Photokina: Adobe Releases Lightroom Beta 4

[Cloud9]

Beta 4 (http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/lightroom/)is out now.

[Obsidian6]

i would just like to say that the UI is SO MUCH BETTER now. it is feeling like a very solid program now and i will definately be getting it when it comes out :)

and why did they change the name to Adobe Photoshop Lightroom?

[Abstract]

Well the Library is much better. It's not really much better because of layout. It's just better because they provide you with more information in both Grid and Loupe view. I hate the RIGHT panel, and would rather not use it. However, the EXIF data I want to see is there. Sometimes, I just want to see the resolution of the image after cropping. Now, some of the data I want is just there, and if it's not there, I just go into Loupe view and there's more info from the Info Overlay than I need. :)

Oh, the one thing I was really upset about was the change to the Tone Settings in DEVELOP mode. They took away the brightness and contrast controls from the Tone Curve area, which I thought was useful, and they renamed things after I got used to the labels in Beta 3. Also, I didn't really understand the FILL LIGHT slider.

After one hour of playing with the DEVELOP mode, I think it is better. Oh, and now you can just drag the curve around from the graph itself!! :) What's even more amazing is that now, you can put the mouse pointer over a part of the image (say the shirt that a person is wearing) and hit the UP-DOWN arrow keys on your keyboard, and it'll change the tone curve and adjust things accordingly. Absolutely fantastic editing feature!! :eek:

[Abstract]

Some of my RAW files look so different now. I'm talking about colder than before, colour hues are much much different. They even look noisier, and adjusting the noise reduction/smoothing doesn't seem to make a visible difference anymore unless you use the loupe. :mad:

EDIT: I've posted 2 photos below for comparison. One was exported from BETA 3, and the darker blue one was exported from BETA 4.

EDIT 2: Do I have to change the hue and saturations around to get my photos to look the same as before? :mad:

[MacRumors]

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

Adobe announced (http://home.businesswire.com/portal/site/google/index.jsp?ndmViewId=news_view&newsId=20060924005016&newsLang=en) today the release of the Beta 4 version of Lightroom, available for public download (http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/lightroom/).

Adobe Photoshop Lightroom beta 4.0 offers improved digital photography workflow tools, including a precision white balance selection option and a more streamlined and elegant user interface experience with customizable controls. An intuitive new tone curve adjustment feature provides powerful image correction capabilities, allowing users to visually obtain excellent midtone, shadow and highlight adjustments.

The first beta of Lightroom was released (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2006/01/20060109021315.shtml) by Adobe in January 2006 and is poised as a direct competitor to Apple's Aperture (http://guides.macrumors.com/Aperture).

Meanwhile, Apple is rumored to release an update to Aperture at their September 25th Media Event (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2006/09/20060914090209.shtml) today at 10:30 EST. The possibility of Mac portable updates (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2006/09/20060915171825.shtml) has also been raised, though the evidence has not been overwhelming. The latest report (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2006/09/20060919000003.shtml) simply places the updates before the holiday season.

[bigandy]

it's definitely improving, but i still think the look of Aperture is much, much better. i continue to be unsure about moving my library to Lightroom..

[SPUY767]

After being thoroughly trounced in the video market, it appears that Adobe will be damned before it lets Apple rain on its photo parade.

[SpaceMagic]

Haha! Adobe are clever.

[mkjellman]

10:30 here i come.

[amac4me]

Waiting for the Aperture and MacBook Pro updates today :D

[iGary]

I'm actually considering dumping Aperture and trying this out Aperture is slow for me - always has been. :(

[junker]

Well cool... I enjoyed Lightroom alot when it first came out...though I haven't used it since I got apeture :)

I will certainly check it out...I hope they dealt with the slowness I expeirenced when I scrolled .....grrr... but now that I think about it Apeture kinda does the same thing..

[lOUDsCREAMEr]

Exclusive rumor: Apple will release iPhoto Pro today:D

[Eraserhead]

I'm actually considering dumping Aperture and trying this out Aperture is slow for me - always has been. :(

Don't you have a G5 Quad? You shouldn't be having any speed problems with that :rolleyes:.

[zwida]

I'm actually considering dumping Aperture and trying this out Aperture is slow for me - always has been. :(

Yeah, slow like mud. Today's update has got to fix that, right?

...Right?

[iGary]

Don't you have a G5 Quad? You shouldn't be having any speed problems with that :rolleyes:.

I hate to even say this, but I think my machine has issues. I have a panorama program that renders QTVR's and a friend of mine's dual G5 2.0 is faster. God I do not want to start another drama. iTunes beachballs on startup. Photoshop take a little long to load images, I think. I just remember my 2.7 being faster. - but hell, it didin't work at all.

[mi5moav]

Is this Adobe Lightroom Beta 4.0 or Adobe Lightroom Beta 4 or Adobe Lightroom Beta release 4? So, how long until Google Releases Picasa Pro for free?? On the slower side of news MacBooks released today MacBookPros Soon Aperture update today new video/photo sharing site from Apple will compete with Adobe yet to be released phote site Adobe PhotoTube beta 2.0

[iGary]

MacBooks released today MacBookPros Soon Aperture update today new video/photo sharing site from Apple

What does this have to do with Lightroom?

I see one more person invade another thread and start talking crap about these stupid laptop upgrades... :mad:

Go away.

[ajaygrover]

I think Apple would update the whole line of notebooks to core 2 duo just to confront the competition. Fujitsu Siemens if offereing Core 2 Duo notebook for just 900 Euros with 1 GB of RAM 1.66 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo processor and 80 GB of hard disk space.

Maybe Apple will even reduce the prices from 1099 Euros for an MB to 999 Euros:D

...Just waiting to get one

[Abstract]

Aperture is just slow ass. May not be your computer at all. ;)


Lightroom lacks the stacking, but has fantastic editing features that are 1000x better than in Aperture. I know that you'll say, "Well I have Photoshop for that!", but that's not nearly as convenient. I can probably do 99% of what I want in Lightroom Beta 3 and Beta 4. If Adobe started offering the ability to stack and organize, I don't know why anyone would choose Aperture.

Also, Adobe's RAW conversion is better, and the software works on mid-range machines better than Aperture can. :)

[iGary]

I think Apple would update the whole line of notebooks to core 2 duo just to confront the competition. Fujitsu Siemens if offereing Core 2 Duo notebook for just 900 Euros with 1 GB of RAM 1.66 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo processor and 80 GB of hard disk space.

Maybe Apple will even reduce the prices from 1099 Euros for an MB to 999 Euros:D

...Just waiting to get one

Why don't you talk about this here. (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=234380)

For the love of God. :rolleyes:

[arn]

What does this have to do with Lightroom?

I see one more person invade another thread and start talking crap about these stupid laptop upgrades... :mad:

Go away.

Sorry, I might have hijacked this thread with the front page story. MacBook update talk should probably go to this ongoing thread:

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=234380

arn

[spicyapple]

EDIT: I've posted 2 photos below for comparison. One was exported from BETA 3, and the darker blue one was exported from BETA 4.:
Darker blue one looks better.:)

[iGary]

Sorry, I might have hijacked this thread with the front page story. MacBook update talk should probably go to this ongoing thread:

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=234380

arn

You're banned. :D

[SPUY767]

Waiting for the Aperture and MacBook Pro updates today :D

You know we can't have a Macbook Proupdate on a non-tuesday. Plus, watch what you say about that, iGary nearly killed the last guy to suggest that.

[MattyMac]

I forgot about the press announcement today...nice surprise.

Hopefully something good:D

[(L)]

So why is Apple even making Aperture again? I'm no camera person, so I don't know which is better or anything, but why is it suddenly Apple vs Adobe? Or has Apple always made software for camera people? Actually, on second thought, I don't care much. Sorry.

[Abstract]

Darker blue one looks better.:)

Seriously? It's way too blue for me. The lighter pinkish photo is what I actually saw that day. And besides, the pastel-y colours and softness make that photo what it is.

But hell, everyone has opinions.... ;)

[jholzner]

So why is Apple even making Aperture again? I'm no camera person, so I don't know which is better or anything, but why is it suddenly Apple vs Adobe? Or has Apple always made software for camera people? Actually, on second thought, I don't care much. Sorry.

Apple released Aperture before Adobe released lightroom.

[Multimedia]

i would just like to say that the UI is SO MUCH BETTER now. it is feeling like a very solid program now and i will definately be getting it when it comes out :)

and why did they change the name to Adobe Photoshop Lightroom?So you like it much better than Aperture no matter what Apple introduces today?

Obsidian6 Platforms:
Work: DP 2.7GHz G5 / 6.5GB RAM / 400GB HD / Rad. 9650 256MB / CS2
Road: 1.67GHz G4 15" PB HR / 1.5GB RAM / 80GB HD / Rad. 9700 128MB / CS2

I love that Adobe would give us the software to play with until March. Very good marketing plan. Spring 2007 will be quite the season for Adobe as well as for Dual Clovertown Mac Pros. :p

[rodpascoe]

So why is Apple even making Aperture again? I'm no camera person, so I don't know which is better or anything, but why is it suddenly Apple vs Adobe? Or has Apple always made software for camera people? Actually, on second thought, I don't care much. Sorry.

Apple has always made software for CREATIVE people. Whatever profession that person has. Apple's products always seem to do what they say on the tin, and that for me is one of the main reasons as a pro photographer that I use Apple hardware/software. Aperture has opened a can of worms in the industry by spotting un unfilled niche and filling it in a spectacular way. Adobe is playing fire fighter (although they have made a good product in response) Jury is still out I think.

[Tommyg117]

I'll have to check it out!

[bdj21ya]

10:30 EST? But aren't we on Dailight Savings Time right now? Does this mean the announcement will happen at 11:30 for people in New York, or is it just a typo?

[mi5moav]

It is quite strange that Adobe would do that. We'll there you have it that is why it is now called Adobe Photoshop Lightroom and not just Lightroom. The colors the pop out behind the clouds are actually not as bright as those in the sand washed over by the water in the second pic. I'm not quite sure how much light(percentage per material) is lost in a reflected image but the second picture doesn't even look true to life.

[p0intblank]

You know we can't have a Macbook Proupdate on a non-tuesday. Plus, watch what you say about that, iGary nearly killed the last guy to suggest that.

The iMac 24-inch was announced on a Wedensday.

[JobsRules]

It's a tough choice as both Lightroom and Aperture both have their strong points. I tend towards Lightroom and feel Apple would never have actually bothered with Aperture if they'd known Adobe would be making a similar package.

I look forward to seeing next Aperture before I decide to go with one or the other.

Oh, the other thing, I think RAWs processed with CaptureOne just have an added layer of sheen for some reason. I wonder if either of these two package will match that going forward?

[relimw]

Sorry, I might have hijacked this thread with the front page story. MacBook update talk should probably go to this ongoing thread:

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=234380

arn
Bad, bad, bad arn...darn thread hijacker! :p

In the 5 minutes I've been using the update:
The flow of the layout seems a bit better, still has some annoying bugs. Such as after deleting a photo, no photo is selected. Instead is should advance to the next photo in the strip.

They've include a History feature like Photoshop's in the Develop section and preview for both Flash and HTML export actually work on my machine.

[840quadra]

Competition is good!

I am hoping with this, the price of Apeture will go down (assuming that Adobe will have their product cost less (which actually is kinda doubtful knowing them)), either because of cost wars, or because Apple want's to be competitive.

Granted I don't have a system that is "supported" :rolleyes: by Aperture (stupid video requirements, just let me run it anyway I am fine with it being a bit slow for now!!!), however I like how the program integrates with the OS, iPhoto if needed, and other applications!

[scottlinux]

Lightroom runs FAST on my wife's 800Mhz iBook G4. Aperture runs okay/slow on my powermac G5 (Radeon 9600 128 card).

I think that alone is what is going to sell lots of copies of Lightroom. It doesn't take a $2000 machine.

[relimw]

Apple has always made software for CREATIVE people. Whatever profession that person has. Apple's products always seem to do what they say on the tin, and that for me is one of the main reasons as a pro photographer that I use Apple hardware/software. Aperture has opened a can of worms in the industry by spotting un unfilled niche and filling it in a spectacular way. Adobe is playing fire fighter (although they have made a good product in response) Jury is still out I think.
The only problem I really have with Aperture is the higher requirements to run it (although that is no longer a problem for me since my Mac Pro showed up :). I do like their 'stack' feature, but since I've had more time on Lightroom, it's working for me just fine. Maybe we'll see what shakes out when Adobe sets their price next year :D

[amac4me]

The name change from "Lightroom" to "Adobe Photoshop Lightroom" clearly demonstrates the Adobe sees Lightroom as a complement to Photoshop.

[bigandy]

The name change from "Lightroom" to "Adobe Photoshop Lightroom" clearly demonstrates the Adobe sees Lightroom as a complement to Photoshop.
that or they're trying to sell more copies by including the established name... maybe they're scared people won't see it as something that can stand on its own two feet.

[Mike Teezie]

I'll check it out to satiate my curiosity, but I still shoot jpg.

One of these days, there might be a reason to switch to raw, but that's a debate for another thread and forum.

I hope Aperture is improved and can best Lightroom - just because I'm always pulling for Apple.

[ready2switch]

I apologize for the lack of knowledge while making this post.

How does "Adobe Photoshop Lightroom" relate to "Adobe Photoshop"? Are they two completely different programs or is the one eventually to replace the other?

[SWC]

I apologize for the lack of knowledge while making this post.

How does "Adobe Photoshop Lightroom" relate to "Adobe Photoshop"? Are they two completely different programs or is the one eventually to replace the other?

Lightroom complements photoshop when working with raw images and is part of the "photoshop family" which is why photoshop is in the name. It is not a replacement at all.

[ariel]

This article says the announcement is at 4:30 Cologne time...

"The company is hosting an invitation-only event the day before the Photokina photography trade show in Cologne at 4.30pm on September 25"

http://www.digitmag.co.uk/news/index.cfm?NewsID=6173

I think Aperture rocks and with over 17k images in my library, i'm not switching

[relimw]

I apologize for the lack of knowledge while making this post.

How does "Adobe Photoshop Lightroom" relate to "Adobe Photoshop"? Are they two completely different programs or is the one eventually to replace the other?
Two completely different programs. Lightroom doesn't even come close to what Photoshop can do, and it's meant more as a preprocessor for Photoshop.

[ariel]

http://www.tuaw.com/2006/09/25/apples-photokina-event-has-started/

Apple has just introduced Aperture 1.5. More details to come.

Aperture 1.5 has a new library system with better support for external storage, DVD's, as well as RAID. This should make a lot of Aperture users happy.

[jbh001]

Meanwhile, Apple is rumored to release an update to Aperture at their September 25th Media Event today at 10:30 EST.

10:30 Eastern Standard Time? :confused:
Last time I checked, Daylight Savings doesn't end until 2AM on Sunday 29 October 2006. Also, I think Arizona, Puerto Rico, Hawaii, U.S. Virgin Islands and American Samoa don't do Daylight Saving Time. :eek:
So if it really is 10:30 EST, we will have to wait until 11:30 EDT before the announcement begins. :D

Maybe in the future you can just avoid this confusion by using ET for Eastern Time, PT for Pacific Time, and so forth.

By the way, next year (http://www.timetemperature.com/tzus/daylight_saving_time_extended.shtml) Daylight Saving Time begins at 2AM on Sunday 11 March 2007, and ends at 2AM on Sunday 04 November 2007 (unless you are in Arizona, Puerto Rico, Hawaii, U.S. Virgin Islands or American Samoa).

[relimw]

Maybe in the future you can just avoid this confusion by using ET for Eastern Time, PT for Pacific Time, and so forth.


Or you can just use UTC :rolleyes: :D

[JAT]

The name change from "Lightroom" to "Adobe Photoshop Lightroom" clearly demonstrates the Adobe sees Lightroom as a complement to Photoshop.
Adobe sees ALL things as a complement to PS. Including the pencil cup on the CEO's desk.

[SPUY767]

... what's with the attitude? I was simply stating the iMac was releaed on a non-Tuesday. That's no different from being a MacBook Pro. They are both products from Apple.

No need to be so rude. :rolleyes:

That was just gratuitous Rudeness, no need to take offense.

[hayesk]

I apologize for the lack of knowledge while making this post.

How does "Adobe Photoshop Lightroom" relate to "Adobe Photoshop"? Are they two completely different programs or is the one eventually to replace the other?

It doesn't really. More of the public knows the name "Photoshop" than they know "Adobe". Adobe is calling it that so the public thinks, "photoshop is great, so this must be great too" and then buy it.

[hayesk]

EDIT: I've posted 2 photos below for comparison. One was exported from BETA 3, and the darker blue one was exported from BETA 4.

EDIT 2: Do I have to change the hue and saturations around to get my photos to look the same as before? :mad:

Probably. No offence, but that mad face is unjustified. You are using beta software. There is no reasonable expectation that it operate in the same manner from one beta release to the next. Surely you weren't using it for your professional work, right?

Developers always go through this dilemma. Do they release a beta and put up with people getting upset with bugs and behaviour changes, or do they wait until it is final and then lose early sales opportunities? This is the reason most products aren't offered as a public beta. Adobe only did this so people wouldn't invest their time and workflow into Aperture.

[PerfectlyFlawed]

I don't know much about photo apps. I'm in the process of learning Photoshop CS2. I messed around with Lightroom a bit, it seems like just an alternative to iPhoto. couple quick questions.

1. What is Lightroom for, editing or basically same as iPhoto?
2. Aperture is Apple's equivalent of Photoshop CS, right?
3. If Aperture is the about the same as photoshop which is easier to use, cause I find Photoshop somewhat confusing?

[SPUY767]

I don't know much about photo apps. I'm in the process of learning Photoshop CS2. I messed around with Lightroom a bit, it seems like just an alternative to iPhoto. couple quick questions.

1. What is Lightroom for, editing or basically same as iPhoto?
2. Aperture is Apple's equivalent of Photoshop CS, right?
3. If Aperture is the about the same as photoshop which is easier to use, cause I find Photoshop somewhat confusing?


No, No, and No. Loghtroom is Adobe's answer to RAW based workflows. Aperature is Apple's solution for the same. Aperature is nothing close to photoshop. Photoshop is an image editor. Aperature is designed to change attributes that the RAW image format gives you, i.e. you can change the exposure level of a RAW formatted image in ways that would be impossible in any other format.

[Abstract]

Probably. No offence, but that mad face is unjustified. You are using beta software. There is no reasonable expectation that it operate in the same manner from one beta release to the next. Surely you weren't using it for your professional work, right?

But I really didn't expect the way Adobe sees my RAW files to be any different. I know that might sound odd because this is a beta, but this is Adobe, and they've played the game for years. :confused:


And while I wouldn't mind if they bundled Lightroom with Photoshop, I really hope they sell it as a standalone product, and for cheaper than Aperture. :)