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View Full Version : Fear not, Steve, your secrets really aren't worth stealing ...


MacBytes
Aug 24, 2006, 08:31 PM
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Category: Opinion/Interviews
Link: Fear not, Steve, your secrets really aren't worth stealing (http://www.macbytes.com/link.php?sid=20060824213156)
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Posted on MacBytes.com (http://www.macbytes.com)
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Lau
Aug 24, 2006, 08:40 PM
I've got to kind of agree with the article. I think the whole attitude of the way they presented WWDC as so anti-Microsoft left it open to this kind of criticism, justified or not. In that the features they showed weren't terribly exciting and had been around as various apps and in OSs for a while, I think it was a gamble that didn't really pay off and left them looking a bit sheepish.

Fotograffiti
Aug 24, 2006, 08:50 PM
What a bunch of Microsoft loving crap. I get that it takes awhile to add something to an operating system. That could be said without the rest of the article talking up Microsoft and insulting Leopard at every turn. This makes it sounds like everything is peachy with Vista and OS X Leopard is just a mess.

swingerofbirch
Aug 24, 2006, 08:55 PM
I don't think Mac OS X lacks for speed. It's much better IMO at multi-tasking than Windows.

And from what I have heard Leopard is even faster even though it hasn't been fully optimized.

He says he doesn't use any of the mac os x features, like spotlight etc, so why does he use Macs at all?

I have used google desktop search, windows desktop search, and the regular windows search and none are as fast or comprehensive as spotlight.

A is jump
Aug 24, 2006, 09:20 PM
I dont know, I think that article seems to ignore that alot of the features in Vista, HAVE been available in OSX for many years. Not just the ones Steve showed durring his keynote. Also, I dont think Steve was especially smug.

as far as the features he shows... I for one use them all the time. Expose, dashboard, spotlight, at least every day if not every other day. Spaces has me really excited too.

all in all, speed is important yes, but I isnt that what spotlight and expose are all about? keeping your work flow going, without interuptions. when I get on a mac that has expose disabled... i get so frustrated with switching apps, even with ctrl+tab its a pain in comparison.

I'll admit that what steve demonstrated at WWDC didnt blow me away, but I'm putting my bets on some of the secret features being extreamly awesome. (of course the author of this article will probably only find them lukewarm)

thedude110
Aug 24, 2006, 09:27 PM
I think the whole attitude of the way they presented WWDC as so anti-Microsoft left it open to this kind of criticism, justified or not.

Agreed.

I also think that some of "option one" from the article is true -- if there are advanced features ("secrets," if you will) in X.5, I don't think they were ready for play at WWDC.

Call me cynical ... I think Steve was trying to come through on a promise (from the prior year's WWDC) when he may have been better off saying "Wait 'till Paris."

blasto333
Aug 24, 2006, 09:37 PM
I can't belive the person who wrote the article doesn't use expose, spotlight, safari, or widgets. I use those things on a daily basis. Sometimes when I work on a windows machine I find myself hitting f9 but nothing happens. Expose is awesome!

Voidness
Aug 24, 2006, 09:48 PM
But I've learnt, in five years of using OS X, that I rarely end up using the stuff Jobs shows off in keynotes. I don't use Expose, rarely use Spotlight or Dashboard (the "widgets" substratum, like Yahoo's Konfabulator), nor Automator, nor iChat, nor Safari.
Interesting. Do you use the Dock?

For me, the single must-have feature Apple's engineers could build into Leopard would be speed. But somehow I doubt that's one of the "secret features" under lock and key in Cupertino.
I can assure you it's not one of the secret features, because it's a default feature. Apparently, you haven't noticed in five years of using Mac OS X that every version brings MAJOR speed improvements to the OS.

Analog Kid
Aug 24, 2006, 09:56 PM
What claptrap...

Nobody really thought that with all the trouble MS is having with Vista that they're going to make major changes now. And since the next OS will be 5 years after that they're not worried about MS implementing anything soon. Maybe an application developer like Google could throw together an add-on in 6 months, but that would be it...

The reasons are 1 and 3-- stuff ain't finished (we're still 9 or 10 months from GM) and they want something to talk about next time.

And why would anyone think the Leopard Developer Preview is a) Beta (it's a preview, not a release milestone) or b) represents what the final Leopard will look like?

Oh well, they're getting us to hit the site I guess...

dmw007
Aug 24, 2006, 09:57 PM
I can't belive the person who wrote the article doesn't use expose, spotlight, safari, or widgets. I use those things on a daily basis. Sometimes when I work on a windows machine I find myself hitting f9 but nothing happens. Expose is awesome!

I know, same here- I can not stand to use a computer that does not have Expose. :)

timswim78
Aug 24, 2006, 10:24 PM
I

I have used google desktop search, windows desktop search, and the regular windows search and none are as fast or comprehensive as spotlight.

Use the google desktop extreme plug-in, and I bet that you'll never want to use spotlight again.

macnulty
Aug 24, 2006, 11:18 PM
The author was pretty whinny, the article basically empty. So he doesn't like any OSX features, who gives a ff. Jobs has room to be smug, Gates (MS) can buy just about anything he wants except one thing. Classic story.

redAPPLE
Aug 25, 2006, 12:52 AM
Gates (MS) can buy just about anything he wants except one thing.

what is that? dignity? :D

nagromme
Aug 25, 2006, 02:00 AM
Some people talk as though this "Microsoft-bashing" at WWDC were some kind of ad campaign aimed at Windows users.

It was not. It was, first and foremost, cheerleading for developers. And cheerleading with more than a grain of truth in it, like it or not.

rams
Aug 25, 2006, 03:48 AM
But I've learnt, in five years of using OS X, that I rarely end up using the stuff Jobs shows off in keynotes. I don't use Expose, rarely use Spotlight or Dashboard (the "widgets" substratum, like Yahoo's Konfabulator), nor Automator, nor iChat, nor Safari.

what did you say? you've learnt? for me, it sounds, like you are one of those who are in the habit of NOT learning and PREVENT all new stuff, because it's evil.
go back console hacking. :D

SpaceMagic
Aug 25, 2006, 07:02 AM
I have to agree with Lau and others. The Keynote was really childish in my opinion and it was a huge smokescreen to cover up the fact they hadn't really done anything and are lagging behind with Leopard. The whole 'Top Secret' thing is rubbish as Microsoft are cutting features from Vista not adding!

As it stands, I'm not paying £90 for a backup utility with fancy graphics. I use QuickSilver and VirtueDesktops and apple have just stolen the layout from BlackTree.

wnurse
Aug 25, 2006, 07:10 AM
I know, same here- I can not stand to use a computer that does not have Expose. :)

I have expose and never use it myself. I guess you would have to train yourself to use it. In fact, no one that lives in my house uses expose. I think what he was saying is that's it a fluff feature and i think he's right.. you can do live without it and not even notice it's there. That being said, i think i will use expose some more to see if i can train myself to like it.

MacBoobsPro
Aug 25, 2006, 08:03 AM
I have expose and never use it myself. I guess you would have to train yourself to use it. In fact, no one that lives in my house uses expose. I think what he was saying is that's it a fluff feature and i think he's right.. you can do live without it and not even notice it's there. That being said, i think i will use expose some more to see if i can train myself to like it.

I think Expose is mostly used by people with a moderate to large workflow. For example when I work (as a designer) I have Quark, Freehand, Photoshop and Acrobat open and when moving files around the screen gets very cluttered. Just hitting a button to get to the window you want in an instant saves loads of time throughout a days work.

Spaces will be a even greater step forward and I cant wait. Its the small things that make a difference.

nagromme
Aug 25, 2006, 12:56 PM
I have expose and never use it myself.
To each his own... I was late to start using email, myself! (Seriously :o ) Not every feature will mean the same to every user with unnique needs and tastes.

But Exposť is not fluff for me--it's vital, saving time, preventing mistakes, and helping me think about what I'm DOING instead of about fighting my computer. (Which is basically what the Mac is about after all.)

It's most vital when I'm using a bunch of windows at once, going back and forth. But I also use it simply to go between 2 or 3 windows. It's just a really simple way to get around at all times.

Forget the key: put Show All Windows on a mouse button--or do what I do an assign a hot corner (lower-left seems least obtrusive). When you find yourself hiding and showing apps, clicking arounf the dock, or worse yet, losing a window behind another one, try hitting Exposť Show All and before long you won't know how you got along without it.

Unless you pretty much use on app/window at a time, which I know some people do.

Exposť's best trick--and this works best with a hot corner, not a button: you can drag something FROM a window, go into Exposť, hover over the destination until it enlarged, and drop INTO the other window. Drag-and-drop with Exposť used in the MIDDLE of the drag! A huge time saver--especially when you're dragging from one big window to another and can't see both.

I use this all the time with file dialogs too: I hit Open or Save, and then I drag the desired destination folder from the Finder into the file dialog. That sets the dialog to that location in zero clicks :) (Exposť show Desktop can be handy for this too.)

Sharewaredemon
Aug 25, 2006, 01:09 PM
nagromme You can hit space when you are dragging and dropping in exposť to speed up the process.

Hitting space when you are dragging and dropping in OS X initiates the "springload" instead of waiting the system designated time (2 seconds usually).

ghall
Aug 25, 2006, 01:15 PM
I used to never use Expose, but now I can't live without it.

This may come off as extreme fanboyism, but I think theres a lot more to Leopard that meets the eye. Sure, I don't really think that they're will be any more MAJOR new features, but maybe a few smaller features and changes.

Also, I don't know about any of you, but I'm gonna LOVE Spaces. I've used VirtueDesktop but it's not quite as cool.

nagromme
Aug 25, 2006, 01:16 PM
Yeah, that's what I do--good tip.

(Pet peeve, hopefully fixed in Leopard: the Dock is left uncovered by Exposť... but doesn't actuall WORK in Exposť. Would be great if it did, since it's there. Otherwise hide it!)

Sharewaredemon
Aug 25, 2006, 01:41 PM
(Pet peeve, hopefully fixed in Leopard: the Dock is left uncovered by Exposť... but doesn't actuall WORK in Exposť. Would be great if it did, since it's there. Otherwise hide it!)

Oh so true! That really bugs me!

Mainyehc
Aug 26, 2006, 09:05 AM
(Pet peeve, hopefully fixed in Leopard: the Dock is left uncovered by Exposť... but doesn't actuall WORK in Exposť. Would be great if it did, since it's there. Otherwise hide it!)

Strange as it seems, my Dock is automatically hidden when I trigger Exposť-all and Exposť-apps, and it's not hidden and works fine when I trigger Exposť-show desktop... Then again, my Dock is set to auto-hide, so maybe that's what makes it behave this way.

bousozoku
Aug 26, 2006, 09:37 AM
I've got to kind of agree with the article. I think the whole attitude of the way they presented WWDC as so anti-Microsoft left it open to this kind of criticism, justified or not. In that the features they showed weren't terribly exciting and had been around as various apps and in OSs for a while, I think it was a gamble that didn't really pay off and left them looking a bit sheepish.

Indeed. Poking fun is one thing but they went beyond that and then, showed nearly nothing.

I think it's true that so many secret items are too buggy at this point that they couldn't show them. That's why it looked like Tiger with add-ons. I'm betting that the finished product looks very little like what was demonstrated.


...
As I write, the first "release candidate" of Vista - a version meant to be almost good enough to box and sell - is hotly expected by many news sites. Once you get to that stage, you don't add anything.
...


I think someone is confused. Most authors of articles I've seen are complaining about how utterly buggy the latest release is. It's feature complete but it's going to take a lot to get it to production quality--even Microsoft's.

nagromme
Aug 26, 2006, 12:14 PM
Strange as it seems, my Dock is automatically hidden when I trigger Exposé-all and Exposé-apps, and it's not hidden and works fine when I trigger Exposé-show desktop... Then again, my Dock is set to auto-hide, so maybe that's what makes it behave this way.
True, Show Desktop is different from other Exposé functions: you can work with regular windows, and the Dock, normally in that mode.


Indeed. Poking fun is one thing but they went beyond that and then, showed nearly nothing.
They showed only 10 things that sound superficially showy or noteworthy (like Core Animation and Time Machine) but they showed a lot more than those 10 things under NDA. And what we as non-developers call "nothing" might be really welcome under-the-hood enhancements to a developer. Leopard certainly doesn't seem like "nearly nothing" when compared to Vista.

This was a developer's conference after all. (And when you're the underdog, you can make fun of the 800-lb. gorilla and get away with it. Who is going to be offended, and what harm will they do Apple in response? Especially if you do it in a way that highlights your strengths and their weaknesses--and presents them in a humorous style to the developers whose enthusiasm you need. Most of the public has no idea what posters were shown to Mac developers, and did not watch the keynote stream.)

FF_productions
Aug 27, 2006, 08:21 PM
That wasn't a bad article. It makes you want to speculate what is taking so long for Leopard to be released. Doesn't Apple want to release Leopard before Vista? Vista is coming by the end of this year, and it will make a splash, no matter how buggy you may think it is.

Spring 07, you better be one damn good OS, or Steve might get ahead of schedule and release it at MacWorld.

Tiger is good enough for me right now, heck even Panther is good enough. It's all better than what MS offers.

bousozoku
Aug 27, 2006, 11:02 PM
...
They showed only 10 things that sound superficially showy or noteworthy (like Core Animation and Time Machine) but they showed a lot more than those 10 things under NDA. And what we as non-developers call "nothing" might be really welcome under-the-hood enhancements to a developer. Leopard certainly doesn't seem like "nearly nothing" when compared to Vista.

This was a developer's conference after all. (And when you're the underdog, you can make fun of the 800-lb. gorilla and get away with it. Who is going to be offended, and what harm will they do Apple in response? Especially if you do it in a way that highlights your strengths and their weaknesses--and presents them in a humorous style to the developers whose enthusiasm you need. Most of the public has no idea what posters were shown to Mac developers, and did not watch the keynote stream.)

I've been a developer for over 20 years and have signed multiple NDAs in the past.

Apple is late and they know it.

nagromme
Aug 28, 2006, 10:05 AM
What do the NDAs have to do with Apple being "late," and what are they "late" for?

Tiger made it out before Vista. What is vital about whether Leopard does or not? (Which it may.)

I agree that if Apple has missed some deadline ("early 2007" is the only one they stated, and might still make even if early Spring) then they do know they have missed it :)