That sly dog Xbox360

[Dagless]

Are you ready folks? The true era of HD begins soon.

the 360 is going 1080p through a firmware upgrade, will also upscale DVDs too.

http://www.joystiq.com/2006/09/20/tgs-xbox-360-to-add-1080p-support-ps3-to-lose-bullet-point/

the HD-DVD player (in Japan) goes on sale November 17th at ¥19,800 (about $170).

http://www.joystiq.com/2006/09/20/tgs-hd-dvd-add-on-hits-japan-nov-17th-for-19-800/

[kwajo.com]

I LOVE firmware updates :p

seriously though, this is great news for those of us already invested in the 360, even if we don't have TVs that support the high resolution, because it shows Microsoft is willing to continue to support existing users and that the system itself is more powerful than the initial software (both OS and games) let us evaluate.

[Dagless]

I think it's nice, and though I don't have a 1080p TV myself it's just great that MS feels like updating this sort of thing. It's a great surprise too. I didn't think the 360 could technically output a 1080p signal!

[kwajo.com]

I don't think it can output 1080p over Component, but it definitely could over VGA. I believe there's a limit to the Component connectors above 1080i


EDIT: well according to the Wikipedia entry, Component can output 1080p, so maybe I'm wrong (assuming Wikipedia is right :rolleyes: )

[MacRumorUser]

I don't think it can output 1080p over Component, but it definitely could over VGA. I believe there's a limit to the Component connectors above 1080i


EDIT: well according to the Wikipedia entry, Component can output 1080p, so maybe I'm wrong (assuming Wikipedia is right :rolleyes: )

Yep. Sony have also clearly stated that their no HDMI version of the PS3 will still output 1080p over component.

Looks like the Ps3 & Xbox 360 are becoming increasingly similar spec wise :) Which is good for consumers as it offers choice.

[2nyRiggz]

Great. I know MS would not let sony bring their monster to the table running 1080 and they are not...up the ante...we all win.



Bless

[takao]

good news for 360 owner .. not that it is coming as a surprise or something

Microsoft really going for taking the sails out of the wind for the ps3

lost odyssey looks pretty damn good too even though from the footage i've seen it's too much fmv for me ... too bad microsoft can't get it out this year ... blue dragon doesn't even come close

[Haoshiro]

Well this is good news, and funny at that. Upscaling of DVDs definitely interests me more then 1080p games, but it's a great tactical move by Microsoft to let people know that "feature" isn't PS3 exclusive.

[MacRumorUser]

I know blue dragon is more anime, but I actually like the style. It reminds me of that old 'Mystical Ninja' (Goeman) games on the Snes.

Xbox 360 owners have a lot to look forward too, there's a shed load of stuff coming to them this month on Live too.

The Xbox Live Marketplace has a bunch of goodies in store for everyone - all in the spirit of the imminent Tokyo Game Show. First of these include the Half-Life 2: Episode Two and Tenchu Senran trailers as well as a Tokyo Game Show picture pack. There are also map packs for Battle for Middle-Earth II: one for Aragorn's Journey (free today until September 29) and another for Northern Badlands (350 points). The Spades, Hearts, Backgammon and Bankshot Billiards on Xbox Live Arcade will now come with Vision camera.

More happy news for the Xbox fans: From today until September 29, Microsoft plans to release a lot of Xbox Live Arcade content and more -- from Halo 3 trailer to Call of Duty 3 demos -- all done to mark the passage of Tokyo Game Show and X06. Picture packs and themes for Alan Wake, Fable 2, Mass Effect and Forza Motorsport 2 will also be available.

In between, you'll also find a five-minute cut of the Tokyo Game Show briefing delivered earlier. Xbox 360 gamers in Japan will have a chance to download the Dead or Alive X2 E3 trailer, a Project Sylpheed trailer and a playable demo of Tenchu Senran. Fans in the US, on the other hand, will be able to see previews of the new Battlestar Galactica series in early October. Finally, in Europe, Xbox Live Gold access will be available to everyone for free between now until September 30, at 8am GMT.


So loads of demos and stuff, and FREE XBOX LIVE GOLD until the end of september for those who havent subscribed yet. Great Stuff microsoft.

Sony really have a lot to live up to to make it's live service compare. Let's hope they do because its better for us all as gamers.

[Foxglove9]

Wow, that is great news for Xbox360 owners!

[Jovian9]

Awesome! I've been looking for a DVD player that can upscale through to HD through component. Though this doesn't say it necessarily will.......since their is no HDMI output on the 360 I assume it will. Now I do not have to spend nearly $200 for that "hard to find" component upscaling DVD player. I cannot wait for this update..........I'm going to be watching lots of DVD's once this happens. :) Anyone find a reference to when this is going to be happening?

I'm no expert on 720p vs 1080i vs 1080p.....but will an upscaling DVD player that can go to 1080p also go to 1080i or 720p (my TV does not do 1080p)?

It stated the HD-DVD add-on is priced for Japan at around $170 US Dollars. I would be fine with that. I was hoping for $150 and dreaming that it would be $100.....but anything under $200 and I will get it.

I'm really starting to like the 360 more and more especially with around 5 games coming out in the next few months that I want. My initial warranty is about to end so I'm going to buy the extended one from Microsoft soon....after that I am going to start buying some XBLA games (just wanted to make sure I didn't have to have my 360 replaced before I bought any).

[MacRumorUser]

^ Yeah I was thinking of buying the extended warranty too.

[mkubal]

I'm no expert on 720p vs 1080i vs 1080p.....but will an upscaling DVD player that can go to 1080p also go to 1080i or 720p (my TV does not do 1080p)?


I don't see why it wouldn't do 720p/1080i. The firmware update will probably allow you to select "1080p" as your output format in addition to the 720p/1080i it had before.

As per upscaling DVDs: Unless the DVDs you play are shown in a small cutout in the middle of the screen, your DVDs are already being upscaled somewhere along the line. I would imagine that the 360 was already doing the upscaling before assuming you had it set on 720p/1080i. If not, it was being upscaled by your TV to fit the screen.

The only differences when it comes to upscaling is the quality of the upscale. Assuming that the 360 wasn't doing upscaling before, it remains to be seen what the quality of the upscale will be.

I believe, however, that the 360 has always upscaled (unless someone has some other info) and I don't think it's going to get any better than it already is. Although I hope someone proves me wrong because I will, eventually, hopefully, have a working 360, maybe. ;)

[DougTheImpaler]

(just wanted to make sure I didn't have to have my 360 replaced before I bought any).
If you *did* have to have ti replaced, the Live Arcade is very specific that you *can* download full versions again, assuming you're logged onto the Xbox with the gamertag you used to purchase.

[wwooden]

I have to say, I really like these semi-annual updates that Micrsoft puts out for the XBox 360. To me, it seems like they are really trying to make a system that people will like and are also listening to their customers and what changes they want as well.

In the last update, I was very happy to see that they allowed for a list of downloads to be made and that they could be downloaded in the background while we play games and such, nice touch.

I wonder what else they have in store for this next update.

[srobert]

Sounds good.

Will 1080p be only for movies played from the HD-DVD drive or also for games?

[MacRumorUser]

I believe, however, that the 360 has always upscaled (unless someone has some other info) and I don't think it's going to get any better than it already is.

360 only upscales to 720p via the VGA cable at the moment. And it does look very much improved over the component output.



I hope the 1080p output is not limited to VGA cable users, but I can't imagine it is. It's the ps3 they are trying to match res with so I'm assuming 1080p and upscaling will be fully through Component as well as VGA.


Will 1080p be only for movies played from the HD-DVD drive or also for games?


Games as well - should developers decide to use it (doubt many will. same as ps3) but chances are most will stick to 720p to maximize framerates in games (again same as PS3)..

[sikkinixx]

i didnt know they could do that with a firmware update! Too bad I don't havbe a 1080p tv....yet.But damn thats sweet, upconverting DVD's will do nicely until my PS3/other dvd player takes its place (damn 360 is too loud for watching movies...:( )

[Abulia]

HAHAHAHAAAAAHAAAAHAAA! :D

Sorry, I'm just grinning from ear-to-ear at everyone who was stating that the 360 was "gimped" or "inferior" to the PS3 and couldn't do 1080p...EVAR. Anyone remember "Xbox 1.5?"

EAT IT! :D

The big question is...will this be enough to push jimmi into finally getting a 360?

Oh, who am I kidding. Of course not! ;)

[MacRumorUser]

The big question is...will this be enough to push jimmi into finally getting a 360?

Oh, who am I kidding. Of course not! ;)

Lol! If it was a Nintendo 360 then he would have done so already ;) :D (sorry Jimmi mate, couldnt resist)

[takao]

HAHAHAHAAAAAHAAAAHAAA! :D

Sorry, I'm just grinning from ear-to-ear at everyone who was stating that the 360 was "gimped" or "inferior" to the PS3 and couldn't do 1080p...EVAR. Anyone remember "Xbox 1.5?"

EAT IT! :D

The big question is...will this be enough to push jimmi into finally getting a 360?

Oh, who am I kidding. Of course not! ;)


i would be happy if there were actually some 1080p tvs available here for a start ... heck last time they didn't even had a 1080i tv in the showroom :rolleyes:

if the 360 was priced here as it is in japan i guess jimmi would buy one .... i would buy one for 200€ including 2 games too

[Jovian9]

If you *did* have to have ti replaced, the Live Arcade is very specific that you *can* download full versions again, assuming you're logged onto the Xbox with the gamertag you used to purchase.

Yeah, I was aware of that. But I just wanted to be sure that I didn't have some of the major problems that others are having here. I have a 90-day return window with my 360 from Target....so if I would have had constant problems I probably would have just returned it and got a refund and not ever bought another one. So I didn't want to risk wasting money on XBLA games just in case. It is great that they let you download the full versions again though.....I think the Wii will also allow that. Too bad Apple doesn't do that with the iTunes Store. That is the reason I hardly buy from the iTunes store anymore. I lost a few songs when my RevA iMac G5 crashed........and I'd rather lose a few bucks than have to deal with tech support and all the time it takes to get anything done with them to get approval for another download.

[greatdevourer]

Just a question generally - the article says that it upscales the DVDs to 1080p. What does this gain? Please explain this to me. The source material is 480p. It's not like a game, where you can render it in higher resolutions. I really don't see the point

[GFLPraxis]

Just a question generally - the article says that it upscales the DVDs to 1080p. What does this gain? Please explain this to me. The source material is 480p. It's not like a game, where you can render it in higher resolutions. I really don't see the point


It's like antialiasing. If you watch 480p content on a 1080p screen, it'll be stretched and blocky...this smooths out and blends together the blocks, so it looks fine.

[MacRumorUser]

Just a question generally - the article says that it upscales the DVDs to 1080p. What does this gain? Please explain this to me. The source material is 480p. It's not like a game, where you can render it in higher resolutions. I really don't see the point

Well I know what your saying - it's like

taking a low res JPG 640x480 and stretching it to 1920x1080 would indeed reduce the quality.

BUT... what these 'upscaling' devices do is actually process the image with very clever codecs that not only increase the resolution, but increase the quality of the image, without causing artifacts and blurring..

It really does work. I have a Panasonic HDMI DVD player that does it and you really can tell the difference. I was watching armageddon upscaled to 1080i last night on a 42" lcd and it looked amazing.

True its not real HD, but for most people who are very happy with DVD, and have a flatscreen TV, upscaling offers a cheap way of boosting your existing dvd's without investing in a €1500 blu ray dvd player.

[takao]

i think you both are looking for "Interpolation" ;)

[Dagless]

HAHAHAHAAAAAHAAAAHAAA! :D

Sorry, I'm just grinning from ear-to-ear at everyone who was stating that the 360 was "gimped" or "inferior" to the PS3 and couldn't do 1080p...EVAR. Anyone remember "Xbox 1.5?"

EAT IT! :D

The big question is...will this be enough to push jimmi into finally getting a 360?

Oh, who am I kidding. Of course not! ;)

It's nice, but no. It's still lacking the games IMO, they're still going to charge me extra just because I have a wireless network. I don't have a 1080p TV so it's also not much good to me. But what is good is MS pushing the 360 with these good extra bonuses.
Oh, I also won't buy one just like I won't be buying a Wii for a while... I'm spending all my dosh on the best iMac I can afford. :p

[XNine]

Meh, nothing exciting here. Anyone who thinks upscaling of DVD's is some great feature is sorely mistaken. There's only so far that you can upscale before it degrades into garbage. Take a DVD, go to your local Apple Store, and play it full screen on a 30 inch display. You'll see just how bad a SD DVD looks on a true HD display.

*sigh*

[Jovian9]

Meh, nothing exciting here. Anyone who thinks upscaling of DVD's is some great feature is sorely mistaken. There's only so far that you can upscale before it degrades into garbage. Take a DVD, go to your local Apple Store, and play it full screen on a 30 inch display. You'll see just how bad a SD DVD looks on a true HD display.

*sigh*

I disagree. It's a great feature when it is FREE.....which it will be when they do the firmware update. FREE. I have 600 DVD's and very few of them will be replaced by their HD-DVD counterparts so I think this is a great upgrade. Even if it is only a tiny-bit better with upscaling it is a tiny-bit better for FREE. I do not have nor will I ever have a 30" Apple Display so that is irrelevant for me. I have a 53" HDTV and this firmware update will be welcomed :)

[coal]

This is great news though sort of expected. I am not going to be purchasing any new HD media for the immediate future as most of the initial offerings are not too appealing. Now I just need to upgrade this 1080i TV!

[gco212]

Meh, nothing exciting here. Anyone who thinks upscaling of DVD's is some great feature is sorely mistaken. There's only so far that you can upscale before it degrades into garbage. Take a DVD, go to your local Apple Store, and play it full screen on a 30 inch display. You'll see just how bad a SD DVD looks on a true HD display.

*sigh*

I could be mistaken, but isn't this nothing like showing a DVD on a 30 inch display? Unless I'm mistaken, there's no true upscaling in that situation, simply stretching.

[MacRumorUser]

I could be mistaken, but isn't this nothing like showing a DVD on a 30 inch display? Unless I'm mistaken, there's no true upscaling in that situation, simply stretching.

your right.

A standdard DVD player is doing that, the upscaling ones improve the picture quality not just blow it up.

[bmb012]

There's no upscalling required for 1080p, the system would just have to deinterlace the interlaced signal, right?

I only have 720p tv (psh, yeah, 'only,' ha, the thing's gorgeous), but upscaling DVDs would rock, they always look so washed out...

[HunterPlatinum]

screw 360 or ps3
Atari Jaguar 4 Life


:p :p :p :p :p

[Dagless]

screw 360 or ps3
Atari Jaguar 4 Life


:p :p :p :p :p

At least name a good old console!

[Schmittroth]

So will the regular XB360 upscale DVD to 1080p or will you need the HD-DVD add on? And how do regular DVDs play in it currently. Is it as painful to use and the PS2 and original Xbox are? Slowest access times and menus ever.

[2nyRiggz]

screw 360 or ps3
Atari Jaguar 4 Life


Yup hold on to that...The Jag will never see the light again.

I still don't think the 360 will gain any grounds in Japan with all the 1080s, RPGs and the "go this go that." Japan is just not interested in the 360.


Bless

[XNine]

Yup hold on to that...The Jag will never see the light again.



Bless

Now THAT was an expensive console. People wanna talk about the 360/PS3 being expensive... Christ, the Jaguar was 700 bucks in a time when there were only 200 dollar systems.... YIKES!

Oh, btw, I'm not saying upscaling is completely useless, I'm just saying it doesn't do a whole lot compared to a true HD recorded signal. Jovian brought up a good point, and that is that there's not a whole lot of people willing to replace their already substantial DVD collection. I'm sure as hell not. But regardless, upscaling doesn't equal HD video... but I'm sure everyone knew that. So I'm going to cook my porkchops and pray to god they turn out like they're supposed to, or else I'll be feeding them to the dog and I'll be eating Little Juan burritos for dinner....

[Jovian9]

Now THAT was an expensive console. People wanna talk about the 360/PS3 being expensive... Christ, the Jaguar was 700 bucks in a time when there were only 200 dollar systems.... YIKES!

Oh, btw, I'm not saying upscaling is completely useless, I'm just saying it doesn't do a whole lot compared to a true HD recorded signal. Jovian brought up a good point, and that is that there's not a whole lot of people willing to replace their already substantial DVD collection. I'm sure as hell not. But regardless, upscaling doesn't equal HD video... but I'm sure everyone knew that. So I'm going to cook my porkchops and pray to god they turn out like they're supposed to, or else I'll be feeding them to the dog and I'll be eating Little Juan burritos for dinner....

Agreed. It definitely will not be as good as true HD but if it's even a little better I'll be happy. I'll replace my favorites: Stanley Kubrick Collection (they better release it in HD), Star Wars, LOTR, etc.....but most of them will never be replaced.
How'd those chops turn out Onizuka? :)

[Mavimao]

So I'm going to cook my porkchops and pray to god they turn out like they're supposed to, or else I'll be feeding them to the dog and I'll be eating Little Juan burritos for dinner....

The trick is, don't overcook them. You still want the juices in them. What I like to do is to cook them in sauerkraut. Mmmm! Or throw in a can of sliced pineapples - juice and all. I can't say I recommend sauerkraut AND pineapples together, but anyone can be my guest and try.

And as far as the topic is concerned: this is more of a marketing move than anything. They needed to show that they are just as capable as sony and needed to counter their "TRUE HD" hooplah.

The ironic thing is: to get 1080p, you need to reduce polygons and textures. So in practice your games look less detailed and perhaps WORSE than if they were in 720p/1080i

[ReanimationLP]

The Playstation 3 will still sell well due to the exclusive games like MGS4 and FF13.

[Jovian9]

It looks as though we were all misled by the initial announcement by Microsoft. The 360 will not upconvert all DVD's.....only those being output through VGA. DVD's played via component will only do 480p. This is rather disappointing. They clearly did not state this at first.

http://www.engadgethd.com/2006/09/21/xbox-360-hd-dvd-playback-maximum-1080i-via-component-1080p-vga/

Does anyone think one of these would work in order to allow upscaling?:

http://www.lenexpo-electronics.com/home.php?cat=276&gclid=CKzm-NKgyYcCFQT_Sgod51xZFA

http://www.smarthome.com/777060.html

These would take a VGA signal and convert it into a component signal........therefore the 360 would be outputting through VGA and therefore upconvert the DVD's....I think :)

[Dagless]

That's fine for my and my mates. All the 360 folk I know are playing with VGA, though it does seem to mess up a lot of regular Xbox games. I really don't get how they can just all output the same signal. My Geforce 2 can output VGA and S-Video, why is it so hard for consoles to do the same with no problems?

[XNine]

VGA.... How many people in the world have their 360 hooked up to a ****ing computer monitor? What, Jimmi and all of his clsoe friends? Jesus. I'm going to guarentee that most people have their consoles hooked to either a A/V receiver, or a TV directly. BAH! Googleymoo@MS.

[greatdevourer]

It looks as though we were all misled by the initial announcement by Microsoft. The 360 will not upconvert all DVD's.....only those being output through VGA. DVD's played via component will only do 480p. This is rather disappointing. They clearly did not state this at first.

http://www.engadgethd.com/2006/09/21/xbox-360-hd-dvd-playback-maximum-1080i-via-component-1080p-vga/

Does anyone think one of these would work in order to allow upscaling?:

http://www.lenexpo-electronics.com/home.php?cat=276&gclid=CKzm-NKgyYcCFQT_Sgod51xZFA

http://www.smarthome.com/777060.html

These would take a VGA signal and convert it into a component signal........therefore the 360 would be outputting through VGA and therefore upconvert the DVD's....I think :) So it appears that the VGA connector will now support hires monitors! :D

[Abulia]

Well, they may not have stated it implicitly, but it sure was implied. You can't use those resolutions over component and be HDCP-compliant. VGA has no such restrictions.

As someone who owns three HD sets that support 1080i I guess I don't see what the fuss is about. Personally, 1080p is nothing but marketing material; until you've seen 1080i vs 1080p you really don't understand that there's minimal difference in picture quality.

So bagging on MS because they provide a free upgrade to support a resolution that less that 1% of all HD sets worldwide can display...kinda confuses me.

Your monitor would need to support WUXGA 1920x1200 to view 1080i/1080p and even then the output would look identical.

[Jovian9]

I have no interest in 1080p as my TV is 1080i. My interest lies in the upconverting of regular DVD's. Microsoft made it sound as if they would be enabling this without initially stating it would be VGA only. There are upconverting DVD players out there that allow the signal to go through component as well as HDMI.

[Abulia]

I have no interest in 1080p as my TV is 1080i. My interest lies in the upconverting of regular DVD's. Microsoft made it sound as if they would be enabling this without initially stating it would be VGA only. There are upconverting DVD players out there that allow the signal to go through component as well as HDMI.
I know. I own one. :)

I agree; there's no technical reason why they couldn't use the 360's internal scaler to upconvert the DVD output. I suspect this is another firmware update down the road.

You don't give everything all at once; they need a good press release for around the time of the PS3 launch and a free upconverting DVD player would be one.

[takao]

I agree; there's no technical reason why they couldn't use the 360's internal scaler to upconvert the DVD output. I suspect this is another firmware update down the road.

well it's a right/license issue so i don't know if some content providers will allow that output ;)

[funwithstuff]

It really does work. I have a Panasonic HDMI DVD player that does it and you really can tell the difference. I was watching armageddon upscaled to 1080i last night on a 42" lcd and it looked amazing.


Upscaling picture quality is very dependent on the algorithm used to scale. Most standalone DVD players apparently have better code for this than the 360. I can verify that the 360 does *not* do a good job of this compared to, say, my PowerBook plugged into a TV with VGA. To me, the PowerBook looks better than the 360 for DVD playback at 720p. YMMV, and your TV may produce better results with one plug over another, which could sway things.

Since the DVD Forum forbids upscaling over component (stupid copy protection nonsense) then first-party DVD players like the 360 won't either. Your standard cheapie player apparently *will* upscale over component, if you can find a code on the net to activate it. Of course, the 360 observes region codes too, which counts it out for a number of my discs.

[Jovian9]

It looks as though we were all misled by the initial announcement by Microsoft. The 360 will not upconvert all DVD's.....only those being output through VGA. DVD's played via component will only do 480p. This is rather disappointing. They clearly did not state this at first.

http://www.engadgethd.com/2006/09/21/xbox-360-hd-dvd-playback-maximum-1080i-via-component-1080p-vga/

Does anyone think one of these would work in order to allow upscaling?:

http://www.lenexpo-electronics.com/home.php?cat=276&gclid=CKzm-NKgyYcCFQT_Sgod51xZFA

http://www.smarthome.com/777060.html

These would take a VGA signal and convert it into a component signal........therefore the 360 would be outputting through VGA and therefore upconvert the DVD's....I think :)

I'm quoting myself to see if anyone can answer the question I had. Does anyone have any experience with VGA to Component cables? If so, how is the quality?

Thanks!

[Abulia]

I'm quoting myself to see if anyone can answer the question I had. Does anyone have any experience with VGA to Component cables? If so, how is the quality?
Well.........you're converting analog to analog so there's going to be a drop. Not much of a way around it. I suspect the level of drop is tied to the quality of the converter.

What's your set, if I may ask? Is the viewing source worth bothering with this trouble?

See, that's why I got a HD set 4 years ago with DVI-HDCP to avoid this sticky issue. My upconverting DVD player does 720p/1080i over HDMI/DVI-HDCP avoiding this issue entirely. A much better quality video chip than the 360, too.

Of course if you're not really a HT buff then it's all rather academic. You'll got to be pretty sharp-eyed and have a good quality set to see a meaningful difference between a native 480p DVD and an upconverted 720p/1080i DVD.

[evangelion-01]

now i only need a high def tv with vga input because vga owns on xbox and it will only upscale dvds with it.

[Tommyg117]

So it will upscale regular dvds? Or do I have to buy that handy hddvd add on for any sort of quality?

[SpankyPenzaanz]

now i only need a high def tv with vga input because vga owns on xbox and it will only upscale dvds with it.

I wouldn't be surprised if they annouce a MS AVport to Hdmi cable because those damned hollywood studios want their 'precious little movies' encrypted and that is the only real difference that hdmi has over dvi

EDIT: by the way I am not saying this angrily just making a mere observation as I will probably have a x360 by spring as well - don't yell at me

[MacRumorUser]

I wouldn't be surprised if they annouce a MS AVport to Hdmi cable because those damned hollywood studios want their 'precious little movies' encrypted and that is the only real difference that hdmi has over dvi

EDIT: by the way I am not saying this angrily just making a mere observation as I will probably have a x360 by spring as well - don't yell at me

Apparently movie studios wont be encrypting HD-DVD or BluRay until around 2010 so for the life of these consoles (PS3 & Xbox360) HDMI & HDCP is not as big a major issue as once we were led to believe. Hence there will be no need for HDMI cable for the 360 (even though I'd quite like one as its a nice tidy cable)

[takao]

Apparently movie studios wont be encrypting HD-DVD or BluRay until around 2010 so for the life of these consoles (PS3 & Xbox360) HDMI & HDCP is not as big a major issue as once we were led to believe. Hence there will be no need for HDMI cable for the 360 (even though I'd quite like one as its a nice tidy cable)

so after 4 years your hd dvd player is useless because it wont play new hd-dvd movies ?

[MacRumorUser]

so after 4 years your hd dvd player is useless because it wont play new hd-dvd movies ?

YEP! :D Bless :o

[Abulia]

so after 4 years your hd dvd player is useless because it wont play new hd-dvd movies ?
Yea.

Sorry, but this is why I think it's just silly to rely on the goodwill of the studios to not turn on the ICT in this lifetime.

BTW, the PS3 has the same issues.

[kuyu]

A lot of newer HDTV's have VGA inputs. For anyone looking at HD, don't buy anything with less than 2 HDMI, 1 VGA, & 2 Component inputs.