PS3 in better position than bloggers say...

[XNine]

http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=33303

10,000 devkits is quite a bit. The developer in the article stated that the 360 didn't have devkits ready for the E3 before launch, and the PS3 did. Quite the turn-around from what all of these FUD reports going on around the net are saying.

[yellow]

While I, like you, yearn for some positive news about the PS3... I hate to say that I completely agree with:

10,000 devkits and a chummy games VP do not necessarily equal millions of sales of a $600 console

But it's safe to say it'll equal at least a sale of 2 units, one for you, and one for me. :)

[MacRumorUser]

But it's safe to say it'll equal at least a sale of 2 units, one for you, and one for me. :)

WOW That must come as a real welcome relief to the bods at Sony ;)

:D :D :D

Or from the same article

However, Cell yields are still low, and Sony must be hoping this improves soon, along with the image of the console perceived by the gaming public - which is still at a low ebb

Just to put a balanced perspective on things :o

[Tommyg117]

I think they are anticipating more than will happen. I am a Playstation fan and supporter and REALLY want this to succeed. But I am also a gamer, and while 600 dollars seems fair for us gamers, the average consumer will not think this is a great deal. I want a playstation wii60

[Dagless]

about time Sony had some good news. Interestingly, there isn't 10,000 studios with PS3's. and that article doesn't point out there is actually 600 studios with kits. still a huge number though!

I'm very interested to find out how many Wii dev kits are out there. and 360 just for comparison sake.

[mkaake]

I do hope the PS3 does well... 3 console makers is a good number.

Though I thought the article was pretty funny, in and of itself... I mean, you can read this part:

PR manager Ryan Bowling that over 10,000 PS3 devkits have been shipped

And then you get to this part:

to aid developers in their fight against the esoteric architecture of the Cell-based console

:D

[MS bulldog]

theinquirer.net[/url]



there's a reliable source:rolleyes:

[2nyRiggz]

But it's safe to say it'll equal at least a sale of 2 units, one for you, and one for me. :)

Make it 3:) ......Any positive coming to light is great.






Bless

[sixstorm]

Sony needs to lower their prices way down, at least to compete with the 360. $500+ is just too much for a gaming console, let alone a crappy video quality DVD player (Blu-Ray).

[XNine]

Sony needs to lower their prices way down, at least to compete with the 360. $500+ is just too much for a gaming console, let alone a crappy video quality DVD player (Blu-Ray).

Just curious, how do you know the quality of the blu-ray player when not one PS3 has even been to market yet?

[yellow]

Telepathy. Doy! :rolleyes:

[Haoshiro]

Yeah, my guess is that it won't be able to do anything beyond 1920x1080! ;)

Of course... what films even support that? I thought only Superman Returns and Apacolypto so far were the only films shot in "true hd", and at a horrific price (for the camera's).

[BlizzardBomb]

Yeah, my guess is that it won't be able to do anything beyond 1920x1080!

Of course... what films even support that? I thought only Superman Returns and Apacolypto so far were the only films shot in "true hd", and at a horrific price (for the camera's).

1080p doesn't look that much better than 720p at normal viewing distance. Once you go beyond 720p you need to start upgrading our eyes before anything else.

Anyway, I think the PS3 will do decently. However, if someone else tried to pull this off they would probably fail no matter how much money they have. I think the Playstation brand is helping here.

[Mavimao]

Yeah, my guess is that it won't be able to do anything beyond 1920x1080! ;)

Of course... what films even support that? I thought only Superman Returns and Apacolypto so far were the only films shot in "true hd", and at a horrific price (for the camera's).

Oh good lord! If I had a dime for everytime I've heard this on a forum...

HD is not some magical resolution ceiling as the name suggests. 35mm film, which has no fixed resolution anyway, can be scanned up to 6000 lines of resolution and even then you might not squeeze every single silver halide of detail. Hell 16mm can hold more detail than HD's resolution depending on the stock of course. This may blow your mind, but the original negative of Citizen Kane holds more picture detail than Superman Returns, Star Wars 2-3, Miami Vice, etc etc.

The "high" in HD is relative to NTSC/PAL resolution.

[ReanimationLP]

I hope for their sake the launch wont end up like the PSP console.

All the stores I went to on the launch day had PILES of them. No one was buying them.

[Tommyg117]

I really hope blu-ray succeeds. At least for the sake of the console. I saw one in best buy the other day and it was actually pretty incredible when compared with standard definition. It looked the same as HD-DVD to me. They just need to drop the prices a little bit.

[MacRumorUser]

I really hope blu-ray succeeds. At least for the sake of the console. I saw one in best buy the other day and it was actually pretty incredible when compared with standard definition. It looked the same as HD-DVD to me. They just need to drop the prices a little bit.

Yeah this is a big gamble. If blu ray doesnt succeed then that could be the nail in the coffin for an early funeral for the ps3.

[ifjake]

while price and low chip yeilds will most likely lend to a slow start, it does appear that the PS3 is the superior machine, albiet presently the most awkward. there's a good likelyhood of some quality stuff coming from that thing. i'm not so quick to write it off.

that said, given my current income, the Wii looks like the one i'm most likely to buy, if any. and secretly i'm still addicted to metroid, carried over from a stint 2 years back.

[Dagless]

I still have 3 words for the PS3.
CD-i, 3D0 and Saturn.

[Haoshiro]

while price and low chip yeilds will most likely lend to a slow start, it does appear that the PS3 is the superior machine, albiet presently the most awkward. there's a good likelyhood of some quality stuff coming from that thing. i'm not so quick to write it off.

But you know, how easy it is to use the system from a development perspective is really important.

I think of vehicles. If you follow cars much, or even just watch shows like Top Gear you will notice that there are plenty of cars that are busting with amazing power in paper, but due to the way the car is designed you can't actually take advantage of it. A car that can go 200mph could lose to a car that can only do 150mph in a race simply because the more powerful car doesn't handle well and can't stay on the road.

This could be a problem for PS3 as well, it could be 4X as powerful as a 360 (although it's likely, at best, 1.25X) and still under-perform in comparison if developers have a hard time taking advantage of it.

[Will_reed]

People seem to be forgeting that Gamers wont be the only ones purchasing or interested in purchasing a ps3. The wii has one sales point gaming only gamers will buy it and I dare say 80% of them will be nintendo fan boys
were as ps3 will probably be purchased mostly by people wanting a cheap blu-ray solution or a media center. Or maybe they dont have a ps2 and can actually see that buying the ps3 will mean a good long term desicion.

[Tommyg117]

But you know, how easy it is to use the system from a development perspective is really important.

I think of vehicles. If you follow cars much, or even just watch shows like Top Gear you will notice that there are plenty of cars that are busting with amazing power in paper, but due to the way the car is designed you can't actually take advantage of it. A car that can go 200mph could lose to a car that can only do 150mph in a race simply because the more powerful car doesn't handle well and can't stay on the road.

This could be a problem for PS3 as well, it could be 4X as powerful as a 360 (although it's likely, at best, 1.25X) and still under-perform in comparison if developers have a hard time taking advantage of it.
That's a pretty good analogy. I hope that developers can harness this power and still "keep it under control"

[Mavimao]

I still have 3 words for the PS3.
CD-i, 3D0 and Saturn.

I see similarities with the PS3 and the Saturn...sorta. But the CD-i and 3DO are in a completely different boat. They were consoles made by companies that didn't have a reputation in the industy at all, and quite frankly didn't have great games to justify their prices. And plus, there were no CD-i fanboys back then.

Similarities with the Saturn can be justified. The Saturn was more expensive than the PS1 and didn't do a whole lot Sony's machine couldn't. Kinda like ps3/360. At the same time, Sega's reputation wasn't tarnished after the genesis and 32x were left for dead in 96. Sony still supports PS2 to this day and shows no signs of slowing down. Hell they were making PS1s until recently.

In my opinion, whatever success - or lack thereof - the PS3 has, will be its very own example. You really can't relate anything to it.

[Will_reed]

Oh good lord! If I had a dime for everytime I've heard this on a forum...

HD is not some magical resolution ceiling as the name suggests. 35mm film, which has no fixed resolution anyway, can be scanned up to 6000 lines of resolution and even then you might not squeeze every single silver halide of detail. Hell 16mm can hold more detail than HD's resolution depending on the stock of course. This may blow your mind, but the original negative of Citizen Kane holds more picture detail than Superman Returns, Star Wars 2-3, Miami Vice, etc etc.

The "high" in HD is relative to NTSC/PAL resolution.

and if I had a dime for every time I herd THAT!
look mr Hey we can scan at 6000 lines they NEVER scan at 6000 lines they usually scan at 2k at most and after looking at the usable area it actually turns out lower than HD. 4k is usually used for visual effects only
I've seen superman returns on imax and the detail and color is amazing
Don't be so quick to discount HD just listen to what robert rodreguez and micheal man have to say, or even brian singer and tom segal who said it's as good as shooting 65 mm. Same detail but a little cleaner

[Mavimao]

People seem to be forgeting that Gamers wont be the only ones purchasing or interested in purchasing a ps3. The wii has one sales point gaming only gamers will buy it and I dare say 80% of them will be nintendo fan boys
were as ps3 will probably be purchased mostly by people wanting a cheap blu-ray solution or a media center. Or maybe they dont have a ps2 and can actually see that buying the ps3 will mean a good long term desicion.

I disagree. It will only be gamers and perhaps several techniphile HD tv owners purchasing the PS3. If it's selling at 600 dollars, this machine will remain a niche product. Yes it will be a "cheap" blu-ray player relative to other players on the market, but until those prices go down, blu-ray and HD-DVD will remain a niche in itself. Therefore the Blu-ray "trojan horse" is only a niche within a niche.

Another problem with your prediction is in the name Playstation. While gamers and other techy people know what other things it can do besides play games, others will just see it as yet another video game console. A video console that is being sold in the videogame section at your local Target/Walmart, etc. The Wii on the other hand KNOWS it is a video games console and will market it that way. It will try to market itself to those who don't really play video games. Whether or not they can expand into this market is anyone's guess. The DS might be a glimpse at what success awaits the Wii, but you never know.

[Mavimao]

and if I had a dime for every time I herd THAT!
look mr Hey we can scan at 6000 lines they NEVER scan at 6000 lines they usually scan at 2k at most and after looking at the usable area it actually turns out lower than HD. 4k is usually used for visual effects only
I've seen superman returns on imax and the detail and color is amazing
Don't be so quick to discount HD just listen to what robert rodreguez and micheal man have to say, or even brian singer and tom segal who said it's as good as shooting 65 mm. Same detail but a little cleaner


Do you shoot film? Do you shoot high def?

I have. Many times.

I've had this argument before, so let me direct you to this link and educate yourself:
http://www.originaltrilogy.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=9&threadid=5853&STARTPAGE=4

It's on page 4 of the discussion, about where you need to start.

And I'll say this: there is a different between sharpness and detail. HD does not hold the same amount of detail as 35 and there is no way in hell it has more detail than 65. It is however very sharp. Look at the edges. Some people like it, some find it distracting.

[XNine]

What I find funny is how many people around here use this mentality of "people and gamers." There are more ****ing gamers then there ever have been in the world. How many people in the world own a console? How many own several? MILLIONS. We're not talking a niche market here, there's more than enough market to be spread around.

And the analogy of a car was horrible. These are machines that aren't meant to compete on physical levels.

anyway. The "gamers" market is so godamn vast it's not even funny. Take a look at 2004's stats alone:
http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=538229

[Will_reed]

I disagree. It will only be gamers and perhaps several techniphile HD tv owners purchasing the PS3. If it's selling at 600 dollars, this machine will remain a niche product. Yes it will be a "cheap" blu-ray player relative to other players on the market, but until those prices go down, blu-ray and HD-DVD will remain a niche in itself. Therefore the Blu-ray "trojan horse" is only a niche within a niche.

Another problem with your prediction is in the name Playstation. While gamers and other techy people know what other things it can do besides play games, others will just see it as yet another video game console. A video console that is being sold in the videogame section at your local Target/Walmart, etc. The Wii on the other hand KNOWS it is a video games console and will market it that way. It will try to market itself to those who don't really play video games. Whether or not they can expand into this market is anyone's guess. The DS might be a glimpse at what success awaits the Wii, but you never know.

the ps3 isnt much more expensive than what the ps2 went for dont underestimate what people will spend for a brand name. Playstation is much bigger than nintendo only the xbox really stands up in this area.

[zap2]

What I find funny is how many people around here use this mentality of "people and gamers." There are more ****ing gamers then there ever have been in the world. How many people in the world own a console? How many own several? MILLIONS. We're not talking a niche market here, there's more than enough market to be spread around.

And the analogy of a car was horrible. These are machines that aren't meant to compete on physical levels.

anyway. The "gamers" market is so godamn vast it's not even funny. Take a look at 2004's stats alone:
http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=538229


Yes, people will buy the PS3, but for ever PS3 sold those "Nintendo fanboys" win, because Sony is losing money,and if people pass on the PS3, and buy a Wii, Nintendo wins. As long a Nintendo stay around, they are winning as there making money.

[zap2]

the ps3 isnt much more expensive than what the ps2 went for dont underestimate what people will spend for a brand name. Playstation is much bigger than nintendo only the xbox really stands up in this area.

PS2 sold for 299, the good PS3 sells for 599... that double the price... that a huge differnce.

Nintendo is making a come back... look at the DS sales. The Wii is looking to be a new type of game system.. which is good for Nintendo as their fanboys stay,and "new gamers" come to it. And parnets looking for a system for their kids look at the PS3 price tag and cry, look at the Wii and go "this look good"

[Mavimao]

I've got a good idea...how about we WAIT and see what happens? There's a concept.

[Dagless]

People seem to be forgeting that Gamers wont be the only ones purchasing or interested in purchasing a ps3. The wii has one sales point gaming only gamers will buy it and I dare say 80% of them will be nintendo fan boys
were as ps3 will probably be purchased mostly by people wanting a cheap blu-ray solution or a media center. Or maybe they dont have a ps2 and can actually see that buying the ps3 will mean a good long term desicion.

I suppose you haven't seen the DS have you? A machine targetted towards bringing new people into gaming. This also ties in with

What I find funny is how many people around here use this mentality of "people and gamers." There are more ****ing gamers then there ever have been in the world. How many people in the world own a console? How many own several? MILLIONS. We're not talking a niche market here, there's more than enough market to be spread around.

I don't know about everyone here. But I'm going to take a little cross section of my street. I'm one of the few 20 year olds here, I'm into gaming. I have consoles. Harold who lives across the road is retired and has a PC. he occasionally plays little arcade-style games but only if they are very easy to understand, he is 75 after all. The pub next door has no games machines. Barry (the mayor) next door doesn't have a gaming console, but he does play card games and chess. Tiara over the road is only 10 and doesn't game.
Same can be said for my family. Discounting my siblings there are no other gamers, with people aged 4-80, most in their 30's. none game. none own consoles. Hell the Wii even has my dad interested. Your stereotypical 50 year old who has never cared about games in the past.

This is where the Wii is going to have massive impact. the pub landlady said she wants to get some kind of basic arcade game or 2 in the pub for competitions. Motion sensing and few buttons=success.
It's like that new DS game coming out - "42 All Time Classics" with classic card games with basic sports stuff (bowling, darts, some strange snooker) all Wi-Fi enabled. non-gamers are going to eat it up.

Gaming is still a minority. Especially in the UK. The non-gamer market is huge. Just look at the Tough Generation games that are selling like wildfire. Look at the parents, the neighbours, the countless mass who don't own systems. The PS2 sold 200 million (IIRC). there are (were?) 6 billion people in the world. say half of that could afford a console then you have a HUGE market. absolutely huge.

Now, as soon as games console replace VHS/DVD recorders in houses then we're out of the minority. That's Nintendos aim. Simple and cheap. get everyone involved. and I still cant believe people try and find a fault with simply trying to expand a market. More the merrier IMO.

[2nyRiggz]

PS2 sold for 299, the good PS3 sells for 599... that double the price... that a huge differnce.

Nintendo is making a come back... look at the DS sales. The Wii is looking to be a new type of game system.. which is good for Nintendo as their fanboys stay,and "new gamers" come to it. And parnets looking for a system for their kids look at the PS3 price tag and cry, look at the Wii and go "this look good"

And they bring home the Wii and the spoiled little brat throws it out the window because its not the PS3. I don't see Nintendo getting a bigger share than they have now...handhelds belong to them but if the 3rd party don't come with sme heavy hitters then its Cube squared.
Sony knows what they are doing....getting the sony peppz early with the price make some money back then lower the thing. This generation will go down just like this one except sony won't have that much of a gap.




Bless

[seenew]

And they bring home the Wii and the spoiled little brat throws it out the window because its not the PS3. I don't see Nintendo getting a bigger share than they have now...handhelds belong to them but if the 3rd party don't come with sme heavy hitters then its Cube squared.
Sony knows what they are doing....getting the sony peppz early with the price make some money back then lower the thing. This generation will go down just like this one except sony won't have that much of a gap.




Bless

Here's where you contradict yourself. In your scenario, a Wii is purchased and a PS3 is not. +1 for Nintendo, -1 for Sony (since with the price of the console, I don't think most people will buy a PS3 AND something else). It doesn't matter what the brat does to the Wii, it was still purchased. Thus Nintendo can add it to it's marketshare figures. Sony loses a potential buy, because after trashing a brand new Wii, this kid's parents aren't gonna shell out $600 to buy him something else, they're going to kick his ass.

So yes. No one will buy the PS3. Doesn't matter how many dev kits are sold to developers; the press is too bad for Sony right now, and people these days let the media make up their minds for them.

This generation will be a battle between the 360 and the Wii. Sony may have a chance if they somehow manage to drop their price, but as it's been said, it's hard to develop for anyway, so it will still need good games to compete. I mean, if the 3rd party ports look just as good as the 360, then people will buy the 360.

and Onizuka, you're uptight.

[Dagless]

It isn't bloggers either. It's the mass media. Hell I'm reading about negative press in the Oldham Chronicle. Live showcase new electronics and they're massive admiration for the Wii is being read by their audience, the sort of audience who have mass disposable income, the 20-30 year old male. They're banging on about HD, HD-DVD, BluRay, yachts that cost £12 million, a watch that costs more than a yacht etc.
It's outside the blogosphere.

[PlaceofDis]

without being flamed, and without this turning into an argument more than it already is....

can someone tell me the allure of the PS3?

i ask because of this...
Wii = nintendo franchise and the new wiimote. its a new take on playing games thats cool.
the Xbox 360 = it has graphics and FPS games. thats what i see that makes is stand out.
PS3 = BluRay... okay... but what type of games are we talking about? perhaps the Playstation franchise just doesn't specialize in the type of games i prefer.

either way i don't want sony to totally bomb but i think they need to gain some perspective too.

[mkaake]

gahh!

Every discussion doesn't have to turn into an argument about who will 'win' the console wars!

Goodness. I mean, honestly - we win. There will be 3 very nice consoles on the market - 1 uuber powerful, 1 uuber different, 1 uuber the same as before, but not as expensive as the uuber powerful. All will have their share of good games.

Now, to let my fanboy side into this, I think that big N is going to have a much easier time with 3rd party this time around - they've seen what's happening with the DS, and they're willing to give the Wii a shot. With the low development costs, they don't have to have a best seller to turn a profit - and I think that'll be HUGE for bringing in the third party.

Anyway, to each his own. The PS3 is more than I would pay for, but there are many who are willing to pay that much for a gaming machine (or a blu-ray player). That's *fine*, they can do that, it's their choice to make. I'll be picking up a Wii, which is also fine, that's my choice to make. And there are those who are happy with the 360 - again, also fine. And of course, there will be some with 2 or all 3 of these.

Who cares?

And before you say the winner of the wars gets the third party support, so we should all care, I refer to my previous statement - I think the Wii will draw in all sorts of 3rd party, even if it's not #1 (or #2)... The PS3 won't have too much to worry about in the 3rd party arena, as they've got the name behind them right now - in two years, if the console is doing horribly, that might change, but I doubt it. The 360 has the 3rd party by virtue of being the first by a long shot, and having the demand there.

So we all win. How can that be a bad thing?

[yellow]

gahh!

Every discussion doesn't have to turn into an argument about who will 'win' the console wars!

Goodness. I mean, honestly - we win. There will be 3 very nice consoles on the market - 1 uuber powerful, 1 uuber different, 1 uuber the same as before, but not as expensive as the uuber powerful.

Agreed. Soooo agreed.

[Haoshiro]

You know, people do always talk about third party support, which of course is important... but Nintendo could probably still be profitable even if it only had 1st/2nd party games, I know I would buy their systems just for Zelda, because I am a freak. ;)

As for PS3, which is what this thread is about, it is good to see they have something in production now, though we don't know if this is debug kits or final hardware at this point.

It is disappointing about Cell yields, but I'd imagine Sony has faced this with all of their systems, since they seem to always use very new custom hardware, rather then known chips custom modified.

[Haoshiro]

More good Sony news:
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/721/721540p1.html

July 27, 2006 - Sony walked a little taller in the boots today, reporting strong earnings for the quarter ending June 30, 2006. The company reported overall net income of 32.3 billion yen ($279.4 million), a dramatic jump from the 7.3 billion yen ($62.8 million) loss Sony reported in 2005.

[2nyRiggz]

Agreed. Soooo agreed.

It will never stop...holy war i guess.


Here's where you contradict yourself. In your scenario, a Wii is purchased and a PS3 is not. +1 for Nintendo, -1 for Sony (since with the price of the console, I don't think most people will buy a PS3 AND something else). It doesn't matter what the brat does to the Wii, it was still purchased

o yes. No one will buy the PS3. Doesn't matter how many dev kits are sold to developers; the press is too bad for Sony right now, and people these days let the media make up their minds for them.

This generation will be a battle between the 360 and the Wii. Sony may have a chance if they somehow manage to drop their price, but as it's been said, it's hard to develop for anyway, so it will still need good games to compete. I mean, if the 3rd party ports look just as good as the 360, then people will buy the 360.


The bold part is BS.

The point of my post is the kid is spoilt and will get what he/she wants so it looks like both partys win....did you say a beating? HA!!


I would like a thread without flaming but hey I want world peace and that ain't happening.







Bless

[Doraemon]

gahh!

Every discussion doesn't have to turn into an argument about who will 'win' the console wars!

Goodness. I mean, honestly - we win. There will be 3 very nice consoles on the market - 1 uuber powerful, 1 uuber different, 1 uuber the same as before, but not as expensive as the uuber powerful.
Agreed. Soooo agreed.

Dito. The consoles discussions at Macrumors are so borring. In the end, all three consoles will do fine. It's a growing market. And everyone can pick what he/she likes best.

[Dagless]

More good Sony news:
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/721/721540p1.html


umm, sorta. The Sony company as a whole was happy, but the gaming division took losses. the only department to do so.

http://www.joystiq.com/2006/07/27/sony-earnings-increase-while-games-division-incurs-losses/

[paddy]

Dito. The consoles discussions at Macrumors are so borring. In the end, all three consoles will do fine. It's a growing market. And everyone can pick what he/she likes best.

Don't read them if you think they're so borring so, no ones forcing you to.

[milo]

Yeah, my guess is that it won't be able to do anything beyond 1920x1080! ;)

Of course... what films even support that? I thought only Superman Returns and Apacolypto so far were the only films shot in "true hd", and at a horrific price (for the camera's).

I think Miami Vice uses the same Genesis cameras as Superman Returns. And I don't see the point of arguing which format technically holds more detail if the audience can't see a difference between film and video.

While this is a good step for Sony, they have a LOT of obstacles yet to overcome. Is there even a real release date set?

People seem to be forgeting that Gamers wont be the only ones purchasing or interested in purchasing a ps3. The wii has one sales point gaming only gamers will buy it and I dare say 80% of them will be nintendo fan boys
were as ps3 will probably be purchased mostly by people wanting a cheap blu-ray solution or a media center. Or maybe they dont have a ps2 and can actually see that buying the ps3 will mean a good long term desicion.

I see it the other way around. Most people aren't interested in blu-ray, at least not at those prices. At $500-600, only "fanboy" hardcore gamers will buy a PS3. If the wii is $199 or less, it is much more approachable for the casual gamer. Hate to say it, but there's a ceiling above which I'm not willing to spend. Who knows, maybe that means I'll end up with a new nintendo.

[Doraemon]

Don't read them if you think they're so borring so, no ones forcing you to.

That's not the point. The point is that every discussion is turned into a flame war. This thread started as an article discussion about the Sony dev kits. The first thing that happens is that someone comes along saying something like "But the [Wii, Xbox, SNES or whatever] is better anyway!".

[Haoshiro]

That's not the point. The point is that every discussion is turned into a flame war. This thread started as an article discussion about the Sony dev kits. The first thing that happens is that someone comes along saying something like "But the [Wii, Xbox, SNES or whatever] is better anyway!".

Not to be a punk, but I believe the first thing that happened was that someone posted:

While I, like you, yearn for some positive news about the PS3... I hate to say that I completely agree with:

10,000 devkits and a chummy games VP do not necessarily equal millions of sales of a $600 console

But it's safe to say it'll equal at least a sale of 2 units, one for you, and one for me.

:rolleyes:

[zap2]

And they bring home the Wii and the spoiled little brat throws it out the window because its not the PS3.

I don't see Nintendo getting a bigger share than they have now...

This generation will go down just like this one except sony won't have that much of a gap.




First statement- Anyone is is old enought to know they only want a Playstation will also know they can break things like that. Few parnets will shell out 600, plus 75 bucks per game


You 2nd and 3rd statement make no sense.. If Sony is going to not have as big of a gab..then it can't be the same as last generation. The Wii is cheap, people just entering the market like low prices, people like new things to chnage the way people game(the Wii-Mote is something new) and they have famous games

[XNine]

and Onizuka, you're uptight.

Aaaaw, does your vagina hurt? Want some midol? :p
:rolleyes: I've been called worse by my own mother, you think someone with so many skewed views calling me "uptight" is really going to get to me? lmao. Too funny. Too funny. Now that's entertainment I should pay for!

[Haoshiro]

I don't think he was trying to "get to you", just be honest with you about his accurate observations. :rolleyes:

[Dagless]

Hate to bring this topic back but I suppose it's better than starting a new one...

Sony have unveiled part of their online service. Guess what? Where they could have added something original, they instead chose to add "entitlements". The PS3's humiliating clone of the 360's "achievements". Effectively rendering the PS3 as a super-premium version of the 360 without a rumbling controller.

even the name is wrong. an entitlement is something you're blessed with, or given. an achievement is something you earn.

To echo what a poster on Kotaku said. "creatively bankrupt".

-1 to Sony.

http://www.kotaku.com/gaming/sony/sony-entitles-players-to-ps3-points-190810.php

[ddrueckhammer]

It may be ripping off the Xbox but all of these companies do it. Microsoft stole Gadgets from Apple's Widgets and Apple stole them from Konfabulator (who Yahoo! bought). We all know that M$ is king of all plagerists. Calling them entitlements is kind of stupid though. Maybe the Japanese meaning just doesn't translate well into English...

[Dagless]

I suppose. but it's just Sony saying "we're going to offer a service to rival Xbox Live".

No. They're going to blatantly copy Xbox Live. I'd just love Sony as current console market leader to offer something to lead the way. isn't that in the positions job description?

[ddrueckhammer]

Actually, I imagine the shareholders would prefer Sony offer just enough to keep the top spot. Sony isn't doing this, they are betting the future of their console on the future of Blue-Ray. Crazy to me, but I guess there is a ton of money in proprietary formats or they wouldn't keep creating them. Microsoft did more of what I would expect a major corporation to do with the 360 (a better version of what they already have).

[JRM PowerPod]

I think everyone is a little warped to be honest.

I don't understand why people are so negative towards to PS3. It is the most powerful and Playstation generally offer the best games to go with its hardware. I'm going to be paying AU1000 for mine. I don't care. Sure its a fair amount of money but i would have to spend three times that much to get a comparable PC, which will have to be upgraded every year.

Get a grip. I don't think a lot of you understand common economics, you pay for what you get. A lot of people won't pay the extra for the PS3, and that is their 'entitlement'. That's why people have the choice of Hyundai's and choices of Mercedes. If you don't want the Mercedes or can't afford the Mercedes, don't rubbish it for no reason, just drive the Hyundai. In real terms though we are talking a couple hundred bucks here.

Whinge whinge whinge. Sony is evil and doesn't have rumbling controllers. Buy Microsoft their integrity is a lot higher and they have rumbling conrollers. Or go for the Wii, it looks like Nintendo will be the biggest improver but i doubt the great Playstation downfall that you predict is going to occur. I'm not a Playstation fanboy, i'm a realist, how can people speculate to the degree that they are about Playstation's demise. Comments like "no one will buy a PS3" are fanciful at best. People will buy what they want. The "UUBER" guy is so true with what he said.

Lets wait and see

[ddrueckhammer]

Wow! you Aussies must have much more disposible income for electronics than us Americans because the price being higher will definately hurt the console here. The only people who don't care how much consoles cost are:

1. Wealthy people (not a huge demographic)
2. Kids (they aren't doing the buying are they)
3. 20 somthings with no kids and a good job etc (this is a small market). I'm in this demographic but still don't to want to drop alot on a console because I have other things to spend my money on like a nice ride and a freaking expensive engagement ring for my girlfriend (if she reads this it's totally worth it though... ;))

There is a much larger market for a less expensive console. Console are not computers no matter how much you try to make them one and most people (in America) these days have computers that are <$500. We are all "warped" on this board because we are Mac users which means that we are in a more affluent demographic. Nintendo are trying to expand the market for consoles and they are right. This doesn't take away from the fact that Sony's console is going to be a technologically superior product and will be fantastic. But volume wise, there is no better differentiator than cost.

[JRM PowerPod]

Wow! you Aussies must have much more disposible income for electronics than us Americans because the price being higher will definately hurt the console here. The only people who don't care how much consoles cost are 1. Wealthy people, 2. Kids (they aren't doing the buying are they) 3. 20 somthings with no kids and a good job etc (this is a small market). There is a much larger market for a less expensive console. Console are not computers no matter how much you try to make them one and most people (in America) these days have computers that are <$500. We are all "warped" on this board because we are Mac users which means that we are in a more affluent demographic.

My english teacher told me never to use 'everyone'. Sorry i did. It will definitely hurt sales, the Wii is probably going to be the greatest beneficiary, but, i'm just sick of stumbling across this console threads that are rubbishing the PS3 when really we are yet to see one in action. They will drop in price and thats when most people will buy. I paid AU$749 for my PS2 and will never regret it. They have been $200 for a while now. I have had it God only know how long, never had a problem and has kept me entertained. I know a console doesn't replicate the function and some of the gaming features of a PC, but all i say is you could spend $1000 on a video card, so something with Blu-ray and all these other cool features doesn't seem all that real expensive, I think i nearly spent that much on my first colour screen iPod. I just don't see the doom and gloom which everyone expects.

And i fit into Number 3 of your criteria. I'm 20 and no where near having kids, work my 45 hours a week and am full time uni, but yet to learn to appreciate money. I luv the drink, luv the ladies, will always have my mac and a game of Gran Turismo every now and then keeps me sane.

[ddrueckhammer]

You are probably right. Sony will keep the price high for early adoptors and then drop it to encourage sales. This strategy will work during the holiday season and maybe into the Summer (Wii and PS3 will be selling out at Christmas time) but if they don't drop the price pretty quick next year, I feel sorry for the developers who will be missing out on sales because of the pricing of the platform. Nintendo has done an excellent job with the Wii for encouraging developers to come over. I make it a point not to trash the PS3 because I really want one eventually and they have proven that they are capable of making great consoles but there are really some valid concerns about Sony's decision making this round.

[XNine]

It may be ripping off the Xbox but all of these companies do it. Microsoft stole Gadgets from Apple's Widgets and Apple stole them from Konfabulator (who Yahoo! bought). We all know that M$ is king of all plagerists. Calling them entitlements is kind of stupid though. Maybe the Japanese meaning just doesn't translate well into English...

To correct you, Apple didn't steal from Konfabulator, Konfabulator stole the idea from Apple's Desk Accessories in earlier versions of the Mac OS. Just to be clear here.

Everyone else... Flame on!

[Tommyg117]

Entitlements? Wow. I don't like the name, BUT I have to admit that I have gotten used to earning achievements and I think it is an amazing part about Xbox 360. That instant gratification is amazing and something that has made me play games more thoroughly as a result. I hope that all systems from here on out have some similar.

[MS bulldog]

i think sony is targeting their welfare recipients with the name "entitlements" it comforts poor gamers to know that they are properly receiving their entitlements...and these will probably come more often than the monthly ones they are used to receiving. this is probably plan b, since they realize that no self respecting videophile would ever use a game console as their next gen movie player.

[zero2dash]

Bloggers and their opinions about the systems don't really hold any water in an argument, and neither do financial analysts who speculate on video game consoles. :D

That being said:

-All three consoles will sell, and sell well. Anyone who thinks otherwise is kidding themselves. Each of the three consoles & their manufacturers have large enough fanbases that their fans will buy their systems; the job up for grabs is "who can sway someone who's going into a store to buy a system but doesn't care whose it is?"

-Nintendo's hurdle is to show people that they're not just a kiddie company; I don't think they are myself, but they didn't convince people of this too well with the Gamecube. They also need to prove to people that the controller concept isn't a gimmick and that they can offer better gameplay experience than the competition. (Side note on this: I remember how many people thought the DS would be a gimmick, myself included. Now I think it's one of the most fun consoles I've ever played and it has quickly become one of my favorites.)

-Sony's hurdle is their price tag, the lead of the 360, and the fact that they're just now starting a unified online service. (this being one with downloads, usernames, friend lists, etc. meanwhile Live has a 5+ year head start and a several-million user base)

-Microsoft's hurdle is continuing to deliver solid games that deviate the attention away from the competitions "new consoles" and back onto their system, and the fact that "Microsoft Xbox [360]" doesn't carry as much cache with a lot of people that "Sony Playstation [3]" does.

I'll end up owning a Wii and most likely a 360...the Ps3 is just out of the range of money I'm willing to spend on a gaming console that doesn't offer me much over the competition's 'high end' effort (that being the 360). If I'm looking at both the 360 and the Ps3, I know that Live is time-tested and proven reliable, and I know that if I crave a higher resolution DVD format, I can always get the HD-DVD add-on, which IMO is a better bet than trying another one of Sony's proprietary formats.

I got burned on the Memory Stick, bad...what a pile of crap. No one but Sony supports Memory Sticks, just like no one but Sony supported the Betamax. And the argument could be made that no one (thus far, to my knowledge) has pledged support of BluRay except Sony. Tsk tsk

Otherwise, graphics wise, hardware geeks out there will tell you that the Ps3 may be slightly more powerful than the 360, it's not as productive and efficient as the 360, so we're almost revisiting the whole "G5 vs. P4/Athlon" argument again. (It's a crude comparison, but I say this because I always thought G5s weren't that great because of their lower clock speed - and then I found out how much more efficient they were at handling data so they outperformed everyone else in the end.) So in a nutshell - I think when it counts, the 360 will outperform the Ps3 and therefore will maintain better/more steady framerates in games. But this is all rumor/speculation, obviously.

[2nyRiggz]

Bring it Sony...lets see what you got and if it will be better.


<Flamesuit On>




Bless

[XNine]

I got burned on the Memory Stick, bad...what a pile of crap. No one but Sony supports Memory Sticks, just like no one but Sony supported the Betamax. And the argument could be made that no one (thus far, to my knowledge) has pledged support of BluRay except Sony. Tsk tsk

Wrong.

The Blu-ray Disc format was developed by the Blu-ray Disc Association (BDA), a group of leading consumer electronics, personal computer and media manufacturers, with more than 170 member companies from all over the world. The Board of Directors currently consists of:

Apple Computer, Inc.
Dell Inc.
Hewlett Packard Company
Hitachi, Ltd.
LG Electronics Inc.
Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., Ltd.
Mitsubishi Electric Corporation
Pioneer Corporation
Royal Philips Electronics
Samsung Electronics Co., Ltd.
Sharp Corporation
Sony Corporation
TDK Corporation
Thomson Multimedia
Twentieth Century Fox
Walt Disney Pictures
Warner Bros. Entertainment

Just as well, the next version of TOAST will have Bluray support, so it's already taking hold.

[yellow]

This is seriously the last console thread I will read on this site.
Back to the Mac, **** the console wars and all it's Holy Knights of Rightousness.

[ddrueckhammer]

To correct you, Apple didn't steal from Konfabulator, Konfabulator stole the idea from Apple's Desk Accessories in earlier versions of the Mac OS. Just to be clear here.

Everyone else... Flame on!

Wow, sorry didn't know that. I guess I didn't read up my history far enough back.

Yellow, I can't believe this thread is sending you away from the console discussions. This one is actually pretty civil. Go read some of the threads on IGN or Nintendo.com. They read like a bunch of uninformed 10 year olds. I posted one there once and had to reiterate my statements for about 10 pages because noone could read the first page. As long as people, respect people's opinions there isn't anything wrong with a thread about the Pros and Cons of each system. I just try to be the bigger person and not let it spiral into personal attacks.

[Mackilroy]

Wrong.

He did say to the best of his knowledge... now he's learned something.

Just as well, the next version of TOAST will have Bluray support, so it's already taking hold.

Will it have HD-DVD support as well or just Blu-ray?

[zero2dash]

Wrong.

The Blu-ray Disc format was developed by the Blu-ray Disc Association (BDA), a group of leading consumer electronics, personal computer and media manufacturers, with more than 170 member companies from all over the world. The Board of Directors currently consists of:

Apple Computer, Inc.
Dell Inc.
Hewlett Packard Company
Hitachi, Ltd.
LG Electronics Inc.
Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., Ltd.
Mitsubishi Electric Corporation
Pioneer Corporation
Royal Philips Electronics
Samsung Electronics Co., Ltd.
Sharp Corporation
Sony Corporation
TDK Corporation
Thomson Multimedia
Twentieth Century Fox
Walt Disney Pictures
Warner Bros. Entertainment

Just as well, the next version of TOAST will have Bluray support, so it's already taking hold.

Ok, I stand corrected. I just assumed that it was a Sony-only property at this point because I haven't heard anyone else really hype it, but - good enough, thanks for the info.

[XNine]

Ok, I stand corrected. I just assumed that it was a Sony-only property at this point because I haven't heard anyone else really hype it, but - goood enough.

So here's a question for you though...I thought HD-DVD was the only format of the two supported by the DVD compendum (or whatever it's called) and BluRay isn't (for whatever reason). Good? Bad? Does it matter?

There are few companies who support both formats (HDDVD and BluRay) such as Apple. As for the DVD Forum, a lot of the companies including Sony were a part of it. But yes, at this time it only supports HDDVD.

As far as I know, the only news is that Toast will Support BD, there has been no mention of HDDVD. http://www.macobserver.com/article/2006/07/25.4.shtml