Quick 17" MBP review

[eAspenwood]

I've been working on it for almost 24 hours, here's a quick list of my impresions:

good -

- no whine
- heat is same or less as my old 15" powerbook. definitely less hot than my buddy's 15" MBP.
- feels snappy (opening and navigating in finder, sys pref is faster than pb)
- not noticeable weight difference when I carry it in my backpack
- NICE SCREEN

bad -

- noticeable weight difference when I carry it in my hand. (worth it in my mind)
- mouse clicker rubs on side a little (hopefully this will "break in")
- latch and closing clearance not as well done as on powerbook.
- sleep mode takes a little longer to engage when I close the lid I think.

Thats all I have for now. Overall, I am very please so far (knock on wood).

-- J.

[Blue Velvet]

What's the most demanding task you've done on it and how well did it run? Tried any video editing or something similar?

[eAspenwood]

couple things:

1) Compiled about 250 java classes via IntelliJ a few times today. Smoking fast.
2) Imported 40GB worth of music and 20GB worth of pics via FW800. As fast as expected.
3) played 5 mpegs via quicktime simulatneously just for fun. No jerkiness.

[King A]

- sleep mode takes a little longer to engage when I close the lid I think



maybe this has something to do with the safeslepp feature.
this was online available in the latest pb revision and on the mbps.

before going to sleep it writes its memory onto the harddrive for example when you switch batteries.

[Blue Velvet]

I think I'll be buying one around this time next year. It's time to ditch the tower... it'll be interesting to see what specs may be in store for May-July 2007.

[Benjamindaines]

maybe this has something to do with the safeslepp feature.
this was online available in the latest pb revision and on the mbps.

before going to sleep it writes its memory onto the harddrive for example when you switch batteries.
Nope that can't be it, I was playing with the newest version of the 17" PB right before the MBP came out and it went to sleep instantly when the lid was closed. Maybe it has something to do with Rosetta shutting down.

[King A]

Nope that can't be it, I was playing with the newest version of the 17" PB right before the MBP came out and it went to sleep instantly when the lid was closed. Maybe it has something to do with Rosetta shutting down.

yeah, but your signature pb doesn't nativly support safesleep.
i don't own a 17" mbp but my 15" mbp needs a while before it goes to sleep

[citi]

yeah, but your signature pb doesn't nativly support safesleep.
i don't own a 17" mbp but my 15" mbp needs a while before it goes to sleep

I believe it's the x86 architecture that requires the lag time. Powerpc laptops were the only ones that went to sleep on a dime. I also have a 2006 IBM thinkpad and it needs like 20 seconds to go to sleep. (I was more impressed that a windows machine could go to sleep without taking 5 minutes like the old ones use to!)

[Benjamindaines]

yeah, but your signature pb doesn't nativly support safesleep.
i don't own a 17" mbp but my 15" mbp needs a while before it goes to sleep
No no no, the one in the Apple Store, not mine. Mine takes a bit.

[MovieCutter]

The Speakers On This Thing Rock!!!!

[slick316]

Thats what I was wondering, the speakers.

I have mine on order, and one of the things I liked after reading the specs was that the speakers are more powerful. I use my 15" PB at work and try to watch movies on it, but the speakers aren't loud enough for me to hear (in my office, there is a server that has some loud fans, but thats as noisy as it gets).

I am hoping that the 17" MBP has speakers powerful enough that I can watch DVD's without need of external speakers.

Any comparison on how much louder the 17" MBP is over the previous model PB's?

[Stowned]

The Speakers On This Thing Rock!!!!

Oh yes, yes they do indeed... :cool:

[NVRsayNVR]

I think I'll be buying one around this time next year. It's time to ditch the tower... it'll be interesting to see what specs may be in store for May-July 2007.


Me too! My 1.67 GHZ is just now a year old and still working and looking good though I wish I had more horse power. I can wait for things to smooth out and get even faster by then...And maybe even with a new ultra cool enclosure. :cool:

Thanks for the early report eA!



"Think Alike....BE Different!"

[Transeau]

I got mine this morning!

Everything looks and sounds perfect. No whine, closes correctly, audio is perfect (10x better than my PowerBook and 15" MBP)

Weight isn't bad. It's still lighter than my Dell D810 15"

Only complaint (so far) is that one of the screws for the memory cover had SOOO much lock-tight on it I nearly stripped the head. Insted the head snapped off. The other three were fine, a bit of pressure and they released.

Doing a clean install now.

Temps above the F Keys is better - 104.7F / 40.7


Edit: One problem, the display is too loose. tilting the notebook causes the display to close.

[joshwest]

So does everyone agre a clean install is beneficial? if so ill do it when i get home to my MBP

[bazotic]

I'm going to be getting mine soon. Why is everyone doing a clean install? What does it get rid of?

[Transeau]

*sigh* 3 hours in and it just started whining and getting pretty hot (119F above the F keys)

[entropy1980]

*sigh* 3 hours in and it just started whining and getting pretty hot (119F above the F keys)
Ae you sure it's the whine and not just the fan? Have you heard the whine on the 15"?

[eAspenwood]

A couple updates now that I've been using it for a couple days:

- lid build quality issue 1 - when I pick it up with the lid closed, the lid is somewhat loose and it gets knocked out of sleep mode sometimes.

- lid build quality issue 2 - no longer can I lie down and type w/ the keyboard on my lap, cuz the lid will slide closed if it is angled any less than vertical. Transeu mentions this too. Anyone know if 17" PB's did this too? I'm thinking the lid might just be too heavy compared to the 15".

- noise - when plugged in, there is a faint buzzy whine type sound that I heard this morning when everything was quiet. oh well, not too bad.

Well, these issues are annoying but by no means show-stoppers for me. My 15" Rev D had issues too (faulty latch and hard drive made a kerplunk noise frequently). Its a speedy development box for what I do (java mainly). My G5 has become unneccesary and is getting ebayed. :).

[kiwi-in-uk]

...
- lid build quality issue 1 - when I pick it up with the lid closed, the lid is somewhat loose and it gets knocked out of sleep mode sometimes.

- lid build quality issue 2 - no longer can I lie down and type w/ the keyboard on my lap, cuz the lid will slide closed if it is angled any less than vertical. Transeu mentions this too. Anyone know if 17" PB's did this too? I'm thinking the lid might just be too heavy compared to the 15".

...
- My 17"PB sometimes gets knocked out of sleep mode when I carry it around (lid closed) with one hand.
- the lid also slides closed when I have it on an angle - anything over (say) 30º to 40º

I'm following these posts with interest - I'll be in the market for a couple of new Macs in the next 12 months - certainly a Mini, and I'm wondering about whether to get an iMac, a tower, or another 17" laptop.

[entropy1980]

- noise - when plugged in, there is a faint buzzy whine type sound that I heard this morning when everything was quiet. oh well, not too bad.



ok this is not sounding good. Looks like the 17" may have the same whine from the 15" MBP. Anyone have a whiny 15" now have a 17" to compare it with?

[bazotic]

Ok, it's whining. But is it mooing too? That is the more important question.

[Stowned]

My 17" MBP is VERY quiet... Had one issue with the right latch not going in all the way but now it seems it has fixed itself. I took it to the nearest Apple store, about an hours drive away and the guy wrote me up a report and gave me a case number I can use in case it starts acting up again, other than that this things is the most wonderful machine I have ever owned. Runnin WoW blazingly with the graphics settings UP UP UP! Having the best time with my first Mac.:D

[ipearx]

- lid build quality issue 2 - no longer can I lie down and type w/ the keyboard on my lap, cuz the lid will slide closed if it is angled any less than vertical. Transeu mentions this too. Anyone know if 17" PB's did this too? I'm thinking the lid might just be too heavy compared to the 15".

Yeah, my 1.33GHz PowerBook has always had a loose hinge, useless for putting on knees while lying down. Part of the problem is the screen doesn't bend back enough, to keep it vertical.

I wonder if some are simply stiffer than others? Or maybe it's just the 17"ers? My friends 15" PowerBook has a much stiffer hinge.

[Mechcozmo]

yeah, but your signature pb doesn't nativly support safesleep.
i don't own a 17" mbp but my 15" mbp needs a while before it goes to sleep

I tried that at an Apple Store. The 15" MBP, with a few apps open, just died. I closed the lid, waited for sleep, and then yanked the battery. When I put it back in, it required a restart (not just waking form sleep as the G4s could) and then entered the fresh login state.

Not good. Major step backwards, IMO. My friend's 15" G4 can go to sleep and then we play catch with the battery. The MBP is supposed to be 4x faster, which it is, but also takes a few steps back along the way.

[iHeartTheApple]

- lid build quality issue 1 - when I pick it up with the lid closed, the lid is somewhat loose and it gets knocked out of sleep mode sometimes.

- lid build quality issue 2 - no longer can I lie down and type w/ the keyboard on my lap, cuz the lid will slide closed if it is angled any less than vertical. Transeu mentions this too. Anyone know if 17" PB's did this too? I'm thinking the lid might just be too heavy compared to the 15".

I have the latest rev.E 17" PB and my screen is very tight. I can position it at any angle between "almost closed" to vertical and it stays where it is...This could be a troubling issue if it turns out to be common. I can't imagine that the isight would add enough weight to cause this to happen. :(

[Transeau]

Another update for mine. 12 hours of running with with random reboot and cooldown times (My random, not the notebook's) the whine is gone.

There is a faint hiss while it's plugged in, but it's very acceptable.

The screen is still closing on me if I tilt it too much. Apple Techs have me going into the local Apple Store (Rancho Cucamonga) tomorrow evening to have it tightened. The phone support feels that it is a very simple fix.

The display quality is beautiful. Just as bright as the 15" MBP.

Sound quality it great! It's by far the best that I have heard out of an Apple notebook, and second only to one that I have heard. (I can't remember the brand, but it was HUGE with a Bose speaker system)

Thermal wise it is better than the MBP'15. It could be the fact that there is more surface area to disapate the heat. The core temp hovers around 45~48C while idle and light use, and topped out at 79C with both cores at full load. The fans have still not turned on.

Build quality is fair. The only complaint that I have so far is that the edges are not smooth. The grey plastic around the edge is not flush with the case.

I will post more after the Apple Techs fix the screen.

[neutrino23]

Yeah, my 1.33GHz PowerBook has always had a loose hinge, useless for putting on knees while lying down. Part of the problem is the screen doesn't bend back enough, to keep it vertical.

I wonder if some are simply stiffer than others? Or maybe it's just the 17"ers? My friends 15" PowerBook has a much stiffer hinge.

My 15" PB Al 1.25 had a squeaky hinge that didn't move smoothly. When I sent it in for repair of the white spot problem they also worked on the hinge. After it came back the hinge worked beautifully. If the display flops over and you care about that I suggest sending it back for adjustment.

[daneoni]

The last revision of the PBs (Hi-Res) and the new MacBook Pros all support safe sleep and all take a while to actually sleep because as someone said the computer writes to the memory first before shutting down which takes about 5 seconds give or take

[richinspace]

There is a faint hiss while it's plugged in, but it's very acceptable.
My PB15" also used to have this faint hissing noise when plugged in (disappeared immediately when running on battery). At the same time the entire casing of the computer felt static. The problem continued for about half a year until the day the screen fried. After repair at Apple (new screen) both static and hissing were gone.

I'm afraid the hissing is a bad sign which may be related to a grounding problem, and eventually may wear sensitive components down. In my case the static was so annoying at times that I actually shaved off the tiny hair on the side of my hands that touched the computer.

[witness]

In my case the static was so annoying at times that I actually shaved off the tiny hair on the side of my hands that touched the computer.

That's extreme loyalty :)

[MainStreeter]

I'm into day 3 working on my new 17" MBP... and no whine here at all. Quiet as a mouse. But man, does this thing get hot. Like you-could-fry-an-egg-on-it hot. I haven't seen/felt a 15" that people were complaining about, but it sounds like the heat issue is pretty darn similar.

I can't help but feel like this level of heat can't be good for the machine. But I'm far from an expert.

I also have seen noticeable slow-downs on Rosetta apps. Nothing major, but slight delays in typing, etc. even in Word/Excel. Interestingly, Quark/InDesign run at about the same speed they were on my PowerBook G4 Titanium.

[eAspenwood]

I guess the faint "buzzy whine" I hear when plugged in could more aptly be described as a "hiss", as Transeau calls it. I only really notice it when my room is quiet. It goes away when I unplug or I run something that pegs the cpu.

[entropy1980]

Well so much for the "17" won't have the hiss theory". Looks like I hold onto my money for a while until next rev and see what problems they have. Thanks Apple :rolleyes: .

[hidea]

I got my MBP yesterda


so far

I have no display problems, it's beautiful!
it does get bloody hot, like.. HOT when I plug it onto a poweroutlet, being charging and such. I can probably heat up dinner with this kind of heat. it doesn't burn my skin tho. but it's too hot to handle by hand

it does whine a bit... like the fan. but for most of the time, its been quite.

[eAspenwood]

Just noticed the speakers are awesome. Also, the right click from the track pad might be one of my favorite features so far. Ah, the simple things....

[Slakerr]

Just noticed the speakers are awesome. Also, the right click from the track pad might be one of my favorite features so far. Ah, the simple things....

how do you right click with the trackpad ?

[eAspenwood]

from sys prefs, enable "tap trackpad using two fingers for secondary click". only works on 17mbp, not 15mbp (for now i hope).

[Slakerr]

I have a 15" Powerbook and right clicking with the trackpad would be so usefull right now :)

[eVolcre]

Just noticed the speakers are awesome. Also, the right click from the track pad might be one of my favorite features so far. Ah, the simple things....


The speakers really are fantastic. But the screen just didnt' seem as bright and awe inspiring as the MBP15 I sent back.

As a portable presentation tool for quick sales meetings in an office where you can't get a projector it is going to be AMAZING.

eV

[absurdio]

Another update for mine. 12 hours of running with with random reboot and cooldown times (My random, not the notebook's) the whine is gone.

There is a faint hiss while it's plugged in, but it's very acceptable.

The screen is still closing on me if I tilt it too much. Apple Techs have me going into the local Apple Store (Rancho Cucamonga) tomorrow evening to have it tightened. The phone support feels that it is a very simple fix.

The display quality is beautiful. Just as bright as the 15" MBP.

Sound quality it great! It's by far the best that I have heard out of an Apple notebook, and second only to one that I have heard. (I can't remember the brand, but it was HUGE with a Bose speaker system)

Thermal wise it is better than the MBP'15. It could be the fact that there is more surface area to disapate the heat. The core temp hovers around 45~48C while idle and light use, and topped out at 79C with both cores at full load. The fans have still not turned on.

Build quality is fair. The only complaint that I have so far is that the edges are not smooth. The grey plastic around the edge is not flush with the case.

I will post more after the Apple Techs fix the screen.

I keep reading these posts with a little bit of disappointment (I expect the best from apple). Only then I remember that I'm still using a 15" Tibook. 1Ghz G4, 1Gb ram, frequently loud, terrifyingly hot, mediocre speakers, and screen glitches pretty regularly. Sweet.

Now I just wait for merom. perhaps by then (august, i hope?), apple will have sufficiently adressed the heat, the whine, etc. Also, maybe by then I'll actually have the requisite three grand. :p

[friedymeister69]

How are you people checking your core temperature? I have a 17" iMac 1.83ghz 1.5gb ram and I have been using all the widgets and apps I have seen and none of them will give me the processor temperature, they only tell me the hard drive temperature.

[jagolden]

>>I keep reading these posts with a little bit of disappointment (I expect the best from apple). Only then I remember that I'm still using a 15" Tibook. 1Ghz G4, 1Gb ram, frequently loud, terrifyingly hot, mediocre speakers, and screen glitches pretty regularly. Sweet. <<

Yeah, I'm a little dissapointed too. Looking foward to the 12" MPB.
My 15" 867Ghz Ti still runs very smooth and quiet - never hot.
This even after a long drop to tile floors in the airport last year (slipped out it's case).

Also have a 12" 1st gen icebook. Love the form factor and size. No problems even though it falls in a problem serial number range. Folks with the 17" say they get envious looks over the screen size. I get envious looks when traveling from people lugging the others around.

May get the 15" MBP but really want to be able to compare it to the 12" first.

[jagolden]

>>Looking foward to the 12" MP<<

OOPS!
12", 13" - whaterver it takes.

[Mechcozmo]

Also, the right click from the track pad might be one of my favorite features so far. Ah, the simple things....

iScroll 2 has been doing that for quite a while now... :D

The last revision of the PBs (Hi-Res) and the new MacBook Pros all support safe sleep and all take a while to actually sleep because as someone said the computer writes to the memory first before shutting down which takes about 5 seconds give or take

No, no, no, no, NO! Don't try this with unsaved work!

The G4 PowerBooks have a kinetic battery inside them, to keep them in sleep mode for about a minute or so without the battery. The 15" and 17" versions, and the Titanium revision before them, but not the 12" PowerBook, have this feature.
At an Apple Store I tried the same thing with a 15" MacBook Pro. After yanking the battery the computer did NOT stay in sleep. The G4s kept their white lights on to show they were still asleep-- the MacBook Pro's light went out.

[61132]

the mbp's have safe sleep. If you take out the battery while the mbp is sleeping, then reinstall it, turn the computer on, it will show a progress bar, and boot to your original screen. I do agree though, dont sleep any computer without saving your work!!!

[Transeau]

I keep reading these posts with a little bit of disappointment (I expect the best from apple). Only then I remember that I'm still using a 15" Tibook. 1Ghz G4, 1Gb ram, frequently loud, terrifyingly hot, mediocre speakers, and screen glitches pretty regularly. Sweet.

Now I just wait for merom. perhaps by then (august, i hope?), apple will have sufficiently addressed the heat, the whine, etc. Also, maybe by then I'll actually have the requisite three grand. :p

At this point I would tell everyone to avoid the Mac book Pros - both sizes.

I took my 17" MBP into the Apple Store as per the Phone Support's request to have the hing adjusted. The "genius" (moron?) said that there was nothing wrong with it. The manager (guy acting as manager, the manager is on vacation) told me that.... wait for it... "The MacBook Pro's were not designed to be used on anything other than a flat desk." and get this... "If you need it to stay open when laying in bed, then maybe you should return it and buy an iBook."

Next he told me that the MacBook Pro's are designed differently and the NONE of them will stay open when at an angle. So I walked over to a 15" MacBook Pro and held it at a 90 degree angle, so the display was parallel with the counter. He responded "I get your point, but the 17" is designed to close." I asked to show me where it says that it was designed to do that.

He became very annoyed with me by this point, so I told him that I would take up his attitude with the General Manager and walked out.

Time for another letter to Steve. It worked for my 15" MBP, I suppose it will work again.

[Transeau]

Okay - I fixed it myself!
it wasn't exactly simple, but not too hard either. Now I can have the notebook at a 90 degree angle from the desk, and the LCD will stay open. What I did was this;

1) I followed the iFixIt.com guide to removing the upper case.
2) Removed the 4 screws from each side of the tension springs. (two screws on each side of the hing - closest to the edge of the notebook.
3) support the display and remove the 6 remaining screws supporting the display. (3 on each side, 1 long one and 2 shorter ones)
4) Once the display is free, I used a small torch to heat the spring and twisted the end of the spring AWAY from the screen. You will need to heat it up enough to bend the steel. You should get it final resting posisition about 10 ~ 15 degrees.
5) Put it back together.

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE
If you try this - PLEASE be carefull!!!! If you hold the torch at the wrong angle YOU WILL DAMAGE THE LCD!!!

----

Side note - Interesting fact - The 17" MacBook Pro has 4 speakers.

[Multimedia]

Okay - I fixed it myself!
it wasn't exactly simple, but not too hard either. Now I can have the notebook at a 90 degree angle from the desk, and the LCD will stay open. What I did was this;

1) I followed the iFixIt.com guide to removing the upper case.
2) Removed the 4 screws from each side of the tension springs. (two screws on each side of the hing - closest to the edge of the notebook.
3) support the display and remove the 6 remaining screws supporting the display. (3 on each side, 1 long one and 2 shorter ones)
4) Once the display is free, I used a small torch to heat the spring and twisted the end of the spring AWAY from the screen. You will need to heat it up enough to bend the steel. You should get it final resting posisition about 10 ~ 15 degrees.
5) Put it back together.

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE
If you try this - PLEASE be carefull!!!! If you hold the torch at the wrong angle YOU WILL DAMAGE THE LCD!!!

Side note - Interesting fact - The 17" MacBook Pro has 4 speakers.Wish you had taken a picture of both speakers on each side while it was open. So the tweeters are below the woofers off picture?

I doubt anyone else here will follow your instructions. Who else here even has a blow torch in their home? :confused:

I am shocked at the Apple Store employees' attitudes. Unbelieveable! :eek:

[Transeau]

Wish you had taken a picture of both speakers on each side while it was open. So the tweeters are below the woofers off picture?

I doubt anyone else here will follow your instructions. Who else here even has a blow torch in their home? :confused:

I am shocked at the Apple Store employees' attitudes. Unbelieveable! :eek:

I did :)
It's not the clearest pic, but it works.
http://www.elliejean.com/djoyce/MacBookGuts.jpg

[Multimedia]

When I sit down in front of my 17-inch MacBook Pro, the screen is brighter in areas, hazy in others, and overall unevenly backlit. I tried to take some photos to describe what I am talking about. You'll see the darker haze on the right side, and a little on the left. The area where the dock is noticeably brighter than the rest of the display. Perhaps I am being a little too picky, but I don't know if this is normal. I don't see this problem on my 17-inch PowerBook G4 1.5GHz.

Images:
http://homepage.mac.com/davehagan/macbook17a.jpghttp://homepage.mac.com/davehagan/macbook17b.jpgOh NO. Not Again. This was a huge problem for the early original Rev. A Aluminum 15" 1.25 GHz G4 PBs in September-December 2003. I remember it vividly because I was one of the victims. Thousands were. I can't believe they let it happen again. :eek: :mad: :(

Thanks for the complete inside photo Transeau.

[Mechcozmo]

the mbp's have safe sleep. If you take out the battery while the mbp is sleeping, then reinstall it, turn the computer on, it will show a progress bar, and boot to your original screen. I do agree though, dont sleep any computer without saving your work!!!

I tried that. It didn't work. The Apple Tech in store tried it. It didn't work.

Can someone on MacRumors try it? I'd love to be proved wrong as Apple made a colossal mistake by removing the kinetic battery and relying on "Safe Sleep" to sell Macs. Doesn't sound too terribly impressive to say, "It'll die, but don't worry-- hope that it saved everything to the hard drive beforehand and it will start up again correctly afterwards!"

[famarm]

I did :)
It's not the clearest pic, but it works.

Thanks for the interesting picture ;)

Ciao

[61132]

I tried that. It didn't work. The Apple Tech in store tried it. It didn't work.

Can someone on MacRumors try it? I'd love to be proved wrong as Apple made a colossal mistake by removing the kinetic battery and relying on "Safe Sleep" to sell Macs. Doesn't sound too terribly impressive to say, "It'll die, but don't worry-- hope that it saved everything to the hard drive beforehand and it will start up again correctly afterwards!"

I tried it on my mbp, worked fine, showed the progress bar when I reinstalled the battery and turned it on.

[hidea]

yeah, I have that problem with the screen as well, but i don't really mind it all that much.

My biggest problem is that the lid doesn't close up properly. there's a HUGE gap betweeen the CPU and my screen. It's atleast 30mm. It's uneven closed.

Should I take it back to apple?

[Multimedia]

yeah, I have that problem with the screen as well, but i don't really mind it all that much.

My biggest problem is that the lid doesn't close up properly. there's a HUGE gap betweeen the CPU and my screen. It's atleast 30mm. It's uneven closed.

Should I take it back to apple?Am I the only one here who thinks that is a GOOD THING? You don't want the screen to touch the keyboard. It will scratch the screen. Perhaps I don't understand what you are trying to describe with words. Would you take and post a picture of your problem please?

[cnakeitaro]

Am I the only one here who thinks that is a GOOD THING? You don't want the screen to touch the keyboard. It will scratch the screen. Perhaps I don't understand what you are trying to describe with words. Would you take and post a picture of your problem please?

Maybe there is a gap in between the cpu and screen when closed which could allow dust and crap to get in there....?

[MovieCutter]

Maybe there is a gap in between the cpu and screen when closed which could allow dust and crap to get in there....?

Take care of your stuff, put it into a decent case and you don't have to worry about getting crap in there. Seriously folks, I just don't understand you people. A 3mm "gap" is a cause for concern which only occurs when you're not using the thing and it's off, in a bag, or on your desk? WTF!!!???

[Multimedia]

Take care of your stuff, put it into a decent case and you don't have to worry about getting crap in there. Seriously folks, I just don't understand you people. A 3mm "gap" is a cause for concern which only occurs when you're not using the thing and it's off, in a bag, or on your desk? WTF!!!???I have a 2.6 year old 1.25 GHz Aluminum G4 PowerBook. I always carry it in a Marware case (http://www.marware.com/intro.php). Whenever I pack it to move, I put the ORIGINAL FOAM SHIELD that came with it on top of the keyboard after putting a iKlear keyboard cover and trackpad cover (http://iKlear.com) directly on each. Then I slip the PB into the ORIGINAL FOAM ENVELOPE that came with it before putting it into the Marware case (http://www.marware.com/intro.php). Why toss out the protective foam that comes with your MacBook?

I keep both foam parts stored in the Marware case and both are still in like new condition.

[hidea]

well, here's the problem.

The lid closes, but, the left side of it is higher than the right side. So, it's slanted. Sorry, it wasn't 40mm, it was more like 5mm, so almost half a centimetre, maybe less. But the left side is higher than the right side, with the middle part actually attached to the latch, holding the LCD and keyboard together. but basically, if you apply pressure to the left side of the screen.. it bouches, but the right side doesnt bounce as much as the left side.

I know there's suppose to be a bit of EVEN gap. mine is uneven.

[Multimedia]

well, here's the problem.

The lid closes, but, the left side of it is higher than the right side. So, it's slanted. Sorry, it wasn't 40mm, it was more like 5mm, so almost half a centimetre, maybe less. But the left side is higher than the right side, with the middle part actually attached to the latch, holding the LCD and keyboard together. but basically, if you apply pressure to the left side of the screen.. it bouches, but the right side doesnt bounce as much as the left side.

I know there's suppose to be a bit of EVEN gap. mine is uneven.Definitely call Applecare and arrange for a repair.

[eAspenwood]

well, here's the problem.

The lid closes, but, the left side of it is higher than the right side. So, it's slanted. Sorry, it wasn't 40mm, it was more like 5mm, so almost half a centimetre, maybe less. But the left side is higher than the right side, with the middle part actually attached to the latch, holding the LCD and keyboard together. but basically, if you apply pressure to the left side of the screen.. it bouches, but the right side doesnt bounce as much as the left side.

I know there's suppose to be a bit of EVEN gap. mine is uneven.

Mine has the same exact problem. Sometimes it gets knocked out of sleep mode, sometimes not. No time to return to apple. Gotta get some work done.

[hidea]

Mine has the same exact problem. Sometimes it gets knocked out of sleep mode, sometimes not. No time to return to apple. Gotta get some work done.


well, mine isn't as severe as yours. It will still be sleeping.

Edit:

I JUST GOT THE WHINE! lol. I'm laughing, this is comedical, too funny to be pissed off at apple's quality control.

[Transeau]

The squeaky wheel got the oil again!

After the Apple Store told me that my display not supporting itself, and tech support wouldn't replace it - Apple's Exec Relations is sending me an advanced replacement for my MBP17. I should have my new one in 5~7 days. Here's hoping that the next one is perfect.

[eAspenwood]

I'm getting a replacement too.

The accidental awake from sleep issue was driving me nuts. Got home after a 30 minute biking commute yesterday, and the MBP was red hot cuz it was had turned on in my backpack.

Should see a replacement in about a week.


-- J.

[eVolcre]

I'm getting a replacement too.

The accidental awake from sleep issue was driving me nuts. Got home after a 30 minute biking commute yesterday, and the MBP was red hot cuz it was had turned on in my backpack.

Should see a replacement in about a week.


-- J.


Are you going for the glossy screen? I just changed my order ...

eV

[eAspenwood]

Yeah, I considered doing that but I think I'll just stick with non-glossy. I'd be concerned with getting a glare/reflection. Last thing I want to do I stare at myself all day. But I haven't researched if that's a real issue or not.

Any pro's to going glossy?

-- J.

[Mechcozmo]

I tried it on my mbp, worked fine, showed the progress bar when I reinstalled the battery and turned it on.

An Apple Store Genius assured me that the MacBook Pros do have Safe Sleep. He also said that the MacBooks have it. I'm not sure why my test failed, but it is nice to hear from an 'official' source that the MacBooks support it.

[bbrosemer]

Transeau CAN YOU please confirm 2 things for me being that my 17'' MBP is on its way.

1.) By some miracle is the CPU socketed.
2.) Is there a thermal paste issue.

[iHeartTheApple]

Are you going for the glossy screen? I just changed my order ...

eV

I figure no one has gotten ahold of a 15" or 17" MBP with the glossy screen yet, but when they do...let this post serve as a reminder that you've gotta tell us what you think! :D I'm pretty sure I don't want my 17" MBP to be glossy, but I'd like to hear from others. Great thread so far, btw! :)

[Transeau]

Transeau CAN YOU please confirm 2 things for me being that my 17'' MBP is on its way.

1.) By some miracle is the CPU socketed.
2.) Is there a thermal paste issue.

The CPU is still soldered in. The notebook is just too thin to fit another 1/4" for the socket, and the thermal paste issue is up for debate...

yes, there is a LOT of paste on there - however, it DOES NOT cause the heat problem. My 17" MacBook Pro 2.167GHz runs at about 37~43c under light use. As a matter of fact, I've been using it for nearly 3 hours on my lap without any discomfort. Try not to freak out about the thermal paste - the only physical problem with it would be if the heat pipes are not applying enough pressure to the chips. I've been a computer engineer for close to 15 years now, and I know that the #1 cause of overheating is lack of pressure between the two surfaces.. Think about it - if the heat pipes WERE NOT working, would the bottom of the notebook get so hot? That's what it was designed to do. The bottom casing is a heat sink. That is the reason that Apple has a thermistor attached to the bottom of the case. In this case, it's really just a matter of making use of the CPU's C1E sleep state, as well as the EIST. (Flame me if you must, but you can't dispute the 37~43c idle temp, while mine has just as much thermal paste as the rest.)

For those with heat issues, i strongly urge you to 1) do the SMC firmware update (this will make the fans come on sooner, and alter the CPU SpeedStep settings) and 2) use InCrew's SpeedIt kext (http://www.increw.com/open_source/speedit_kernel_extension/speedit.html). (The .5 release will help get you to the 35~37 range)

Bottom Line - no worries. The 17" runs much cooler, and quieter than the 15" out of the box. My 15" (yes, I have both) runs much cooler now after the SMC update. and the BOTH run much cooler while using InCrew's SpeedIt (http://www.increw.com/open_source/speedit_kernel_extension/speedit.html).

edit:
Oh Yeah! After a letter to Mr Jobs, and a fax to the Executive Relations Department, Apple is sending me a replacement for my 17". It seems that the top execs feel that it is in fact defective! The LCD should in fact be able to support it's own weight and remain vertical while the base of the notebook is at a 30~45º angle. When the notebook reaches 90º the LCD should close to about 30%, it should NEVER close completely on it's own. (Contrary to the tech at the Apple Store who said that ALL 17" MacBook Pro's would close if they were not on a flat surface)

[absurdio]

Oh NO. Not Again. This was a huge problem for the early original Rev. A Aluminum 15" 1.25 GHz G4 PBs in September-December 2003. I remember it vividly because I was one of the victims. Thousands were. I can't believe they let it happen again. :eek: :mad: :(

Thanks for the complete inside photo Transeau.


Are you thinking this is the same as the "white spots" issue? It may well be, I have no idea. I just ask because my TiBook (the very last of the Tibooks, just weeks before the aluminum PBs) got a pretty foul case of the white spots, and I had to send it in for service. But in that case, the white spots were much more pronounced/isolated and less like a gradual unevenness across the whole screen. I hadn't heard of the "hazy" screen issue, but man, I hope they get all this isht figured out by the time the Merom editions are ready to roll. :o

[absurdio]

The G4 PowerBooks have a kinetic battery inside them, to keep them in sleep mode for about a minute or so without the battery. The 15" and 17" versions, and the Titanium revision before them, but not the 12" PowerBook, have this feature.


...is there a defensible reason Apple got rid of the kinetic battery feature? Seems like an awfully poor choice...

[bbrosemer]

Thanks for the info!!!

[Mechcozmo]

...is there a defensible reason Apple got rid of the kinetic battery feature? Seems like an awfully poor choice...

Safe Sleep is the new thing. Now, assuming it goes correctly, your 'book will be asleep until it gets a new battery, whereas before it only had ~1 minute. I see the advantages, but I'm a bit leery of it since I couldn't get it to work. YMMV.

(Fun trick now, BTW. Put your 'book to sleep, pull out the battery, and then put it back in. Next time you want to use your 'book, press the Power button. Like hibernation, but different)

[iHeartTheApple]

For those with heat issues, i strongly urge you to 1) do the SMC firmware update (this will make the fans come on sooner, and alter the CPU SpeedStep settings) and 2) use InCrew's SpeedIt kext (http://www.increw.com/open_source/speedit_kernel_extension/speedit.html). (The .5 release will help get you to the 35~37 range)

Bottom Line - no worries. The 17" runs much cooler, and quieter than the 15" out of the box. My 15" (yes, I have both) runs much cooler now after the SMC update. and the BOTH run much cooler while using InCrew's SpeedIt (http://www.increw.com/open_source/speedit_kernel_extension/speedit.html).

Transeau, this is good to hear! But I still have a question regarding the firmware update and the SpeedIt fix...Do these *only* tell the fans to come on earlier or do the actually throttle back the CPU speed? If they *do* throttle back the CPU speed does that mean that we would expect to see a decrease in the overall performance of the computer because it's not operating at its full speed? I don't know much about this stuff, but I seem to remember hearing that somewhere... :o :(

Also, congrats on getting Apple to replace your MBP! Here's to hoping it's flawless this time! :)

[Transeau]

Transeau, this is good to hear! But I still have a question regarding the firmware update and the SpeedIt fix...Do these *only* tell the fans to come on earlier or do the actually throttle back the CPU speed? If they *do* throttle back the CPU speed does that mean that we would expect to see a decrease in the overall performance of the computer because it's not operating at its full speed? I don't know much about this stuff, but I seem to remember hearing that somewhere... :o :(

Also, congrats on getting Apple to replace your MBP! Here's to hoping it's flawless this time! :)


The SMC Firmware (15" MBP Only - The MacBook's and The 17" MBP already have it) Changed the fan settings. They now come on much sooner, and appear to be load based. I hear the fans in my 17" come on quite often now. ANd it rally doesn't bother me at all.

SpeedIt is a kernel based version of what the MacBook (pro)'s Firmware already does, but it is more inteligent. The Firmware simply enables the CPU's EIST & C1E functions in fully automatic mode. SpeedIt takes this a several steps more and actively manages the CPU's thermal system. The fans are still controlled by the firmware, but the CPU's EIST, C1E and ACPI throttling are active insted of passive. The new version (0.5) allows the use to set the idle threshold. I know my 17" is always using about 1.5~3% cpu time. By default the CPU thinks this is enough activity to bring the CPU to 2.16GHz. My feeling is that anything less than 5~7% IS IDLE. A torrent does not need 2.16GHz.. 1GHz is just fine for that. Also, SpeedIt makes use of the CPU's VID Throttling too. That is, the CPU is allowed to not only drop down to 1GHz, but also drop the core voltage to .9v insted of 1.4v This will cool it WAY down (about 35~37C) as well as add time to your battery.

[eAspenwood]

Transeau - did you get your replacement 17" already? Was the hinge still loose? My replacement just shipped from Shanghai this morning.

[eVolcre]

Transeau - did you get your replacement 17" already? Was the hinge still loose? My replacement just shipped from Shanghai this morning.

Me too. Our laptops must be on the same flight. :)

eV

[Wano]

I got my 17" yesterday and have been using it almost the whole time since. The screen brightness is a little uneven but not enough to be annoying, it does get hot above the f keys, but just like my 12" powerbook got hot in other places, the hinge is fine, and no noise! It is super quiet, even less than my old 12" powerbook. This is a great machine and compared to what people are complaining about I have not experienced anything that I should be concerned about.

[xPismo]

Safe Sleep is the new thing.... Fun trick now, BTW. Put your 'book to sleep, pull out the battery, and then put it back in. Next time you want to use your 'book, press the Power button. Like hibernation, but different)

Yeah, I guess. But why does this do really for the user? I can't think of a reason for having my battery out for over a min... and I never ran into a problem before. So other than being a cool trick someone thought of, how is this better for the user experience? I don't get it.

[DeVizardofOZ]

Just talked to a couple of people here in Beijing.
One has a 17" PB and will have the 5th (FIFTH) screen changed! Others have all the issues described in diverse forums here. When NOT ALL have problems it simply means that QUALITY CONTROL on a manufacturer level stinks big time. It is APPLE's responsibility to fix this quick otherwise they lose customer confidence, and that is harder to fix than hardware quality....:(

To release a product with faulty hardware- parts, heat issues, etc. means screwing the customer. That has actually been the style of Microsoft where millions of paying customers had to do the R&D after paying good money. and spend millions of man hours to get faulty software working... I am an advocate for a class action lawsuit by Windows application users sueing for compensation of at least 10 hours per year per customer. In addtition I vote for sueing Microsoft for spying on customers by transmitting information from personal equipment to MS on a continuous basis

THAT cannot be the style of APPLE CORP. Especially not when challenging WIN based users to switch to OSX and APPLE hardware.

:D