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View Full Version : Japan ain't takin' no *****


LethalWolfe
Feb 13, 2003, 10:59 PM
Japan has warned it would attack North Korea if it had evidence Pyongyang was preparing to launch ballistic missiles, Defense Minister Shigeru Ishiba has said. (http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/asiapcf/east/02/13/nkorea.nuclear/index.html)


Lethal

rice_web
Feb 13, 2003, 11:05 PM
This could be funny. I wouldn't be surprised to see both Japan and China attack North Korea with territory on their minds.

uhlawboi80
Feb 13, 2003, 11:56 PM
considering that N Korea gets 80% of its aid from china i would think china could just stop giving it to them and take them over if they really wanted :p

melchior
Feb 14, 2003, 04:52 AM
i'd like to see them pass the referendum in japan to change the constitution first.... that'll be the day

bokdol
Feb 14, 2003, 08:04 AM
have you guys thought about why northkorea hates japan. how about how when japan invaded korea and china. killing thousand torturing raping and doing expiraments similar to the nazi in germany. china would probably be happy if northkorea and japan went to war. then china would become probably the number one economic superpower

bokdol
Feb 14, 2003, 08:09 AM
not that i am saying that northkorea has a right to launch an missle.(i think they are crazy) but please dont praise the japanese for their actions. the japanese are just as bad as any other. they just hide it better in cute little small packages. and videogames:p

Dont Hurt Me
Feb 14, 2003, 08:16 AM
Japan is not the country they were 60 years ago,( Thanks to the U.S. ) They have allready had the crazy korean shoot a missile over their coast. I think this is good that they let that crazy bastard no they arent playing. Also where are those commies ( russia and china ) in all this. you would think they would be saying to N. korea stand down or else. But these so called freinds of ours have basically done nothing! We pump billions into the ussr and china yet at every oppertunity to show freindship with freedom/peace loving countries they stick with Saddam and the crazy Korean! Are these really our friends?

irmongoose
Feb 14, 2003, 08:19 AM
This is actually very weird.. and interesting. In the past, Japan has stuck to realpolitiks... I mean seriously, their self-defense force SUCKS (trust me about that)... and Japan seemed to realise that and say 'We can't do anything about it... so what's the point in complaining? It just might make N. Korea even more mad...' But now, with this kind of statement, they seem to be doing the exact thing they were refraining from doing before... very interesting.

Seems to me N.Korea is more of a threat than Iraq.. there seems to be new evidence that they have nuclear weapons strong enough to hit the US West coast... and with them it's pretty damn clsoe to sure that they have the weapons, but with Iraq it's more like they may be able to make some... Anyways, if N.Korea attacks, it'll most probably be Tokyo.. heh, well I am NOT moving out!




irmongoose

bokdol
Feb 14, 2003, 09:27 AM
i think the only reason japan is standing tall is that they believe north korea is just bluffing. which i do think they are. and i realy dont think northkorea would ever attack american soil. (it would be the compleate and total end of them). in my view north korea just wants to be a big dog. seem by other contries as a power. but in the pas they were always put down compared to their communist brothers. i think they are taking a chance in this unstable time to get noticed. doing a good job at it too. as a threat worse the then iraqies i really dont think they are. i think they are more desperate for power and survival. think about this. you see your nieghbor with the newest hottest stuff around and you have allways driven a pinto. how would you feel. then your other niehbors laugh at you. now you have a chance to buy a dodge viper. what do you do. it does not mean your going to break the speed limit but it well get you noticed.

hummm maybe that was not the right way to put it but eh.. close enough

Kid Red
Feb 14, 2003, 11:00 AM
What gets me is Japan's non agressor polociy since we bombed them in WW2. They wouldn't help in Afganistan but the did provide ships. So to see someone who has led a 'we don't want to fight' policy for 60 some odd years to say they would strike first is pretty funny. Not in a 'ha ha whatever' way but in a 'ha ha holy ****, you pissed them off' way.

Groovsonic
Feb 14, 2003, 11:32 AM
Originally posted by bokdol
. then china would become probably the number one economic superpower

Umm... no. Remember the USA? Ya know, that big country with all of the money? Have you ever heard the economic saying "If the US sneezes, the world catches a cold"? China is too backward (for now) to be THE superpower at anything, except population.

macfan
Feb 14, 2003, 12:17 PM
It wasn't Japan's choice not to have a military policy. We (the US) kind of told them what they would do with that when we wrote their consitution. However, I wouldn't underestimate them if I were North Korea, they do have a significant self defense budget, very good equipment, and one can only expect that they are well trained. They also have a very powerful ally in the United States.

melchior
Feb 14, 2003, 12:21 PM
they spend the 3rd highest money on their "self defonse force" in the world.

they have equipment. what they don't have is constitutional freedom (compared to the american, bomb the **** out of everything, i can have a loaded hand gun in my hand when i open the door policy)

bousozoku
Feb 14, 2003, 06:19 PM
The Koreans are some of the toughest people in the world. The Mongolians went through Korea, the Chinese, the Japanese...all on the way to conquest. The Koreans have survived as has their dignity. Put nothing past them. China is more than happy to have North Korea do their bidding and North Korea is happy to get their pay check for doing it.

I would be extremely surprised if my people, the Japanese, would strike Korea in aid of the U.S.A. because of the U.S.A.'s continuing restriction on them. It's interesting to note the U.S. Congress opinion of Japan, when they didn't offer to fight, as well as their ignorance of what happened in World War II. Japan only spends big money on SDF to keep defence manufacturing going.

Of course, it some of those missiles from Korea hit Washington and Oregon would I really mind?

Okay, yeah, I suppose so...what about just Redmond?

melchior
Feb 14, 2003, 07:21 PM
Of course, it some of those missiles from Korea hit Washington and Oregon would I really mind?

won't they hunt you down a put you in cuba, wearing a black hood for saying stuff like that? patriot act and all....

topicolo
Feb 14, 2003, 09:11 PM
Originally posted by melchior
they[China] spend the 3rd highest money on their "self defonse force" in the world.


That's not saying much at all, considering the fact that the US spends more money on their military than the next 10 greatest spenders COMBINED. (The US spent over 320 Billion in 2002 on defense while the next highest, spent around 60-70 billion).

topicolo
Feb 14, 2003, 09:26 PM
Originally posted by Dont Hurt Me
Japan is not the country they were 60 years ago,( Thanks to the U.S. ) They have allready had the crazy korean shoot a missile over their coast. I think this is good that they let that crazy bastard no they arent playing. Also where are those commies ( russia and china ) in all this. you would think they would be saying to N. korea stand down or else. But these so called freinds of ours have basically done nothing! We pump billions into the ussr and china yet at every oppertunity to show freindship with freedom/peace loving countries they stick with Saddam and the crazy Korean! Are these really our friends?

Japan is still really the same country they were 60 years ago, when they killed about as many Chinese as Hitler killed Jews. At the time, they believed that they were superior to all the other ethnic groups and they saw themselves as destined to rule the world (sound familiar?).

They didn't think the Chinese, the Koreans, and the Russians deserved their land so they set out to take Korea and China by force. The Japanese murdered and raped hundreds of thousands of Koreans, forcing many young girls to become prostitutes. They later attacked China and massacred entire cities. In Nanjing alone, they KILLED 300,000 people, beheading them, using them for target practice, and even as guinea pigs for horrible medical experiments. They even had BEHEADING CONTESTS to see who could behead the most Chinese prisoners, with the final score printed in the paper (the "high score" was over 100 people).

This even happened to american POWs. Japanese doctors experimented on the POWs by shooting them in the stomach, and then they "practiced" battlefield medicine on their writhing bodies. They also injected seawater into their veins to see how much they could take before dying. It was sickening. To this day, I still can't understand why and how a human being can be driven to do such despicable acts. The Massacre (http://www.missouri.edu/~jschool/nanking/Table/table.htm) (warning graphic images).

Today, the Japan is still one of the most racist countries in the world. I don't want to stereotype and lump all Japanese people into the same group, but ask any non ethnic-japanese person living in japan and they'll tell you the special racial slurs they get called occasionally.

EDIT: grammar errors

TMay
Feb 14, 2003, 09:52 PM
...the U.S. has pledged to defend Japan and the Japanese constitution only allows a defensive force, all of which came about because Japan's many neighbors were afraid of Japan repeating its WWII conquests.

It is also true that China will launch a manned spacecraft, probably by next year, and are working on their own stealth aircraft to come online in about 8 years. They have the population, and an agressive education system that puts out about 700,000 engineers a year, and are determined to not only be a manufacturing power, but have begun a program to create leading edge industries. While China may not be a military superpower in 20 years, they will probably, with Asia, dominate the world's economy. The US will find it more and more difficult to fund expensive military programs to maintain its superpower status, if our already less than stellar economic progress continues.

On the Koreans. They are tough fighters, on both sides, but the proximity of Seoul to the partition, and the weaponry and forces that could be brought to bear on South Korea, make a US military move risky.

bokdol
Feb 14, 2003, 10:00 PM
Originally posted by Groovsonic


Umm... no. Remember the USA? Ya know, that big country with all of the money? Have you ever heard the economic saying "If the US sneezes, the world catches a cold"? China is too backward (for now) to be THE superpower at anything, except population.

sorry meant number one asian superpower

bokdol
Feb 14, 2003, 10:04 PM
also another note on japan. their government has actually taken out that part of their history so their children would never know what they did. just think if in american the american government said slavery did not happen and all the historybooks had it removed. if you were black how would you feel. now think how the koreans and chinese feel. just a side note japan is not as wonderful as some people may think.

ttfan
Feb 14, 2003, 10:22 PM
I am a Japanese Mac user. I am deeply sorry about the rude comment made by Bosozoku, who claims to be my fellow countryman. (By the way, "Bosozoku" means a motorcycle gang, one of the most antisocial groups in Japan. Probably he does belong to it.)

To be honest, I was somewhat surprised by this thread because you generally have a good understanding of Japan. I didn't expect American people know the Japanese constitution.

I admit Japan invaded Korea and China sixty years ago. But we apologized for those invasions to South Korea and China. Both of them accepted our apology. It is totally unfair to call the contemporary Japanese as "as bad as others."

I can supply some information about the quality of SDF. A few years ago, a military journal in Japan evaluated the strength of SDF. Their conclusion: SDF could beat the South Korean army. Well, the comparison was not made with the North Korean army. But, SDF is not so bad.

Russian military experts believe the North Korean long range missles are aimed at Okinawa, where major US bases are located. A Japanese expert confirms this story from the technical point of view of the globe's axis. Probably that's why many US reconnaissance planes have been dispatched to Okinawa for the past few weeks.

I hope these terrors end someday.

bokdol
Feb 14, 2003, 10:38 PM
I admit Japan invaded Korea and China sixty years ago. But we apologized for those invasions to the South Korea and China. Both of them accepted our apology. It is totally unfair to call the contemporary Japanese as "as bad as others."

i understand the apology but why is the japanese government trying to erase that part of their history? removing it from the history books do not seem like a apology it seems like an insult.

it's like "hey i am sorry. next day hey the **** never happened what are you talking about."

well the information i had was a few months old. i have not kept up on that subeject so with in that few months it could have changed. also i like japanese people. governments just suck sometimes.

gaijinjim
Feb 14, 2003, 10:49 PM
Originally posted by topicolo

Today, the Japan is still one of the most racist countries in the world. I don't want to stereotype and lump all Japanese people into the same group, but ask any non ethnic-japanese person living in japan and they'll tell you the special racial slurs they get called occasionally.


Normally, I don't post to threads like this but I have to in regard to this. HAVE YOU LIVED IN JAPAN? From you location you are in Canada I'm assuming.

I have lived in Japan for a total of seven years between being an exchange student and working. Some Japanese are racist, but that is everywhere!!! Look at the state of the USA, my home. Since 9/11, some people are looking at middle easterns wondering "Are they going to get us?" :confused: :eek:

Japanese are some of the most friendly people in the world. And yes, I have been to Europe as well. Only thing is that the difference between Japanese and say Europeans is that it takes longer for a Japanese to open up to a foreigner cause of their nature and upbringing.

I do get annoyed at things. Crap, idiots with their loud speakers in front of train stations. Just yesterday on my way to work there was a kid, who couldn't have been more than 20 years old screaming at the top of his lungs rambling about how they need to change Japan and create more jobs. Well, when I walked past wearing my suit and company pin, his mouth dropped and he stopped screaming for about 10 seconds. When he started up again, he took aim at me; how foreigners shouldn't be taking jobs away from Japanese.

I stopped, turned and started to listen to him for a short while. My only reaction was to shake my head and start laughing. Why was I laughing? Cause he is ignorant and ignorance leads to racism. He had no clue that the points he was making had no basis in fact. And that is the case with alot of racists. They are just plain ignorant and don't know any better.

On the flip side of things, most Japanese will try to use their "heitakuso" English to help a foreigners find their way where as the French with perfect English won't at times even bother.

As far as the Defense Minister's comments, I think it is about time that the Japanese start standing up for themselves. Honestly, I don't think Japan would become the militaristic, power hungry country it was in the past.

It might just make some Japanese feel more respective of their own country. Since 9/11 and the response that Americans showed, renewed my faith in the American way of life. Possibly if the SDF were raised to a position that it could act faster in response to threats that are minutes away, Japanese would feel more proud of themselves. You never know.

That's just my two cents. :D

Sedulous
Feb 14, 2003, 11:47 PM
I'm not sure why Japan would feel the need to say anything.

As far as the guy that said Japanese are especially racist, I have to disagree. In my travels there I received nothing but pleasant welcomes.

Yes, the Chinese are developing new "stealthy" planes. However, I know a thing or two on this topic. The Chinese design is much like the Soviet MiG designs where in the 80's. The MiG program emulated U.S. designs as closely as they could. While MiGs looked much like U.S. planes, they didn't seem to perform as well. Following the collapse of the USSR, closer inspection of even the newest MiGs confirmed what was suspected... internal designs were far inferior. The Chinese "stealth" utilizes the obvious design features that contribute to low radar cross section such as the angular sides and absorbant paint. These designs can be seen in the F-117... a design that is nearly 30 years old. The internal components (such as avionics and engines) are not revolutionary. Notably, pilots of the F-117 Nighthawk often remark how difficult the plane is to fly. The newest American figher design integrates innovations not found anywhere else. Between the super light aerodynamic airframe to ultra efficient thrust vectored engines that allow for hours of supercruise flight (faster than sound at mach 1.5) without even using an afterburner (as opposed to something like an F-14 where supercruise is limited to far less than an hour) there is little competition to be found... and I haven't even gotten to the really interesting stuff.

Anyway, every country has good and bad people. Apple rules! Microsoft sucks!

yamadataro
Feb 15, 2003, 09:04 AM
Here's a little opinion from a Japanese man.

I seriously doubt Japan will make any offensive move to North Korea.
That's the least I can say from my experience in living in Japan and hearing the public opinions. In any case, I'd be totally be pissed off when Japan does such a thing.

I think the states made a right decision back then about prohibiting Japan to have a real military power, whatever their reason behind it was at that time. Japan has done a lotta bad stuff to the world during WWII which I'm totally ashamed of as a Japanese citizen. I deeply and truely thank the US for stopping and spanking us.

And I'm 100% proud of the current/continuing Japanese policy which prohibits any offensive actions.

As to the contribution to the world safety, Japan should make a lot more monetary contribution since we don't want any militalistic contribution.

FYI: Conflict is the last thing we would enjoy, considering the fact that Japanese people try to avoid any form of conflict in everyday life. That's why we appear very polite, quiet and shy in the western culture. (well, you know, there are some Japanese nut balls out there too, of course) That's also the exact reason why we suck in terms of communicating in English, IMO :D

Peace. I can't believe we are still having wars in the 21st century... We haven't changed much, have we?

Ifeelbloated
Feb 15, 2003, 11:33 AM
I was watching a Frontline documentary about North Korea. They had a British camera crew go into the country as tourists. I wasn't quite sure what to expect, maybe see a pomp and circumstance military parade replete with columns of goose-stepping soldiers. They were led around with guides of course and the guides never left them while showing them around. One of the guides was a young woman who was quite attractive and the other was some older guy. They were both adamant about selling the party line. I wasn't surprised. The people are pretty shy to foreigners and some just plain voiced their opinion on how Bush and America are a bunch of imperialists. Whatever. Classic commie rhetoric. They went to the beach with an electrified fence, saw the U.S.S. Pueblo complete with bullet holes, saw the ax on display that killed some U.S. Army soldiers way back when, talked with North Korean military men who said they'd fight the Americans to the death.
Even with all that, the creepiest thing I saw was when they went to one of the commune farms and were entertained by a little girl who looked like she was only 4 years old sing some kind of song extolling the "Dear Leader". Damn creepy. The people aren't taught to think for themselves. It's classic communism gone awry. After it ended I just felt so sad. Not just sad that I'm an American of Korean ancestry who may have barely escaped that fate but sad that the only way I see of bringing North Korea around is to maybe nuke them. It took two atom bombs to bring the Japanese to their senses. Unfortunately, I can see the same fate for North Korea. :(