ThinkSecret's iPod Rendering

[MacRumors]

For what it's worth, the ThinkSecret iPod rendering (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2003/04/20030410085125.shtml) that has spawned so much discussion is indeed accurate.

And the new iPod will be coming in 10GB, 15GB and 30GB sizes as was reported.

New Toshiba drives (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2003/02/20030203032124.shtml) were reported in February... spawning speculation about iPods built around those specifications. No 15GB drive, however, was reported at that time.

[DHagan4755]

If it's real, ThinkSecret will have a Cease and Deceast from Apple soon and then it will be removed from ThinkSecret's site. :D

[swahilibill]

what the hell, how do they know this is true, DONT LET IT BE, IT IS SO ****ING UGLY!!!

[macphisto]

Cool. But I still like the original design better.

[HasanDaddy]

I'm not too crazy about the design, or the lack of Firewire

I think I might be investing in a 20 gigger

[Tiauguinho]

Originally posted by swahilibill
what the hell, how do they know this is true, DONT LET IT BE, IT IS SO ****ING UGLY!!!

Im a proud owner of a 10Gb model with the touch wheel... if that draw is the example of the next iPod then Apple is going a big step back in terms of design and User Interface since the buttons around the wheel are awsome and very easy to play with. We shall see what they will come up with...

[swahilibill]

Originally posted by Tiauguinho
Im a proud owner of a 10Gb model with the touch wheel... if that draw is the example of the next iPod then Apple is going a big step back in terms of design and User Interface since the buttons around the wheel are awsome and very easy to play with. We shall see what they will come up with...


same here bro, i got the sam iPod, adn i love it, and you are absolutely right when you say they will be taking a step back. I hope this is not true, it will look like every other mP3 player. Plus, no other cases out right now will work with it. BAD IDEA APPLE...

[arn]

Originally posted by DHagan4755
If it's real, ThinkSecret will have a Cease and Deceast from Apple soon and then it will be removed from ThinkSecret's site. :D

not true

[arn]

Originally posted by HasanDaddy
I'm not too crazy about the design, or the lack of Firewire

I didn't get the impression that firewire was dropped from the article

arn

[erik1975]

Originally posted by Macrumors
For what it's worth, the ThinkSecret iPod rendering (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2003/04/20030410085125.shtml) that has spawned so much discussion is indeed accurate.

And the new iPod will be coming in 10GB, 15GB and 30GB sizes as was reported.

New Toshiba drives (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2003/02/20030203032124.shtml) were reported in February... spawning speculation about iPods built around those specifications. No 15GB drive, however, was reported at that time.

So you are saying that you have solid evidence that this is true? Care to reveal your sources?

BTW, no matter what it looks like when it comes out, I am buying one. I too have been waiting since Macworld to buy one. I can't hold out much longer!

[Wuddel]

I will probably buy one if the 10GB-Model gets updated too and there is no DRM-nerf. I am uncertain about the 15GB-model. BTW i think it won't lack firewire but get an additional USB2.0-Interface, although i can't remember any PC's around with USB2.0 and without FireWire.

[MorganX]

Originally posted by HasanDaddy
I'm not too crazy about the design, or the lack of Firewire

I think I might be investing in a 20 gigger

I don't think Firewire will be dropped. The interface will probably be in the cradle with a proprietary connector on the bottom of the iPod.

I'd like to hear about any software enhancements. The design doesn't bother me, and I think your hand would have to be pretty small to have to use 2 hands or adjust the unit in your palm.

Since I use it mostly lifting weights and on the treadmill, it will be easier for me to reach and feel for the controls. I just hope it looks good and the buttons don't portrude much.

[Tom800]

How the heck do you know? Tell us some more, and where AAC is, and how you know, or don't say it. It's just cruel and petty.

[esome]

does that mean just teh form or does that include the color too?

I mean, perhaps that sketch is only meant to convey the general shape and the button layout and doesn't reflect the true color or the case material.

Arn, can you elaborate on what "rendering" is meant to encompass here?

Thanks!

[Tiauguinho]

Originally posted by swahilibill
same here bro, i got the sam iPod, adn i love it, and you are absolutely right when you say they will be taking a step back. I hope this is not true, it will look like every other mP3 player. Plus, no other cases out right now will work with it. BAD IDEA APPLE...


You are right swahilibill, it would look like every other mp3 player! And i hope they dont ditch the Chrome back... that thing can save your life if you get lost in the woods and need to signal to a Airplane!! :D

[Nipsy]

While I could use more space, I LOVE the current control layout.

I also travel alot with my 20GB, and all I have to do is bring a teeny adapter, and my firewire cable to charge anywhere.

I don't want to have to remove a cradle from my desktop setup every time I travel, and carry it as well as a power adapter (if one still exists).

[weev]

Originally posted by arn
I didn't get the impression that firewire was dropped from the article

arn

Absolutely, Apple drop firewire?, bwahahahahahahha. Next thing you know, it'll only sync up to Music Machine.

On the first impression of the 'new' design - boring as anything.

Canst believe they'd employ such pedestrian industrial design. Not owned an ipod one but the current buttons (from my limited expererience) made sense while the new ones you'll need to 'braille' your device each time to find the correct button.

It cant be so...

[GroundLoop]

I don't see why everyone is complaining about the buttons. Sure, aesthetically, it may not be as pretty. But, with the buttons directly below the screen, they may be multifunctional and work with a new integrated menu system. Until we see what the new iPod software's user interface looks like, I don't think anyone can say it is less user-friendly.

By the way, I like the new button placement. It will work much better for people with big hands (like myself).

[pkradd]

Apple cannot stop anybody from offering mockups or drawings of an upcoming product. They can stop them if they show an actual photograph (which would have to be stolen). There will be no cease and desist. The rendering is very rough and the actual new iPod will look much nicer. The upper buttons will be slightly curved (see Loop rumors for their rendition). The bottom of the iPod will have the firewire port. You can plug the cable in directly or through the cradle. (Just guesses).

[vniow]

:puke:

If in fact that is real, I'm going to go looking for a used/refurbished one.

Blech.

[bokdol]

so now what happens to the prices of the old ones now.. if it is indeed true?

[swahilibill]

i think its a bad idea to put FW port on the botton. even with a cover, it will still get really dirty adn scratched up. I usuall put my iPid in my pants pocket, and it would be realyl **** it up if the port was on the botton.

[BillyShears]

i think its a bad idea to put FW port on the botton. even with a cover, it will still get really dirty adn scratched up. I usuall put my iPid in my pants pocket, and it would be realyl **** it up if the port was on the botton.

Hmm, a 2 cent rubber cover should cover that port.


so now what happens to the prices of the old ones now.. if it is indeed true?

Depends... I think you MAY see old ones at apple.com... but on eBay... well if the new ones are as HORRIBLE as everyone seems to think, I am guessing they may increase in cost... otherwise decrease.

[pseudobrit]

This rumor is so damned solid it ended up on The Reg (http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/39/30197.html)

FireWire is here to stay.

The new model, to be offered in 15GB and 30GB incarnations, not only sports a redesigned control system that adds QuickTime Player-style, fast forward, and track skip (forward and backward) buttons, removing them from around the scroll wheel, but will ship with a music transfer/recharge cradle.

Fortunately the cradle doesn't replace the iPod's 1394 port, but provides a more consumer-friendly way of sitting the iPod on your desktop. It also provides a USB 2.0 connection for Windows users.

[mkaake]

honestly, how many products has apple had that people were really worried about looking like crap? and how many times has apple actually brought out a product that looked like crap? they may make some silly business decisions from time to time, but they're not in the business of putting out products that look like crap (at least from the cube on)...

so while i think that 'commissioned rendering' looked like total crap, i'm not worried cause apple knows what looks good to us better than what we do. and i think they've proven that time and again...

matt

[pinks]

Sorry, if this site is now Macfacts, then you'd better give us some proof of your information. Until then, why should we believe a word of this unsubstantiated word-of-mouth? It is doing damage to the reputation of this site, Apple and the iPod as a product!

Come on, show your cards!!! This is becoming ridiculous!!!

[Hemingray]

Eh... if that drawing's what the real deal is going to look like, I'm not thrilled. I think the existing design's great. To each his own, I guess. My 5GB serves me just fine. :)

Just to complicate things, this dock will be one less reason for Apple to add front FW and USB ports to their comps! :( (I'm still waiting for that one.)

[Unclej78]

Regardless of what updates are made I would love to own one.

I wished that they could have a intro. model w/5gb @ $150. I know that the are really cool to own, but I think that they are just to expensive.:mad:

[Flowbee]

Originally posted by mkaake
honestly, how many products has apple had that people were really worried about looking like crap? and how many times has apple actually brought out a product that looked like crap? they may make some silly business decisions from time to time, but they're not in the business of putting out products that look like crap (at least from the cube on)...

so while i think that 'commissioned rendering' looked like total crap, i'm not worried cause apple knows what looks good to us better than what we do. and i think they've proven that time and again...

matt

I don't know... I thought the Mirror Drive Doors PowerMac was a pretty ugly "upgrade" from the Quicksilver.

[Hemingray]

Originally posted by pinks
Sorry, if this site is now Macfacts, then you'd better give us some proof of your information. Until then, why should we believe a word of this unsubstantiated word-of-mouth? It is doing damage to the reputation of this site, Apple and the iPod as a product!

Come on, show your cards!!! This is becoming ridiculous!!!

The use of factual speak is pretty strong stuff to be putting on a rumor site, but no one's forcing you to believe this. It's still a rumor until we see the physical product and hear the official announcement.

It's not doing damage to this site! It will do damage to the site if it turns out not to be true, but credibility is based upon reputation, and MR has a pretty good record.

[Wonder Boy]

Brian Hickman is right. i don't know why everyone is bashing the drawings. I liked the old ipod, but i dont see how this is any worse. unless ipod users have freakishly small hands, i think they can reach the newly placed buttons. I'm getting one either way, but i did have my heart set on the 40giger.

Also, the dock will prevent scratching the back, and the usb2 port will free up already scarse amounts of firewire ports.

Even more, if the ipod has a brushed metal face as suggested in an earlier post i read, i may switch back to windows.

enough beating around the bush... I LIKE THE NEW IPODS! I like the drawings and i hope this is a reality. USB2 can only increase marketshare, there is nothing wrong with this potential release.:mad:

[melchior]

i would be guessing this is an encouraged leak considering the broad coverage, the same way the music service has been 'leaked' most probably per steve's instructions.

thus for all those whining 'show us your sources' you just need to read between the lines. arn was dead on with the powerbook updates and if he says something is indeed accurate then you better believe him, he doesn't say it willy nilly... unlike others might.

there could be some cloak and dagger and a bit of smoke of course, but it's not in apple's best interests are this time or turmoil.

that's my impression anyway.

[xmad]

Wouldn't it be cool if Apple's Music service included downloading songs for a price and also satellite radio for the iPod.

[nickmcghie]

Originally posted by Brian Hickman
I don't see why everyone is complaining about the buttons. Sure, aesthetically, it may not be as pretty. But, with the buttons directly below the screen, they may be multifunctional and work with a new integrated menu system. Until we see what the new iPod software's user interface looks like, I don't think anyone can say it is less user-friendly.

By the way, I like the new button placement. It will work much better for people with big hands (like myself).

i didn't like the new placement of the buttons at first.. but this would make sense

[porovaara]

the current ipod is hard to control inside a pocket because of the button layout, hopefully these new buttons will fix that somewhat.

[kishba]

the button placement might also be better for cases or other add ons... i don't have a clue what that could entail, but i can certainly dream...

ugh, i need money for a new ipod :-p

[Hozie]

I gotta say I agree with the general feeling, Arn. I think you should let us in on a little more than the cryptic phrases you posted... although I understand you don't want to burn your sources. Still, do enlighten us!

[G4scott]

The iPod may incorporate new features to make sure songs bought from Apple's music service aren't swiped. The only thing is that there is no easy way to do protect the songs, and the easiest way is to make them practically unaccessible to the user.

I just hope that this doesn't leave us older model iPod owners in the dark. I'd like some AAC and possibly Ogg compatibility. I'd say maybe an open system where you can load different codecs into it, but that might cause too much trouble...

I'd willing to bet that AAC support will come with these new iPods.

[MrMacMan]

:BOO!:

I was hoping on getting a small 5GB model or something, before they killed it, now it will be impossible.

The case looks mad fugly too, huge buttons suck. That looks horrible. Apple slap a new case, or the old one...

BOOOOO!!!!

That looks ewwwwwww. I don't need USB 2.0 Functional because the apple hardware doesn't include USB 2.0 like it should.

Bad bad bad idea.

[centauratlas]

So, are there any mods out there to pop out the 10GB drive on a current generation iPod and pop in a 40GB (or for that matter on a 20GB drive model iPod)?

I am somewhat surprised they'd go without a 40GB drive given that they are available...

[scmacdaddy]

Originally posted by xmad
Wouldn't it be cool if Apple's Music service included downloading songs for a price and also satellite radio for the iPod.

That would be awesome....but there has been no indication of that....so i wouldn't get my hopes up. Still a good idea though.

[pinks]

Originally posted by Hemingray
The use of factual speak is pretty strong stuff to be putting on a rumor site, but no one's forcing you to believe this. It's still a rumor until we see the physical product and hear the official announcement.

It's not doing damage to this site! It will do damage to the site if it turns out not to be true, but credibility is based upon reputation, and MR has a pretty good record.

Eh? Not doing damage to the site? Sorry, when a site which professes to be a forum for the discussion of rumours puts forward, so definitely, supposedly factual statements without any evidence, then damge is definitely being done. One consistent factor of this site has been its grounding in, and demand for, overt, explicit evidence - as reliable and justifiable as possible from known or acknowledged sources. Statements like "accurate" and "will be" - so solid and rigid in their meaning - must be reinforced with some proof, some evidence to ground them in reality.

Reputations are hard won and easily lost. The potential damage to MR can be easily moderated with some sensible release of proof. I know we don't have to believe this stuff, but as previous posters have said, MR has a good reputation for being sensible and accurate in their reporting of news and rumoured information. However, I have never known such an untethered, unjustified set of statements as the one which fronts this thread to be attributed to MR. It is the very substantiation of news which maintains the reputation of this site... and without evidence - replaced only with opinion - this site seems to lose its credibility. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but would you except these kind of statements from anyone else or, indeed, from any other Mac information/rumours site? Probably not!!!

Once again, come on MR, furnish us with this rock-solid information you have: your credibility as a sensible, moderate discussion forum - based on the investigation of well-founded, sourced evidence - is at stake!!

- pinks

[pseudobrit]

MR is like rumor central.

It's the only place I scan for rumors because it's the only place that checks all the info and only posts reliable-sounding bits.

MacRumors' reputation precedes it.

[nmarsh1]

Boooo!!!

10GB $299
15GB $399
30GB $499

How about a 5GB model for $199? Come on Apple, the economy is in the toilet and I'm broke.

[JakeWalker]

Macrumors reputation is at stake?

Give me a break.

Macrumors reputation would be at stake if iPod's DIDN'T come out at the end of April, or if they were totally different, I suppose (though certainly even if arn were dead wrong on this, he'd have 25 times the reputation of SpyMac or MacWhispers or whomever else.)

But to say it's at stake for not revealing its sources is just silly. Do you want future rumors and updates from Arn? Then don't ask him to reveal sources and facts.

[arn]

Originally posted by pinks
Once again, come on MR, furnish us with this rock-solid information you have: your credibility as a sensible, moderate discussion forum - based on the investigation of well-founded, sourced evidence - is at stake!!

Hmm....

didn't realize such a controversy would strike up from this.

If you want rock-solid information, I'm afraid I can't offer it to you. I can say that such certainty is only offered when based on very reliable sources... but I assumed this would be obvious.

arn

[MacFan25]

Originally posted by nmarsh1
Boooo!!!

10GB $299
15GB $399
30GB $499

How about a 5GB model for $199?
Yeah, I am still hoping that there will be a $199 iPod. But, I'm not counting on there being one. So I guess, that I might buy a 10GB if they are updated.

[bentmywookie]

Originally posted by arn
Hmm....

didn't realize such a controversy would strike up from this.

If you want rock-solid information, I'm afraid I can't offer it to you. I can say that such certainty is only offered when based on very reliable sources... but I assumed this would be obvious.

arn

Seriously!

I assumed it arn (especially after the call on the 12 and 17" powerbooks). For those people asking for evidence - what answer do you expect? Arn can't reveal his sources, both for his sake and theirs.

[pinks]

Unless Arn has seen the iPod for himself then he can't say accurately that this information is 100% true... which is the implication of this thread.

I am lead to assume one of two things. Either Arn has seen this new device in all its plastic glory or this "fact" remains as a "reported" fragment of news/speculation/rumour - however reliable the source of this information may seem to be!!!! This is the whole ethos of this site!!!!

If the latter of the above is the case, then MR should state that the Thinksecret information shows "strong signs" of being accurate and that it is "highly likely" that the new iPods will be of a certain capacity. To introduce the concept of "fact" here is problematic and must mean, therefore, that Arn has seen this new product for himself, perhaps even used it! If he has not, then some element of doubt must be involved here, and "factual accuracy" must ultimately be questioned. Steve Jobs, himself, could tell me that the new iPod was a all-in-one PDA, mp3, digicam, phone (or whatever you may wish for) and this would, still, not be "proof" that these features were be genuine. I don't want to get into philosophy here, but to state so categorically that something is accurate is jeopordising the rep of the site because nothing, other than the physical engagement with something: visual, aural, olfactory, experiential can show something to be real or genuine.

Arn may, very well, be correct on this - and a large part of me hopes he is - but unless he has seen, used and experienced this thing for himself then an element of doubt must prevail. All I am saying is that he has taken someone's word to be factual, which these sites teach you never to do, and I fear for the consequences if this word is wrong. That is what I mean by the rep of this site is at stake!

This is, surely, the sensible, pragmatic position in all of this!

- pinks

[s_owen03]

do they need a new iPod? the old ones seem to be doing fairly well, and this is going to make a lot of 20GB users fairly unhappy... bad move for apple.

[joed]

Could the USB2 port be mainly to connect to a digital camera?

Seeing as USB2 is backwards compatible with USB1.1

That would be cool, alot of people have asked for it.


James.

[bousozoku]

One thing I noticed about the drawing is that it doesn't show the thing opened.

It is good that they've decided to double up on interfaces. Having both USB 2.0 and FireWire will double its appeal, even if they have nowhere left to sell it.

[damax452]

If this iPod is real, its just further proof that Apple is headed towards failure. They come up with a brilliant product and end up uglifying it in an update. And the pricing is still not competitive with other players out there. They could have made so much money if they left the design *exactly* the same and did a price scheme of:

5gb $199
10gb $299
20gb $399
40gb $499

This looks like a horrible decision by Apple, hard to believe in fact. We'll see when they are announced. Only time will tell.

[mkaake]

<sorry... hit back a few too many times when i got back to my mac><accidentally reposted earlier post>

[mkaake]

i dunno. even if that picture is accurate, there's probably no comarison to how it actually looks in life. time and again apple has been teaching me what i like in design, so i'm not worried about this. as for the mirrored drive update, i personally liked it, but again, some things aren't for everyone.
like the h1 hummer (or h2 for that matter). holy cow. i still take heat for saying i like the way it looks.

i don't think apple is going to let us down on this one no matter how that rendition looked... let's have a little faith in apple here. i'm a little afraid at what answers i'm about to get, but can you think of any ugly mac product update in the past two or three years? i think they've done a great job of defining the industry time and again (i mean seriously, how many kitchen appliances can be had in imac colors?)

matt

[Kwyjibo]

Originally posted by pinks
Unless Arn has seen the iPod for himself then he can't say accurately that this information is 100% true... which is the implication of this thread.

I am lead to assume one of two things. Either Arn has seen this new device in all its plastic glory or this "fact" remains as a "reported" fragment of news/speculation/rumour - however reliable the source of this information may seem to be!!!! This is the whole ethos of this site!!!!

If the latter of the above is the case, then MR should state that the Thinksecret information shows "strong signs" of being accurate and that it is "highly likely" that the new iPods will be of a certain capacity. To introduce the concept of "fact" here is problematic and must mean, therefore, that Arn has seen this new product for himself, perhaps even used it! If he has not, then some element of doubt must be involved here, and "factual accuracy" must ultimately be questioned. Steve Jobs, himself, could tell me that the new iPod was a all-in-one PDA, mp3, digicam, phone (or whatever you may wish for) and this would, still, not be "proof" that these features were be genuine. I don't want to get into philosophy here, but to state so categorically that something is accurate is jeopordising the rep of the site because nothing, other than the physical engagement with something: visual, aural, olfactory, experiential can show something to be real or genuine.

Arn may, very well, be correct on this - and a large part of me hopes he is - but unless he has seen, used and experienced this thing for himself then an element of doubt must prevail. All I am saying is that he has taken someone's word to be factual, which these sites teach you never to do, and I fear for the consequences if this word is wrong. That is what I mean by the rep of this site is at stake!

This is, surely, the sensible, pragmatic position in all of this!

- pinks

I think the only ppl who have seen the new ipod are apple employees and they sign an NDA not to show or release picture of unrelased products. I'm sure he hasn't actually palyed with it but if he has strong relaible sources that say this is it i believe him. I'm sure the day before MWSF he hadn't played with a 17in powerbook but he reported that they were coming..... arn doesn't present rumors as fact until they've personaly ocnviced him and I perosnalyl trust that judgement.

[macdong]

Originally posted by mkaake
i dunno. even if that picture is accurate, there's probably no comarison to how it actually looks in life. time and again apple has been teaching me what i like in design, so i'm not worried about this. as for the mirrored drive update, i personally liked it, but again, some things aren't for everyone.
like the h1 hummer (or h2 for that matter). holy cow. i still take heat for saying i like the way it looks.

i don't think apple is going to let us down on this one no matter how that rendition looked... let's have a little faith in apple here. i'm a little afraid at what answers i'm about to get, but can you think of any ugly mac product update in the past two or three years? i think they've done a great job of defining the industry time and again (i mean seriously, how many kitchen appliances can be had in imac colors?)

matt


That's what I am hoping.
I believe Apple has the finest artists, and they have done a very good job in the past.
But.... what if they fail this time?
I'll be all heart-broken.
Just to think after all this waiting, I might end up going back to buy an old second-hand iPod...

[RowdyFROG]

Whist I like the idea of docking ports - they make the charging, U/L and D/L of stuff like cameras, phones etc. much quicker and easier - I'm a bit concerned about the rendering and how much of the ipod will sit in the cradle.

To me, this lends itself to having the whole edge of your ipod covered in cratches/rub marks. I hope they've designed it well enough that this doesn't happen.

[chewbaccapits]

Either way...We're getting freak'en updates...Been waiting since NOV!!!!!

[IJ Reilly]

Originally posted by pseudobrit
This rumor is so damned solid it ended up on The Reg (http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/39/30197.html)

The Reg claims knowledge of a detail left hanging by TS -- the 10 gig is expected to be the original model at a reduced price. FWIW. Quite possibly nothing.

[Mr. Anderson]

Has anyone thought that the rendering a thinksecret could have been a prototype and what we'll see from Apple will be slightly different?

I think that quite a few people are all worked up about this for nothing. A new updated iPod will be great and if you're that concerned about the new design, buy one now before the new ones come out.

D

[pascalpp]

I for one like the new look. I have a 10gb iPod, and while the current button arrangement certainly has a visual appeal, i think it actually hampers the user experience, similar to the round mouse that shipped with the original iMac. Looks nice, doesn't quite work as well as it could. Form over function, which is bad for user experience.

One thing I don't like about the current button layout is that I frequently change the volume (that is, CRANK IT WAY TOO LOUD) on accident when I reach (without looking) for the 'Next' button while driving. I think the new button layout will make this much less likely.

One of the marketing points of the iPod when it first came out was that it only takes about 45 seconds to figure out how to use it. Certainly that is pretty fast compared to the cryptic interfaces of many other MP3 players on the market, but I think you'll see that number drop to about 15 seconds with the new button layout.

As for Apple adding USB2, I doubt they would do anything that would hamper Windows buyers should they decide to switch to the Mac. So my guess is that all new iPods will have a standard Firewire port, allowing them to be used with a Mac should a Windows user decide to switch, and that the USB2 connection will be provided via the docking station. Maybe there will be a different docking station depending on whether you buy the Windows iPod or the Mac iPod.

Now if they would quit fooling around and make a 40gb version, I'd upgrade.

[alxths]

I don't know why everyone is so upset about it... It looks fine to me.

We should probably consider that the ipod is very, VERY popular in Japan. So, maybe this new design is meant to cater to the japanese market particularly?... Yeah I know that's a bit of a stretch..

But, Brian Hickman brough up another good point: we can't be so quick to judge the configuration without knowing what the software interface is like. Maybe apple implimented some new features that would necessitate that layout... maybe it will be able to play cell-phone games...?

[greenstork]

Originally posted by pinks
Eh? Not doing damage to the site? Sorry, when a site which professes to be a forum for the discussion of rumours puts forward, so definitely, supposedly factual statements without any evidence, then damge is definitely being done. One consistent factor of this site has been its grounding in, and demand for, overt, explicit evidence - as reliable and justifiable as possible from known or acknowledged sources. Statements like "accurate" and "will be" - so solid and rigid in their meaning - must be reinforced with some proof, some evidence to ground them in reality.

Reputations are hard won and easily lost. The potential damage to MR can be easily moderated with some sensible release of proof. I know we don't have to believe this stuff, but as previous posters have said, MR has a good reputation for being sensible and accurate in their reporting of news and rumoured information. However, I have never known such an untethered, unjustified set of statements as the one which fronts this thread to be attributed to MR. It is the very substantiation of news which maintains the reputation of this site... and without evidence - replaced only with opinion - this site seems to lose its credibility. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but would you except these kind of statements from anyone else or, indeed, from any other Mac information/rumours site? Probably not!!!

Once again, come on MR, furnish us with this rock-solid information you have: your credibility as a sensible, moderate discussion forum - based on the investigation of well-founded, sourced evidence - is at stake!!

- pinks

Ummmmm....stop being such a whining baby. If arn does have a souce and that person works for Apple, he'd be fired if arn said anything on this site. Hello, do you even understand rumor sites. They are based on track records and MR has a pretty good one. I for one trust arn implicitly after the 17" PB rumors ahead of the release. No one thought that was real.

BTW, going on your definition of fact, if arn posted a picture or revealed a source, it still wouldn't suffice as fact by your definition. According to you, just because you see a picture or read an article on the internet, how do you REALLY know? So stop whining here. Go to another less reliable rumor site if you're not happy, but you'll never get the accuracy you get here.

[bertagert]

A few things:

1. Is it possible to get a firewire to USB 2.0 adapter? If so, wouldn't it clear up that dispute?

2. Why drop the 20 gig for a 15 gig? Is the 20 gig drive faulty? An extra hundred $ for 5 gigs doesn't seem right.

3. About this music service. I'm guessing that you'll probably only be able to play the songs through the iPod. I find this totally acceptable. I don't own an iPod but when I get one, I plan on getting the FM adapter from the people that make the mouse/spinny thingamagig ( I think its Griffin?) and play in my car and on the home stereo system. I do question quality of such a transfer but I'm not an audiophile and I don't think the majority is so it might not matter.

4. As for the looks, I think everyone should question the drawing and also note that its a line drawing and would be much more compelling in real life.

Comments paleez

[SoonToGetAMac]

Originally posted by bertagert
A few things:

2. Why drop the 20 gig for a 15 gig? Is the 20 gig drive faulty? An extra hundred $ for 5 gigs doesn't seem right.

Comments paleez

Yeah, but assuming the price scheme stays the same, you get 15GB for en extra $100 when going from 15 to 30.

[janey]

blech *puke*
i'm getting another 10gb iPod with the $500 i saved since february (specifically for another newer iPod).
There is no way i would even take that for free if someone offered it to me.
it's just tooo ugly and i'd rather have something prettier...to me comparing that iPod to the current iPod is like comparing an original 1984 Mac to a G4 Cube.

[xjohn]

This is ridiculous speculation, but what if...

Remember the mysterious 'enclosure (http://www.envestco2.com/macwhispers/archives/000053.php) ' mentioned by MacWhispers? I remember someone saying that one of the two openings on the back was about the size of an ipod.

What if the 'docking' station is actually a tablet-like device, and the new ipod can function as both an ipod and as a hard drive for the tablet device?

Maybe the other opening on the enclosure is for the battery?

Of course, the likelihood of this is very slim... but... what if?

(I apologize if someone has suggested this already!)

[voyagerd]

Maybe the buttons have been moved to give space for a touch pad that could be used for writing....:rolleyes:

[nagromme]

I won't deny that the old buttons did the job, and looked great doing it--better and simpler and more "Apple" than separate buttons.

But separate buttons have two advantages--maybe even mentioned in specific feedback from users--and if they do the same job BETTER then I'm all for them:

1. You don't hit the volume wheel accidentally when going for Skip and Play.

2. You don't have to bend your thumb awkardly down (or use two hands) to get the bottom button (Play). Your thumb can now do all the basic music operations high up--more natural, like a TV remote.

As for looks, change is a bad thing to some people, good for others, but inevitable. The new design does not look better to me than the old. But it looks almost as good, so I don't think the sky is falling. (See my Photoshop attachment below.)

Likewise, adding USB is great for Mac owners: we can now use the iPod (or just the portable storage/backup space) with early iMacs, iBooks, and Lombard PowerBooks. Dual-standard FW-USB external drives are a common product with great flexibility.

And since USB will sell Apple products to MANY more PC users, all the better. Income for Apple for R&D, plus the trojan-horse effect of showing Apple design to potential switchers.

Why USB 2 instead of 1? It's faster, expected by many PC owners, and yet does NOT threaten Firewire because USB 2 can't match FW's real-world performance--not to mention FW800. And USB 2 works with USB 1.1 computers, so nothing is lost. And Apple has never set themselves up as an enemy of USB 2: they've said it's something they'll keep considering. I'm sure Macs will get it eventually, not that it matters with Firewire.

For every person who wishes Apple chose USB 1.1 ALONE for the second connector on iPods (in addition to FW), there would have been been many more howling for BOTH USB 2 AND 1.1... which sounds like what we've got, and gives us three ways to connect. If my iPod will connect to more computers because it has USB added, that can't possibly be bad for me.

[nagromme]

Here you go. Is this so bad that Apple is dead?

[iSmell]

Originally posted by pinks
Unless Arn has seen the iPod for himself then he can't say accurately that this information is 100% true...

I've never seen a bear **** in the woods, but I'd take Arn's word on that one, too.


... I fear for the consequences if this word is wrong

I am also deeply afraid of these consequences. I'm going to go write a will. Does anybody here know a notary?


This is, surely, the sensible, pragmatic position in all of this!

- pinks


Yes. Sensible and pragmatic.






Surely...

[Rower_CPU]

Originally posted by nagromme
Here you go. Is this so bad that Apple is dead?

Why would they move away from the ease of use of having the play/pause etc buttons right by the scroll wheel?

"No, sir...I don't like it." :p

[rainman::|:|]

Originally posted by MrMacman
:BOO!:

I was hoping on getting a small 5GB model or something, before they killed it, now it will be impossible.

uhhh... you could now get a 10 gig for $299, why not get double the HD space for the same price? not sure increasing the specs of a product is a 'step in the wrong direction'...

tho everything else about this is. button layout is so un-apple i'd be tempted to discredit it right there... they have an interface that works beautifully... someone mentioned the 45 second interface... if the directional keys were gone, the interface would lose that... the circle design is just so easy to get used to. plus i just cannot see them switching from a one-handed design. as for the docking station, i don't really see how this is going to happen... i don't think there's room for ports on the top and bottom, and you couldn't put a cover on the bottom one, else the cradle would be a hassle. If it's just a holder for use with the cable, it's something i could see...tho i bought a nice one i like more :)

surprised a 40 gig isn't making an appearance... apple is either making a killing off of these ipods, or getting a really bad deal on drives...

and, seriously, to the newbies who don't know how this works. arn = good track record, which is what it's all about. sources should never even be hinted about, as people's jobs could be on the line here. arn has proven that MR can be very accurate and tends to get things right. sure i'm curious to arn's confidence in this one, but that confidence is enough for me... i'm saying, don't judge until the ipods come... then we see who got things right :)

pnw

[Potus]

Well, I'm happy I bought a 20 gig refurb last month. Got a great deal from Smalldog and the aesthetics are superior to the one shown in the graphic. Plus firewire is awesome.

[Wonder Boy]

Originally posted by nagromme
Here you go. Is this so bad that Apple is dead?

I never thought apple users to be lazy, but this complaining about the distance of the buttons from the scrollwheel is rediculous/hilariuous. we dont have to get in our cars to change the songs, its still right there!. i cant believe how fruststrated im am reading that 90% of my fellow readers are boycoting new ipods because the buttons are .99mm from the original position. anyone who is going to get short of breath fastforwarding through their playlist better stay away from the new pods. F*$@!%G rediculous.

LONG LIVE THE NEW IPOD!

ps. so i guess there won't be quicktime ability...
now thats something to be mad about...:mad: :mad:

[Rower_CPU]

Originally posted by Wonder Boy
I never thought apple users to be lazy, but this complaining about the distance of the buttons from the scrollwheel is rediculous/hilariuous. we dont have to get in our cars to change the songs, its still right there!. i cant believe how fruststrated im am reading that 90% of my fellow readers are boycoting new ipods because the buttons are .99mm from the original position. anyone who is going to get short of breath fastforwarding through their playlist better stay away from the new pods. F*$@!%G rediculous.

LONG LIVE THE NEW IPOD!

ps. so i guess there won't be quicktime ability...
now thats something to be mad about...:mad: :mad:

There's no good reason for them to move them. Why make something easy to use and compact harder to use and spread out?

[bigjohn]

Some of you people are a bunch of Mac snobs. The iPod is a revolutionary device no matter where the stupid buttons are located. 30 Gigs for $500 (ok, I wanted 40GB) is fine, I'm gonna buy when the day they come out. In two years, when the 100GB model comes out, I'll buy that one. You guys remind me of Chicago Bulls fans that stopped being fans once Jordan retired. So it doesn't have the buttons you like - now you're willing to condemn Apple and the earth-shaking design work they've provided just in the last few years (new iMac, TiBook, new iBook, iPod, OS X). Does it play MP3's (and later AAC) - YES. Does it work with both an Apple's Firewire and a PC's USB/USB2 - YES. Is it small in physical size while being large in drive space - even at 30GB - YES!

[shadowfax]

I just think that the styling is less clean on the new ones, with the buttons not around the wheel. it seems less intuitive as well. we'll see. i have plenty big hands either way, so i don't care so much :D

[Sol]

Personally I never liked those thin buttons on the circumference of the jog-wheel and these new round ones would surely be less flimsy. By the way, the rumored button layout resembles the interface of the QuickTime player. This in itself may spark new rumors about a vPod.

The USB 2.0 part of the rumor is a bit odd. Apple does not support the connection for any of its products and for good reasons too. For one, an iPod connected via USB 2.0 would not recharge its battery through it like it does with FireWire. Perhaps the proposed docking station would take care of recharging with an AC adaptor but that would take away from the simplicity of the iPod. Another reason why Apple does not support USB 2.0 is that it is in its own interests to support the FireWire standard. If Windows users want to use an iPod they would have it invest in an inexpensive FireWire card; that is, if their PeeCees do not have FireWire on-board already.

I for one am looking forward to the bigger capacity iPods and even more so to the ACC support. Ideally all current versions of the iPod would also have new firmware to playback the ACC format and access the new functions, whatever they may be.

[Potus]

Originally posted by Shadowfax
I just think that the styling is less clean on the new ones, with the buttons not around the wheel. it seems less intuitive as well. we'll see. i have plenty big hands either way, so i don't care so much :D

I agree.

I'm just glad I got the 20 gig. Like any product it doesn't mean the next one won't be better; it just means that this version is fine with me. (it's the same reason I keep my Bluberry iBook: it works great, looks great.)

[Awimoway]

Originally posted by Wonder Boy
I never thought apple users to be lazy, but this complaining about the distance of the buttons from the scrollwheel is ridiculous/hilariuous . . .
LONG LIVE THE NEW IPOD!


You are right. Three points:

1. People around here depend on something ridiculous to complain about like it's the end of the world. Examples include charging for iLife, tabless Safari, and brushed metal (O, the humanity!).

2. Apple changed the buttons because that's how commerce works. At some point, you have to make the older models look and feel older so that people will be at least a little more prone to put their old devices on eBay and buy new ones. I know it sounds ridiculous, but it's true. It also gets some fence-sitters to finally go ahead and buy because they think they're getting the latest and greatest. Maybe some functionality will be added or ergonomics improved, or maybe they just did it to keep the iPod looking fresh.

3. Maybe there are so many whiners because a lot of these people never jumped ship to Windows when the vast majority did. These are people who simply hate change. They hate thinking different, despite hype to the contrary. So they stayed where they were out of fear of change. Counterintuitive, maybe, but of course I'm just a recent switcher to Macs. :D

[calel]

I don't know if anyone picked up on it or if it amounts to anything, but as I was updating to 10.2.5 I was looking at the previous iPod Software Update (1.2.6) and the description listed:
"Increased playback time on scroll-wheel iPods"

Anyone else pick up on this?

[Awimoway]

1.2.6 has been out for some time. "Scroll-wheel" refers to those which physically revolve, as opposed to the newer "glass-like" wheels that are touch sensitive. It doesn't mean the new iPods will be entirely without wheels.

[Rower_CPU]

Originally posted by calel
I don't know if anyone picked up on it or if it amounts to anything, but as I was updating to 10.2.5 I was looking at the previous iPod Software Update (1.2.6) and the description listed:
"Increased playback time on scroll-wheel iPods"

Anyone else pick up on this?

I'm pretty sure that's just referring to the earlier iPods with a moving scroll wheel as opposed to the current ones with the trackwheels.

[requies]

Originally posted by xjohn
This is ridiculous speculation, but what if...

Remember the mysterious 'enclosure (http://www.envestco2.com/macwhispers/archives/000053.php) ' mentioned by MacWhispers? I remember someone saying that one of the two openings on the back was about the size of an ipod.

What if the 'docking' station is actually a tablet-like device, and the new ipod can function as both an ipod and as a hard drive for the tablet device?

Maybe the other opening on the enclosure is for the battery?

Of course, the likelihood of this is very slim... but... what if?

(I apologize if someone has suggested this already!)

yay! someone reads what i write (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=23302&perpage=25&pagenumber=3) and actually remembers it. later in that thread i outlined (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=23302&perpage=25&pagenumber=5) exactly why i believe such a symbiosis would be a great idea. i am hoping that the tablet will also be introduced on april 28th, but i won't be surprised if it's not.
(i don't have the money for one yet, anyway. gotta save!)

[MacQuest]

Originally posted by pinks
Once again, come on MR, furnish us with this rock-solid information you have: your credibility as a sensible, moderate discussion forum - based on the investigation of well-founded, sourced evidence - is at stake!!

- pinks

arn & the MR staff dont owe you squat!! PERIOD.:mad:

[Wonder Boy]

Originally posted by Rower_CPU
There's no good reason for them to move them. Why make something easy to use and compact harder to use and spread out?

But it's not harder! I can't believe this is an issue!:mad:

[MacQuest]

Originally posted by s_owen03
do they need a new iPod? the old ones seem to be doing fairly well, and this is going to make a lot of 20GB users fairly unhappy... bad move for apple.

Yeah. Introducing new product in the non-evolving computer/electronics technology sector [sarcasm] is a bad idea for fear of making existing users "unhappy".:rolleyes:

[MacQuest]

Originally posted by pinks
I am lead to assume one of two things. Either Arn has seen this new device in all its plastic glory or this "fact" remains as a "reported" fragment of news/speculation/rumour - however reliable the source of this information may seem to be!!!! This is the whole ethos of this site!!!!...

...All I am saying is that he has taken someone's word to be factual, which these sites teach you never to do, and I fear for the consequences if this word is wrong. That is what I mean by the rep of this site is at stake!

This is, surely, the sensible, pragmatic position in all of this!

- pinks

Why does the description "idiot savant" keep ringing in my head everytime I read "pinks" convictional/paranoid posts? Why does the "idiot" part ring louder than the "savant" part?

Pinks-
Take your medicine and a nap. When you wake up you may come to realize that, despite its renowned reputation for credible information and/or educated speculation, MacRumors is still just a "rumor" site. C'mon, say it with me, "MacRumors".:rolleyes:

Even if arn has confirmed his information and states that something is in fact true, he has NO OBLIGIATION whatsoever to devulge the source of his information to anyone, including you and I.

BTW, have you ever seen the "Tweek" character in SouthPark? OH...every morning in the mirror huh? Well then, "have another cup of coffee and calm down..." ;)

[Perceptes]

I think the old button design was more innovative as far as looks go, but honestly this new design looks much easier to use. I'm surprised so many people here think that the circle design is easy, for me the buttons are too thin and hard to hit without accidentally moving the scroll wheel. I also don't see how this new design would make the buttons harder to reach or require two hands to operate. That doesn't make sense.

The only disappointments I have about this new iPod are that the big one will be 30 GB instead of 40 GB, and that there isn't really anything that revolutionary about it. Unless there is some completely new software functionality that is yet to be revealed, this doesn't really have anything that makes my heart race with excitement like it did when iPods were first introduced.

[ELYXR]

It's quite possible that the reason why Apple waited so long to release the new iPod was to add a 'significant' amount of new features. This makes sense in terms of creating critical mass of inventory of new iPods while effectively depleting the old. I hope these new iPods are as revolutionary as the first ones and not a simple rearrangement of buttons and increase in harddrive size.

Does anyone know if they will come out on a "Tuesday" by any chance? :rolleyes:

[SPG]

Maybe I'm the one getting old and cynical but I remember when the first iPod was announced everyone was asking why you needed 5 whole gigs in an MP3 player. Now you complain that 30 isn't enough?
"$299 is too much!" you whine? A "$199 5gig iPod would be great!" Buy one used or keep dreaming of the day Audi lowers the price of the S4 Quattro to $5,000. If you don't have the kibbles for the latest greatest, then break out the bits for yesterday's greatest and be happy you've got something at all.
I'd sell you my 5gig, but I've got a girlfriend with a long commute who I'm gonna give it to. Just wait though, there will be plenty of people out there lining up to buy the new ones who already have iPods they wouldn't mind parting with for a reasonable price.
As far as the aesthetics go, it's hard to judge until we see the real deal. When was the last time that Apple released something that was openly criticized by the majority of Macusers as being too ugly to throw down top dollar? Not looking back in retrospect, but at the time it was released.

[MacQuest]

Originally posted by damax452
If this iPod is real, its just further proof that Apple is headed towards failure.

Yeah. They're really ***** up. BIG TIME!!:rolleyes:

Originally posted by damax452
They come up with a brilliant product and end up uglifying it in an update.

Hmmm...classic CRT iMac to Flat panel iMac. Why, you're right!! Very poorly recieved by the nay-sayers. At least for about 2 seconds. In regards to the [rumored] new iPods, I'm sure consumers are really going to be upset with the new hardware/software features that we don't even yet know about [not including the ones that have already been rumored] and that Apple has already researched to make sure we want. Again...:rolleyes:

Originally posted by damax452
And the pricing is still not competitive with other players out there.

Maybe because the "players" you speak of are just now getting to where Apple has already been for the past 1.5 years. This update will put the iPod on top again. Not only in terms of aesthetics, but with the features and fuctionality that, in typical Apple fashion, will blow us away.:D

Originally posted by damax452
They could have made so much money if they left the design *exactly* the same and did a price scheme of:

5gb $199
10gb $299
20gb $399
40gb $499

In terms of having "left the design *exactly* the same", not improving on an excellent product is the last thing Apple should do because there's this thing called "competition" which Apple's products seem to attract in spades.

About price structuring. Yes, Apple would have surely remained profitable and expanded during the past couple of years, especially during this horrid economy, if they just would've played "price wars". What?! They [I]did remain profitable and expand during all this time? Through innovation and marketing? Apple was one of the only two computer manufacturers to do this? Remarkable!!:cool:

Originally posted by damax452
...We'll see when they are announced. Only time will tell.

Exactly.;)



Price drops would obviously be welcome by everyone, but I dont think Apple is focusing on becoming the Taco Dell of the tech. industry.

Just in case SJ & Co. are reading this, let me re-emphasize: "Price drops would obviously be welcome by everyone...":D

[MacQuest]

Originally posted by Wonder Boy
But it's not harder! I can't believe this [slightly moving the iPod buttons] is an issue!:mad:

Ditto.

[polyesterlester]

I don't know, it sort of looks photoshopped to me. If you zoom it in to 3000%, you can see where the pixels get fuzzy in an abnormal fashion.:eek:

[Awimoway]

It IS photoshopped. None of these are actual Apple publicity images. They are all mockups based on the rumors. But Arn says they are right on.

. . . or was that humor? :p

[polyesterlester]

Originally posted by Awimoway
It IS photoshopped. None of these are actual Apple publicity images. They are all mockups based on the rumors. But Arn says they are right on.

. . . or was that humor? :p

Ha ha ha. It was humor. God, I swear I'm like a million bucks sometimes.

[MacQuest]

Originally posted by iSmell
...Yes. Sensible and pragmatic.

Surely.

Don't call me "Surely". :D

[Hozie]

So, who thinks that thos buttons are ACTUALLY pieces of plastic with led's behind them that light up when pressed? Remember the `lighting enclosure' or whatever Apple files a patent for? Disco iPods!! :)

No, seriously, anyone thought about the possibility of the iPod including this new enclosure?

[pinks]

Your not a US Marine, are you "MacQuest" ? Its just that you seem to be dishing out a lot of friendly fire today. Perhaps your understanding of what people are saying has been lost in the "fog of war!"

We all know this is a site for rumour discussion, but if you can't discuss the issues around the formulation of news and information without resorting to personal insults then you should you should perhaps elect for an "honorable discharge." ;)

All I did was ask the same questions of "Macrumors", as "Macrumors" prides itself in asking of other sites! That's it!

Anyway, I quite like the speculated-over design. I would, however, like an audio-in facility.

-pinks

[MacQuest]

Originally posted by Sol
...By the way, the rumored button layout resembles the interface of the QuickTime player. This in itself may spark new rumors about a vPod...

Hmmm...having checked all the rumor sites, it does strike me as odd that none of them have even speculated on color capabilities.

Considering that one of the main features of iCal is color coded calendars, and that one of the main selling points of the iPod is it's ability to view iCal information, this would be a huge benefit.

Not to mention that it would be really cool to watch the video of the song you're listening to.:D

Don't flame me about this either!:mad:There are plenty of people who would make use of the color video playback capabilities in one way or another. Or at least the ability to color code other information stored on your iPod.:cool:

Here's to dreaming...:)

[melchior]

the whole ipod has blue leds under the casing that makes the whole thing glow. it's true. i swear.

[MOFS]

Is it just me, or is the jogwheel superfluous if the buttons on the drawings are for real? Doesn't the jogwheel consist of those buttons but in a circle?

I haven't got an iPod myself, but it would seem to be a minor update if all Apple were doing was to increase the disk space. There has to be something else after all this time Apple has spent deliberating over these changes – built in FM or digital radio anbody?:confused:

[MacQuest]

Originally posted by polyesterlester
...I'm like a million bucks sometimes.

Well if that's the case, can I borrow you?;)

[Happy Hamlet]

I own a 20G iPod and think the controls are just fine (the remote is too basic, however). What I don't like is the rather poor sound quality compared to the comptetition (iRiver, Archos). I can't understand why people get upset about some extra buttons. I mean, do you spend more time looking at the iPod or listening to music?
My top priorities for a revised iPod are better sound quality and a better remote.

[SoonToGetAMac]

Originally posted by Rower_CPU
There's no good reason for them to move them. Why make something easy to use and compact harder to use and spread out?

Mabye they'll also be softkeys in the new iPod OS.

[MacQuest]

See what Ritalin and a little rest will get you? You're tone seems to be a lot more calm now.;)


Originally posted by pinks
...Perhaps your understanding of what people are saying has been lost...

I know exactly what you're saying. You simply need to take things in stride and not take them so literally...from a rumor site nonetheless. Regardless of whether you choose to see arn as having used a poor choice of words [which is at most what it was] you just...need to "chill".:)

I really am concerned, because your previous posts sounded like you were going to self inflict a cerebral aneurysm at the thought of not knowing who/what arn's source is.

Have you now come to the realization that you, a "newbie" [whether or not you've been reading these posts for awhile now], have no right to demand something from arn, MacRumors' "God", that he would never have a reason to give anyone unless he sees it fit to do so? Also that, right or wrong, MacRumors [as well as the other rumor sites] will go on whether these iPods ever materialized or not? Even if there is some lost credibility?


Originally posted by pinks
We all know this is a site for rumour discussion...

Very good...


Originally posted by pinks
...but if you can't discuss the issues around the formulation of news and information without resorting to personal insults...

You should really go back and read your former posts. They were unnecessarily alarmist and insulting in nature because of your demand for information that you, or anyone of us, have any right to be privy to.


Originally posted by pinks
All I did was ask the same questions of "Macrumors", as "Macrumors" prides itself in asking of other sites! That's it!

It's not always what you do, it's how you do it. BTW, why are you so worried about what MR ASKS of other sites? Not DEMANDS, asks. If in fact arn or MacRumors staff do forcefully demand info. I'm sure that it is in the best interest of their reputation [which is NOT at stake because "you say so"] as well as our education. Now read the first line of this paragraph again because "Repetition Works".

I was genuinely concerned that you were in some way hurt by not being "in the know" of this iPod release information. Almost like a frustrated member, or even moderator, of a not so prestigious rumor site.;)


Originally posted by pinks
Anyway, I quite like the speculated-over design. I would, however, like an audio-in facility.

-pinks


I agree. Unless audio-in is a major selling point for the iPad/PowerPad that will be released on April 28th as well...This information "is indeed accurate"...;)

Have a good day "pinks". :)

[pseudobrit]

As for the GB size issue, Apple was selling 20GB iPods for the same price as the 30 will probably be, so what's the issue? 6000 songs not enough? I have a LaCie FireWire drive -- 80GB for $200, and it's build like a brick s__thouse and weighs about as much as one too. If you're that concerned about size, just buy a LaCie.


I admit when I saw the illustrations I thought to myself "why put the buttons so far away from the scroll wheel? Man this thing is going to suck to try to use, it's not going to work...

...then I came to my senses -- has Apple ever put out a product that was hard to use or harder to use than that which came before?

I think just because we're looking at mockups of it doesn't mean we automatically know how it's going to work in our hand.

I trust Apple not to fudge this one up.

[Raiden]

Dude, calm down guys! This isnt the end of the world. Remember when APPLE58 (or whatever his name was) showed us exclusive pics of the new powermac, and everyone whined that it wasnt true, then they flamed APPLE58 saying that it wasnt true, then they bitched about the "poor" design. This is a perfect example of what a few of you have just done in this thread.

Now this doesnt apply to everyone, just the people mentioned above. Seems to me that you guys bitch that you cant get substanciated (sp?) rumors, then when you get them, you totally bitch about how they are not true.

You people are a bunch of hypocrites! This is a good thing! Were getting new ipods, something everyone has wanted for months. Were getting a higher amount of gigs for less the cost. Did I hear AAC and USB2 also?

Stop whining about stuff just so you can whine, because it makes you all look like children.

WOHOO IPODS!!! :)

bye

[sanford]

Any bets on whether or not older iPods will fully upgrade to the new iPod OS -- via firmware upgrade or whatever?

I have a 10GB with the mechanical scroll wheel. I wouldn't mind having a 30GB with a touch wheel, but not at the expense of the button layout -- that's not whining, it's my personal preference.

I do think I'll want AAC and the new iPod OS, but my bet is that it will be available via a firmware upgrade.

[iMook]

If this rumor turns out to be true (and from what I've seen, that's very likely) I'll kiss a toad (since I'll be so high on joy).

I've been waiting for the new iPods to come out since Christmas. I can finally get my Christmas present!

On a more serious note... do you people think that Apple is still gonna stick with white Lucite? I hope they replace the darn mirror back with something like brushed aluminum.

[KLFloyd]

I'm still a novice when it comes to the hardware end of the Mac so perhaps someone can answer me this question...

If the iPod came with a USB 2.0 adapter on the base station (or wherever) would this mean that either

a: People with older macs who didn't have FireWire cards could use the iPod though at much slower USB 1 speeds?

and

b: Could the iPod be used as a backup hard drive to connect to older Apple computers (ie: blueberry ibook) that didn't have firewire as well?

Are USB 2.0 and 1 compatiable? I've heard different answers to this question and didn't know if anyone here could tell me for sure. If so I'd buy a new iPod just for that ease of data transfer and backup.

Thanks,

[sanford]

Originally posted by KLFloyd
If so I'd buy a new iPod just for that ease of data transfer and backup.

I think USB 2 is backward compatible, but if you've never transferred more than couple megabytes over USB 1, you'll soon discover it's so slow, it's almost worthless.

[KLFloyd]

Originally posted by sanford
I think USB 2 is backward compatible, but if you've never transferred more than couple megabytes over USB 1, you'll soon discover it's so slow, it's almost worthless.

Oh I undesrtand that it's insanley slow (and remember when it seemed so fast?) The only other mac I have here for backup is an old blueberry iBook. If for some reason my shiney new TiBook crashes and dies it would be nice to at least be able to recover the essential information off my iPod as the iBook has now FW. (Of course I make CD backups and all but still).

I'd like to buy a Lacie USB/FW external Hard Drive for just that occasion, but now that the new iPods seem to finally be coming out, I think that's going to have to be my first new purchase! :)

[achmafooma]

Originally posted by SoonToGetAMac
Mabye they'll also be softkeys in the new iPod OS.

Softkeys, eh? Considering that all the address book info is in the iPods, maybe this is the rumored iPhone ;-) when I hear softkeys, I always think of cell phones.

Imagine... a 30GB iPod/iPhone :-) It's about the right size for a slightly bulky phone.

Crazy speculation of course... personally I liked the styling of the old button arrangement, but agree that it wasn't all that great in actual use (playing with them at the store - a little out of my price range). I kept hitting the scroll/touchwheel when trying to move to the next track and blasting my ears with a sudden volume increase.

I'd have to play with the new ones to see if the layout works okay, but I don't think Apple is stupid (despite what some have said) and I'm sure they researched this at least a little.

And I might be a newbie, but I know from reading long before joining that if Arn says something definitively he's probably right. Like others, the 12 & 17" Powerbooks stand out, but there are lots of other examples as well.

[mkaake]

i've been reading for a while, and seeing as i'm a *newbie*, i don't know if this sort of post is looked down apon (as much as *first post!!!* anyways), but holy cow! some of you people really need to get a life! or maybe a job! or both!

my first complaint of complaints:
you're complaining about spacing of buttons being to far away on a device that is currently about the size of a deck of cards! think about that for more that 3 seconds!

my second complaint of complaints:
how many of you talk and type before you think?
how many times has it been said that firewire isn't going anywhere, usb2 is not concidered by apple as threat to fw (and it's not). just a lot of little things like that, where ppl just seem to be whining about everything that pops into their head, and before they stop to think about it, they write it down, because it really sounded good at the time.

of course, i still may be one of those people that needs to get a life, seeing as i'm still here reading every last post... hmm...

matt


oh, and just to add some speculation... i haven't heard a single thing about the ipod concerning fw800... doesn't that seem at least a little bit reasonable to bring out on a new ipod revision when you concider that apple just recently (well it feels recent anyways) brought out fw800 on the 17 albook?

just a thought

matt

[Sol]

Originally posted by MacQuest
Hmmm...having checked all the rumor sites, it does strike me as odd that none of them have even speculated on color capabilities.

Considering that even the GameBoy has a colour screen (now illuminated too!) it would seem right for the iPod to get one too. The extras like calendars, address book, etc would surely benefit from the use of colour. Being able to select a colour sceme for the interface would make using the device even more personal... and what is a music collection if not personal? It would also be an amusing gimmick to have an oscilloscope visualizer ala iTunes on the little screen. After all, with two CPUs in the iPod there is a lot of wasted processing power and this would be a great way to utilize some of it.

[iAndy]

Originally posted by centauratlas
I am somewhat surprised they'd go without a 40GB drive given that they are available... If they roll out AAC with these new versions, that would give you much more capacity than a 40GB without it...! :D

[danishboy]

Originally posted by SoonToGetAMac
Mabye they'll also be softkeys in the new iPod OS.

I was reading through this thread and thinking the same thing...
I use my 20gig iPod on business travel, and often just scroll through, pick a song and hit the center button to start playing - if I jump around, I'll navigate solely with the scroll wheel. When I decide to fast forward (scan) through any song, I'll pick my iPod up again and go for the cue/ffwd key. So, it doesn't necessarily have to be around the scroll wheel, it could just as easily be below the screen.

Perhaps the artist rendering is simplified and the menu key along with other keys are still around the scroll wheel and the four buttons are indeed soft-keys that could access iCal and palm-like functions? Color would be nice too - the greenish B&W display when the backlight isn't on doesn't really go well with the nice white color of my iPod. If they get rid of the Chrome back, I'll have to start carrying a mirror around to check my teeth after lunch for bits of spinach - ugh!

-AC

[porovaara]

Originally posted by iAndy
If they roll out AAC with these new versions, that would give you much more capacity than a 40GB without it...! :D

If you don't care about the quality of your music. Since my HD-based mp3 player is my primary interface all of mp3s are ripped with very high VBR settings which make them significantly larger than a normal CBR 128 or 192 (and sometimes 256) CBR mp3. This means these portable players hold a lot less than the number of songs quoted in PR materials. A tradeoff worth making, for sure, but remember more disk space is always better because it gives everyone more options.

Apple really should slap in the largest drive they can, even if it is only a sepcial edition iPod.

[sanford]

Originally posted by KLFloyd
If for some reason my shiney new TiBook crashes and dies it would be nice to at least be able to recover the essential information off my iPod as the iBook has now FW.

Oh that makes much more sense. You would be backing up via Firewire and only in the event of catastrophe would you have to load via USB. Yeah, that should be no problem; it would be slow, but you'd still get your data back; and hopefully the situation would never arise, anyway.

[MorganX]

Originally posted by melchior
the whole ipod has blue leds under the casing that makes the whole thing glow. it's true. i swear.

That would actually be kind of nice with an ambient light sensor :)

[wdodd]

Originally posted by Sol
The USB 2.0 part of the rumor is a bit odd. Apple does not support the connection for any of its products and for good reasons too. For one, an iPod connected via USB 2.0 would not recharge its battery through it like it does with FireWire. Perhaps the proposed docking station would take care of recharging with an AC adaptor but that would take away from the simplicity of the iPod.
This is the same thought that I had and posted to another mac forum. I think the new iPod will have contacts on the bottom that connect to the dock and the dock will be USB2 in the windows version and firewire in the Mac version. This would be similar to the HP PocketPC I have from a few years ago that could work with either a serial or a USB dock.

The dock would accomplish two things: more connectivity options and charging when 6-pin firewire isn't used (because the AC adapter could connect to the dock). With all the dual USB2/Firewire drives out there, I think this would be relatively easy to build.

And I think I would like the new buttons. They seem more functional to me, even if they are less aesthetically pleasing.

[Kid Red]

Originally posted by vniow
:puke:

If in fact that is real, I'm going to go looking for a used/refurbished one.

Blech.

Why? If you red the article only the 15 and 30 gig get the new design, the 10 gig will stay as is but have a lowered price.

Ah, the joy of reading.

[pseudobrit]

Originally posted by mkaake
i've been reading for a while, and seeing as i'm a *newbie*, i don't know if this sort of post is looked down apon (as much as *first post!!!* anyways), but holy cow! some of you people really need to get a life! or maybe a job! or both!

my first complaint of complaints:
you're complaining about spacing of buttons being to far away on a device that is currently about the size of a deck of cards! think about that for more that 3 seconds!

my second complaint of complaints:
how many of you talk and type before you think?
how many times has it been said that firewire isn't going anywhere, usb2 is not concidered by apple as threat to fw (and it's not). just a lot of little things like that, where ppl just seem to be whining about everything that pops into their head, and before they stop to think about it, they write it down, because it really sounded good at the time.

of course, i still may be one of those people that needs to get a life, seeing as i'm still here reading every last post... hmm...


I'd say. Complaining about people complaining, in my experience, is somewhat of a waste of time.

Doing it so rudely is just bad form.

You can argue your ideas without putting people down so harshly. We're all losers who need to get lives, duh! :p

[Q-bert]

Some of you guys crack me up. Assuming that the new design does NOT increase the size of the iPod at all (and all indications seem to support this), I can't see how any of these "it will be hard to use with one hand" arguments hold any water at all.

For anybody who's worried that has a current iPod, do this: hold the iPod in your left or right hand, then run your thumb along the bottom of the screen from one edge to the other, where the new buttons will allegedly be located. See how easy it is to access the entire width of the iPod with one hand? I can do this no problem, and I have small hands!

Having said this, I prefer the LOOK of my original 5GB iPod, but I think this new design will probably be a big improvement in functionality. The circular button design sure is "purty", but it can be a pain to press the small buttons sometimes. I also get the same "accidental volume" thing as others do when changing tracks. Putting a small amount of space between the buttons and the scroll wheel will help the usability quite a lot.

The new design isn't fugly at all. To me, it's the difference between strikingly beautiful (the old design) and "merely" beautiful (the new design).

[MacRumorSkeptic]

But it's not harder! I can't believe this is an issue! (regarding new button configuration)

It is most certainly harder! With the current button configuration you can navigate your iPod without looking down to see what buttons your pressing, its all by feel.
AND! might I say that anyone who REALLY has trouble with the current button configuration ( hitting the scrollwheel, accidentally turning up the volume etc. ) must be some of the most uncoordinated people on the face of this earth.

Let us not forget that with the current iPod form & function both peacefully coexist. If Apple is really changing the buttons for the sake of making it fresh, new, and different looking then that is one of the dumbest moves I've ever heard of. IF ITS NOT BROKE DON'T TRY TO FIX IT!!!

Don't get me started on how pointless an accessory the cradle is. What can it do that a single Firewire cable can't? Does this mean it comes in place of the Firewire cable? I'd rather they NOT include it and reduce the price of the iPod.

I think it goes without saying that we have limited information/details and will await its release until giving final judgement, but based on the rumors it doesnt sound promising.

[nemo]

I don't know if anyone has looked at Software Update today, but there is an iPod update that specificl references "scroll wheel iPods", which indicates to me that the new ones are not only coming soon, but that they won't have a scroll wheel.

Here's the text:

iPod Software 1.2.6 has improved battery management, providing the following updates:


Increased playback time on scroll-wheel iPods
Longer stand-by time for all iPods


nemo

[Rower_CPU]

Originally posted by nemo
I don't know if anyone has looked at Software Update today, but there is an iPod update that specificl references "scroll wheel iPods", which indicates to me that the new ones are not only coming soon, but that they won't have a scroll wheel.

Here's the text:

iPod Software 1.2.6 has improved battery management, providing the following updates:


Increased playback time on scroll-wheel iPods
Longer stand-by time for all iPods


nemo

No. This has been discussed already.

Apple distinguishes between the original iPods with a moving scroll-wheel and the newer ones with track-wheels.

[IndyGopher]

Originally posted by nemo
I don't know if anyone has looked at Software Update today, but there is an iPod update that specificl references "scroll wheel iPods", which indicates to me that the new ones are not only coming soon, but that they won't have a scroll wheel.

Here's the text:

iPod Software 1.2.6 has improved battery management, providing the following updates:


Increased playback time on scroll-wheel iPods
Longer stand-by time for all iPods


nemo

This was already covered once.. the update you refer to is not new, for starters. Secondly, the 20 gig iPod never had a scroll wheel, and the 10 only had one in the first revision. What the sentence you are quoting really means, is: People who bought the first and second incarnations of the iPod, with the mechanical, moving wheel, will see increased playback time. As the article that accompanies your snippet explained, these older iPods tend to complain about low battery power and stop playing BEFORE the battery is really drained. This update fixes that.

[TheInevitable]

Originally posted by MacRumorSkeptic
If Apple is really changing the buttons for the sake of making it fresh, new, and different looking then that is one of the dumbest moves I've ever heard of.

Although I disagree, you do have a point. I don't think Apple would change the buttons for no reason. I speculate that the iPod OS will be updated as well to include other PDA type features like games.

Also, the cradle would be a good idea if the rumored Apple Tablet could also dock on it.

Are the rumors saying Firewire AND USB2, or Firewire OR USB2? Because if the iPod had USB2, then we could probably connect a keyboard directly to it.

[nemo]

Originally posted by IndyGopher
This was already covered once.. the update you refer to is not new, for starters. Secondly, the 20 gig iPod never had a scroll wheel, and the 10 only had one in the first revision. What the sentence you are quoting really means, is: People who bought the first and second incarnations of the iPod, with the mechanical, moving wheel, will see increased playback time. As the article that accompanies your snippet explained, these older iPods tend to complain about low battery power and stop playing BEFORE the battery is really drained. This update fixes that.

Thanks for the clarification. I just assumed that even though the "wheel" on the 20 gig isn't mechanical, its only function is to "scroll" through song titles, so it still qualifies as a scroll wheel. And since the Software Update specifically mentions "scroll wheel" and not mechanical wheel, I thought it might be a hint of things to come.

Sorry for the retread of information.

nemo

[rangerrick]

new macwarehouse catelog describes iPods as bluetooth connectable-- any news about this?

[Q-bert]

It is most certainly harder! With the current button configuration you can navigate your iPod without looking down to see what buttons your pressing, its all by feel.

There's no reason you can't navigate a row of straight buttons by feel either. I have no problems navigating my TV remote by feel, just like my iPod.

I don't see this as a valid "it'll be harder" argument. Even my old cassette Walkman circa 1985 is easy to navigate by feel, too.

AND! might I say that anyone who REALLY has trouble with the current button configuration ( hitting the scrollwheel, accidentally turning up the volume etc. ) must be some of the most uncoordinated people on the face of this earth.

Oh come on. That's just unnecessary. I could say the same thing about you - if you find pressing a row of straight buttons "hard", then you're pretty uncoordinated, too. But I wouldn't say something like that. :D

Let's just say that some people might prefer one arrangement, and others might prefer another. Leave the ad hominem attacks on our supposed coordination abilities out of it.

Bottom line is, you might like the design, you might not. That's quite fair, and much too subjective to argue about. Express your opinion and move on. But I still haven't seen any valid arguments that this alleged new design somehow ruins the FUNCTIONALITY of the iPod, it only affects the LOOK, period.

[Rower_CPU]

Ergonomics come to mind.

Having to move your thumb back and forth between the wheel and buttons makes it harder to use the iPod with one hand. People with smaller or "less coordinated" hands might have to use two hands to use it comfortably.

Even with large hands you'd have to shift your hand back and forth.

[Foxer]

I go on vacation for a couple days and all iPod Hell breaks loose. First, I REALLY like the new design. I love my old (scroll wheel, heh-heh) iPod, but that love has been IN SPITE OF the layout of the buttons. I'm fat, and I have fat fingers and I'm always adjusting the volume or hitting "menu" when I don't intend to. the new layout is better.

I wish there was a 40 GB, but 30 will do. I was also hoping they'd be a little cheaper... I'll buy a new one anyway.

I don't know what to think about the dock. Just another thing on my too crowded desk. Will I still be able to charge it on the raod with just a cable and power plug? I travel too much to want to have to lug the dock with me as well.

Originally posted by rangerrick
new macwarehouse catelog describes iPods as bluetooth connectable-- any news about this?

Many people seem to want bluetooth compatibility. It might work for those of you who use the thing to store your contacts and/or calendar, but it would never work for music files. Much, much to slow. Bluetooth is slower than most dial-up connections.

[rog]

This is all sooooo terrible! I'm going to slit my own throat. Buttons, not buttons!!!! Waaaaaaa!!! Life is too cruel.

[wsteineker]

I'm not going to bitch about the new design, as it lowers the cost of the current 10 GB original and refurb stock if it's true. That said, the purported new layout is just so...unelegant. That's one of the things that made the iPod such a hit to begin with, it's simplicity of design and clean lines. I really hope Apple's not going to be cluttering it up like this. It just kind of feels like something Creative would do.

[nagromme]

FW800: Some have said that it exceeds the speed capabilities of the small HDs used in iPods, so no benefit except during the initial moments of transferring to buffer. Thus, the more common FW400, with no adpaters needed, makes sense still. I don't know, personally.

Navigating by feel: much easier with the new buttons away from the wheel: feeling for buttons around the wheel means accidentally moving the wheel (changing the volume). Now, that problem is solved. As for finding which button you want, here's an experiment: pick up your iPod, close your eyes, and try to touch an imaginary button on the right side. Open your eyes and see if you made it, or if you accidentally wound up on the left. I don't have an iPod on me to test this.

[Hemingray]

You've just got to wonder... why would they change the layout of the buttons?

Is it just to do something different?

Is it because everything needed to be re-arranged internally to add other features?

Is it based on user feedback?

Guess we'll find out eventually... but I'm certainly not sweating over it. ;)

[MacRumorSkeptic]

Oh come on. That's just unnecessary. I could say the same thing about you - if you find pressing a row of straight buttons "hard", then you're pretty uncoordinated, too. But I wouldn't say something like that.

I never said I find pressing a row of straight buttons "hard", I could easily do both. Its just that with the current button configuration I don't have to glance down for a split second to see what I'm pressing thus its easier, more intuitive and almost like a natural reflex.

Here are some crystal clear examples:
1.) To pause or play simply feel for & click the bottom most button.
2.) To Fast Forward or Skip feel for & press Right most button.
3.) To Rewind or Skip back feel for & press Left most button.
I'm sorry but there is NO WAY its easier to do this with any other type of layout.

This rumored configuration is a HUGE step backward unless the new iPod has increased funtionality that gives good reason for the new buttons.

[BillyShears]

My remote for my TV, stereo, DVD Player, etc. ALL have a "layout" similar to the alleged new iPod, I have no problem with them. Why would it be different here? It seems easier... actually, there is LESS hand movement if all you want to do is change pause/play, next, etc.... which is often what I would want to do... not volume.

I also don't think we have to worry about looks... when was the last time Apple let us down in that department?

[KLFloyd]

Assuming this rumor is true, I personally would like to see and feel the real iPod before I jump to conclusions as to the egernomics/ease of use.

One concern I do have, as I look down at my old TV remote (which many people have compared the new button model to) I can't help but notice that after a few years of use there are no longer numbers on my TV keypad. Over the years, the paint has worn right off.

Hopefully if the buttons do have some kind of painted on identification they'll take this into account. Maybe by painting the underside of the button or perhaps not painting them at all, just engraving them somehow.

Just a random thought...

[thefong]

Originally posted by MacRumorSkeptic
Oh come on. That's just unnecessary. I could say the same thing about you - if you find pressing a row of straight buttons "hard", then you're pretty uncoordinated, too. But I wouldn't say something like that.

I never said I find pressing a row of straight buttons "hard", I could easily do both. Its just that with the current button configuration I don't have to glance down for a split second to see what I'm pressing thus its easier, more intuitive and almost like a natural reflex.

Here are some crystal clear examples:
1.) To pause or play simply feel for & click the bottom most button.
2.) To Fast Forward or Skip feel for & press Right most button.
3.) To Rewind or Skip back feel for & press Left most button.
I'm sorry but there is NO WAY its easier to do this with any other type of layout.

This rumored configuration is a HUGE step backward unless the new iPod has increased funtionality that gives good reason for the new buttons.


Mon Dieu. Its a matter of personal preference. Some will like the old some will like the new. But, I think its wrong to dismiss the new when all we know of the new design is very VERY basic layout. We know nothing of improved features that may have warrented the change. It may be that with the new software having the old configuration use would be very complicated. So in onder to keep the simplicity of operation that the ipod is based upon the chage was necessary.

The Simple fact is we dont know and dismissing the new configuration outright is simply crap.

Personally, I have been waiting a few months now to get an ipod because of the rumorred updates. The way I look at it now is I get a great new 15gb ipod or a cheaper 10gb or old 20gb ipod.

[BillyShears]

Originally posted by KLFloyd
Assuming this rumor is true, I personally would like to see and feel the real iPod before I jump to conclusions as to the egernomics/ease of use.

One concern I do have, as I look down at my old TV remote (which many people have compared the new button model to) I can't help but notice that after a few years of use there are no longer numbers on my TV keypad. Over the years, the paint has worn right off.

Hopefully if the buttons do have some kind of painted on identification they'll take this into account. Maybe by painting the underside of the button or perhaps not painting them at all, just engraving them somehow.

Just a random thought...

I'm guessing this won't be an issue, unless it is with current ones. (I don't see why they'd change the materials of the buttons)

[Q-bert]

I never said I find pressing a row of straight buttons "hard", I could easily do both.
Then what's the problem? Either you can "easily do both", OR it's a "HUGE step backwards". You can't have it both ways. Maybe the old way is much better for you. Fine - but that's a long way from saying that the new way is going to be actually difficult, as opposed to "slightly less easy". Sounds like you're exaggerating things to make your point.

It sounds to me like some people don't like the new look and are fishing for serious ergonomic reasons to back up their subjective opinion. Why is that necessary? Saying "I think the new design sucks" is plenty good enough, you don't need to bring anything else into it.

For the record, I've already said that I think the new design isn't as nice looking as the old one. I just don't see any ergonomic or functionality problems with the new design after a glance at some crude artist's renditions. And yes, I do have small hands and have no problem with coordination (see my "test" in a previous post).

[BillyShears]

I agree, there is a difference, but I think it is an improvement.

[deanmass]

OK...

IF this thing is accurate...

The wheel navigation is one of the simplest most useful interfaces I have used. I love it. Adding those freaking buttons is just going to drive the prices UP on the old ones.

Cradle? CHRIST!

Suggestions?

Dump the chrome with a more scratch resistant surface, extend battery life, a tiny bit more gain on the outputs and either shrink it a bit more OR make it more 'drop proof'.

The originals were damn near perfect. Do you really NEED more capacity NOW?

[Wry Cooter]

Originally posted by Hemingray
You've just got to wonder... why would they change the layout of the buttons?

Is it just to do something different?

Is it because everything needed to be re-arranged internally to add other features?



This is where I say "BINGO!"

Have you heard one bit of complaint about the buttons around the edge of the scroll wheel? I haven't . In fact I think they will still exist in the new iPods.

The four buttons at the top are for RECORDING functions.

That is the only justification for them I can see.

If I am not right here, the only other reason I can think of is production cost. Perhaps it will save them a boatload of money. Maybe even allow them to lower the price.

Otherwise, the drawing is 100% accurate.. as a rendering of BS.

[nagromme]

Just to stir things up... I don't know WHAT to make of this thing I found in the AppleInsider.com forums (and apparently from Spymac before that). Could easily be a fake, since it's blurry--and clever to show so little, as if the shot was taken sneakily without checking the angle. Or maybe it's a prototype that will never sell. Or maybe some existing non-Apple product. Anyway... it looks smaller than the ~5.5"x7" macwhispers enclosure, but bigger than the iPod.

I found it here: http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=23036

And it came from here (where the poster simply called it "Pad" without explanation):
http://www.spymac.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=24610

[Wonder Boy]

Originally posted by MacRumorSkeptic [b]It is most certainly harder!


you poor thing. my deepest sympathies to you and yours. if buttons being moved .99mm from their original spot is your definition of hard, than may god have mercy on your soul...and your freakishly small hands. :mad:

[Perceptes]

"Pad" looks fake to me. If someone was going to go to the risk and trouble to take a picture of a new iPod with intent to leak it to the net, they would do a much better job and take a picture that wouldn't be open to debate.

[sparks9]

Originally posted by deanmass
OK...

IF this thing is accurate...

The wheel navigation is one of the simplest most useful interfaces I have used. I love it. Adding those freaking buttons is just going to drive the prices UP on the old ones.

Cradle? CHRIST!

Suggestions?

Dump the chrome with a more scratch resistant surface, extend battery life, a tiny bit more gain on the outputs and either shrink it a bit more OR make it more 'drop proof'.

The originals were damn near perfect. Do you really NEED more capacity NOW?


You are stupid! The new iPod will still have the wheel...

[pseudobrit]

Originally posted by nagromme
Just to stir things up... I don't know WHAT to make of this thing I found in the AppleInsider.com forums...{snip}

Can't be real. At least not a real Apple. It doesn't have any of the look/feel attributes that Apple does so well. Apple stuff cries out: "touch me, feel me, use me (buy me!)" This thing cries out "blech".


_________


If you look at the perspective and resize the photo (about 85%), the size of that "iPod" is about 4 1/8 inches WIDE. If it retains the proportions of the original iPod that would make this thing...

4 1/8" X 7

6000 songs in your pocket? You got some bigass pockets...


EDIT: Just noticed something else -- the fake iPod is certainly a Photoshop -- the thing's not even square! The right side angles in! Art 101 will tell you -- bad perspective!

[Potus]

As I said earlier, I'm happy w/the 20 gig iPod I bought in March. HOWEVER, whenever I purchase tech, I know (and hope) that something better, cooler, and cheaper is probably going to be released the next day. So what? I'm happy. The dude that buys the next greatest thing is happy. And innovation and usefulness, which is what draws us to tech in general and Apple in particular continues. (Actually, I was waiting until April, but a convergence of "needs" made me jump a bit faster; it doesn't make me unhappy with what I bought.)

[Monkeypoo]

I seriously am thinking too much about this new ipod design possibility. So much that it made it's way into my dream last night. I was at a compusa and there was an apple guy there doing a weird keynote type thing about the ipods and he unveiled the new design. It didn't have a scroll wheel (touch or mechanical) but had those 4 buttons and then left of center below those buttons, it had 4 buttons arranged in a circle (much like what you see on tv remote controls for vol up, down and channel up , down) and then something else right of center next to it that was smaller. Not a great description but it looked really nice. And I think this image is the result of all the posts I've read and pictures that have been posted about ipods in the last few days. Oh and unfortunately in my dream the sizes were still 10, 15, and 30. Someone posted awhile back about there only being a 5 gig difference between the 10 and 15 vs the 15 and 30 for the same price yet there was only a 5 gig diff between the 5 and 10 for the same $100 difference in price. granted, paying $100 for a doubling of space (5 to 10) looks better than a difference of 1/3 but they're probably thinking that consumers will say to themselves "Hmmm...for $100 more I can get 5 more gigs of space" but I'm thinking "Hmmm...for $100, all I'm getting is a measly 5 more gigs? I think I'll just keep saving so I can buy the one with max capacity"
I still hope that the lineup is 10-20-30 or 10-20-40 so I can get the 20 at hopefully $399 (if pricing stays the same) since the reason why I didn't just buy the 10 months ago was because I wanted to save up for the 20 then this whole thing started up and the next thing I knew, the only place I could get the ipod was direct from apple and I'm all about avoiding the tax monster (shhhhh).

[ebow]

Originally posted by Monkeypoo
I seriously am thinking too much about this new ipod design possibility. So much that it made it's way into my dream last night.

Heehee, several weeks ago, back during the early days of "this Tuesday!" I had an iPod dream as well, except it was about the special edition 100 pound (as in weight) iPod! :D All I remember is that this thing was approximately 2 feet by 3 feet in dimensions. I must have had a good late-night snack that night.

[Computer_Phreak]

I think that a solution would be to have both the buttons surrounding the scroll wheel, and the buttons above the scroll wheel, so that everyone would be happy!:D

[MacRumorSkeptic]

you poor thing. my deepest sympathies to you and yours. if buttons being moved .99mm from their original spot is your definition of hard, than may god have mercy on your soul...and your freakishly small hands.

Thanks for taking my quote out of context. I actually have rather large hands and if you read on it also says I could easily do both. The complaint is NOT that I have to reach further its that the FEEL of the iPod is radically different if the rumors are true.

I never heard of anyone complaining about the iPods button configuration until now. I think its because there are a lot of Apple yes men who think that Apple can do no wrong and must always defend them even if they make a stupid decission. I for one am an Apple fanatic, who expects only the best, will accept nothing less and is willing to criticize them if they don't deliver.

[Wonder Boy]

Thanks for taking my quote out of context

My fault. I guess I was taking my frustrations out on the wrong person. but you do raise an interesting point. You say the new config will be difficult/frustrating to get used to. but what about people like me who dont have an ipod now? anything they put out is new to me. im going to have to get used to something, no matter what it looks like.

[nagromme]

Perspective makes things angle--and it could be real even if it's not the mainstream iPod (which I agree it's too large for). The only thing that looks suspicious to me as far as fakery is the character of the buttons. They COULD be real, but they give me the impression of a bump-map somehow.

[deanmass]

If they add features while retaining the same old ones that are excellent ( scroll wheel w/controls, firewire w/o cradle and style) it will sell.

[kylos]

A possible design would be with the buttons still located around the scrollwheel, but only taking up a 120º arc. It would reduce the finger gymnastics required for the current model but would still (I think) look sweet.

[Wonder Boy]

Just for fun...

[job]

what would the scroll wheel be used for with the advent of new buttons? anyone?

[Wonder Boy]

scrolling through dates and addresses, and to a lesser extent playlist sets could still be done with the scroll wheel and button. its much faster that way. the fast forward and rewind buttons could be utilized in specific albums and playlists.

i know its a stretch, but thats what i think.

[nagromme]

Originally posted by hitman
what would the scroll wheel be used for with the advent of new buttons? anyone?

The new design shown at ThinkSecret is just a rearrangement: still five buttons and a wheel (one button in the middle of the wheel). No reason to assume major changes in the button functions:

Play
Next
Prev
Menu
Select

[nagromme]

By the way, that AI thread now has more images, showing the back of the supposed device (the larger one, not the ThinkSecret iPod). Either it's not an Apple product at all or it's a prototype with temporary materials: there are big black grips on the back that look very functional but not very Apple.

http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=23036&perpage=40&pagenumber=2

[pseudobrit]

Originally posted by nagromme
Perspective makes things angle--and it could be real even if it's not the mainstream iPod

No, look at it again. There are several factors that don't add up.

One: the object is photographed very closely and flat; the perspective needed to distort right angles so severely is extreme.

Two: if it were perspective, the angle on the right side would also be present on the left side, but it's square there. The side lines would need to be parallel, but they're not even close.

[Wry Cooter]

Originally posted by Wonder Boy
you poor thing. my deepest sympathies to you and yours. if buttons being moved .99mm from their original spot is your definition of hard, than may god have mercy on your soul...and your freakishly small hands. :mad:

I am not sure what you are referencing, but the buttons being removed from edge of the scroll wheel is a move of more than .99 mm. If I were to hold a deck of cards and my hands, and trace out the areas my thumb could reach, it would describe the scroll wheel and surrounding buttons. (I never have a problem accidently hitting the side switches, but they are easy to hit if I wish my merely contacting the knucklejoint instead of the thumbtip)

Four buttons across the top, might call for a shift of the ipod in the hand, a chance to drop it, etc.

I think the reason for the buttons in a row is to separate them for new functions.

[Wry Cooter]

Originally posted by MacRumorSkeptic
[b]

Don't get me started on how pointless an accessory the cradle is. What can it do that a single Firewire cable can't? Does this mean it comes in place of the Firewire cable?


This is the most believeable aspect of the rumored redesign if you ask me.
A cradle would allow access to USB as well as firewire, without having to put a second port on the iPod itself, and add an accessory they could sell extras of. It would allow it to drop in via gravity dock to a little boom box, or as storage on an iTablet, etc...

A cradle holding the iPod upright as it is charging would also make it easier to mount the iPod where you could view the songs name as it is playing, in a car cigarette lighter. Although I think this is a bad idea... keep your eyes on the road.

[MetallicPenguin]

maybe I missed something, but would the ipod have to be upside down to go in the cradle? If it would I hope they changed the port to the bottom

[ebow]

My hope is that it had the firewire port still on top with a special cradle port on the bottom. Using the cradle seems like a better idea when you're at home, but if you take your iPod to another Mac (e.g. a lab Mac, or if you're traveling) you probably don't want to be carrying around a cradle when it could be just a cable. Besides, eliminating the top FW port would mean that things like the iTrip (http://www.griffintechnology.com/products/itrip/) won't fit as well.

[scem0]

Originally posted by hitman
what would the scroll wheel be used for with the advent of new buttons? anyone?
scrolling! :rolleyes: ;)

[GroundLoop]

To add more fuel to the button debate:

http://www.envestco2.com/macwhispers/archives/000059.php

Personally I hope that ThinkSecret is correct, as I believe the buttons would make for a more rewarding user experience. I am starting to believe MacWhispers is only looking for attention, like the forgotten older child. Have fun with this one.

Hickman

[Qball]

Originally posted by nmarsh1
Boooo!!!

10GB $299
15GB $399
30GB $499

How about a 5GB model for $199? Come on Apple, the economy is in the toilet and I'm broke.

I think this pricing structure leaves the 15GB model out in the cold. You plunk down an extra hundred to get just 5GB more. Wouldn't it make more sense to retain the 20GB model?

[iJon]

Originally posted by erik1975
So you are saying that you have solid evidence that this is true? Care to reveal your sources?

BTW, no matter what it looks like when it comes out, I am buying one. I too have been waiting since Macworld to buy one. I can't hold out much longer!
reveal your sources??? are you crazy. do you want people fired at apple, its called a secret.

iJon

[GeneR]

What was so wrong about the old version? That was very nice. :confused:

[d46799]

I think 10GB, 20GB, and 30GB is more realistic than 10, 15, and 30. Hope they go 20, 40, and 60, since the drives are readily available.