Apple To Host September 25th Special Event (Photokina)

[Erasmus]

What is it with some of you guys? Does hope spring eternal, or what!

Apple could be at a medical convention to promote the new artificial Apple iHeart and some of you would be jumping up and down screaming: "Yahoo, this means MBP updates".

17" MBP came out at NAB didn't it? Wasn't that also a photography convention?

[Erasmus]

Me too, when I said iMac would never get a Conroe chip. :D

Considering your use of the word 'never', you will 'never' be able to use this prediction as proof of your accuracy in your future predictions. The use of 'Rev A Core 2 Duo iMacs' would have been far more appropriate. I find the concept that iMacs will 'never' have Conroe chips very hard to believe. Forever is a long time for a prediction of the future to hold true.

[Cowinacape]

Exscuse the ignorance here, but.... is Aperture set to be Apples answer to Photo Shop? it has been a few years since I used PS, and have not kept up to date at all since then. Just curious.

[Westside guy]

Would it?
How is it different than using a Wacon Tablet?
Would seem like there would be a lot more control. But maybe I am wrong. Still would love to try it.

Hmm... you know, I still think I was right in what I said - but I must admit I wasn't considering things like Wacom tablets at all.

When I've seen Tablet PCs used "on the go", the software interfaces being used always appear to have been designed as if the effective screen resolution was about 80x120 (just ballparking it for effect) - when you're walking around, you just can't be very accurate with the stylus at all.

Now if you used it like a graphics tablet, I'd think you could get comparable resolution. But that would mean using it on a table, and to my mind would defeat the purpose of having all that expense related to a tablet design.

[p0intblank]

Exscuse the ignorance here, but.... is Aperture set to be Apples answer to Photo Shop? it has been a few years since I used PS, and have not kept up to date at all since then. Just curious.

Definitely not. Photoshop and Aperture are both used for entirely different reasons. They're alike when it comes to editing/enhancing photos, but the rest is totally different.

[MacinDoc]

I think we'll see the New C2D MacBook's appear on the Apple.com homepage on the 19th, and the following Monday at the event, Apple will announce the New MacBook Pro's with the MacBook style keyboard, and the magnetic latch. As the MacBook Pro is wider, it will get very light magnets at either end of the displays too, to hold it neatly shut.

I can just imagine the uproar if Apple introduces C2D MacBooks before C2D MacBook Pros. If that happens, I'm staying well away from Macrumors until after the 25th to avoid the falling debris and collateral damage.

We'll also be introduced to the new Cinema Displays. I think they'll be lighter and thinner with built-in iSights and IR sensors, and optionally the Apple remote. Steve will also add that there is one more thing. A thing that was the most requested feature for the next Gen Cinema Displays, and that will be iMac-esque hidden speakers.

Size? We'll see 20", 24" and 32".
At first, I expected this, as well, but now I have a small grain of doubt in my mind about updated displays. Initially, I had thought that the new iMacs displays were brighter and had more contrast than the Cinema Displays, but I subsequently discovered that the specs for the iMac 24" monitor were identical to those of the 23" Cinema Display, with the exception of the 1" size difference. On the other hand, the price drop does suggest an attempt to clear inventory, and the Cinema Displays have frequently had better specs than the iMac displays (they are the pro models, after all). I guess I would have to list new Cinema Displays as a "probable" for release in the next month, and this pre-Photokina event would be as good a time as any to introduce them.

[Warbrain]

Well, now that we know it's not so much of a special event, I bet it's just an Aperture update. Nothing more.

[Shagrat]

one of the best predictions i have heard to date...

Since a prediction is, per se, prior to the event, temporally speaking, the best prediction, by definition is the most accurate, ie closest to what actually turns out to be the case.

Since it ain't happened yet, you cannot say the "best" prediction! Only that it accords most with want you want to see announced.

(Welcome to Pedant's Corner!

[robotx21]

This is what I predict you will be able to order for the 17" Macbook Pro, which I want:

- 1920X1200 Display
- 2GB Ram (Maybe up to 3 or 4gb if lucky!)
- 160GB 5400 RPM HD or 100GB 7200RPM HD
- ATI X1800 or the Nvidia 7600 GT 256mb Video Card
- 8X Dual Layer DVD Burner (OR Blue-Ray DVD burner, highly unlikely though)

~ $3000 - $3200 (for totally spec'd out computer) other wise base price would stay the same (or $100 cheaper would be nice :-D)

[phatspider]

A camera isnt only about MP. The weakest link of the camera in phones is the optics. You just cant get good pics from a camera phone due to the limited formfactor, even if you had 3200 MP.
So yes, in a foreseeable furture, the cameras in phones are crap.

I agree

Check out the N93 - despite needing a crane to carry it around, the pic quality is comparable to a 3mp camera.

[B. Hunter]

I don't think Apple will release a co-branded camera or anything else like that, but you never know.
Leave that to companies that are good at it like Canon or Nikon.

There is already >iMovie >FCP Express and >FCP.
What about something to fill the void between >iPhoto ??and?? >Aperture?

I know, people will say "there is Photoshop Elements and Photoshop."

Perhaps Apple has a new photo software or hardware in the works that is different from what we have already seen?

[Shagrat]

starting to think that maybe there WILL be a new piece of software that leverages all the Core video/imaging software in the OS and could either be a plug-in to Aperture (which would avoid the "Photoshop killer" tag that has been bandied around for ages!) or maybe as a seperate app to complement Aperture. Dunno, either might make sense, but this is based merely on my wishes, rather than specific news/rumours.

Has to be said that opening up an app to a plug-in architecture makes sense, look what there is available for P'shop, Quark, etc!

[Links]

17" MBP came out at NAB didn't it? Wasn't that also a photography convention?
No.
NAB = National Association of Broadcasters

http://www.nabshow.com/highlights.asp

"NAB2006, The World’s Largest Electronic Media Show, covers the entire spectrum of media from entertainment, to news, to business communications. Starting with an exhibit floor brimming with more technology innovations than you could possibly imagine, NAB2006 features world-class educational conferences, packed with electrifying keynote addresses, panel discussions, training sessions and presentations that will help you thrive in today's ever-evolving media landscape."

[Links]

deleted duplicate post

[MacinDoc]

Well, now that we know it's not so much of a special event, I bet it's just an Aperture update. Nothing more.
Umm...how do we know that it's not so much of a special event?

[Machead III]

Hmm, I wonder if I should cancel my MacBook order and wait for an update?

Is it unlikely the MB will see an update?

[MacinDoc]

Hmm, I wonder if I should cancel my MacBook order and wait for an update?

Is it unlikely the MB will see an update?
With C2D laptops now shipping, and C2D chips priced the same as their CD counterparts, the MacBook will get C2D as soon as the current inventory of CD chips is used up...

[Machead III]

Judging by the shpping forcasts I'd have thought they'd run out of CDs already. The bloody thing I ordered won't ship until the 22nd, and even now, over 48 hours after I ordered, I haven't had order confirmation :confused:

So close to cancelling, but others are saying that there'll be no MacBook updates until late this year. I don't want to wait longer than October 1st, as I lose big discounts I have.

EDIT: Order cancelled.

[Erasmus]

No.
NAB = National Association of Broadcasters

http://www.nabshow.com/highlights.asp

"NAB2006, The World’s Largest Electronic Media Show, covers the entire spectrum of media from entertainment, to news, to business communications. Starting with an exhibit floor brimming with more technology innovations than you could possibly imagine, NAB2006 features world-class educational conferences, packed with electrifying keynote addresses, panel discussions, training sessions and presentations that will help you thrive in today's ever-evolving media landscape."

Mip. Close enough. Broadcasting, Photography, it's all the same. Still think Merom MBP's either next week, at the keynote thing, or that week. Surely no later.

[Machead III]

The current MacBook has only been out a couple of weeks less than the current MBP. Surely the updates would come together?

There are craploads of consumer laptops with C2D shipping already, so why would Apple delay? There's a good distinction between Pro and consumer now, when both are on the same chip, so why wouldn't there be if they bumped them both up?

tbh, the current MacBook line either needs a significant price cut or C2D updates to remain competative now the back-to-school frenzy is over.

[Cowinacape]

Definitely not. Photoshop and Aperture are both used for entirely different reasons. They're alike when it comes to editing/enhancing photos, but the rest is totally different.

Thanks!

[coal]

I'm not expecting much, but as nearly everything has been updated, like others, I cannot imagine Apple leaving their Pro notebooks lacking any longer.

I'm also trying to temper my hope though, but I'm in the market as my current notebook is already spoken for and classes for the new term start very soon.

[Bobthemonkey]

I agree

Check out the N93 - despite needing a crane to carry it around, the pic quality is comparable to a 3mp camera.


or the Sony Ericsson K800i 3.2mp, and suprisingly decent pic quality - its been developed with the Sony Cybershot team, so it brings tech from a proper digital camera line

[MacSA]

The current MacBook has only been out a couple of weeks less than the current MBP. Surely the updates would come together?

There are craploads of consumer laptops with C2D shipping already, so why would Apple delay? There's a good distinction between Pro and consumer now, when both are on the same chip, so why wouldn't there be if they bumped them both up?

tbh, the current MacBook line either needs a significant price cut or C2D updates to remain competative now the back-to-school frenzy is over.

Weren't the prices of those Core Duo (Yonah) chips supposed to drop significantly after Core 2 appeared?

[SPUY767]

How can you be so sure?

You are a photographer yourself, and you use a laptop as you travel correct?

Maybe Apple just want to be present, demoing Aperture running on the MacBook Pro's, in the hope of converting a few more Windows photographers.

Maybe they won't make a fan fare and just be there to demo the MacBook Pro with Core 2 Duo running Aperture.

Rich.


Back down rich, I've already tried throwing logic at him, he simply refuses to get off his soapbox. When backed into a corner, moderators can be extremely dangerous.

[SPUY767]

Mac Pro is not a gaming machine. The memory kills it. It is a server/workstation class designed to worked on large pieces of data.
Gaming is very different and can not use slow memory, it needs to be snappy. Apple does need to make the Gamer machine but it does not have to be as big as the Mac Pro. Kensfield is a real possibility in that system, and yes it is coming in my opinion. Not so much for us but for selling to Wintel users and potential switchers.


This is off topic, but that's funny, cause My MacPro outpaces my Dual Core PD and my PD uses DDR2 @ 800 Mhz. And has a better graphics card.

[MacinDoc]

Weren't the prices of those Core Duo (Yonah) chips supposed to drop significantly after Core 2 appeared?
They didn't (but the most recent price list seems to have been removed from Intel's website, so maybe this is going to change).

[shecky]

Back down rich, I've already tried throwing logic at him, he simply refuses to get off his soapbox. When backed into a corner, moderators can be extremely dangerous.

QFT*

[mi5moav]

I still think that Apple has a major chance in the videorecorder/camcorder arena. Everything seems to be headed to HD drives and there are but a few players out there. With integration into imovie or whatever they come out next this is going to help a lot of newbies into the arena. I know so many people that still won't use a camcorder or can't figure it out. But with itv coming it's going to be a wonderful thing. I hope they come out with a 699 and 999 pricepoint on a new HD video camera with 30G and 80G HDs. I will be a buyer... I need something besides ipods already, I want to go see the world!!!!!

Apple has probably sold at least 4 million cameras (isights) and macs with isights so, they now a few things about optics and they are still the leader in digital imaging.

ipod-->Itunes----itv PODCASTS

quicktake HD--->imovie--->itv YOUTUBE

[iGary]

Back down rich, I've already tried throwing logic at him, he simply refuses to get off his soapbox. When backed into a corner, moderators can be extremely dangerous.

Since when am I a moderator? :confused:

[AlBDamned]

I agree

Check out the N93 - despite needing a crane to carry it around, the pic quality is comparable to a 3mp camera.

I'd have to disagree there. I bought an N93 last week and sent it back two days later for three reasons:

1. Build quality was appalling
2. Screen was loose
3. Video recorder quality was superb but still shots were marginally better than my 2MP W800i.

I was hugely disappointed with that phone - especially as I put down close to £500 for it. Back to the trusty sony-ericsson I go. :rolleyes:

[Unspeaked]

The current MacBook has only been out a couple of weeks less than the current MBP.

More like 3 months.

(Unless you count the very minor processor bump...)

[apachie2k]

no 1 mentioned the new...802.11n !!!!!!! :D in the new mbp's that are GOING to be released at photokina!!!

[Klut]

Both MacBook and MBP will get merom very soon.. Apple needs to keep their laptops good compared to other pc's...

And for the "MacBook won't get Merom, cause then it will be too good" theory...
Apple are "competing" with other companies, not with themselfs...

(sorry if there are spelling-mistakes)

[syklee26]

Both MacBook and MBP will get merom very soon.. Apple needs to keep their laptops good compared to other pc's...

And for the "MacBook won't get Merom, cause then it will be too good" theory...
Apple are "competing" with other companies, not with themselfs...

(sorry if there are spelling-mistakes)

if Apple is indeed competing with others, they DON'T have to put merom in MacBooks. every computer makers have high end and low end computers. Macbook is low end and MBPs are high end. high end computers see faster processors.

i don't see any compelling reason for Apple to stretch the seriously scarce supply of merom to put that in Macbooks when they can put meroms in MBP to hit higher margins

[Reach]

If it is indeed a simple drop-in they could make it available as a slightly expensive BTO on the Macbooks too, as far as I know, that's what the other manufacturers do. :)

[Klut]

Why should they not put the Core 2 Duo in the MacBooks?
MB and MBP have had the same processor so far, so did Powerbook and iBook, it's just a matter of how many Ghz and other specs to make the low end - high end diffrence...

[undead-design]

Both MacBook and MBP will get merom very soon.. Apple needs to keep their laptops good compared to other pc's...

And for the "MacBook won't get Merom, cause then it will be too good" theory...
Apple are "competing" with other companies, not with themselfs...

(sorry if there are spelling-mistakes)


I understand your point and I think it is logical that Apple isn't competing with itself...but you have to remember that the Macbook Pro is their top of the line notebook. I think personally there should be a gap between the two. The MB is the introductory line/standard user notebook. The MBP is their "power" user (if no one minds i say that) laptop in line with the Mac Pro as where the MB is in line with the iMac. I mean, I can be wrong, but Apple has had their computers in a hierarchy for years.

As for them releasing something special at the show, I think it is completely possible. A camera...not very likely. Aperature 2.0, absolutely likely. A new design for the MBP, I can only hope so. At least an upgrade to C2D for the MBP. Thats what I want to see. :D

[itodd]

i think macbooks will get core 2 duo. i base this on the fact that as of this morning, my sep 5th order for a blackbook has been pushed back to the 26th. coincidence?

MA472LL/A, MB 13/2.0/2X256/80/SD:BLACK-USA
will now ship by Sep 26, 2006
and deliver by Sep 29, 2006

todd

[Josias]

The MBP would be great... but I really doubt all of those changes. Even with CPU, HDD, and RAM bumps only... I think the price points stay unchanged - Apple has a history of doing that. It would be nice if I'm wrong, though;)

Consider that Merom is cheaper. X1600's has also become cheaper. As has RAM. I can only pray.:p

And yes, apachie2k, I mentioned 802.11n here (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=2836900#post2836900).;)

[BRLawyer]

Consider that Merom is cheaper. X1600's has also become cheaper. As has RAM. I can only pray.:p

And yes, apachie2k, I mentioned 802.11n here (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=2836900#post2836900).;)

Sorry, MBPs are NOT gonna happen at that event...NO WAY. It's only about Aperture 2.0 and nothing else.

[shecky]

Sorry, MBPs are NOT gonna happen at that event...NO WAY. It's only about Aperture 2.0 and nothing else.

why not?

[BRLawyer]

why not?

Because it's not the right venue...the invitation is clear, and refers to Aperture...nothing else.

[Timothy Flint]

No Macs, no iPods, no new products at all. It's like this.

1. The invitiation shows the cover of the Aperture box. So guess what? It's about Aperture.
2. Apple will be showing at Photokina. So will Adobe.
3. Months ago Adobe started letting users work with Adobe Lightroom beta - for free, but only until the retail version is released AT PHOTOKINA!!!.
4. If you have Lightroom on your computer it will shut down unless you buy the retail version at a special Photokina introductory price. This is fact. It was announced months ago.
5. The special Apple announcement will be that Aperture will meet that price for Lightroom beta users.

No iCamera, iPhone, iShip, iPlane, iRocket or iHummer. Buy Aperture instead of Lightroom. That's it.

[Horst]

Because it's not the right venue...the invitation is clear, and refers to Aperture...nothing else.


Hmm, I don't know,.... Photokina is the most important event worldwide for professional photography and related businesses, if not the only one.
Pro-books an Mac Pros are what this fairly big clientele uses.

Aperture is just another image browser, not important enough really to justify Job's presence there.

[Tommy Wasabi]

No Macs, no iPods, no new products at all. It's like this.

1. The invitiation shows the cover of the Aperture box. So guess what? It's about Aperture.
2. Apple will be showing at Photokina. So will Adobe.
3. Months ago Adobe started letting users work with Adobe Lightroom beta - for free, but only until the retail version is released AT PHOTOKINA!!!.
4. If you have Lightroom on your computer it will shut down unless you buy the retail version at a special Photokina introductory price. This is fact. It was announced months ago.
5. The special Apple announcement will be that Aperture will meet that price for Lightroom beta users.

No iCamera, iPhone, iShip, iPlane, iRocket or iHummer. Buy Aperture instead of Lightroom. That's it.

Holy Crap Batman - if this is true - it is really a waste.

I counter this frigtard's statement by stating the follow.

He's right about everything BUT the hardware.

He will introduce the new MBP - and MAYBE - the new ACD's (color editing) and if we are lucky, 802.11n.

Mark MY words - it will be more than just software - it will also be about hardware.

One additional rumor is that Adobe may introduce CS3 at this event

[pmbooks]

Hmm, I don't know,.... Photokina is the most important event worldwide for professional photography and related businesses, if not the only one.
Pro-books an Mac Pros are what this fairly big clientele uses.

Aperture is just another image browser, not important enough really to justify Job's presence there.

Hitting the nail on the head!

[JAT]

Surprised I didn't see 2 possible products among the wealth of predictions and arguing in this thread:

1) Aperture for Windows.
2) Something like this, not far from an iPod: Photo storage/viewer (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=405500&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation)

[JAT]

Aperture is just another image browser, not important enough really to justify Job's presence there.
Not in his mind.

[Josias]

Surprised I didn't see 2 possible products among the wealth of predictions and arguing in this thread:

1) Aperture for Windows.
2) Something like this, not far from an iPod: Photo storage/viewer (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=405500&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation)

Why would anyone even consider that?

They don't have iLife, iWork, Logic Express, Logic Pro, Final Cut Studio, Final Cut Pro or anything else for Windows.

Only things Apple makes for Windows is Quicktime and iTunes.:rolleyes:

To the "there will be no MBP guys": I am seriously willing ot bet. If they release an MBP, you buy me the high end 15" MBP maxed out. If they do not, I'll buy you a loaded 24" iMac?:) What say ye?

[shecky]

Because it's not the right venue...the invitation is clear, and refers to Aperture...nothing else.

i think that is flawed logic. i have never seen an apple "special event" invite refer to every single thing that was announced at said event. usually its based around a notable product which is the primary reason for the event, and other stuff gets announced as well. like a main dish + sides. i would only expect a C2D MBP to be a "side dish" at this event, personally.

[gugy]

i think that is flawed logic. i have never seen an apple "special event" invite refer to every single thing that was announced at said event. usually its based around a notable product which is the primary reason for the event, and other stuff gets announced as well. like a main dish + sides. i would only expect a C2D MBP to be a "side dish" at this event, personally.


I agree as long as the "side" product announce is a relate to photography.
I doubt the MBP is that product. Even though you can argue photographers use it.
The "Showtime" event had announcements of products that were all relate to music and movies/video.
That's why I feel skeptical of other things not close to photography.

[shecky]

I agree as long as the "side" product announce is a relate to photography.
I doubt the MBP is that product. Even though you can argue photographers use it.

i totally agree that when someone says "MBP" i don't immediately think "Photography!" but i think it is within the realm of possibility as lots of photo pro's use the MBP, especially in studio settings (i work with one who does exactly that - tethers the camera to Capture One on his MBP so he can move it around the studio easily; then goes for precise color correction on a desktop + Eizo monitor), hence why i do not think it would be out of place here.

i hope so anyway :)

[prady16]

My Logic as to why Apple has delayed the release of the C2D MBPs.

Maybe Apple has deliberately postponed the release of C2D MBPs until the day before photokina because the new C2D MBPs would have more 'Pro' features than the current one. At present, i personally feel that there is little technical difference between a MacBook and a MacBook Pro to warrant such a huge price difference. So maybe Apple has added some newer and more advanced features for the pro users to justify the considerably higher proce tag compared to the MacBook. And Apple wants to announce these new Pro features at a conference for the Pro's like Photokina rather than at an event where they primarily wanted to focus on the entertainment industry!

Makes sense?

[gugy]

i totally agree that when someone says "MBP" i don't immediately think "Photography!" but i think it is within the realm of possibility as lots of photo pro's use the MBP, especially in studio settings (i work with one who does exactly that - tethers the camera to Capture One on his MBP so he can move it around the studio easily; then goes for precise color correction on a desktop + Eizo monitor), hence why i do not think it would be out of place here.

i hope so anyway :)

I look at the way the Imac 24" was announced. It was a new size and somewhat new product and it was only update on a regular Tuesday(Wednesday) without much fanfare.
That's why I think the MBP will be release on a Tuesday as well. Unless there is a major cosmetic change to it. Then it deserves a special event.
Otherwise, I think the Event at Photokina will be centered on photography.
Apple wants to keep the focus on that so too many things happening seems unlikely.

My 2 cents.

[BRLawyer]

Hmm, I don't know,.... Photokina is the most important event worldwide for professional photography and related businesses, if not the only one.
Pro-books an Mac Pros are what this fairly big clientele uses.

Aperture is just another image browser, not important enough really to justify Job's presence there.

But SJ will not be there...

[notjustjay]

So, 300+ messages and so far what we have is...

"Apple's going to release the new MacBook Pros!"

"No they're not!"

"Yes they are!"

"No they're not!"

...

:rolleyes:

[jwdsail]

Well, if we're going to start wild speculation,guessing and hoping ;-)

I say we'll see the resurection of Apple QuickTime VR Authoring Studio.. Either as a stand alone product, or built into Apeture 2.0.

;-)


I hope..

jwd

[Reach]

Yea, too many people itching for the MBP now, no matter what Apple does at this point it becomes a MBP-issue.
And I'm one of them, can't wait to order one, obviously I sol my old PowerBook too soon, as I've been without a laptop for a little too long already now..

[lessthandmb]

Wait.... is Jobs going to be at this event or not? If he's not MBPs are coming this upcoming week or not until october. They're not going to release an all new MBP at this event.

[mi5moav]

I would bet my left testicle that 18th or 19th they will release new MBPs. The news media doesn't care to much for incremental powerbook or imac launches, same reason Apple released imac 2 weeks ago then opened her up for the new ipod and itunes announcement. Same thing starting next week. MBP on monday or tuesday and the new Quicktake HD video camera on the 24th at Photokina. DUH can it get any simpler to figure out what's going on??

[BRLawyer]

i think that is flawed logic. i have never seen an apple "special event" invite refer to every single thing that was announced at said event. usually its based around a notable product which is the primary reason for the event, and other stuff gets announced as well. like a main dish + sides. i would only expect a C2D MBP to be a "side dish" at this event, personally.

New MBPs as a side dish to a single, irrelevant software product? Not a chance. C2D MBP and MBs only by Macworld 2007...

[BRLawyer]

Well, if we're going to start wild speculation,guessing and hoping ;-)

I say we'll see the resurection of Apple QuickTime VR Authoring Studio.. Either as a stand alone product, or built into Apeture 2.0.

;-)


I hope..

jwd

Hehe, worse than that only QuickTime 3D AND Cyberdog... ;)

[mcstewart37]

"Yes they are!"

Um operating under the same "the invitation shows the only things that are released at special events" logic:

The recent event, for which the invitation featured spotlights and the words "its showtime" would only relate to movies and not iPods or the iTV that were also announced.

The February 28, 2006 event, for which the invitation featured the iCal icon and the words "fun new products" would only relate to calendars or maybe games? Not the iPod HiFi or Mac Mini update.

Or the October 12, 2005 special event, for which the invitation featured closed curtains and the words "one more thing..." which would only relate to movies? Not the iMac or the iPod video that actually showed up

The only invitation that was direct to the point was the september 2005 special event for the ipod nano, which featured the line "1000 songs in your pocket changed everything, here we go again"...

My point is the invitations are intentionally vague.

[BRLawyer]

"Yes they are!"

Um operating under the same "the invitation shows the only things that are released at special events" logic:

The recent event, for which the invitation featured spotlights and the words "its showtime" would only relate to movies and not iPods or the iTV that were also announced.

The February 28, 2006 event, for which the invitation featured the iCal icon and the words "fun new products" would only relate to calendars or maybe games? Not the iPod HiFi or Mac Mini update.

Or the October 12, 2005 special event, for which the invitation featured closed curtains and the words "one more thing..." which would only relate to movies? Not the iMac or the iPod video that actually showed up

The only invitation that was direct to the point was the september 2005 special event for the ipod nano, which featured the line "1000 songs in your pocket changed everything, here we go again"...

My point is the invitations are intentionally vague.

So repeat with Fox Mulder..."I want to believe"...:rolleyes:

[Unspeaked]

Why should they not put the Core 2 Duo in the MacBooks?
MB and MBP have had the same processor so far, so did Powerbook and iBook, it's just a matter of how many Ghz and other specs to make the low end - high end diffrence...

No, the iBooks and Powerbooks were both G3 for only a very small length of time. The Powerbook line moved to G4 rather quickly, and it took AGES for the iBook to get a G4 processor...

And the only reason the Powerbook wasn't moved to a G5 then is because it was practically impossible to get it in the form factor.

Then:

EVERYONE was waiting for Powerbook G5s - NO ONE was expecting iBook G5s.

Now:

MOST PEOPLE are waiting for C2D MacBook Pros - PEOPLE WHO HAVEN'T THOUGHT ABOUT IT VERY LONG are expecting C2D MacBooks.


:)

[robotx21]

I went looking on brenthaven for cases and came accross this:

http://www.brenthaven.com/catalog-shoulder-cases.html

All of the premium core cases are pretty much out of stock or pre-order for after september 26th. Also, if you look at the pro 12/15, there are two of them. The one that is out of stock is a little fatter in terms of depth, so does this also mean a fatter macbook pro? (possibly for DVD dual layer OR blu-ray?)

[Jheaden]

Just to get in the spirit of things I thought I'd make my own prediction...

9/19 - New MacBooks
9/25 - Apeture 2.0, New MacBook Pro's, and maybe just maybe an update to the cinema displays

I mean think about. We're already frothing at the mouth for the MBPs so what better way to push everyone to new frenzied heights :p

Besides that if you think about it, they've already updated most of their hardware line

[shecky]

New MBPs as a side dish to a single, irrelevant software product? Not a chance. C2D MBP and MBs only by Macworld 2007...

in what world are MBP's irrelevant to Aperture? or vice versa? that are totally relevant for reasons i mentioned above.

edit: or are you saying that a C2D MBP is a main course kind of product as opposed to a side dish?

[kresh]

Apple already has a black eye over the heat issues with the MBP.

Mine, after an hour of heavy use, feels like it's a half a degree from melting into a pool of slag. I can't imagine what the C2D would do to it. The C2D has a 9.6% increase in watts which means more heat. I am convinced that there is not enough engineered cooling for the 31W Core Duo, much less the 34W Core 2 Duo.

I suspect the delay is a heat issue.

[mazola]

Q. What's a 100% expected feature in a cell phone these days?

A. A built in camera.

Q2. What's this special event a part of?

A. Photokina

therefore, Photokina == iPhone

QED.

[Molnies]

3. Months ago Adobe started letting users work with Adobe Lightroom beta - for free, but only until the retail version is released AT PHOTOKINA!!!.
4. If you have Lightroom on your computer it will shut down unless you buy the retail version at a special Photokina introductory price. This is fact. It was announced months ago.
5. The special Apple announcement will be that Aperture will meet that price for Lightroom beta users.

Uhm, what are you talking about?
Taken from Lightroom's website:
Download now before the Lightroom beta 3 build expires January 30, 2007.

I highly doubt that Adobe will have the beta software downloadable for 4½ more month, if it's like you're saying (that it won't run unless you buy it)

[Klut]

MOST PEOPLE are waiting for C2D MacBook Pros - PEOPLE WHO HAVEN'T THOUGHT ABOUT IT VERY LONG are expecting C2D MacBooks.


:)


Smart a$$...

I don't really care about this event, I'm just waiting for the MacBook with Core 2 Duo, I hope it'll be out before 2007, as I've finaly got the money and need a laptop before Christmas... It's either a MacBook with Core 2 Duo or a Pc laptop for me...

[undead-design]

Just something else from my thoughts. I saw above that people are saying that Photographers use Macbook Pro's, I second that. I actually do not know a single photographer that actually uses Windows for digital photography editing (not saying that I know thousands or anything), and anyone that did before Aperture came out has already switched over. I personally see this as a great time for them to release even at least just a processor update for the MBP. But with Apple's lack of announcements on upgrading the processors while every other notebook PC company has leads me to believe that Apple will make sure it's worth it and make a clear difference between the MB and the MBP. So a brand new MBP and Aperture 2.0 (or whatever) would be the holy grail to any photographer not already convinced that Apple is the clear choice for digital imaging.

It just seems likely, even if its wishful thinking.

[CalfCanuck]

Surprised I didn't see 2 possible products among the wealth of predictions and arguing in this thread:

1) Aperture for Windows.
2) Something like this, not far from an iPod: Photo storage/viewer (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=405500&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation)
Aperture for Windows will NEVER happen - where is FCP for Windows? THe Pro apps exist to sell Macs.

But I've been posting about a new, larger 640 x 480 next generation iPod here for over 3 weeks, which I also think is quite likely.

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=2760148#post2760148

But my second post from yesterday says it better:
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=2838760#post2838760

I think this is likely. The upgrade to 640 x 480 iTunes video downloads has to be exploited by SOME iPod. Someone trashed this second post, saying "well, it plays on my 5G iPod so you are full of it", but why would Apple take up more of the existing iPod's HD space merely to "downsize" the video at runtime. There MUST be a new larger size video/photo iPod that exploits this video in the works.

Of course I have the Epson P-4000 you linked to, but I think it is too specialized for general use. But done right, this could be VERY sweet and meet several different markets (photographers like at Photokina, video playback for travellers on planes or kids in the back seat of cars, etc).

[exactjack]

curious about that myself. historically, have there been "special events" like this without a stevenote? (or a philnote, for that matter)

i think that just aperture would not justify a stevenote, but more than just aperture might (tho aperture would be the primary subject)

Yep. April 2004 NAB in Las Vegas. No Steve in the building, but his subordinates handily launched Motion, FCP Pro HD, DVD Stidio Pro HD, Shake v3.5, and Xsan. All software. All related to the theme of the convention. I expect the same at this special event prior to Photokina... all software, and no Steve.

I frankly wouldn't be surprised to see a direct competitor, with a unique Apple twist, to Photoshop launched out of the blue here... It would complete Apple's photo related app lineup, get a major Universal Binary omission fixed, and create more buzz than a herd of high-revving chain saws in the industry. And, if it's a strong app (as no doubt it will be from Apple), it will be amazing to see the growing flow of photo pros abandoning Photoshop in the years ahead.

[sth]

Q. What's a 100% expected feature in a cell phone these days?
A. A built in camera.
Q2. What's this special event a part of?
A. Photokina
therefore, Photokina == iPhone
QED.
Unless it features a miniaturized SLR camera (which it won't) Photokina is the wrong event for that.

Mobile phone cams have advanced quickly but so did professional digital cameras. Photokina is primarily aimed at professional and semi-professional users.



My predictions:

- Apple will update MBPs pretty soon.
- MacBooks and Minis will use Core Duo a bit longer but may get updated later this year.
- MacWorld Expo in Q1 next year will feature the 6th-gen iPod, iTV (whatever it is called then), the iPhone, iLife and iWork '07 and of course Leopard (pretty much for one event if you ask me, even without new Mac Hardware).

[gugy]

I frankly wouldn't be surprised to see a direct competitor, with a unique Apple twist, to Photoshop launched out of the blue here... It would complete Apple's photo related app lineup, get a major Universal Binary omission fixed, and create more buzz than a herd of high-revving chain saws in the industry. And, if it's a strong app (as no doubt it will be from Apple), it will be amazing to see the growing flow of photo pros abandoning Photoshop in the years ahead.

well, that will be a hard thing to happen.
I like competition, but I have to say Photoshop user base is huge plus is a awesome program.
Apple to surpass all of this on version 1.0 seems like a huge task.
I know the FCP story, but that was a different circumstances. Premiere was not that popular. As for Photoshop that's a whole different ballgame.

I don't know, I rather see Apple focusing on apps that need better improvement. The Adobe trio Photoshop, Illustrator and After Effects seems very strong to beat.

[exactjack]

well, that will be a hard thing to happen.
I like competition, but I have to say Photoshop user base is huge plus is a awesome program.
Apple to surpass all of this on version 1.0 seems like a huge task.
I know the FCP story, but that was a different circumstances. Premiere was not that popular. As for Photoshop that's a whole different ballgame.

I don't know, I rather see Apple focusing on apps that need better improvement. The Adobe trio Photoshop, Illustrator and After Effects seems very strong to beat.

Funny, but my gut's telling me that Apple's penchant for coming at old problems from an entirely fresh perspective might result in a surprisingly strong contender for the new standard in photo editing software. Photoshop's a multiply-extended iteration of a 16-year old paradigm. I betcha if Apple's had a ongoing project running for a few years aimed at a next-gen approach, the resulting app could be pretty mind-boggling.

[Reach]

Photoshop is beatable, it just seems unbeatable beacuse it's all most of us know. Just get colorhandling down 100% and work from there, Apple has some great ideas that could surpass an ancient application with incremental updating.
I don't really think it'll happen now, but I do think it COULD happen, of course Apple won't do it in version 1.0, nobody could, but it could be doable.

Anyway, I just want my MBP for now. :)

[gugy]

I understand what you guys are saying but I have to say I have a huge reservation seeing Apple fighting against Adobe.
Photoshop plus other apps from Adobe are very well integrate with each other providing a very good workflow. If Apple decides to compete with Photoshop that could bring a huge problem for the whole creative community that depends so much on Adobe and Apple.

•Adobe, could just say forget it about developing for the Mac and leaving us on the dust with an inferior app from Apple.
•Even if Apple provides a breakthrough app, it will take time to bring all the folks that are so loyal to Adobe into Apple apps. Including me.
• Learning curve for a new app.
• Plus a lot of other apps are so well connect with Photoshop, like I said before, after Effects, Illustrator and now Flash and the whole suite.

Just imagine Adobe giving up to develop for the Mac platform. That will be a huge disaster.

I rather have Apple focusing on make better computers and improving apps that could compete with Microsoft Office and others. IMHO leave Adobe alone.
I think Adobe is doing a good job updating and creating nice features. The whole Adobe universal apps transition delay thing is not their only fault, Apple should be blamed for that as well.

[BWhaler]

My prediction:

Definiantly:
MacBook Pro:
2 15" and 1 17" model with 2.16 and 2.33 GHz Merom
1 GB RAM standdard, up to 3 or 4 GB
100 and 120 GB HDD's, up to 160 GB
8x DVD+/-RW DL drives for all
X1600 Pro in low-end 15" and X1800 Pro/XT in hi-end 15" and 17"
FW800 on all models
Magnetic latch (no integrated keyboard)
Expresscard/54 slot on all models
$1899 - $2299 - $2499


Boy, do I hope you are right.

My 17" PowerBook is less than a year old, so I thought I could wait for the move to Intel.

I was wrong. The speed difference is just too drastic of a leap, and that's too important to a guy who uses his laptop 12-18 hours a day for work.

I am waiting for the upgrade at this point. For me, what I care about is:

- 160gig HD
- Better GPU
- No quality/heat issues.

I was hoping to have the new computer before my trip. But if it can be waiting for me when I return in a month, that's great too.

I just hope the update is announced soon with the specs I need. Knowing I will be able to buy it is a lot better than wondering if and when Apple is going to update the line.

[generik]

Q. What's a 100% expected feature in a cell phone these days?

A. A built in camera.

Q2. What's this special event a part of?

A. Photokina

therefore, Photokina == iPhone

QED.

Lol, this is so funny I don't even know how to begin. If you think a phone produces better images than a 5 year old camera, think again.

[EagerDragon]

I can just imagine the uproar if Apple introduces C2D MacBooks before C2D MacBook Pros. If that happens, I'm staying well away from Macrumors until after the 25th to avoid the falling debris and collateral damage.

At first, I expected this, as well, but now I have a small grain of doubt in my mind about updated displays. Initially, I had thought that the new iMacs displays were brighter and had more contrast than the Cinema Displays, but I subsequently discovered that the specs for the iMac 24" monitor were identical to those of the 23" Cinema Display, with the exception of the 1" size difference. On the other hand, the price drop does suggest an attempt to clear inventory, and the Cinema Displays have frequently had better specs than the iMac displays (they are the pro models, after all). I guess I would have to list new Cinema Displays as a "probable" for release in the next month, and this pre-Photokina event would be as good a time as any to introduce them.
I wear glasses (getting old) and that extra inch made the fonts very readable for me since the image was a little bigger. I loved it when I tried the 24" iMac at the store.

[generik]

Somehow I have this funny feeling that the launch of the new MBPs will coincide with 10.4.8, possible?

Wonder what changes they could have made to require such an update though :rolleyes:

[Reach]

I understand what you guys are saying but I have to say I have a huge reservation seeing Apple fighting against Adobe.
Photoshop plus other apps from Adobe are very well integrate with each other providing a very good workflow. If Apple decides to compete with Photoshop that could bring a huge problem for the whole creative community that depends so much on Adobe and Apple.

•Adobe, could just say forget it about developing for the Mac and leaving us on the dust with an inferior app from Apple.
•Even if Apple provides a breakthrough app, it will take time to bring all the folks that are so loyal to Adobe into Apple apps. Including me.
• Learning curve for a new app.
• Plus a lot of other apps are so well connect with Photoshop, like I said before, after Effects, Illustrator and now Flash and the whole suite.

Just imagine Adobe giving up to develop for the Mac platform. That will be a huge disaster.

I rather have Apple focusing on make better computers and improving apps that could compete with Microsoft Office and others. IMHO leave Adobe alone.
I think Adobe is doing a good job updating and creating nice features. The whole Adobe universal apps transition delay thing is not their only fault, Apple should be blamed for that as well.
I'm so glad you didn't have anything to do with Apples descision to destroy Premiere... Final Cut is just great, I'm very glad Apple doesn't "leave adobe alone", and examples like that show that compeition is good.
Just the possibility that Apple might enter the Photoediting-market is great, as Adobe won't just say "forget about macs" and lose a large portion of their customer base, they would have to fight. And fighting is what makes old applictions better, the need to improveto stay ahead. Photoshop has not been forced to improve the same way applications with competitors have, and I truly believe we are worse off for it.

Therefore I welcome competition, especially considering it would be from those that created Final Cut and Aperture, two great programs.

Besides, why would Apple leave Adobe alone? When Aperture was launched Adobe just got dead scared and started pushing Lightroom, that to me is an invitation to battle, and I sure hope APple accepts! :)

[bikertwin]

Photoshop is the kitchen sink: photo editor, paint program, print production program, etc.

Apple will come out with an app designed for photo editing. It may not have "painting" tools, per se. It may not do CMYK.

It would be aimed squarely at photographers. And be much easier for photographers to use.

That's what I'm hoping for, anyway.

[Erasmus]

Sorry, MBPs are NOT gonna happen at that event...NO WAY. It's only about Aperture 2.0 and nothing else.

My golly gosh! BRLawyer and I actually agree on something.

I don't think Macbooks will get Merom at this media event.

I think it is more likely we will see them in a month or too. I agree with Multimedia when he said about the time of "Thanksgiving" (Clearly I'm not American) whenever it is. Still a month or so off, isn't it?

I think Macbooks will get their Core 2 Duos before the end of November. Leaving plenty of time for Apple to design a Mini Mac Pro for its release at MWSF2007. That, I know, BRLawyer and I do disagree on. ;)

MBP however is completely different. I think there is a very good chance of Merom MBP's with nVIDIA 7300/7600's.

[Westside guy]

Photoshop is the kitchen sink: photo editor, paint program, print production program, etc.

Apple will come out with an app designed for photo editing. It may not have "painting" tools, per se. It may not do CMYK.

It would be aimed squarely at photographers. And be much easier for photographers to use.

That's what I'm hoping for, anyway.

Hey, I think you're on to something. And, going out on a limb here... I bet it'll have a name like "Aperture". :p

[Josias]

Because it's not the right venue...the invitation is clear, and refers to Aperture...nothing else.

So, the showtime event referred only to the new iCurtain and iLamps?:confused:

As well as the Feb. 28th with the iCal update (it was the Mini/Hi-fi thingy)...

Dude. Why would Apple not release an MBP before/at Photokina?

There is no way anyone would be dumb enough to hold back such a revolutionary machine longer than necessary.

[FleurDuMal]

There is no way anyone would be dumb enough to hold back such a revolutionary machine longer than necessary.

I would hardly call a speed bump of 10-15% revolutionary.

If the MBP's are updated, it'll be a silent upgrade I bet. Replacing a processor isn't really very exciting.

[BRLawyer]

My golly gosh! BRLawyer and I actually agree on something.

I don't think Macbooks will get Merom at this media event.

I think it is more likely we will see them in a month or too. I agree with Multimedia when he said about the time of "Thanksgiving" (Clearly I'm not American) whenever it is. Still a month or so off, isn't it?

I think Macbooks will get their Core 2 Duos before the end of November. Leaving plenty of time for Apple to design a Mini Mac Pro for its release at MWSF2007. That, I know, BRLawyer and I do disagree on. ;)

MBP however is completely different. I think there is a very good chance of Merom MBP's with nVIDIA 7300/7600's.

See? You should always believe lawyers... :rolleyes:

[BRLawyer]

in what world are MBP's irrelevant to Aperture? or vice versa? that are totally relevant for reasons i mentioned above.

edit: or are you saying that a C2D MBP is a main course kind of product as opposed to a side dish?

Exactly. MBPs cannot be regarded as side dish... :rolleyes:

[riciad]

I wear glasses (getting old) and that extra inch made the fonts very readable for me since the image was a little bigger. I loved it when I tried the 24" iMac at the store.
Glad to hear that. I'm just waiting until the end of the month to order a 24" iMac (financial constraints) and I was hoping it would be an ease to my aging eyes.

Even infinitesimal improvements would be a boon to me.

[BRLawyer]

Glad to hear that. I'm just waiting until the end of the month to order a 24" iMac (financial constraints) and I was hoping it would be an ease to my aging eyes.

Even infinitesimal improvements would be a boon to me.

I saw a 24" one here in Switzerland, too, in an Apple Reseller...truly amazing...i just dont know what to do with my great 17" iMac G5...:o

[bikertwin]

Hey, I think you're on to something. And, going out on a limb here... I bet it'll have a name like "Aperture". :p
LOL! :D

Nah, I was thinking more along the lines of a pixel editor, something that Aperture doesn't currently do. You know, like masks and burning & dodging & selections. That sort of thing.

[Machead III]

MacBooks?

[Josias]

I would hardly call a speed bump of 10-15% revolutionary.

If the MBP's are updated, it'll be a silent upgrade I bet. Replacing a processor isn't really very exciting.

64-bit?
Speedbump of 40-50%?
3 or 4 GB RAM option?
X1800?
Magnetic latch?
Better battery?
Better screens?
802.11n?
1 GB RAM standard?
Expresscard/54?
Lower prices?

They may do a slient announcement, but it will definiantly be noticeable.

[gugy]

I'm so glad you didn't have anything to do with Apples descision to destroy Premiere... Final Cut is just great, I'm very glad Apple doesn't "leave adobe alone", and examples like that show that compeition is good.
Just the possibility that Apple might enter the Photoediting-market is great, as Adobe won't just say "forget about macs" and lose a large portion of their customer base, they would have to fight. And fighting is what makes old applictions better, the need to improveto stay ahead. Photoshop has not been forced to improve the same way applications with competitors have, and I truly believe we are worse off for it.

Therefore I welcome competition, especially considering it would be from those that created Final Cut and Aperture, two great programs.

Besides, why would Apple leave Adobe alone? When Aperture was launched Adobe just got dead scared and started pushing Lightroom, that to me is an invitation to battle, and I sure hope APple accepts! :)


you don't get it.
I welcome competition. I love FCP and Aperture.
But if Adobe drops the Mac platform because Apple decides to create a Photoshop competitor, then it better be as good as Photoshop. If not, then not just me will be whining but thousands of professionals that depend on APPLE AND ADOBE.

Premiere was lame and Adobe dropped the ball and Apple saw a great opportunity to compete specially with Avid folks.
Now, Photoshop is another ballgame.

I think Apple is great of what they did with FCP and Aperture, but look at Motion aimed to in some way be competitor to After Effects. What a joke. Motion is a good app but It can not even close match After Effects.
This is where I think it could become a problem.
I agree, it would take a lot for Adobe to abandon the Mac plataform.

I am basing all my comments above on a hypothetical scenario of Apple releasing an inferior application than Photoshop and Adobe in retaliation dropping the development of their products to the Mac platform. Until then, I think is a pointless discussion to have. Let's see what happens at the Photokina Event.

my 2 cents.

[shiv]

Hey, I think you're on to something. And, going out on a limb here... I bet it'll have a name like "Aperture". :p

Votes for "Shutter Speed" please say Aye! ...:p

[Machead III]

lol, if Apple loses Adobe, Apple dies.

[Klut]

How's 802.11n compared to 802.11g ??

[Chundles]

How's 802.11n compared to 802.11g ??

Look it up.

Faster and bigger range.

[InsiderTravels]

I understand what you guys are saying but I have to say I have a huge reservation seeing Apple fighting against Adobe.
Photoshop plus other apps from Adobe are very well integrate with each other providing a very good workflow. If Apple decides to compete with Photoshop that could bring a huge problem for the whole creative community that depends so much on Adobe and Apple.

•Adobe, could just say forget it about developing for the Mac and leaving us on the dust with an inferior app from Apple.
•Even if Apple provides a breakthrough app, it will take time to bring all the folks that are so loyal to Adobe into Apple apps. Including me.
• Learning curve for a new app.
• Plus a lot of other apps are so well connect with Photoshop, like I said before, after Effects, Illustrator and now Flash and the whole suite.

Just imagine Adobe giving up to develop for the Mac platform. That will be a huge disaster.

I rather have Apple focusing on make better computers and improving apps that could compete with Microsoft Office and others. IMHO leave Adobe alone.
I think Adobe is doing a good job updating and creating nice features. The whole Adobe universal apps transition delay thing is not their only fault, Apple should be blamed for that as well.



In the past, I may have agreed with your opinion that directly competing with Adobe would be a misguided idea on Apple's part, but now I'm not so sure.

Look at how much Adobe has been slacking in the Mac arena lately. They just released Photoshop Elements 5.0 for Windows, but they've given no indication that I can find about when the Mac version will be released. Not only that, but even the late-coming Photoshop Elements 4.0 for Mac isn't available as widely or as generously as the Windows version.

Typically Elements is bundled with various camera models. Now, Elements 4.0 is bundled for Windows, but only the archaic Elements 3.0 is bundled for Mac. This is even the case for some of the newly announced Leica cameras and other newer models from other brands.

In addition, Adobe does not offer a downloadable demo version of Elements 4.0 for Mac (the demo is only v3.0), although they have offered a demo of the Windows version for quite some time. The ONLY way to get Elements 4.0 for Mac it seems is to buy it outright site unseen.

Then there's the ever-present Universal problem. As someone who uses Photoshop CS2 every day on a maxed Intel iMac Core Duo, I must say its performance is terrible compared to what it should be. Using Photoshop in Rosetta is a slightly painful experience, especially when you have tons of large images to process, and Bridge is even worse - it crashes constantly for no apparent reason (like when you try to save an image in Photoshop with Bridge open) - even after a fresh install.

Plus, Adobe's becoming more draconian with their activation schemes, which in my opinion accomplish nothing but to punish, annoy, and alienate the HONEST, paying customers. Obviously, crooks will find a way around the limitations anyway, so they are pointless because they affect only those of us who actually own licenses to the software.

It seems as if Adobe has been digging its own grave over the past few years. If Apple came out with some sort of plugin or other compatible program that would add the functionality of Photoshop Elements 4-5 into Aperture plus maybe a few trivial things from CS2 that were stripped from Elements, and if they did it in typical Apple style with a greatly streamlined, classy interface, I'd definitely consider dropping Adobe from my arsenal altogether. For anything else I needed, I would use Painter or Painter Essentials.

[InsiderTravels]

lol, if Apple loses Adobe, Apple dies.


You honestly think that the ONLY reason Apple exists today is because of Adobe? I think that's quite an illogical and simplistic assumption. Adobe isn't responsible for the innovation that comes out of Cupertino any more than Apple is responsible for the historical success of Photoshop and its cluttered, incoherent interface or the incompetence coming out of Redmond.

Apple doesn't NEED Adobe to survive. Perhaps that may have once been the case when Apple was on its deathbed, but the company has rebounded and is now stronger than ever. Everything Apple's done in recent memory has been a result of its own innovation and ingenuity and its ability to foresee upcoming trends.

I'm not a cheerleader for Apple by any means because I'm still waiting to be thoroughly satisfied by Aperture as well, but to say that Apple must court Adobe to stay alive is a bit ridiculous, I think. But of course, that's just my opinion. ;-)

[Machead III]

You honestly think that the ONLY reason Apple exists today is because of Adobe?

lawl, what I meant was, until there are comparative alternatives, without apps like Photoshop and illustrator, Apple would lose a vast portion of it's base.

Sort of goes without saying tbh.

[gugy]

In the past, I may have agreed with your opinion that directly competing with Adobe would be a misguided idea on Apple's part, but now I'm not so sure.

Look at how much Adobe has been slacking in the Mac arena lately. They just released Photoshop Elements 5.0 for Windows, but they've given no indication that I can find about when the Mac version will be released. Not only that, but even the late-coming Photoshop Elements 4.0 for Mac isn't available as widely or as generously as the Windows version.

Typically Elements is bundled with various camera models. Now, Elements 4.0 is bundled for Windows, but only the archaic Elements 3.0 is bundled for Mac. This is even the case for some of the newly announced Leica cameras and other newer models from other brands.

In addition, Adobe does not offer a downloadable demo version of Elements 4.0 for Mac (the demo is only v3.0), although they have offered a demo of the Windows version for quite some time. The ONLY way to get Elements 4.0 for Mac it seems is to buy it outright site unseen.

Then there's the ever-present Universal problem. As someone who uses Photoshop CS2 every day on a maxed Intel iMac Core Duo, I must say its performance is terrible compared to what it should be. Using Photoshop in Rosetta is a slightly painful experience, especially when you have tons of large images to process, and Bridge is even worse - it crashes constantly for no apparent reason (like when you try to save an image in Photoshop with Bridge open) - even after a fresh install.

Plus, Adobe's becoming more draconian with their activation schemes, which in my opinion accomplish nothing but to punish, annoy, and alienate the HONEST, paying customers. Obviously, crooks will find a way around the limitations anyway, so they are pointless because they affect only those of us who actually own licenses to the software.

It seems as if Adobe has been digging its own grave over the past few years. If Apple came out with some sort of plugin or other compatible program that would add the functionality of Photoshop Elements 4-5 into Aperture plus maybe a few trivial things from CS2 that were stripped from Elements, and if they did it in typical Apple style with a greatly streamlined, classy interface, I'd definitely consider dropping Adobe from my arsenal altogether. For anything else I needed, I would use Painter or Painter Essentials.


Maybe you are right about Photoshop Elements, but I am talking about professional apps. If we look at the update cycle of the professional apps from Adobe I think they are pretty good. every 18 to 24 months a new version with a lot of nice features.

The universal fiasco is bad. I don't blame Adobe entirely for that. Steve and Apple said it would take 2 years to complete the transition. In the end it took what? not even 1 year, I think. So now Adobe is saying they will bring CS3 spring 2007 that would be on the original timeframe. How can we blame them for that? I think is their main interest to have Universal apps out there to make money.

I am with you, I love Apple apps, like FCP, DVD Studio Pro and Aperture. Adobe has no competition for that. As for Motion, is nice but After Effects is way more powerful and Photoshop and Illustrator are awesome.

Maybe I am an Adobe fanboy, but I am Apple's too. As long as we can have great apps from whatever company, I'll be satisfied. I would only hate to have to compromise for something less because competition between those two companies.
So, my only hope they can coexist in harmony and provide us with the best.

[InsiderTravels]

Maybe you are right about Photoshop Elements, but I am talking about professional apps. If we look at the update cycle of the professional apps from Adobe I think they are pretty good. every 18 to 24 months a new version with a lot of nice features.

The universal fiasco is bad. I don't blame Adobe entirely for that. Steve and Apple said it would take 2 years to complete the transition. In the end it took what? not even 1 year, I think. So now Adobe is saying they will bring CS3 spring 2007 that would be on the original timeframe. How can we blame them for that? I think is their main interest to have Universal apps out there to make money.

I am with you, I love Apple apps, like FCP, DVD Studio Pro and Aperture. Adobe has no competition for that. As for Motion, is nice but After Effects is way more powerful and Photoshop and Illustrator are awesome.

Maybe I am an Adobe fanboy, but I am Apple's too. As long as we can have great apps from whatever company, I'll be satisfied. I would only hate to have to compromise for something less because competition between those two companies.
So, my only hope they can coexist in harmony and provide us with the best.


I see where you're coming from, I do, but I guess I'm just thoroughly annoyed at this point - enough to dream about a possible future without the headaches Adobe has given me.

Don't get me wrong, I'm annoyed with some of the remaining glitches and bugs in Aperture as well. But at least it seems like Apple's TRYING to appease its customers by giving free updates and asking for input about feature wishes and the like. It seems that whenever a new version of Photoshop is FINALLY released, it contains a few new bells and whistles but nothing substantial and few of the pre-existing problems have been addressed. It's almost like they're taking a page or two from the Microsoft book; they just keep piling stuff on top of the decades old codebase, and as a result, the program keeps getting more and more bloated and lethargic.

In contrast, Aperture started out slower than molasses but has steadily increased in speed with each incremental update. It still has a long way to go to kick Photoshop or anyone else out of the market (assuming that ever even becomes Apple's goal), but at least it seems to be heading in the right direction. Photoshop, on the other hand, just keeps going in the opposite direction.

Who knows what direction Apple will ultimately take Aperture and/or any rumored complementary editing application, but whatever they do I sure hope the final product (s) will allow me to get rid of the barrage of applications on my hard drive in favor of one or two cohesive applications that will alleviate the need for all the rest of them.

[digitalbiker]

It seems that whenever a new version of Photoshop is FINALLY released, it contains a few new bells and whistles but nothing substantial and few of the pre-existing problems have been addressed. It's almost like they're taking a page or two from the Microsoft book; they just keep piling stuff on top of the decades old codebase, and as a result, the program keeps getting more and more bloated and lethargic.

In contrast, Aperture started out slower than molasses but has steadily increased in speed with each incremental update. It still has a long way to go to kick Photoshop or anyone else out of the market (assuming that ever even becomes Apple's goal), but at least it seems to be heading in the right direction. Photoshop, on the other hand, just keeps going in the opposite direction.


I think you just need to wait until CS3 before passing judgement on Adobe. Rumors from developers indicate that CS3 is going to blow Apple users away. Much much better performance boost. Totally re-written. Many bugs addressed. Newly designed interface and product integration.:cool:

[gugy]

InsiderTravels, fair point.

[InsiderTravels]

I think you just need to wait until CS3 before passing judgement on Adobe. Rumors from developers indicate that CS3 is going to blow Apple users away. Much much better performance boost. Totally re-written. Many bugs addressed. Newly designed interface and product integration.:cool:


I'll believe it when I see it, and believe me, I will be waiting and hopeful that your predictions come to fruition. Any judgment passed upon Adobe by anyone at this point is fairly deserved. Their software is way too expensive to have to deal with the headaches that go along with it. If you're going to ask people to mortgage themselves to you for the privilege of using your software, you'd better be darn certain it's worthy of such reverence, and you'd better spend most of your time kissing the rear ends of every single customer who coughs up the cash over and over again. And it wouldn't hurt to get rid of that ridiculous authorization scheme from both Adobe and Macromedia titles because like I said, it only hurts the paying customers, not the thiefs.

That's all I'll say about this issue. My soapbox time is finished for now. ;-)

[dsnort]

you don't get it.
I welcome competition. I love FCP and Aperture.
But if Adobe drops the Mac platform because Apple decides to create a Photoshop competitor, then it better be as good as Photoshop. If not, then not just me will be whining but thousands of professionals that depend on APPLE AND ADOBE.

I think I read somewhere that Macs account for almost 50% of Adobe's revenue. If that's true, I wouldn't worry about them walking away.

[Virtualball]

I read that people thnk C2D MBP would be released alongside Aperture 2 would be logical. How is it logical that Apple would release new computers at a photography event?

[sth]

How is it logical that Apple would release new computers at a photography event?
Because they already did this in the past.

[AppleKrate]

I read that people thnk C2D MBP would be released alongside Aperture 2 would be logical. How is it logical that Apple would release new computers at a photography event?

because photographers use mobile computers?

[OdduWon]

has anyone thought that the true video/photo ipod could also be the photographers sidekick? it could be an apaturepod and download moves and photos. allowing for fast mobil transfert of raw data to aid in the never ending battle of storage, or as the interface for external storage...... yeah it could play from the drive that would be cool. :D

[CalfCanuck]

has anyone thought that the true video/photo ipod could also be the photographers sidekick? it could be an apaturepod and download moves and photos. allowing for fast mobil transfert of raw data to aid in the never ending battle of storage, or as the interface for external storage...... yeah it could play from the drive that would be cool. :D
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=2842810#post2842810

As you can see by my posts, I also think this is likely. I just can't see why Apple increased the size of the iTunes video download files unless they introduce a new, larger iPod (that can do double duty with a photographers need, as you said).

Everyone in this thread is so amped up about a minor MBP upgrade - what a SLEEPER! I use a MBP and Aperture, and kicking up it's CPU by 10-15% isn't going to change my workflow (or impress a lot of people at Photokina!).

Apple had better have a really hot Aperture 2.0 release, plus some more specific photo hardware (i.e. my iPod with Aperture keywords and filtering functions), if they want to make a splash at Photokina.

[OdduWon]

i agree. merom is not a big deal other than it taking us closer to santarosa. i need a laptop for poly next year so i''m holding out fot leapord and santatrose MBP. also if they only released apature 1.2 this would be a letdown as it is not that big of a deal to release an incremental update unless theres new features. still think that apple is playing it safe, saving the big guns for when the real/sansdisk rapsody mp3 player Macrocrap's zune come out. apple will realaease the digiPod and rule the digital world muhahaha muhahah!
sorry, but world domination aside the next ipod needs to be more of a companion to our digital lives rather a backpack.

[Unspeaked]

lawl, what I meant was, until there are comparative alternatives, without apps like Photoshop and illustrator, Apple would lose a vast portion of it's base.

Sort of goes without saying tbh.

I dunno, a vast portion circa '95.

Not a vast portion circa '06.

I bet way less than half (WAY less than half...) of Macs today have any Adobe software on them (excluding Acrobat, of course).

[HecubusPro]

I dunno, a vast portion circa '95.

Not a vast portion circa '06.

I bet way less than half (WAY less than half...) of Macs today have any Adobe software on them (excluding Acrobat, of course).

Almost everyone I know who has a mac (around 10 or so) has at least Photoshop installed. A few of them have Illustrator as well. This may not be indicative of the greater population though. I have no idea. It's a broard statement.

[Unspeaked]

Almost everyone I know who has a mac (around 10 or so) has at least Photoshop installed. A few of them have Illustrator as well. This may not be indicative of the greater population though. I have no idea. It's a broard statement.

No one I know who uses their own Mac (and not a corporate issued one) has any of the Adobe Suite.

However, let me ask you this: are all 10 or so people you're referring to running legal copies?

[jaw04005]

Actually, without Apple there would be no Adobe, and besides the Macintosh platform accounts for some 50 percent of Adobe's sales. Adobe is not dropping Apple anytime soon.

[HecubusPro]

No one I know who uses their own Mac (and not a corporate issued one) has any of the Adobe Suite.

However, let me ask you this: are all 10 or so people you're referring to running legal copies?

That I don't know. Why is it pertinent to the subject? If anything it's a little insulting to ask that question.

[EvryDayImShufln]

Off posters' topics but on the topic of the post...

Has Apple even planned the september 25th event or is it simply speculated ? Every time I check their site, it says photokina starts on the 26th, so what am I missing ?

[AppleKrate]

No one I know who uses their own Mac (and not a corporate issued one) has any of the Adobe Suite.

However, let me ask you this: are all 10 or so people you're referring to running legal copies?

*winds down window* "What seems to be the problem here, officer?" :p

[Unspeaked]

That I don't know. Why is it pertinent to the subject? If anything it's a little insulting to ask that question.


Apologies if you're insulted; I'm not trying to offend you (or your friends).

I just ask because unless the 10 people are running licensed copies of the Adobe software they're using, they contributed $0.00 to Adobe's bottom line and thus don't even count as part of Adobe's installed user base in their eyes.

Very pertinent to the subject of how much Apple versions of Adobe software contribute to both company's well beings, if you ask me.

[Josias]

lol, if Apple loses Adobe, Apple dies.

LOL! Bootcamp zorz

[BRLawyer]

lawl, what I meant was, until there are comparative alternatives, without apps like Photoshop and illustrator, Apple would lose a vast portion of it's base.

Sort of goes without saying tbh.

Actually it's the other way around...Adobe wouldn't even exist without Apple and the desktop publishing revolution sparked by the Cupertino company (via the Mac, the LaserWriter and the WYSIWYG paradigm)...this alone should constitute enough reason for Adobe to support Macs for at least 100 more years...:rolleyes:

[sth]

this alone should constitute enough reason for Adobe to support Macs for at least 100 more years...:rolleyes:
In today's business world those things count nothing at all. Sad but true.

Anyway, I don't think Adobe will drop Apple anytime soon since many of their paying customers use this platform.

[MarceFX]

Hey there!

First of all,this is my first post, so i just wanted to thank you all for making this "Macommunity" so great :) Here's my doubt:

I've been reading a lot at this thread lately but couldnt get at what time this special event is scheduled, can anyone help me out?

Thanks! :D

[Apple Corps]

Hey there!

First of all,this is my first post, so i just wanted to thank you all for making this "Macommunity" so great :) Here's my doubt:

I've been reading a lot at this thread lately but couldnt get at what time this special event is scheduled, can anyone help me out?

Thanks! :D

MarceFX - I recall reading that it will be around 1630 hours local (Germany) on Monday.

[Deputy-Dawg]

MarceFX - I recall reading that it will be around 1630 hours local (Germany) on Monday.

That would make some kind of sense. Germany is GMT +1 while California is GMT -7 so there is an 8 hour difference between the two. Translated it means that if the event is scheduled for 1630 in Germany that would be 830 in California. Put another way just after breakfest in CA and just before dinner in Germany.

[HecubusPro]

That would make some kind of sense. Germany is GMT +1 while California is GMT -7 so there is an 8 hour difference between the two. Translated it means that if the event is scheduled for 1630 in Germany that would be 830 in California. Put another way just after breakfest in CA and just before dinner in Germany.

Darn. That's about the time I leave for work. So I'll be on the road with a 45 min. commute time which means I'll likely miss everything as it happens--assuming someone's going to be covering it live on MR as has been done in the past. I guess I'll just have to read everything after the fact and hope for the best that C2D MBP's become available.

[MarceFX]

That would make some kind of sense. Germany is GMT +1 while California is GMT -7 so there is an 8 hour difference between the two. Translated it means that if the event is scheduled for 1630 in Germany that would be 830 in California. Put another way just after breakfest in CA and just before dinner in Germany.

Thanks buddies! weird time though... :p

[mi5moav]

So, has anyone heard anything yet?????

[Willis]

hmm, its been quiet in this camp. *ponders* gah... Im just gonna be finishing college, and then im at work till 1:30am. bah!!

[shecky]

just to clarify the time thing, the correct time differences are:

Cologne, Germany = GMT +1
USA East Coast (New York - Eastern Daylight Time) = GMT -5
USA West Coast (San Francisco - Pacific Daylight Time) = GMT -8

so if this event is really happening at 16:30 in Cologne, then its at 10:30AM EDT and 7:30AM PDT.

[Apple Corps]

just to clarify the time thing, the correct time differences are:

Cologne, Germany = GMT +1
USA East Coast (New York - Eastern Daylight Time) = GMT -5
USA West Coast (San Francisco - Pacific Daylight Time) = GMT -8

so if this event is really happening at 16:30 in Cologne, then its at 10:30AM EDT and 7:30AM PDT.

I'm the party that posted 1630 hours local - it may have been 1730 local - I can't find the original thread where I saw the time announcement - but 0730 or 0830 PDT is close.

[shecky]

from Ars Tehnica:

"Apple Special Event Presentation: September 25th 16:30~18:00h
Gürzenich Köln,
Martinstraße 29-37
50667 Koln
Cologne, Germany

Registration: 15:30h and reception to follow presentation."

there we go :)

[knackroller]

Now that there has been the "enhanced" iPod, unlikely to have anything exciting on the iPod front then..

[MacinDoc]

from Ars Tehnica:

"Apple Special Event Presentation: September 25th 16:30~18:00h
Gürzenich Köln,
Martinstraße 29-37
50667 Koln
Cologne, Germany

Registration: 15:30h and reception to follow presentation."

there we go :)
So, a full 90 minutes. Must be more than just Aperture 1.2...

[Teddy's]

from Ars Tehnica:

"Apple Special Event Presentation: September 25th 16:30~18:00h
Gürzenich Köln,
Martinstraße 29-37
50667 Koln
Cologne, Germany

Registration: 15:30h and reception to follow presentation."

there we go :)
Is it in German or English? :confused:

[Aaon]

Anyone have news on the event, or did I get my timing totally off? By my watch, it should have started about 8 minutes ago...

[MacBoobsPro]

Anyone have news on the event, or did I get my timing totally off? By my watch, it should have started about 8 minutes ago...

You missed it. They released iTV and G5 laptops!

[FleurDuMal]

Anyone have news on the event, or did I get my timing totally off? By my watch, it should have started about 8 minutes ago...

Isn't it a two-plus hour event though? The first 30 mins might be nothing but some boring introductions.

Disclaimer: I have no knowledge of how Apple events span out :p

[MacsRgr8]

Yeah, should have started 10 mins ago...

But, no AppleStore down?
Is 10:30 EST, 16:30 CET the correct time?

:confused: