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MacRumors
Jul 19, 2006, 03:40 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

Apple posted their (http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2006/jul/19results.html) 3rd Quarter 2006 financial results today.

Apple posted revenue of $4.37 billion and a net quarterly profit of $472 million or $.54 per diluted share. For reference, the year-ago quarter brought in $3.53 billion in revenue, net profit of $320 million or $.37 per diluted share.

Apple shipped 1,327,000 Macintosh computers and 8,111,000 iPods during this quarter which represents a 12% growth in Macs and 32% growth in iPods year-over-year.

- 75% of Macs sold during the quarter used Intel processors.
- 2nd highest quarterly sales and earnings in Apple's history
- International sales accounted for 39 percent of the quarter’s revenue.
- iPod continued to earn a US market share of over 75 percent
- Desktops: 529,000, down 14% from previous quarter
- Portables: 798,000, up 60% from previous quarter
- iPods: 8,526,000


Live streaming of the results conference call will be broadcast at 5pm EST (http://www.apple.com/quicktime/qtv/earningsq306/).

Updates:

- Mac: 55% of revenue. Increased sales to 1.327 million.
-- Pleased with Intel transition. "Solidly" on track to update Xserve and PowerMac by end of this year.
-- Over 2900 Universal Applications.
-- Most "critical" applications will be converted by September
-- MacBook very well received
-- Happy with the Mac ad campaign, feel that it is contributing to Apple's momentum
- iPod
-- NPD: 75% of market share US (MP3)
-- Other music product revenue up 90% year over year
-- Strong sales of iTunes and iPod accesories
-- iTunes Music Store - 85% marketshare.
-- Enthusiastic about upcoming iTunes/iPod products in the pipeline
- Retail
-- 146 stores open during quarter.
-- 50% of buyers are new to Mac.
- Outlook:
-- "Very excited about and confident in the products in our pipeline."

Q&A

Q: How important is it to hit the holiday season. and how innovative can innovative be [w/ respect to iPods]?
A: We don't talk about unannounced products, but "very confident" in products in our pipeline.

Q: Markets: Consumer, Education, Pro
A: The MacBook was in high demand in both consumer and education. Pro market has been slow - thought to be due to wait in PowerMac with Intel and some Universal apps. Education market did very well. Higher edu grew 31% year to year. Very well poised in going into school season.

Q: Assuming any contribution from Leopard for the September [next] quarter?
A: We've not announced the ship date for Leopard, but will show the new features at WWDC.

Q: Does the fact that Intel rolls our processors more quickly and drops prices affect you? Will you be adjusting prices more frequently or same as you have been with new product releases?
A: We're very pleased to be working with Intel. A great partner. They have the best processor by far in our current and upcoming products. Pleased with the new products, but as you know we don't discuss our unannounced products. don't want to comment on how we'll be changing our pricing.

Q: Will there be any surprises at WWDC?
A: [Laughter, then Openheimer:] Well, you will have to come and attend.


Digg This (http://digg.com/apple/Apple_s_Q3_2006_Financial_Results_Are_In!_2nd_Best_In_Company_History!)

esquared
Jul 19, 2006, 03:42 PM
and the train kept 'a rollin', all night long.

Shaun.P
Jul 19, 2006, 03:43 PM
This is excellent. iPod sales are slowing down however this is to be expected. Nice to see the Mac sales well above the million mark.

macidiot
Jul 19, 2006, 03:43 PM
What, the analysts weren't even close? I'm shocked. :rolleyes:

liketom
Jul 19, 2006, 03:43 PM
i get the feelling i helped ... yet again with a few of them macs and pods:D

great results

Cubert
Jul 19, 2006, 03:46 PM
Boooo-Yahhhh!

Quoth Jim Cramer.

p0intblank
Jul 19, 2006, 03:46 PM
Impressive numbers! :D Intel Mac sales are actually higher than I thought they'd be. And of course, the iPod is the leader once again.

mainstreetmark
Jul 19, 2006, 03:47 PM
Count me in, too.

Of course, they got an extra $200 out of me, because I wanted a black Macbook. *grumble*

plinden
Jul 19, 2006, 03:47 PM
There are more details here - http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/060719/sfw089.html?.v=60

At the end of the page is a breakdown in the sales figures.

Desktop sales are down 14% on last quarter, and 23% on a year ago, but laptop sales are up a whopping 60% on last quarter and 61% on a year ago.

im_to_hyper
Jul 19, 2006, 03:47 PM
Other than recently, how often have Mac sales been in the million+ a quarter? Didn't 2002 or something only see that many shipped the entire year?

sfwalter
Jul 19, 2006, 03:47 PM
Those analysts really need to do their homework. They brought Apple's stock down because of their negativity. Since they were wrong I think the analysts need to reimburse shareholders for lost money :).

longofest
Jul 19, 2006, 03:48 PM
What, the analysts weren't even close? I'm shocked. :rolleyes:

Actually, the analysts were pretty close this time, except for the profit margins. I'm thinking that the fact that the iPod is now using older parts (therefore cheaper parts) is pushing the cost down for Apple, and hence really making it a big cash cow and driving up the profit margin, even if they aren't selling quite as many as last quarter (which also has to do with seasonal decline).

Edit: oops... it appears as though the analysts definitely did blow the whole revenue expectation a bit. Missed that.

ampd
Jul 19, 2006, 03:49 PM
one of these days when I have enough money (hopefully by around Aug. 7th) I will be able to buy a mac and become part of those stats.

Mulyahnto
Jul 19, 2006, 03:51 PM
Analysts' expectation of $3.68B revenue is incorrect. Apple exceeded income expectations by 10c per share and was in line with revenue expectation of about $4.4B.

andiwm2003
Jul 19, 2006, 03:52 PM
Where are all you "Apple is doomed" sayers now?:p :D

Apples sells ~4 Million Macs per quater. That's ~16 Mio a year. Given a 4 Year Life time that's "only" ~64 Mio Mac's installed, maybe more. That should be enough to keep developers happy.

So ADOBE, release those f#$%ing universal binaries NOW!!!!

plinden
Jul 19, 2006, 03:53 PM
Other than recently, how often have Mac sales been in the million+ a quarter? Didn't 2002 or something only see that many shipped the entire year?
No - according to http://www.pegasus3d.com/total_share.html Mac sales have been above 3 million since 1998. But it looks like Apple's on track for > 5 million in 2006, the highest sales figures ever.

Where are all you "Apple is doomed" sayers now?:p :D

Apples sells ~4 Million Macs per quater. That's ~16 Mio a year. Given a 4 Year Life time that's "only" ~64 Mio Mac's installed, maybe more. That should be enough to keep developers happy.
No, please re-read the figures - it's 1.327 million Macs for the last quarter.

Peace
Jul 19, 2006, 03:54 PM
Woo Hoo!! Keep it up guys!!

Queso
Jul 19, 2006, 03:54 PM
Nice to see the mothership sailing smoothly. What do you reckon for the Christmas quarter? Is 2 million Macs possible?

Mulyahnto
Jul 19, 2006, 03:55 PM
I think iPod and Mac sales volume was towards the high end of the range of analysts' predictions. iPod and Mac sales volume is a more important indicator than revenue, I think.

longofest
Jul 19, 2006, 03:57 PM
For those who do the digging thing: http://digg.com/apple/Apple_s_Q3_2006_Financial_Results_Are_In!_2nd_Best_In_Company_History!

macidiot
Jul 19, 2006, 03:59 PM
Actually, the analysts were pretty close this time, except for the profit margins. I'm thinking that the fact that the iPod is now using older parts (therefore cheaper parts) is pushing the cost down for Apple, and hence really making it a big cash cow and driving up the profit margin, even if they aren't selling quite as many as last quarter (which also has to do with seasonal decline).

Edit: oops... it appears as though the analysts definitely did blow the whole revenue expectation a bit. Missed that.

Actually, they were completely off base with their Mac estimates. Since it appears that most people on Wall St. think that Apple only makes iPods, this is no surprise.

Most estimates were for around 1 million Macs sold. Apple came in at 1.3 million. There's the margin difference right there.

lOUDsCREAMEr
Jul 19, 2006, 04:01 PM
does it mean mac's desktop market share is climbing? 5%?

Mulyahnto
Jul 19, 2006, 04:01 PM
No - according to http://www.pegasus3d.com/total_share.html Mac sales have been above 3 million since 1998. But it looks like Apple's on track for > 5 million in 2006, the highest sales figures ever.

Apple has been shipping at least 1 million Macs per quarter since Q1 2005. They shipped ~800K in Q4 2004.

Mulyahnto
Jul 19, 2006, 04:03 PM
Actually, they were completely off base with their Mac estimates. Since it appears that most people on Wall St. think that Apple only makes iPods, this is no surprise.

Most estimates were for around 1 million Macs sold. Apple came in at 1.3 million. There's the margin difference right there.

This is what page 1 reported a couple days ago:


They predict Apple sales results that are close to but slightly lower than the Wall Street consensus estimates, with iPod quarterly sales between 7.7 and 8.3 million units, Mac sales of 1.2 to 1.23 million units, and revenue of $4.6 billion and $0.48 earnings per share, compared to Wall Street estimates for revenue of $4.95 billion and $0.52 earnings per share.

jholzner
Jul 19, 2006, 04:03 PM
Where are all you "Apple is doomed" sayers now?:p :D

Apples sells ~4 Million Macs per quater. That's ~16 Mio a year. Given a 4 Year Life time that's "only" ~64 Mio Mac's installed, maybe more. That should be enough to keep developers happy.

So ADOBE, release those f#$%ing universal binaries NOW!!!!

Huh? Apple doesn't come close to selling 4 million Macs per quarter! They sold just above 1.3 million this quarter.

lu0s3r322
Jul 19, 2006, 04:04 PM
that's great news. w00t im a first time conference call listener! :p

macidiot
Jul 19, 2006, 04:04 PM
does it mean mac's desktop market share is climbing? 5%?

It would appear so. Apple's computer sales rose faster than the overall market. But, most of those sales were laptops... so the desktop marketshare is probably falling ;)

Peace
Jul 19, 2006, 04:07 PM
It would appear so. Apple's computer sales rose faster than the overall market. But, most of those sales were laptops... so the desktop marketshare is probably falling ;)


Wait till next quarter when the MacPro line-up comes out and new iPods etc..
Q4 is gonna kick some butt!!

macidiot
Jul 19, 2006, 04:15 PM
Wait till next quarter when the MacPro line-up comes out and new iPods etc..
Q4 is gonna kick some butt!!

Which is exactly why the past few weeks have been a great time to load up on Apple stock. Apple has been increasing computer sales with transitional computers. The "real" machines aren't out yet.

In other words, Apple growth won't be slowing down any time soon. In fact, it should probably accelerate over the next 12 months.

Apple just needs to do a phone. Then you could probably add another billion or two to revenue...

theBB
Jul 19, 2006, 04:17 PM
There are more details here - http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/060719/sfw089.html?.v=60
Desktop sales are down 14% on last quarter, and 23% on a year ago, but laptop sales are up a whopping 60% on last quarter and 61% on a year ago.
23% drop in desktop sales is surprising to me. Is it just due to people waiting for PowerMacs with Intels? It is not a good sign that higher iMac sales are not making up for it.

Of course, maybe Apple sold so many Mac Minis last year, that a drop was inevitable.

liketom
Jul 19, 2006, 04:20 PM
Which is exactly why the past few weeks have been a great time to load up on Apple stock. Apple has been increasing computer sales with transitional computers. The "real" machines aren't out yet.

In other words, Apple growth won't be slowing down any time soon. In fact, it should probably accelerate over the next 12 months.



with a little help from us Mac users out here who end up buying 2 Macs or more a year ;)

i tell you this year is getting real expensive for me , Mac Mini Intel then the Black Book and later this year the new Mac Pro and just don't even talk about iPods yet :D Apple is skinting me worse then a divorce

theBB
Jul 19, 2006, 04:21 PM
Which is exactly why the past few weeks have been a great time to load up on Apple stock. Apple has been increasing computer sales with transitional computers. The "real" machines aren't out yet.

In other words, Apple growth won't be slowing down any time soon. In fact, it should probably accelerate over the next 12 months.

When the "real" machines are out, Vista will be out as well. Unless Leopard has revolutionary improvements, the difference between Windows and OSX+iLife would be much less than that it is today. I would still appreciate the UNIX under the hood, but I doubt most consumers care. If Mac sales or market share starts to come down a bit due to fewer switchers, the share price could easily crash.

shawnce
Jul 19, 2006, 04:23 PM
I see a little confusion on numbers, for the straight facts review the two PDFs provided by Apple (data summary is a good one to understand unit volumes)...

Q306 Data Summary (http://images.apple.com/pr/pdf/q306data_sum.pdf)

Q306 Financial Statements (http://images.apple.com/pr/pdf/q306fin_statements.pdf)

Core Trio
Jul 19, 2006, 04:23 PM
Most critical applications to be out in september? wouldnt adobe fall into this category???

bluelovesorange
Jul 19, 2006, 04:28 PM
for me, yes, and i bet a bunch others too

Peace
Jul 19, 2006, 04:28 PM
Most critical applications to be out in september? wouldnt adobe fall into this category???

could be the universal binary of Office

ahuman7341
Jul 19, 2006, 04:29 PM
Most critical applications to be out in september? wouldnt adobe fall into this category???

I was thinking the same things and didn't adobe say that their stuff would be out in md 2007?

lOUDsCREAMEr
Jul 19, 2006, 04:29 PM
Most critical applications to be out in september? wouldnt adobe fall into this category???

isn't he referring to Apple's own apps?

but wait, what are the critical Apple apps that are yet not in universal binary?:eek:

Compile 'em all
Jul 19, 2006, 04:30 PM
23% drop in desktop sales is surprising to me. Is it just due to people waiting for PowerMacs with Intels? It is not a good sign that higher iMac sales are not making up for it.


This is actually the general trend in the computer market since the rise of
portables against desktop machines. Portables are becoming increasingly
powerful (computational-wise) up to the point that the line between them
and Desktops is blurred.

swingerofbirch
Jul 19, 2006, 04:32 PM
How could the analysts be off by almost a billion dollars? Are they held to account for this?

macidiot
Jul 19, 2006, 04:33 PM
When the "real" machines are out, Vista will be out as well. Unless Leopard has revolutionary improvements, the difference between Windows and OSX+iLife would be much less than that it is today. I would still appreciate the UNIX under the hood, but I doubt most consumers care. If Mac sales or market share starts to come down a bit due to fewer switchers, the share price could easily crash.

Vista vs. Leopard is a moot point. There is enough pent up demand for high end desktops to fuel growth for some time. Switchers aren't material in this market. Besides, desktop buyers aren't waiting for Leopard, they are waiting for universal binaries from Adobe.

Vista will have zero near term effect. The simple truth is that you won't see widespread adoption of Vista for at least 12-18 months. And that is assuming Vista actually ships when it is supposed to. Which is no sure thing.

As for the consumer, what they care about is stability and security. imo, that is what is getting switchers. Your right that they don't care how it's being done. However, Vista will be far more secure than xp when it comes out. At least for a month or so. It will take at least a few weeks for good malware to come out for it...

theBB
Jul 19, 2006, 04:33 PM
This is actually the general trend in the computer market since the rise of
portables against desktop machines. Portables are becoming increasingly
powerful (computational-wise) up to the point that the line between them
and Desktops is blurred.
Yes, laptops are getting more popular, but I don't remember other companies losing 23% of desktop sales in one year. I guess Apple sells few computers to companies who might be buying a bigger share of desktops nowadays, but still...

milo
Jul 19, 2006, 04:34 PM
Wow, already up to 75% intel machines. So much for the stupid notion that nobody wants intel because there are still big apps that aren't universal.

freeny
Jul 19, 2006, 04:37 PM
stocks up 7.45% in after hours.....:)

Applespider
Jul 19, 2006, 04:39 PM
Wow, already up to 75% intel machines. So much for the stupid notion that nobody wants intel because there are still big apps that aren't universal.

No, 75% of Macs sold in the last 3 months were Intels which given that most of the Macs are Intels, isn't that surprising.

The OS X install base has around 940,000 Intel users and several million PPC users

macidiot
Jul 19, 2006, 04:41 PM
How could the analysts be off by almost a billion dollars? Are they held to account for this?

Of course not. Their job is to not be accurate. Their job is to generate revenue, usually in the form of stock trades. If they are accurate, it is usually because the company they are covering essentially gave them the EXACT numbers.

Analyst downgrades stock, people sell. Analyst upgrades stock, people buy. rinse, repeat every couple of months.

However, most analysts are pleasant people. Must be from those mid-six figure salaries.

deputy_doofy
Jul 19, 2006, 04:42 PM
This is actually the general trend in the computer market since the rise of
portables against desktop machines. Portables are becoming increasingly
powerful (computational-wise) up to the point that the line between them
and Desktops is blurred.

Agreed. I love my dual-proc G5, but a little more than a year later, I still find myself using my PB G4 more simply because it's with me almost all the time. That said, I'll be buying a nice, little portable monster (MPB w/C2D) to rival my G5. :D

network23
Jul 19, 2006, 04:46 PM
I fully believe the lower desktop numbers are due to people waiting for the Intel-based desktops. The wonderful thing about Macs are that they aren't always in need of updating, so it's not a problem to wait until they are released.

Expect a huge increase in desktop sales the next quarter or two (if indeed the Mac Pro with Intel line appears next month).

Queso
Jul 19, 2006, 04:47 PM
Interesting comment from the conference call is that only 39% of Apple sales are now international. That was 50% not too long ago.

Based on that, the rise in Mac sales is almost exlusively US-based. If they can repeat that success in Japan, Europe etc., we could be looking at a lot more Mac sales every quarter.

milo
Jul 19, 2006, 04:49 PM
No, 75% of Macs sold in the last 3 months were Intels

That's exactly what I meant. I still think that's very impressive.

liketom
Jul 19, 2006, 04:49 PM
when asked are we expecting any surprises from WWDC regarding the music store - they just laughed :eek:

so i'd take that as movies are coming at WWDC

Stella
Jul 19, 2006, 04:51 PM
The figures seem OKish.
'

However, Apple are still slacking on markets outside the u.s
"International sales accounted for 39 percent of the quarter’s revenue."

Apple really need to sort themselves out.

BrianMojo
Jul 19, 2006, 04:54 PM
Wow, he basically just revealed they're working on an iPhone...

AvSRoCkCO1067
Jul 19, 2006, 04:54 PM
when asked are we expecting any surprises from WWDC regarding the music store - they just laughed :eek:

so i'd take that as movies are coming at WWDC

I heard this too - everyone laughed! I'm excited...:o

swingerofbirch
Jul 19, 2006, 04:55 PM
I've been listening live for a while and they are very tight lipped but they just said that they believe that cell phones are poor MP3 players compared to the iPod (I guess including their own cobranded cell phones?!!?). They said they realize it wont always be the case that iPods are superior to cell phones, and don't think we don't realize that etc, as if to suggest phone iPod integration.

Sony is with Ericsson.

I believe Nokia and Microsoft have some sort of alliance.

And we all know Apple for the second time decided to hitch their wagon to Motorola with the co-branded phone.

Who else is there? LG, Siemens, Samsung? Or would they do it alone? How hard can it be to make a cell phone?

liketom
Jul 19, 2006, 04:56 PM
Wow, he basically just revealed they're working on an iPhone...
nope just putting iTunes on the phone

Peace
Jul 19, 2006, 04:57 PM
Apple pretty much confirmed an iPhone in this call..

He said that cell phones dont play music very well.iPods do and they were doing something about that.

50548
Jul 19, 2006, 04:58 PM
The great numbers shown today just prove that this is the perfect moment to bury MS once and for all in the OS war...OS X is by far the best system, and Longsight is still more than 6 months away...Microsoft is doomed.

BrianMojo
Jul 19, 2006, 04:59 PM
nope just putting iTunes on the phone

Well, he clearly dismissed all current MP3/Phone integration setups and said that they're not just sitting around. It's no outright admission, but I'd say that's pretty revealing -- if he was refering to iTunes on a phone, I feel like he would've had a talking point ready for it. This seemed more like a "er, I just backed myself into this sentence" type thing.

AvSRoCkCO1067
Jul 19, 2006, 05:00 PM
The great numbers shown today just prove that this is the perfect moment to bury MS once and for all in the OS war...OS X is by far the best system, and Longsight is still more than 6 months away...Microsoft is doomed.

Yeah....no....

Aren't there still more people using Windows Me/Windows 98/Windows 95 than all Mac OS users...??? People don't upgrade quickly - it would be dozens of years before Apple could even have, say, a 25% marketshare.

liketom
Jul 19, 2006, 05:03 PM
The great numbers shown today just prove that this is the perfect moment to bury MS once and for all in the OS war...OS X is by far the best system, and Longsight is still more than 6 months away...Microsoft is doomed.
Apple has had a better OS IMO for years and i wish i'd switched much sooner then i did -

LongShight i think you mean Vista will be here next year and will be a big cash cow for Microsoft - will it work as well as Mac OS ? no,will it be better ? no ...but people will buy it and still get viruses and spyware

and whilst there are doing that i will still keep buying Mac's and adding to there Quarterly Profits :D

Well, he clearly dismissed all current MP3/Phone integration setups and said that they're not just sitting around. It's no outright admission, but I'd say that's pretty revealing -- if he was refering to iTunes on a phone, I feel like he would've had a talking point ready for it. This seemed more like a "er, I just backed myself into this sentence" type thing.
true - after posting i thought this too - well maybe, but i'll not get my hopes up like the Powerbook G5 thing;)

mdntcallr
Jul 19, 2006, 05:06 PM
very cool. happy apple is financially doing great.

now if only they would come out with the new macbook pro with cooler features and the merom faster processor.

dongmin
Jul 19, 2006, 05:10 PM
This past quarter was all about the MacBook. I wonder how much of the 500,000 laptops sold were MacBooks; I'd hazard to guess 70-75% The PowerBooks are currently bad buys, in my opinion. Hopefully, Apple will update the MBPs with a new design and new processors.

The dropoff in the desktops can be attributed to a couple factors:

1. The initial pent-up demand for Intel consumer desktops have now cooled. Apple will refresh the line this quarter which should help move a lot more of these units.

2. Now that the cat is out of the bag, everyone is waiting for an Intel pro desktop. If Apple is able to do some sort of joint Mac Pro and Adobe CS3 release, they'll sell these Mac Pros is truckloads.

Shooting from hip: I expect bigger Mac sales in September with the refresh of the desktops plus MBPs. Maybe in the 1.5 mil territory with higher profit margins.

And for the Xmas quarter, we could get close to the 2 mil mark. OK, maybe 2 mil is too ambitious; but I'd expect nothing less than 1.8 mil.

WCat
Jul 19, 2006, 05:10 PM
Like some others here have asked, I just have to wonder how some of these top-tier analysts manage to maintain cred with such lousy predictions? Not only were they off on the numbers quite a bit, but they were also off in the overall direction. That's pretty major.

Leave it to Apple to prove the "common knowledge" wrong yet again! Isn't that what they're best at??

kresh
Jul 19, 2006, 05:10 PM
LongShight i think you mean Vista will be here next year and will be a big cash cow for Microsoft - will it work as well as Mac OS ? no,will it be better ? no ...but people will buy it and still get viruses and spyware



I don't think that Windows is the reason that people will buy it. It has much more to do with the $499.99 price point, which buys a fairly decent machine for most home users.

Apple will never, ever dominate in marketshare. They are not geared for it profit margin wise, and I don't think they should be.

amac4me
Jul 19, 2006, 05:12 PM
Great quarter for Apple!

The introduction of the MacBook during the quarter really helped to drive Macintosh sales. The dip in desktop sales can be explained by the PowerMac (G5 processors) Once Apple releases the Intel powered PowerMac, there will be a dramatic increase in Macintosh desktop sales.

Apple is doing very well right now and I expect Macintosh sales to really spike as we head into the holiday shopping season.

Can anyone say increased "Market Share"?

:D :D :D

apple-science
Jul 19, 2006, 05:15 PM
Would be interesting to see the trajectory of sales. Jobs usually shows such a graph at the keynotes - anyone got the data to post to see if the trend is slowing and by how much?

It's remarkable that iPods are still selling so well given the stale refresh rate. Still, Microsoft would love a piece of 8.1 million sales for Zune.....

generik
Jul 19, 2006, 05:24 PM
- 2nd highest quarterly sales and earnings in Apple's history


Made possible by paying 10c for each Mac constructed with a high quality and proficient workforce.

NewSc2
Jul 19, 2006, 05:31 PM
It would appear so. Apple's computer sales rose faster than the overall market. But, most of those sales were laptops... so the desktop marketshare is probably falling ;)

I think more people nowadays are looking to buy a laptop over a desktop. Let's say the average computer user upgrades their computer every 3 years... 3 years ago, the laptop to desktop discrepancy overall was pretty huge.

Nowadays? Not so much.

Anyways, a rising laptop share is better than a rising desktop share, imo.

iJawn108
Jul 19, 2006, 05:31 PM
:) I contributed to these stats I bought a shuffle... now apple hurry up and release leopard so i can give you more sales numbers in Q4.:cool:

LastLine
Jul 19, 2006, 05:35 PM
Where are all you "Apple is doomed" sayers now?:p :D

Apples sells ~4 Million Macs per quater. That's ~16 Mio a year. Given a 4 Year Life time that's "only" ~64 Mio Mac's installed, maybe more. That should be enough to keep developers happy.

So ADOBE, release those f#$%ing universal binaries NOW!!!!
*Most critical applications will be converted by September*

Interesting...

stagi
Jul 19, 2006, 05:37 PM
Sounds like some pretty sweet things are coming for iTunes, can't wait!

paulsecic
Jul 19, 2006, 05:38 PM
and the train kept 'a rollin', all night long.
I'm about ready to buy a 20" iMac but I want the new OS. How long do I have to wait?

Peace
Jul 19, 2006, 05:39 PM
I'm about ready to buy a 20" iMac but I want the new OS. How long do I have to wait?


not as long as Vista customers will have to wait :D

lOUDsCREAMEr
Jul 19, 2006, 05:40 PM
I'm about ready to buy a 20" iMac but I want the new OS. How long do I have to wait?

around six months or less

longofest
Jul 19, 2006, 05:46 PM
not as long as Vista customers will have to wait :D

It never gets old... ;)

supremedesigner
Jul 19, 2006, 05:51 PM
What, the analysts weren't even close? I'm shocked. :rolleyes:

analysts always assumed too much!!!!!!!!! :rolleyes:

treblah
Jul 19, 2006, 05:51 PM
Good Lord, 9.5 Billion in the Bank!

Dear Apple,

This just makes .Mac sucking that much more incredible.

Please hire some .Mac engineers.

Thanks,

Every Apple User in the World

supremedesigner
Jul 19, 2006, 05:53 PM
Boooo-Yahhhh!

Quoth Jim Cramer.

ha!

banjomamo
Jul 19, 2006, 06:01 PM
I bought 3 macs in this last quarter, so I accounted for 0.00023% of their revenue. Rock on Apple. Don't ever stop.

bigmc6000
Jul 19, 2006, 06:14 PM
Good Lord, 9.5 Billion in the Bank!

Dear Apple,

This just makes .Mac sucking that much more incredible.

Please hire some .Mac engineers.

Thanks,

Every Apple User in the World

I've been holding off on .Mac for quite some time. I'd love to use my iWeb as I've got quite a few picture pages I'd like to make but combining the .mac experience with the horrendous price tag I'm stuck uploading to yahoo for free for eternity. PLEASE - no more than $49 for a year, even that is too much IMO but I'll take it...

Side note: AAPL stock up 8.43% in afterhours - within 1 billion of Dell now. *Play Jaws theme song here* :-D (figuring in both stocks after market #'s...)

wealjays
Jul 19, 2006, 06:25 PM
I'm about ready to buy a 20" iMac but I want the new OS. How long do I have to wait?

I dont know for sure but isnt an OS upgrade with apple like $25 a piece in a family pack?

Why dont you get the computer you want now and in 6 months shell out the extra few bucks for Leopard.

Remember they arent Microsoft that charges an arm and a leg for windows.


p.s. This seems obvious. Am I missing something?:confused:

macrumors12345
Jul 19, 2006, 06:25 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

Apple posted their (http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2006/jul/19results.html) 3rd Quarter 2006 financial results today.

Apple posted revenue of $4.37 billion and a net quarterly profit of $472 million or $.54 per diluted share. For reference, the year-ago quarter brought in $3.53 billion in revenue, net profit of $320 million or $.37 per diluted share.

Apple shipped 1,327,000 Macintosh computers and 8,111,000 iPods during this quarter which represents a 12% growth in Macs and 32% growth in iPods year-over-year.

- 75% of Macs sold during the quarter used Intel processors.
- 2nd highest quarterly sales and earnings in Apple's history

Live streaming of the results conference call will be broadcast at 5pm EST (http://www.apple.com/quicktime/qtv/earningsq306/).

Digg This (http://digg.com/apple/Apple_s_Q3_2006_Financial_Results_Are_In!_2nd_Best_In_Company_History!)

The numbers on portables and desktops aren't right (looks like they are Q3 05 numbers). The right numbers are 800k laptops and 527k desktops.

yac_moda
Jul 19, 2006, 06:26 PM
Seeee Steve, I told you if you SWITCH to Intel market shart will rise :eek:

BornAgainMac
Jul 19, 2006, 06:32 PM
I bet at the Developer's conference that Adobe and Microsoft announce Universal Binaries for September.

rdowns
Jul 19, 2006, 06:33 PM
Here are historical Mac sales by quarter.

1Q2000 - 1,377,000
2Q2000 - 1,043,000
3Q2000 - 1,016,000
4Q2000 - 1,122,000

1Q2001 - 659,000
2Q2001 - 751,000
3Q2001 - 827,000
4Q2001 - 850,000

1Q2002 - 659,000
2Q2002 - 813,000
3Q2002 - 808,000
4Q2002 - 734,000

1Q2003 - 743,000
2Q2003 - 711,000
3Q2003 - 771,000
4Q2003 - 787,000

1Q2004 - 743,000
2Q2004 - 749,000
3Q2004 - 771,000
4Q2004 - 787,000

1Q2005 - 1,046,000
2Q2005 - 1,070,000
3Q2005 - 1,182,000
4Q2005 - 1,236,000

1Q2006- 1,254,000
2Q2006- 1,112,000
3Q2006- 1,327,000

swingerofbirch
Jul 19, 2006, 06:39 PM
I didn't hear the entire conference call--did anyone ask about the virtual slave labor they've got going on in China?

It's easy to have good numbers when it's someone else's belt your tightening!

lOUDsCREAMEr
Jul 19, 2006, 06:41 PM
Here are historical Mac sales by quarter.

1Q2000 - 1,377,000
2Q2000 - 1,043,000
3Q2000 - 1,016,000
4Q2000 - 1,122,000

1Q2001 - 659,000
2Q2001 - 751,000
3Q2001 - 827,000
4Q2001 - 850,000

1Q2002 - 659,000
2Q2002 - 813,000
3Q2002 - 808,000
4Q2002 - 734,000

1Q2003 - 743,000
2Q2003 - 711,000
3Q2003 - 771,000
4Q2003 - 787,000

1Q2004 - 743,000
2Q2004 - 749,000
3Q2004 - 771,000
4Q2004 - 787,000

1Q2005 - 1,046,000
2Q2005 - 1,070,000
3Q2005 - 1,182,000
4Q2005 - 1,236,000

1Q2006- 1,254,000
2Q2006- 1,112,000
3Q2006- 1,327,000

what happened exactly in between 2000-Q4 and 2001-Q1?

Apple Corps
Jul 19, 2006, 06:42 PM
does it mean mac's desktop market share is climbing? 5%?

No - they are actually losing market share.

macmunch
Jul 19, 2006, 06:45 PM
Thats very cool !

I see high chance to even better Results ...

1. Look for People which wait for the Mac Pro (its me and at least 3-4 of my friends, 2 of them Switchers)
2. iPod no major new features (New model will boost Sales)
3. More Stores ---> more People who learn about Macs and try them out (50% new to mac in stores) ----> Here is much Space in Europe ecspecially in Germany !!! Every 11 or 12 PC user knows Mac or OS X, some know Apple cause of the iPod ....
4. The Good old guys which wait for Revision 2 of a Mac :D

bye

dsnort
Jul 19, 2006, 06:47 PM
As a recent "switcher", I feel personally responsible for these numbers. An iMac 20" intel, a Black Book, a Nano and a shuffle in the last 3 months! ( Of course, I'm totally broke now, and the kids are going hungry, but it's nice to see Apple doing well!)

ObsidianIce
Jul 19, 2006, 06:55 PM
Ahhh, as a loyal user, and stockholder this is what i like to hear. And i agree it is nice to personally be able to say that you've helped!

yac_moda
Jul 19, 2006, 06:56 PM
So here are the plans for the future that I passed on to Apple that will make market share GO THROUGH THE ROOF :eek: :eek: :eek:

First priority: Update Xcode to cross compile -- MacsWin.

P2: Make a hands free iPod, voice control, voice feedback, a big screen for podcast video, communications integration or support. Demonstrate secure servers for podcasts.
The MILITARY will eat this up, and THAT will give Apple and Macs credibility with corporations.

P3: Invent wireless disposable earphones, that is a permanent battery that lasts about a year, Bluetooth, a wire between the two ears with a small box in the middle that clips to your collar which contains a micro phone. Make them standard for Macs, iPods, phones. Offer a return bonus, and make them locatable/beep via BT secure access if lost.

P4: Make an Apple phone that supports messaging of all types interchangeably as text and voice. This means servers or the phone listens to people as they talk and uses that as training to later convert stored text to voice on the fly. Support voice mail with Email. Thus voice and text will be truly interchangeable for frequent callers and VOIP can be enhanced, sound clearer plus all sorts of features based and voice/text prompts and control. Like tell your Mac to control your house or reboot or run an Applescript.

P5: Merge Disney and Apple and create the hardware that will allow for truly interactive movies in theaters. Laser tracking for each audience member for a gesture and body language interface, for movies with audience controlled scenarios. This professional movie and game interface will be the basis for a future family game platform.

Although this merger is very dependent upon a greatly improved Xcode that can support LARGE groups and is VERY easy to program with, we have a good start but we need MORE !!! :eek:

yac_moda
Jul 19, 2006, 07:00 PM
No - they are actually losing market share.

"-- 50% of buyers are new to Mac."

The way to compare is not from one quarter to the next, but 3rd quarter with 3rd quarter (Very seasonal buying by education scews all comp companies number this way.) -- SO THEY HAVE HAD A HUGE JUMP :eek:

But we will have to wait to see exactly how much.

kiwi-in-uk
Jul 19, 2006, 07:02 PM
what happened exactly in between 2000-Q4 and 2001-Q1?
OS X?

mi5moav
Jul 19, 2006, 07:02 PM
Well, during 2000-2001 that was a long waiting period for OSX... and then of course during the Q4 of 2001 we had 9-11

dongmin
Jul 19, 2006, 07:03 PM
what happened exactly in between 2000-Q4 and 2001-Q1?Such short memories...

2001-Q1 would be when the "Dot.com Bubble" burst. The whole PC industry tanked, not just Apple. Motorola was also struggling to bring faster G4 processors to market, if I remember correctly.

yac_moda
Jul 19, 2006, 07:15 PM
Apple is up 8.6 % after hours :eek: :eek: :eek:


Does anybody think the stock pricing in the last 3 days was insider trading that indicated the coming good results.

I can't tell but looking at the 5 days chart -- maybe :confused:

EagerDragon
Jul 19, 2006, 07:20 PM
All this fear that iPod and MAcs are in a down turn. Apple will blow them away real soon. They don't sleep on their Laurel unless they don't have a choice.

Wonder what will happen to the stock tomorrow?

Too bad im broke and could not buy any.

kresh
Jul 19, 2006, 07:27 PM
Such short memories...

2001-Q1 would be when the "Dot.com Bubble" burst. The whole PC industry tanked, not just Apple. Motorola was also struggling to bring faster G4 processors to market, if I remember correctly.

Ah, those were the days.

A one page web-site, drooling capital venurists, a silly name like "BoxOfRox.com", and the day of your IPO your stock was $100 a share. Set for life I tell ya.

EagerDragon
Jul 19, 2006, 07:28 PM
Nice to see the mothership sailing smoothly. What do you reckon for the Christmas quarter? Is 2 million Macs possible?

Given the popularity of the MacBook, the MacBook pro, the iMac, and soon the Mac Pro, and the ability to hedge your bets by running windows, I would think that 2 mil or maybe 2.2 mil Macs are possible in the Xmas quater.

Care to bet?

yac_moda
Jul 19, 2006, 07:29 PM
All this fear that iPod and MAcs are in a down turn. Apple will blow them away real soon. They don't sleep on their Laurel unless they don't have a choice.

Wonder what will happen to the stock tomorrow?

Too bad im broke and could not buy any.


My guess is it will open UP a great deal, around $4 then drop $1 or 2, 2 hours into the day and then climb to finish up 5 to 6$ :D

Seasonally and VERY consistently AAPL drops from March to the end of sept and then rises strongly from late Aug. to Christmas. Then rises more in Jan. rests in Feb. and quickly and unpredictably peaks in March or May !?!?!?!

Some years you will make %100 playing it this way, every once in a while you might loose %10, when betting makes bets that have BIG upsides and small downsides !!!

yac_moda
Jul 19, 2006, 07:38 PM
Ah, those were the days.

A one page web-site, drooling capital venurists, a silly name like "BoxOfRox.com", and the day of your IPO your stock was $100 a share. Set for life I tell ya.

NOT NEAR AS BAD AS THE ROARING 20s when many IPOs were openly pyramid schemes -- pyramid scheme TODAYS HOUSING MARKET :eek: :mad:

Have you ever noticed that old timers LIKE pyramid schema !!!

I guess that is why DELL was once sooo popular :rolleyes:

kresh
Jul 19, 2006, 07:38 PM
Wow. I still can't get used to the positive press coming from dedicated PC sources.

Lance Ulanoff is predicting Apple to sell more notebooks than Gateway by the end of 2006 and give Dell a run for the money.

link: http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,1990674,00.asp

Wowee. I love it!


edit: spelling

EagerDragon
Jul 19, 2006, 07:43 PM
Vista will be out as well. Unless Leopard has revolutionary improvements, the difference between Windows and OSX+iLife would be much less than that it is today. I would still appreciate the UNIX under the hood, but I doubt most consumers care. If Mac sales or market share starts to come down a bit due to fewer switchers, the share price could easily crash.

Vista sucks, there is very little incentive for people to upgrade. Leopard will ROCK, is a lot faster then Tiger and has a lot of new functionality. They are not even going to show all the stuff under the hood at the presentation.

Windows Vista is "Asta La Vista" even the virus guys say that it wont be that secured either. Why should people upgrade? Most sales will come from new machines, people will get Vista by default.....Some time mid year, not in January BTW. Little to no sales in the first year for Vista. Large corporations take 2 to 3 years to deploy, and a lot of school are considering Macs running windows, so that is also good for the hardware side.

Redmond has a lot of problems including morale, and lack of creativity.

Our club is growing and is growing fast. We rock!!!!!

dlittle
Jul 19, 2006, 08:12 PM
The article posted:
- Desktops: 614,000, down 14% from previous quarter
- Portables: 498,000, up 60% from previous quarter

I belive these numbers are for last quarter (note they don't add to 1.3M macs). They should post a correction.

EagerDragon
Jul 19, 2006, 08:12 PM
I'm about ready to buy a 20" iMac but I want the new OS. How long do I have to wait?

January best time to buy. New OS is pre-installed, no need to buy computer and OS.
Besides the iMac will either get Meron in about 2 weeks or will get Conroe. Wait!!!!! Get the new machine and new OS together. Just a few months.

shawnce
Jul 19, 2006, 08:17 PM
Vista sucks, there is very little incentive for people to upgrade.

Actually Vista is rather good in various areas in comparison to Windows XP SP2 and it is getting better as MS nears release (I use is it on various Windows developer systems I do work on and note my primary work is Mac development on Mac OS X). Don't discount Vista...

Of course with that said... even if Vista is amazing (in comparison to Tiger/Leopard) the fact that Vista will often require users to upgrade older computers to make it usable will play to Apple's advantage. The upgrade (hardware and software) disruption that Vista is going to cause is a perfect point for folks thinking about switching to a Mac to make the jump... they have to spend the money anyways so why not get a Mac (especially since if they don't like Mac OS X they can fallback on running Vista or XP on it).

shawnce
Jul 19, 2006, 08:19 PM
The article posted:
- Desktops: 614,000, down 14% from previous quarter
- Portables: 498,000, up 60% from previous quarter

I belive these numbers are for last quarter (note they don't add to 1.3M macs). They should post a correction.

Yup... the correct numbers can be found in this PDF (http://images.apple.com/pr/pdf/q306data_sum.pdf) ... they should be 529,000 and 798,000 respectively.

theBB
Jul 19, 2006, 08:22 PM
Well, during 2000-2001 that was a long waiting period for OSX... and then of course during the Q4 of 2001 we had 9-11
No, 9-11 happened in Q1 of 2002 according to Apple's fiscal calendar.

Vista sucks, there is very little incentive for people to upgrade. Leopard will ROCK, is a lot faster then Tiger and has a lot of new functionality.
Take a pill... Vista may not better than Tiger, but it certainly is better than XP.

treblah
Jul 19, 2006, 08:25 PM
Leopard will ROCK, is a lot faster then Tiger and has a lot of new functionality. They are not even going to show all the stuff under the hood at the presentation.

Source? :rolleyes:

theBB
Jul 19, 2006, 08:30 PM
Vista will often require users to upgrade older computers to make it usable will play to Apple's advantage. The upgrade (hardware and software) disruption that Vista is going to cause is a perfect point for folks thinking about switching to a Mac to make the jump... they have to spend the money anyways so why not get a Mac (especially since if they don't like Mac OS X they can fallback on running Vista or XP on it).
But, look at it from the other angle. If Vista and Leopard does not look all that different, why switch to a Mac? Tiger would be a bit more user friendly to maintain, iLife might end up being less buggy, but you gotta balance that againts the "fear of the unknown", repurchasing some of your software and lack of close friends etc. to "borrow" software from. I am not that upbeat about 2007 for OSX.

lOUDsCREAMEr
Jul 19, 2006, 08:38 PM
Source? :rolleyes:

"super secret apple rumors" :D

EagerDragon
Jul 19, 2006, 08:42 PM
Actually Vista is rather good in various areas in comparison to Windows XP SP2 and it is getting better as MS nears release (I use is it on various Windows developer systems I do work on and note my primary work is Mac development on Mac OS X). Don't discount Vista...

Of course with that said... even if Vista is amazing (in comparison to Tiger/Leopard) the fact that Vista will often require users to upgrade older computers to make it usable will play to Apple's advantage. The upgrade (hardware and software) disruption that Vista is going to cause is a perfect point for folks thinking about switching to a Mac to make the jump... they have to spend the money anyways so why not get a Mac (especially since if they don't like Mac OS X they can fallback on running Vista or XP on it).

Did you noticed you compared Vista to XP and said it was "rather good and getting better?

I agree with most of what you stated, but..... With all the carving that M$ performed on Vista, IMHO there is little reason to drive the current XP users to switch to Vista. Besides as you stated, it is likely to need a large numbers of users to upgrade in order to see some eye candy that looks cool.

You are using it, what will drive the sales?

Compare that to the % of users that upgraded to Tiger in the first and secon year and % wise Tiger was a lot more attractive that Vista will be to upgraders.

Leopard will be an even bigger hit.

But yes I agree with most of what you stated, but it sucks compared to Tiger and Leopard.

Fabio_gsilva
Jul 19, 2006, 08:42 PM
Made possible by paying 10c for each Mac constructed with a high quality and proficient workforce.

Well, if you discovered this just now: welcome to the real world.:rolleyes:

yac_moda
Jul 19, 2006, 08:44 PM
But, look at it from the other angle. If Vista and Leopard does not look all that different, why switch to a Mac? Tiger would be a bit more user friendly to maintain, iLife might end up being less buggy, but you gotta balance that againts the "fear of the unknown", repurchasing some of your software and lack of close friends etc. to "borrow" software from. I am not that upbeat about 2007 for OSX.

MS is functioning with BG for the FIRST TIME, they have lost their IDOL their reason for being -- will they go insane :confused:

WHAT is the historical precedence for this :confused: :confused:

Lets see Japan lost their GOD, their king after WW2, replaced him with MacArthur who rebuilt their industry, but for a long time THEY JUST COPIED AMERICAN GOODS even though they had newer equipment.

HHHMMM !!! Could this mean the MS will collapse because they spent their best years copying everything tech !?!?!?!?

NO ! I think they will emerge eventually as a new company, BUT FIRST THEY WILL HAVE TO QUIT COMPUTERS !!

A new company that builds all things based on thar XBox.

And things won't work out until they jettison Balmer :D

EagerDragon
Jul 19, 2006, 08:47 PM
Source? :rolleyes:

Little birdy. running the code.

theBB
Jul 19, 2006, 08:52 PM
Lets see Japan lost their GOD, their king after WW2, replaced him with MacArthur who rebuilt their industry
Actually, after WW2 Japan kept the emperor, so they had "one god talking to another [MacArthur]" for a while.

yac_moda
Jul 19, 2006, 09:06 PM
Actually, after WW2 Japan kept the emperor, so they had "one god talking to another [MacArthur]" for a while.

"emperor" thanks I was having a hard time finding the right words on that one.

But he had previously NEVER appeared in public, too GODLY, he appeared in public so they saw that he was HUMAN !!!

Probably QUITE a disappointment.


There should be other examples from history though ...

Remember Gates took his last position just because the devisions were fighting with each other ENDLESSLY ?!?!!?!?

YES I can see it now, further and NASTY delays for Vista which continues to SLAM Dell, which in turn BOOSTs Apple.

Then Balmer MUST go, because all the premadana's at MS will blame him, THEY WILL ALL BE TO BLAME !

I learned early on in High School that a team of Supermen ALWAYS fail because they won't play as a team and constantly quit expecting winning to be EASY -- THIS IS MICROSOFT !!!

Then a new CEO will clean house and make a regular company out of it, but first he will have to DUMP Windows because support and WORTHLESS development will be draining too much money from the company, and by then the XBox will be profitable just by normal hardware cost drops.

Windows will be dumped by building a thin embeded version of Windows that will support Wind apps on a chip in other OSs and in a soft reduced Wind, MS will not disclose the cost of the chip but will claim big royalties from it to save face !!!

And of course computers will be QUITE AWESOMELY POWERFUL but Windows won't use it because it won't ship, and all the betas won't help much there won't be any progress on the code, too much infighting :D

shawnce
Jul 19, 2006, 10:36 PM
...but it sucks compared to Tiger and Leopard.

I don't fully agree with that ... and as I said I use it often.

shawnce
Jul 19, 2006, 10:38 PM
Interesting... (http://www.macnn.com/articles/06/07/19/apple.grows.16.in.us/)

AvSRoCkCO1067
Jul 19, 2006, 10:51 PM
Source? :rolleyes:

MacOSRumors.

Dude. They're Completely Reliable. Obviously. Psssh. ;)

SteveRichardson
Jul 19, 2006, 11:05 PM
Q: Will there be any surprises at WWDC?
A: [Laughter, then Openheimer:] Well, you will have to be redundant and be redundant.

mozmac
Jul 19, 2006, 11:17 PM
Dang it, their stock jumped up over 2 points. I was pullling some money together to buy some more! Ugh....oh well, $54 is still lower than it's going to be by the end of the year. :) !

MacFan782040
Jul 19, 2006, 11:45 PM
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/5a/IPod_sales_quarterly.png

mazola
Jul 19, 2006, 11:58 PM
So will there be any surprises at WWDC?

They weren't very clear...

shawnce
Jul 20, 2006, 12:09 AM
So will there be any surprises at WWDC?

They weren't very clear...

If they told you it wouldn't be a surprise now would it? :D

Demoman
Jul 20, 2006, 01:09 AM
When the "real" machines are out, Vista will be out as well. Unless Leopard has revolutionary improvements, the difference between Windows and OSX+iLife would be much less than that it is today. I would still appreciate the UNIX under the hood, but I doubt most consumers care. If Mac sales or market share starts to come down a bit due to fewer switchers, the share price could easily crash.

You are probably nursing those MS shares you bought at $90, hoping for a better day. It is not coming anytime soon sorry to say. Buying is about momentum. Apple has it and MS does not. Vista already has a great deal of bad press and it has not even hit the street. eWeek and other journals are already writing about Vista security vulnerabilities. That is not a good sign. Vista features and functionality has been scaled back numerous times. That too is not a good sign.

Who would have imagined that the common view. amongst the informed computer community, was MS was trying desperately to draw close to even-up with Apple? About the time MS established Windows 2000, they were at the top of the computer world in just about every SW market there was.

They finally had a very stable desktop, server platform, mail server, yellow pages, browser, office suite, SQL engine, and so on. But once they reached this pinnacle, two things happened (or at least two I want to talk about). One, they became way too greedy with their predatory licensing. It just went through the roof. If you have never purchased SW at the enterprise level, you do not understand how expensive this has become. SW can cost (at least) as much HW at the enterprise level.

The second thing that happened at MS is best described in a quote "When Alexander looked at his empire, he wept for there was nothing more to conquer." Instead of continuing on the path of R&D, they tried to find "new worlds to conquer", secure in the knowledge they had indeed subdued all competitors who could challenge them. Sun had tried to mount a charge in the early-mid 90's. Fortunately for MS, Sun's CEO lacked the wherewithal to do more than file lawsuits. Linux suffers from the exact problems that have plagued the Unix community; they cannot unify because they have no leadership.

Apple has been the sleeping giant. They have made their mistakes, taken their lumps and paid their dues. After 20 years, I finally bought a Mac. That was mainly because my boss gave me ~ $15K to buy any personal technology I wanted (bonus type of deal). I was learning video production/editing and using the cheap PC stuff. To make a long story short, I can now boast the purchase of:

5 PM
16 iMac
28 Mini
2 PB

Those purchases are mainly within the past 18 months. Per our company's upgrade/expansion plan, I will not buy another Dell, but will add 28-32 Apples this year.

Switching is happening, even with the negative, false, disinformation posts on this site. The numbers will bear this our in the upcoming quarters. Apple at $54, Google @ $455, hmmm I wonder what I should invest in???

tmornini
Jul 20, 2006, 01:10 AM
This is excellent. iPod sales are slowing down however this is to be expected. Nice to see the Mac sales well above the million mark.

iPod sales GROWTH is slowing, but iPod sales are still speeding up.

30% more than same quarter last year...

kalisphoenix
Jul 20, 2006, 01:42 AM
You are probably nursing those MS shares you bought at $90, hoping for a better day. It is not coming anytime soon sorry to say. Buying is about momentum. Apple has it and MS does not. Vista already has a great deal of bad press and it has not even hit the street. eWeek and other journals are already writing about Vista security vulnerabilities. That is not a good sign. Vista features and functionality has been scaled back numerous times. That too is not a good sign.

Vista will sell more copies in its first two weeks than Leopard in its first year. As several hundred thousand years of humanity have demonstrated, rhyme and reason matters little.

Who would have imagined that the common view. amongst the informed computer community, was MS was trying desperately to draw close to even-up with Apple? About the time MS established Windows 2000, they were at the top of the computer world in just about every SW market there was.

....and they still are. The anti-Apple and anti-Linux advertising games are defense, not offense.

They finally had a very stable desktop, server platform, mail server, yellow pages, browser, office suite, SQL engine, and so on. But once they reached this pinnacle, two things happened (or at least two I want to talk about). One, they became way too greedy with their predatory licensing. It just went through the roof. If you have never purchased SW at the enterprise level, you do not understand how expensive this has become. SW can cost (at least) as much HW at the enterprise level.

No doubt, but I don't see businesses exactly fleeing in droves.

The second thing that happened at MS is best described in a quote "When Alexander looked at his empire, he wept for there was nothing more to conquer." Instead of continuing on the path of R&D, they tried to find "new worlds to conquer", secure in the knowledge they had indeed subdued all competitors who could challenge them. Sun had tried to mount a charge in the early-mid 90's. Fortunately for MS, Sun's CEO lacked the wherewithal to do more than file lawsuits. Linux suffers from the exact problems that have plagued the Unix community; they cannot unify because they have no leadership.

Sun's ailments are a lot more complicated than that, as are SGI's. Most of their problem is that their workstation prices make Apple's seem like bargain-bin deals.

Gah. The Linux community doesn't want to unify. In fact, not unifying is the core of their philosophy. The vast majority of Linux users (ie, non-n00bs) don't really give a crap about mass adoption of Linux. Many even view such a possibility with horror and disgust. The only priority is choice. It's why there are 415 distributions (none of which are compatible with each other), 9,843 window managers (none of which have remotely similar configuration options), and 3.43x10^15 terminal emulators (none of which actually emulate terminals any better or worse than any other one).

Waving the "king of the OS hill" prize in front of a bunch of Linux users/developers will only result in them staring at you like a dog that's been shown a card trick. With very few exceptions, only n00bs (and uncomprehending businessmen who think they can somehow profit) want mass adoption of Linux.

macnews
Jul 20, 2006, 02:33 AM
*Most critical applications will be converted by September*

Interesting...

I found this to be most interesting. I think we could actually see some Adobe apps by Septemeber. Adobe has been going on an 18-24 month cycle and based when CS2 was released Sept/Oct would be 18 months and 24 would be April when Adobe has said basically "no later than".

Phobophobia
Jul 20, 2006, 02:50 AM
Vista will sell more copies in its first two weeks than Leopard in its first year. As several hundred thousand years of humanity have demonstrated, rhyme and reason matters little.


I have doubts about this statement.

Leopard will be able to run on all macs from the past several years. Vista requires a relatively new machine.

Vista likely will cost much more than Leopard.

Most copies of Vista will be sold with new computers.

Steve has been saving the good stuff for Leopard. He's known for a long time that he needs to steal M$'s thunder with this release.

Lollypop
Jul 20, 2006, 03:33 AM
Gah. The Linux community doesn't want to unify. In fact, not unifying is the core of their philosophy. The vast majority of Linux users (ie, non-n00bs) don't really give a crap about mass adoption of Linux. Many even view such a possibility with horror and disgust. The only priority is choice. It's why there are 415 distributions (none of which are compatible with each other), 9,843 window managers (none of which have remotely similar configuration options), and 3.43x10^15 terminal emulators (none of which actually emulate terminals any better or worse than any other one).

Waving the "king of the OS hill" prize in front of a bunch of Linux users/developers will only result in them staring at you like a dog that's been shown a card trick. With very few exceptions, only n00bs (and uncomprehending businessmen who think they can somehow profit) want mass adoption of Linux.

This is a very true statement! With all the different features of the different distributions there will never be a singular Linux out there. People dont want to download the source and compile it, even the best package managers dont really solve the problem, I want to download any application and run it, I dont want to have something check dependancies and then get teh appropriate version ect. The newest Suse enterprise desktop has a lot of Mac os like features, and claim to have done a lot of research into user interface optomization ect, but thats only Suse, what about the rest, Linux will never have a singular unified front, and that is its achilees heel, and the macs inherant strenght (ok so the mac isnt that unified anymore)

I hope apple continues the trends they showed this quater, more and more people need to exposed to the mac, and more and more people will switch.

Evangelion
Jul 20, 2006, 04:33 AM
I believe Nokia and Microsoft have some sort of alliance.

Not quite. Yes, Nokia did announce a while ago that they will support MS's mobile-email-thingy. But that's it. Other than that, the two are more or less mortal enemies.

Evangelion
Jul 20, 2006, 04:44 AM
But he had previously NEVER appeared in public, too GODLY, he appeared in public so they saw that he was HUMAN !!!

Take it easy with the ALL CAPS and exclamation points!!!!!! And BTW: he had appeared in public before.

And more to the point: Why are we discussing the emperor of Japan?

Evangelion
Jul 20, 2006, 04:47 AM
I have doubts about this statement.

Leopard will be able to run on all macs from the past several years. Vista requires a relatively new machine.

I doubt it. I bet that Vista will run on several year old machines. You might not get all the bells and whistles, but I don't have all the bells and whistles of Tiger on this Mac Mini of mine either. And since just about all OEM's wil preload Vista on their machines, the sales-numbers will be HUGE. And then we have those who upgrade their existing machines.

itcheroni
Jul 20, 2006, 04:50 AM
Switching is happening, even with the negative, false, disinformation posts on this site. The numbers will bear this our in the upcoming quarters. Apple at $54, Google @ $455, hmmm I wonder what I should invest in???

You sound paranoid. Where are the negative, false, disinformative posts? It's the exact opposite here, people are so pro-Apple they can't think straight.

And, by the way, purchasing stocks based on price isn't very smart. I don't understand why you're singleling out Google just because it has a high stock price. It actually works against your point because it's a great stock-arguably better than Apple.

Evangelion
Jul 20, 2006, 05:00 AM
Gah. The Linux community doesn't want to unify. In fact, not unifying is the core of their philosophy.

You do realize that you are full of crap? There is acautlly quite a bit work being done in order to unify various areas of Linux.

It's why there are 415 distributions (none of which are compatible with each other)

Again: you do realize that you are full of crap? There are handful of distributions that matter, rest are more or lesss niche. The ones that matter are (IMO): Fedora/Red Hat, SUSE, Ubuntu, Debian and Gentoo. Of those, Ubuntu and Debian are quite compatible with each other.

9,843 window managers (none of which have remotely similar configuration options), and 3.43x10^15 terminal emulators (none of which actually emulate terminals any better or worse than any other one).

Maybe they realized that "one size does NOT fit all"? Why should there be just WM, just one editor, just one browser, just one email-client etc. etc.?

Yes, Linux has several options to choose from. And is that a bad thing? Is it a good thing to cram some specific thing down users throatts without gicing them the option to choose? It has two primary GUI's (with several smaller ones floating around as well): GNOME and KDE. And while they are both GUI's, they are both sufficiently different that they do not overlap as much. They have different architecture behind them, different design-goals, different ideology... And they cater to different types of users. I have used both, and I can appreciate the strengths of either of them.

Evangelion
Jul 20, 2006, 05:05 AM
People dont want to download the source and compile it

What makes you think that you have to do that?

even the best package managers dont really solve the problem, I want to download any application and run it, I dont want to have something check dependancies and then get teh appropriate version ect.

have you ever used Linux? Application-installation in any modern Linux-distro is VERY smooth. If I want to install an app in Ubuntu (the previous distro I used), how do I do that? Well, I load a package-manager, which gives me a list of apps. I select the app I want to install, and click "Install". And that's it. How much simpler could it be? Why does everyone think that loading a web-browser, searching the app with Google, browsing to the website, downloading the installer (assuming that the apps is free. Usually with Mac, it's not) and running the installer is somehow "easier" that launching an app, selecting the app to be installed from a list and clicking "install"? Seriously?

The newest Suse enterprise desktop has a lot of Mac os like features, and claim to have done a lot of research into user interface optomization ect, but thats only Suse, what about the rest, Linux will never have a singular unified front, and that is its achilees heel, and the macs inherant strenght (ok so the mac isnt that unified anymore)

What do you mean by "unified front"? The GUI? Most distros use either KDE or GNOME (usually alloweing the user to choose which one he prefers), so they are in fact quite unified.

AdeFowler
Jul 20, 2006, 05:06 AM
I found this to be most interesting. I think we could actually see some Adobe apps by Septemeber. Adobe has been going on an 18-24 month cycle and based when CS2 was released Sept/Oct would be 18 months and 24 would be April when Adobe has said basically "no later than".
I think it'll be very awkward for Steve to announce the Mac Pros without a UB version of Photoshop being available, however I can't see CS3 being finished. However we know that Indesign is progressing well, so I wouldn't be surprised if Bruce Chizen came on stage and announced the availability of time limited betas; assuming Adobe are willing to help Apple.

Now what should we spend that 9.5 billion on? ;)

Evangelion
Jul 20, 2006, 05:11 AM
And, by the way, purchasing stocks based on price isn't very smart. I don't understand why you're singleling out Google just because it has a high stock price. It actually works against your point because it's a great stock-arguably better than Apple.

Stock-price is irrelevant, what matter is the market-capitalization. Quite often I see people comparing two companies and saying stuff like "Company A has a shareprice of $50, whereas Company B has a shareprice of $60. Therefore Company B is better".

I guess Berkshire Hathaway is the Capo di Tutti Capi of companies, since their shareprice is over 90.000 dollars!

whooleytoo
Jul 20, 2006, 05:47 AM
And since just about all OEM's wil preload Vista on their machines, the sales-numbers will be HUGE.

I think this is the key - once Vista comes out what OEM will be able to continue selling PCs with XP installed? Even if Vista's hardware requirements were a Core 2 Duo with 2GB RAM, they'd build every PC with a minimum of a Core 2 Duo with 2GB RAM, because they can't afford not to be on the Vista bandwagon.

bwintx
Jul 20, 2006, 06:58 AM
I bet that Vista will run on several year old machines. You might not get all the bells and whistles, but I don't have all the bells and whistles of Tiger on this Mac Mini of mine either. And since just about all OEM's wil preload Vista on their machines, the sales-numbers will be HUGE. And then we have those who upgrade their existing machines.

You are correct. Existing PCs will run Vista but without the Aqua-ripoff pretty interface. For the Aqua-ripoff (I refuse to call it anything else), that's where much more RAM and newer video cards come into play by necessity. So, essentially, you get two classes of Vista users (imagine having to write the "requirements" text for Windows software in the near-future; ugh), and a giant opportunity for the memory and video card companies, which are probably buying their magazine and Web banner ad space right now -- not that anybody should alert the media for such info.

Lollypop
Jul 20, 2006, 07:47 AM
What makes you think that you have to do that?



have you ever used Linux? Application-installation in any modern Linux-distro is VERY smooth. If I want to install an app in Ubuntu (the previous distro I used), how do I do that? Well, I load a package-manager, which gives me a list of apps. I select the app I want to install, and click "Install". And that's it. How much simpler could it be? Why does everyone think that loading a web-browser, searching the app with Google, browsing to the website, downloading the installer (assuming that the apps is free. Usually with Mac, it's not) and running the installer is somehow "easier" that launching an app, selecting the app to be installed from a list and clicking "install"? Seriously?



What do you mean by "unified front"? The GUI? Most distros use either KDE or GNOME (usually alloweing the user to choose which one he prefers), so they are in fact quite unified.

I have used Linux before, admit that I gave up with linux with Suse 9. The point I was trying to make with the package manager is that its not easy to go out and find something, every time you either have to find a package for your specific distribution or have it "built" for your distro. If you look at the way the mac works now I can drag the aduim icon to a remote drive, and from almost any machine that meets the basic specs I can then double click that app, even if its on a network drive, it will run, can you say the same for Linux?

By unification I meant giving a constant user experience with singal points of administration, management ect. Some of my previous sessions with linux the applications did not always fully adhere to guidelines that were set out by KDE, whatever theme i choose, it didnt adapt to it for example. I fully admit im not a linux guru, and that things very likely have changed, but my perception is that every distro comes with a boat load of software on the DVD or via download, if you want to get something thats not listed it becomes a bit more difficult. There is the issue of building your own kernel and then software for it but other than bulding the kernel i have no knowlede of any related issues.

The mac advantage is that its a bit easier to get, install and run applications than windows, and IMO linux as well. Thats a advantage apple should leverage and try and sell more if they are going to sell more machines and increase the market share of the entire platform.

I agree with kalisphoenix to an extent when he says that the linux people dont want a single unified distro, the linux crowd doesnt want a true singular unfied platform, why is there a few big distros out there after years of linux development, why are there so many niche ones, and why do linux users argue with others over their favorite distro? Diversity and flexability is one of the strenghts of Linux, its users know that, and having a single distro that does everything will counter that strength, they also know that.

Im not taking on linux, to the contrary I believe linux has a critical place, I personally believe that its diversity/flexibility is one of the reasons it hasnt concored the desktop market, (peolpe want the plain and simple windows thing, to much options makes it overly complex), diversity/flexibility is the same reason linux has concored the server market.

mac-er
Jul 20, 2006, 08:19 AM
"We're not sitting around doing nothing," Apple said about the prospect that mobile phones may soon emerge as very capable digital music players and challenge the iPod.

This was a pretty interesting quote AppleInsider had from the presentation.

dpMacsmith
Jul 20, 2006, 08:20 AM
I think it'll be very awkward for Steve to announce the Mac Pros without a UB version of Photoshop being available, however I can't see CS3 being finished. However we know that Indesign is progressing well, so I wouldn't be surprised if Bruce Chizen came on stage and announced the availability of time limited betas; assuming Adobe are willing to help Apple.

I listened to most of the call and evidently missed this statement. I think it means that CS2, or Office, or Indesign will be out in some form. Probably as public Beta as you suggest. But, this is good news!

Market share increase is good news as well. It should happen, there are a lot of things positive about Apple computer now.

grouse
Jul 20, 2006, 08:35 AM
If desktops sales are down 23%, is that revenue or units?

If it's revenue, then it's hardly surprising. If the most expensive models are essentially stalled waiting on new chips/new enclosures/new universal binary apps from Quark and Adobemedia, as backed up by reports that apple store staff in the last quarter have actually been advising punters NOT to buy the G5 towers, then actually that's pretty much as expected I'd have thought.

If new Mac Pro models are just around the corner then you'd expect a big leap for the 4th quarter. I, for one, am part of the higher spend pent-up demand sector. And don't forget, bureaux, design studios, architects, 3D motion design/modeller etcs have big budgets and if they pause on buying it is going to skew the Apple market. As everyone says, expect a big leap in the Desktop Pro market over the next two quarters.

apple-science
Jul 20, 2006, 09:48 AM
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/5a/IPod_sales_quarterly.pngThanks MacFan. Interesting curve.
Will probably be leapt upon by iPod-haters as proof of the end of the world but just watch the Holiday sales quarter.... ;)

bretm
Jul 20, 2006, 10:02 AM
There are more details here - http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/060719/sfw089.html?.v=60

At the end of the page is a breakdown in the sales figures.

Desktop sales are down 14% on last quarter, and 23% on a year ago, but laptop sales are up a whopping 60% on last quarter and 61% on a year ago.

Not surprising. They haven't released a replacement for the G5 tower, and people have been waiting for a faster laptop for 3+ years since they never had the G5 laptop.

milo
Jul 20, 2006, 10:07 AM
Made possible by paying 10c for each Mac constructed with a high quality and proficient workforce.

Works for me. I prefer it over the alternative of making it somewhere else and having prices that are even higher.

Why dont you get the computer you want now and in 6 months shell out the extra few bucks for Leopard.

$129 ain't cheap, especially if it's not long after you shelled out for a computer. I wish Apple would announce a window of free OS upgrades for people buying computers after a certian date.

I bet at the Developer's conference that Adobe and Microsoft announce Universal Binaries for September.

Unlikely since Adobe has already announced for next spring. And that release is for both OSX and windows, not going to get pushed up much.

No - they are actually losing market share.

They may be losing a little desktop market share (or maybe not), but they're probably gaining notebook market share, and market share overall.

Does anybody think the stock pricing in the last 3 days was insider trading that indicated the coming good results.

I hope not, since that could put them in jail. All publically traded companies have a blackout period before announcements where no employees are allowed to buy or sell.

bretm
Jul 20, 2006, 10:11 AM
iPod sales GROWTH is slowing, but iPod sales are still speeding up.

30% more than same quarter last year...

Increasing. Not speeding up.

JohnHummel
Jul 20, 2006, 10:17 AM
There are more details here - http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/060719/sfw089.html?.v=60

At the end of the page is a breakdown in the sales figures.

Desktop sales are down 14% on last quarter, and 23% on a year ago, but laptop sales are up a whopping 60% on last quarter and 61% on a year ago.

Not surprising - until they announce the Intel Powermacs, I think that desktop sales will continue to decline. But once they get those new Powermacs out, I think new users - including gamer types - will start picking up. You'd be surprise how many times I've heard that the Macbook Pro is quite the gaming machine.

Evangelion
Jul 20, 2006, 11:36 AM
I have used Linux before, admit that I gave up with linux with Suse 9. The point I was trying to make with the package manager is that its not easy to go out and find something, every time you either have to find a package for your specific distribution or have it "built" for your distro. If you look at the way the mac works now I can drag the aduim icon to a remote drive, and from almost any machine that meets the basic specs I can then double click that app, even if its on a network drive, it will run, can you say the same for Linux?

Yes I can. Like I said, I just fire up the package-manager, find the app in question and click "Install". That really is all there is to it. No need to browse the web, looking for installers to download.

By unification I meant giving a constant user experience with singal points of administration, management ect. Some of my previous sessions with linux the applications did not always fully adhere to guidelines that were set out by KDE, whatever theme i choose, it didnt adapt to it for example.

Things are different these days. You are basing your judgement on SUSE9, which was released three years ago. During that three years, Linux has made HUGE progress. Things are chaning for the better, and they are changing FAST. I would say that Linux has changed more during the last three years than it did during the five years before 2003.

Note: that is NOT a bad thing for Apple. I bet that Apple would much rather co-exists with Linux than with Windows. There could never be a monopoly Linux could exploit to harm competitors, Microsoft could do that, and they have done it. Linux is open and follows established standards, Microsoft does not, if they can get away with it. Linux has no interest in destroying competitors, Microsoft does.

I fully admit im not a linux guru, and that things very likely have changed, but my perception is that every distro comes with a boat load of software on the DVD or via download, if you want to get something thats not listed it becomes a bit more difficult.

Well, SUSE does ship with tons of apps on the DVD (mainly so that it could be used wby people without broadband). But if you look at Ubuntu for example, it ships with relatively few apps. In a way, they have selected "best of breed"-apps for their distro. But if the user wants to have some additional piece of software, he can just fire up the package-manager, where he can choose from 16.000 pieces of software. The app the user is looking for is most likely listed there. If he's installing a piece of commercial software, they usually ship with nice installers that are not one bit harder to use than the ones in OS X or Windows.

There is the issue of building your own kernel

You have no need to do that. Seriously. I haven't built my own kernels in years. And when I did, it was because I wanted to do it, not because I had to do it.

Just because you CAN compile your own kernel does not mean that you are required to do so. The possibility is there for power-users.

The mac advantage is that its a bit easier to get, install and run applications than windows, and IMO linux as well.

I disagree. In Linux all the apps I could even want were just few mouse-clicks away. On OS X (and on Windows) I have to hunt for those apps in internet, only to find out that I'm expected to pay for them. I had none of those problems in Linux.

why is there a few big distros out there after years of linux development, why are there so many niche ones, and why do linux users argue with others over their favorite distro?

There are several distros, because one distro can't do it all. Want an OS that can be tweaked and customized to your exact needs and for your specific hardware? Obviously Ubuntu is not ideal then, but Gentoo is. Want a distro that "just works"? Ubuntu would be a good choice then. Want a distro with rock-solid reliablity? Try Debian. Want to run Red Hat servers, but don't want to pay for support? Use CentOS.

All those distros exist because there are users who find them to be better for their needs than the other distros are. And there's nothing wrong with that, since one size does not fit all. No-one could tell the users that "from now on, there will be just one distro". And even if someone could say that, the users who were unhappy with the "one true distro" could start their own distro if they wanted to.

Why do users argue which distro is best? For the same reason why Mac-users tell Linux and Windows-users that OS X is the best? For the same reason why BMW-drivers tell others that BMW is better than Merc is? People like to rationalise their choice of OS.

Diversity and flexability is one of the strenghts of Linux, its users know that, and having a single distro that does everything will counter that strength, they also know that.

They know that there can't be one distro that "does everything". Ubuntu wants to be easy to use OS that just works. Gentoo wnts to be as customizable, flexible and powerful as possible. It would be very, very hard for single OS to offer both of those ideoogies in one package. It would en up being "jack of all trades, master of none".

Take Mandrake (Mandiva these days) and Red Hat for example. Years ago Red Hat decided to use GNOME as their default desktop. There were bunch of Red Hat users who liked the distro, but liked KDE more than GNOME. So they took Red Hat, replaced GNOME with KDE and voila: Mandrake was born. From that point te two started to diverge. as independted OS'es.

bigmc6000
Jul 20, 2006, 11:51 AM
Anybody else notice that they predicted increased revenue but decreased net income? That SCREAMS to me that they plan on selling some unreleased lower-margin products. It pretty much has to be something large considering everything is getting cheaper as time goes by so we're either talking about processor updates across the board, a drop in price (MacBook 999 anyone? ;) or an updated nano with greater storage capacity at same price points. I would tend to think it's the latter seeing as how that would directly correlate to an increase in sales but a decrease in margin. Any other thoughts??

APPLENEWBIE
Jul 20, 2006, 12:00 PM
Currently reporting at $61.10. Up $7.00 from yesterday.

Yahoo article reports: According to Gartner, Apple shipped 766,000 PCs in the second quarter of the year, good enough for 4.6% of the U.S. market, and a 15.4% increase over a year ago. Apple's growth rate exceeded those of the No. 1 and No. 2 PC companies, Dell Inc.:)

plinden
Jul 20, 2006, 12:37 PM
Currently reporting at $60.80 at 12:44 ET. Up 6.73 from yesterday.

Yahoo article reports: According to Gartner, Apple shipped 766,000 PCs in the second quarter of the year, good enough for 4.6% of the U.S. market, and a 15.4% increase over a year ago. Apple's growth rate exceeded those of the No. 1 and No. 2 PC companies, Dell Inc.:)
Just to give some more figures - Gartner says worldwide PC sales are 55 million compared to 49.5 million this time last year, and 16.6 million in the US compared to 15.6 million last year.

But I wonder where they got 766,000 from. The sales figures separate out retail from regional sales, but considering that most Apple stores are in the US, the vast majority of the 216,000 retail sales would be in the US, so US sales could be anything between 642,000-858,000. That's 3.9%-5.2% US market share. Looks like they picked a percentage right in the middle, but I would say it's nearer to 5%. Of course, worldwide it's still only 2.4%.

To put this in perspective, Dell sold 9.73 million PC worldwide and 5.3 million in the US, ie. 7x Apple's shipments.

yac_moda
Jul 20, 2006, 02:00 PM
I hope not, since that could put them in jail. All publically traded companies have a blackout period before announcements where no employees are allowed to buy or sell.


That's funny that is not what they told us when I worked for Aldus, although there was one time that we could not trade.

I think the blackout period is only for execs and VPs, most of the time.

Although that could be because we were in San Diego and not Seatle, companies with lots of remote offices would probably be the same.

macidiot
Jul 20, 2006, 02:00 PM
Just to give some more figures - Gartner says worldwide PC sales are 55 million compared to 49.5 million this time last year, and 16.6 million in the US compared to 15.6 million last year.

But I wonder where they got 766,000 from. The sales figures separate out retail from regional sales, but considering that most Apple stores are in the US, the vast majority of the 216,000 retail sales would be in the US, so US sales could be anything between 642,000-858,000. That's 3.9%-5.2% US market share. Looks like they picked a percentage right in the middle, but I would say it's nearer to 5%. Of course, worldwide it's still only 2.4%.

To put this in perspective, Dell sold 9.73 million PC worldwide and 5.3 million in the US, ie. 7x Apple's shipments.


According to Gartner, Apple US marketshare last quarter was 4.8%.

yac_moda
Jul 20, 2006, 02:13 PM
Some people take SOOOOO LONG to get IT :eek: :mad:

BUYING A MAC IS NO LONGER SWITCHING :eek: :eek: :eek: :D

According to the stats all you fine people are posting Apple is now simply growing as fast as all of the other small fast growing PC companies, mostly at Dells expense.

Although my guess is Mac sales will now have a nice peak and LEAD the PC industry around and just after Christmas, this will happen year after year.

Kids will return their regular PCs after Christmas to BUY A MAC ! WOOPPPY !!!

Thus, I think it is very likely that Leopard will be announced right after WWDC and that will lead to EXTREMELY high Mac sales at Christmas this year as it is now clear the Mac is the IN COMPUT and Mac groupies such as myself will be trading up after Leopard and the new laptop design ships :p

HOTDOG :eek: :eek: ;)


OH !

And Apple could start to DOMINATE PC sales again since they are the BEST multi-OS platform, which would also allow them to lead PC sales in the 3rd quarter as that is when most edSales occur.

Notice how low Apple still is in world wide sales, world wide sales are now very significant.

So my guess is Apple sales increase from here over the next year 4 fold !!!

macidiot
Jul 20, 2006, 04:36 PM
You are probably nursing those MS shares you bought at $90, hoping for a better day. It is not coming anytime soon sorry to say. Buying is about momentum. Apple has it and MS does not. Vista already has a great deal of bad press and it has not even hit the street. eWeek and other journals are already writing about Vista security vulnerabilities. That is not a good sign. Vista features and functionality has been scaled back numerous times. That too is not a good sign.

Somewhat true. Momentum buying is generally for fools. Unless your a money manager with dedicated stock research, your always going to be late to the party. While you can still make money doing it, you can just as easily be the one without the chair in musical chairs.

Who would have imagined that the common view. amongst the informed computer community, was MS was trying desperately to draw close to even-up with Apple? About the time MS established Windows 2000, they were at the top of the computer world in just about every SW market there was.

Microsoft has never been technologically superior to Apple. At best, they were kind of close, with Win2k. At worst, they were about 7-10 years behind with DOS. They have always been catching up technologically. Microsoft dominance is due to a host of factors. Superior technology isn't one of them.

The second thing that happened at MS is best described in a quote "When Alexander looked at his empire, he wept for there was nothing more to conquer." Instead of continuing on the path of R&D, they tried to find "new worlds to conquer", secure in the knowledge they had indeed subdued all competitors who could challenge them. Sun had tried to mount a charge in the early-mid 90's. Fortunately for MS, Sun's CEO lacked the wherewithal to do more than file lawsuits. Linux suffers from the exact problems that have plagued the Unix community; they cannot unify because they have no leadership.

Apple has been the sleeping giant. They have made their mistakes, taken their lumps and paid their dues. After 20 years, I finally bought a Mac. That was mainly because my boss gave me ~ $15K to buy any personal technology I wanted (bonus type of deal). I was learning video production/editing and using the cheap PC stuff. To make a long story short, I can now boast the purchase of:

5 PM
16 iMac
28 Mini
2 PB

Those purchases are mainly within the past 18 months. Per our company's upgrade/expansion plan, I will not buy another Dell, but will add 28-32 Apples this year.

Switching is happening, even with the negative, false, disinformation posts on this site. The numbers will bear this our in the upcoming quarters. Apple at $54, Google @ $455, hmmm I wonder what I should invest in???

I don't know about sleeping giant. Apple has always been a giant in the computer industry. At their best, they were the largest pc manufacturer in the world. Even at their worst, they were a top ten PC company. Seems like you, like many people, confuse windows marketshare vs. computer manufacturer marketshare. Sun hasn't been a player for about 15 years. Just a much better version of SGI. They were in decline over 10 years ago.

And as for stock price like Google vs. Apple... what you said was meaningless. Per share price is meaningless in the way you describe. Just because Google stock is $455/share doesn't necessarily mean it is expensive compared to Apple stock. Berkshire Hathaway stock is over $90,000, but it is arguably cheaper than either. The real metric is price-to-earnings ratio. And the real performance indicator is percentage returns. If you buy 10 shares of a stock @ $50 or 1 share of a stock @ $500 and both increase 10%, either way, you made $50. This is exactly why stock splits are meaningless.

And finally, don't take this as coming down hard on you. Your coming to the right conclusions, but your reasons are off base.

Apple is poised to do well because :

Microsoft is following standard monopolist policy of status quo. They were never quality innovators, but with monopoly, their innovation has slowed to a crawl. When you have a monopoly, it is not in your best interest to change anything. Why would you want to when your at the top? By the way, this is not unique. The iPod pace of change has slowed a lot now that they are clearly the dominant leader.

The PC industry is largely stable now. What that means is that most of the applications people use are mature and stable. Also, most computers are plenty powerful enough for everyday tasks. Effectively, what that means is that to a large extent, it does not matter what platform you use (web browsing for example). This applies especially to home users. So instead of application compatibility, the home user looks to other things like ease of use, stability, security, design, etc. In other words, there aren't severe penalties like in the past for switching or choosing one platform over another.

The Windows base is essentially stagnant. The lion's share of the windows market is corporations. And that market is basically built out. Again, there is nowhere to go but down. And Apple corporate presence is tiny. No where to go but up. Your own company actions is a good example.

Apple now has it's own cash cow a la Microsoft Office. Its called the iPod.

Apple's current management is frankly, ridiculously superior to Microsoft's. Ballmer is a fool. I'm not sure what is qualifications are except for being a college buddy of Bill Gates.

funkychunkz
Jul 20, 2006, 04:40 PM
I feel that I'm part a cult right now.

macidiot
Jul 20, 2006, 04:44 PM
My guess is it will open UP a great deal, around $4 then drop $1 or 2, 2 hours into the day and then climb to finish up 5 to 6$ :D

Seasonally and VERY consistently AAPL drops from March to the end of sept and then rises strongly from late Aug. to Christmas. Then rises more in Jan. rests in Feb. and quickly and unpredictably peaks in March or May !?!?!?!

Some years you will make %100 playing it this way, every once in a while you might loose %10, when betting makes bets that have BIG upsides and small downsides !!!

That is the general trend of the stock market. And the US economy.

Late spring/summer... market trends flat to down. People are more interested in vacations than working.

Sept. market rallies briefly as people get back to work.

October is traditionally the worst month to be in stocks. Every major crash has happened in October.

Nov-Dec the market usually rallies. I attribute this to Christmas and bonuses/performance rating. Money managers need to boost their performance numbers for the year so they pump up stocks, usually pouring into any stock that has performed decently. It may not go up, but at least they can say they were in winning stocks.

Jan-early spring usually has selling. A combination of cashing out of the Christmas rally and tax selling.

milo
Jul 20, 2006, 04:47 PM
That's funny that is not what they told us when I worked for Aldus, although there was one time that we could not trade.

I think the blackout period is only for execs and VPs, most of the time.

Although that could be because we were in San Diego and not Seatle, companies with lots of remote offices would probably be the same.

Probably depends on the company. It's still very dicey to make transactions right before an announcement, since accusations could easily be made of insider trading. I suppose at McDonalds they don't enforce a blackout period for the guys flipping burgers...

plinden
Jul 20, 2006, 04:55 PM
That's funny that is not what they told us when I worked for Aldus, although there was one time that we could not trade.

I think the blackout period is only for execs and VPs, most of the time.

Last company I worked for, there was a blackout period for everyone, but it was longer for executive and sales staff, or in fact for anyone who might have had detailed inside knowledge. For instance one colleague, a software engineer, shared an office for a few months with a sales manager, and during that time he had a longer blackout period than the rest of us because he might have overheard some insider information.

Also, we weren't allowed to short the company stock ... since that's kind of like athletes betting that their team will lose, and you might be tempted to release information that would tank the stock.

jeff303
Jul 20, 2006, 05:45 PM
Stock-price is irrelevant, what matter is the market-capitalization. Quite often I see people comparing two companies and saying stuff like "Company A has a shareprice of $50, whereas Company B has a shareprice of $60. Therefore Company B is better".

I guess Berkshire Hathaway is the Capo di Tutti Capi of companies, since their shareprice is over 90.000 dollars!

Not quite. The main thing that makes a stock attractive is consistent growth and strong financials (increasing profits, increasing tax liability, decreasing percentage of operating costs, etc.) This is the reason Apple's stock looks so good right now; today's announcement shows strong growth this quarter and suggests the trend will continue.

yac_moda
Jul 20, 2006, 09:06 PM
That is the general trend of the stock market. And the US economy.

Late spring/summer... market trends flat to down. People are more interested in vacations than working.

Sept. market rallies briefly as people get back to work.

No I TOTALLY figured this one out. Its during this period that taxes get paid, either at the end of march or late until Aug. and with businesses this is cheap and easy to do. So people sell stock to pay their taxes and that depresses the market -- especially if they made a lot of money which could have been on stocks thus it is guaranteed to happen.

October is traditionally the worst month to be in stocks. Every major crash has happened in October.

But Oct. is also the second or third biggest gaining month.

Nov-Dec the market usually rallies. I attribute this to Christmas and bonuses/performance rating. Money managers need to boost their performance numbers for the year so they pump up stocks, usually pouring into any stock that has performed decently. It may not go up, but at least they can say they were in winning stocks.

Jan-early spring usually has selling. A combination of cashing out of the Christmas rally and tax selling.

Yes, I have heard these before in many places but I think there are larger money movers that actually create it although I am not sure what they are.

Although Christmas is no doubt BIG, I think corp. hiring and purchasing to start new projects is what rules the January effect, but there should other things I have not thought of.

Certainly with product intro ruled stocks like tech stocks Christmas and the new years creates a big effect.

I think the #1 shifter of market fortunes though is USA Presidents and popular pres. end of 8 years as pres. cause a big down effect. Especially now that we have had good feds for so many years, that hold back on the money supply although the HYPER WW competition created by the internet may actually be the BIGGEST force here.

And most pres. now days are smart enough to restrict the money supply strictly during their first 2 years otherwise all hell can break loose.

Bush didn't need to do this, 911 did it, but the lack of lowing taxes and gradual secret tax hikes by Clinton were VERY BAD for the economy.

The presidential transition and voting problems blew-out the economies back !!!

macidiot
Jul 21, 2006, 01:28 AM
No I TOTALLY figured this one out. Its during this period that taxes get paid, either at the end of march or late until Aug. and with businesses this is cheap and easy to do. So people sell stock to pay their taxes and that depresses the market -- especially if they made a lot of money which could have been on stocks thus it is guaranteed to happen.



But Oct. is also the second or third biggest gaining month.



Yes, I have heard these before in many places but I think there are larger money movers that actually create it although I am not sure what they are.

Although Christmas is no doubt BIG, I think corp. hiring and purchasing to start new projects is what rules the January effect, but there should other things I have not thought of.

Certainly with product intro ruled stocks like tech stocks Christmas and the new years creates a big effect.

I think the #1 shifter of market fortunes though is USA Presidents and popular pres. end of 8 years as pres. cause a big down effect. Especially now that we have had good feds for so many years, that hold back on the money supply although the HYPER WW competition created by the internet may actually be the BIGGEST force here.

And most pres. now days are smart enough to restrict the money supply strictly during their first 2 years otherwise all hell can break loose.

Bush didn't need to do this, 911 did it, but the lack of lowing taxes and gradual secret tax hikes by Clinton were VERY BAD for the economy.

The presidential transition and voting problems blew-out the economies back !!!

IMO the President has very little direct effect. Since the President barely affects the economy, there really isn't much he can do to the stock market. Anything he might do in the form of stimulus packages... tax cuts, credits, etc. take years to work it's way into the economy. That said, there can definitely be a long term effect from a president's actions.

The Federal Reserve directly affects both the economy and stock market. They are the ones controlling money supply. Not the President. And they are independent of the White house. Alan Greenspan was chairman of the fed for 3 different presidents. However, the Fed does not care about the stock market per se. The Fed is interested in controlling inflation and the economy, avoiding overheating and softening downturns. Essentially, the Fed tries to "tune" the economy.

The President can not restrict money supply. What you've seen over the past 25 years was basically 3 administrations (Reagan/Bush, Clinton, Bush Jr.) that essentially transitioned during downturns in the business cycle. Coincidence.

And I have no idea what "hyper ww competition from the internet" means.

JackSYi
Jul 21, 2006, 01:47 AM
The stock price is gonna soar.

John Jacob
Jul 21, 2006, 08:00 AM
Here are historical Mac sales by quarter.

1Q2000 - 1,377,000
3Q2006- 1,327,000

So we are still not back upto Q1 2000 numbers? :eek:

Queso
Jul 21, 2006, 08:20 AM
So we are still not back upto Q1 2000 numbers? :eek:
Except of course that Q1 is the Christmas quarter, not April to June :rolleyes:

yac_moda
Jul 21, 2006, 06:16 PM
IMO the President has very little direct effect. Since the President barely affects the economy, there really isn't much he can do to the stock market. Anything he might do in the form of stimulus packages... tax cuts, credits, etc. take years to work it's way into the economy. That said, there can definitely be a long term effect from a president's actions.


Your summation is a leap of faith, check your market history what I said has STRONG historical backing yours does NOT.

The USA President has a HUGE effect day to day ON THE WORLD scene and that effects the value of the dollar and thus everything else especially foreign investment which is THE BIGGEST money flow.

And Jimmy Carter is the BEST EXAMPLE of a disaster of foreign confidence.


However, the Fed does not care about the stock market per se.

I YOU believe THIS then you believe everything else he says and you are not paying any attention to WHAT HE DOES :eek:


The Fed is interested in controlling inflation and the economy, avoiding overheating and softening downturns. Essentially, the Fed tries to "tune" the economy.

Duuu !!


The President can not restrict money supply. What you've seen over the past 25 years was basically 3 administrations (Reagan/Bush, Clinton, Bush Jr.) that essentially transitioned during downturns in the business cycle. Coincidence.

Without any doubt the President can and does, by WHO he appoints to the position of Fed Chairman.

Presidents that have a clue also have HUGE control over the money supply by how they fine tune and enforce immigration law, the demographics of entrepreneurialism is hugely effected in a relatively short time by emigration from europe since the average age of those emigrants is around 35.

The Feds money supply adjustments are diluted by this immigration which has a BIG effect on economic growth and the job market, although I don't expect you to understand this.


And I have no idea what "hyper ww competition from the internet" means.

¡¡¡ I AM NOT SURPRISED !!!


You just like to argue !

macidiot
Jul 21, 2006, 07:07 PM
Your summation is a leap of faith, check your market history what I said has STRONG historical backing yours does NOT.

The USA President has a HUGE effect day to day ON THE WORLD scene and that effects the value of the dollar and thus everything else especially foreign investment which is THE BIGGEST money flow.

And Jimmy Carter is the BEST EXAMPLE of a disaster of foreign confidence.



I YOU believe THIS then you believe everything else he says and you are not paying any attention to WHAT HE DOES :eek:



Duuu !!



Without any doubt the President can and does, by WHO he appoints to the position of Fed Chairman.

Presidents that have a clue also have HUGE control over the money supply by how they fine tune and enforce immigration law, the demographics of entrepreneurialism is hugely effected in a relatively short time by emigration from europe since the average age of those emigrants is around 35.

The Feds money supply adjustments are diluted by this immigration which has a BIG effect on economic growth and the job market, although I don't expect you to understand this.



¡¡¡ I AM NOT SURPRISED !!!


You just like to argue !

Your dreaming. The only thing a president can directly do to a market is provide a psychological boost, like when Reagan took office. The president can pass laws that make things favorable for the economy and stock market. However, this takes years to see the effects. And in case you don't know, the president can NOT pass laws by himself.

Again, since you clearly have no idea about government or economics, the market did well during the 80's because the overall economy was doing well. Which was normal, considering the country was in recession during the Carter administration. Oh, and the economy did poorly during the BUsh administration. Then did well during Clinton. It's called the business cycle. Which you obviously have no idea what that is. If you did, you would understand what the Fed does.

WTF does foreign confidence have to due with domestic economy? Carter was a failure economically because he was ineffective. And this was due to Congress. And AGAIN, there is something called the business cycle. You should study your history. The value of the dollar has little effect on day to day matters. Additionally, the foreign investment you speak of is important to debt, in the form of bonds and t-bills. It has far less effect on the stock market. You should study how world markets work.

While the president does appoint reserve board members, again your completely wrong. When Bush came into office, Greenspan was Chairman. So obviously, Bush did not appoint him. In fact, Ronald Reagan appointed him. Additionally, the governers serve for a time long enough to effectively keep them independent (14 years). So tell me, how does the President instruct the Fed to adjust the money supply? Oh that's right, he can't.

Basically, what you are saying is that the President also completely controls the Supreme court since the president also nominates justices? Whatever.

Immigration from Europe? What century are you living in? You think that effects the US economy? Puh-lease. Europe is in decline. Economically, the US pays attention to China and the far east. Not Europe. The money supply is diluted by immigration? WTF. And the President controls the money supply through immigration law? Those statements are absurd. In fact, they have to be some of the dumbest things I've heard in a long time.

I am guessing your living in Europe. Which would explain your euro-centric, myopic, and ill-informed opinions about how the US government and economy works.