Grief over Perfect Ebay 12" PB Sale [Archive]

Calvinatir

Jun 6, 2006, 03:44 AM

Well, it seemed as though it was time to sell the ol' 12" Powerbook SD/1.25GB. The best of the best for the 12" powerbooks. So I put it up on ebay Ebay Link (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=9725370424) and fortunately for my it ended within HOURS of the Macbook release and I got a VERY good price for it ($1252 Shipped). I had this 12" PB from the day it was release back in Feb 05 until the final day of it's existence on the apple website, truly perfect and due mostly to Macrumors.com. I know that if I were the person who bought it, I'd be pretty peeved as well. Well, I got payment almost immediately and shipped it off the next day as soon as I heard the Macbook news. Hours later i got an ebay message saying she wanted a refund because of some credit card balance issues, which I took as a ploy to get a refund from me. I took it straight to the point and asked her if it was about the new Macbook, and she responded by saying again that her credit card was over the balance.

I then told her that I'd refund the 1st payment if I received a 2nd payment within the next week. After that I received NO correspondence and was forced to keep the original payment. Over 2.5 weeks later (tonight) i receive an email from Paypal saying that the bidder filed a "Chargeback" on the payment and now I have a $-12xx amount on my paypal account! :eek: :eek: I just now filed my formal writing with paypal and it's in the dispute overview phase. It was also confirmed as delivered and has >$1000 insurance and was shipped in the original box inside of another box so there is no chance at damage. I'm just really peeved that this chick is doing this to me. I can no longer use my paypal and who knows if I'll have to fork out the $1200 bucks before this is resolved...UGH

Then again, if it all works out it will still be the most PERFECT apple laptop sale in history, thanks to MR!!

PatrickF

Jun 6, 2006, 04:32 AM

Well there goes some very negative feedback for her on eBay! Oh, I'd also file a complaint with eBay. From what I read you never received full payment. I believe you can file a non-payment complaint with eBay.

PayPal are totally useless at sorting stuff out so beware! A friend of mine had his debit card registered on another person's account without him knowing (after giving his card details out to pay for a pizza over the phone) and had money taking out of his bank account. It's amazing how PayPal even let's people register other people's debit cards without verifying that they own the card.

Abstract

Jun 6, 2006, 04:43 AM

I avoid Paypal. They don't provide you with anything. If I was to sell something, I would go with the direct deposit option, but I've never dealt internationally before though, so maybe I'd give in.

.....meh, actually, no I wouldn't. :p Too many problems with Paypal and getting money deducted from your account, as was the case here.

mward333

Jun 6, 2006, 05:14 AM

ImNoSuperMan

Jun 6, 2006, 05:15 AM

Then again, if it all works out it will still be the most PERFECT apple laptop sale in history, thanks to MR!!

May be it got just a bit too perfect I guess:D /

Anyways I dont think you`ll get the money. IMO the deal will be cancelled and all you could do is give the girl a -ve feedback.

If I was i your place I`d just try convince the girl to buy it at a lesser price may be. Give her a discount of 50-100$ and see if she agrees. Since the PB has already shipped it`d be better to sell it to her only. Getting it back and selling it again, paying fr the shipping again and hoping this time you do get the money; will be one big trouble you should try to avoid definitely.

mward333

Jun 6, 2006, 05:21 AM

In a perfect world, what vikas soni said would be right (trying to correct the sale by talking with the buyer)....

but I'm sure that the buyer is long gone!! I'm sorry to say you'll probably never hear from the seller (or see your laptop!) again.

Just focus your efforts on getting your money back from paypal/eBay. It is a tough process, and they might not back you up anyway, so keep working on that.

Again, I'm sorry to hear about your loss.

If it sounds "to good to be true" folks..... then avoid it!

ImNoSuperMan

Jun 6, 2006, 06:07 AM

I'm sure that the buyer is long gone!! I'm sorry to say you'll probably never hear from the seller (or see your laptop!) again.

Just focus your efforts on getting your money back from paypal/eBay. It is a tough process, and they might not back you up anyway, so keep working on that.

That would be the guy`s worst nightmare if he doesnt even get his PB back. But I have a bit more faith in PayPal. The guy is not at fault in any way. And I dont think he`ll ever loose money. It`ll definitely take some time(plus a lot of effort) but he`ll get the money in the end.

Also taking a look at the feedbacks the buyer doesnt sound fraud IMO. But that doesnt assure you that she`ll stay honest and genuine this time too. I m sure this is all bout MB as the OP said. I m suggesting a discount as this will be the least worst option possible(if possible at all).

Any ways I hope you dont loose the money Calvinatir. Just make sure you keep us updated bout the matter. I`d really be surprised if PayPal doesnt help the guy.

Stridder44

Jun 6, 2006, 06:09 AM

Another scam. Yuck. I'm sorry it happened to you.

It happened to me once. I'll never use eBay, paypal, Fedex, etc., again (my story was posted on MR two years ago). When it comes down to it, all of these services can easily fail the honest internet seller or buyer. This is a huge generalization, but there are zillions of stories about such scams.... we see this stuff on MR all the time.

As a side note: I learned my lesson when it happened to me, and I only use craigslist now, just doing local selling/buying, and I've never been cheated. In fact, I've had lots of success. I always have buyers meet me at my office (I teach at the university), and we have an easy transaction in a public place. I mean, I'm not running a business here! Just an occasional sale every few months, but craigslist is so easy.

Thats it. Ive heard too many horror stories. Im closing my PayPal & eBay accounts right now.

/Thank God I've never used them

lamina

Jun 6, 2006, 06:14 AM

Please keep us updated on what happens...

California

Jun 6, 2006, 07:09 AM

What do you mean first and second payment?

This happened to me on a logic board sale. The bids went pretty high. I was surprised, as the item was listed as damaged. I had no way of testing the board and stated so in the auction and it turned out it worked except for the video. They tried to charge back through PayPal. I fought it as an honest sale, I was truthful and as up front as possible about the item. (it had been dropped!) I threatened legal action, because eBay is a legit sale. Wrote many forceful and honest letters backed up by my honest description on the auction page. I won. Money returned to me.

I don't understand how the girl only paid you the "first" payment. What does that mean? I thought you got the money right away? Your first mistake was to give in. Unless you stated some refund policy on the auction page, this is a firm sale.

ImNoSuperMan

Jun 6, 2006, 09:47 AM

I don't understand how the girl only paid you the "first" payment. What does that mean? I thought you got the money right away? Your first mistake was to give in. Unless you stated some refund policy on the auction page, this is a firm sale.

I guess OP meant that the girl paid him in full through PayPal making it her first and final payment. But next day she demanded a refund as their was some problem with her credit card balance. OP then asked her to use some other credit card and make another payment of the same amount first(which he reffered to as Second payment) so that he can refund the first payment.

Atlasland

Jun 6, 2006, 10:00 AM

Chrispy

Jun 6, 2006, 10:00 AM

Paypal is TERRIBLE. I had a similar incident happen to me and even after I told paypal what happened they still held me responsible. Give them the tracking information so you have proof it was delivered. They sent a collection agency after me and I wrote the agency a letter telling them how it was a wrongful collection. It has been a year and I have not heard from them again, thankfully! Fight this until the bitter end and don't give up. Screw paypal.. they never stick by their sellers!

danny_w

Jun 6, 2006, 10:20 AM

I've personally never had a problem with PayPal or eBay, but their fees are getting outrageous and these horror stories just make it seem not worthwhile anymore. I have gone to selling most of my stuff for cash locally via craigslist with good results. I would rather get the cash in a face-to-face transaction than risk the problems with eBay and PayPal.

interlaced

Jun 6, 2006, 10:49 AM

What a horrible situation! Hopefully emphasizing the fact that you contacted her back about setting up a payment schedule but never received any response will help you out. Unfortunately, I was in a similar situation once but didnt get one red cent back even after contesting it with legitimate proof. I was out $1400 and after reading up on threats that Paypal does to send you to a debt collection agency, I paid the $1400 to get my balance out of the red. Ugh, not fair. Now I don't use PayPal. US Money Orders all the way or straight up cash. Try Craigslist sometime. I sold my 12" to someone in WeHo for $1100 AFTER the Macbooks came out, and it was only the Combo and 60GB version. Good luck to you, though.

Ryan T.

Jun 6, 2006, 10:55 AM

This is why I'd MUCH rather sell my computers here on MR, even at a little bit of a loss. While not fool proof or "safe", it does provide a better chance of an honest transaction.

That being said, I sold my G5 tower on eBay and it was a flawless sale.

savar

Jun 6, 2006, 11:17 AM

Most of the eBay/PayPal horror stories involve people who didn't know any better. I don't think eBay/PayPal is an unsafe place to do business, you just have to keep in mind that its a long-distance transaction with a complete stranger. Keep that in the back of your mind at all times and be cautious. I've bought and sold many things on EBay, and conducted lots of non-auction transactions through PayPal. Of course, I always try Craigslist first if I think its reasonable, but the local market is so much smaller than the national market that sometimes Craigslist just doesn't make sense. Unless you're trading in cash and in person, Craigslist isn't any safer -- in fact, its LESS safe than eBay/PayPal.

Let's just all wait and see what happens. I will be really shocked if the poster doesn't get his money back. My only comment on his sale is that he should not have contacted the buyer to ask if she wanted to buy a MacBook. The buyer was legally obligated to pay, no matter what her reasons for wanting the money back. I wouldn't feel bad about profiting from the timing of the sale -- you were only using information that was just as available to her as it was to you.

edit: I just looked at interlaced's post. If someone threatens to refer you to a debt-collection agency, don't let that scare you. It's a little bit of work, but if you write a letter to the debt-collection agency explaining your side of the story they will probably just leave you alone and write it off to bad debt (or take it back to the original debt owner). If they report you to a CRA (EquiFAx, Transunion, etc.), then you write letters to THEM explaining your side. If you're a literate adult and you write a nice, balanced letter, printed envelope, etc. (i.e. be professional about it), then people will take you seriously. Keep in mind that you can force an expensive endgame -- litigation -- and most of these companies won't take that risk for relatively small debt ($1-2K) if you've made a good case and presented yourself professionally. There is far more low-hanging fruit out there that they can make money on.

Chrispy

Jun 6, 2006, 11:30 AM

Let's just all wait and see what happens. I will be really shocked if the poster doesn't get his money back. My only comment on his sale is that he should not have contacted the buyer to ask if she wanted to buy a MacBook. The buyer was legally obligated to pay, no matter what her reasons for wanting the money back. I wouldn't feel bad about profiting from the timing of the sale -- you were only using information that was just as available to her as it was to you.

edit: I just looked at interlaced's post. If someone threatens to refer you to a debt-collection agency, don't let that scare you. It's a little bit of work, but if you write a letter to the debt-collection agency explaining your side of the story they will probably just leave you alone and write it off to bad debt (or take it back to the original debt owner). If they report you to a CRA (EquiFAx, Transunion, etc.), then you write letters to THEM explaining your side. If you're a literate adult and you write a nice, balanced letter, printed envelope, etc. (i.e. be professional about it), then people will take you seriously. Keep in mind that you can force an expensive endgame -- litigation -- and most of these companies won't take that risk for relatively small debt ($1-2K) if you've made a good case and presented yourself professionally. There is far more low-hanging fruit out there that they can make money on.

I did exaclty what you described with the collection agency when paypal sent one after me. The collection agency backed off and must have written it off as a bad bebt. I would not be surprised if PayPal takes him money and turns him over to a collection agency even with proof. They are just starting to think they are invincible. Finally, I also agree that you should have told the lady she was out of luck and she committed to the sale. Fight this to the end and DO NO give in to paypal. Follow this posters advice and be professional about it to the very end. It worked for me and it will work for you, or anyone else for that matter as well.

Calvinatir

Jun 6, 2006, 11:34 AM

I guess OP meant that the girl paid him in full through PayPal making it her first and final payment. But next day she demanded a refund as their was some problem with her credit card balance. OP then asked her to use some other credit card and make another payment of the same amount first(which he reffered to as Second payment) so that he can refund the first payment.

Yes, sorry for the confusion, she paid in FULL the first time. Then I told her I'd refund the 1st payment if I received a 2nd. No word back from either party yet, this is just complete BS and I hope paypal doesn't send it to a collections for having a negative balance. What other proof can I send to paypal so that they will believe it was a legitimate sale? I tried to sell it here and on Craigslist to no avail before I went to ebay. Thanks for your support!

macpastor

Jun 6, 2006, 11:49 AM

And now everyone knows why I choose to never take PayPal. In PayPal land the buyer takes preference over the seller. I sold a LCD screen for $500, adn it got shipped, buyer received, then he claimed he never got it, put a claim in to PayPal and a week later they freeze my account and drop it to a negative $500 so they could pay him back.

2 years later, it is still there and I can't get it off.

I opened a new account a year ago, and sold many things, and finally a computer. The buyer bought it, I shipped, and 2 weeks later I get a drop of $1500 in my paypal account because the buyer used a credit card that was fraudulent. I tried to contact PayPal and they would never work with me on the phone or e-mail. They sent me to collections, and it took me a year to pay off the $1500.00

They are a bad experience all around. I will NEVER use them. I have heard to many horror stories.

Want to hear more? www.paypalsucks.com

drift1492

Jun 6, 2006, 11:52 AM

interlaced

Jun 6, 2006, 11:56 AM

savar, thanks for that. I should have asked around more before paying that money to PayPal. =\

Calvinatir

Jun 6, 2006, 12:01 PM

Did you ship the computer with a tracking number? It seems like if you could prove that you shipped the computer to HER address that might be enough for paypal. I mean, if she told her credit card company in the chargeback that she didn't receive anything, and that info was sent to paypal, then the fact that you have proof she received something from you would be enough. Just a thought. Good luck with this.

The main problem here is that it is easier for paypal to screw you over without asking for your side than to fight a credit card chargeback.

Also, I try not to use paypal for high dollar stuff. Anything over about 300 bucks and I will ask for Postal Money Orders. I may lose out on potential bidders because they want the "buyer protection" that paypal provides, but I won't get screwed over like this.

It was sent Insured with a tracking Number and she received the item.
I just got off the phone with paypal and it seems that she circumvented paypal (probably because she thought she tried to file an argument with paypal). She called up American Express and called the charge fraudulent or something to that effect. So the lady from paypal said that they are fighting on the seller's (my) behalf. It could take up to 75 days but she said that money was just a hold and wouldn't go to collections. This really just sounds like steeling though, she has the money and the PB now. UGH

drift1492

Jun 6, 2006, 12:03 PM

It was sent Insured with a tracking Number and she received the item.
I just got off the phone with paypal and it seems that she circumvented paypal (probably because she thought she tried to file an argument with paypal). She called up American Express and called the charge fraudulent or something to that effect. So the lady from paypal said that they are fighting on the seller's (my) behalf. It could take up to 75 days but she said that money was just a hold and wouldn't go to collections. This really just sounds like steeling though, she has the money and the PB now. UGH

Im sure you have seen this, if not, it could be helpful. (http://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=p/sell/chargeback_risk-outside)

Specifically,

What information can a seller provide to increase the chances of winning a chargeback dispute?

Some types of information that sellers can provide to PayPal to increase the chances of winning a chargeback include:

Proof of delivery, such as online tracking numbers
Copies of the original item description or auction description, including any photos
Proof that the buyer was already refunded
Proof that the buyer was provided with a replacement product
Correspondence with the buyer or feedback from the buyer
Any agreements signed or accepted by the buyer at time of purchase
Any return policy that was communicated to the buyer

Try to send as much of that to paypal as you can to help them convince the credit card company that the chargeback was fraudulent.

Eluon

Jun 6, 2006, 12:11 PM

Jovian9

Jun 6, 2006, 12:53 PM

Could this be reported as theft or fraud? If you have not been paid and she has the item (with tracking # proof) then maybe contact authorites and report a stolen laptop.....not sure how that works though. But I'd do it if I were in your position.

ImNoSuperMan

Jun 6, 2006, 04:47 PM

i sold my old iBook G4 laptop to a guy here on macrumors. the guy sent the money to my paypal account, then 2 weeks later (after i had deposited it into my checking account) removed the money. he kept giving me B.S. reasons and paypal wouldn't help me. It took me about 6 months to get the last dime from him - after he made payments that were rather infrequent. the whole time paypal giving me garbage about my account being negative.

no more selling via paypal. they're trash.

There`s a difference between using paypal for ebay transactions and using it for non ebay transaction. PayPal with ebay is definitely a lot more secure than the other.

But the best way to use ebay will be cash on delivery when you are buying and Pick up n Pay when selling. This way there is no chance of a fraud. The only downside may be that your potential market reduces to your own city only. But it`s better than taking a chance and then suffering like the OP and a lot of other people have in past.
I had a similar incident while selling my iBook G4 on eBay. I had made it absolutely clear that I wont accept anything but Pick n Pay. Some as#hol# bought it within 2 hours after it went on sale. And then asked me for my Bamk account no sa that he can send me money and i can ship it to his friend in NIGERIA:eek: . I mailed Paypal and told them bout the situation. The deal was cancelled within 24 hours and also the selling fees, which was 1st credited to my accoint, got debited again.

So that increased my faith in paypal a lot. Especially the speed they adddressed my problem and solved it was really something I didnt ever imagine.

So I really believe the OP will not loose money at all. It might take some time and effort though. just make sure you inform PayPal bout each and every detail ASAP.

California

Jun 6, 2006, 05:55 PM

It was sent Insured with a tracking Number and she received the item.
I just got off the phone with paypal and it seems that she circumvented paypal (probably because she thought she tried to file an argument with paypal). She called up American Express and called the charge fraudulent or something to that effect. So the lady from paypal said that they are fighting on the seller's (my) behalf. It could take up to 75 days but she said that money was just a hold and wouldn't go to collections. This really just sounds like steeling though, she has the money and the PB now. UGH

I would call AmEx. Explain what happened. If she has not paid her AMEX bill you are screwed. If she has, then they might work with you. When my PayPal payment came in on the logic baord ,I took it out of paypal and into my bank account right away, so that they could not "freeze" my account. If she has not paid her AMEX bill, then you have to work with Amex to get the powerbook back. Important that you get it back in good condition, too. Demand this and also you need to talk to the girl.

Your mistake was talking about the MacBook release. So what? YOu made her not want it, you pushed her into buyer's remorse, while there are pefectly great reasons why she would want a 12" PB.

Be smart about human nature here, but you need to get her to send the PB back to you , insured and at her expense. She is commiting theft until she returns it to you. SHE HAS NOT PAID FOR WHAT SHE HAS RECEIVED!!!!

PS Where in VV are u?

Calvinatir

Jun 6, 2006, 05:58 PM

Coldwater and Riverside

Music_Producer

Jun 6, 2006, 06:19 PM

Another scam. Yuck. I'm sorry it happened to you.

It happened to me once. I'll never use eBay, paypal, Fedex, etc., again (my story was posted on MR two years ago). When it comes down to it, all of these services can easily fail the honest internet seller or buyer. This is a huge generalization, but there are zillions of stories about such scams.... we see this stuff on MR all the time.

As a side note: I learned my lesson when it happened to me, and I only use craigslist now, just doing local selling/buying, and I've never been cheated. In fact, I've had lots of success. I always have buyers meet me at my office (I teach at the university), and we have an easy transaction in a public place. I mean, I'm not running a business here! Just an occasional sale every few months, but craigslist is so easy.

You shouldn't use PayPal if you can't follow their policy instructions. Unfortunately people get 'scammed' simply because of this. I thought the same, when I faced my first chargeback and I panicked and I was like "Screw ebay! screw paypal.. bas#rds..etc etc" but they refunded my money, since I had shipped according to their seller protection policies.

Music_Producer

Jun 6, 2006, 06:20 PM

I would call AmEx. Explain what happened. If she has not paid her AMEX bill you are screwed. If she has, then they might work with you. When my PayPal payment came in on the logic baord ,I took it out of paypal and into my bank account right away, so that they could not "freeze" my account. If she has not paid her AMEX bill, then you have to work with Amex to get the powerbook back. Important that you get it back in good condition, too. Demand this and also you need to talk to the girl.

Your mistake was talking about the MacBook release. So what? YOu made her not want it, you pushed her into buyer's remorse, while there are pefectly great reasons why she would want a 12" PB.

Be smart about human nature here, but you need to get her to send the PB back to you , insured and at her expense. She is commiting theft until she returns it to you. SHE HAS NOT PAID FOR WHAT SHE HAS RECEIVED!!!!

PS Where in VV are u?

Calling AMEX is a waste of time.. for them, the seller IS the fradulent person. They will only correspond with the chargeback team from PayPal.. and not anyone else (of course, the card holder.. but thats it)

Roba

Jun 6, 2006, 07:14 PM

I mailed Paypal and told them bout the situation. The deal was cancelled within 24 hours and also the selling fees, which was 1st credited to my accoint, got debited again.

So that increased my faith in paypal a lot. Especially the speed they adddressed my problem and solved it was really something I didnt ever imagine.

This doesn't sound like Paypal territory at all to me as it is the job of Ebay to cancel auctions on their site and not Paypal. Paypal cannot refund you any selling fees either as that is Ebay's domain.

OP by now the buyer will have got her money back as she got her credit card company to do a chargeback to Paypal. I think that as this was unauthorised by Paypal and you have done everything right in turn Paypal is more than likely to put this buyers credit into negative balance to the tune of however much your laptop sold for.

If this happened to me i would have gone to the Police station already and i would have filed a report of theft against this person.

I hope that things get sorted for you with a positive outcome soon.

YS2003

Jun 6, 2006, 07:36 PM

Even though I consider myself tech savvy and progressive thinker, I don't think I can use eBay or its equivalent service to sell or buy goods from strangers. I am comfortable doing business with established online merchants such as Amazon and others; but, I cannot go through the thoughts of going through those BS and non-sensical excuses you can get from the other party through the transactions. This type of example reinforces my distrust and skepticism of those methods of selling/buying.

When I need to deal with an individual buyer, I can only go through cash payment at the time of sale.

topgunn

Jun 7, 2006, 02:20 PM

I often sell things on eBay but seldom buy things from eBay. Since I started using PayPal, it was standard practice to automatically withdraw any funds that were placed there so they would be "safe" in my bank account. The only problem is that PayPal has access to that bank too.

I had just finished parting off and selling a computer on eBay. As usual, I withdrew everything to my bank account as soon as it hit PayPal. Everything shipped and I went about my business. A week later, I got an email from PayPal that one of the buyers had requested a refund. I went to look on PayPal and my balance was 0 still but in the mean time, my bank balance had dropped by the amount in question. PayPal had withdrew funds from my bank account to insure that I had the funds available to meet the refund.

I really get nervous doing large transactions on eBay/PayPal but it beats the alternatives.

3kids

Jun 7, 2006, 02:29 PM

I honestly think you will win this. Provide the investigator from American Express everything you have in documentation. With what you have it should show that their cardholder is the one scamming.

Acehigh

Jun 7, 2006, 04:57 PM

i receive an email from Paypal saying that the bidder filed a "Chargeback" on the payment and now I have a $-12xx amount on my paypal account! :eek: :eek: I just now filed my formal writing with paypal and it's in the dispute overview phase. It was also confirmed as delivered and has >$1000 insurance and was shipped in the original box inside of another box so there is no chance at damage. I'm just really peeved that this chick is doing this to me. I can no longer use my paypal and who knows if I'll have to fork out the $1200 bucks before this is resolved...UGH

you should win the chargeback if you shipped to a confirmed address. Make sure you put in the tracking number.

ImNoSuperMan

Jun 10, 2006, 03:30 PM

hi Calvinatir. Dont forget to keep us updated.

EDIT. Hmmmmm.... Still no update.

3kids

Jun 25, 2006, 04:52 AM

What happened with the investigation?

Calvinatir

Jun 25, 2006, 10:18 AM

it is still in the investigation process, which they say could take up to 30 days or something. They e-mailed me once asking for the tracking number, which I provided to them. But now there is a change in the story. The lady rejected the UPS package. Tracking number: 1ze03a470358463183

But i stated in the email to paypal that in my auction there were NO RETURNS. So she has to pay the shipping back to her house. What a disaster, hopefully it ends well.

Thanks for the concern

Jamesw

Jun 25, 2006, 10:49 AM

Good luck Calv, I hope this lady pays dearly... what a ... female dog.

Azmordean

Jun 25, 2006, 12:02 PM

Well, my advice would be first to wait for the paypal investigation to resolve itself. However, if in the end, she is keeping a computer she didn't pay for, I would STRONGLY suggest speaking to a lawyer. Sure, that isn't cheap, but in my opinion, anything over $1000 or so is worth your while. If she ultimately sends the computer back, fine - but otherwise, she needs to pay something.

For future reference, the minute a buyer of anything balks, I'd call UPS, cancel the delivery and have it returned to you, refund the money, and end the sale. As far as I am aware, you always have the right not to do business with someone. If there is balking going on early in the transaction, usually nothing good will come of it. Easier just to start over, eat the shipping cost, and find someone else.

Anyway, hope this all works out okay for you!

BackInTheSaddle

Jun 25, 2006, 12:20 PM

It sucks that a few unscrupulous people can ruin the whole system for everyone else. As someone mentioned, sellers should do their best to follow the protection policy to avoid being stuck in the event a buyer is either "remorseful" or is attempting to defraud you.

One thing I seem to get a lot of these days is unsolicited offers to buy my auction items outside of eBay. These are almost always scams so I would recommend never trusting someone who makes an offer. Also, if you have an unhappy buyer, it's always best to give them a refund and get your item back than to try to force the deal to go through.

I went through a big headache last year with one of these Nigerian bank scams. Our not-for-profit group runs a meeting every year, and people attending the event from overseas often want to wire transfer their fees to us. Well, someone used our bank and routing numbers to get fake checks printed with our names on them, then proceeded to buy a bunch of items both on eBay and outside. Fortunately, we didn't lose any money but I think quite a few unsuspecting folks did get scammed. The worst part was we only found out when someone selling a Harley got suspicious and tried to contact our organization. The bank never caught on.

millsy

Jun 25, 2006, 12:30 PM

Paypal seems to be a very evil organization at least from my viewpoint. It has shoddy business details in how it manages money from account to account. I really dont like having a company like Paypal hooked up to my bank account and have that happened. Whenever I sell on eBay i usually ask for check/money order and wait for that to clear and enter my bank account successfully. All of this paypal business seems fishy. I dont understand the legality of it, but it seems fishy that if you sell something to someone and then refund it, how could you lose money? Also, personally you should have said no to the refund. By just talking about card inbalances...well....then she shouldn't have bid so high on the computer. it is not your responsibility to manage other people's card inbalanaced. The credit card companies will take care of her. You should have also immediately canceled the delivery of the package....but hopefull all will be ok for you in the end.

Johnny Rico

Jun 25, 2006, 12:32 PM

The last time I used ebay the opposite thing happened to me. I bought something, didn't recieve it, then was attacked by the seller and told to piss off by paypal.
I tried to buy a t shirt. I paypal'd my money to the (power) seller, someone who actually has a brick and mortar store but uses ebay as a supplemental outlet. They recieved my money, then mailed my purchase to the wrong address (I don't know who they mailed it to). Then, when I asked about the whereabouts of the shirt, the seller contacted paypal and claimed that they never recieved payment for the item and tried to get paypal to take more money forcibly out of my account. I then informed paypal that I did pay for the item (THROUGH paypal, that was easy enough to prove), but never received it. The seller was then able to "prove" that they had sent me the item by giving paypal a tracking number saying that the item had been delivered (to some random person on the other side of the continent). I was out $25, never got a shirt. Never used ebay for anything again.

w8ing4intelmacs

Jun 25, 2006, 03:01 PM

So let me get this straight. You have the computer back in your hands, yes?

Unfortunately, I think PayPal will end up giving the lady her money (minus shipping hopefully). PayPal doesn't care about who is right or wrong. Rather, they just figure out who has the item and gives the money to the other person.

regre7

Jun 25, 2006, 03:46 PM

I just closed my PayPal account and gave them a piece of my mind.

w8ing4intelmacs

Jun 26, 2006, 12:22 PM

I just closed my PayPal account and gave them a piece of my mind.

you sure showed them.

daveaudio

Jun 26, 2006, 01:15 PM

ok I will add my experiences in here. I do have paypal because I sell a lot of stuff online and a lot of people want to put it on their credit card and I do not have a merchant account. Anyways I had sold a person a carpet several months ago. They had someone scam their credit card. They reported it as fraudalent to their credit card company. The credit card company did a blanket chargeback on everything spent on the card. I.E. my payment by this person through paypal. Of course my account went negative by that amount. I followed paypals resolution process. I emailed the tracking number number for the item to paypal and copied the screen of proof of arrival to paypal as well. After several emails between paypal and I . Paypal released the amount hold and everything is fine now. They did not take my money and they did rule in my favor because I showed them I had done everything correctly.
The original poster has nothing to fear , if he follows their chargeback process complaint guidelines he will prove his case because he has proof the item was recieved.
90% or more of the problems people have with paypal is they do not follow guidelines. I am not saying its perfect but neither are banks or credit card companies.