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macilosh
Aug 2, 2001, 01:50 PM
Anyone have an idea when the new Tibook will arrive, and if it will house a faster MHz G4, Superdrive or CD-RW and an addition 1394 port?

iboy
Aug 2, 2001, 02:40 PM
maybe at the end of September...
faster G4 ---> sure
superdrive ---> I don't think so, but a combodrive
1394 port ---> ?

menoinjun
Aug 2, 2001, 04:57 PM
I am predicting in Paris a new TiBook with the following features:

600/700mhz G4s
128/256 mb Pc 100 ram
Combo drive
USB 2.0 is a possibilty, but doubtful. (does that require a motherboard revamp?)



I don't think that anything more will be added. It's selling too well and it's too soon for a complete revamp. It's possible that it will be available in maybe on extra anodized color (black anyone?) but that is completely up for grabs. What does iboy mean by a 1394 port?

-Pete

To next post: Sorry, I meant what did he mean by that considering that there is already one on there. I am very aware of firewire, it rules!! Sometimes I have to watch what I say so that I dont look like an idiot. T hanks

[Edited by ptrauber on 08-03-2001 at 12:41 PM]

ThlayliTheFierce
Aug 2, 2001, 05:51 PM
1394 port = FireWire = iLink. I guess he's wondering if there will be an extra one added?

Kela
Aug 3, 2001, 01:56 AM
People dont you think we should be asking, Is an ATI RAdeon Mobilitiy or Ge-Force Go going to be put in the Ti2 powerbook? THEN IT IS an very good gaming machine, not to speak of the other aweosome features.

ciao

max

MrMacMan
Aug 3, 2001, 08:28 AM
It should be a 600/733 processor
A better vid card. It will be a last minute change.
Usb 2.0 no. Soon though
Firewire port yes.
Memory is dirt cheap so we should give it to you for free...

jeffrs
Aug 3, 2001, 10:55 AM
I have noticed all the WinTel notebooks carrying the new GeForce are quite fat... just wondering if the new GeForce Go will fit in the svelte TiG4 and if heat issues would be a probblem?

MrMacMan
Aug 4, 2001, 10:04 AM
But then you never know with exotic metal's... The g4 titanuim was extremaly hot normally the GeForce should not create more heat.

ThlayliTheFierce
Aug 6, 2001, 02:53 PM
If a plastic laptop can handle the heat, the TiBook should be able to. That was one of the reasons for Titanium, it's part of the cooling system and conducts heat rather well.

john123
Aug 6, 2001, 04:51 PM
If Apple's previous product cycles are any indication, a major revamp isn't in the works. If you recall, Pismo was introduced at the start of 2000, and the only revisions that it got were an (undocumented) motherboard change in June/July (mostly to resolve problems with the FireWire ports not having enough power, thus creating problems with 3rd party devices like Orange Micro's iBot), and a boost in harddrive space in September from 6 to 10 in the low end and from 10 to (I think) 18 in the high end.

The only 2 things that should prompt a major upgrade in the PB G4 are:
1) That starting with the Pismo in early 2000, the entry level processor speed has been 400 Mhz and the high end has been 500 Mhz. G3, G4, whatever -- the Mhz configurations have remained stagnant, and that just is a little sorry considering the 900 Mhz laptops you can purchase for less than the TiBook from Dell, etc.
2) That the ATI 128 Mobility chip set is also pretty dated. It's time to move to NVIDIA like Dell and others have done.

A hard drive bump up would also be nice and is certainly possible...it's also a lot easier than putting in a new graphics board and the like.

Rather than expecting major overhauls (no way this soon after its introduction), a more likely strategy for Apple is a bit of a price cut, plus (1) and/or (2) above. I'm banking on the combination of price and features to be good enough for me to do my trade-in then....

MrMacMan
Aug 6, 2001, 07:56 PM
To DEll? And apple will have Some revisions to the Ti book. Not a lot.. But some. That is a must.

Kela
Aug 7, 2001, 04:33 AM
Simple equation. If S.Jobs puts a GeForce Go or ATIRAD Mobility in the G4 Titanium. Sales GO UP EVEN MORE. I mean, tough luck for those who bought the revision 1 Ti-Powerbook. What are they gonna do...change to PC? IF THE TECHNOLOGY IS AVAILABLE, THEN ADD THE 3d Accelerator card in the Ti revision 2 Powerbook, APPLE!! STOP WASTING TIME AS YOU HAVE IN THE PAST. Bring the lowend model to 500 MHZ and the high end to 733 by next Feb. BUT THE RADEON MOBility or Geforce go has to be in there By MWParis. PLEASEEE!! SHIP IT WITH OS X 1.0 or OSX 10.0.4.

ALSO SELL THE LOWEND Model currently BUndled with Adobe COllection (i.e premiere, ps, e.t.c.) for less than the price of the high end POwerbook. (500)

mikebach
Aug 7, 2001, 09:31 PM
II worked on a Tibook before.. Love the speed hate the crowded work space due to low res. It that when you working on a brochure or magazine spread in illustrstor and/or photoshop 1024 x 768 with all the palettes open gives you a very small and cumbersome work space. At 1600x1200 with all the palettes open you work space is huge you can don't have to scroll to look at things everywhere. That was my main reason I purchase the IBM...I was just wondering if anyone thinks that in the Rev2 TiBook they will up to resolution to a higher resolution be be on par with some of the Higherend notebooks offered by IBM, Sony and Dell. Don't get me wrong..The TiBook is a great machine. I would just be perfect with a option to use it a a higher res. Any Guesses ANYONE?.

mischief
Aug 8, 2001, 04:17 PM
have any of you stuck your hand under a Tibook that's been running for a while? Ouch!!! Not damaging but certainly would get uncomfortable after a while. Still better than Wintel's, but 733 may require an asbestos lap-blanket. Better to hope for a real video card.

john123
Aug 8, 2001, 04:21 PM
Originally posted by mischief
have any of you stuck your hand under a Tibook that's been running for a while? Ouch!!! Not damaging but certainly would get uncomfortable after a while. Still better than Wintel's, but 733 may require an asbestos lap-blanket. Better to hope for a real video card.

Yeah -- when I have used one, I have just used a leather folio thing (like the kind of thing people keep who wear suits put their papers in). Takes all the heat impact and saves your lap.

The thing is that if Apple and everyone weren't so obsessed with having a "thin" portable, the heat-on-the-lap issue wouldn't be a problem.

MrMacMan
Aug 8, 2001, 05:49 PM
The company's like Compaq make their own Super thin laptop. "The New Compaq _________ is less then 1" thick... Is made of high quality _________ and is Fully loaded with _______ and is priced reasobally under $ ______ (I was gasping when I saw the commercial please fill in the blanks if you have seen it too.)
And Yes the ti Book Does have a heating problem, but is that Really a Problem? I used one for a lap warmer and it was more efficent then my heater! And if it really burns you please contact apple. It should spin the Hd down b4 that happens though.

john123
Aug 8, 2001, 06:43 PM
Originally posted by MrMacman
The company's like Compaq make their own Super thin laptop. "The New Compaq _________ is less then 1" thick... Is made of high quality _________ and is Fully loaded with _______ and is priced reasobally under $ ______ (I was gasping when I saw the commercial please fill in the blanks if you have seen it too.)
And Yes the ti Book Does have a heating problem, but is that Really a Problem? I used one for a lap warmer and it was more efficent then my heater! And if it really burns you please contact apple. It should spin the Hd down b4 that happens though.

Has really nothing to do with "copying companies"...has everything to do with (perceived) marketability, which results in all companies trying to pack more into a smaller chassis. Apple's creed of its PowerBooks "weighing less" didn't start with the TiBook...the same has been said of the "PowerBooks" before it (not to be confused with the PB G3 Series, which was criticized for being heavy).

As for the heat, yeah it's a problem. It's not third-degree burns type of heat, but particularly if you are working outside, it can get unbearable.

MrMacMan
Aug 8, 2001, 08:30 PM
.5" thin! That would be a sight to be Seen! And are the ti books selling well? Hope they are. I hope we see some new Spec's soon. :) The Go vid card would be a start. And something has to come out of a the Paris MW and Seybold. It better be better than what came out of MYNY.

mnkeybsness
Aug 8, 2001, 10:07 PM
1/2 inch thin may be a little too thin for me, i need to know that there is actually something there that i'm working on. and besides, the durability would drop even if it's titanium.

john123
Aug 8, 2001, 10:13 PM
For better or for worse, the preferences over thickness are kind of irrelevant...PowerBooks typically enjoy a relatively long product life in terms of chassis changes, so you won't see any external modifications in this year anyway...

Kela
Aug 9, 2001, 02:21 AM
People, THERE IS NO LAPTOP EVER GOING TO EXIST (until a new technology allows it to) which is 1.3 centimeters thick!! HAHAHAH. The LCD screen would be like wafer and the durability of titanium needs atleast a good 2 cm. If not the full 2.5 cm = 1 inch. FREAKS MAN FREAKS!! How can anyone say that a laptop which is half an inch thick exists.

Kela
Aug 9, 2001, 04:54 AM
besides, where would the proccessor fit? Isnt the G4 more than a cm thick itself? What about hard drive?? LOL.

digitalrampage
Aug 9, 2001, 06:44 AM
Just to point out :

Was it phillips or fujitsu that have created "plastic" lcd's which are paper thin..

These things are out there, and regardless of whether they make the systems smaller, at least it will be 100 times more dificult to damage then your standard LCD

well thats my two cents. Other then :

TiBook 2
* September
* 667mhzz only
* 256mb ram
* 20 or 30 gig HDD
* additional Firewire (or at least 1394 chip upgrade)
* Titanium or Black titanium
* 10x slot load CD burner DVD combo
And thats it I would say.

Kela
Aug 9, 2001, 06:52 AM
Paper THIN!?!?!?!? yeah then plastic that is paper thin is not easy to damage you tell me?? You still havent answered my question about the processor, hard drive e.t.c. I doubt they are 1.3 cm thick. BTW, this so called "paper thin" technology is actually around .75 cm thick. Now, add to that a slight titanium hull to support it and then the actual motherbody (i.e processor, laptop, keyboard) youre back to 2cm atleast.

macilosh
Aug 9, 2001, 06:57 PM
Who really cares about a thin, thinner, thinest powerbook... The issue is performance a.k.a., function over form, not the pother way around.

Give me a thicker, faster,loaded Tibook over a "paper-thin," etc, etc... anyday!!!

What good is an apple skin without the tasty fruit inside???

priorities mates!!!!

MrMacMan
Aug 9, 2001, 08:57 PM
I went overboard. The Ti books are looking good now and maynot even see a upgrade this soon.

iboy
Aug 10, 2001, 01:05 AM
No thiner "Powerbook", more performance... please!!!

There is "Power" standing in the name... give me the power!!!

Kela
Aug 10, 2001, 02:29 AM
This may seem wierd but...indeed, we may see a slightly thicker powerbook g5. INVESTING in a Ti g4 now is dumb since a revision 2 is due out in the next 3-4 months.

MrMacMan
Aug 11, 2001, 08:53 PM
Um, I haven't heard of nay G5 Rumor's I know it's coming, but Not rumor's is bad news.

JoyBoy
Aug 12, 2001, 04:16 PM
The new PowerBook will probably have a 600mhz G4, maybe 667. They PB uses the 7410 G4, thus the speeds aren't as high but the power consumption is lower than the desktop G4s. Apple doesn't support USB 2.0, that would be illogical for it to have any ports of that kind. They would have most likely put any knew interfaces in the Quicksilver G4s anyways, if they were going to do that. Besides, Firewire will jump to 800mbs soon enough, much faster than USB 2.0's 450 or 420, I forget what exactly it is. I feel Firewire has a brighter future for high speed than USB 2.0 does. USB is great for gaming pads, mice, etc, but for DV and other high speed transfer devices, Firewire is the future. Apple and Microsoft both fully support it, but neither independently support USB 2.0 and probably won't anytime soon.

I could be way off on a lot of this stuff, but so could all of you, keep that in mind :)

Curiousstrngmint
Aug 12, 2001, 05:50 PM
I would love to see a 600 or 700 MHz CPU in the titanium, but what I really would like to see is a much better graphics processor. I want to run the upcoming Doom 3 and the minimum requirements for that are a GeForce2 or a Radeon.

Personally I don't do much video editing except school projects and the like, so I don't really care about a much larger hard drive. I have trouble filling up 20 gigs. But big numbers are always appreciated.

I can wait until July 02 for a revision to the Titanium, or even a new PowerBook. So what do people think the system's going to look like in July?

By the way, and this is COMPLETELY unrelated: go see Apocalypse Now Redux.

john123
Aug 12, 2001, 06:10 PM
Originally posted by Curiousstrngmint

I can wait until July 02 for a revision to the Titanium, or even a new PowerBook. So what do people think the system's going to look like in July?


You won't have to wait that long...I'd say there's a 90% chance the PowerBook gets a revision in September -- albeit not a major one. You won't see any new chassis or anything like that in September -- speed bump maybe. The current model is due, first and foremost, for a new graphics board, followed by a processor upgrade...

I'd be shocked if you don't see an NVIDIA card in the September model. And disappointed, too, given that that's when I plan on upgrading from my Pismo.

JoyBoy
Aug 12, 2001, 06:17 PM
The next rev to the PBG4 will probably have a GeForce2GO or a Radeon MObility, leaning towards the first.
This is just my input, but if you want to run an upcoming game from id, which will most likely use the latest in 3D techniques(That's Carmack fer ya), get a Desktop. A Dual 800 G4 will probably run Doom 3 without a single hitch :)
There will be a major revision to the current Powerbook G4 most likely in September. And as for waiting until next July, it is almost impossible to predict what will happen to the PB by then. That is 11 months away, a lot can happen in that time.

john123
Aug 12, 2001, 06:43 PM
Originally posted by JoyBoy

There will be a major revision to the current Powerbook G4 most likely in September.

This might be a bit premature....remember the Pismo last September? A dippy hard drive upgrade....

JoyBoy
Aug 12, 2001, 07:13 PM
About 6 months seems to be the pattern though, but of course it's Apple and they aren't ones for patterns. When I said major I didn't necessarily mean totally new Powerbook or anything, more of an internal update. Like graphics chip, processer speed, updated I/O bus that the iBook has, combo drive. If all of those come true, that's a rather substantial update. A new graphics chipset alone is major, major over the weak Rage 128.

MrMacMan
Aug 12, 2001, 07:54 PM
Nothing major to come, but a small spped upgrade. It's to soon for a total remake. No combo drives, I think.

JoyBoy
Aug 12, 2001, 08:56 PM
I'll be surprised with no combo drive. The free CD-RW firewire drive offer expires about the time an update would come. The iBook has it, it only seems logical for the next revision PB to have one.

MrMacMan
Aug 12, 2001, 09:08 PM
Combo is a good idea. The ibook's have it. I would lke to see some CDRw's too.
Sorry, I didn't make that very clear.

[Edited by MrMacman on 08-13-2001 at 09:23 PM]

john123
Aug 12, 2001, 11:39 PM
Originally posted by MrMacman
Combo is okay. I'm not sure that a combo is a good idea.

1) The question isn't whether it is a "good idea" or not...the question is whether it is likely. The fact that the promo expires makes it likely...that fact is also why I sort of expected the TiBook to remain stagnant at MWNY, and as we all saw, it did.

2) Why on earth WOULDN'T it be a good idea? You can talk all you like about the virtues of your iMac, but as a PowerBook user, I have to say that it SUCKS to wag around a burner with me. I'll be glad when I can consolidate. Sure, you have to take time to copy one CD to disk image format on the HD....but whoop-de-doo.

Kela
Aug 13, 2001, 05:18 AM
Do you people agree that the most important update the titanium can have is a 3d graphics accelerator card like Go or mobility built into it. Then it will become a good gaming machine. Otherwise I think it rips throuigh cd burning and the usual mac only cool stuff. So please hope for a upgrade in the graphics motherboard.

iboy
Aug 13, 2001, 07:27 AM
I totally agree with you Kela...

Kela
Aug 13, 2001, 08:36 AM
Another question people, is there like any rumor anywhere that has a proposed release date of Ti2? I am getting impatient. Its like, theres no hope in sight.

john123
Aug 13, 2001, 08:50 AM
Originally posted by Kela
Another question people, is there like any rumor anywhere that has a proposed release date of Ti2? I am getting impatient. Its like, theres no hope in sight.

Paris...Sept 26 (I think)

JoyBoy
Aug 13, 2001, 12:39 PM
I'm curious as to why a combo drive isn't a good idea?
Watch DVDs and Burn CDs on the go? What other alternative could you want?

I think I said this before, if you want to play games on a serious "gaming" machine, get a desktop.

john123
Aug 13, 2001, 01:18 PM
Originally posted by JoyBoy

I think I said this before, if you want to play games on a serious "gaming" machine, get a desktop.

If the PowerBook gets a graphics card upgrade, this advice won't pack quite the punch it does now. Cross your fingers for a nice, new board with lots of VRAM....

Curiousstrngmint
Aug 13, 2001, 01:47 PM
About the powerbook not being a gaming machine:

Of course it's not. It's not supposed to be. It's supposed to be one inch "thin" and all that. Can you imagine lugging a G4 tower on board a plane? But while a laptop isn't meant primarily for games it would really be nice to have the option in case I want something else to do in the car or on the train.

jeffrs
Aug 13, 2001, 03:32 PM
plus the iBook shares the same graphics processor as the TiG4... it would be nice to see them differentiate the TiRev2 by upping the graphics processor... I know as a Web Designer and casual gamer this would be a welcome addition.

I am about to venture into unfamiliar territory here so correct me if I?m wrong.... I am curious if the new nVidia & ATI cards are the same dimensions as the current ATI card in the TiG4... my thinking is this... if a new card can be placed in there without a major reworking of the internal architecture then we could see the rev in Sept., if it requires a major overhaul of the components then I would bet my money on a later date.

JoyBoy
Aug 13, 2001, 08:17 PM
Originally posted by john123
[QUOTE][i]
If the PowerBook gets a graphics card upgrade, this advice won't pack quite the punch it does now. Cross your fingers for a nice, new board with lots of VRAM....

Actually, it will pack the same punch. I don't remember a Powerbook being able to upgrade it's graphics board. And to say a 600mhz 7410 or whatever it will be G4 can even come close to a dual 800 w/ GeForce3 doesn't go far.

I doubt the new ATI and nVidia boards are bigger, they're designed to be put in portables, besides Apple is the king of design, they always figure it out. I wouldn't worry too much.

[Edited by JoyBoy on 08-13-2001 at 09:19 PM]

MrMacMan
Aug 13, 2001, 08:29 PM
Apple will have a Ti book have at Seybold. Seybold is for pro's and the Pro Graphic designers go to seybold. They will have them at Paris as a (major) release, cause it is apple's expo. Remember, Steve is at Paris while At Seybold the Vp is their. Steve will use the Digital phone from Paris.

john123
Aug 13, 2001, 09:21 PM
Originally posted by JoyBoy
Originally posted by john123
[QUOTE][i]
If the PowerBook gets a graphics card upgrade, this advice won't pack quite the punch it does now. Cross your fingers for a nice, new board with lots of VRAM....

Actually, it will pack the same punch. I don't remember a Powerbook being able to upgrade it's graphics board. And to say a 600mhz 7410 or whatever it will be G4 can even come close to a dual 800 w/ GeForce3 doesn't go far.

[Edited by JoyBoy on 08-13-2001 at 09:19 PM]

Um...you're missing a few key elements:
1) For the upmteenth time, if you don't have things that are taking advantage of multiple processors (the game or the OS), then that "dual" doesn't help you nearly as much. With the growth of OS X, the playing field changes somewhat, but you aren't comparing like 1.6 Ghz here to 600 Mhz.

2) Games must be especially optimized for the GeForce3 to take advantage of much of its special stuff. Check out other threads here on that subject....

JoyBoy
Aug 14, 2001, 11:56 AM
Originally posted by john123
Originally posted by JoyBoy
Originally posted by john123
[QUOTE][i]
If the PowerBook gets a graphics card upgrade, this advice won't pack quite the punch it does now. Cross your fingers for a nice, new board with lots of VRAM....

Actually, it will pack the same punch. I don't remember a Powerbook being able to upgrade it's graphics board. And to say a 600mhz 7410 or whatever it will be G4 can even come close to a dual 800 w/ GeForce3 doesn't go far.

[Edited by JoyBoy on 08-13-2001 at 09:19 PM]

Um...you're missing a few key elements:
1) For the upmteenth time, if you don't have things that are taking advantage of multiple processors (the game or the OS), then that "dual" doesn't help you nearly as much. With the growth of OS X, the playing field changes somewhat, but you aren't comparing like 1.6 Ghz here to 600 Mhz.

2) Games must be especially optimized for the GeForce3 to take advantage of much of its special stuff. Check out other threads here on that subject....

And you missed a key elements yourself, with Apple's turn to MP machines, developers are going to multi-thread their apps. That makes the most sense. And the 800mhz G4s in the MP machine are not the same G4s in the Powerbook, also you must take into account the difference in bus speeds. Like I already said you can't upgrade a PB like you can with a desktop. I'm not trying to down play the PB's graphics capabilities, but to say they can scale along with a dual 800 machine is simply not true. And also with future support of EAX with the Sound Blaster cards, that will also jump the framerates and rendering speed of a desktop machine, the Powerbook simple CANNOT compete with a dual 800. It isn't supposed though, and I realize this, but it is not even close to being a gaming machine when compared to a dual 800.

john123
Aug 14, 2001, 12:57 PM
Originally posted by JoyBoy

And you missed a key elements yourself, with Apple's turn to MP machines, developers are going to multi-thread their apps. That makes the most sense. And the 800mhz G4s in the MP machine are not the same G4s in the Powerbook, also you must take into account the difference in bus speeds. Like I already said you can't upgrade a PB like you can with a desktop. I'm not trying to down play the PB's graphics capabilities, but to say they can scale along with a dual 800 machine is simply not true. And also with future support of EAX with the Sound Blaster cards, that will also jump the framerates and rendering speed of a desktop machine, the Powerbook simple CANNOT compete with a dual 800. It isn't supposed though, and I realize this, but it is not even close to being a gaming machine when compared to a dual 800.

OK, *way* too many leaps in logic here...
1) It's really funny for you to talk about a dual 800 smoking machine X -- especially given that you have never used nor tested a dual 800. Talk to me next week, buddy.
2) As for bus speeds and processor speeds: OK, look, I don't know how many games you've played, but the bus and processor speeds are both second-tier in importance compared to the graphics card. I don't care if you have a quad-2 Ghz machine sitting on your desk -- if you have some crappy video card, you aren't going to be able to run games such as Q3 and Unreal very happily.
3) EAX and Sound Blaster: not here on the Mac, so doesn't make much sense in a comparison of PowerBooks to G4 desktops.

Look, very simply, it breaks down to the fact that, right now, your desktop G4s have a pretty nice Nvidia card in them and your PowerBooks and iBooks have the ATI 128 Mobility chipsets in them. That single fact is the #1 reason why, if you are a serious gamer, you'd prefer a desktop over a laptop. If, however, Apple chooses to upgrade its graphics coprocessors in the September revision to the PowerBook G4 (and I sincerely believe that they will), then much of the gap will have disappeared. Do you pay a price in your gaming for a slower processor and bus speed, and a slightly scaled down Nvidia board? Of course. Would that price be astronomical? Absolutely not.

mischief
Aug 14, 2001, 03:57 PM
Ouch what a left hook.

Yeah, the thing to remember about Duals is that they deepen processing not double it's rate: you can do more things at once NOT the same things twice as fast.

Video Acceleration, however only adds significantly to games (admittedly most games) that exploit hardware 3D acceleration. The performance IS more affected by bus speed and Video card than any other combined factors though. Mostly the CPU just calculates location, kinda like a dispatcher: they still need to be speedy but other things are more critical to overall performance.

.....And a spectator is in the ring with a chair!!!........

JoyBoy
Aug 14, 2001, 07:50 PM
Originally posted by john123
Originally posted by JoyBoy

And you missed a key elements yourself, with Apple's turn to MP machines, developers are going to multi-thread their apps. That makes the most sense. And the 800mhz G4s in the MP machine are not the same G4s in the Powerbook, also you must take into account the difference in bus speeds. Like I already said you can't upgrade a PB like you can with a desktop. I'm not trying to down play the PB's graphics capabilities, but to say they can scale along with a dual 800 machine is simply not true. And also with future support of EAX with the Sound Blaster cards, that will also jump the framerates and rendering speed of a desktop machine, the Powerbook simple CANNOT compete with a dual 800. It isn't supposed though, and I realize this, but it is not even close to being a gaming machine when compared to a dual 800.

OK, *way* too many leaps in logic here...
1) It's really funny for you to talk about a dual 800 smoking machine X -- especially given that you have never used nor tested a dual 800. Talk to me next week, buddy.
2) As for bus speeds and processor speeds: OK, look, I don't know how many games you've played, but the bus and processor speeds are both second-tier in importance compared to the graphics card. I don't care if you have a quad-2 Ghz machine sitting on your desk -- if you have some crappy video card, you aren't going to be able to run games such as Q3 and Unreal very happily.
3) EAX and Sound Blaster: not here on the Mac, so doesn't make much sense in a comparison of PowerBooks to G4 desktops.

Look, very simply, it breaks down to the fact that, right now, your desktop G4s have a pretty nice Nvidia card in them and your PowerBooks and iBooks have the ATI 128 Mobility chipsets in them. That single fact is the #1 reason why, if you are a serious gamer, you'd prefer a desktop over a laptop. If, however, Apple chooses to upgrade its graphics coprocessors in the September revision to the PowerBook G4 (and I sincerely believe that they will), then much of the gap will have disappeared. Do you pay a price in your gaming for a slower processor and bus speed, and a slightly scaled down Nvidia board? Of course. Would that price be astronomical? Absolutely not.

Alright, I may be making assumptions about the performance of the dual 800, but I don't see a new Powerbook taking on a new desktop G4 anytime soon.
I agree with you on the dependency on graphics chips, but that also brings up again the advantage of a desktop, when you want to upgrade that graphics card, how do you plan on doing that on your "gaming machine" Portable? Expandability is my #1 one reason for using a desktop over a Portable for a gaming machine. Knowing that the card I have doesn't have to be the one I always use, you have no luxary like that with a Portable. Umm...Sound Blaster is here for the Macintosh, check out creative's website. And as for EAX, westlake and others have spoken many times of future implementation of it in their games. Personally, I use my computers for many years before I buy a new one, so looking to the future is a good thing for me. I'm sorry, but I am still not seeing how you can compare a Portable with a desktop when in terms of gaming. I just don't see even an updated PBG4 pumping out the framerates a dual 800 should. I'll be sure to get back to you on those performance tests "next week, buddy".

Heh...I'm enjoying this way too much :D
http://www.americas.creative.com/products/category.asp?Category=8&MainCategory=8

john123
Aug 14, 2001, 09:05 PM
Originally posted by JoyBoy
Alright, I may be making assumptions about the performance of the dual 800, but I don't see a new Powerbook taking on a new desktop G4 anytime soon.
I agree with you on the dependency on graphics chips, but that also brings up again the advantage of a desktop, when you want to upgrade that graphics card, how do you plan on doing that on your "gaming machine" Portable? Expandability is my #1 one reason for using a desktop over a Portable for a gaming machine. Knowing that the card I have doesn't have to be the one I always use, you have no luxary like that with a Portable. Umm...Sound Blaster is here for the Macintosh, check out creative's website. And as for EAX, westlake and others have spoken many times of future implementation of it in their games. Personally, I use my computers for many years before I buy a new one, so looking to the future is a good thing for me. I'm sorry, but I am still not seeing how you can compare a Portable with a desktop when in terms of gaming. I just don't see even an updated PBG4 pumping out the framerates a dual 800 should. I'll be sure to get back to you on those performance tests "next week, buddy".


When I said that the Sound Blaster is "not here," I meant that it is quite literally "not here," as in not built-in to the original Macs that you spoke of. Sure, you can add sound cards to desktop Macs, and upgrade your video cards, etc. etc. etc. Of course desktops offer upgradability while portables do not; no one contests that point. But, out of the box, a revised PowerBook will compete pretty well with your dual 800.

That you only upgrade after "many years" seems like your bigger problem. A PowerBook in 2 years will smoke your dual-800 of today, and of course it would offer a superior gaming experience to that dual-800 as well. If you're really this hard-core of a computer user, save your money that you seem intent on spending on SoundBlaster cards and video cards and God knows what else, and invest it so that you can upgrade a little quicker....

JoyBoy
Aug 14, 2001, 09:17 PM
Haha. I never claimed to be a hardcore computer user, I just like to play games. And a desktop in 2 years will beat a Powerbook of today and in 2 years...Don't really get the point of that one. Any computer in 2 years will smoke any computer of today...that's just technology.
This is going absolutely no where, you're not gonna give in obviously and I am not either. I disagree with you, we'll just wait and see for the revised Powerbook that doesn't actually exist to us yet...then either of us can make claims of gaming power.
heh, and don't give advice to me. you don't know a single thing about me. :)

john123
Aug 14, 2001, 09:42 PM
Originally posted by JoyBoy
Haha. I never claimed to be a hardcore computer user, I just like to play games. And a desktop in 2 years will beat a Powerbook of today and in 2 years...Don't really get the point of that one. Any computer in 2 years will smoke any computer of today...that's just technology.
This is going absolutely no where, you're not gonna give in obviously and I am not either. I disagree with you, we'll just wait and see for the revised Powerbook that doesn't actually exist to us yet...then either of us can make claims of gaming power.
heh, and don't give advice to me. you don't know a single thing about me. :)

Wow, that was a defensive post if I've ever seen one!

Anyway, I think that this actually went somewhere important: what to buy today and what to buy tomorrow. By your own concession, computers tomorrow will beat computers today. My argument is that that means PowerBooks of tomorrow (2 years) will beat desktops of today(including your flashy dual-800) -- and that's at gaming or whatever else you want to talk about. So, unless you are completely loaded, or are looking to buy your computer for the long haul, you should get something that IS NOT top of the line (so you aren't paying premium prices) and upgrade frequently. You'll have a machine that is always state-of-the-art while losing a minimum in depreciation. You can always prey on the less computer-savvy by selling your used Mac right before Expos and therefore getting top dollar for your machine while maximizing the time that you have to use it.

I guess, JoyBoy, where I'm left befuddled is why you want to invest *SO* much in a computer today, and to make it complete with every gizmo and gadget out there, when you don't have the resources to upgrade frequently or don't choose to. I just am not getting why you don't save some of that cash and trade-up your Mac in a year and get your NVIDIA GeForce 4 card with 64 MB of VRAM or whatever is "in" at that point in time...and if you "just like to play games"...well... $3500+monitor+peripherals is an awful lot to pay for games. I hear there is this new thing called the Sony Playstation out..................

[Edited by john123 on 08-14-2001 at 10:44 PM]

Kela
Aug 15, 2001, 02:19 AM
Look at you freaks. Getting all personal over rumored mac news. Just chill and dont get personal. WE all have powerful macs. WE DONT DO ANYTHING TO INFLUENCE APPLE SO WHY SHOULD WE DEBATE SOMETHING ABOUT THE FUTURE. PLease relax.

spikey
Aug 15, 2001, 08:12 AM
yes u r right, calm down and relax.... enjoy a pernot with a mate or even just settle for casual sex.
I think the big issue is clock speed improvements in tibooks.
and elvis aint dead hes just having a break.....heeeheeee, sorry that woz immature of me.

mischief
Aug 15, 2001, 11:16 AM
the frame rate in the Duals is due to the Nvidia, not the dual G4's. Given enough RAM the game should run almost exactly as fast on all 3 G4's if they're using the same card. If there's any difference in the Tibook it's the lack of 3D acceleration in the ATI chipset.

Back to the subject: can anyone see a keyboardless, touchscreen Tibook2? That might resolve a lot of rumors and lose that Evil little keyboard. It'd even lose that thickness in exra framing around the keyboard/hinge/monitor.

Kela: the bulk of the chassis is actually an assortment of composite and exotic materials, the Titanium just comprises the frame. The processor CARD takes up +/- 1cm but the chip itself is,(dare I say it ?) wafer thin. Open an Imac A-D to see a similar board.

JoyBoy
Aug 15, 2001, 12:56 PM
Originally posted by john123
Originally posted by JoyBoy
Haha. I never claimed to be a hardcore computer user, I just like to play games. And a desktop in 2 years will beat a Powerbook of today and in 2 years...Don't really get the point of that one. Any computer in 2 years will smoke any computer of today...that's just technology.
This is going absolutely no where, you're not gonna give in obviously and I am not either. I disagree with you, we'll just wait and see for the revised Powerbook that doesn't actually exist to us yet...then either of us can make claims of gaming power.
heh, and don't give advice to me. you don't know a single thing about me. :)

Wow, that was a defensive post if I've ever seen one!

Anyway, I think that this actually went somewhere important: what to buy today and what to buy tomorrow. By your own concession, computers tomorrow will beat computers today. My argument is that that means PowerBooks of tomorrow (2 years) will beat desktops of today(including your flashy dual-800) -- and that's at gaming or whatever else you want to talk about. So, unless you are completely loaded, or are looking to buy your computer for the long haul, you should get something that IS NOT top of the line (so you aren't paying premium prices) and upgrade frequently. You'll have a machine that is always state-of-the-art while losing a minimum in depreciation. You can always prey on the less computer-savvy by selling your used Mac right before Expos and therefore getting top dollar for your machine while maximizing the time that you have to use it.

I guess, JoyBoy, where I'm left befuddled is why you want to invest *SO* much in a computer today, and to make it complete with every gizmo and gadget out there, when you don't have the resources to upgrade frequently or don't choose to. I just am not getting why you don't save some of that cash and trade-up your Mac in a year and get your NVIDIA GeForce 4 card with 64 MB of VRAM or whatever is "in" at that point in time...and if you "just like to play games"...well... $3500+monitor+peripherals is an awful lot to pay for games. I hear there is this new thing called the Sony Playstation out..................

[Edited by john123 on 08-14-2001 at 10:44 PM]
Heh. Defensive? Maybe, only because you're way too offensive. I don't take this to heart, I might be being defensive only because I don't have any desire to turn a debate into a personal attack. You seem to want to do that and that's grand. Note how I'm the one using the happy smiley faces. And you're the one on the attack,. It's just forum posting. It appears to make more of an influence on you than me. Which is rather amusing.

You can trade up a with a dual 800 the same as with any other computer. I do just like to play games, you are assuming that is the only thing I use my computer for. If that were true, I'd be buying a PC :)
Of course a Powerbook in 2 years will beat a desktop of today, I'm not disputing that at all. I just don't see what that prooves whatsoever. A desktop in 2 years will beat a desktop of today as well. That's the way computers are. My 2 year old G3 doesn't compete real well with a G4. But I don't expect it to.
I am excited because it will run games blazing fast, how does the become "wanting to compete with every gizmo and gadget out there". I didn't buy a new monitor or 1.5gigs of RAM from Apple or any peripherals, and it didn't cost me $3,500 dollars. You're making quite a few assumptions. Which is fine by me, just know most are way off. But hey, you want to judge me because whether you can't afford one yourself or whatever reason you have, go ahead. Maybe you think I'm putting down the Powerbook, which I am not trying to do. Of course if I needed a portable I'd go for one, they're great machines, I just want the power of a desktop top for gaming and work. If that seems like a poor reason to spend all this money on a dual 800, that's fine with me, I just don't care.
I'd never buy a PS2 btw. :)

If anyone wants to get ripped a new one go post on maccentral or something, many of the people that frequent there know more than all of us combined. It is quite intimidating.

mischief
Aug 15, 2001, 01:46 PM
John123 could use a new playmate to pick on in the Grammar thread.......I'm bored with his ass.

mischief
Aug 15, 2001, 02:34 PM
Folks got tired of you did they?

mischief
Aug 15, 2001, 02:38 PM
Hey guys, What was that topic again? We were talking about Tibooks not Desktop systems anyway.

Curiousstrngmint
Aug 15, 2001, 03:48 PM
Will you two be quiet? This is one of those "arguments" where both people yell "at" each other instead of arguing or discussing.Of course a desktop is a better gaming mac, but you can't take it on the plane, and if you bought a powerbook and kept it on your desk all the time you should be guillotined or something. Plus, by the time you guys are finished disemboweling each other it will be September already and we'll have our new Ti. I propose that we all shut up until September.

mischief
Aug 15, 2001, 05:28 PM
Okay, sure. Perhaps Battlenet Starcraft at twenty paces?

Go check out the thread on Hardware/software ready for Paris.

MrMacMan
Aug 15, 2001, 09:29 PM
lol, Let's see what happens...

JoyBoy
Aug 16, 2001, 11:20 AM
Originally posted by Curiousstrngmint
Will you two be quiet? This is one of those "arguments" where both people yell "at" each other instead of arguing or discussing.Of course a desktop is a better gaming mac, but you can't take it on the plane, and if you bought a powerbook and kept it on your desk all the time you should be guillotined or something. Plus, by the time you guys are finished disemboweling each other it will be September already and we'll have our new Ti. I propose that we all shut up until September.

We weren't yelling, just simply raising the volume of our theoretical voices to help the hearing impaired.
Ya just try to help the less fortunate and you get a slap on the wrist...what is this world coming to. :D

JoyBoy
Aug 16, 2001, 11:21 AM
Originally posted by mischief
Okay, sure. Perhaps Battlenet Starcraft at twenty paces?

Go check out the thread on Hardware/software ready for Paris.


Starcraft? Bah. Quake 3 is where deathmatch related "I OWN YOU FOREVER" type competitions should go down :D

I smile too much. :)

john123
Aug 16, 2001, 11:24 AM
Originally posted by JoyBoy
Originally posted by mischief
Okay, sure. Perhaps Battlenet Starcraft at twenty paces?

Go check out the thread on Hardware/software ready for Paris.


Starcraft? Bah. Quake 3 is where deathmatch related "I OWN YOU FOREVER" type competitions should go down :D

I smile too much. :)

You're on. Name a day and time and an IP, and I'll frag your butt.

mnkeybsness
Aug 16, 2001, 02:24 PM
save your gaming talk for somewhere else-ie software rumors


this is a hardware rumors forum

mischief
Aug 16, 2001, 05:39 PM
Damn, I could make some cash selling consessions. Any bets? Odds on favorite on the language Geek, he's more likely to Hack the Arena. Then again JoyBoy has that certain special, Ear-biting-off quality.

Ice Cream, Cotton Candy, Condoms, Lube.......wait wrong bag..........

mischief
Aug 16, 2001, 05:39 PM
Damn, I could make some cash selling consessions. Any bets? Odds on favorite on the language Geek, he's more likely to Hack the Arena. Then again JoyBoy has that certain special, Ear-biting-off quality.

Ice Cream, Cotton Candy, Condoms, Lube!!.......wait wrong bag..........

macilosh
Aug 16, 2001, 07:02 PM
Name teh hotel room number or bar and buy each other a drink all ready. kiss and make up and get a grip. You guys act like this is the key element of the world as we know it.

We're talking about the upgrade to the Tibook no the ability to sqeeze each other's cocks harder, or frag each other... does that include foreplay???

Back to the issue...

How much improvement will the GeFore2 or similar give the Final Cut Pro app over the current ATI 128 Rage?


LOL!!!

JoyBoy
Aug 16, 2001, 07:09 PM
Originally posted by john123
Originally posted by JoyBoy
Originally posted by mischief
Okay, sure. Perhaps Battlenet Starcraft at twenty paces?

Go check out the thread on Hardware/software ready for Paris.


Starcraft? Bah. Quake 3 is where deathmatch related "I OWN YOU FOREVER" type competitions should go down :D

I smile too much. :)

You're on. Name a day and time and an IP, and I'll frag your butt.

I'm game, but I can't host, slow connection. Might be able to set up something at work though. Plus we'd be able to have witnesses. Unless you can host. I also want my Dual G4 first :D

Btw, what is it with some of you and sex? Get outside...hit the gym...get a g/f. This is just replusive.


[Edited by JoyBoy on 08-16-2001 at 08:13 PM]

MrMacMan
Aug 16, 2001, 09:33 PM
A Quake game will settle this mess. Eh?

Kela
Aug 17, 2001, 02:23 AM
Bay Area Freaks!!!!

mischief
Aug 17, 2001, 11:27 AM
The whole reason I reccomended a Blizzard title is because the games don't rely so heavily on grafix acceleration. Not to mention the strategy element. Q3 has distinct lamenesses: Just sit on an entry point and kill 'em as they come in. Lame. We need to establish a game both of you have that you're both skilled in that doesn't require much power from the machines. Hence Starcraft: it's old, popular, not really effected by which machines are used and set up through a public site. Arbitration and Witnessing could be fairly easy by inputting "neutral" players.

JoyBoy
Aug 17, 2001, 03:02 PM
Originally posted by mischief
The whole reason I reccomended a Blizzard title is because the games don't rely so heavily on grafix acceleration. Not to mention the strategy element. Q3 has distinct lamenesses: Just sit on an entry point and kill 'em as they come in. Lame. We need to establish a game both of you have that you're both skilled in that doesn't require much power from the machines. Hence Starcraft: it's old, popular, not really effected by which machines are used and set up through a public site. Arbitration and Witnessing could be fairly easy by inputting "neutral" players.

Umm..."Just sit on an entry point and kill 'em as they come in." That's called camping, lamers do it and no one with any actual skill does it. Quake 3 is a better way to find a superior. Kill or be killed. It's that simple. Starcraft is all fine and good(I love Warcraft more than Quake 3 actually) but to me...I just don't get the same feeling of "I OWNED YOU" from it.

mischief
Aug 17, 2001, 05:48 PM
Quake 3 is too reliant on frame rate. Warcraft would be better but it's harder to maintain game ballance than Starcraft. Unless we have a sponsor to host a LAN game (assuming you two are local to each other) there's no way to make two widely variant Macs play the same.

They threw me off the IOC because I was too picky. sheesh.

john123
Aug 17, 2001, 09:05 PM
ENOUGH!!!!!!!!!!!

You all are right; you all win; whatever. BLAH! Unless we all wanted to get together for Q3 games just for fun some time, this thread is going in a totally pointless direction. Can we get back to the topic at hand which is rumors on the PowerBook G4?

Other rumor sites are increasingly suggesting that a brand new mobile card will make its way into the next generation of PowerBooks -- and by "new" I mean not the GeForce2Go that is in some PCs, but NVIDIA's next generation. Anyone else heard/seen anything on this?

Kela
Aug 18, 2001, 01:58 AM
John123 I agree, there lurks a certain immaturity in some posters. Sad thing is that they are all adults.

iboy
Aug 18, 2001, 08:09 AM
Yes, you are right john123...

the new graphic card could be the "Quadro2Go" from Nvidia.

http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/archives/aug01/081501.html#S12392

but I don't believe that, we can be lucky if there will be an 16MB GeForce2Go or Radeon (my opinion).

JoyBoy
Aug 18, 2001, 12:28 PM
I'm no adult :D


Humm..."new" chipset? Based on the GeForce3 technology possibly...or something like that. Interesting to say the least.

john123
Aug 18, 2001, 03:03 PM
There is some new evidence in favor of a new TiBook in September:

The price on the low-end model of the TiBook is now $1979 for academic institutions, down from the $2339 it's been for eons...the other two are now down to $2699 and $3147, respectively.

Big price drops, particularly in education markets, often signal new products on the way. Yay!

Kela
Aug 20, 2001, 04:22 AM
so ummm aaa...anyone wanna give me a free mac?

JoyBoy
Aug 20, 2001, 07:08 PM
Originally posted by Kela
so ummm aaa...anyone wanna give me a free mac?

Out of curiousity, what machine are you running right now?

MrMacMan
Aug 20, 2001, 08:41 PM
A load of crap... Kidding for u people who have no sarcasim.

So for a sake of a picture what will the new Powerbook have?
Specs's wise.

Classic
Aug 23, 2001, 09:30 AM
According to go2mac.com:

http://www.go2mac.com/story.lasso?newsID=8229

Apple is expected to drop its powerbook pretail rices $300-500 on Saturday.

Perhaps a New Ti2 at Seybold, and their trying to clear their current inventory?

iamnotmad
Aug 23, 2001, 10:34 AM
check this out:
http://forums.macnn.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=17&t=003162

JoyBoy
Aug 23, 2001, 11:06 AM
Originally posted by Classic
According to go2mac.com:

http://www.go2mac.com/story.lasso?newsID=8229

Apple is expected to drop its powerbook pretail rices $300-500 on Saturday.

Perhaps a New Ti2 at Seybold, and their trying to clear their current inventory?


Seems logical. Apple has already slashed the Education prices by a considerable amount.

Kela
Aug 29, 2001, 03:26 AM
For those of you who havent heard, please visit macosrumors.com. The Ti2 will have the 7500 new version of the ATI Radeon in it!

Gallifrey
Aug 29, 2001, 02:37 PM
Will there be a new ti2 comming out? I would love to have one... but I want to wait for the next rev. Will that be out soon?

john123
Aug 29, 2001, 08:56 PM
Originally posted by Kela
For those of you who havent heard, please visit macosrumors.com. The Ti2 will have the 7500 new version of the ATI Radeon in it!

Apparently, Kela doesn't quite understand the distinction between rumor and fact.

spikey
Aug 30, 2001, 12:25 PM
And apparently john talks out his ass, so no need to listen to him whether it is rumor or fact he farts on about.

Hes Nikke
Aug 30, 2001, 01:40 PM
Originally posted by mikebach
II worked on a Tibook before.. Love the speed hate the crowded work space due to low res. It that when you working on a brochure or magazine spread in illustrstor and/or photoshop 1024 x 768 with all the palettes open gives you a very small and cumbersome work space. At 1600x1200 with all the palettes open you work space is huge you can don't have to scroll to look at things everywhere. That was my main reason I purchase the IBM...I was just wondering if anyone thinks that in the Rev2 TiBook they will up to resolution to a higher resolution be be on par with some of the Higherend notebooks offered by IBM, Sony and Dell. Don't get me wrong..The TiBook is a great machine. I would just be perfect with a option to use it a a higher res. Any Guesses ANYONE?.



i don't konw about you but i'm blind, (well not legaly ^_^) and have a hard enough time with the current TiBook screen! i run my 19" monitor at 1152x870 for crying out loud!

i have to hand it to apple for sticking to a reasonable resolution for this long! but i can see it coming, they have already turned the iBook into something that i can no longer use. (without a lot of effort :()

Hes Nikke
Aug 30, 2001, 01:41 PM
Originally posted by Kela
This may seem wierd but...indeed, we may see a slightly thicker powerbook g5. INVESTING in a Ti g4 now is dumb since a revision 2 is due out in the next 3-4 months. unless you need a laptop a week ago! (like me, i'm STILL waiting for my TiBook that i order on the 18th!)

Hes Nikke
Aug 30, 2001, 01:42 PM
Originally posted by john123

Wow, that was a defensive post if I've ever seen one!

Anyway, I think that this actually went somewhere important: what to buy today and what to buy tomorrow. By your own concession, computers tomorrow will beat computers today. My argument is that that means PowerBooks of tomorrow (2 years) will beat desktops of today(including your flashy dual-800) -- and that's at gaming or whatever else you want to talk about. So, unless you are completely loaded, or are looking to buy your computer for the long haul, you should get something that IS NOT top of the line (so you aren't paying premium prices) and upgrade frequently. You'll have a machine that is always state-of-the-art while losing a minimum in depreciation. You can always prey on the less computer-savvy by selling your used Mac right before Expos and therefore getting top dollar for your machine while maximizing the time that you have to use it.

I guess, JoyBoy, where I'm left befuddled is why you want to invest *SO* much in a computer today, and to make it complete with every gizmo and gadget out there, when you don't have the resources to upgrade frequently or don't choose to. I just am not getting why you don't save some of that cash and trade-up your Mac in a year and get your NVIDIA GeForce 4 card with 64 MB of VRAM or whatever is "in" at that point in time...and if you "just like to play games"...well... $3500+monitor+peripherals is an awful lot to pay for games. I hear there is this new thing called the Sony Playstation out..................

[Edited by john123 on 08-14-2001 at 10:44 PM] [/B]

lets get our defininition of upgrade right!

to me and a lot of people i know an upgrade is to exchange a componat of a machine for a better one. eg proccessor upgrade , or graphincs card upgraded or a sound card upgrade none of wich you can do on the power book!

otoh, the false upgrade that i think your refuring to is actuly a compleet system replacement, both of those have there advantages, namely a componant upgrade is a lot cheaper! where as you do get a little more bang for your buck with a system upgrade.

spikey
Aug 30, 2001, 02:23 PM
Anyway, the playstation 2 is a **** console. It has ****ed up the gaming industry, destroyed games developers etc
the playstation2 doesnt even have anti-aliasing, it is very hard to program for, it is overpriced, ugly, it has destroyed games developers, it breaks, it had to be recalled god knows how many times, it had a late launch, it had a **** launch, it will never have better graphics than its competitors (x-box, gamecube).
So it is a **** up.
considering all that, I would much rather spend a bit more cash for a pc.

john123
Aug 30, 2001, 03:40 PM
Originally posted by Hes Nikke
lets get our defininition of upgrade right!

to me and a lot of people i know an upgrade is to exchange a componat of a machine for a better one. eg proccessor upgrade , or graphincs card upgraded or a sound card upgrade none of wich you can do on the power book!

otoh, the false upgrade that i think your refuring to is actuly a compleet system replacement, both of those have there advantages, namely a componant upgrade is a lot cheaper! where as you do get a little more bang for your buck with a system upgrade.

Sorry, guy, but I don't think your delineation here is shared by all. Or even most, since I have spent the last three years actually working in computing services and all the technogeeks use the word "upgrade" to refer to both components and whole systems.

Curiousstrngmint
Aug 30, 2001, 09:34 PM
Does anyone (or, most likely, everyone) else agree with me that Spikey is forced to resort to using ****, **** or ass every third word to disguise the fact that he has absolutely nothing worthwhile or intelligent to contribute to this discussion?

Spikey: I especially appreciated your eloquent response to John's post about the difference between rumor and fact by pointing out that he "talks out his ass" and is only "farting."

I also was glad to know that the PS2 is a "**** console," that it had a "**** launch," that it "****ed up the gaming industry" and that it was a "**** up." Your persuasive powers are truly magnificent.

I hope that whoever on this site has administrative powers will expel or otherwise remove this infantile.

Hes Nikke
Aug 31, 2001, 02:01 AM
Originally posted by Kela
so ummm aaa...anyone wanna give me a free mac?
I have a Mac 128k sitting in the dining room, i payed $6 for it, do you want it? :P

(that was a joke, i plan on restoring it to it's original gloory and having a boot race against my new TiBook, when ever that comes ^_^)

NOTE: it seems i missed a window in my dock when i posted in my little burst this morning :)

Kela
Aug 31, 2001, 02:01 AM
In support of SPikey, his posts were always filled with good info and accurate remarks. They have recently become like this since 2 POSTERs, JOHN123 and Megaquad, make it a point to give derogatory remarks on our so called "3rd Grade Education" and belittle every point made by me or Spikey and thats what can anger anybody.

Hes Nikke
Aug 31, 2001, 02:10 AM
Originally posted by john123
Sorry, guy, but I don't think your delineation here is shared by all. Or even most, since I have spent the last three years actually working in computing services and all the technogeeks use the word "upgrade" to refer to both components and whole systems. [/B]

i only have 2 things to say here.

1st i don't think my defininition is sheard by all either, but i think yours is shared by fewer. but that's besideds the point, i pointed it out becuse some people might be confused (i thought that joyboy was using my definition whereas you were using your own)


2nd what does having been working in computing services for 3 years have anything to do with the above? i've been working in computer sales for the past 2 years, and guess what, upgrade is used interchangably, but it is used more in the context of a componat upgrade. (at least in my neck of the woods this is prbably a soda/pop/soda-pop kinda thing :))

[Edited by Hes Nikke on 08-31-2001 at 03:18 AM]

Kela
Aug 31, 2001, 02:50 AM
YOu see Hes NIkke, the thing with JOhn123 is that whatever he sais, or "his" definition in this case HAS to be right. You know why? Cause he is from "the Harvard Club". LOL!!

John123: Question for you. Dont the members of the Harvard Club push you around since working in the computer "services" area cant be a Job high enough for a man of your "high" status or?

Megaquad
Aug 31, 2001, 04:22 AM
Originally posted by Kela
YOu see Hes NIkke, the thing with JOhn123 is that whatever he sais, or "his" definition in this case HAS to be right. You know why? Cause he is from "the Harvard Club". LOL!!

John123: Question for you. Dont the members of the Harvard Club push you around since working in the computer "services" area cant be a Job high enough for a man of your "high" status or?


Kela,can you please stop? You are only starting fight..
those administratots should delete all your messages..

Kela
Aug 31, 2001, 05:09 AM
Ok Megaquad. Ill stop. From now on I will post only when neccessary. But if John123 sais something objectionable (like his comment on cd burning which started it all) you tell me to respond ok?

john123
Aug 31, 2001, 11:44 AM
Originally posted by Hes Nikke

2nd what does having been working in computing services for 3 years have anything to do with the above? i've been working in computer sales for the past 2 years, and guess what, upgrade is used interchangably, but it is used more in the context of a componat upgrade. (at least in my neck of the woods this is prbably a soda/pop/soda-pop kinda thing :))


"Services" can include sales. My department was actually called "Sales and Service," although the last time I was doing computer sales was for a year about 4 years ago.

Anyway, this is something of a pointless debate. People are going to choose the terms they prefer, and I am quite happy to use "upgrade" to refer to both components and whole systems.

john123
Aug 31, 2001, 11:46 AM
Originally posted by Kela
Ok Megaquad. Ill stop. From now on I will post only when neccessary. But if John123 sais something objectionable (like his comment on cd burning which started it all) you tell me to respond ok?

My comment on burning was in response to being told I was "wrong." You can't provoke someone and expect them not to strike back.

But perhaps you have already forgotten the chronology. It's OK; I'm sure you took the short bus to school frequently, so we don't expect much from you.

Curiousstrngmint
Sep 1, 2001, 07:53 PM
Kela: Spikey's posts MAY have once been filled with accurate information but I don't think I've seen any information at all other than broad generalizations, like the comments about the PS2 and so forth.

Additionally, while you may be angry, those types of replies do not help your cause at all. If you think you're right stick to your guns. Whether you are or not rampant obscenity is not conducive to intelligent arguments.

And finally, most of the posts I'm incensed about are not in response to any criticism of Mr. Spikey that I've seen. The PS2 post, for example. If you want to get angry write an email. There are far more constructive means of expressing differences than "he talks out his ass."

For example, I'm fairly angry at Spikey, and you don't see me putting up posts like his. I hope I'm coherently and lucidly expounding on my position, because no one would be persuaded in the least if I said something like:

"spikey stop your ****ing cursing. you have no ****ing idea what the hell you're talking about. your **** makes no sense. go rip yourself a new *******."

See what I mean? I made MYSELF angry just writing it. We're not the Sopranos. Those types of posts just poison the whole site.

spikey
Sep 2, 2001, 10:00 AM
Ok ****nuts, u think i shouldnt insult someone just because i use swearing?
swearing is just part of the english language and is aimed to insult someone, so in actual fact you ******** whether you like it or not it is just as bad as someone like john insulting me only without swearing.
And as for the broad generalizations, you call me mentioning the PS2 only having part anti-aliasing a broad generalization, you call me pointing out the difference in pipelline stages between athlons pentiums and G4s a "broad generalization, you call me pointing out why megahertz cant be directly proportional from chip to chip because of vector processing units a "broad generalization"
**** off you faggit u know nothing
Take your ****ing prudish temprement and stuff it up your own ass

If you are going to criticise someone for getting pissed off then you have to also criticise the provoker (john123), and you also have to criticise other people who get angry as much as me (john123). You should not judge what people say by the way that they speak or the amount of swearing because john got just as pissed off as me and he shared just as many insults as me. So ****head, see the content of what people say and not how they say it. ****head, i now officially hate you.

(oh and sorry john123 i was not singling you out but what i said had to be pointed out)

and i dont give a **** what you thing ****head, im gonna carry on speaking how i like until i get banned (if i do get banned)

[Edited by spikey on 09-02-2001 at 11:15 AM]

john123
Sep 2, 2001, 11:35 AM
I don't get angry. Just disappointed in America's youth....

spikey
Sep 2, 2001, 11:41 AM
Im English

Kela
Sep 2, 2001, 12:01 PM
Couriosstingment: You implied that John123 remains very calm during his posts right? Please read this quote from a mail he sent me in response to a comment I had made about him having no clue about CD burning.

" Kela you son of a bitch. You exhibit a brain power how it would be documented in the Bell Curve. Your posts are so ****ing bad that the admins of this forum send me mails telling me how stupid you are."


- now you tell me, this is the kind of stuff John123 sends me!!

john123
Sep 2, 2001, 12:27 PM
Originally posted by Kela
Couriosstingment: You implied that John123 remains very calm during his posts right? Please read this quote from a mail he sent me in response to a comment I had made about him having no clue about CD burning.

" Kela you son of a bitch. You exhibit a brain power how it would be documented in the Bell Curve. Your posts are so ****ing bad that the admins of this forum send me mails telling me how stupid you are."


- now you tell me, this is the kind of stuff John123 sends me!!

That's not from me, and here's how one would know it's not from me: the second sentence isn't even a sentence. The use of the word "how" is altogether inappropriate. That's a mistake I'd never make.

-J

spikey
Sep 2, 2001, 03:09 PM
i dont get it, who implied what?

Gallifrey
Sep 3, 2001, 10:48 PM
Your posts should all be nuked. Grow up your acting like todlers. IF you have to argue do it in ICQ or AIM please.

mnkeybsness
Sep 4, 2001, 12:45 AM
i do enjoy a good argument every once in a while, but all you guys do seem to be taking it a little far, i thought this thread was for a new Ti2G4, but i guess it's more about telling eachother that you are all ****ing retards.

my mistake i guess

spikey
Sep 4, 2001, 10:06 AM
if you dont like it then dont look at it you ****ing wanker.
If someone pisses me off then i dont let it go, so stop whining and put up with it.

jasper
Sep 4, 2001, 06:03 PM
spikey- you are an *******. period. you are not smart and you are not tough and you are not mature. your drivel does not belong in this forum. none of us care to read your childish rants. please go away...

fallt
Sep 4, 2001, 07:21 PM
...but I thought this thread was about the possibility/possibilities of a new TiBook 2. Does the following really contribute anything (other than evidence of latent neolithic tendencies...):

"If you dont like it then don't look at it you ****ing wanker. If someone pisses me off then I dont let it go, so stop whining and put up with it."

Ouch! Grow up there and please do try and calm down; you'll give yourself a heart attack.

Curiousstrngmint
Sep 4, 2001, 10:22 PM
Don't put words in my mouth. You're wrong, Spikey, first of all. Insulting is not the same as swearing. Swearing may be a form of insulting but is far more offensive and crude and frankly unimpressive. "OK ****nuts?" What kind of a retort is that?

I didn't "imply" anything about John's posts. All I'm talking about is you, Spikey. Everything you say is not a broad generalization. The antialiasing point may very well be true. But you do make plenty of general unsupported statements. If you think the ps2 has ****ed up the gaming industry say why.

I'm not a prude at all. I curse plenty (and thank you, I know it's part of the English language) but at the level you curse it loses all effectiveness and meaning and just becomes obscene.

If Spikey believes that he has substantiated opinions on a topic he should feel free to post them, WITHOUT resorting to fourth-grade vocabulary to "argue." I'd be perfectly willing to read them.

But frankly I give up. I don't have the willpower or the tolerance for idiots or for those who may yet be intelligent but instead choose to offend the rest of us and ruin what was a perfectly reasonable discussion. Goodbye.

Kela
Sep 5, 2001, 02:28 AM
LOL!! I cant believe he left!

p.s Curiousstrngmint are you from Singapore?

spikey
Sep 5, 2001, 12:54 PM
Ok blind git****er, someone explain to me what part of this isnt an explanation for why the PS2 is ****

"the playstation2 doesnt even have anti-aliasing, it is very hard to program for, it is overpriced, ugly, it has destroyed games developers, it breaks, it had to be recalled god knows how many times, it had a late launch, it had a **** launch"

And tell me what parts of that are "unsupported statements"

Do i have to give you a website to explain every point in that list?
And about my language, if someone insults me then i insult them back and worse because i dont put up with it. hence the swears.

Good he left, go **** off. Your petty comments arent welcomed by me.

Stryker
Sep 6, 2001, 04:44 AM
So that I don't have to read FOUR pages of posts on the topic -- most of which seemed to take a left turn at Albuquerque -- can anyone tell me what they think (or hear rumors on) Apple will do with regard to the Titanium G4 PowerBooks in the next few months? I am trying to decide whether I should upgrade my 20GB HD (already upgraded from my G3 PowerBook 2000's original 6GB drive) to an IBM 48GB Travelstar or whether I should just get a new PowerBook later this year (which I want)? I'd like to upgrade to a G4 but want to wait to make sure (one way or the other) that Apple is/is not going to upgrade the speed of the PowerBooks (to 600+ MHz) as well as HD size and graphics card upgrade. Any CONCISE info would be appreciated.

Thanks!

john123
Sep 8, 2001, 02:53 AM
According to this article,
http://www.powerbookcentral.com/daily/viewnews.cgi?newsid999824401,17507,
which cites a retailer claiming that the PowerBooks were classified as discontinued products, new TiBooks are on the horizon...

fallt
Sep 8, 2001, 02:35 PM
I hope you're right John, I desperately need a laptop and flat refuse to buy in to Revision 1 so late in the day... One small correction: the URL you'd pasted didn't work, it should read:

http://www.powerbookcentral.com/daily/viewnews.cgi?newsid999824401,17507,

If that doesn't work, cut'n'paste manually, it seems the comma before 17507 might be causing a hiccup.

fallt
Sep 8, 2001, 02:36 PM
Sorry John, it's a software thing... cut'n'paste manually, the comma before 17507 is causing a hiccup.

Technology, too clever for its own good.

samir
Sep 8, 2001, 08:34 PM
I think that the powerbook g4 is great but it has some problems that they have to fix like , the bottom of the laptop gets to hot and also that happen in the new ibook
i know that the powerpc doesn't need refrigeration sistem to work but i belive that they most put one on the laptops
also they said that the battery last 5 hours but thats not tottaly truth

john123
Sep 9, 2001, 12:14 PM
Originally posted by samir
I think that the powerbook g4 is great but it has some problems that they have to fix like , the bottom of the laptop gets to hot and also that happen in the new ibook
i know that the powerpc doesn't need refrigeration sistem to work but i belive that they most put one on the laptops
also they said that the battery last 5 hours but thats not tottaly truth

The hot bottom isn't a "problem" you're going to see fixed. In fact, it's not a problem at all. It's just those pesky laws of physics again....

hbrake
Sep 9, 2001, 02:46 PM
Don't know, but late this month would be a good idea for Apple to announce new Ti Book and new I Book for the Christmas holidays. The Athalon 4 is now in the Compaq (now HP) laptop and therefore, Apple needs something to draw our attention. I want a new TiBook - but are awaiting new ones with faster processor, better graphics card for gaming and a combo drive. Come-on Apple - let's get busy - make me happy!!!