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MacBytes
May 4, 2006, 10:33 AM
http://www.macbytes.com/images/bytessig.gif (http://www.macbytes.com)

Category: Opinion/Interviews
Link: Boot Camp is for chumps (http://www.macbytes.com/link.php?sid=20060504113308)
Description:: Jim Louderback goes on an anti-mac bender with this tirade. Among other things, he rails against Apple design and questions the intelligence of Mac users.

Posted on MacBytes.com (http://www.macbytes.com)
Approved by Mudbug

iGary
May 4, 2006, 10:39 AM
Don't get too excited about the whole Mac/Windows dual-boot thing. Although a wide range of starry-eyed experts—including some in our very own lab—have lauded Boot Camp (aka BC) in tones not heard since the days of OS/2, it's really nothing to get excited about. Here are my top reasons why—at least to real computer users—"Boot Chump" is a snore.

It's really "AKA" BC? Never heard that, or maybe you just made it up.

The more effete among us have embraced BC because now they can run all their favorite Windows apps on a saucy, sexy Mac. The underlying assertion embraced here is that Apple machines are just so much cooler than their PC counterparts. Hogwash. There are dozens of better-looking notebooks out there than those tired, industrial-looking iBooks and PowerBooks that dribble out of Infinite Loop. Want silver? Toshiba's razor-thin Portégé looks better and won't give you a hernia if you carry it around the corner. Acer's Italian-inspired lineup ranges from testosterone-pumping Ferrari red to svelte and sweet. Even Dell now has discovered red.

Uh....yeah. Red is cool. Much better than brushed aluminum and a luminescent white Apple logo - oh and a lit keyboard. That all is just for the fags.

http://www.itreviews.co.uk/graphics/normal/hardware/h601.jpg

or

http://koti.mbnet.fi/website/powerbook15/powerbook-19.JPG

And this is just dead sexxay:

http://www.madeforone.com/news/Dell_xps_gen2.jpg
What was I thinking? Now that the meds have worn off, let's take a closer look at how fast these BC machines really are. Sure, they run a Photoshop benchmark test as fast as or faster than Windows dedicated machines. But throw in anything needing fast graphics and you're SOL. The dual-core Mac mini uses shared memory for its anemic graphics, which will seriously eat into that default 512MB of RAM. Every time I see Boot Camp benchmark test scores, they come with caveats. Apple apologists give their favorite company more latitude than any other PC company on the planet—I just don't understand it. Substitute "Microsoft" or "Dell" for Apple in any of the recent reviews and a firestorm of bloggers would be criticizing the reviewer up and down the Web. Instead, the laurels just pile on higher and higher. But I digress. This brings me to the next reason you don't want Boot Camp….

So, how about mentioning something that runs liks ass because of the graphics...oh, you're just pulling stuff out of your poop chute again.

Sure, a Mac that runs Windows looks good on paper. But how do you know that that expensive scanner, graphics card, or sound device will actually work on a BC system? To be fair, USB and FireWire devices that work in Windows ought to work under BC. But what about add-in cards?

And he finishes off wih a nice healthy dose of FUD.

What a crap writer and a crap, non-researched article. My thirs-grade nephew could have written better content.

yellow
May 4, 2006, 10:44 AM
Nice..

Performance: [snip]

The dual-core Mac mini uses shared memory for its anemic graphics, which will seriously eat into that default 512MB of RAM. Every time I see Boot Camp benchmark test scores, they come with caveats.

Uhhh.. this is apple equivalent of an eMachine. Who uses and eMachine for "anything needing fast graphics"?

I declare this dude a FUDtard™.

iGary
May 4, 2006, 10:46 AM
Nice..



Uhhh.. this is apple equivalent of an eMachine. Who uses and eMachine for "anything needing fast graphics"?

I declare this dude a FUDtard™.

Oh, wait, Yeller, you should definitely get 60FPS out of a $600.00 machine, what are you retarded?

This dude is just pissed off because PC's are being rendered obsolete.

Even Rob is ready to switch with the introduction of "BC." (That's the AKA for Boot Camp, in case you are wondeirng.)

yellow
May 4, 2006, 10:51 AM
(That's the AKA for Boot Camp, in case you are wondeirng.)

LOL. I thought "BC" was for Boob Cups. Silly me! :)

gekko513
May 4, 2006, 10:53 AM
Even Rob is ready to switch with the introduction of "BC." (That's the AKA for Boot Camp, in case you are wondeirng.)
Despite your numerous issues with Apple hardware. That's a bit surprising.

Peace
May 4, 2006, 11:00 AM
Keep in mind all the old PC World folks like Louderback are paid employees of Ziff-Davis which we all know is a MS propaganda machine.

byokitis
May 4, 2006, 11:01 AM
In fact, I believe that most of today's societal ills can be either indirectly or directly attributed to Apple. Widespread hearing loss? Blame the iPod. Carpal tunnel? Blame the Newton. Upswing in hernias? That Infinite Loop idiot who decided to put a handle on the first iMac—and started the whole luggable trend

Good stuff.

lol

Eraserhead
May 4, 2006, 11:13 AM
Good stuff.

lol
Is this guy actually sane? That is the most irrational ********* I've ever heard ever.

I mean how seriously can Apple have by any stretch have caused the problems he describes?

He's a complete joke, worse than Dorvak.

me_94501
May 4, 2006, 11:24 AM
Want to ruin your credibility? Refer to a product by a major computer manufacturer ad "Boot Chump" and call users of it "suckers."

Someone must really be desperate for site traffic.

Silencio
May 4, 2006, 11:26 AM
The more effete among us have embraced BC because now they can run all their favorite Windows apps on a saucy, sexy Mac. The underlying assertion embraced here is that Apple machines are just so much cooler than their PC counterparts. Hogwash. There are dozens of better-looking notebooks out there than those tired, industrial-looking iBooks and PowerBooks that dribble out of Infinite Loop. Want silver? Toshiba's razor-thin Portégé looks better and won't give you a hernia if you carry it around the corner. Acer's Italian-inspired lineup ranges from testosterone-pumping Ferrari red to svelte and sweet. Even Dell now has discovered red.

"My laptop looks like a racing car!", he says in his best Kirk Van Houten voice.

http://reviews.zdnet.co.uk/i/z/rv/2004/05/acer-ferrari-350x330.jpg

Is anyone over the age of 14 supposed to be impressed?

What a bunch of hateful tripe. And this is the type of person who called Mac users "zealots", huh?

yellow
May 4, 2006, 11:27 AM
Want to ruin your credibility? Refer to a product by a major computer manufacturer ad "Boot Chump" and call users of it "suckers."

Hehehe, excellent point.

javierbds
May 4, 2006, 11:31 AM
Why?
Maybe because all switchers have already got their almost mandatory XP license?
Maybe because Leopard is going way better than Vista?
Maybe because a Mac is a better PC (Vista won't support EFI)?
Maybe because a Mac does not follow Redmond's sw views?
Maybe because we do not need to buy two machines but just an Apple one?
Maybe because offices can now buy iMacs?
Maybe because OS X gets updated every year vs every 3 or more years for Win?
...
I do not know:
Maybe because this guy is so lonely that needs some spamming?

Who knows?

I have a feeling Vista is too big a Cathedral for Microsoft ... The structure could collapse :)


I think it is because we can now see with our own eyes the real maintenance costs of Windows...
On the same machine, same hardware, same person, same policies ... (RCO) real cost of ownership is going to be experienced easily by anybody !

dejo
May 4, 2006, 11:44 AM
Performance: Some idiot wrote recently that "Apple now makes the fastest Windows machines on the planet." What was I thinking? Now that the meds have worn off...

OMFG! He then links to his own blog. So he admits to everyone one that HE is that idiot. And we're supposed to take the rest of the article seriously? [mencia]"Dee-dee-dee"[/mencina]

DUCKofD3ATH
May 4, 2006, 12:01 PM
I expect better from the guy who started the TopFive list and is one of its Hall of Famers. It's not very funny, but who cares?--the hit counters will be ringing "Ka-Ching!" from all the outraged Mac users who'll read the article.

I'm guessing it was deadline time and, since there's not much going on in the PC world except for what Apple's doing, Louderback tossed off this piece in five minutes, submitted it and hustled out of the office in time to make Happy Hour at the local pub.

So it's a win-win for him. He makes his deadline with a stream-of-consciousness opinion piece, PC Mag gets hits galore, and they get to poke a stick at rabid Mac zealots! Even better, they can say afterwards "Sheesh, can't you guys even take a joke?!"

war
May 4, 2006, 12:03 PM
Why is it that if a mac site writes an article like this but against something from the usual combo of MS/PC company then they are some sort of mac zealot. Now that it is a PC company writing this about a mac it is "respectable" reporting and comparison. I just think the double standard is rather amusing. Gheesh, these are the same people that wonder why we get so annoyed at such obvious bias.

yellow
May 4, 2006, 12:06 PM
Even better, they can say afterwards "Sheesh, can't you guys even take a joke?!"

Let's hope he doesn't quit his day "job" then..

KREX725
May 4, 2006, 12:12 PM
"My laptop looks like a racing car!", he says in his best Kirk Van Houten voice.

http://reviews.zdnet.co.uk/i/z/rv/2004/05/acer-ferrari-350x330.jpg


As soon as I saw this "high class" Acer Ferrari merchandise was being sold through walmart.com I knew the gig was up. Wasn't Acer the company that tried the ugly "shotgun blast" hole design on their greenish gray towers back in the mid-90s? Yeah, there was some style for the likes of Jeff Foxworthy. :p

macFanDave
May 4, 2006, 12:16 PM
Don't waste your time on this POS. It's the same old crap recycled again. Not a single interesting or original point in the whole steaming turd.

I would have liked to see an article that says that you should use a Mac to run OS X and you are a poor, unfortunate chump if you have to resort to using Boot Camp.

Mord
May 4, 2006, 12:33 PM
dammit i just wrote a corrective email to him, the funny thing is that allot of articles are as bad as his to the fact that it does not look like satire.


DAMN YOU dvorak, DAMN YOU.

TwitchOSX
May 4, 2006, 12:36 PM
He talks about being ripped off by Apple because its more expensive. Then he states you have to pay a couple hundred extra for Windows. Uh.. yea.. lets see. Buy a Macbook. Might pay a little more .. might not depending on what your comparing it to. Then buy Windows. STILL CHEAPER THAN BUYING AND LUGGING AROUND 2 COMPUTERS IDIOT!

What a fuggin tard.

Dagless
May 4, 2006, 12:37 PM
Haven't read the article :) but iGary's first post just said it all. Then the other posts cemented this guys insanity.

I knew you got raving fanboys online but having their work actually published? wow.

bobdgil
May 4, 2006, 12:52 PM
As soon as I saw this "high class" Acer Ferrari merchandise was being sold through walmart.com I knew the gig was up. Wasn't Acer the company that tried the ugly "shotgun blast" hole design on their greenish gray towers back in the mid-90s? Yeah, there was some style for the likes of Jeff Foxworthy. :p
You can carry this beauty around too! It's only 6.3 lbs for a 15". No hernias there...;) I know someone with an Acer. Trust me, they look BETTER than they actually ARE on the inside.

winmacguy
May 4, 2006, 02:07 PM
If the various brands of PC are so cool why is it that the Apple logo is often covered with tape or photoshopped out when shown in 'product placement' on lots of TV shows like The Nanny, Boston Legal?
Fortunately you can see the Apple logo on many of the Macs used in the FBI forensics show 'Bones'. I have never seen a PC manufacturers logo covered over or photoshopped out.:D

dejo
May 4, 2006, 02:13 PM
If the various brands of PC are so cool why is it that the Apple logo is often covered with tape or photoshopped out when shown in 'product placement' on lots of TV shows like The Nanny, Boston Legal?
Fortunately you can see the Apple logo on many of the Macs used in the FBI forensics show 'Bones'. I have never seen a PC manufacturers logo covered over or photoshopped out.:D

The reason is that the companies producing these shows expect payment from the companies whose logos they feature on their shows. It's called a product placement fee. Since Apple does not, and has never AFAIK, paid such fees, the producers choose to cover up the Apple logo rather than give Apple free advertising.

steve_hill4
May 4, 2006, 02:15 PM
I sell both Macs and PCs on a daily basis and the Macs are the only machines I truly feel that if I had at home, I would feel comfortable using. Especially on the laptop front. The others feel okay for 5 minutes, but try using them all the time and then compare to a MacBook.

This article may try to look at things from a balanced and objective point of view, but the writer is so blinkered to the PC world, he doesn't realise when he is just penning another advert for Redmond.

alexprice
May 4, 2006, 02:16 PM
You can carry this beauty around too! It's only 6.3 lbs for a 15". No hernias there...;) I know someone with an Acer. Trust me, they look BETTER than they actually ARE on the inside.

Better than a MacBook?:eek:

alexprice
May 4, 2006, 02:17 PM
Also..... http://www.itreviews.co.uk/discuss/1629

Blue Velvet
May 4, 2006, 02:21 PM
I'll be smart, fit, and enjoying my real Windows computers...

Steve Ballmer also recently made a remark about preferring 'real' PCs.

Is this the beginning of a party line spun from Redmond? 'Real' computers?

alexprice
May 4, 2006, 02:25 PM
Steve Ballmer also recently made a remark about preferring 'real' PCs.

Is this the beginning of a party line spun from Redmond? 'Real' computers?

Are they saying that Mac's are fake or something?

Blue Velvet
May 4, 2006, 02:30 PM
Are they saying that Mac's are fake or something?

More like implying that Macs are insubstantial toys with a whiff of dilettantism about them unlike those honest working-joe Windows machines.

mkrishnan
May 4, 2006, 02:35 PM
Is anyone over the age of 14 supposed to be impressed?

Well, the red is a *little* much, as is the gratuitous sportscar linkup. But I still have to say, by Windows standards, that's a relatively good looking laptop. Which isn't saying much, granted.... :o

ctango
May 4, 2006, 02:35 PM
Wow.
I love this article, it made me laugh and cry. I laughed at the comments about his confidence in his PC (" ... I want everything to work right. I have some confidence that peripherals and software will work on my PCs ..." ). I cried though because I have a degree in Journalism, and this wasn't it. It is sad to see what should be considered a leading trade magazine resort to mud throwing.

I don't know. I don't want to boot Windows from my Macs, just not my style. So I can't play all the games in the world. Maybe I'll just read a book or go play outside with my kids. I also feel like I don't need to write anymore or get on a soap box.

But that's just me.

BKF
May 4, 2006, 02:35 PM
More heat than light, as the saying goes. Lazy way to write a column.

steve_hill4
May 4, 2006, 02:46 PM
I see that the Acer is a perfect PC laptop then. Problems galore.

We rarely have Apple laptops return with genuine problems after the first month of their guarantee, (we offer two, so enough time to go wrong), but these kind of PC laptop problems are common. Not writing discs, overheating, faulty power unit, hard drive failure etc.

As it stands at the moment, I would always avoid PC laptops myself. Desktops can be okay, but there seems to be so much mofre to go wrong on a laptop.

MacBoobsPro
May 4, 2006, 03:05 PM
"My laptop looks like a racing car!", he says in his best Kirk Van Houten voice.

http://reviews.zdnet.co.uk/i/z/rv/2004/05/acer-ferrari-350x330.jpg

Is anyone over the age of 14 supposed to be impressed?

What a bunch of hateful tripe. And this is the type of person who called Mac users "zealots", huh?

The guy obviously knows **** all about design either.

So lets recap... he can't write, he doesn't research, he likes laptops made by Tonka and thinks a laptop adorned by a Ferrari badge is cool. My conclusion? Hes a dumbass!

And i didnt even waste my time reading his drivel! How cool am i? :D

EDIT: I have seen an Acer laptop upclose and they are made from paper and twigs. If you pick one up it sort of sags where its not supported, the build quality and materials are absolute "hogwash"

MacBoobsPro
May 4, 2006, 03:06 PM
"My laptop looks like a racing car!", he says in his best Kirk Van Houten voice.

http://reviews.zdnet.co.uk/i/z/rv/2004/05/acer-ferrari-350x330.jpg

Is anyone over the age of 14 supposed to be impressed?

What a bunch of hateful tripe. And this is the type of person who called Mac users "zealots", huh?

The guy obviously knows **** all about design either.

So lets recap... he can't write, he doesn't research, he likes laptops made by Tonka and thinks a laptop adorned by a Ferrari badge is cool. My conclusion? Hes a dumbass!

And i didnt even waste my time reading his drivel! How cool am i? Well not very because I havent got a Ferrari tattoo. :rolleyes:

EDIT: I have seen an Acer laptop upclose and they are made from paper and twigs. If you pick one up it sort of sags where its not supported, the build quality and materials are absolute "hogwash"

winmacguy
May 4, 2006, 03:17 PM
The reason is that the companies producing these shows expect payment from the companies whose logos they feature on their shows. It's called a product placement fee. Since Apple does not, and has never AFAIK, paid such fees, the producers choose to cover up the Apple logo rather than give Apple free advertising.
Thanks dejo I wasn't aware of that. I'll stop pointing it out to my wife now:rolleyes: :eek:

zephead
May 4, 2006, 03:27 PM
As it stands at the moment, I would always avoid PC laptops myself. Desktops can be okay, but there seems to be so much mofre to go wrong on a laptop.

I know exactly what you mean. I have some plastic and metal thrown together (a.k.a. a Dell) for a laptop, and when I got it I had not been enlightened by the Mac world yet, so I thought it was pretty cool. Now, my keyboard randomly stopped working a month ago, and I have to use up a USB port for a separate one, and I can barely have iTunes and Firefox running at the same time (with random freezes here and there that last probably 2-3 minutes). I've been ACHING for an Apple portable since before the Intel revolution.

jbcaro
May 4, 2006, 03:42 PM
and pc's are for chimps, and tricks are for kids.

BenjyD
May 4, 2006, 03:52 PM
He's seriously putting Acer in the same league as Apple? Bloody hell. I own an Acer laptop (8104) and the build quality is terrible. Nothing quite goes together, the shift key has fallen off, the power button is playing up, the keyboard sucks, it looks like crap and the ports are all in annoying positions. Hence the fact that I'm typing this on a 17" Intel iMac.

me_94501
May 4, 2006, 03:56 PM
Why is it that if a mac site writes an article like this but against something from the usual combo of MS/PC company then they are some sort of mac zealot. Now that it is a PC company writing this about a mac it is "respectable" reporting and comparison. I just think the double standard is rather amusing. Gheesh, these are the same people that wonder why we get so annoyed at such obvious bias.
Have you seen the response from Mac users regarding Dvorak's "MS is dead in the water" article yesterday? By and large from the comments I've seen, Mac users disagree with his assessment.

We're a less biased lot than you might think.

Mainyehc
May 4, 2006, 04:31 PM
Ladies and Gentleman, before I say what I'm about to say, let me just get this straight: I'm a moderate Apple fan; I've used PCs for more than 12 years, and even though I love Apple gear, I don't "fail" to acknowledge its shortcomings, both in hardware or software; But I'm über-proud of one, ONE thing: the fact that I actively KNOW both sides of the fence, and I'm also, thus, very demanding towards others, (that is, I expect other people to at least TRY to have informed opinions and not spread FUD all over the place). That being said, the only thing I have to say about this is:

DO NOT FEED THE TROLL. *EAT* THE TROLL!! (alive, preferrably :p )

Yours sincerely,
The usually harmless Apple Fan.

Gus
May 4, 2006, 04:32 PM
One more thing: BETA

Boggle
May 4, 2006, 04:38 PM
That article isn't about not liking a piece of technology but hating the people who invented it, those who believe in it, and anybody who knows somebody who might want to use it.

Jim Louderback's next article title, "Steve Jobs: First against the wall when the revolution comes."
I get the feeling he keeps an industrial cleanser close at hand b/c of all the spit he gets on the display as he types.

josepho
May 4, 2006, 04:58 PM
As I read that article, I was nearing the end when I was still thinking "wow, this couldn't be any more boring, a completely worthless read". As I reached the last paragraphs, I realised that perhaps the author had re-read what he'd written so far and come to the same conclusion -- hence decided that he'd spice things up by adding some sprinkings of "lemmings", "chums", general "let's provoke those Mac zealots (read: let's give people a reason to link to this page)".

By the end of the article, he has clearly failed to deliver his promise of telling us why Boot Camp is a bad idea. Personally, I can see its benefits, although in my two years plus of sole-Mac using (except at work) I have never had the occasion to say "I wish I had a Windows box", so it wouldn't help me.

me_94501
May 4, 2006, 04:58 PM
Are they saying that Mac's are fake or something?
It's the same old "Macs are toys" rhetoric PC users have been spewing for the last 22 years.

And yet people use Macs to do some real heavy lifting (pro media, UNIX stuff, etc..). Go figure.:rolleyes:

swajames
May 4, 2006, 05:44 PM
Well, Jim Louderback (in his first couple of months as editor of PCMag) has managed to do something that even Dvorak, at his most insane and outrageous, never quite achieved over the last few years, which is to prompt me to call up and cancel my PC Magazine subscription.

aussie_geek
May 4, 2006, 06:05 PM
meh - didn't bother reading any further than when he started talking a mac mini being not fast enough to run windows at full speed....

seriously, why would you buy anything else than a Macintosh at the moment. You have OSX Tiger and Windows XP in the one sleek package at your disposal...

Apple really needs to push this and then they will start to move more hardware. Hopefully Leopard will have all this built in and we will see the Mac's fly off the shelves like back in the late 70's :p.


aussie_geek

matthew24
May 4, 2006, 06:10 PM
I am afraid that Jim Louderback like many other Windows sufferers have a kind of 'Ich habe es nicht gewust' syndrome if it comes to the 'quality' of Windows compared to OS X. :eek: :eek:

mvc
May 4, 2006, 06:12 PM
...and we will see the Mac's fly off the shelves like back in the late 70's :p. aussie_geek

There were no Macs in the late 70's :cool:

wmmk
May 4, 2006, 06:14 PM
It's the same old "Macs are toys" rhetoric PC users have been spewing for the last 22 years.

And yet people use Macs to do some real heavy lifting (pro media, UNIX stuff, etc..). Go figure.:rolleyes:


exactly. i don't know any kids at school who run acpache, hack (in a good way, only on my own files), and program on their peecees.
geez.

btw, THINKPADS ARE SO FRACKING UGLY!
http://www.zdnet.com.au/shared/images/tandb/ibm_thinkpad_t42_200x150.jpg
:regurgitates at sight of ugly peecee:

DeathChill
May 4, 2006, 06:16 PM
That article isn't about not liking a piece of technology but hating the people who invented it, those who believe in it, and anybody who knows somebody who might want to use it.

Well, this is basically what Mac zealots do to Windows (Winblows) and Microsoft(M$, Microsuck, etc) and I don't see anyone complaining.

However, this guy is just a moron. A hilarious moron. I don't think he can REALLY believe the crap he spews.



seriously, why would you buy anything else than a Macintosh at the moment. You have OSX Tiger and Windows XP in the one sleek package at your disposal...

Well, if you need upgradability there's definitely no point in buying a Mac. A sleek package is nice but certainly not a requirement for a working computer.

As well, is it REALLY time for people to be complaining about build quality of PC laptops when the Macbook Pro's have had numerous problems and are now having their batteries recalled? I'd say that it's fairly funny how people DO complain about the Macbook Pro, but if it was a Dell laptop (certain models are actually quite good quality) people would be attributing it to how crappy a company Dell is. Just a funny little fact.

Silencio
May 4, 2006, 06:35 PM
btw, THINKPADS ARE SO FRACKING UGLY!
http://www.zdnet.com.au/shared/images/tandb/ibm_thinkpad_t42_200x150.jpg
:regurgitates at sight of ugly peecee:

Please. As far as PC laptops go, they are completely inoffensive. That, and they're actually incredibly well engineered and put together -- I'd place them ahead of Apple on those criteria, even if Apple laptops have more truly useful multimedia features and are thinner/lighter/better looking. We have a ThinkPad T43 and it rocks. If only it ran Mac OS X in a supported configuration...

mkrishnan
May 4, 2006, 07:19 PM
Please. As far as PC laptops go, they are completely inoffensive. That, and they're actually incredibly well engineered and put together -- I'd place them ahead of Apple on those criteria, even if Apple laptops have more truly useful multimedia features and are thinner/lighter/better looking. We have a ThinkPad T43 and it rocks. If only it ran Mac OS X in a supported configuration...

I think Thinkpads are like Elvis Costello glasses...like a counter-style icon. And I can't help but love them. I'm happy Apple, but if I had to go Windows, that's where I would be. :)

TwitchOSX
May 4, 2006, 08:22 PM
<i> think Thinkpads are like Elvis Costello glasses...like a counter-style icon. And I can't help but love them. I'm happy Apple, but if I had to go Windows, that's where I would be.</i>

Are you serious? I hope your joking. Thinkpads are bricks. Ugly bricks at that.

If I ever bought a PC laptop it would most likely be a Sony VAIO or however you spell it.

Actually, I was at Costco the other day and was looking around (didnt know they sold Macs!) and saw a windows laptop. It was running and was fairly small.. probably around the size of a 12" Powerbook.. so I picked it up. I was like WTF? It felt like it was solid plastic.. It felt like a 8 year old's toy! It was light as hell.. and actually had an optical drive (which surprised me due to its light weight) but still.. the thing was trash. Didnt look at the price.. I was still thinking about the Mac Mini's for sale (WITH 3 year Applecare warranty for no charge it looked like).

mkrishnan
May 4, 2006, 08:48 PM
Are you serious? I hope your joking. Thinkpads are bricks. Ugly bricks at that.

No, I'm not. I don't think the Thinkpad is pretty in and of itself. But the physical design represents years of honing by IBM top make the thing reliable, consistent, and bombproof, to a greater extent than almost anything else out there. And their design *is* distinctive. That was the point I was making... that I think their look wins me over because it speaks to what they've done in terms of practical design and engineering....thus the Elvis Costello analogy. ;)

Dane D.
May 4, 2006, 08:50 PM
What a waste of my time, I should send him a bill for taking 4 mins of my time. He sounds like a insecure women talking about supermodels. God I wish I didn't read that. Hope his life is fulfilling using Windows ie. installing and running anti-whatever ware, looking for drivers, hoping that latest MS patch doesn't cause a crash or worse, open more cans of worms, wishing he could run mulitple apps without crashing or slowing down, re-installing the system often (after re-formatting of course) and generally wasting his time using a second rate OS and associated apps. Add him to the last of jealous PC users.:)

TwitchOSX
May 4, 2006, 09:22 PM
No, I'm not. I don't think the Thinkpad is pretty in and of itself. But the physical design represents years of honing by IBM top make the thing reliable, consistent, and bombproof, to a greater extent than almost anything else out there. And their design *is* distinctive. That was the point I was making... that I think their look wins me over because it speaks to what they've done in terms of practical design and engineering....thus the Elvis Costello analogy. ;)

Wow.. I seriously thought you were joking. OK.. I admit I have never been around a Thinkpad.. or any other IBM laptop.. (that I knew of) but still.. if its built strong and sturdy.. its still a brick compared to an Apple laptop. I would assume (not actually holding a thinkpad) but look at the thing? Its not skinny, its not pretty.. it might work well, but IBM is not known for building the best PC's in the industry. They just do their thing and stay out of the way. Thats cool. I dont have a beef with IBM. They built Apple processors for a long time so thats cool but they will always be a PC company and just dont get "it".

Anyway.. wtf am I talking about? I dont care.. no need for a PC/Mac flamewar here! I just dont like the Thinkpads. They look overdone and cheap to me.

iamhammill
May 4, 2006, 09:55 PM
"Don't get too upset you missed the AAPL run over the last year. It'll come down eventually."


That's in my outbox right now.


What a joke.

gekko513
May 4, 2006, 10:08 PM
http://www.zdnet.com.au/shared/images/tandb/ibm_thinkpad_t42_200x150.jpg

I thought that picture of a Thinkpad was an outdated picture from the mid 90's, so I went to Lenovo to see how they look now, and to my shock I found that the picture posted here is current.

That's almost too ugly to be true.

Silencio
May 5, 2006, 03:28 AM
OK.. I admit I have never been around a Thinkpad..

And yet you feel you know enough to endlessly pontificate on the subject of All Things Thinkpad. Perhaps you ought to actually see one and touch one in person before you embarass yourself further.

I haven't used all of their different series, but have pretty extensive experience with both the T- and X-series, and I'd say both are pretty solid examples of why IBM has had the long-held reputation of making the best PC laptops around. They look plasticky in pictures, but it's an interesting matte "grippy" surface that resists scratches and surface damage very nicely. They have solid magnesium chassis and just don't feel as "precious" as the AlBooks. They're not inundated with unnecessary colors or design flourishes, unless you don't like the red pointer-thing and the different colored keys on the keyboard -- and no laptop has a better keyboard than the Thinkpads do, period.

That said, I wouldn't ever trade my 12" Powerbook for an X-series: I prefer laptops with everything built-in instead of having the detachable docks that can be left behind when you need them most.

mkrishnan
May 5, 2006, 08:53 AM
Anyway.. wtf am I talking about? I dont care.. no need for a PC/Mac flamewar here! I just dont like the Thinkpads. They look overdone and cheap to me.

Sorry, you're quite right. I'm sorry for inciting. ;) Although it looks like the fight is going on without us! :(

Seasought
May 5, 2006, 11:21 AM
Dvorak's grinning mug is settled next to him over on the right.

Fitting.

Stridder44
May 8, 2006, 05:01 AM
I guess that makes me a chump then!

SPUY767
May 8, 2006, 08:16 AM
exactly. i don't know any kids at school who run acpache, hack (in a good way, only on my own files), and program on their peecees.
geez.

btw, THINKPADS ARE SO FRACKING UGLY!
http://www.zdnet.com.au/shared/images/tandb/ibm_thinkpad_t42_200x150.jpg
:regurgitates at sight of ugly peecee:

I read ya, they are ugly, but to be honest, they are one of the best built PC Laptops. Also, scientists have proven that people who think up cutsie acronyms are morons.