PDA

View Full Version : Nintendo Wii and ATI Hollywood


mac000
May 18, 2006, 09:36 PM
has anyone been able to dig up any information on the GPU? :) :confused:

GFLPraxis
May 19, 2006, 01:10 AM
has anyone been able to dig up any information on the GPU? :) :confused:

Yup, I talked with a Blitz Games guy at E3. He said that it's significantly more powerful than the GameCube's GPU but to his knowledge doesn't have any new shaders- but it's powerful enough to do stuff like Bloom lighting in software.

No HDR and stuff like that, sadly :(

Dagless
May 19, 2006, 06:11 AM
Aye bloom is most definitely in there. However one thing confused me. Soft shadows are in there. I always thought that was a form of HDR, or have they got around that now?

Haoshiro
May 19, 2006, 10:01 AM
Aye bloom is most definitely in there. However one thing confused me. Soft shadows are in there. I always thought that was a form of HDR, or have they got around that now?

I didn't think soft shadows were related to HDR... could be wrong though.

Chaszmyr
May 19, 2006, 10:03 AM
Rumor has it, there's not much info about it because there is no working prototype yet. http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=31829

bokdol
May 19, 2006, 10:36 AM
ohhh so this sounds really promising.... yeah the graphics althgough sharp did not look next gen.. sorry if any one disagrees but red steel looked like a gamecube game.

bobber205
May 19, 2006, 11:03 AM
Even if the graphics are a mountain-sized improvement like the PS3 and (to a lesser degree) XBOX360 has, I'll still be pleased.

Question though: are they taking preorders yet?

I can't wait!

GFLPraxis
May 19, 2006, 11:41 AM
ohhh so this sounds really promising.... yeah the graphics althgough sharp did not look next gen.. sorry if any one disagrees but red steel looked like a gamecube game.

Red Steel had some UGLY environments.

But yeah, the Wii is basicly an overclocked GameCube.

Interestingly, the devs at Blitz Games explained to me that the GameCube was actually the most powerful system of current gen (which actually surprised me). I knew that the G3 in the GameCube should be able to possibly outperform the Celeron/P3 hybrid in the XBox, but I commented that I thought the GameCube had less RAM and a slower GPU. He agreed, though noted that the RAM was faster and said that the trick was that the GPU could do a lot of stuff for free in the hardware that the XBox's GPU could not, though the XBox's GPU was faster. So when utilized properly the GameCube could potentially push out the best graphics, and he pointed out Twilight Princess and Resident Evil 4; but for ports, it's not that well optimized for the system and the XBox's faster GPU wins out, that's why ports always look best on the XBox, because it had the fastest GPU.

It was an interesting conversation. He told me that he expected to see great graphics out of the Wii, because the GameCube was potentially so powerful and it was just a vastly overclocked GameCube. Not on par with the XBox 360, but still good.

GFLPraxis
May 19, 2006, 11:43 AM
Rumor has it, there's not much info about it because there is no working prototype yet. http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=31829

According to Kotaku, they were Wii dev kits stuffed into GameCube casings.
I doubt they were actual GameCubes, considering the reaction of some of the people in the line with me; one guy told me how he was there last year, and Twilight Princess looked even better this year.

It's possible though...

Dagless
May 19, 2006, 11:48 AM
ohhh so this sounds really promising.... yeah the graphics althgough sharp did not look next gen.. sorry if any one disagrees but red steel looked like a gamecube game.

I always get confused at this. The only cube game I've seen with Bloom is Twilight Princess. Soft shadows, that level of beautiful lighting, the lack of polygons.
Did someone brain wash everyone else but me? what have you all been drinking?

I keep getting dragged into lighting on the Wii. In that shot I posted above look at the yellow ticket - soft shadows. What I'm seeing is comparable to what I've played of the 360 in 480p.

Chaszmyr
May 19, 2006, 12:08 PM
According to Kotaku, they were Wii dev kits stuffed into GameCube casings.
I doubt they were actual GameCubes, considering the reaction of some of the people in the line with me; one guy told me how he was there last year, and Twilight Princess looked even better this year.

It's possible though...

Just cuz it's not a Gamecube doesn't mean it's a Wii. The Wii dev kits may very easily be less powerful than the actual Wii will be.

mrgreen4242
May 19, 2006, 12:08 PM
Red Steel had some UGLY environments.

But yeah, the Wii is basicly an overclocked GameCube.

Interestingly, the devs at Blitz Games explained to me that the GameCube was actually the most powerful system of current gen (which actually surprised me). I knew that the G3 in the GameCube should be able to possibly outperform the Celeron/P3 hybrid in the XBox, but I commented that I thought the GameCube had less RAM and a slower GPU. He agreed, though noted that the RAM was faster and said that the trick was that the GPU could do a lot of stuff for free in the hardware that the XBox's GPU could not, though the XBox's GPU was faster. So when utilized properly the GameCube could potentially push out the best graphics, and he pointed out Twilight Princess and Resident Evil 4; but for ports, it's not that well optimized for the system and the XBox's faster GPU wins out, that's why ports always look best on the XBox, because it had the fastest GPU.

It was an interesting conversation. He told me that he expected to see great graphics out of the Wii, because the GameCube was potentially so powerful and it was just a vastly overclocked GameCube. Not on par with the XBox 360, but still good.

I always figured that the GCN was the "potentially most powerfull" system, with a very fast CPU, and a GPU that was different, but perhaps equal to the Xbox. The RAM, as you say, limited what you could do without REALLY working hard to do it. Lots of extra RAM means you can do the same things, just lazily. With game development budgets getting so high, is it any wonder that they don't want to spend an extra few months of programmers time to really optimize a game engine for the best possible performance?

My hope for the Wii is that Nintendo bites the bullet and loads as much RAM as is practical in there. At least that will help lazy programmers make nice looking games. And it'll let the non-lazy ones push just that much further.

Of course while I can program (mostly web and database stuff these days), I'm not a game dev, so what do I know...

bokdol
May 19, 2006, 01:54 PM
I always get confused at this. The only cube game I've seen with Bloom is Twilight Princess. Soft shadows, that level of beautiful lighting, the lack of polygons.
Did someone brain wash everyone else but me? what have you all been drinking?

I keep getting dragged into lighting on the Wii. In that shot I posted above look at the yellow ticket - soft shadows. What I'm seeing is comparable to what I've played of the 360 in 480p.


sorry i was not talking about the bloom effects.. i mean the game it self from the video did not look like a next gen title. it felt like and moved like a gamecube game. (with a pointer) and looked like a game cube game. i no nothing about anyof the other games just looking at the video for red steel. my coment is just..humm i guess what i am saying is red steel looks like a current gen (not 360, you know what i mean), not next gen. just the video i saw looks like gamecube (or ps2 or xbox)

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6190489201111590665&q=red+steel

mac000
May 19, 2006, 04:09 PM
so can someone expain this to me, at least what it could possibly be referring to:

"Updated 05/15/2006: We previously reported that ATI's Hollywood is based on the R520 family of GPUs. This is incorrect, Hollywood is actually rooted in a separate graphics family than desktop GPUs at ATI. "

from : http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=2227

what card could they be possibly talking about

no chance in the world it a mod of a x1900?

sk1985
May 19, 2006, 07:13 PM
Rumor has it, there's not much info about it because there is no working prototype yet. http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=31829
That was written by a non-gaming press. Of course almost all wii units showed were most likely unfinished development kit. Last year the most games running on the 360 were really in fact running on G5 power macs. This is totally NOT uncommon. Same most likely goes for the PS3 (it too was running on devo kits and not finished hardware). The current wii devo kits given out are basically just upgraded game cube kits that have wii performance stats. Nintendo could have used demo wiis to give off the illusion of how the wii would look in action. Once again this is totally common among unfinished hardware. This story may or may not be true. Even if it is true Nintendo really didn't do anything wrong. Every other video game company does the same exact thing. The inquirer is blowing everything out of proportion and reporting on something they have no knowledge of. Truly it wouldn't surprise me if the wiis were running in the way they described (the 360 last year ran the same way, so was the PS3 this year, and most likely the wii too). It also doesn't surprise me that the wii isn't totally finished. The hardware is going through it's final development stage (same goes for the PS3, and the 360 last year). Nothing is really out of the ordinary.

mac000
May 19, 2006, 07:25 PM
That was written by a non-gaming press. Of course almost all wii units showed were most likely unfinished development kit. Last year the most games running on the 360 were really in fact running on G5 power macs. This is totally NOT uncommon. Same most likely goes for the PS3 (it too was running on devo kits and not finished hardware). The current wii devo kits given out are basically just upgraded game cube kits that have wii performance stats. Nintendo could have used demo wiis to give off the illusion of how the wii would look in action. Once again this is totally common among unfinished hardware. This story may or may not be true. Even if it is true Nintendo really didn't do anything wrong. Every other video game company does the same exact thing. The inquirer is blowing everything out of proportion and reporting on something they have no knowledge of. Truly it wouldn't surprise me if the wiis were running in the way they described (the 360 last year ran the same way, so was the PS3 this year, and most likely the wii too). It also doesn't surprise me that the wii isn't totally finished. The hardware is going through it's final development stage (same goes for the PS3, and the 360 last year). Nothing is really out of the ordinary.

does anyone remember how games on the XBOX360 looked at E32005 running on dev kits? compared to when it was finalized and shipped?

Dagless
May 19, 2006, 07:35 PM
does anyone remember how games on the XBOX360 looked at E32005 running on dev kits? compared to when it was finalized and shipped?

There was a dramatic difference, biggest being the FSAA. The PowerMacs had none :( IIRC.

sk1985
May 19, 2006, 07:53 PM
does anyone remember how games on the XBOX360 looked at E32005 running on dev kits? compared to when it was finalized and shipped?
Yes I do. It's graphics card wasn't finished nor was it's CPU. Thats why the Power mac was used. M$ used the closest PC architecture on the market to work as temporary 360s. The Power Mac was the next best thing to a real 360. It also was it's early development kit. No GPU at the time was nearly as powerful as the 360's thats why game looked and played poorly.

GFLPraxis
May 19, 2006, 07:55 PM
does anyone remember how games on the XBOX360 looked at E32005 running on dev kits? compared to when it was finalized and shipped?

Gears of War ran at like 10 FPS.

MacRumorUser
May 20, 2006, 06:35 AM
Yup, I talked with a Blitz Games guy at E3.

The same Blitz Games who got rocked last year when one of their main graphics artists was locked up for being one of the UK's worst paeodphiles!

With insider rumors that employee's children may have been victims?

I wonder infulence for the dark titles coming out of blitz latley comes from....

Just some useless insider knoweldge of the workings of Blitz...

sam10685
May 20, 2006, 08:27 PM
Aye bloom is most definitely in there. However one thing confused me. Soft shadows are in there. I always thought that was a form of HDR, or have they got around that now?

there's LOADS of bloomyness in the mario galaxy previews.

mac000
May 20, 2006, 09:03 PM
so to put it in spec. from ati.com 's website, what type of graphics card are they going to be using a "mod" of?

me hate windows
May 20, 2006, 09:44 PM
so to put it in spec. from ati.com 's website, what type of graphics card are they going to be using a "mod" of?

Maybe the Mobility Radeons that go into laptops, or the FireGL workstation cards.

bokdol
May 25, 2006, 12:40 PM
ok so i have stated that it looks like a game cube game.. but as i find more and more trailers. i become more and more intrested in it. not the sword play but the gun battles look kinda cool. so it may not have super graphics. but this really will take gameplay to the next level. i am getting excited over a game i did not like orriginally. wow. i cant wait for more wii action. :eek: :D the machine gun scenes look fun.

jdechko
May 25, 2006, 12:48 PM
Maybe the Mobility Radeons that go into laptops, or the FireGL workstation cards.

As nice as the FireGL cards are, they're not going to be in the Wii. The chips are way too expensive, and most likely overkill. The Mobility is probably a better choice for the basis of Hollywood.

mrgreen4242
May 25, 2006, 01:17 PM
ok so i have stated that it looks like a game cube game.. but as i find more and more trailers. i become more and more intrested in it. not the sword play but the gun battles look kinda cool. so it may not have super graphics. but this really will take gameplay to the next level. i am getting excited over a game i did not like orriginally. wow. i cant wait for more wii action. :eek: :D the machine gun scenes look fun.

Also, just for the record, several developers have said that once the hardware is finalized, and all the code optimized, Wii games should look close to 360 games at SD resolutions... so it might not LOOK that bad in addition to playing well.

mac000
May 25, 2006, 04:09 PM
Also, just for the record, several developers have said that once the hardware is finalized, and all the code optimized, Wii games should look close to 360 games at SD resolutions... so it might not LOOK that bad in addition to playing well.


where did you read that?