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MacRumors
Aug 26, 2006, 03:43 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

eWeek reported (http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,2006986,00.asp) that PC manufacturers are expected to announce availability of new Core 2 Duo (http://guides.macrumors.com/Core_2_Duo) (Merom) notebooks on Monday August 28th.

The Core 2 Duo for notebooks, otherwise known by the code name "Merom," offers buyers a performance upgrade—an increase of about 20 percent, according to Intel—but holds power consumption to nearly the same level as its predecessor, the Core Duo.

According to Intel, the Core 2 Duo processors fit into existing notebook systems with only a system software update required to work. The new chips are to range from 1.66GHz to 2.33GHz. Apple is expected (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2006/08/20060814180417.shtml) to join in with Core 2 Duo based Macs as early as September, according to early reports.

The next major upgrade to Intel's notebook design isn't expected until early 2007 with a new notebook platform named "Santa Rosa". Santa Rosa will combine the Core 2 Duo processors with new supporting chips as well as Intel's AMT (http://www.intel.com/technology/manage/iamt/) (Active Management Technology) and Robson technology. Robson uses flash memory to improve startup times and to cache frequently used applications. Previous rumors (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2006/01/20060105165725.shtml) have placed Robson technology in future Mac notebooks.

daneoni
Aug 26, 2006, 03:47 PM
PowerBook G5 next tuesday?

boogieman
Aug 26, 2006, 03:49 PM
PowerBook G5 next tuesday?

Im guessing hopefully by the years end for the G5.... :) :)

daneoni
Aug 26, 2006, 03:51 PM
I dont see much change really, the 1.66GHz merom chip will find its way into the mini (they'll scrap the solo model).

The 1.83 & 2.00GHz for iMacs (if they use merom) and MacBooks and the 2.16 and 2.33 for the 15 & 17 MBPs respectively. Its that simple.

freakonguitar
Aug 26, 2006, 03:55 PM
well...then maybe we will see a new macbook pro and possibly some other things in the next few weeks to come. :) but from some of the rumors, mermon has worse battery life and more heat than yonah :( ....which is too bad, cause we could use a cpu that gives at least just as good performance but less heat!

512ke
Aug 26, 2006, 03:57 PM
If the power consumption is the same... does that mean that the Merom and the current chips suck the same amount energy while going full throttle?

If the above is true, if you turned down the Merom to match the speed of the current chips, wouldn't the Merom be drawing 20% less power?

In other words if the Merom and the current chip were both going 60 mph down the freeway, would the Merom be drawing less power?

Am I missing something here (such as the basics of electricity, the basic way that chips work, etc.)?

512ke

BlizzardBomb
Aug 26, 2006, 03:58 PM
PowerBook G5 next tuesday?

Mildly funny when it first started, but my god is that an old joke.

In other news, Merom this, Merom that, just make sure you get it out on time Apple :p

StealthRider
Aug 26, 2006, 03:59 PM
Old, but still funny. A little :p

bluetorch18
Aug 26, 2006, 04:02 PM
Merom MBP on Tuesday? I sure hope so.

Warbrain
Aug 26, 2006, 04:06 PM
Im guessing hopefully by the years end for the G5.... :) :)

I was told it would be released before Christmas. I can't wait!

DavidLeblond
Aug 26, 2006, 04:08 PM
The 1.83 & 2.00GHz for iMacs (if they use merom) and MacBooks and the 2.16 and 2.33 for the 15 & 17 MBPs respectively. Its that simple.

That doesn't make sense, marketing wise. If they do anything to the MacBooks and iMacs they would at least bump their speeds. It doesn't matter f the 2GHz Merom chip is faster than the 2GHz Yonah chip, the consumers don't give a crap about the chip... they want to see "them GHz numbers" go up.

daneoni
Aug 26, 2006, 04:08 PM
To be honest i dont really care anymore. As it is, im leaning away from Apple portables and moving to their desktops. Maybe just maybe if the 15" MBP sports a 16x DL superdrive, Magnetic latch Firewire 800 and maybe an extra USB port i may consider. But to be honest the MacPro is looking like a better candidate for me. My PB is fine my mobile computing needs, its time for a powerful workhorse thats more stable and reliable, namely, the MacPro

Jon'sLightBulbs
Aug 26, 2006, 04:08 PM
You're screwing up, intel. We don't want 300 trillion transistors on a 1 nm die. We want longer battery life. Idiots.

gnasher729
Aug 26, 2006, 04:08 PM
I dont see much change really, the 1.66GHz merom chip will find its way into the mini (they'll scrap the solo model).

The 1.83 & 2.00GHz for iMacs (if they use merom) and MacBooks and the 2.16 and 2.33 for the 15 & 17 MBPs respectively. Its that simple.

Only problem with that is that a 2.33 GHz Merom chip will be fifty percent more expensive than a 2.16 GHz Yonah is today. So do you think Apple will increase prices of the MacBook Pro by $150 to $200 or reduce their profit?

After G
Aug 26, 2006, 04:09 PM
If the power consumption is the same... does that mean that the Merom and the current chips suck the same amount energy while going full throttle?

If the above is true, if you turned down the Merom to match the speed of the current chips, wouldn't the Merom be drawing 20% less power?

In other words if the Merom and the current chip were both going 60 mph down the freeway, would the Merom be drawing less power?

Am I missing something here (such as the basics of electricity, the basic way that chips work, etc.)?

512keThey'd draw the same power, but the Merom would be done faster at the same clock rate. So you use less power by taking less time to do your work. That and better power saving modes.

DJMastaWes
Aug 26, 2006, 04:10 PM
So, if Merom is out the 28th and possiblity of Merom MBPs comeing out the 29th? or sometime BEFORE September.

Ace25
Aug 26, 2006, 04:10 PM
I am now pretty sure that new MacBooks are being released in the next few days.
I ordered one on the 17th of august and it was scheduled to ship on the 24th of august. Then for some reason it was bumped to a new ship date of august 31st, just enough time to drop a new merom processor in it!

toughboy
Aug 26, 2006, 04:11 PM
If the power consumption is the same... does that mean that the Merom and the current chips suck the same amount energy while going full throttle?

If the above is true, if you turned down the Merom to match the speed of the current chips, wouldn't the Merom be drawing 20% less power?

In other words if the Merom and the current chip were both going 60 mph down the freeway, would the Merom be drawing less power?

Am I missing something here (such as the basics of electricity, the basic way that chips work, etc.)?

512ke

Maybe its just efficiency... As days past and R&D continues to evolve, chips will be more efficient and they'll produce more power for less energy..

gnasher729
Aug 26, 2006, 04:12 PM
That doesn't make sense, marketing wise. If they do anything to the MacBooks and iMacs they would at least bump their speeds. It doesn't matter f the 2GHz Merom chip is faster than the 2GHz Yonah chip, the consumers don't give a crap about the chip... they want to see "them GHz numbers" go up.

We are talking here about Macintosh buyers, not about idiots.

Just sell Merom as "64 bit", that's twice as much as "32 bit".

daneoni
Aug 26, 2006, 04:13 PM
That doesn't make sense, marketing wise. If they do anything to the MacBooks and iMacs they would at least bump their speeds. It doesn't matter f the 2GHz Merom chip is faster than the 2GHz Yonah chip, the consumers don't give a crap about the chip... they want to see "them GHz numbers" go up.

Well unless they use Conroe in iMac thats how it will be. They'll just tell you the new machines are using intel's new Core 2 Duo (64 bit computing) chips. Apple WILL differentiate their pro laptops so the 2.16 & 2.33 GHz combo is a given. Maybe, just maybe, they might bump the mini to 1.83 and 1.66 on its low end. The imacs will use 1.83 & 2.00 there is just no other option apparent to me because the 17" & 20" will also be differentiated. The macbooks may become 2.00GHz only across the board but even that route is questionable.

prady16
Aug 26, 2006, 04:13 PM
Yippee.....
Definitely buying a MBP asap.....not gonna wait for santa rosa!

Clydefrog
Aug 26, 2006, 04:16 PM
same here! I just hope Sept 5th or sooner:D

phairphan
Aug 26, 2006, 04:19 PM
Only problem with that is that a 2.33 GHz Merom chip will be fifty percent more expensive than a 2.16 GHz Yonah is today. So do you think Apple will increase prices of the MacBook Pro by $150 to $200 or reduce their profit?

I believe the 2.33 GHz Merom chip debuted at the same price as the 2.16 GHz Yonah when it was released. The prices of MBPs certainly haven't fallen. Apple has just been enjoying the extra profits from Intel's price drops of the past few months.

gadgetgirl85
Aug 26, 2006, 04:21 PM
I'll believe it when I see it. Merom rumours have been flying for a long long time now. Not that it really concerns me anyway. Just hope its what you guys are anticipating

HecubusPro
Aug 26, 2006, 04:22 PM
same here! I just hope Sept 5th or sooner:D

I would hope within the first few weeks of September at least. I shipments Apple was supposed to receive from overseas will reportedly hit on the 5th of September. After that, it would seem that all Apple has to do is ship products to the resellers and their online warehouses and begin selling them. I'm thinking the merom MBP's will start shipping to coincide with the Paris Expo next month though.

Still, it's getting close. I went ahead and dropped some cash on my first .mac account/software. I just can't wait to start using it on my new merom MPB 2.33ghz 17".:cool:

BlizzardBomb
Aug 26, 2006, 04:34 PM
You're screwing up, intel. We don't want 300 trillion transistors on a 1 nm die. We want longer battery life. Idiots.

Are you being serious? Think about how much energy the LCD, the speakers, the HD, the RAM and the graphics card use. You can't just change the processor and go "Poof!" 15 hour battery!

tekmoe
Aug 26, 2006, 04:34 PM
hoping for a 13" mbp but it's doubtful...

storage
Aug 26, 2006, 04:35 PM
MEROM ROBSON MACBOOK FTW YEAH!!!!!!!!!!!!

I seriously hope for it. Robson sounds like an interesting technology. I also hope they have fixed some of the problems with the current MacBook.

Peace.

tf843364
Aug 26, 2006, 04:36 PM
I happen to have a Yonah Macbook, and im a little concerned.
I wonder, if merom does make it into the Macbooks did i make a mistake by buying my computer before i had to (as in next friday is the cutoff)
I wonder if Merom is really that good. *it sucks that macbooks dont have PGA slots*
well im hoping to sell this one next year, and thatll get me most of the way to my santa rosa beast, cuz i KNOW santa rosa is that good.

Zwhaler
Aug 26, 2006, 04:40 PM
So, if Merom is out the 28th and possiblity of Merom MBPs comeing out the 29th? or sometime BEFORE September.

I could see that happening. Well, it will be on a tuesday! :)

iJawn108
Aug 26, 2006, 04:47 PM
I hope they put them into the macbooks soon or they will loose a customer untill santarosa/leopard/iLife '07 are all out.

Silentwave
Aug 26, 2006, 04:48 PM
You're screwing up, intel. We don't want 300 trillion transistors on a 1 nm die. We want longer battery life. Idiots.

But there's no die size change here....

and doesn't transitioning to a smaller process usually mean improvements in that department anyways?

Next die change is the 45nm Intel Core Microarchitecture "Penryn" core for mobile- mid-2007 or thereabouts.

Eidorian
Aug 26, 2006, 04:50 PM
A Merom thread? On my MacRumors?

http://guides.macrumors.com/Merom

ltcol266845
Aug 26, 2006, 04:53 PM
Well, the on advantage of not being able to afford a lappy until next years it that I might a MacBook based on the Santa Rosa platform.

It seems though that Santa Rosa might end up getting delayed... there have been many issues with getting 802.11n finalized, which is an important component to the new platform

heehee
Aug 26, 2006, 04:53 PM
Can't wait unti it comes out. My "work" is getting me a Mac Pro, but I want to wait until this comes out and decide if i should get the Mac Pro or the new Macbook Pro. :cool:

joe8232
Aug 26, 2006, 05:01 PM
I have just ordered a mbp :( It wasn't supposed to ship until Monday but it shipped early :( If the rumors are true will I be able to send it back and get the new one? Has anyone had any experience in returning unwanted stuff to apple as time is not on my side (leave for uni on the 16th Sept)

swingerofbirch
Aug 26, 2006, 05:23 PM
This is interesting, BUT, from what I know, Intel announced the desktop (Conroe) Core 2 Duo proccessor on July 27, and as far as I know, no Conroe systems are shipping right now, almost a month later.

Dell has announced some Conroe systems that you can order, but as far as I know they aren't readily shipping yet.

HecubusPro
Aug 26, 2006, 05:26 PM
I'll believe it when I see it. Merom rumours have been flying for a long long time now. Not that it really concerns me anyway. Just hope its what you guys are anticipating

Thankfully this isn't a rumor. It was reported on CNET as fact. Of course, there's always a chance that any news source is mistaken, but considering Intel announced their merom plans at the end of July, I don't have a problem with taking what CNET reported as most likely fact.

Coupled with the report of large shipments from overseas due to arrive on the 5th of September, connecting the dots to merom equipped macs seems fairly obvious to me. Whether it happens in September or October, it is going to happen.

I'm sure it will be what I'm anticipating, but thanks for your concern. :D

hvfsl
Aug 26, 2006, 05:38 PM
I have just ordered a mbp :( It wasn't supposed to ship until Monday but it shipped early :( If the rumors are true will I be able to send it back and get the new one? Has anyone had any experience in returning unwanted stuff to apple as time is not on my side (leave for uni on the 16th Sept)
The only change is likely to be the cpu. The rest of the MBP will probably be kept the same and if you look at the yonah vs merom benchmarks at places like AnandTech, it probably isn't worth sending it back.

jmsait19
Aug 26, 2006, 05:39 PM
This is interesting, BUT, from what I know, Intel announced the desktop (Conroe) Core 2 Duo proccessor on July 27, and as far as I know, no Conroe systems are shipping right now, almost a month later.

Dell has announced some Conroe systems that you can order, but as far as I know they aren't readily shipping yet.

that's because conroe wouldn't have been an upgrade compared to what apple already had out (maybe the imac, but merom waiting for merom would keep it cooler inside). The only thing left to change at that point was the PowerMac and they put Woodcrest in it and that one IS shipping.

Willis
Aug 26, 2006, 05:43 PM
If the power consumption is the same... does that mean that the Merom and the current chips suck the same amount energy while going full throttle?

If the above is true, if you turned down the Merom to match the speed of the current chips, wouldn't the Merom be drawing 20% less power?

In other words if the Merom and the current chip were both going 60 mph down the freeway, would the Merom be drawing less power?

Am I missing something here (such as the basics of electricity, the basic way that chips work, etc.)?

512ke

no.. what it means is that the chip is 20% more efficient using the same amount of power... Some have said that the chips do run a bit cooler because they are more efficient, but until they come out in the MBP... who knows?

timmillwood
Aug 26, 2006, 05:43 PM
I hope we see a core 2 duo in the macbook pro to get it upto the speed of the mac pro

Object-X
Aug 26, 2006, 05:44 PM
Anyone know of benchmarks comparing the core duo with the core 2 duo?

Tommyg117
Aug 26, 2006, 05:47 PM
Great News! I want a merom macbook pro.

Eidorian
Aug 26, 2006, 05:50 PM
Anyone know of benchmarks comparing the core duo with the core 2 duo?http://guides.macrumors.com/Merom#Benchmarks

MrCrowbar
Aug 26, 2006, 05:51 PM
Well, I have some problems with my MacBook (LCD backlighting flickers horribly sometimes and from time to time the power goes off without reason, even 1 second after powering the mashine on). So I will bring it to the apple store in New Jersey soon. Did you know you can buy an Apple laptop anywhere in the world and get it repaired anywhere else? I bought it in Europe and can get it fixed here. Neato.

Now I wonder if I should wait one or two weeks just in case they want to give me a new one :)

soulatrium
Aug 26, 2006, 05:53 PM
The only change is likely to be the cpu. The rest of the MBP will probably be kept the same and if you look at the yonah vs merom benchmarks at places like AnandTech, it probably isn't worth sending it back.

NOT true, I think. Macbooks already have new features like a magnetic latch and easy upgradeability. We will see this at the very least in the next MBP update, as Apple has never let consumer features be absent from pro machines for long

HecubusPro
Aug 26, 2006, 05:57 PM
NOT true, I think. Macbooks already have new features like a magnetic latch and easy upgradeability. We will see this at the very least in the next MBP update, as Apple has never let consumer features be absent from pro machines for long

I certainly hope this is true. Of course, if the MBP doesn't have some of the cool features in the MB (upgradable HDD, etc.) it's not going to deter me from getting the merom MPB when it starts shipping. Still, it wouldn't hurt.

regan
Aug 26, 2006, 05:58 PM
This sounds good to me. I am waiting/saving up for a new laptop replacement for my recently departed(moment of silence) ibook.

Even if i had the money, I was going to wait for the 2nd generation of the macbooks.

Santa Rosa sounds cool, but if the macbooks got the merom along with the MBPs in September, then I wouldn't wait for Santa Rosa and just nab one now.

However, if they don't go 64bit....then I may just wait till January, and get by without a laptop(gulp) for another 4-5 months.

HecubusPro
Aug 26, 2006, 06:05 PM
I'm not sure if this is old news, but I only had heard last week that the UK Dell site was listing (not selling) Core 2 Duo systems. When I heard about that, I checked the US site, but no Core 2 Duo computers were yet advertised there. Well, I checked again today, and Dell is starting to sell their Core 2 Duo desktops. I didn't see anything about estimated ship time.

It doesn't look like their notebooks are selling the new chips yet.
http://www.dell.com/content/products/results.aspx/desktops?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&~ck=anav&a=23~0~98591&navla=23~0~98591

Bakey
Aug 26, 2006, 06:05 PM
Im guessing hopefully by the years end for the G5.... :) :)

What by the years end? That we stop reading the same "PowerBook G5 next Tuesday!" non-starting done-to-death joke?? :rolleyes: :p

gnasher729
Aug 26, 2006, 06:09 PM
I believe the 2.33 GHz Merom chip debuted at the same price as the 2.16 GHz Yonah when it was released. The prices of MBPs certainly haven't fallen. Apple has just been enjoying the extra profits from Intel's price drops of the past few months.

At that time, Apple upgraded all MacBook Pros to the next faster chip without changing prices.

bryanc
Aug 26, 2006, 06:12 PM
... those who understand binary and those who do not.

Just sell Merom as "64 bit", that's twice as much as "32 bit".

64 bits is not twice as big as 32 bits.... it's 2^32 (roughly 4.3 billion) times as big. Just like 1000 is not twice as big as 10.

33 bits would be twice as big as 32 bits.

But yes, you're right, the important thing here is not that merom is 20% faster (or 20% more power efficient), it's that it's 64 bit.

Leopard will be 64 bit, and you can bet that once leopard is the shipping OS, there will be 64 bit only software that you will want to run. That's why it's worth having a Core 2 Duo system.

Cheers

ChickenSwartz
Aug 26, 2006, 06:18 PM
I have just ordered a mbp :( It wasn't supposed to ship until Monday but it shipped early :( If the rumors are true will I be able to send it back and get the new one? Has anyone had any experience in returning unwanted stuff to apple as time is not on my side (leave for uni on the 16th Sept)

I never have but I hear it is pretty easy if you DON'T OPEN THE BOX.


The only change is likely to be the cpu. The rest of the MBP will probably be kept the same and if you look at the yonah vs merom benchmarks at places like AnandTech, it probably isn't worth sending it back.

It has been rumored that there might some minor changes to the computer such as easilly removable HD, differnt latch, as said above. But more importantly, I hope they bump the clock speeds and include 1GB RAM as standard on lowest MBP model for the same price.

Nuks
Aug 26, 2006, 06:31 PM
Can someone briefly explain the huge benefits of Santa Rosa (in layman's terms) or post a link to a thread/description of it?

Much thanks.

YEMandy
Aug 26, 2006, 06:37 PM
Could this mean an iMac update is coming soon as well? I ordered a loaded iMac two weeks ago and it still hasn't shipped yet. The estimated ship date is Aug. 28th with arrival on the 5th...

BWhaler
Aug 26, 2006, 06:37 PM
In other news, Merom this, Merom that, just make sure you get it out on time Apple :p

...and with quality.

Enough of these crappy shortcuts and horific QA Apple; we're premium buyers. Or maybe you didn't notice how well Dell is doing nowadays.

You're screwing up, intel. We don't want 300 trillion transistors on a 1 nm die. We want longer battery life. Idiots.

Agreed. I still think Intel doesn't get it. Yes, faster is good. But Intel has been paying lip service to the 9 - 10 hour battery life for about a decade now.

Only problem with that is that a 2.33 GHz Merom chip will be fifty percent more expensive than a 2.16 GHz Yonah is today. So do you think Apple will increase prices of the MacBook Pro by $150 to $200 or reduce their profit?

Wrong. Just wrong.

Google is your friend. Learn some facts before you post.

Yippee.....
Definitely buying a MBP asap.....not gonna wait for santa rosa!

Me too. I am sure I could squeeze out another 9 months with my 17" PowerBook--which is less than 1 year old--but I think it's time to get with the future.

It's a pretty easy decision given how much faster the Intel Macs are.

Old, but still funny. A little :p

Only if you have no sense of humour! :p

Nothing would make me happier than for the new MacBook Pros to be shipping early next week. And with all of the quality issues worked out.

My expectations for the next generation 17" MacBook Pro:

2.33 Core 2 Duo
Better GPU
160gig HD
Higher quality displays. No more of this uneven backlighting crap.

My hopes:
Longer battery life
Get the power adaptor below 70 watts so we can use them on planes
Lower price

Hell, I'm buying whatever comes next. I just hope there are some solid spec bumps across the board.

And most importantly, I hope Apple fixes the crappy quality issues that have been plaguing their portable line all year.

Erasmus
Aug 26, 2006, 06:45 PM
I vote Apple release a modified version of the Core 2 Duo Macbook Pro.

The only difference would be the words "Powerbook G5" under its screen, a change of the label on the box to "Dual 2.33 G5" and software that changes the actual name of the processor in System Processor to "IBM PowerPC G5 Dual 2.33".

This would make the IBM fanboys very happy, as they would think they had a G5 Powerbook, and therefore the wishes for "G5 Powerbooks next Tuesday" would hopefully stop.

Apple could sell them for five times the cost of a regular Macbook Pro, and get a healthy 20 grand profit off each sale for almost no effort on their part.

BWhaler
Aug 26, 2006, 06:49 PM
Only if you have no sense of humour! :p

It's not really that.

It's just that the joke is soooo done. Played out.

It's time to turn the page.

jsw
Aug 26, 2006, 06:51 PM
Note: I believe I accidentally merged someone's (possibly a couple of people's) posts into BWhaler's post (3 above this post). Sorry. :o

j_maddison
Aug 26, 2006, 06:58 PM
It's not really that.

It's just that the joke is soooo done. Played out.

It's time to turn the page.

I never found it funnny in the first place. But then again I never found it funny a few years back when everyone was going around going WAAAZZZ UPPP! :eek: Cause it was on the budweiser advert :)

Erasmus
Aug 26, 2006, 07:04 PM
I cannot believe that the iMac will continue to have a slower processor than the Macbook Pro. For years, the iMac has been about twice as fast as the leading Powerbook. I see no reason why Apple will not choose to put a "real man's" processor in what I would think is there most popular product (dismissing iPod). iMac deserves to retake the crown from Macbok Pro for speed in all areas, with CHEAPER components, ie. Conroe over Merom. And a decent GPU of course. In both.

I think it would be possible that Apple will rrefresh both Macbook Pro and iMac very soon, why not Tuesday? It would be nice to keep these two very comparable machines (at least at the moment) on par with each other.

After all, there is no shortage on Conroe, is there, and why else would they wait to release new iMacs? (unless iMacs get Merom too, in which case I'll be taking a quick trip to America, to find out just how much kidneys can be sold for on the black market, and how long a certain old man can survive without his.)

Conroe iMacs AND Merom MBP's on TUESDAY!

slb
Aug 26, 2006, 07:05 PM
I happen to have a Yonah Macbook, and im a little concerned.
I wonder, if merom does make it into the Macbooks did i make a mistake by buying my computer before i had to (as in next friday is the cutoff)
I wonder if Merom is really that good. *it sucks that macbooks dont have PGA slots*

It'll just be a slightly faster chip with 64-bit (which won't get used until Leopard, and which most people will never need anyway).

The time you'll want to upgrade will be next year after Santa Rosa comes out with its faster FSB to really take advantage of the Core 2 chips. Intel calls these upcoming Meroms an "initial version," a stepping stone for current Yonah users. It'll be interesting to see if Apple does anything with the Robson flash.

That said, the current Core Duo Macs are still really fast and will continue to be so next year, running Leopard fine. I've got no regrets. I expect my iMac to last me for at least a few years.

tekmoe
Aug 26, 2006, 07:07 PM
I cannot believe that the iMac will continue to have a slower processor than the Macbook Pro. For years, the iMac has been about twice as fast as the leading Powerbook. I see no reason why Apple will not choose to put a "real man's" processor in what I would think is there most popular product (dismissing iPod). iMac deserves to retake the crown from Macbok Pro for speed in all areas, with CHEAPER components, ie. Conroe over Merom. And a decent GPU of course. In both.

I think it would be possible that Apple will rrefresh both Macbook Pro and iMac very soon, why not Tuesday? It would be nice to keep these two very comparable machines (at least at the moment) on par with each other.

After all, there is no shortage on Conroe, is there, and why else would they wait to release new iMacs? (unless iMacs get Merom too, in which case I'll be taking a quick trip to America, to find out just how much kidneys can be sold for on the black market, and how long a certain old man can survive without his.)

Conroe iMacs AND Merom MBP's on TUESDAY!

not trying to start a war or anything but...isn't that what the mac pro is for? isn't the iMac considered consumer grade while the mbp is considered professional grade??? i think it is badass that the mbp is faster than the imac.

dernhelm
Aug 26, 2006, 07:10 PM
What by the years end? That we stop reading the same "PowerBook G5 next Tuesday!" non-starting done-to-death joke?? :rolleyes: :p

No kidding. That's getting really tired now. It's the new "first post" carp we used to have to deal with a while back.

iMikeT
Aug 26, 2006, 07:11 PM
Oh man.... I sure these new processors make their way into the PowerMac G5.

BWhaler
Aug 26, 2006, 07:11 PM
Note: I believe I accidentally merged someone's (possibly a couple of people's) posts into BWhaler's post (3 above this post). Sorry. :o

jsw, thanks for merging my postings.

Didn't mean to spam the thread. (Just wasn't thinking...)

dernhelm
Aug 26, 2006, 07:13 PM
I'm Really hoping for a new iMac this Tues. But I might jump on a Core 2 Duo mini if they offer that instead...

Anyone have any idea if they'll be using "laptop chips" in the iMac and mini still - or if they'll move the iMac to a "desktop" chip instead?

QCassidy352
Aug 26, 2006, 07:20 PM
The only change is likely to be the cpu. The rest of the MBP will probably be kept the same and if you look at the yonah vs merom benchmarks at places like AnandTech, it probably isn't worth sending it back.

I'm sure the GPU will also be bumped, at the very least. The MBP will probably also see some things that the MB has like a user-removable hard drive and magnetic latch. The CPU and GPU alone make it worth getting the new one, IMO.

Also, I'll say it one last time (yea right) - the imac should not and will not get a mobile processor. It only got Yonah because there was no alternative. It had a real desktop processor when one was available on the PPC side (G5), and it will have a real desktop processor now that one is available on the intel side (Conroe). Leave merom for what it was meant for - laptops.

Erasmus
Aug 26, 2006, 07:36 PM
not trying to start a war or anything but...isn't that what the mac pro is for? isn't the iMac considered consumer grade while the mbp is considered professional grade??? i think it is badass that the mbp is faster than the imac.

Yes, but Conroe processors are less expensive than Merom for faster clocks, faster bus speeds, but increased power consumption, but considering iMacs used to house G5's, and they don't rely on battery power, Conroe is the logical choice for the iMac.

Obviously the MBP should get the 2.16 and 2.33 Ghz Meroms, as you couldn't put a Conroe in one, but the MBP should not limit the speed of the iMac, just because it's not "Pro", and I would personally consider the iMac at least "semiPro" because it is damn fast. I've said before that there is much too much of a price and capability gap between iMac and Mac Pro, which could easily be filled with a "Pizza Box" or more likely, and probably more favourable in my opinion, a "fullPro" larger version of iMac (upgradeable of course) which I designate iMac Ultra, cos it's a cool name.

There are good gradients between Mac Mini and iMac, MB and MBP, but not between iMac and MP.

An appropriately maxed (RAM and GPU) 20" iMac costs AU$3169.
A "comparable" MP (20" ACD, 2Ghz, 2Gb RAM) costs AU$5148

That's 60% more. Enough to buy a Macbook to take to Uni. Apple needs a ~AU$4000 option to fill the gap, ie. with a bigger screen, upgradeable, better GPU, better CPU, and I will be very happy. :rolleyes:

swingerofbirch
Aug 26, 2006, 07:39 PM
I hope they use Conroe in the iMac over Merom. Conroe is faster than Merom at cheaper prices. But it would mean more hardware tweaking that plopping a Merom in there.

swingerofbirch
Aug 26, 2006, 07:40 PM
I'm sure the GPU will also be bumped, at the very least. The MBP will probably also see some things that the MB has like a user-removable hard drive and magnetic latch. The CPU and GPU alone make it worth getting the new one, IMO.

Also, I'll say it one last time (yea right) - the imac should not and will not get a mobile processor. It only got Yonah because there was no alternative. It had a real desktop processor when one was available on the PPC side (G5), and it will have a real desktop processor now that one is available on the intel side (Conroe). Leave merom for what it was meant for - laptops.


I agree with you wholeheartedly.

But, I guess they COULD have put a pentium d in them...didnt they have dual cores?

silverblue3
Aug 26, 2006, 07:49 PM
What's the GPU on the new mbp gonna be? Bring on the SLI GPU's ;) Will give alienwares a run for their money.

Multimedia
Aug 26, 2006, 07:50 PM
I Just Hope Apple Joins The Rest Of The Manufacturers In This Mass Announcement. I'm afraid they won't due to EGO problems. :rolleyes: In this case, I wish they wouldn't "Think Differently".

HecubusPro
Aug 26, 2006, 08:06 PM
I Just Hope Apple Joins The Rest Of The Manufacturers In This Mass Announcement. I'm afraid they won't due to EGO problems. :rolleyes: In this case, I wish they wouldn't "Think Differently".

Agreed. That is a worry I share as well. I can't imagine why they would wait, but part of me thinks they garner some sort of perverse pleasure in making people sick with excitement over new announcements, releases, and upgrades. Making us wait longer than anyone else, especially considering Dell USA is now offering Core 2 Duo systems for sale on their website, wouldn't shock me too much unfortunately. I hope I'm wrong though. I wants my MBP Merom!

Multimedia
Aug 26, 2006, 08:11 PM
My expectations for the next generation 17" MacBook Pro:

2.33 Core 2 Duo
Better GPU
160gig HD
Higher quality displays. No more of this uneven backlighting crap.

My hopes:
Longer battery life
Get the power adaptor below 70 watts so we can use them on planes
Lower price

Hell, I'm buying whatever comes next. I just hope there are some solid spec bumps across the board.

And most importantly, I hope Apple fixes the crappy quality issues that have been plaguing their portable line all year.I agree. But I refuse to buy any "So-Called" MacBook Pro until they have implemented the easy access HD professional feature they put in the MacBook. I would rather buy a C2D MacBook with that feature than ever buy a MBP without it. :mad:Post #81 Apple has, on occasion, introduced new or upgraded features on its consumer computers when those computers were refreshed between refresh cycles of their professional computers. For example, at one time, the iMac had a faster SuperDrive than the Power Mac. Of course, with the next refresh of the pro computers, the new/upgraded features seen previously in the consumer products have always been added.Good to remember. Thanks. Hope it's the rule this time as well.

JMies419
Aug 26, 2006, 08:21 PM
On the day that the MBP's with merom go on sale, I wonder WHAT TIME Apples website will change and display the new products? :confused:

Multimedia
Aug 26, 2006, 08:28 PM
On the day that the MBP's with merom go on sale, I wonder WHAT TIME Apples website will change and display the new products? :confused:Updated Wesbite Is Usually by 9 Eastern. Occasionally later. But usually then. :)Probebly 10:00AM - 11:00AM Pacific time.No.Eastern? That's 6:00AM Pacific? You think? 9:00AM Pacific sounds good.No. its usually by 6AM Pacific 9AM Eastern. I KNOW - not guessing.

DJMastaWes
Aug 26, 2006, 08:28 PM
On the day that the MBP's with merom go on sale, I wonder WHAT TIME Apples website will change and display the new products? :confused:
Probebly 10:00AM - 11:00AM Pacific time.

DJMastaWes
Aug 26, 2006, 08:29 PM
Updated Wesbite Is Usually by 9 Eastern. Occasionally later. But usually then. :)

Eastern? That's 6:00AM Pacific? You think?
9:00AM Pacific sounds good.

MacinDoc
Aug 26, 2006, 08:39 PM
I agree. But I refuse to buy any "So-Called" MacBook Pro until they have implemented the easy access HD professional feature they put in the MacBook. I would rather buy a C2D MacBook with that feature than ever buy a MBP without it. :mad:
Apple has, on occasion, introduced new or upgraded features on its consumer computers when those computers were refreshed between refresh cycles of their professional computers. For example, at one time, the iMac had a faster SuperDrive than the Power Mac. Of course, with the next refresh of the pro computers, the new/upgraded features seen previously in the consumer products have always been added.

mightymike107
Aug 26, 2006, 09:06 PM
when will the Apple retail stores reflect the changes to the product line?

-mike

treblah
Aug 26, 2006, 09:14 PM
when will the Apple retail stores reflect the changes to the product line?

-mike

If they are being refreshed, the stores probably already have recieved them in a black lock box that says do not open until Tuesday morning.

SeaFox
Aug 26, 2006, 09:18 PM
You're screwing up, intel. We don't want 300 trillion transistors on a 1 nm die. We want longer battery life. Idiots.

Yes, and as someone has already pointed out, if the Core2 can do 20% better with the same power, can't you just throttle your new Core2 MBP down 20% and get a laptop with the same performance of your old one with 20% better battery life?

Talk about not seeing the forest through the trees. :rolleyes:

Some_Big_Spoon
Aug 26, 2006, 09:21 PM
May have been said, but ship dates on iMacs are 7-10 days.

swingerofbirch
Aug 26, 2006, 09:22 PM
May have been said, but ship dates on iMacs are 7-10 days.


Where do you see this? When I look at the Apple store it says ships in 1-2 days.

extraextra
Aug 26, 2006, 09:24 PM
The update time for Apple's store is 9am EST? I was under the impression that it was 9am PST. I'm behind the times! (pun intended, I suppose)

Is the 7-10 days for BTO iMacs? Or stock ones?

Multimedia
Aug 26, 2006, 09:44 PM
May have been said, but ship dates on iMacs are 7-10 days.Tonight NBC News noted that there is a combined Back To School K-12 $17.6 Billion + College $36.6 Billion = $54.2 Billion in play right now - much of it for Consumer Electronics - particularly computers. Add in the switch to Core 2 and we are looking at an impossible situation to predict what is happening with regard to and of the supply backlog.

This is the second largest buying season only trumped by the end of the year holidays. Given this reality, I think we all need to try and exercise maximum patience and skip all the speculation why "clues" mean what. Any "clues" could have multiple reasons in this moment. :eek: :confused: ;)Post #90 Here in Los Angeles, I have been to a couple of apple stores, and a couple of best buy stores in the apple section. Everytime I was in those places, there were obviously college kids with their parents purchasing new macs, particularly the regular macbook. The apple stores especially were swamped with college bound students.

This is a huge time for all computer manufacturers, and laptops are big sellers for college kids. Shortages are bound to happen. I hope this doesn't affect my MBP making it to a store near me sooner rather than later, but I have a feeling it will. I do feel confident however, that within the next 3 to 4 weeks, I will have, or will have on order a new merom MBP. I hope. :)Me too. ;)

Also Soon:
MacBook Pro 17"
Easy Access HD Bay
2.33 GHz Merom
1 GB DDR2 RAM + 1 or 2 GB Third Party Stick
Black Anodized Aluminum
$2799 + 30" Dell on 20% off Sale $1520 = My ultimate Core 2 Duo Starter Kit for only $4319 + $346 CA sales tax = $4665 . :p

Makes me think twice about a Mac Pro refurb as the way to go. :D

puckhead193
Aug 26, 2006, 09:57 PM
god i hope new iMacs are coming out on tues. My butt will be at an apple store placing the order in 5 seconds... well not literally i'll wait till the weekend, but still.... i want an iMac...the mac pro is way to big for my college dorm (i think)

HecubusPro
Aug 26, 2006, 10:02 PM
Tonight NBC News noted that there is a combined Back To School K-12 $17.6 Billion + College $36.6 Billion = $54.2 Billion in play right now - much of it for Consumer Electronics - especially computers. Add in the switch to Core 2 and we are looking at an impossible situation to predict what is happening with regard to any of the supply shortages.

This is the second largest buying season only trumped by the end of the year holidays. Given this reality, I think we all need to try and exercise maximum patience and skip all the speculation why "clues" mean what. Any "clues" could have multiple reasons in this moment. :eek: :confused: ;)

Here in Los Angeles, I have been to a couple of apple stores, and a couple of best buy stores in the apple section. Everytime I was in those places, there were obviously college kids with their parents purchasing new macs, particularly the regular macbook. The apple stores especially were swamped with college bound students.

This is a huge time for all computer manufacturers, and laptops are big sellers for college kids. Shortages are bound to happen. I hope this doesn't affect my MBP making it to a store near me sooner rather than later, but I have a feeling it will. I do feel confident however, that within the next 3 to 4 weeks, I will have, or will have on order a new merom MBP. I hope. :)

DJMastaWes
Aug 26, 2006, 10:12 PM
No. its usually by 6AM Pacific 9AM Eastern. I KNOW - not guessing.
Well, this was not the case for the BT Mighty Mouse.

Anyway, I'm hopeing that we see Merom in a the next few days. That would make me JUMP for joy!

MrCrowbar
Aug 26, 2006, 10:21 PM
Yes, and as someone has already pointed out, if the Core2 can do 20% better with the same power, can't you just throttle your new Core2 MBP down 20% and get a laptop with the same performance of your old one with 20% better battery life?

Talk about not seeing the forest through the trees. :rolleyes:

You won't get 20% more battery life unless the screens and other components don't get more power efficient too. I think 7% battery life increase is more realistic. You can already upgrade todays macbooks with more RAM (saves HDD work) and more efficient HDDs. With the screen brightness down, I get 6 and a half hours of text editing out of that thing.

Silentwave
Aug 26, 2006, 10:42 PM
I agree with you wholeheartedly.

But, I guess they COULD have put a pentium d in them...didnt they have dual cores?

yes, but they were significantly hotter, consumed much more power, and worst of all were incredibly inefficient per clock versus C2D. If memory serves, when the Conroe/Allendale (the codename for C2D desktop chips under 2.4GHz with 2MB L2) benchmarks first came out after the NDA lifted, the best Pentium Extreme Edition (3.73GHz Pentium D Presler core, dual core, 2x2MB L2, 1066 FSB, 130W TDP) was in many of the tests at least equaled by the Core 2 Duo E6300, a chip with the following specs:
Speed: 1.86 GHz Dual core
2MB L2 Cache
1066 MT/S FSB
TDP 65W

So a much slower, far cheaper C2D chip matches the best Pentium D Extreme Edition, though both are dual-core, have the same FSB speed, the Pentium D has a bigger L2 Cache, and each core is clocking at twice the speed of the Core 2 chip.

The C2D chips with the sole exception of the Core 2 Extreme X6800 version have a TDP of 65W- HALF that of the Pentium D series. Even the X6800 only has an 80W TDP.

To give you an idea of pricing, the *retail* version of the Core 2 Duo 1.86GHz chip at Newegg is listed at $193.
The retail version of the Pentium Extreme Edition dual core 3.73GHz chip at Newegg is listed at $1,015.

The rest of the Pentium D line has been dropped in price significantly since Core 2 Duo came out, its almost a fire sale. then again, they are much hotter, less efficient processors by far.

Silentwave
Aug 26, 2006, 10:47 PM
This is interesting, BUT, from what I know, Intel announced the desktop (Conroe) Core 2 Duo proccessor on July 27, and as far as I know, no Conroe systems are shipping right now, almost a month later.

Dell has announced some Conroe systems that you can order, but as far as I know they aren't readily shipping yet.

I believe Intel has been having trouble getting the required chipsets out on time to the desktop market.

You can get the chips themselves without much trouble- the retail versions are available at Newegg for the 1.86, 2.13, 2.66, and 2.93 Extreme Core 2 Duo chips, with the sole out of stock chip being the 2.4GHz chip, with an estimated time of arrival being Sept. 1st at 2:30PM.

TheKrillr
Aug 26, 2006, 11:33 PM
Expect new Merom-based macs, and a new iPod, on September 18th.

BWhaler
Aug 26, 2006, 11:36 PM
I'm sure the GPU will also be bumped, at the very least. The MBP will probably also see some things that the MB has like a user-removable hard drive and magnetic latch. The CPU and GPU alone make it worth getting the new one, IMO.

I agree. The practical differences between the Core Duo and the Core 2 Duo in real world tests are tiny.

But a serious bump to the GPU, HD, and the other enhancements you mention certainly would make the upgrade worthwhile.

I Just Hope Apple Joins The Rest Of The Manufacturers In This Mass Announcement. In this case, I wish they wouldn't "Think Differently".

I hope you are right. I would love to buy a MBP next week.

Expect new Merom-based macs, and a new iPod, on September 18th.

I suspect you are correct, but I hope you are wrong. I'd love to get a new MBP in the next couple of weeks before my next international trip. But to your point, I am not optimistic.

Multimedia
Aug 26, 2006, 11:54 PM
Expect new Merom-based macs, and a new iPod, on September 18th.Please Sustantiate Your Reasoning Why You Think September 18th. :confused: Three more weeks of anxiety ridden torture! :eek:

TheKrillr
Aug 26, 2006, 11:57 PM
Please Sustantiate Your Reasoning Why You Think September 18th. :confused: Three more weeks of anxiety ridden torture! :eek:

Simple. Apples' current sale for students on getting a MAJOR discount on iPods when you buy a new mac, ends on Friday the 15th. Thus, the following monday, will come the new updates. They wouldn't release before, because they would be cutting their profits even more than they are now.

wmmk
Aug 27, 2006, 12:16 AM
PowerBook G5 next tuesday?
that is so not funny at all any more:rolleyes:

Multimedia
Aug 27, 2006, 12:24 AM
PowerBook G5 next tuesday?that is so not funny at all any more:rolleyes:The current Yonah MacBook is more powerful than any G5 - even dual core G5's. So why would you even make a fake joke about a weak mobile G5 coming? It's a joke that was only briefly funny two years ago. :rolleyes:

ezekielrage_99
Aug 27, 2006, 12:53 AM
PowerBook G5 next tuesday?

Now that has been replaced with Core 2 Dup next Monday ;)

Alag28
Aug 27, 2006, 01:03 AM
so lemee guess these new lappies are gonna start at 1999$??

twoodcc
Aug 27, 2006, 01:06 AM
i just hope they don't forget the mac mini

Erasmus
Aug 27, 2006, 01:18 AM
Damn PowerPC fans.

Apple is INTEL now. We Love Intel Because Stevie Tells Us So.
We hate AMD and IBM. Should Apple ever move to another CPU provider, we will seamlessly transition to hating Intel again. This is the Way of the Mac.

What's so good about G5's anyway? They are slow, too hot, and skull juice.
Why do we love Intel? Because Steve says to, and Core 2 Duo is powerful, cool, not permanently drunk, allows us to run Windows and helps Apple increase its market share.

We love ATi because just like Intel, their products are the best at the moment. We still love nVIDIA because their GPUs are in the Mac Pro.

We love Israel because they make our Core 2 Duos and we love China because they make our Macs. We love California because that's where Our Lord Stevie J is (Don't particularly care about the rest of the US, sorry guys).

We love our Big Cats because they run so fast and look so clean and powerful (Hmmm... Mystery of OS codenames revealed?) and of course because they are not Windows, which are susceptible to breaking...

People who live in Windows shouldn't throw Viruses?

Off track...

Anyway, Rawr to all you PowerPC fanboys (And girls)

Intel 4EVER!

Some_Big_Spoon
Aug 27, 2006, 01:19 AM
BTO's

The update time for Apple's store is 9am EST? I was under the impression that it was 9am PST. I'm behind the times! (pun intended, I suppose)

Is the 7-10 days for BTO iMacs? Or stock ones?

NJPitcher
Aug 27, 2006, 01:44 AM
Also Soon:
MacBook Pro 17"
Easy Access HD Bay
2.33 GHz Merom
1 GB DDR2 RAM + 1 or 2 GB Third Party Stick
Black Anodized Aluminum
$2799 + 30" Dell on 20% off Sale $1520 = My ultimate Core 2 Duo Starter Kit for only $4319 + $346 CA sales tax = $4665 . :p

How do you get black aluminum? Or is this just a wish? Cause that'd be pretty ill.

And what is the easy access HD bay?

Multimedia
Aug 27, 2006, 01:57 AM
How do you get black aluminum? Or is this just a wish? Cause that'd be pretty ill.

And what is the easy access HD bay?It is speculated by some of us that the next MacBook Pro revision will include a Black Anodized Aluminum case. Here is the MacWorld video showing the MacBook's Easy Access HD Bay (http://www.macworld.com/weblogs/macword/2006/05/macbookvideo/index.php) which many of us here think is a Pro feature Apple must implement in the next revision of the MacBook Pro. :)

Here is the Apple documentation on the MacBook's Easy Access Hard Drive Bay (http://manuals.info.apple.com/en/MacBook_13inch_HardDrive_DIY.pdf).

amols
Aug 27, 2006, 02:02 AM
The next major upgrade to Intel's notebook design isn't expected until early 2007 with a new notebook platform named "Santa Rosa". Santa Rosa will combine the Core 2 Duo processors with new supporting chips as well as Intel's AMT (http://www.intel.com/technology/manage/iamt/) (Active Management Technology) and Robson technology.

I still pity those guys expecting "Major" MBP performance gain by moving to Merom without Santa Rosa. They are as ignorant as those people expecting G5s with their two pound heat sinks to go in powerbooks. I'm just looking forward to see Conroe iMac and better battery life for MBPs. And iPod update off course ;)

Multimedia
Aug 27, 2006, 02:12 AM
I still pity those guys expecting "Major" MBP performance gain by moving to Merom without Santa Rosa. They are as ignorant as those people expecting G5s with their two pound heat sinks to go in powerbooks. I'm just looking forward to see Conroe iMac and better battery life for MBPs. And iPod update off course ;)I don't give a rat's A** about Santa Rosa. What I do give a Rat's A** about is that Easy Access HD Bay. The ability to have multiple 160 GB HDs standing by for different field purposes can make for revolutionary work flow procedures.

Erasmus
Aug 27, 2006, 02:26 AM
I don't give a rat's A** about Santa Rosa. What I do give a Rat's A** about is that Easy Access HD Bay. The ability to have multiple 160 GB HDs standing by for different field purposes can make for revolutionary work flow procedures.

Calm down Multimedia...

You can have your precious removable HD bay, your easy to access RAM slots, and maybe some other upgradeable items as well, like DVD drive ready to be upgraded to Blueray Burning Uber Drive. And Black Aluminium. And of course an X1800, which is bound to happen, because X1600's are pathetic.

On Tuesday. (This coming tuesday, the 29th, not just any tuesday!)

If I'm wrong, I'll eat a biscuit. If i'm right, I'll eat one anyway. The difference is whether I'll be happy or sad for Multimedia when I do.
And everyone else who wants a new MBP.

Anything else on your wishlist?
Oh, a full size PC slot, two Firewire 800 ports, 802.1n, and maybe even a button that sends a death ray through any standard broadband connection to fry annoying MacRumors Posters? OK, bad idea.

Don't Worry, Be Happy! :cool:

amols
Aug 27, 2006, 02:28 AM
I don't give a rat's A** about Santa Rosa. What I do give a Rat's A** about is that Easy Access HD Bay. The ability to have multiple 160 GB HDs standing by for different field purposes can make for revolutionary work flow procedures.

Exactly!! I did swap my MBP HD from 100GB (Seagate 5400.2) to 160GB (Seagate 5400.3) and almost cracked the top cover, not to mention destroyed the warranty (which I don't mind anyway). Its really funny that we can easily swap HD in MB but not in MBP. I hope they fix this in next release instead of silly Merom updates.

swingerofbirch
Aug 27, 2006, 02:29 AM
What do you guys think the new iMac specs will be like?

Let's say on the 17" iMac maybe a 250 gig hard disk, 1 gb ram, upgraded video card, and conroe at some speed who cares what for $1299? Sounds sweet but not outrageously impossible.

louden
Aug 27, 2006, 02:39 AM
But I refuse to buy any "So-Called" MacBook Pro until they have implemented the easy access HD professional feature they put in the MacBook. I would rather buy a C2D MacBook with that feature than ever buy a MBP without it.

To me, the most important thing is dedicated video graphics. I'd buy a 2.0 Ghz Core Duo today if it ran with a dedicated graphics card. That would give a user the freedom to run Vista under Parallels and still have pretty good performance.

There's a 15" MBP in my future...

seenew
Aug 27, 2006, 02:49 AM
What do you guys think the new iMac specs will be like?

Let's say on the 17" iMac maybe a 250 gig hard disk, 1 gb ram, upgraded video card, and conroe at some speed who cares what for $1299? Sounds sweet but not outrageously impossible.

I already have those stats, I want to see them drop in a high-end Conroe (~3GHz) so I would know that I could feasibly upgrade my 2GHz Core Duo in the future. It's possible, isn't it? I mean, the G5's were really hot, and the iMac enclosure could handle that, wouldn't the new Intel ones be able to handle the Conroe Extremes?

Erasmus
Aug 27, 2006, 02:58 AM
I already have those stats, I want to see them drop in a high-end Conroe (~3GHz) so I would know that I could feasibly upgrade my 2GHz Core Duo in the future. It's possible, isn't it? I mean, the G5's were really hot, and the iMac enclosure could handle that, wouldn't the new Intel ones be able to handle the Conroe Extremes?

See Apple???
Yet another potential customer for iMac Ultra. We Want C2DE + X1900 and a 23" screen!

It has been demonstrated an iMac can take large amounts of heat. I should expect (With almost certainty) that iMac will get at least 2.4 Conroe, which should be quite a significant increase on its own, and possibly higher. 2.4 on the low end 17" model, 2.66 in 20" and the option of 2.93 or 3.2 in iMac Ultra! (Then Apple can gift me with one for coming up with such a great idea)
X1800's for the 17 and 20 inches, and X1900 for the 23".
Sounds good to me.
Extra space due to 23" could be used for the cooling of the twin fires of CPU and GPU.

Multimedia
Aug 27, 2006, 02:59 AM
I already have those stats, I want to see them drop in a high-end Conroe (~3GHz) so I would know that I could feasibly upgrade my 2GHz Core Duo in the future. It's possible, isn't it? I mean, the G5's were really hot, and the iMac enclosure could handle that, wouldn't the new Intel ones be able to handle the Conroe Extremes?I think you might be able to put a Merom 2.33GHz in there without much trouble. But I dont' think Conroe is pin compatable with your iMac. :)

odedia
Aug 27, 2006, 03:19 AM
I dont see much change really, the 1.66GHz merom chip will find its way into the mini (they'll scrap the solo model).

The 1.83 & 2.00GHz for iMacs (if they use merom) and MacBooks and the 2.16 and 2.33 for the 15 & 17 MBPs respectively. Its that simple.

the iMac will get a conroe. Nothing can be as dumb as putting a laptop chip in the desktop iMac. If the iMac could hold a G5 in it, it sure can hold a Conroe chip.

MacinDoc
Aug 27, 2006, 03:23 AM
the iMac will get a conroe. Nothing can be as dumb as putting a laptop chip in the desktop iMac. If the iMac could hold a G5 in it, it sure can hold a Conroe chip.
So, does a dual core Conroe produce less heat than a G5? Remember, the iMac is essentially a laptop form factor, so heat dissipation is more difficult. I agree, though, it will get a Conroe chip, as long as it is cool enough.

seenew
Aug 27, 2006, 03:40 AM
See Apple???
Yet another potential customer for iMac Ultra. We Want C2DE + X1900 and a 23" screen!

It has been demonstrated an iMac can take large amounts of heat. I should expect (With almost certainty) that iMac will get at least 2.4 Conroe, which should be quite a significant increase on its own, and possibly higher. 2.4 on the low end 17" model, 2.66 in 20" and the option of 2.93 or 3.2 in iMac Ultra! (Then Apple can gift me with one for coming up with such a great idea)
X1800's for the 17 and 20 inches, and X1900 for the 23".
Sounds good to me.
Extra space due to 23" could be used for the cooling of the twin fires of CPU and GPU.

Except they get pissed off if you give them ideas.
Or was that Nintendo?
Both, probably. Legalities.

Erasmus
Aug 27, 2006, 04:08 AM
Except they get pissed off if you give them ideas.
Or was that Nintendo?
Both, probably. Legalities.

OK, that's wierd. Who would get angry about having research into what the public wants done for them???

No wonder Nintendo sucks so much.

BTW, Congrats on ur 500 Posts!

Marx55
Aug 27, 2006, 04:10 AM
This is what we NEED:

1. Computer with no fan. Quiet. Silent. CRITICAL.

2. Modular computer to add a gorgeous Apple Cinema Display.

3. At lesat two FireWire 800 ports.

Then all the rest (power, etc).

Erasmus
Aug 27, 2006, 04:16 AM
This is what we NEED:

1. Computer with no fan. Quiet. Silent. CRITICAL.

2. Modular computer to add a gorgeous Apple Cinema Display.

3. At lesat two FireWire 800 ports.

Then all the rest (power, etc).

How loud is a present day iMac, Mac Pro or Mac Mini? They're not noisy are they? I never hear my dad's 17" Powerbook. I assume it has a fan.

I wouldn't have thought modern macs would be noisy.

And fanless macs, like my Cube are absolutely huge compared to what's in them. The convectin core takes up about half the computer. Fans are good, because they allow a computer to be small. I like fans, and I expect my iMac Ultra to have lots, but still be quiet. Like the Mac Pro.

BlizzardBomb
Aug 27, 2006, 04:27 AM
See Apple???
Yet another potential customer for iMac Ultra. We Want C2DE + X1900 and a 23" screen!

It has been demonstrated an iMac can take large amounts of heat. I should expect (With almost certainty) that iMac will get at least 2.4 Conroe, which should be quite a significant increase on its own, and possibly higher. 2.4 on the low end 17" model, 2.66 in 20" and the option of 2.93 or 3.2 in iMac Ultra! (Then Apple can gift me with one for coming up with such a great idea)
X1800's for the 17 and 20 inches, and X1900 for the 23".
Sounds good to me.
Extra space due to 23" could be used for the cooling of the twin fires of CPU and GPU.

Yup, heat is no problem. :) Cost on the other hand is. Going from a 2.4 GHz Conroe from a 1.83 GHz Yonah on the low-end is roughly a 30% increase in cost JUST for the CPU. As for your "iMac Ultra"...

$1000 - 2.93 GHz Conroe
$800 - 23" Display
$300 - X1900
$400 - Hard Drive, Optical Drive, RAM etc.
+ Build costs, marketing costs, logic board cost, casing costs etc.
+ Apple's profit margin

And you are easily looking at a $3000 machine.

I want to see:

The MB with a 1.83 GHz and a 2 GHz Core 2 Duo (Merom)
The 15" MBP with a 2.16 GHz and a 2.33 GHz Core 2 Duo (Merom) and a MR X1800.
The 17" MBP with a 2.33 GHz Core 2 Duo (Merom) and a MR X1800 XT.
The 17" iMac with a 1.86 GHz Core 2 Duo (Conroe (Allendale)) and a X1600 Pro 256 MB.
The 20" iMac with a 2.13 GHz Core 2 Duo (Conroe (Allendale)) and a X1650 Pro 256 MB.
Maybe a high-end 20" (possibly 23") iMac with a 2.4 GHz Core 2 Duo (Conroe) and a X1800 GTO 256 MB.
The Mac Mini with a 1.66 GHz and a 1.83 Ghz Core 2 Duo (Merom) with MR X1400 on the high-end model or as a BTO.

Evangelion
Aug 27, 2006, 04:34 AM
We are talking here about Macintosh buyers, not about idiots.

I'm sorry but I have seen plenty of evidence around the net (in this forum and elsewhere) that many Mac-users have zero clue when it comes to computers.

aswitcher
Aug 27, 2006, 04:40 AM
This is great news. Looking forward to a revamp of half the Apple line over the next month or so.

Manic Mouse
Aug 27, 2006, 04:54 AM
Yup, heat is no problem. :) Cost on the other hand is. Going from a 2.4 GHz Conroe from a 1.83 GHz Yonah on the low-end is roughly a 30% increase in cost JUST for the CPU. As for your "iMac Ultra"...

$1000 - 2.93 GHz Conroe
$800 - 23" Display
$300 - X1900
$400 - Hard Drive, Optical Drive, RAM etc.
+ Build costs, marketing costs, logic board cost, casing costs etc.
+ Apple's profit margin

And you are easily looking at a $3000 machine.

I want to see:

The MB with a 1.83 GHz and a 2 GHz Core 2 Duo (Merom)
The 15" MBP with a 2.16 GHz and a 2.33 GHz Core 2 Duo (Merom) and a MR X1800.
The 17" MBP with a 2.33 GHz Core 2 Duo (Merom) and a MR X1800 XT.
The 17" iMac with a 1.86 GHz Core 2 Duo (Conroe (Allendale)) and a X1600 Pro 256 MB.
The 20" iMac with a 2.13 GHz Core 2 Duo (Conroe (Allendale)) and a X1650 Pro 256 MB.
Maybe a high-end 20" (possibly 23") iMac with a 2.4 GHz Core 2 Duo (Conroe) and a X1800 GTO 256 MB.
The Mac Mini with a 1.66 GHz and a 1.83 Ghz Core 2 Duo (Merom) with MR X1400 on the high-end model or as a BTO.



For a desktop machine those iMac specs are utterly pathetic. A X1600 in 2007? Heck, it was a mediocre card 6 months ago, let alone in 6 months time. A crappy 2Mb cache C2D and both slow as hell compared to what every other desktop manufacturer will be offering?

The iMac is a desktop computer and Apple's only desktop computer. It should offer desktop performance, end of. What use is a crippled desktop, with all the problems of a mobile form factor but none of the advantages, to anyone? You might as well buy a Macbook.

If Apple released an iMac with those specs you would have to be totally retarded to buy one. They will be using the same processors as everyone else with C2D and will have no excuse for offering crappy specs.

What would be competitive:

MB: 1.83 and 2.0Ghz Merom, Integrated graphics
MBP: 2-2.33Ghz Merom, X1800
iMac 2.4-2.66Ghz Conroe, X1800 and LCD res upgrade
Mac Mini: 1.83Ghz Allendale (going to be much cheaper than Merom, so if they can they will put one in) Integrated graphics
Mac Pro: Dual 2.0-3.0Ghz Xeons

Kelmon
Aug 27, 2006, 05:11 AM
Arrgh! The anticipation! While I'd like to be able to hold off on a new laptop until Santa Rosa and a supporting MacBook Pro hits the market I can't. My old Ti PowerBook is way too slow these days and it will be replaced by the first 17" Merom-based MacBook Pro that Apple releases. While there's a few things that I'd like to see updated in the new models beyond the processor, I think my #1 will be 4GB RAM limit (2GB is fine for one OS but I want to be running OS X and Windows side-by-side at work) and #2 will be an updated GPU.

It will certainly be interesting to see what happens next week (personally, I'm not expecting an announcement, but hey, I'm happy to be wrong) and it will nicely coincide with the finances becoming available for the muther of all portable Macs. As long as the new one doesn't have any QA or design issues, I'll be as happy as a pig in ****...

aswitcher
Aug 27, 2006, 05:17 AM
What would be competitive:

SNIP
iMac 2.4-2.66Ghz Conroe, X1800 and LCD res upgrade
Mac Mini: 1.83Ghz Allendale (going to be much cheaper than Merom, so if they can they will put one in) Integrated graphics
Mac Pro: Dual 2.0-3.0Ghz Xeons

I agree, it would be really good if Apple did what they did with the Mac Pro, and made sure the next updates used the best appropriate tech available.

Alternatively, they should release a grunty half sized Mac Pro for those who need more power and customisation, but dont need a full on work station.

daneoni
Aug 27, 2006, 05:24 AM
Damn PowerPC fans.

Apple is INTEL now. We Love Intel Because Stevie Tells Us So.
We hate AMD and IBM. Should Apple ever move to another CPU provider, we will seamlessly transition to hating Intel again. This is the Way of the Mac.

What's so good about G5's anyway? They are slow, too hot, and skull juice.
Why do we love Intel? Because Steve says to, and Core 2 Duo is powerful, cool, not permanently drunk, allows us to run Windows and helps Apple increase its market share.

We love ATi because just like Intel, their products are the best at the moment. We still love nVIDIA because their GPUs are in the Mac Pro.

We love Israel because they make our Core 2 Duos and we love China because they make our Macs. We love California because that's where Our Lord Stevie J is (Don't particularly care about the rest of the US, sorry guys).

We love our Big Cats because they run so fast and look so clean and powerful (Hmmm... Mystery of OS codenames revealed?) and of course because they are not Windows, which are susceptible to breaking...

People who live in Windows shouldn't throw Viruses?

Off track...

Anyway, Rawr to all you PowerPC fanboys (And girls)

Intel 4EVER!

...yeah whatever you say fanboy

manu chao
Aug 27, 2006, 05:31 AM
You're screwing up, intel. We don't want 300 trillion transistors on a 1 nm die. We want longer battery life. Idiots.

Don't blame Intel, blame Apple for not using the ULV versions of the Core Duo chips. There are other manufacturers which use them (otherwise it would not make much sense for Intel to offer them).

However, the battery life of these machines is maybe in the order of six hours only, for once because the screen, HD etc. still need the same amount of power. Making the screen smaller, using Intel graphics, maybe even a 1.8" HD, you can reduce power consumption further, most often manufacturers also reduce battery size at the same time to make the laptops lightweight, preventing you to see battery life numbers of ten hours.

Moreover, reports about machines using the ULV versions (and sometimes 1.8" HDs) do complain about the performance.

BlizzardBomb
Aug 27, 2006, 05:37 AM
For a desktop machine those iMac specs are utterly pathetic. A X1600 in 2007? Heck, it was a mediocre card 6 months ago, let alone in 6 months time. A crappy 2Mb cache C2D and both slow as hell compared to what every other desktop manufacturer will be offering?

Crappy 2MB? LOL! So that automatically makes the current iMacs crap. And an X1650 Pro is a brand new card? 600 MHz core/ 700 MHz memory clocks (Apple will probably underclock it though :p) and 12 pixel pipes and great bang-for-buck makes the X1650 Pro the card of choice.

The iMac is a desktop computer and Apple's only desktop computer. It should offer desktop performance, end of. What use is a crippled desktop, with all the problems of a mobile form factor but none of the advantages, to anyone? You might as well buy a Macbook.

You mean only all-in-one. And how is it crippled? You want the GMA 950 from a MacBook? :p

What would be competitive:

MB: 1.83 and 2.0Ghz Merom, Integrated graphics
MBP: 2-2.33Ghz Merom, X1800
iMac 2.4-2.66Ghz Conroe, X1800 and LCD res upgrade
Mac Mini: 1.83Ghz Allendale (going to be much cheaper than Merom, so if they can they will put one in) Integrated graphics
Mac Pro: Dual 2.0-3.0Ghz Xeons

MB: What I said
MBP: What I said
iMac: You'll be pushing up prices as well as getting into Mac Pro's territory. A low-end X1800 is a possibilty but considering Apple's track record for graphics cards, unlikely.
Mac Mini: If you like liquid Mac Minis then sure :) I have even suggested that an Allendale Core 2 Duo along with a 3.5" HD should be put in the Mini but it would require a case redesign.
Mac Pro: It's already like that.

P.S. And you obviously didn't read what I said about cost of going from a 1.83 GHz Yonah to a 2.4 Ghz Conroe.

BeefUK
Aug 27, 2006, 05:40 AM
Just looked at the shpping dates for the Core 2 Duo's listed on the dell site. There's an estimated shipping date of 11th September, so maybe the 5th is a more releastic release date for Apple's merom upgrade, whatever form it may come in.

Recently Apple's made new products avaliable to buy immediately they are announced. So looks like a little more waiting.

I'm hoping for a Macbook with Core 2 Duo 2GHz!!

manu chao
Aug 27, 2006, 05:58 AM
A lot of (very vocal) people keep complaining about the crappy video cards Apple is using. I have heard these complaints for years now, I have heard them for all models.

I, personally, have seen often enough performance limitations in my daily work related to the processor, I have also fairly often seen performance limitations due to my harddrive. I have rarely seen performance limitations due to my graphics card, maybe sometimes with Expose (big deal :rolleyes: ) and possibly with Aperture.

So, getting a faster processor, or moving to a multiprocessor system, getting more RAM (reducing access to the HD) and getting e.g. a RAID system will do much, much more for your performance than getting a better video card, except for those using certain high-end apps and gamers.
But, I do not have a computer to play games, I have a computer to get work done, I am sitting 13 hours a day in front of my computer, zero hours of these doing gaming.

Zadillo
Aug 27, 2006, 06:01 AM
OK, that's wierd. Who would get angry about having research into what the public wants done for them???

No wonder Nintendo sucks so much.

BTW, Congrats on ur 500 Posts!

I've never heard of Nintendo getting "pissed off" with the public for suggesting ideas, etc. Hell, the people who did the Afterburner mod for the original Gameboy Advance probably helped to convince Nintendo of the right way to do a backlight eventually (in the GBA SP). And the constant calls for Nintendo to add wireless capabilities did lead to built-in wifi on the Nintendo DS and the Wii.

What makes you say Nintendo sucks so much?

As far as "legalities" go, usually corporations do have to generally not take unsolicited ideas, commercials, marketing materials, etc. developed by the public. The reason for this is that they want to avoid being sued later on if they do something similar. I don't know how much that would apply to something like product design, etc. but it all sort of falls into the same general category. But the more obvious examples would be things where, for example, someone designs a new computer and sends it to Apple; Apple eventually releases something quite similar to it, and the person who sent in the design tries to sue them for taking their idea and not paying anything for it.

Not to say that would ever really hold up anyway, but it's why most corporations do generally have that policy of not officially accepting anything unsolicited from outside the company.

-Zadillo

Zadillo
Aug 27, 2006, 06:04 AM
Damn PowerPC fans.

Apple is INTEL now. We Love Intel Because Stevie Tells Us So.
We hate AMD and IBM. Should Apple ever move to another CPU provider, we will seamlessly transition to hating Intel again. This is the Way of the Mac.

What's so good about G5's anyway? They are slow, too hot, and skull juice.
Why do we love Intel? Because Steve says to, and Core 2 Duo is powerful, cool, not permanently drunk, allows us to run Windows and helps Apple increase its market share.

We love ATi because just like Intel, their products are the best at the moment. We still love nVIDIA because their GPUs are in the Mac Pro.

We love Israel because they make our Core 2 Duos and we love China because they make our Macs. We love California because that's where Our Lord Stevie J is (Don't particularly care about the rest of the US, sorry guys).

We love our Big Cats because they run so fast and look so clean and powerful (Hmmm... Mystery of OS codenames revealed?) and of course because they are not Windows, which are susceptible to breaking...

People who live in Windows shouldn't throw Viruses?

Off track...

Anyway, Rawr to all you PowerPC fanboys (And girls)

Intel 4EVER!

I know this is just a joke, but even so it's stupid, because the implication is that the only reason anyone here might like the chips Intel is coming out with is because they have been brainwashed into liking them now that Apple uses them (i.e. if Apple was still using PowerPC chips, or had switched to AMD, we would all be sitting here talking about how crappy the Core 2 Duo chips are).

I'm sure there are some people like that, but it is insulting to plenty of people here who actually do know something about the various chips that Intel and AMD make and base their opinions on them just on their actual merits and weaknesses.

-Zadillo

gnasher729
Aug 27, 2006, 06:54 AM
OK, that's wierd. Who would get angry about having research into what the public wants done for them???

No wonder Nintendo sucks so much.

BTW, Congrats on ur 500 Posts!

Very simple. What these companies are all afraid off: You think of some way to improve a Macintosh, or an iPod. You have the same idea as thousand other people, including the guys at Apple. You send the idea to them. They implement the idea - which they developed on their own, independent of what you sent them, and what thousand other people thought of. You see your idea implemented and promptly sue Apple for millions of dollars. The case ends up in front of a jury full of idiots who promptly take your side against the evil corporation and give you millions of dollars.

All that mess can easily be prevented by not accepting any ideas from people who are not paid by the company.

PCMacUser
Aug 27, 2006, 07:39 AM
Yes, and as someone has already pointed out, if the Core2 can do 20% better with the same power, can't you just throttle your new Core2 MBP down 20% and get a laptop with the same performance of your old one with 20% better battery life?

Talk about not seeing the forest through the trees. :rolleyes:
It's quite common in the PC laptop world to do exactly that - using the BIOS to drop the default clock speed and/or voltage of the CPU to extend battery life. But that requires a BIOS which Apples don't have. Perhaps it can be done another way...

AidenShaw
Aug 27, 2006, 07:53 AM
You're screwing up, intel. We don't want 300 trillion transistors on a 1 nm die. We want longer battery life. Idiots.
Check this table of Core processor power consumptions (http://spamreaper.org/frankie/macintel.html).

Intel is making Core processors that draw 5.5 watts, Apple is using the versions that draw more than 30 watts.

Eidorian
Aug 27, 2006, 07:57 AM
Conroe power consumption (http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/core2duo-shootout_11.html)

I also remember another link where it shows the CPU temperature at 100% load being 50° C. (More then likely with a stock heat sink, fan, and in a BTX case.)

I remember my iMac G5 Rev. B hitting 75° C at 100% load. So there's some room for more heat. I don't know if it'll be as quiet though compared to Yonah.

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=219310&highlight=970fx+tdp+conroe

fener
Aug 27, 2006, 08:08 AM
Expect new Merom-based macs, and a new iPod, on September 18th.

Simple. Apples' current sale for students on getting a MAJOR discount on iPods when you buy a new mac, ends on Friday the 15th. Thus, the following monday, will come the new updates. They wouldn't release before, because they would be cutting their profits even more than they are now.


Not true.

Recent years, updates came right before the end of the promotion.

AidenShaw
Aug 27, 2006, 08:17 AM
I believe Intel has been having trouble getting the required chipsets out on time to the desktop market.

You can get the chips themselves without much trouble- the retail versions are available at Newegg for the 1.86, 2.13, 2.66, and 2.93 Extreme Core 2 Duo chips, with the sole out of stock chip being the 2.4GHz chip, with an estimated time of arrival being Sept. 1st at 2:30PM.
I was at a local DIY store Saturday, and they had stacks of Core 2 Duo (Conroe) chips in all speeds, and lots of mobos with 965 and 975 chipsets.

It would be unusual for that store to have all that kit if there's a supply problem.

http://www.centralcomputer.com/products.asp?pline=HCPUI

ChickenSwartz
Aug 27, 2006, 08:24 AM
Not true.

Recent years, updates came right before the end of the promotion.

There is a strategic reason for this. Since there have been some issues with new Macs, this promotion will motivate some buyers not to wait. In the retail world waiting means there is a bigger chance the buyer will go else where (like to Dell or something). I am sure if you look at the profit on a Nano vs. a Mac you will see that if this promotion sells 1 Mac that wouldn't be sold without the promotion makes up for 5 or so Nanos that went with Macs that would have been sold anyway. This promotion is not cutting into Apple's profits; they are making more money off this.

adamfilip
Aug 27, 2006, 08:53 AM
You're screwing up, intel. We don't want 300 trillion transistors on a 1 nm die. We want longer battery life. Idiots.


I think you are missing the point
just cause a processor has 300 quadrillion transistors doesnt mean it will consume a huge amount of power.

if they released a memron that ran at 200mhz but lasted 24 hrs. would you buy it.. eventho it would be painfully slow?

its hard to balance Performance demands and power consumption

Multimedia
Aug 27, 2006, 08:57 AM
I want to see:

The MB with a 1.83 GHz and a 2 GHz Core 2 Duo (Merom)
The 15" MBP with a 2.16 GHz and a 2.33 GHz Core 2 Duo (Merom) and a MR X1800.
The 17" MBP with a 2.33 GHz Core 2 Duo (Merom) and a MR X1800 XT.
The 17" iMac with a 1.86 GHz Core 2 Duo (Conroe (Allendale)) and a X1600 Pro 256 MB.
The 20" iMac with a 2.13 GHz Core 2 Duo (Conroe (Allendale)) and a X1650 Pro 256 MB.
Maybe a high-end 20" (possibly 23") iMac with a 2.4 GHz Core 2 Duo (Conroe) and a X1800 GTO 256 MB.
The Mac Mini with a 1.66 GHz and a 1.83 Ghz Core 2 Duo (Merom) with MR X1400 on the high-end model or as a BTO.
Wow. You are reading my mind. This is the closest list of what might happen that I agree with will likely be the case. I think maybe a little faster on the Conroes in iMacs. And I doubt there will be anything other than IG in the mini. But otherwise we agree. In fact in the mobiles we agree exactly 100% the same with what I think they will be. :eek:For a desktop machine those iMac specs are utterly pathetic. A X1600 in 2007? Heck, it was a mediocre card 6 months ago, let alone in 6 months time. A crappy 2Mb cache C2D and both slow as hell compared to what every other desktop manufacturer will be offering?

The iMac is a desktop computer and Apple's only desktop computer. It should offer desktop performance, end of. What use is a crippled desktop, with all the problems of a mobile form factor but none of the advantages, to anyone? You might as well buy a Macbook.

If Apple released an iMac with those specs you would have to be totally retarded to buy one. They will be using the same processors as everyone else with C2D and will have no excuse for offering crappy specs.

What would be competitive:

MB: 1.83 and 2.0Ghz Merom, Integrated graphics
MBP: 2-2.33Ghz Merom, X1800
iMac 2.4-2.66Ghz Conroe, X1800 and LCD res upgrade
Mac Mini: 1.83Ghz Allendale (going to be much cheaper than Merom, so if they can they will put one in) Integrated graphics
Mac Pro: Dual 2.0-3.0Ghz XeonsBut I do have to agree with Manic Mouse as well regarding the iMac speeds & graphics.iMac: You'll be pushing up prices as well as getting into Mac Pro's territory. A low-end X1800 is a possibilty but considering Apple's track record for graphics cards, unlikely.
Mac Mini: If you like liquid Mac Minis then sure :) I have even suggested that an Allendale Core 2 Duo along with a 3.5" HD should be put in the Mini but it would require a case redesign.

P.S. And you obviously didn't read what I said about cost of going from a 1.83 GHz Yonah to a 2.4 Ghz Conroe.Well for one thing, Apple doesn't pay street prices. iMacs will only have 2 cores until Kentsfield. So I think it's fair to expct aggressive Conroe speed in the iMac due to the 2 core limitation. iMacs need to be about the same speed as Mac Pros because they only have 2 cores.

mrgazpacho
Aug 27, 2006, 09:08 AM
Speaking of wish expectations Multimedia;

I know you're hangin' out for Santa Rosa. The article mentions that it's expected in early 2007. Do you think that would be the date for official announcement of production-standard architecture, or actual availability announcement?

Seems very early to be shipping...

I could go out in September and get a Merom notebook, but I don't mind waiting 6 months for Santa Rosa to hit the street.

BlizzardBomb
Aug 27, 2006, 09:09 AM
And I doubt there will be anything other than IG in the mini. But otherwise we agree. In fact in the mobiles we agree exactly 100% the same with what I think they will be. :eek:

The MR X1400 is more of a wish than a prediction. It would help close the gap between Mac Mini and Mac Pro.

rtdunham
Aug 27, 2006, 09:15 AM
I believe the 2.33 GHz Merom chip debuted at the same price as the 2.16 GHz Yonah when it was released. The prices of MBPs certainly haven't fallen. Apple has just been enjoying the extra profits from Intel's price drops of the past few months.

good information, logical thought.

do you think apple's $100M payoff to Creative*, and possible need to restate financial information for recent quarters/years because of questionable executive compensation, make the company more reluctant than might otherwise have been the case to intro new chips that are, in the beginning more costly and thus will reduce profits?

*--i know, i know, it's only 1% of apple's cash reserves. But that's not meaningless money: trust me, companies make plenty of strategic decisions that affect their products' features, support quality, whatever, over amounts far less than $100M.

Apple Corps
Aug 27, 2006, 09:21 AM
Simple. Apples' current sale for students on getting a MAJOR discount on iPods when you buy a new mac, ends on Friday the 15th. Thus, the following monday, will come the new updates. They wouldn't release before, because they would be cutting their profits even more than they are now.

Are you sure that discount applies to the NEW Merom based Macs - I don't think so?

Apple Corps
Aug 27, 2006, 09:27 AM
good information, logical thought.

do you think apple's $100M payoff to Creative*, and possible need to restate financial information for recent quarters/years because of questionable executive compensation, make the company more reluctant than might otherwise have been the case to intro new chips that are, in the beginning more costly and thus will reduce profits?

*--i know, i know, it's only 1% of apple's cash reserves. But that's not meaningless money: trust me, companies make plenty of strategic decisions that affect their products' features, support quality, whatever, over amounts far less than $100M.

Why are you saying the new chips will be more costly??? All reports indicate that Merom will release at the same cost as Yonah.

Cygnus311
Aug 27, 2006, 09:40 AM
OK, that's wierd. Who would get angry about having research into what the public wants done for them???

No wonder Nintendo sucks so much.

BTW, Congrats on ur 500 Posts!

Nintendo sucks? You must not have payed attention to E3 this year.

BlizzardBomb
Aug 27, 2006, 09:49 AM
Well for one thing, Apple doesn't pay street prices. iMacs will only have 2 cores until Kentsfield. So I think it's fair to expct aggressive Conroe speed in the iMac due to the 2 core limitation. iMacs need to be about the same speed as Mac Pros because they only have 2 cores.

All pricing of chips are quoted in bulks of 1000s. And does it matter whether its street pricing or not because Apple still has to fork out an extra 30% for the CPU (+ logic board redesign costs).

Eidorian
Aug 27, 2006, 09:50 AM
Are you sure that discount applies to the NEW Merom based Macs - I don't think so?The Mac Pro was added into the Major In Mac promo. Considering it was released 2 months after the promo started.

HecubusPro
Aug 27, 2006, 09:56 AM
What makes you say Nintendo sucks so much?
-Zadillo

Because, just as there are Mac fanboys, there are also Nintendo, Microsoft and Sony fanboys. As much as we'd like to think our platform of choice is clearly the best, in all actually, each one has something unique to offer that the other may lack.

Whether we like to believe it or, the same goes for PC vs. Mac, OSX vs. Windows, ATI vs. Nvidia, etc. I've had macs off and on since I was a kid. I've also had several other types of computers other than Windows machines (mostly Commodore systems--man I loved my Amiga 500 with it's upgrade to 1 whole MB of ram :cool:.)

I was first in line to buy the original iMac. I bought it day one. I upgraded it's graphics card, which supposedly was not supposed to be upgradable, so I could play Unreal. Then I began to religiously follow the tragic saga of the Half-Life port to the Mac OS. The guy who was doing it (yes, a one man team), after months of receiving very little support from anyone, eventually threw his hands in the air and gave up. I was distraught, and, as a huge gamer (not fat, just a video game fan :p ), that's when I decided I needed to get a PC with Windows. It was a tough choice, but I knew I had to do it if I wanted to play the latest, greatest PC games. Apple has sorely lacked in porting games to their OS's.

While I did eventually buy a used iBook about 4 or 5 years ago (which I recently sold to help fund my new MBP), I always promised, "I will buy a mac again when I can play any games that a PC can play." Well, now I'm putting my money where my mouth is. I'm jumping head first into the mac market once more, and I thank the Intel switch for allowing it to happen.

While I know I probably won't be able to respectably play games like Crysis and Unreal Tournament 2007 on my MBP, I've become content with having console systems (Xbox 360, soon Wii, much later PS3 when price drops ;).) At this point in my life, I'm trying to simplify. I'm tired of having the huge tower system and massive monitor taking up so much room in my life, so I decide to go with the MBP. I want to be able to move from my desk to the living room, from the house to work, from state to state, etc. with ease and with all I need computer-wise.

So I'm back and I'm happy to be here. Of course, how I managed to get off on a self-rant from someone responding to a perceived Nintendo insult I have no idea. Sorry about that. :D

Did I say I can't wait to get my MBP? :o

MrCrowbar
Aug 27, 2006, 10:03 AM
This is what we NEED:

1. Computer with no fan. Quiet. Silent. CRITICAL.

2. Modular computer to add a gorgeous Apple Cinema Display.

3. At lesat two FireWire 800 ports.

Then all the rest (power, etc).

1. My iMac Core Duo 17" was very quiet. Never heard the fans except using photoshop under rosetta, playing 3D games under XP and during the hardware test. Those fans are powerful when required, make noise like a big hair dryer and you think the computer's gonna lift off and fly away. But on normal use all you hear is the hard drive. I had a desk that happened to resonnate at the frequency of the hard drive which was horrible, but when put on the corner of the desk it was fine. You could crack it open and replace the noisy Maxtor drive with a Seagate Barracuda if you want the absolute silent computer.

2. I hooked up a 20" Dell Screen to the iMac. Worked nicely. the iMac supports up to 23" in dual screen mode.

3. Only has a Firewire 400 Port. You won't get dual 800 on iMac... get a Mac Pro. You could put it in another room, make a hole in the wall for the screen cable and firewire cables and use wireless keyboards and mouses. ;)

rtdunham
Aug 27, 2006, 10:07 AM
As far as "legalities" go, usually corporations do have to generally not take unsolicited ideas, commercials, marketing materials, etc. developed by the public. The reason for this is that they want to avoid being sued later on if they do something similar. ...the more obvious examples would be things where, for example, someone designs a new computer and sends it to Apple; Apple eventually releases something quite similar to it, and the person who sent in the design tries to sue them for taking their idea and not paying anything for it.-Zadillo

but wouldn't it be neat to see a computer maker have a website for submission of ideas: you type in your idea, and get a message that says, "IF we choose to use your idea, you'll receive $1 per unit; if you agree to those terms, hit the "SEND" button now."

Imagine all the 'puter features, (cheap lyric theft intended) that might be in today's units, if they incorporated ideas suggested on these forums alone in the past 5 yrs. It'd be fun to see someone compile a list. Here's a start: Ports on the FRONT of desktop units; easy-swap HD bays on laptops; built-in memory card readers; built-in iPod dock; etc.

Look at the stuff on YOUR desk: how much could be consolidated into the computer itself? Think about what you wish your computer could do that it can't do, now.

ChickenSwartz
Aug 27, 2006, 10:27 AM
Are you sure that discount applies to the NEW Merom based Macs - I don't think so?

It isn't like they are releasing new computers. They will update the current line. So if MBP, iMac, MB, and Mini get Merom (I know there is debate but...) and they don't include them in the promotion only the MacPro will qualify. That makes for a very stupid promotion end, you usually want your promotions to go out BIG.

seany916
Aug 27, 2006, 10:30 AM
Hecubus Pro,

I was distraught, and, as a huge gamer (not fat, just a video game fan )

That was funny! :D :p

bryanc
Aug 27, 2006, 10:30 AM
There's nothing stopping Apple, Dell or anyone else from cruising the forums, reading blogs, etc. and collecting the best ideas out there. They may well be doing this already, but they don't need to, because they employ lots of bright people who can generate good ideas as fast as anyone on these forums.

The problem isn't coming up with the great ideas, it's doing the engineering, marketing, QA and legal wrangling necessary to get an idea implemented in a way that will work well, sell well, and not get you sued.

Apple has been doing a better job of this, IMHO, than most corporations for the past few years, however, they clearly stepped in a big pile with Creative. Fortunately, Apple has an agile legal team, and they appear to have been able to flick most of it off their shoes and onto those of their competitors with their settlement.

But my point is, Apple has no shortage of ideas, and the last thing they need is a ton of people filling out web forms with more 'great ideas' that they would wind up having to pay for.

Cheers

ryanx27
Aug 27, 2006, 10:37 AM
The 1.83 & 2.00GHz for iMacs (if they use merom) and MacBooks and the 2.16 and 2.33 for the 15 & 17 MBPs respectively. Its that simple.

Yeah, I agree. I don't see MacBooks breaking 2.00, but I can def. see a base MBP with a 2.13 and a premium MBP with a 2.33 ... (in fact, I can see it on my desk in 3 weeks :D )

So obviously Merom is coming to the MBP -- what I really want to know is if it will get a better video card and maybe some neat little form factor improvements....:rolleyes:

KingYaba
Aug 27, 2006, 10:45 AM
Maybe an x1800. We all just have to wait and see. :)

Marx55
Aug 27, 2006, 10:53 AM
1. My iMac Core Duo 17" was very quiet. Never heard the fans except using photoshop under rosetta, playing 3D games under XP and during the hardware test. Those fans are powerful when required, make noise like a big hair dryer and you think the computer's gonna lift off and fly away. But on normal use all you hear is the hard drive. I had a desk that happened to resonnate at the frequency of the hard drive which was horrible, but when put on the corner of the desk it was fine. You could crack it open and replace the noisy Maxtor drive with a Seagate Barracuda if you want the absolute silent computer.

2. I hooked up a 20" Dell Screen to the iMac. Worked nicely. the iMac supports up to 23" in dual screen mode.

3. Only has a Firewire 400 Port. You won't get dual 800 on iMac... get a Mac Pro. You could put it in another room, make a hole in the wall for the screen cable and firewire cables and use wireless keyboards and mouses. ;)

Thanks. Yet, I am looking for the return of the Cube (reasonably priced this time, to be a best-seller) or the Mac mini "Pro". BTW, I do not want to pay "twice" for the monitor.

Multimedia
Aug 27, 2006, 10:59 AM
Speaking of wish expectations Multimedia;

I know you're hangin' out for Santa Rosa. The article mentions that it's expected in early 2007. Do you think that would be the date for official announcement of production-standard architecture, or actual availability announcement?

Seems very early to be shipping...

I could go out in September and get a Merom notebook, but I don't mind waiting 6 months for Santa Rosa to hit the street.I don't expect the Santa Rosa setup to be ready before Leopard is next Spring. I was going to wait that long. But hanging out here makes me want something this Fall once Core 2 is in full swing - IE some of it hits the refurb page. :p

I'm thinking 17" MBP or MacBook depending on if MBP has the MB removable easy access HD feature. MacBook is really a bargain @ $949 refurb. I may even go for just a bottom of the line 1.66 GHz C2D refurb mini. But my penchant for spanning says a $949 MacBook at least. I've been a spanner since it became possible in 1986. Find one screen impossably confining - ESP since the 24" is also a TV most of the time thanks to Elgato's amazing EyeTV technologies.

Mac Pro does crush video about 33% faster than this Quad G5 does. Still not fast enough. But significantly faster than I can do it now. But so might the MacBook. I really can't say yet. My mind is in flux. Still have to test Core 2 Duo performance Vs. Mac Pro for my particular video crushing needs. Two bottom of the line Minis may be an option as well.

ryanx27
Aug 27, 2006, 11:01 AM
The current Yonah MacBook is more powerful than any G5 - even dual core G5's. So why would you even make a fake joke about a weak mobile G5 coming? It's a joke that was only briefly funny two years ago. :rolleyes:

It isn't the G5 part that's funny about it. The whole point of the joke is to make fun of the Rumor Article --> Wild Speculation --> Guessing the Specific Release Date cycle.

ryanx27
Aug 27, 2006, 11:05 AM
I happen to have a Yonah Macbook, and im a little concerned.
I wonder, if merom does make it into the Macbooks did i make a mistake by buying my computer before i had to (as in next friday is the cutoff)
I wonder if Merom is really that good. *it sucks that macbooks dont have PGA slots*
well im hoping to sell this one next year, and thatll get me most of the way to my santa rosa beast, cuz i KNOW santa rosa is that good.

This is the classic existential dilemma of the Mac user :D

BWhaler
Aug 27, 2006, 11:37 AM
I happen to have a Yonah Macbook, and im a little concerned.
I wonder, if merom does make it into the Macbooks did i make a mistake by buying my computer before i had to (as in next friday is the cutoff)
I wonder if Merom is really that good.

Don't sweat it.

There is a very comprehensive review of Core Duo vs. Core 2 Duo on Anandtech. Here is there conclusion for people like you:

For Apple users this means that early adopters of the new MacBook or MacBook Pro won't be too pressured to upgrade again by the end of this year...Owners of Core Duo laptops really have no reason to worry about upgrading for now, and waiting for the Santa Rosa platform before your next laptop upgrade seems reasonable.

Sure, the Core 2 Duo is better, but if you read the article, it's not really better in significant ways.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2808&p=1

dornoforpyros
Aug 27, 2006, 11:48 AM
I'm thinking 17" MBP or MacBook depending on if MBP has the MB removable easy access HD feature.


Reading through this thread you've mentioned that the MBP should have a removable HD on pretty much every page. We get it, you really want a user replaceable HD in a MBP. Mentioning it 100 times won't make it happen, however clicking your shoes together and saying 'there's no place like home' just might :rolleyes:

Cygnus311
Aug 27, 2006, 12:04 PM
Because, just as there are Mac fanboys, there are also Nintendo, Microsoft and Sony fanboys. As much as we'd like to think our platform of choice is clearly the best, in all actually, each one has something unique to offer that the other may lack.


But that doesn't make Nintendo (or Microsoft or Sony) suck. Fanboys just make themselves suck by being fanboys. :)

HecubusPro
Aug 27, 2006, 12:08 PM
But that doesn't make Nintendo (or Microsoft or Sony) suck. Fanboys just make themselves suck by being fanboys. :)

You are correct, sir.:D

Silentwave
Aug 27, 2006, 12:19 PM
Yup, heat is no problem. :) Cost on the other hand is. Going from a 2.4 GHz Conroe from a 1.83 GHz Yonah on the low-end is roughly a 30% increase in cost JUST for the CPU.

Um....
E6600 Conroe 2.4GHz: Release price $316
T2400 Yonah 1.83GHz: Release price $294


As for your "iMac Ultra"...

$1000 - 2.93 GHz Conroe
$800 - 23" Display
$300 - X1900
$400 - Hard Drive, Optical Drive, RAM etc.
+ Build costs, marketing costs, logic board cost, casing costs etc.
+ Apple's profit margin

And you are easily looking at a $3000 machine.

Won't get a lot of argument from me as long as that machine comes out *now*.
However, if the X6900 3.2GHz C2 Extreme comes out on schedule in Q4, it will probably take the $999 slot and push down the prices of the X6800 by a good amount. There are also leaks indicating a C2 Extreme X8000 with 1333 MT/S FSB at 3.33GHz.

daze
Aug 27, 2006, 12:29 PM
Speaking of wish expectations Multimedia;

I know you're hangin' out for Santa Rosa. The article mentions that it's expected in early 2007. Do you think that would be the date for official announcement of production-standard architecture, or actual availability announcement?

Seems very early to be shipping...

I could go out in September and get a Merom notebook, but I don't mind waiting 6 months for Santa Rosa to hit the street.
Why not wait for the one after Santa Rosa? Then the one after... ;)

jcampa
Aug 27, 2006, 12:42 PM
Just a few hours left, let's hope we see new MacBook Pros tomorrow, I think we'll see the new iMacs with Merom in Paris, because it's a very good announcement for consumers, and get the Pro MB's tomorrow.

Some_Big_Spoon
Aug 27, 2006, 12:56 PM
I'd like to see a couple pounds shaved off the iMac. I know it sounds goofy, but I'd like a machine thatI could transport easily either to work, or just room to room. It's very light now (considering how much is in there), but - 2 to 5 lbs. would be great.

Also, and I know peeps don't dig them, but the glossy screen would be nice. The glare's not cool, but the rich colors and brightness are tops.

BlizzardBomb
Aug 27, 2006, 12:58 PM
Um....
E6600 Conroe 2.4GHz: Release price $316
T2400 Yonah 1.83GHz: Release price $294


That's the old pricing mate :) 1.83 GHz Yonah/ Merom is $240.

JackSYi
Aug 27, 2006, 01:02 PM
Bring on the 13.3 inch MacBook Pro.

DwightSchrute
Aug 27, 2006, 01:03 PM
Then for some reason it was bumped to a new ship date of august 31st, just enough time to drop a new merom processor in it!

That is interesting because I ordered a Macbook on Tuesday (the 22nd) and mine is also scheduled to ship on the 31st. It is suspiciously strange and hopefully it means that we'll get Meroms because I was waiting for the Merom MBP when I decided to just order a Yonah MB.

MrCrowbar
Aug 27, 2006, 01:17 PM
That is interesting because I ordered a Macbook on Tuesday (the 22nd) and mine is also scheduled to ship on the 31st. It is suspiciously strange and hopefully it means that we'll get Meroms because I was waiting for the Merom MBP when I decided to just order a Yonah MB.


Nice. I have to get my Macbook repaired* but I guess I can wait a few days just in case they want to give me a new one :) .




* I have a loose contact on the screen backlight and sometimes the power just goes off for no reason, even half a secind after powering the thing on... any one with similar problems out there?

aly
Aug 27, 2006, 01:38 PM
Just a few hours left, let's hope we see new MacBook Pros tomorrow, I think we'll see the new iMacs with Merom in Paris, because it's a very good announcement for consumers, and get the Pro MB's tomorrow.

As in Paris Expo? Cause I do believe that apple aren't going to be making a keynote speech. And won't make any annoucements at all or am I still believing in old news proved wrong?

dayne33
Aug 27, 2006, 01:58 PM
I was just checking out the CD vs C2D comparison at Anandtech, pretty interesting stuff.

My question is this, is Santa Rosa strictly the mobile platform? I'm a student holding off for an iMac revision, and am wondering if apple utilizes Conroe in the iMac, will the faster FSB's be supported? Is an updated platform already available for Conroe? (I guess I had more than one question:rolleyes: )

Thanks

33scottie33
Aug 27, 2006, 02:06 PM
That is interesting because I ordered a Macbook on Tuesday (the 22nd) and mine is also scheduled to ship on the 31st. It is suspiciously strange and hopefully it means that we'll get Meroms because I was waiting for the Merom MBP when I decided to just order a Yonah MB.

I ordered a 17" MBP on Thursday and it originally had a ship date for the 31st. Then today I got an email with a tracking number saying that it shipped today.:confused: I was hoping that mine would be a Merom too, but it does not look like it. The delivery date is now the 30th; I'll try to not open it for a couple of days or until I hear some new news.

W. Ademczyk
Aug 27, 2006, 02:12 PM
I hate to say it, but I think the chances of Apple dropping the merom chips into laptops before September 5th are pretty slim. It's probably more likely that the waiting times are due to back to school rush shortages; Apple has doubled its laptop market share with the Macbook. http://arstechnica.com/journals/apple.ars/2006/7/25/4753

In addition, thinksecret reported earlier this month that we might be seeing an updated case for the MBP. http://www.thinksecret.com/news/0606macpro.html While this would be a good thing, because it alludes to Apple maybe addressing the heat issue, it is pretty unlikely that Apple would start shipping a machine to buyers without diclosing that the case looks different.

Apparently, the September 5th date stems from reports that Apple is scheduled to recieved a massive product shipment from Asia. http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=1965 This coincides with other reports of the new Macs being ready "after Labor Day."

It's pretty safe to say that we will be able to get our Merom Macs at the very latest by the second week of September; thus, we will all be able to capitolize on the ipod deal that runs through the 16th. Personally, I think that the likelyhood of time running out on the nano deal is pretty slim because that sale is likely in response to an imminent refresh in the nano's own product line. http://buyersguide.macrumors.com/

anim8or
Aug 27, 2006, 02:26 PM
I really hope that they keep the option for a matte screen open when the upgraded MacBook Pros finally arrive.

I have been waiting a while now to upgrade to a MacBook Pro but have held off primarily as i would like to see if the enclosure gets a few nips and tucks a la Macbook!

The switchable HD bay would be awesome, and the magnetic latch and updated keyboard also would be nice but PLEASE DO NOT make glossy screen a standard on Pro notebooks!

I have a few friends who own PC laptops with glossy screens and all of them have keyboards imprinted on their screens! I cannot say from experience if this happens with the MacBooks but i'd rather not risk it....

seenew
Aug 27, 2006, 02:26 PM
Maybe there will be a new iMac launched with the new iPod in October.

Cinch
Aug 27, 2006, 02:39 PM
That doesn't make sense, marketing wise. If they do anything to the MacBooks and iMacs they would at least bump their speeds. It doesn't matter f the 2GHz Merom chip is faster than the 2GHz Yonah chip, the consumers don't give a crap about the chip... they want to see "them GHz numbers" go up.

The consequence is a laptop with a power cord attach to them feeding the insatiable appetite of the thermo nuclear reactor we call the CPU. For the love of reason and common sense, why can't Apple make a laptop with a day worth of battery powered. How about OLED display and multicore chip running at much lower frequency. Enough with the Ghz BS; what is the different between a 2.16Ghz and a 2.33 Ghz processors again?

Cinch

EagerDragon
Aug 27, 2006, 02:55 PM
All these changes are also likely to see a departure from the standard Alum shell. There will probably be a new attractive enclosure to separate the lines. Almost instant load of applications along with all the extra speed of Leopard on a sweet Meron chip with all the new iCandy and functionality will likely make me pull my credit card. Can't wait for next summer!!!!!!

Bring it ON!!!!!!!:)

Zwhaler
Aug 27, 2006, 03:08 PM
PowerBook G5 next tuesday?

I havn't been here long, but I don't get it. :confused:

EagerDragon
Aug 27, 2006, 03:08 PM
That is interesting because I ordered a Macbook on Tuesday (the 22nd) and mine is also scheduled to ship on the 31st. It is suspiciously strange and hopefully it means that we'll get Meroms because I was waiting for the Merom MBP when I decided to just order a Yonah MB.

Maybe, but remember that they are having a hard time filling the orders due to the large number of people buying the systems.

Apple needs to is not likely to upgrade the MacBooks before Jan. The MacBook pro likely Monday or Mid Sept.

Eraserhead
Aug 27, 2006, 03:13 PM
I havn't been here long, but I don't get it. :confused:

One reason Apple switched to Intel was because they couldn't get a G5 in a notebook, they kept saying they would do this for ages so a joke that powerbook G5's coming out Tuesday emerged. This *hilarious* joke has come back for an encore now we are all Intel chips which are quicker than the G5, especially as no-one knows exactly which Tuesday (28th August / 5th September / 12th September) the Merom MB/MBP will arrive.

ntsapp3
Aug 27, 2006, 03:35 PM
.

daneoni
Aug 27, 2006, 03:38 PM
One reason Apple switched to Intel was because they couldn't get a G5 in a notebook, they kept saying they would do this for ages so a joke that powerbook G5's coming out Tuesday emerged. This *hilarious* joke has come back for an encore now we are all Intel chips which are quicker than the G5, especially as no-one knows exactly which Tuesday (28th August / 5th September / 12th September) the Merom MB/MBP will arrive.

It isn't the G5 part that's funny about it. The whole point of the joke is to make fun of the Rumor Article --> Wild Speculation --> Guessing the Specific Release Date cycle.

Finally people who grasp it

PetMac
Aug 27, 2006, 03:38 PM
Long live PBG5NT. It reminds us how great it is to have frequent updates and powerful portables again.

daneoni
Aug 27, 2006, 03:40 PM
Can someone tell me in what Santa Rosa is all about and how much of a difference it is (as far as Merom is concerned) ??:)

Its the next mobile chipset. Sufficive to say, you get a faster bus 800 from 667MHz and support for 802.11n as well some other goodies

Multimedia
Aug 27, 2006, 03:48 PM
Just got the August Dell catalog and on page 17 under a red notebook that has a Yonah Core Duo inside it they display a large Core 2 Duo logo. In super fine print under it - about 6 point typeface - they mention "E6700 processors start at $2540". Can you believe it?

They are deliberately confusing their customers with unfair comparisons between 1.86 GHz E6300 Conroe for $2460 and 2GHz T2500 Yonah for $2715 on their notebook pages. :eek: :confused: :rolleyes:

I mean Apple's prices are RADICALLY LOWER with RADICALLY MORE power per dollar.

aly
Aug 27, 2006, 03:58 PM
I'm a bit fed up of all these estimates and random guesses at when apple will release merom updated MBPs. Although I am waiting for the revision before I buy one, I've decided to just wait till I see one instead of getting my hopes up each tuessday :) hehe. Ah well maybe next tuesday.....

Zadillo
Aug 27, 2006, 03:59 PM
Finally people who grasp it

It's not that people didn't understand the joke. It's that the joke ceased being funny after the first couple of hundreds of times it was told.

-Zadillo

Multimedia
Aug 27, 2006, 04:03 PM
I really hope that they keep the option for a matte screen open when the upgraded MacBook Pros finally arrive.

I have been waiting a while now to upgrade to a MacBook Pro but have held off primarily as i would like to see if the enclosure gets a few nips and tucks a la Macbook!

The switchable HD bay would be awesome, and the magnetic latch and updated keyboard also would be nice but PLEASE DO NOT make glossy screen a standard on Pro notebooks!

I have a few friends who own PC laptops with glossy screens and all of them have keyboards imprinted on their screens! I cannot say from experience if this happens with the MacBooks but i'd rather not risk it....Closing A Laptop Without The Foam Barrier it ships with Or A Cloth Barrier Is Poor Maintenance. I would NEVER close my laptop without a barrier between the keyboard and the screen. I don't understand those who do. :rolleyes:

I still have the foam barrier and slipcase that came with my 3 year old PowerBook and always use them in addition to two iKlear (http://iKlear.com) cloth barriers on the keyboard as well as on the trackpad.

Zadillo
Aug 27, 2006, 04:06 PM
The consequence is a laptop with a power cord attach to them feeding the insatiable appetite of the thermo nuclear reactor we call the CPU. For the love of reason and common sense, why can't Apple make a laptop with a day worth of battery powered. How about OLED display and multicore chip running at much lower frequency. Enough with the Ghz BS; what is the different between a 2.16Ghz and a 2.33 Ghz processors again?

Cinch

For the same reason that pretty much no-one else makes a laptop like what you described either. The only thing I've seen that even gets close to the sort of battery life you are talking about are some of the Japanese ultraportables that can get 6-11 hours of battery life, using 10-12" screens and very slow and power efficient ULV Core Solo or ULV Pentium M chips. These laptops also tend to cost in the $2000-3000 range.

I would venture to say that even if you slapped one of those ULV processors in a larger notebook with a larger battery, you still wouldn't be able to balance things out to get 24 hours of battery life.

And one has to wonder if people would put up with the performance hit.

OLED display technology at least probably isn't ready to be used for something like a laptop screen.

So, for the "love of reason and common sense", can we stop expecting Apple to create a product that isn't even technically feasible right now?

I think if you want 24 hours of battery life, you're probably better off carrying 6 or 7 spare batteries (and the $600-700 cost of doing so and added weight is still probably less than what it would take to get some laptop that actually had a reliable 24 hour battery life.)

-Zadillo

ryanx27
Aug 27, 2006, 04:15 PM
It's not that people didn't understand the joke. It's that the joke ceased being funny after the first couple of hundreds of times it was told.

-Zadillo

I'm not on these forums (or any other, for that matter) nearly enough to have seen it hundreds of times :)

MrCrowbar
Aug 27, 2006, 04:26 PM
I have a few friends who own PC laptops with glossy screens and all of them have keyboards imprinted on their screens! I cannot say from experience if this happens with the MacBooks but i'd rather not risk it....

I've seen tons of laptops with the keyboard marks on the screen among powerbooks and the expensive Sony things. And those were all matte screens. My glossy Macbook screen is still as it was when I bought it (2 or 3 days after they were announced). The keyboard is a bit lower than on most laptops, so the re's quite some space between the keys and the screen whan it's closed. Unless you have a thick layer of chocklate/peanut butter/anal lube etc.. on your Keyboard, your screen is fine.

As opposed to Multimedia, I don't use foam barriers at all. Those things actually touch your screen, so if you have any dirt on the foam barrier, it's likely to scratch the screen if it moves. I like to bang my laptop lid like a car door and the Macbookhas this nice smooth sound when closeing (gotta love the magnetic latch). :-)

MatthewCobb
Aug 27, 2006, 04:28 PM
That is interesting because I ordered a Macbook on Tuesday (the 22nd) and mine is also scheduled to ship on the 31st. It is suspiciously strange and hopefully it means that we'll get Meroms because I was waiting for the Merom MBP when I decided to just order a Yonah MB.

I ordered a MB on 15 August from my work. Apple registered the order on 23 August (it was faxed on the 16th!)... It will be delivered on 1 September. I phoned up to find out what was going on and complained it was taking forever. Maybe I should have said thankyou!

On the other hand, I have heard that Apple want to emphasise the difference of the MBP (why buy one unless you're doing 3-D gaming or heavy-duty video editing or just like aluminium...?). So maybe they'll just put the Merom in the MBP...

PS I thought the PB G5 next Tuesday thing was quite funny - precisely because it has been done to death, first dead straight (remember how excited people got for so many years), and now because it's a useful reminder not to take our speculations too seriously...

PPS I have skanky keyboard marks all over my squidgy PBG4 screen, always have had. Grrr.

daneoni
Aug 27, 2006, 04:33 PM
PS I thought the PB G5 next Tuesday thing was quite funny - precisely because it has been done to death, first dead straight (remember how excited people got for so many years), and now because it's a useful reminder not to take our speculations too seriously...

Another person who grasps it.

cyberdogl2
Aug 27, 2006, 04:48 PM
i like the powerbook g5 jokes and have been around for a long time if that helps

Zadillo
Aug 27, 2006, 04:50 PM
Another person who grasps it.

Again, come on now...... it's not a question of whether people grasp it. It's question of who finds it funny and who doesn't. It's possible to "grasp" a joke and still not find it funny once it has been done to death. Just because someone doesn't think it is funny doesn't mean you have to insult their intelligence by saying they just don't "grasp" it.

cyberdogl2
Aug 27, 2006, 04:59 PM
hmmm... the funny part is that it's been done to death.* that's the bit.* i guess you don't see it as funny.* ever heard of a reoccuring joke with a little aphormism mixed in?

daneoni
Aug 27, 2006, 05:12 PM
Again, come on now...... it's not a question of whether people grasp it. It's question of who finds it funny and who doesn't. It's possible to "grasp" a joke and still not find it funny once it has been done to death. Just because someone doesn't think it is funny doesn't mean you have to insult their intelligence by saying they just don't "grasp" it.

No, you're putting words in my mouth. People can be intelligent and still not get the essence of a reoccuring joke.

Zadillo
Aug 27, 2006, 05:17 PM
No, you're putting words in my mouth. People can be intelligent and still not get the essence of a reoccuring joke.

Who here doesn't get the "essence" of the joke? Really, I think you must think that the "PowerBook G5" is a lot more clever than it actually is. People "get" the joke, they got it the first few hundred times someone posted "PowerBook G5 next tuesday?".

The humor of the recurring nature of the joke was already worn out a long time ago, and it has long since passed the phase where many people find it funny just because it is repeated so often.

Recurring jokes lose their humor for many people precisely because they get beaten into the ground. That's the problem with recurring jokes.

Just because someone finds a recurring joke that has been beaten into the ground to not be funny doesn't mean they don't "grasp" the concept of it.

-Zadillo

Zadillo
Aug 27, 2006, 05:19 PM
hmmm... the funny part is that it's been done to death.* that's the bit.* i guess you don't see it as funny.* ever heard of a reoccuring joke with a little aphormism mixed in?

But that's the problem. The joke was that it was done to death...... but THAT part has been done to death too, which is why most people no longer find it to be all that funny.

I'm happy that some people still seem to be able to find humor in it, but that doesn't mean that the people who no longer find it to be funny just don't "get it". It just means that the lifespan of this joke has long since passed for many people.

cyberdogl2
Aug 27, 2006, 05:20 PM
I see where you're coming from.

So does this mean there will be no Powerbook G5s next tuesday?

daneoni
Aug 27, 2006, 05:22 PM
I see where you're coming from.

So does this mean there will be no Powerbook G5s next tuesday?

...yeah no PowerBook G5 next tuesday?...say it aint so, say it aint so.

Zadillo
Aug 27, 2006, 05:28 PM
I see where you're coming from.

So does this mean there will be no Powerbook G5s next tuesday?

Hey, you never know.... ;)

daneoni
Aug 27, 2006, 05:32 PM
Hey for what its worth, i understand where you're coming from Zadillo BUT some people still find the joke funny and therefore it deserves to be told.

phytonix
Aug 27, 2006, 05:34 PM
canceled my MBP order
will wait until later
canceled order says shipment date of MBP is also Sept 1st
maybe they are really updating MBP
plz do...

Zadillo
Aug 27, 2006, 05:38 PM
Hey for what its worth, i understand where you're coming from Zadillo BUT some people still find the joke funny and therefore it deserves to be told.

Fair enough, and I won't argue any more about it. I can't think of anything more tedious than a debate about whether a joke is funny or not...:)

dayne33
Aug 27, 2006, 05:40 PM
I was just checking out the CD vs C2D comparison at Anandtech, pretty interesting stuff.

My question is this, is Santa Rosa strictly the mobile platform? I'm a student holding off for an iMac revision, and am wondering if apple utilizes Conroe in the iMac, will the faster FSB's be supported? Is an updated platform already available for Conroe? (I guess I had more than one question )

Thanks

daneoni
Aug 27, 2006, 05:54 PM
I was just checking out the CD vs C2D comparison at Anandtech, pretty interesting stuff.

My question is this, is Santa Rosa strictly the mobile platform? I'm a student holding off for an iMac revision, and am wondering if apple utilizes Conroe in the iMac, will the faster FSB's be supported? Is an updated platform already available for Conroe? (I guess I had more than one question )

Thanks

Santa Rosa is for mobile platforms only. As far as i can tell the Conroe chips already have a rich FSB by default 1066MHz i think. Apple may use conroe and may use merom but conroe is looking to be the slated candidate.

HecubusPro
Aug 27, 2006, 06:25 PM
I hate to say it, but I think the chances of Apple dropping the merom chips into laptops before September 5th are pretty slim. It's probably more likely that the waiting times are due to back to school rush shortages; Apple has doubled its laptop market share with the Macbook. http://arstechnica.com/journals/apple.ars/2006/7/25/4753

I agree 100%.

In addition, thinksecret reported earlier this month that we might be seeing an updated case for the MBP. http://www.thinksecret.com/news/0606macpro.html While this would be a good thing, because it alludes to Apple maybe addressing the heat issue, it is pretty unlikely that Apple would start shipping a machine to buyers without diclosing that the case looks different.

I've always loved the current look of the aluminum enclosure for the MBP's, so I'm not necessarily looking for a different enclosure, though I wouldn't mind if they did. It's what's inside that counts, right? :p

IMO, I believe the new enclosure will basically add easier access to swappable HDD's like the MB. It doesn't seem appropriate for a lower end model computer to have a feature the professional level model should have. That's why you pay the big $. I think the enclosure will remain the same, but we'll see an update that will allow users to change out their hard drives if they choose.

Apparently, the September 5th date stems from reports that Apple is scheduled to recieved a massive product shipment from Asia. http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=1965 This coincides with other reports of the new Macs being ready "after Labor Day."

Agreed again. I know it's exciting to think that we'll see new macs with merom tomorrow, but I think that's 99% unlikely to happen considering the report stated that Apple will receive "a massive product shipment from Asia" on the 5th of September (remember, remember the 5th of September:cool: ) that still doesn't take into account the time it takes to ship from their warehouses where they received those shipments, to their retail outlets--Apple stores, etc. My guess would be that we'll begin seeing merom MPB's between the 7th to the 22nd in stores and online. Perhaps that's not a bold prediction, but I think it's a safe one. :D

It's pretty safe to say that we will be able to get our Merom Macs at the very latest by the second week of September; thus, we will all be able to capitolize on the ipod deal that runs through the 16th. Personally, I think that the likelyhood of time running out on the nano deal is pretty slim because that sale is likely in response to an imminent refresh in the nano's own product line. http://buyersguide.macrumors.com/

Though I certainly do hope they'll be available in time to take advantage of the free Nano before that deal runs out on the 16th.

cyberdogl2
Aug 27, 2006, 06:27 PM
Fair enough, and I won't argue any more about it. I can't think of anything more tedious than a debate about whether a joke is funny or not...:)

Which, to me, is pretty funny.

louden
Aug 27, 2006, 06:36 PM
IF new MBPs are announced tomorrow
and
IF people who had ordered new MBPs see their ship dates slip

Then wouldn't that signal that prices won't change for the various models from existing prices AND that we shouldn't assume drastic shell changes? Sure they can give us easy access and a magnetic lid, but no options on a glossy screen and no black anodized aluminum.

If I were Apple, I'd hold off on the black aluminum for a few months to get a few of us suckers to buy two of the damn things... Malibu Stacy Marketing 101.

danvdr
Aug 27, 2006, 06:42 PM
G5 Powerbook joke explanations next Tuesday :p

DJMastaWes
Aug 27, 2006, 06:47 PM
I don't think we're going to see Merom in the MacBook Pros tomorrow. Of course, I'm HOPEING. If they were annouced tomorrow, it would make not only my day, but my month! I've been waiting since June and was expecing it at WWDC. So I'm keeping my fingers crosses 100%. If the're annouced tomorrow, I'm going to order it withen the first 5 minuts of me finding out.

Hopefully this will be my order.
15" MacBook Pro
2.33GHz
2GB Ram
256MB VRAM
Superdrive

+BT Mighty Mouse (x2)
BT Keyboard
Some sort of bag for the MBP
D-Link USB Bluetooth drive

*Crosses fingers*

TheManOfSilver
Aug 27, 2006, 06:49 PM
OK ... wading into the mire a little bit here ...

I like the sound of some of the iMac configuration suggestions floating around here (especially the iMac Ultra). That being said, everyone's suggestions assume that the iMacs will continue using ATI GPUs. Not that I'm a total conspiracy nut, but don't you think it's possible that Apple may switch to NVidia GPUs now that ATI belongs to AMD?

As the first launch planned after the merger (I'm sure the Mac Pro configurations were set long before then), I think it's entirely possible ...

HecubusPro
Aug 27, 2006, 06:55 PM
+BT Mighty Mouse (x2)
BT Keyboard
Some sort of bag for the MBP
D-Link USB Bluetooth drive

*Crosses fingers*

I just bought this today at my local Apple Store in anticipation of receiving my new 2.33mhz MBP 17".
http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore.woa/wo/2.RSLID?mco=B8F3B1F4&nplm=TH469LL%2FA
I'm a 36 year old man and I still use backpacks instead of briefcases. :cool: When will I ever grow up? :)

Silentwave
Aug 27, 2006, 06:58 PM
That's the old pricing mate :) 1.83 GHz Yonah/ Merom is $240.

Now. But how much have iMac prices changed since release? I don't think they have. They released the iMac and MBP lines around the same time Yonah was intro'ed, and the iMacs did not see any speed bumps or price changes that I know of. Therefore they should be able to implement similar pricing with Conroe @ 2.4GHz, just with a profit margin closer to the iMac release amounts.

Of course they could always go for the 2.13GHz version, which is less expensive, and still plenty faster than the existing 1.83 :)

fluidinclusion
Aug 27, 2006, 06:58 PM
hmmm... the funny part is that it's been done to death.* that's the bit.* i guess you don't see it as funny.* ever heard of a reoccuring joke with a little aphormism mixed in?


All your Powerbook G5's are belong to us

ezekielrage_99
Aug 27, 2006, 06:59 PM
i like the powerbook g5 jokes and have been around for a long time if that helps

I like them as well, but I think it's been replaced with Merom next tuesday, G6 Video iPod next next tuesday and the good old iPhone next tuesday rumors.

Still good for a laugh ;)

Viggy
Aug 27, 2006, 07:07 PM
HI!

Anyone knows if jointly with this rumor is the rumor of the upgrade of graphic cards on MacBook (not Pro) to Intel GMA 965 (I think is this the reference...)?

Thanks!

shawnce
Aug 27, 2006, 07:27 PM
Now. But how much have iMac prices changed since release? I don't think they have. They released the iMac and MBP lines around the same time Yonah was intro'ed, and the iMacs did not see any speed bumps or price changes that I know of. Therefore they should be able to implement similar pricing with Conroe @ 2.4GHz, just with a profit margin closer to the iMac release amounts. Apple new future pricing plans looong before we did... they likely picked the price point with that in mind.

daneoni
Aug 27, 2006, 07:34 PM
Now. But how much have iMac prices changed since release? I don't think they have. They released the iMac and MBP lines around the same time Yonah was intro'ed, and the iMacs did not see any speed bumps or price changes that I know of. Therefore they should be able to implement similar pricing with Conroe @ 2.4GHz, just with a profit margin closer to the iMac release amounts.

Of course they could always go for the 2.13GHz version, which is less expensive, and still plenty faster than the existing 1.83 :)

20" iMac prices have reduced....at least in the UK

ergle2
Aug 27, 2006, 07:41 PM
HI!

Anyone knows if jointly with this rumor is the rumor of the upgrade of graphic cards on MacBook (not Pro) to Intel GMA 965 (I think is this the reference...)?

Thanks!

From the benchmarks I've seen, the 3000/X3000 stuff (the 965 integrated graphics) is *slower* than the 945 integrated graphics. The only advantage it offers is SM 3.0 (pixel shaders), which are required for Vista compliance -- and that nice little sticker that all new PC systems will want for this holiday season. I wouldn't consider it an upgrade.

Silentwave
Aug 27, 2006, 07:46 PM
20" iMac prices have reduced....at least in the UK

I don't recall any major price changes over here, but even so the particular case in point here is the 17" 1.83 iMac so if that hasn't changed over there then that would further support my thinking.

Zadillo
Aug 27, 2006, 07:49 PM
From the benchmarks I've seen, the 3000/X3000 stuff (the 965 integrated graphics) is *slower* than the 945 integrated graphics. The only advantage it offers is SM 3.0 (pixel shaders), which are required for Vista compliance -- and that nice little sticker that all new PC systems will want for this holiday season. I wouldn't consider it an upgrade.

Do you mean Vista Premium compliance? I'm pretty sure I've seen "Ready for Vista" stickers on plenty of current notebooks featuring GMA950 graphics, for example.

And btw, I have to say "good job" to Apple for doing whatever was necessary to avoid having to put a bunch of goofy decals on their computers. The most amazing thing to me is the number of PC notebook users that leave all those stickers on (I've even seen some people leave the "features" stickers on).

daneoni
Aug 27, 2006, 08:01 PM
Do you mean Vista Premium compliance? I'm pretty sure I've seen "Ready for Vista" stickers on plenty of current notebooks featuring GMA950 graphics, for example.

And btw, I have to say "good job" to Apple for doing whatever was necessary to avoid having to put a bunch of goofy decals on their computers. The most amazing thing to me is the number of PC notebook users that leave all those stickers on (I've even seen some people leave the "features" stickers on).

Yeah i never got that either. First thing i do is scrape them off even if i have to use a knife

daneoni
Aug 27, 2006, 08:03 PM
Alright i'm off, i hope everyone gets what they wish for on tuesday, however wild. Cheers and here's to PowerBook G5s tomorrow.

TheKrillr
Aug 27, 2006, 08:19 PM
Not true.

Recent years, updates came right before the end of the promotion.

I didn't know that, thats very good to know. I'm in need of a macbook by the 25th and was afraid i'd have to end up ordering right before the release of Merom.

TheKrillr
Aug 27, 2006, 08:19 PM
Are you sure that discount applies to the NEW Merom based Macs - I don't think so?

I would assume so. The promotion applies to the Mac Pros i believe, and thats new hardware.

dornoforpyros
Aug 27, 2006, 08:41 PM
you know what? I like the g5 powerbook next tuesday joke enough that I think MR should print it on a t-shirt! :)

ro2nie
Aug 27, 2006, 08:43 PM
I think im gonna wait and buy in 2007 with leopard and iLife 07 :rolleyes:

TheManOfSilver
Aug 27, 2006, 08:57 PM
I think im gonna wait and buy in 2007 with leopard and iLife 07 :rolleyes:

That's my plan (if I can hold out until then) ... as much as I'm dying to get my hands on an iMac right now, having an upgraded iMac and an upgraded OS will be that much better.

boncellis
Aug 27, 2006, 09:12 PM
Sifting through this thread can make one either optimistic or irrational, depending on who you ask. One point I found absent among the discussion was the possibility of a Core 2 Duo machine coinciding with the September 16th iPod offer end date.

Makes sense to me, but then I tend to get shouted down a lot in this forum. ;)

TheManOfSilver
Aug 27, 2006, 09:25 PM
Sifting through this thread can make one either optimistic or irrational, depending on who you ask. One point I found absent among the discussion was the possibility of a Core 2 Duo machine coinciding with the September 16th iPod offer end date.

Makes sense to me, but then I tend to get shouted down a lot in this forum. ;)

Actually, this has been mentioned (more than once I think) ... but I agree with you that it would make sense (let people shout what they may ;) )

Multimedia
Aug 27, 2006, 09:33 PM
I think im gonna wait and buy in 2007 with leopard and iLife 07 :rolleyes:I don't think I will be able to wait another 8 months. Waiting for C2D was brutal enough. But I'm gonna try and hold out for a refurb C2 Mac Pro or MB or MBP.

HecubusPro
Aug 27, 2006, 09:37 PM
Sifting through this thread can make one either optimistic or irrational, depending on who you ask. One point I found absent among the discussion was the possibility of a Core 2 Duo machine coinciding with the September 16th iPod offer end date.

Makes sense to me, but then I tend to get shouted down a lot in this forum. ;)

What about simply rational? It's easy to become excited at the prospect of shiny new merom macs ready to hit store shelves tomorrow or tuesday, but I think that's premature. The rational part of me, which has taken over the part of me that's flipping out excited, says we'll see them within three to four weeks. I know that's disappointing to a lot of people, but if you have read through these posts, and the macforums front page, I think it's easy to surmise that that will be the case.

Of course, I would love for my MBP merom to hit stores tomorrow, so if I'm wrong, I'll eat a raw potato. :p But I don't see anything wrong with saying new merom systems will ship by the 16th to take advantage of the Nano promotion. In fact, I bet Apple is probably scrambling to make sure that is the case.

But don't be fooled by my rational side too much. I've already bought a .mac account and a cool new backpack to house my MBP when it finally does ship. I'm about ready to jump out of my skin I'm so excited.:D

EDIT: Wow! I just made "macforums member!" :cool:

W. Ademczyk
Aug 27, 2006, 09:41 PM
IMO, I believe the new enclosure will basically add easier access to swappable HDD's like the MB. It doesn't seem appropriate for a lower end model computer to have a feature the professional level model should have. That's why you pay the big $. I think the enclosure will remain the same, but we'll see an update that will allow users to change out their hard drives if they choose.


Exactly, allowing the user to swap out components is definately a direction that Apple is taking, which is something that helps them stay competitive in the pc world. The Macbook, as we all know, utilizes a design that makes it easy to swap out ram and HDDs; and the Mac Pro is configured with snazzy slide-out trays so that virtually every piece of hardware can be swapped out easily. This is a feature that the new MBP case design had better incorporate.



In regard to the Ipod incentive, if Intel shipped Merom to manufacturers at the end of July, will announce it's release to the public on the 28th, and Apple's own shipment of Merom toting computers comes in on the 5th, I have a hard time understanding why they would wait 2-3 weeks to put these computers in the hands of the public when Dell, HP, and Lenovo will be updating their websites the second that the announcement is made. As far as I can tell, there were two reasons Apple started giving away free Nanos to college kids. First, they needed to clean out the inventory for the next Ipod line; and second, the back to school rush is the best time to increase the market share since college students probably make up the highest percentage of win to mac switchers. Since Merom reportedly costs Apple the same amount as Yonah, and MBP sales have been a little lackluster, it would make next to no sense for Apple to drop the Ipod rebate. We have to remember that the only reason Macintels were released with Yonah in the first place is that Apple wasn't able to pressure Intel into giving them Merom early(thus explaining the drop from 64bit processing to 32bit and then back up again 7 months later). If Apple wouldn't have released the Intel line when it did, they would have been stuck with a stale product line and, missing out on the back to school rush, wouldn't be enjoying their doubled market share.

I think it's fair to conclude that the 16th was chosen as the date for the Nano rebate not because the Merom will appear after that time, but because most back to school shopping will be done by then. It is in Apple's best interest to try to catch the tail end of the college shopping season with the MBP.

boncellis
Aug 27, 2006, 10:19 PM
What about simply rational? It's easy to become excited at the prospect of shiny new merom macs ready to hit store shelves tomorrow or tuesday, but I think that's premature. The rational part of me, which has taken over the part of me that's flipping out excited, says we'll see them within three to four weeks. I know that's disappointing to a lot of people, but if you have read through these posts, and the macforums front page, I think it's easy to surmise that that will be the case.
...
But don't be fooled by my rational side too much. I've already bought a .mac account and a cool new backpack to house my MBP when it finally does ship. I'm about ready to jump out of my skin I'm so excited.:D


Kudos to those optimists, nothing wrong with that. There's nothing really wrong with irrationality in the forum either. ;)

ryanx27
Aug 27, 2006, 10:30 PM
Hey for what its worth, i understand where you're coming from Zadillo BUT some people still find the joke funny and therefore it deserves to be told.

You know what, I found it funny before going into this thread, and now I don't. :rolleyes:

ryanx27
Aug 27, 2006, 10:32 PM
I like them as well, but I think it's been replaced with Merom next tuesday, G6 Video iPod next next tuesday and the good old iPhone next tuesday rumors.

Still good for a laugh ;)


Hahaha, "iPhone" is a one-word punchline

meanmusic
Aug 27, 2006, 10:33 PM
Core 2 Duo is here. Looks like Toshiba is first out of the gate with Core 2 Duo laptops:

http://www.toshibadirect.com:80/td/b2c/pdet.to?poid=347885&coid=-30600&seg=HHO

ergle2
Aug 27, 2006, 10:36 PM
Do you mean Vista Premium compliance? I'm pretty sure I've seen "Ready for Vista" stickers on plenty of current notebooks featuring GMA950 graphics, for example.

And btw, I have to say "good job" to Apple for doing whatever was necessary to avoid having to put a bunch of goofy decals on their computers. The most amazing thing to me is the number of PC notebook users that leave all those stickers on (I've even seen some people leave the "features" stickers on).

Looks like GMA950 is "good enough" for the Premium sticker. From what I'd read from Intel, it sounded like you needed X3000 if you wanted better than the "Compliance" sticker, but I guess Intel want to sell newer, more expensive chipsets ;)

Still, based on what I've read about it thus far, if I had to have one, I'd rather have GMA950. Tho' right now I lean towards not buying anything that lacks discrete graphics.

As for stickers... I don't really care, to be honest. They just peel off anyway. Probably a win for Apple purely because the lack of them looks much "cleaner" for the demo models in the store, and I doubt the majority of people take any notice of them. Most won't even know what they mean, I suspect.

tekmoe
Aug 27, 2006, 11:00 PM
Core 2 Duo is here. Looks like Toshiba is first out of the gate with Core 2 Duo laptops:

http://www.toshibadirect.com:80/td/b2c/pdet.to?poid=347885&coid=-30600&seg=HHO

wish apple would pony up and do a 1920x1200 like that toshiba...

Multimedia
Aug 27, 2006, 11:33 PM
Core 2 Duo is here. Looks like Toshiba is first out of the gate with Core 2 Duo laptops:Toshiba Qosmio G35-AV660 - AVPC Laptop (http://www.toshibadirect.com:80/td/b2c/pdet.to?poid=347885&coid=-30600&seg=HHO)

Wow! And only $3499 :rolleyes: I think a lot of us here would have a problem with the 10.1 pounds part. I agree the 17" 1920 x 1200 would be wonderful. I like all the features - esp if we could have an HD-DVD SuperMultiDrive and dual HDs. But the battery life of 2.5 hours leaves a lot to be desired. I guess you can't have it all without losing something in the process - like reasonable weight, battery life and price. :p

Chundles
Aug 27, 2006, 11:42 PM
I don't think we're going to see Merom in the MacBook Pros tomorrow. Of course, I'm HOPEING. If they were annouced tomorrow, it would make not only my day, but my month! I've been waiting since June and was expecing it at WWDC. So I'm keeping my fingers crosses 100%. If the're annouced tomorrow, I'm going to order it withen the first 5 minuts of me finding out.

Hopefully this will be my order.
15" MacBook Pro
2.33GHz
2GB Ram
256MB VRAM
Superdrive

+BT Mighty Mouse (x2)
BT Keyboard
Some sort of bag for the MBP
D-Link USB Bluetooth drive

*Crosses fingers*

Why are you buying the DLink Bluetooth thingy?