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MacBytes
Jul 27, 2006, 05:33 PM
http://www.macbytes.com/images/bytessig.gif (http://www.macbytes.com)

Category: Reviews
Link: Ten-year-old Apple Newton beats latest Windows UMPC (http://www.macbytes.com/link.php?sid=20060727183337)
Description:: We pitted the Apple Newton Messagepad against the latest Samsung Q1 ultra-mobile PC (Origami project), and -- despite being a decade old -- the Newton won.

Posted on MacBytes.com (http://www.macbytes.com)
Approved by arn

mvc
Jul 27, 2006, 05:46 PM
Come back in 12 months when the UMPC has decent battery life and has shrunk even more. The Newton will look pretty old by then.

If only Apple had continued developing this market segment.

Right product, wrong time...

Yvan256
Jul 27, 2006, 05:59 PM
All I need is my Nintendo DS Lite with that Opera browser cart. Can't wait for the north american release though...

PlaceofDis
Jul 27, 2006, 06:04 PM
an apple ultra portable or
an apple ultra PDA

i'll take either. please??



yeah i have a 12" powerbook... but i want something small to go with me whever i go, rather than a pad of paper.

jaxstate
Jul 27, 2006, 06:10 PM
If this isn't a joke, then they must be on some serious drugs, hard and heavy.

Mord
Jul 27, 2006, 06:13 PM
personally i'd still take the newton.

Eraserhead
Jul 27, 2006, 06:20 PM
Come back in 12 months when the UMPC has decent battery life and has shrunk even more. The Newton will look pretty old by then.

If only Apple had continued developing this market segment.

Right product, wrong time...

I cannot believe it won, and that Apple dropped it. A 162Mhz processor also wasn't bad for 1997...

It looks pretty damn good for 1997 tech, hopefully Apple will release another.

atszyman
Jul 27, 2006, 06:25 PM
...If only Apple had continued developing this market segment...

Just because they aren't on sale now does not mean that the Newton is completely dead. Apple has been running OS X on Intel from the beginning without everyone knowing, how do we know that somewhere within the bowels of #1 Infinite Loop there's not a team of Engineers and programmers resurrecting and refining the Newton to take on the Origami PCs head on?

Of course I know I'm wrong but it would be a nice thought....

katie ta achoo
Jul 27, 2006, 06:35 PM
I thought CNet was unapologetically biased against Apple?

Rocketman
Jul 27, 2006, 06:36 PM
an apple ultra portable or
an apple ultra PDA

i'll take either. please??



yeah i have a 12" powerbook... but i want something small to go with me whever i go, rather than a pad of paper.


Since the 2G video iPod will have broadband wireless, touchscreen, reasonbable processor, OS virtualizationS lite, and a "full computer experience", it will be trivial for it to:

Be a mac
Be an iPod
Be a VoiP/cell v/d phone
Be a portable Tivo
Be a Newton on steroids
Be a UMPC on steroids
Be a remote server window
Be a CPU which is not a Be

Rocketman

mvc
Jul 27, 2006, 07:46 PM
I thought CNet was unapologetically biased against Apple?


It's called linkbaiting. And it's a very cynical form of journalism.

CNet runs a constant line of Apple related articles, some 'pro' but most mainly 'con' to produce headlines that aggregating sites like digg and slashdot will slavishly link to and drive traffic for CNet's advertisers.

'Con' articles usually get the best traffic as they know Mac zealots can't resist taking the flamebait and PC zealots love to see the Mac go down, so it's a win-win. Dvorak uses the same business model.

Ask yourself why this CNet article had so many pages - it's simply to drive more page views to advertising.

Chef Medeski
Jul 27, 2006, 07:47 PM
Just because they aren't on sale now does not mean that the Newton is completely dead. Apple has been running OS X on Intel from the beginning without everyone knowing, how do we know that somewhere within the bowels of #1 Infinite Loop there's not a team of Engineers and programmers resurrecting and refining the Newton to take on the Origami PCs head on?

Of course I know I'm wrong but it would be a nice thought....
Oh they are doing it. I mean at infinite loop they do everything you wouldn't dream off.... put G5s into powerbooks... Intel CPUs into Macs.... run windows on a mac..... make two button mouses..... so the question isn't whether they are doing but if it will ever hit the light of day, they call it the infinite loop for a reason, ideas just keep on going around and around.

hulugu
Jul 27, 2006, 07:48 PM
I thought CNet was unapologetically biased against Apple?

Sometimes they get confused and say something nice, but this will be quickly rectified with an article about how iPods can make puppies explode, or some other nonsense.

It's called linkbaiting. And it's a very cynical form of journalism...Ask yourself why this CNet article had so many pages - it's simply to dive more page views to advertising.

I feel used.

mvc
Jul 27, 2006, 07:50 PM
Sometimes they get confused and say something nice, but this will be quickly rectified with an article about how iPods can make puppies explode, or some other nonsense.



I feel used.

It's the new SPAM! ;-)
Well, actually, its not new, its just the online version of Tabloid journalism.

Bad Beaver
Jul 28, 2006, 01:08 AM
If this isn't a joke, then they must be on some serious drugs, hard and heavy.

[] You own a Newton

Xander562
Jul 28, 2006, 01:19 AM
arent these the same people that said the iPod was inferior to some other music player? :rolleyes:

katie ta achoo
Jul 28, 2006, 01:22 AM
It's called linkbaiting. And it's a very cynical form of journalism

Wow, that's tricky!


I hold CNet in even lower esteem than I did before, now.

severedfingers
Jul 28, 2006, 04:45 AM
It's called linkbaiting. And it's a very cynical form of journalism.

CNet runs a constant line of Apple related articles... digg and slashdot will slavishly link to and drive traffic for CNet's advertisers.

Linkbating is an interesting theory, and no doubt it does happen. But this CNET article doesn't have any adverts on it! This slightly undermines your accusations. I'm all for exposing the people who linkbait, but CNET aren't. Look again if you're unsure. (http://digitalliving.cnet.co.uk/specials/0,39030785,49282099-4,00.htm) Where are the ads? I see a banner telling you about other parts of the CNET site, but I don't see any ads...

mvc
Jul 28, 2006, 04:47 AM
Linkbating is an interesting theory, and no doubt it does happen. But this CNET article doesn't have any adverts on it! This slightly undermines your accusations. I'm all for exposing the people who linkbait, but CNET aren't. Look again if you're unsure. (http://digitalliving.cnet.co.uk/specials/0,39030785,49282099-4,00.htm) Where are the ads? I see a banner telling you about other parts of the CNET site, but I don't see any ads...

The exception proves the rule, usually there will be ads on multipage articles like this. This is a very typical pricatice. Just surf a little with your eyes wider open ;-)

Sesshi
Jul 28, 2006, 05:37 AM
I'd agree. Windows Tablet Edition is a waste of time and although it incorporates some advanced features it's usability is in the crapper compared to Newton. I had such high hopes for my Toshiba but in the end it proved to be more of a hindrance than an advantage. I see some people using Tablet PC's at meetings and I can only salute their perseverance and geekosity. A pen and paper works a whole lot better than Tablet PC.

SPUY767
Jul 28, 2006, 07:30 AM
I thought CNet was unapologetically biased against Apple?

That's C|Net.com, this is C|Net.co.uk, may as well be a different organization. The British journalists usually aren't as dim-witted as their yank brethren, and their opinions tent to be a little more down to earth. For a good reference point, compare Macworld.co.uk to Macworld.com articles.

mkrishnan
Jul 28, 2006, 07:36 AM
This was pretty entertaining, although I did mostly just skim it. I do have to say though that if the UMPC transcriber is like the one in WM5, I am not so overly impressed...I don't do handwriting recognition much at all on my Axim x51v because it just isn't reliable. Doesn't prevent me from enjoying it and using it for the purpose I bought it for (on the go web access via WiFi). But yeah, I don't like the handwriting rec that much. :(

Macmaniac
Jul 28, 2006, 09:02 AM
I think someone has too much time at Cnet..

Mal
Jul 28, 2006, 09:19 AM
It's comparisons like this that may signal Apple that it's time to release their long-hidden Newton 2 project. Like has been mentioned, it's a fairly sure bet that they had at least a small team keeping the project active at least in conceptual design. This does seem to be the right time to do it, just as all these Windows-based UMPC's are hitting the market, Apple comes and deals them the knockout blow right from the start.

All they have to do is throw in the best technologies (not necessarily the most), give it a full-color Newton OS, updated only for speed and visuals, and sell it at the same price or $100 less than the Q1 (which, as mentioned, is hideously overpriced). Then we'll see the true knock-out punch.

jW

mozmac
Jul 28, 2006, 11:11 AM
After reading the article, it made me want to throw down some money to get a Newton. I just can't find a practical place for it in my life other than being a toy. If I had a 14-year-old son, I'd buy one, play with it for a bit, and then give it to him. He would think it was so cool to have something like that just for him. I know I loved to play with any little gadget I could get my hands on, especially if we were on a long road trip. I'd plug all sorts of useless information into the calendar or something. "7:15pm: Stop at gas station." "10:30pm: Arrive at Grandma's." "7:30am: Wake up and watch Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and then Captain N while eating Lucky Charms."

Talk to me in 15 years when I have that 14-year-old son and ask him if I've bought a Newton for him yet.

mozmac
Jul 28, 2006, 11:18 AM
I'd like to hear from other people, though. What would you use a UMPC for? Realisticly, not just as a toy. If you have a laptop that can go with you everywhere, when would you ever use a UMPC?

1. If my laptop can't be there with me, I either don't want to be working or shouldn't be working right then, so a UMPC won't help that.
2. I can see it helping in big businesses, with people in warehouses for scanning inventory, the FedEx guy that scans your packages when he delivers them, at concerts they could scan your tickets...I don't see any really spot for it in the consumer market, though. Anyone? Prove me wrong. But really, as it stands right now, I don't see myself needing something this big when I can have either my laptop or my smartphone with me virtually everywhere I go.

What Apple needs to go is come out with an Newton/iPod/Cell Phone. Something the size of an iPod, but with the full size screen we've been hearing about, that is also a cell phone, and a Newton PDA that syncs with Apple's own enterprise server solution that can compete directly with Microsoft Exchange. However, they must build Exchange support into it if they would like to capture the business market (which I don't know if they do). They're going after consumers.

Eewie Boll
Jul 28, 2006, 12:37 PM
I'd like to hear from other people, though. What would you use a UMPC for? Realisticly, not just as a toy. If you have a laptop that can go with you everywhere, when would you ever use a UMPC?

One size does not fit all and not every device has to do everything. It seems to me that there is an open spot between a PDA/Pocket PC and laptop. A PDA is too small to read a document without scrolling every second and a laptop is too big lug around all the time. (Of course, there isn't a modern mac PDA or pocket PC, either).

I'd also like something more tablet-y that I can use to review and take notes on documents on the train each morning. The ride is often a bit too crampt to open up the laptop and it would be nice to be able use it while standing. Part of the problem with tablets, as I see it, is that they are too cumbersome to be used one-handed.

I do travel frequently, and it would be nice to have a device that is much lighter than my current laptop (a G3 ibook). I have a G4 mac at home for the weighter programs, the Adobe stuff, media manipulation or whatnot. But as a traveling business type, I don't need the same level of functionality on the road (although some do and they can continue to use their laptops).

I'm a big strong guy, but it is a hassle to lug a laptop around sometimes. Heck, often.

When I'm on the road, I have four requirements: email, web surfing, word processing and (rarely) Keynote (if only to edit things last minute).

Something the size of an Origami device, Nokia 770 or iRex Iliad would be ideal for me. And there are plenty of options that are out there for portable keyboards and mice, so I could sit down and type if needed.

As for the Newton/iPod/Cellphone idea, that's nice if it had enough screen space. Although I wouldn't want a cellphone either. I despise smartphones -- too bulky and I hate smearing the screen with my sweaty face. Like I said, not every device has to do everything.

valiar
Jul 28, 2006, 02:50 PM
CNet UK ran a comparison test of a 10-year old Apple Newton
and a brand new Microsoft/Intel/Samsung UMPC tablet.
The 10-year-old technology from Apple came out as a winner! :D :D
It is a hilarious read - just like that infamous Microsoft iPod packaging
video, it underscores the fact that Apple usually "gets it" - while most
other tech companies, with Microsoft at the lead, as a rule do not :)
Read more here:

http://digitalliving.cnet.co.uk/specials/0,39030785,49282099,00.htm

By the way, I was able to get my hands on the Samsung device at my
local Fry's, and it was craptastic. The screen is too small to be practical,
shiny black plastic attracts fingerprits like crazy, and, to top it off, the
test unit was already infested with spyware!
There was also a Sony handheld computer there... With a 4-inch 1024x600
screen. I have 40-40 vision, but my eyes did hurt after I have attempted
to use it for 5-10 minutes.
Why can't anyone make a "modern Newton" these days?

jaxstate
Jul 28, 2006, 03:13 PM
:cool: Don't need to own one to know that this article is ********.
[] You own a Newton

hulugu
Jul 28, 2006, 03:30 PM
:cool: Don't need to own one to know that this article is ********.

The article is indeed lame, but it is interesting that for form factor and UI design the Newton held its own against a brand-new product.
While the UMPC is an interesting idea, it appears to be an immature technology, the battery life is too short and the design tries to do too many things.
The PDA market (of which I consider the UMPC, the Newton, and the Nokia tablet) is still in its infancy.

Or the Newton was just so rediculously revolutionary.