AM
This is great news, but I hope their new games aren't as big of a flop as CC:FTF

longofest
Apr 29, 2006, 11:48 AM
Good assumption. With the Mac community in the middle of a transition from PPC to Intel the developers cannot afford to exclude a proportion of the Mac community. Universal Binary is the only way to go.

For how long this will be the case is difficult to say though, because it wont be long before cutting edge games are too demanding for todays PPC Macs and so it will become unnecessary to make them PPC compatible.

Once you have your staff trained to stop writing directly to hardware API's and use the OS frameworks (so, instead of using Altivec or SSE directly, use Accelerate framework which chooses based upon which platform you are on), it shouldn't be too tough to keep doing that.

That being said, I myself have never programmed a universal binary. I am a programmer however...

bousozoku
Apr 29, 2006, 12:01 PM
Yes, we need more John Deere games. :rolleyes:

What does it matter? They haven't done a whole lot, regardless of Peter Tamte.

nagromme
Apr 29, 2006, 12:04 PM
More ports from MacSoft, and more simultaneous releases--great! Keep it up :)

They also brought us my favorite game: UT 2004. It's not just a game but a platform for thousands of free downloadable mods that provide totally different gaming experiences. Now let's have UT2007, which is reported to have Mac editing/mapping tools (beyondunreal.com/daedalus/singlepost.php?id=6277) :)

As for PPC, I expect some titles, especially casual games, WILL still run on PPC for some time--but high-end 3D games (more so than most other apps) often demand the latest hardware, and that's probably going to mean some games will be Intel-only before too long.


What does it matter? They haven't done a whole lot, regardless of Peter Tamte.
I'll try to figure out what you mean, but I'm too busy playing UT 2004 and Halo ;)

7on
Apr 29, 2006, 12:05 PM
I personally want to see a Halo UB before too long...

longofest
Apr 29, 2006, 12:06 PM
Yes, we need more John Deere games. :rolleyes:

What does it matter? They haven't done a whole lot, regardless of Peter Tamte.

Bringing Halo to the Mac == 50 of Aspyr's games in my book. Not only is it a GREAT game, but it was well coded on MacSoft's part.

As for PPC, I expect some titles, especially casual games, WILL still run on PPC for some time--but high-end 3D games (more so than most other apps) often demand the latest hardware, and that's probably going to mean some games will be Intel-only before too long.

I personally believe that my Quad should be able to run any game that they put out there for a good long time...

jsw
Apr 29, 2006, 12:09 PM
I personally believe that my Quad should be able to run any game that they put out there for a good long time...I hope so too (I've got a Rev A dual-2), but I suspect, soon, that it'll just take a good long time to run any games they put out there. ;)

nagromme
Apr 29, 2006, 12:10 PM
I personally want to see a Halo UB before too long...
I think it's coming. UT 2004 is Universal too.

I personally believe that my Quad should be able to run any game that they put out there for a good long time...
With multiple CPU cores becoming common and mainstream, we might see better multi-threading by game programmers :)

Aaon
Apr 29, 2006, 12:15 PM
I think this is fantastic news for the Mac community. There is a lot of promise in the Mac gaming market, as the Mac marketshare increases. I hope a group of good developers can coax some amazing performance out of the new Intel hardware.

bousozoku
Apr 29, 2006, 12:51 PM
...
I'll try to figure out what you mean, but I'm too busy playing UT 2004 and Halo ;)

It's been a very long time since those two arrived. Since then what has Bold/Destineer or MacSoft done? The John Deere series is the only new software I've seen from them.

As far as patching UT2004, who would know if Ryan Gordon hadn't let everyone know. MacSoft barely acknowledges the game. I suspect he's working on it on his own.

longofest
Apr 29, 2006, 12:52 PM
It's been a very long time since those two arrived. Since then what has Bold/Destineer or MacSoft done? The John Deere series is the only new software I've seen from them.

As far as patching UT2004, who would know if Ryan Gordon hadn't let everyone know. MacSoft barely acknowledges the game. I suspect he's working on it on his own.

Close Combat comes to mind...

nagromme
Apr 29, 2006, 01:28 PM
As far as patching UT2004, who would know if Ryan Gordon hadn't let everyone know. MacSoft barely acknowledges the game. I suspect he's working on it on his own.
Ryan Gordon works for Epic (developer of UT 2004). He handles the Mac and Linux versions. MacSoft can't take credit for Epic's much-welcome ongoing support, but MacSoft did put the game in my hands, and so I'm very glad they plan to keep it up.

Lollypop
Apr 29, 2006, 01:28 PM
I think this generation of games will be writen as UBs, but as soon as they start wiht the next generation they wil go intel only. It happens so often in the windows world that people have to upgrade when a entire new generation of games comes out, dont see why that wont happen for mac titles as well.

Roller
Apr 29, 2006, 01:28 PM
I think that this is good news from more than just the game perspective. People are worried that Boot Camp (and, to a lesser extent, Parallels) will dissuade developers from writing Mac OS software. The fact that a developer, especially one who produces games, is willing to continue supporing the Mac platform may encourage others to do the same.

Daschund
Apr 29, 2006, 01:42 PM
PLEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAASE!!! More racing games! Why not port F-1, Need for Speed and all these games?!?!?!? I need them!!!!!!!! :D

MacsRgr8
Apr 29, 2006, 02:03 PM
PLEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAASE!!! More racing games! Why not port F-1, Need for Speed and all these games?!?!?!? I need them!!!!!!!! :D

I am 100% with you!!

Also more games like DTM 3, Richard Burns etc.

Glad we're getting Colin MacRae 2005 (http://www.feralinteractive.com/?game=colinmcrae&language=english&section=) soon

Waiting a long time for it.... but Feral will get my £$€$£€ when it finally comes out. ;)

mjstew33
Apr 29, 2006, 02:33 PM
I've lost my gaming spirit since I moved to the Mac, so I hope I can "regain" that if there's more games available.

rockandrule
Apr 29, 2006, 02:43 PM
Glad to hear the continued support. Granted, I'm still much more in tune with my PS2 than anything else for games. Maybe if they port over Halo 2 or at least drop the price on the original Halo I'll start playing on my PowerBook (I don't feel like buying an XBOX).

nagromme
Apr 29, 2006, 03:43 PM
Glad to hear the continued support. Granted, I'm still much more in tune with my PS2 than anything else for games. Maybe if they port over Halo 2 or at least drop the price on the original Halo I'll start playing on my PowerBook (I don't feel like buying an XBOX).
I just finished Halo--it's not the "latest thing" but it's a lot of fun--better than I expected. And SO much better with mouse aiming than the X-Box version. Consoles and 3D shooters will never mix for me.

milatchi
Apr 29, 2006, 04:35 PM
This is great news for the Mac!
Let's be honest though, Video Games reached their peak with Super Mario Bros. 3, and have been on a downward spiral ever since.
I for one have found new ways to pass the time.
Solving non-linear Algebraic equations.
Visiting the sample trays at Costco several times each.
Making ice.
Growing beards.
I would now encourage the rest of you to give up these gaming flights of fancy and follow my example.

MrCrowbar
Apr 29, 2006, 04:56 PM
I for one have found new ways to pass the time.
Solving non-linear Algebraic equations.
Visiting the sample trays at Costco several times each.
Making ice.
Growing beards.
I would now encourage the rest of you to give up these gaming flights of fancy and follow my example.

True. Games are perfect for wasting time but you may find yourself addicted to them someday. Go outside, the graphics are amazing :p . I just play once in a while when I'm really bored and not creative. Maybe Macs have been the choice for creative people for a long time because there were no real games to distract you? I wonder...

blueimac'00
Apr 29, 2006, 05:37 PM
This is awesome! More games for mac, but will they still cost 50 bucks a pop?

blueimac'00
Apr 29, 2006, 05:38 PM
Glad to hear the continued support. Granted, I'm still much more in tune with my PS2 than anything else for games. Maybe if they port over Halo 2 or at least drop the price on the original Halo I'll start playing on my PowerBook (I don't feel like buying an XBOX).

You can get halo for 30 bucks on amazon. I hope thats helpful.

chrismcdowell25
Apr 29, 2006, 06:54 PM
Boot camp is only a trial and apple may not decide to support the full boot option forever. In leopard they may make it a virtualization tech and make it focus more on just running the apps WINE instead of running the full os. I have noticed alot of people looking into apple lately I work at geek squad and got almost the whole precinct thinking about a mac.

eXan
Apr 29, 2006, 07:34 PM
Awesome! :) No one better vote this a Negative...

lol there are negatives in to this news also :D

sushi
Apr 29, 2006, 07:41 PM
In a time when many game publishers and studios are taking a

<snip>

Destineer is the parent company of MacSoft and Bold, which have brought hit titles such as Halo: Combat Evolved and Zoo Tycoon 2 to Mac. Destineer has also recently developed an original title, Close Combat: First to Fight, which saw a simultaneous release for PC and Mac.
While not a gamer, this is great news for the Mac community. :)

sushi
Apr 29, 2006, 07:42 PM
lol there are negatives in to this news also :D
Someone always has to vote negative it seems.

eXan
Apr 29, 2006, 07:44 PM
Maybe Macs have been the choice for creative people for a long time because there were no real games to distract you? I wonder...

Hmm... good theory!

I wonder who I would have been now, if my computers were PCs?

Answer: just like all the rest :rolleyes:

The Dweeby Nerd
Apr 29, 2006, 08:47 PM
I just finished Halo--it's not the "latest thing" but it's a lot of fun--better than I expected. And SO much better with mouse aiming than the X-Box version. Consoles and 3D shooters will never mix for me.


That's right. Keyboard and mouse are essential. I can't even imagine myself playing 3D shooters on a console.

BenRoethig
Apr 29, 2006, 10:45 PM
That's right. Keyboard and mouse are essential. I can't even imagine myself playing 3D shooters on a console.

I've tried, it sucks.

steelfist
Apr 30, 2006, 04:02 AM
great news. just hope that their porting is better.

daveyjokes
Apr 30, 2006, 05:40 AM
Finally, some recognition that Macs give a nice gaming experience, when the right pressure is applied at the right place. If you know what I mean.

generik
Apr 30, 2006, 07:10 AM
Awesome! :) No one better vote this a Negative...

I'm on my way :D

aussie_geek
Apr 30, 2006, 05:35 PM
Being a Mac gamers this is excellent news!!


I can never understand how developers don't release games for Mac's. How many families out there now have Mac's?? How many kids are using Mac's now?? The idea of the Mac gaming is a niche market is dictated by the suppliers of games. If there were more to choose from you can guarantee both game and Mac sales. Imagine - a Mac for the lot - Music, photos, web, email, movies AND games. A very attractive offer for all of those out there that have their iPods and would like to have a Mac to go with it ;) ....

aussie_geek

alec
Apr 30, 2006, 07:53 PM
i love my mac games, even if it means waiting a few months extra (civilization 4 in a couple of months from aspyr). i still miss bungie though :)

nagromme
Apr 30, 2006, 09:28 PM
That's right. Keyboard and mouse are essential. I can't even imagine myself playing 3D shooters on a console.
The scary thing is, I know some computer gamers who play first-person shooters with ONLY keyboard. No mouse. No analog nuttin'! And they're good at it.

Then again, some people juggle geese.

Will_reed
May 1, 2006, 03:25 AM
Time to port hl2 :P

G.Kirby
May 1, 2006, 05:36 AM
With Intel’s in our box's we can at last have access to some great PC games. All my friends are playing Battlefield 2, which as gamers know is PC only....it makes me feel like a leper. :( There are some clever Mac users that have got BF2 to run on an Intel iMac in booted XP environment. If these guys can do it I am sure that the gods at Aspyr can do something, although it will NOT work on a PPC Mac no matter how hard you pray.

That said, the gaming future of Mac could be outstanding, bring it on!!!:D

BenRoethig
May 1, 2006, 09:23 AM
It would take a lot of money since Havok charges the same rate for a Mac port as the original PC game.

nagromme
May 1, 2006, 10:45 AM
It would take a lot of money since Havok charges the same rate for a Mac port as the original PC game.

Yeah, that's pretty amazing--do the folks at Havok really hate the Mac platform?

Havok has already been ported to Mac, but Havok has decided to charge an impossibly high licensing cost that no Mac game company could ever afford. The same cost, as you say, as the Windows version--which sells to a much larger audience. And Havok seems to have been standing firm on this "no Macs" policy for over a year now. It's hard to see how that choice would be "just business" for Havok.

Luckily Havok isn't the only physics system--and I think UT2007 will support more than one (like Aegia which is already in Mac games)--but it's a very popular one for now. (And I seem to recall other middleware charging on the same unfair Mac=Windows scale, and really hurting other games in the past. GameSpy maybe?)

http://www.insidemacgames.com/features/view.php?ID=351

"Today's second biggest threat to a healthy Mac gaming market is Havok (piracy, in case you were wondering, is the first), the physics game engine used by popular games such as Medal of Honor: Pacific Assault, Halo 2, and oh yes, Half-Life 2. In at least a few cases, a few Mac ports have been shelved because of a lack of a Mac version of Havok. Ever wonder why Deus Ex 2 never made it to the Mac? Havok. To make matters worse, upcoming games such as Age of Empires III and HellGate and possibly dozens of other games will be using Havok.

It takes no genius to see that the Havok problem is now dire. So, what exactly is said problem? Why isn't Havok available for the Mac? As you might expect, it comes down to money. According to industry sources, the folks at Havok want a six figure dollar amount for Havok Mac. The issue, of course, is that there's no way any Mac game publisher could afford this, especially when you consider that the Mac publisher has to pay a PC publisher the rights for a game. Imagine having to pay $50,000 for the Mac rights to a title, then having to turn around and pay $150,000 just to have Havok on the Mac (my dollar figures are just examples, folks, I don't know the actual numbers).

Ok, now here's the worst part of it. According to my sources, the Havok code is already available on the Mac. That's right. It's pretty much ready to go. Havok just needs to get paid. The issue at hand, it seems, is the amount of money Havok wants for their precious physics code."

G.Kirby
May 1, 2006, 12:40 PM
:eek: Thats a lot of cash (if only an esimate). The only thing that could make it worth while is if the number of Mac's sold doubles in the next year or so. I think there are a lot of if's at the moment. Just going to have to wait and see :confused: ...but if I wait much longer a may just get a gaming PC! (I feel dirty now, I need to wash!) :p

nagromme
May 1, 2006, 01:52 PM
:eek: Thats a lot of cash (if only an esimate). The only thing that could make it worth while is if the number of Mac's sold doubles in the next year or so.
If you're talking about Havok, it would need more than that! (But the Havok group COULD come to their senses.)

Just going to have to wait and see :confused: ...but if I wait much longer a may just get a gaming PC! (I feel dirty now, I need to wash!) :p
Do it! Just make sure it's a Mac :) New Intel Mac towers with top-end GPU options should be coming within a matter of months.

You could BYO gaming PC for cheaper... but then eventually you'll want a new Mac anyway. Combine the two purchases and you come out ahead in price AND convenience.

G.Kirby
May 1, 2006, 03:10 PM
If you're talking about Havok, it would need more than that! (But the Havok group COULD come to their senses.)

I hope so too. It all sounds a bit Microsoft to me :rolleyes:

Do it! Just make sure it's a Mac :) New Intel Mac towers with top-end GPU options should be coming within a matter of months.

You could BYO gaming PC for cheaper... but then eventually you'll want a new Mac anyway. Combine the two purchases and you come out ahead in price AND convenience.


I will need to wait until Quark and Adobe release their new software, Quark7 and CS3. Been having BIG problems with Intel Mac's at work and Quark6.5 and CS2 so I'm not quite ready to spend my hard earned just yet.....May be next year as my current Mac just turned one last week :D