Two version of GT:HD for PS3 - crippled and REALLY crippled.

[LukeW]

Just read this story-

http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3153775

Gran Turismo HD: Two Versions, Tons Microtransactions
Famitsu reports a brand new model for Gran Turismo on PS3.

There's horse armor and then there's the kind of microtransactions that Famitsu is reporting (via: Beyond3D and the vitriolic NeoGAF). According to the Famitsu inteview with Kazunori Yamauchi, Gran Turismo HD will have two SKUs on the PS3. One of these games will ship with no cars, all of them will be purchased via microtransactions.
The other, Gran Turismo HD: Premium, will ship with two courses and 30 cars, with an additional 30 cars and an additional two courses online at a later date. The Premium game is being considered a prologue to the PS3's eventual Gran Turismo 5.

The microtransaction-focused game, Gran Turismo HD: Classic will be the online-focused entrant into the GT-series. In this game, players will (reportedly) start with no cars or courses available to them. Instead, they will need to purchase their stable of cars and courses to race on. The pricing reported in the Famitsu piece indicated that cars would cost between 50-100 yen ($0.43-$0.85) and courses between 200-500 yen ($1.71-$4.26). There are approximiately 750 cars and 50 tracks available for purchase in the GT: HD Classic. Let's do the math:

750 cars for $0.50-$1.00 (Sony will round-up, don't you think?)
50 tracks for $1.50-$4.50
A complete copy of the game will cost gamers somewhere between $426.50 and $975, and that's without factoring in whatever Sony decides to charge for the menus (since that's all you'll get with GT HD: Classic).


Why bother unlocking cars and tracks when you can just buy them? What the hell do you get to do in the game then? Do Sony care or do they just want your money?

[raggedjimmi]

Disclaimer The following message is only valid if this translation turns out to be true

bloody hell. What have we come to?

It does make sense from a business point of view too, which is the scary thing. I mean this really doesn't bother me at all as I don't play racing sim games.
Good luck to Sony on this. It's not a good system to gamers frankly. If I was a developer I'd rather reward skill with new cars than having to charge for them.

[MacRumorUser]

:mad: well this may seem unlikely, but chances are there is some truth to this.

:o Look at EA's recent announcements.

Fifa 07 on xbox 360 will ship with only half the teams and stadiums of the ps2 & xbox versions with EA charging you to download them

EA are also planning on charging a subscription to play Burnout 5 online.



Looks like publishers are warming to downloadable content which is good, but not in these Greedy Bastard ways.

Seems like not only do they want to charge us more for the game, but they want to rip all the stuff out of it and charge us extra for the privillege of putting it back in.

DAMN THIS GREEDY GENERATION. Only thing we can do is say NO and refuse to purchase these games, period.... If noone buys the game, publishers wont put these crippled rubbish out there.

[AoWolf]

Screw cheat codes we will just make people pay!!

The good news here: This will all be pirateable you know it will. Some one will find a way..

[raggedjimmi]

Screw cheat codes we will just make people pay!!

The good news here: This will all be pirateable you know it will. Some one will find a way..

I'm dead against piracy but if this goes through then yaaargh maties where can i buy ye modchip.

no way in hell am I buying crippled versions of games and paying for what I want extra. games should not work like that.

[MacRumorUser]

Do you know whats really really bad about this.

Sony take a $20 1080i capable PS2 title

Slightly up the res to 1080p (which most people will never use for a long while)

Charge you $59 and then decide to strip all the stuff out of the game and charge you even more to put it back in....

If they get away with this, then it's the consumers who are at fault, because they allow them to get away with it.

PS3 has backwards compatability so If you want to play GT HD on your PS3. BUY the PS2 version and play it ay 1080i - you'll barely notice the difference and wont be ripped off.....

[dwishbone]

whats all the complaining about?
just like the PS3 at $600...this is a bargain.
PS3 is a Bluray player for $400 cheaper than SONY's very own Bluray players. they make both. what a bargain!

for $900+ you get 750 cars? wow. thats insane value!
i refuse to pay $60 for games anymore. they gotta at least be $900 now for me to feel im getting my money's worth. kudos sony!

(i really hope you can pick up the insane sarcasm in this post. sony you can rot in hell)

[takao]

if true then it would be completely ridiculous

sure we know already that singstar for ps3 will have downloadable songs for 1 €*but this would be insane

for EA total screwing up with fifa 07 for 360: even the DS has 26 leagues and nearly all stadiums and they can't add it in the 360 version ? sorry that's just crippeling on purpose

[srobert]

Edit: I removed my post. It was inaccurate.

[gloss]

Thank God for the Wii.

[MacRumorUser]

Thank God for the Wii.

Why?


I hear the new Mario Strikers only comes with a football. All the other stuff has to be bought seperatly ;) :p :D

And the reason Metriod 3 was delayed. So they could take all the good stuff out of it of course ;)



(i'm joking incase someone replies 'no they havent!' :rolleyes: )

Seriously if this is the future of gaming, we should all give up now.

[raggedjimmi]

Thank god I'll be a developer in the next few years, I WILL TAKE MORE MONEY OFF YOU.

[DougTheImpaler]

This is quite different than the micropayments that Project Gotham 3 had...you can get 12 cars for like $5 at a time, and even some of those cars are free if you download them individually.

[MacRumorUser]

This is quite different than the micropayments that Project Gotham 3 had...you can get 12 cars for like $5 at a time, and even some of those cars are free if you download them individually.

Yeah giving us 'expansion packs' like PGR3, GRAW are ok. You've given us a full game and a good few months later saying, hey do you want to prolong your game - here's some new expansions you can download....

That I approve of. It's just the same as adding an expansion onto a pc title...

--- however ----

But with this fiasco, here's a totally crippled game that your going to have to start spending extra Straight away to get any game what so ever..... Bah humbug Sony... Unless they give it away Free with the PS3 (which is possible, seeing as it's not listed to buy I believe) then it's a total con.

Same as Fifa 07 and EA. That's a total con job too.

People dont be stupid, we have the power in our pockets to stop being ripped off. If people dont buy the game, then they will think twice before pulling the stunt again.

Unfortunetly I imagine there will still be those consumers who will rush out and buy GT 4 HD, Fifa 07 etc... A big negative drive from the press is whats needed to get the consumer outraged, and then maybe we'll be able to stop this greedy monopoly developers are planning....

[DavidLeblond]

Why?


I hear the new Mario Strikers only comes with a football. All the other stuff has to be bought seperatly ;) :p :D

And the reason Metriod 3 was delayed. So they could take all the good stuff out of it of course ;)



(i'm joking incase someone replies 'no they havent!' :rolleyes: )

Seriously if this is the future of gaming, we should all give up now.

I could just see playing Mario and hitting a block to get a fire flower and instead getting a popup window asking for my credit card number if I wanted to "upgrade."

[Onizuka]

This is something that cannot be blamed on Sony, btw. It's a greedy developer.

Well, I'm not into racing games at all, but this is a big kick in the nuts to whoever was waiting for the game. Lame. Lame lame lame.

[sikkinixx]

IGN says its like kinda that GT4 Prologue, sort of a demo'esc kind of game. I could see them giving you a pack, so like for a $1 you get 40 cars or something. I'm actually looking forward to the preview of GT5 on the disc.

I can't believe everyone is so shocked by all this. How did you NOT know it was coming? Fee's are just becoming part of the game (pardon the pun). MMO's charge you to buy the game the charge you half as much each month to play. Yeah yeah they have servers to maintain and blah blah but its a money cow for them for sure. Since these games are becoming so freakin expensive to make, its only natural that they will wanna take to leech as much outta you as they can. And all those people on 360 who paid 2$ or whatever it is for some horse armor just made it worse. Paying for an expansion, like MRU said, is all well and dandy, but paying for a cosmetic detail or for a new castle or a new spell is the way of the future.

And to the guy who said "thank god for Wii", wake up dude, Wii has a marketplace too, you dont think they will pull the same thing? Nintendo? Mr. You-have-to-buy-a-component-cable-seperately-for-$60-? Nintendo wants money just as much as Sony/EA/MS does and if they see that people are willing to pay for crap like this, then they are gonna do it to.*cough5dollarsforaNESgamecough*

[mwpeters8182]

Do you know whats really really bad about this.

Sony take a $20 1080i capable PS2 title

Slightly up the res to 1080p (which most people will never use for a long while)


PS2 games are 480i, not 1080.

[raggedjimmi]

And to the guy who said "thank god for Wii", wake up dude, Wii has a marketplace too, you dont think they will pull the same thing? Nintendo? Mr. You-have-to-buy-a-component-cable-seperately-for-$60-? Nintendo wants money just as much as Sony/EA/MS does and if they see that people are willing to pay for crap like this, then they are gonna do it to.*cough5dollarsforaNESgamecough*

Just some counterpoints;

Nintendo said their online content will be free. It's up to 3rd party devs if they want to charge for their downloads.
The component cable is a 3rd party pre-order that hasn't an official price yet. how much were the official Cube cables? half that. oh and it's probably worth noting that $60 is exactly what Microsoft charge for their official VGA cable here, so come on now.
$5= £2.50. I will give you that £2.50 on Paypal right now if you can go out into a UK store and buy a working copy of Contra. £2.50? try £30, along side Zelda and the other classics. Or if you're feeling frisky try finding a boxed FF1-6 for less than £30 or Chrono Trigger for less than £50, see attached.

[srobert]

PS2 games are 480i, not 1080.

I thought GT was 1080i.

Yup… it was: Link (http://www.hdtvarcade.com/hdtvforum/index.php?autocom=custom&page=ps2gi) (One of the only 2 PS2 1080i games)

[Cooknn]

750 cars for $0.50-$1.00 (Sony will round-up, don't you think?)
50 tracks for $1.50-$4.50Give me a cockpit view (and a game that doesn't lock up) and I'll buy in. Otherwise, I'll pass :rolleyes:

[mkubal]

I can't believe everyone is so shocked by all this. How did you NOT know it was coming? Fee's are just becoming part of the game (pardon the pun). MMO's charge you to buy the game the charge you half as much each month to play. Yeah yeah they have servers to maintain and blah blah but its a money cow for them for sure. Since these games are becoming so freakin expensive to make, its only natural that they will wanna take to leech as much outta you as they can. And all those people on 360 who paid 2$ or whatever it is for some horse armor just made it worse. Paying for an expansion, like MRU said, is all well and dandy, but paying for a cosmetic detail or for a new castle or a new spell is the way of the future.

I think what shocks people is that, presumably, you would be required to pay more and more to actually complete the game. I probably wouldn't have liked final fantasy as much if I had to pay $1 for each additional sword or materia I wanted/needed (I'm a dork, I know).

That being said, I doubt things are as bad as they seem. Charging that much for cars that are probably necessary to complete the game would be suicide. Sure the "hardcore" GT freaks would buy them, but do we really want to come to a point in gaming where only the rich can afford to finish games?

(This makes me glad that my new iMac will arrive on Saturday. I can Civ-out for a disgusting amount of time without worrying about having to pay extra for ICBMs or horse armor.)

[MacRumorUser]

PS2 games are 480i, not 1080.

Bless :D GT 4 on PS2 was able to output 1080i

So GT 4 HD on PS3 is pretty much a lame excuse for repackaging the same game twice.

Making us pay for content is even lamer.

If you want GT4 buy the PS2 version and play it on backwards compatability. Though it would not surprise me if Sony make GT4 one of the few games not backwards compatible just so the can exploit the new version...

[takao]

here the original article (famitsu) (thx consolewars.de)

anybody knowing enough japanese ?

http://www.consolewars.de/generalpurpose/pictureviewer.php?id=42167&cid=&sid=&rid=13554&type=news&redirect=%2Fnews%2Fnewsdisplay.php%3Fshowpage%3D%26idx%3D13554%23ganc#screenview

http://www.consolewars.de/generalpurpose/pictureviewer.php?cid=&sid=&rid=13554&type=news&deleteit=&redirect=%2Fnews%2Fnewsdisplay.php%3Fshowpage%3D%26idx%3D13554%23ganc&id=42166#screenview

http://www.consolewars.de/generalpurpose/pictureviewer.php?cid=&sid=&rid=13554&type=news&deleteit=&redirect=%2Fnews%2Fnewsdisplay.php%3Fshowpage%3D%26idx%3D13554%23ganc&id=42165#screenview

[twoodcc]

man, i just can't believe this....just can't believe it. GT 5 should be worth getting a PS3 by itself, and now this?

i love the Gran Turismo games, one of the reasons i might get a PS3, but now i'm not so sure.

i'm speechless

[2nyRiggz]

Sounds like the dumbest plan on earth but knowing these companies they will do it...there would be no way I would would buy GT..I never do.



Bless

[grizzlybrice]

If they decided to include a lot of cars in the game already (like normal), and then charge for new cars that are announced after the release, then I'd be fine with it.
But give one a bare bones copy of a game and hope that people are spending real money to proceed further in it... argh.

[bokdol]

wow soo much hate for a demo.. this is what it really is. demoing the new online service. pay 5 bucks get 30 cars and play online. most software companies give out demo or sell anyhow. i personally think it's great. online play and a few cars for cheap. xbox marketplace is the same thing. so whats the big deal?


the only problem i see is that i wont buy a ps3 anytime soon becasue i dont have any first born children to give to sony....

the total cost will suck though.. oh well

[greatdevourer]

This is something that cannot be blamed on Sony, btw. It's a greedy developer.

Well, I'm not into racing games at all, but this is a big kick in the nuts to whoever was waiting for the game. Lame. Lame lame lame. I thought Sony was the Gran Turismo developer :confused:

Either way, this is why I dislike episodic games - rather than pay £30 for the entire game, you pay for it in 4 £20 parts. Reminds me of those TV loan companies...

[Haoshiro]

It's developed by Polyphony Digital, which is owned by Sony.

[dwishbone]

in this case sony is in fact the greedy developer. polyphony digital is (if im not mistaken) owned primarily by Sony.

this kind of crap makes me just sick. look at the travesty that was NCAA Football 07 for the 360. Not only was it really a substandard game...hell the game's 3 years ago were better, they left out TONS of content. im not talking game modes either. for one thing they left out all the alternate uniforms and classic teams. why? because EA said they had plans to sell these online and they also were not included for "size constraints". SIZE CONSTRAINTS? this is a friggin 360??? you mean to tell me you can squeeze all that content onto the Xbox, PS2, and even the PSP version...but for some reason there is a problem on a dual layer DVD??? give me a break. this plan has also backfired for consumers and for EA. their research has shown that the reaction to this tactic was horrible and noone would buy the content online. EA has officially announced that they have scrapped the plans for the downloadable content.
Also...Madded "Hall of Fame" edition. HoF has classic teams and such. it costs more than the normal version. again wtf. this stuff had been in Madden for years and suddenly they said "hey...lets make two versions and get them to pay extra for content we were already giving them".
These tactics just make me ill.

[SpankyPenzaanz]

in this case sony is in fact the greedy developer. polyphony digital is (if im not mistaken) owned primarily by Sony.

this kind of crap makes me just sick. look at the travesty that was NCAA Football 07 for the 360. Not only was it really a substandard game...hell the game's 3 years ago were better, they left out TONS of content. im not talking game modes either. for one thing they left out all the alternate uniforms and classic teams. why? because EA said they had plans to sell these online and they also were not included for "size constraints". SIZE CONSTRAINTS? this is a friggin 360??? you mean to tell me you can squeeze all that content onto the Xbox, PS2, and even the PSP version...but for some reason there is a problem on a dual layer DVD??? give me a break. this plan has also backfired for consumers and for EA. their research has shown that the reaction to this tactic was horrible and noone would buy the content online. EA has officially announced that they have scrapped the plans for the downloadable content.
Also...Madded "Hall of Fame" edition. HoF has classic teams and such. it costs more than the normal version. again wtf. this stuff had been in Madden for years and suddenly they said "hey...lets make two versions and get them to pay extra for content we were already giving them".
These tactics just make me ill.

Bring back the sega sports nfl games - down with EA

[Onizuka]

It's developed by Polyphony Digital, which is owned by Sony.

Ah, well, then it could be a greedy Sony.

[Cooknn]

Ah, well, then it could be a greedy Sony.Guess they have to figure out how to make back all the money they'll lose with the sale of every PS3 :rolleyes: Retail for a standalone Blu-Ray drive is about $700 at the moment.

[fireball jones]

Is GT5 going to be online (I would assume?). The AI in GT4 was outright stupid. It made unlocking cars hardly worth the time... I think my AI controlled car took those 24 hour series by about 30 laps :rolleyes:

Not to mention the class system in the GT series has always been bizarre, when you can take a 800hp Viper into the intro RWD series... maybe you figured it out, I liked Forza a lot more.

Too bad none of the sim games are coming out for the Wii :(

[sikkinixx]

Just some counterpoints;

Nintendo said their online content will be free. It's up to 3rd party devs if they want to charge for their downloads.
The component cable is a 3rd party pre-order that hasn't an official price yet. how much were the official Cube cables? half that. oh and it's probably worth noting that $60 is exactly what Microsoft charge for their official VGA cable here, so come on now.
$5= £2.50. I will give you that £2.50 on Paypal right now if you can go out into a UK store and buy a working copy of Contra. £2.50? try £30, along side Zelda and the other classics. Or if you're feeling frisky try finding a boxed FF1-6 for less than £30 or Chrono Trigger for less than £50, see attached.


Nintendo is still letting them charge for it, but fair enough. But I am still choked about having to pay for component cables. Doesn't EVERY new tv (aside from those little cheap-o 79$ ones) have component now? Hell I know my 20" Toshiba that I got for 159$ has them, and they make a hell of a difference with my PS2.

And as for the retro games, well no kidding they cost a lot, they are in original boxes etc, they are collectors items! ;) maybe I should sell my orignal Chrono Trigger for a few hundred bucks, its mint and all... But still, I got Golden Eye just a few months ago, with orginal packaging, for 7.99$ at a used game store. And yet Nintendo will charge me 10-15$ (american) for an emulator version...

[raggedjimmi]

That's lucky. Goldeneye here is £15, double the cost of the VC version, and it's not in progressive scan either. The cheapest N64 games go for £10 here, even unboxed (read - non collectors item) Smash Bros goes for £30.

It may be different over there, but in the UK the Wii is going to save countless people money on retro games.

[Jovian9]

Bring back the sega sports nfl games - down with EA

Definitely! Other than Tiger Woods PGA Tour I am completely off of my EA Sports Diet :) I wish I could play an NFL game but I'm not buying Madden.

It is ridiculous if they release a crippled game and expect gamers to pay more and more as they make it further into the game. Expansions are fine....sometimes they are great......but I like to have a real game to start with before I expand it.

[Onizuka]

Guess they have to figure out how to make back all the money they'll lose with the sale of every PS3 :rolleyes: Retail for a standalone Blu-Ray drive is about $700 at the moment.

Yeah, that's JUST the drive too, not an entire player. :eek:

Ah, but I do remember when CD players cost that much. It'll go down in time...

[LukeW]

I think what I find stupid is that you have to buy all the tracks. Buying cars I guess is acceptable because most people who play GT that I know normally use their favourite car so I guess they can just go and buy it straight away as apposed to having to unlock it, though I dont know whats stopping you from just going and buying the best car available and forgetting the rest immediately removing any necessity to upgrade throughout the game, unless you either have to buy a number of lower quality cars in order to unlock better cars (which would officially make sony a******s), or all the cars are basically balanced out really really well, or they make the best cars the more expensive ones in order to disuade people from buying them.
What really sucks is unlocking the courses by buying them, that really really sucks! If they released expansion packs, then that would be great, pay £10-£15 for a load of new tracks and cars ontop of the original game, but to just release a menu is really rubbish. Plus what about kids who arent able or allowed to pay online? Actually, scrub that as they wont be able to afford a PS3 full stop.

[GFLPraxis]

I knew this would happen. I said it last year when the 360 started with microtransactions, said it again when the PS3 would have them, and I'll say it again if the Wii does. (Nintendo hasn't announced if there will be a dedicated microtransaction system a la XBox Live Marketplace that 3rd parties can use yet. I hope they don't supply them with one),

Perhaps not with the initial batch of games, but eventually, developers will learn to get lazy. Why bother fixing bugs on a console game when you can patch them later? Why bother adding content when you can update it later...and charge money for it?

Some games are going to start literally removing content that otherwise would have been included, so they can charge extra. Multiplayer maps, unlockable characters- instead of earning these things, people will have to buy them.

I hope, hope, hope this news isn't true. But whether or not it is true, by the end of this console lifespan I think we will see a lot of games doing it.:o


If Wii doesn't get microtransactions, either the Wii versions will get the content free via WiiConnect24, or the Wii versions won't get the added content at all.

[MacRumorUser]

Some games are going to start literally removing content that otherwise would have been included, so they can charge extra. Multiplayer maps, unlockable characters- instead of earning these things, people will have to buy them.

EA are doing that NOW with Xbox 360 version of Fifa 2007:(

It's bad mmmkay...

[MS bulldog]

Is GT5 going to be online (I would assume?). The AI in GT4 was outright stupid.

GT5 might, but GT:HD (the one that will be first on the ps3) probably won't...not that i've read anywhere. GT:HD will be basically GT4 with Super Powerful Graphics Update. Let's hope they tweak the AI and throw in some online racing multiplayer capabilities...wait there is an opportunity for profit via microtransactions...nevermind.

[bobber205]

This is something that cannot be blamed on Sony, btw. It's a greedy developer.

Well, I'm not into racing games at all, but this is a big kick in the nuts to whoever was waiting for the game. Lame. Lame lame lame.

Not stopping something is the same as approving something. :o

If Sony did have a heart, they'd go "Hell no!".

[LukeW]

GT5 might, but GT:HD (the one that will be first on the ps3) probably won't...not that i've read anywhere. GT:HD will be basically GT4 with Super Powerful Graphics Update. Let's hope they tweak the AI and throw in some online racing multiplayer capabilities...wait there is an opportunity for profit via microtransactions...nevermind.

Wait, wait, wait! GT:HD isnt online?! I figured the whole reason why they where selling the tracks and cars online (apart from getting more money obviously) was that the game was basically GT4 with better graphics that the whole selling point was that would could play online, hence no need for any single player game at all (to sony's reasoning). I guess I could understand their intention if it was meant to be online only (though you would still need the tracks to practise on) a bit like Phantasy Star Online on the dreamcast, which had a pretty crappy single player mode but rocked online.
HOWEVER if GT:HD doesnt have a prominent online mode, then they are basically shooting their load straight away and leaving nothing left for the consumer to unlock. Anyone with a fat wad of cash can just unlock everything in the first few minutes of the game, and all that is left to do is essentially play the time attack, unless they decide to make that available for $10...
Its suicide. All graphics, no content. Who the hell would buy it knowing this? :confused:

[840quadra]

Like others have said, if this becomes true for GT5, I will not be purchasing a PS3 or GT anymore.

I have been a loyal GT player since the first generation Playstation. I own the steering wheel and pedal setup, and bought a PS2 just to play that game.

If they want to anally rape me on the price of the game, make me buy cars with "real money", and pay so much for the console itself, I am out.

I will have to continue to enjoy the legacy games, or buy an Xbox 360 and enjoy their racing titles.

I never thought I would want an Xbox until now. The PS3

[jdechko]

If Wii doesn't get microtransactions, either the Wii versions will get the content free via WiiConnect24, or the Wii versions won't get the added content at all.

I highly doubt this (and I'd hate it if it were true). I think there's one big block left to keep Nintendo from doing this on the Wii and that's the lack of a mass storage device (Hard drive) that comes standard with the Wii. (Yeah, I know that the Core 360 doesn't have a HDD). I really hope that because of that simple fact, the Wii doesn't take part in this. There is no officially supported mass storage device from Nintendo, yet. We only have speculated that USB Hard drives will be usable for content, but nothing's been confirmed.

As others have said, I don't mind paying extra for expansion packs or "extras". Because they're just that: extras. But I'd hate to think of a situation as some poster mentioned earlier with SMG... hit a ? Box and up pops a screen asking for your CC number or if you want to spend XXX Wii-Points to unlock the Fireballs.

The other option that I thought of is this:

GT:HD doesn't really sound like a complete game in the way that any of the previous ones do; it really just feels more like a GT:HD tech demo, that's capable of showing the PS3 at 1080p and probably makes use of the "special" controller abilities. What if Sony essentially gives the source code/menus/sounds away (for GT:HD:UCV (Ultra-Crippled Version)) and sells the other Crippled version (the one with a few tracks & Cars) at $10-15? I think it would be a better (?) way of doing it, and consumers wouldn't feel like they'd been screwed over, because really all they got was a demo.