Haggard confesses to 'lifelong' sexual problem

[clevin]

http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/11/05/haggard.allegations/index.html
COLORADO SPRINGS, Colorado (CNN) -- Evangelical pastor Ted Haggard confessed on Sunday to a "lifelong" sexual problem, and said he was "a deceiver and a liar," in a letter read to his New Life Church.

"There is part of my life that is so repulsive and dark that I have been warring against it all my life," he said in the letter.

in comparison, male escort is more honest than this crap

[CanadaRAM]

I don't care what he does with his w*lly, its what he does with his mouth that is dishonest and repulsive.

[scem0]

So much hypocrisy. It makes me so angry that he could speak out so vehemently against his own community. How dare he?

e

[Dont Hurt Me]

So much hypocrisy. It makes me so angry that he could speak out so vehemently against his own community. How dare he?

e
Its all about $$$ and power over others. The selling of religion is a business, just as the using of these same folks is a political business.

[MACDRIVE]

The selling of religion is a business,

This is so true. And the thought of these people having a political influence, gets my blood boiling. :mad:

[ksz]

This month's issue of Wired Magazine has a cover story entitled The New Atheism. One of the most interesting statements from the article is something like this (paraphrased from memory):

"Sometime soon people will be embarrassed to say that they believe in god."

While I don't like the strong rhetoric used by some atheists or Brights, I agree with almost everything they say, including the very real observation that there is no compromise between reason and religious faith, or between naturalism and supernaturalism. It's a very poignant article.

To me, organized religion is no different from organized crime.

[Thanatoast]

Such self-loathing must be painful. This is one area where his brand of religious extremism does more harm than good. I mean, even if he still believes that what he's doing is wrong, wouldn't it be better to live in an open, supportive community that could help him through his perceived problems rather than being angry and secretive and diddling prostitutes on the side? His religious rhetoric and beliefs have stopped him from getting "better". Unless he's just a plain old hypocrite, which is possible.

[leekohler]

Yes, Mr. Haggard- being gay is lifelong, but it is NOT a problem unless you wish to make it one.

[BoyBach]

I feel sorry for him - in spite of his 'public views' on homosexuality. I just can't imagine living my life believing that it is "dark" and "repulsive."

[Blue Velvet]

Is it only me that was more concerned/entertained about the grovelling crystal-meth phone calls?

I couldn't care less about his sexual predilections. Yet again, a self-appointed religious figurehead is revealed as a hypocritical charlatan; what a surprise.

Plus ça change, plus c’est la même chose.

[zimv20]

Plus ça change, plus c’est la même chose.
i don't speak french, but if you're saying that haggard's sexual choice, plus his inability to make change caused this latest meme, then i agree.

[ksz]

At least Ted Haggard called himself, "a deceiver and a liar." His whole life has been a lie...even to himself.

[ksz]

i don't speak french, but if you're saying that haggard's sexual choice, plus his inability to make change caused this latest meme, then i agree.
It means, "the more things change the more they stay the same." Most likely referring to self-appointed or self-righteous religious conservatives as all being the same: hypocrites and deceits.

[scem0]

I feel sorry for him - in spite of his 'public views' on homosexuality. I just can't imagine living my life believing that it is "dark" and "repulsive."

I'd feel sorry for him if all he did was think it was dark and repulsive. But he actively lobbied against homosexuals. That's what really makes me angry, he lobbied against his own people. It's one thing to be ashamed of yourself, it's another thing completely to lash out at your own kind.

e

[zimv20]

It's one thing to be ashamed of yourself, it's another thing completely to lash out at your own kind.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/historic_figures/images/hitler_adolf.jpg

[FleurDuMal]

My friend suggested that some coalition of gay rights groups should have a 'welcome to the party' celebration outside his house (or wherever he's hiding) - just to rub his hypocritical nose in it as much as possible.

[Queso]

I'm just waiting for Fred Phelps' http://www.godhatestedhaggard.com to appear.

Can't be long now :D

[solvs]

Every time I see someone who's that much against homosexuality, I guess they might be protesting a bit too much. Hypocrites like him are just further proof. And another one bites the dust.

Hopefully they don't start calling this one a pedophile and linking the 2 as well.

[Queso]

Hopefully they don't start calling this one a pedophile and linking the 2 as well.
They'd have a job. That's one serious butch boyfriend he had there, not some mid to late teen chicken. I guess we can work out who **ahem** played which role. ;)

[Agathon]

I'd feel sorry for him if all he did was think it was dark and repulsive. But he actively lobbied against homosexuals. That's what really makes me angry, he lobbied against his own people. It's one thing to be ashamed of yourself, it's another thing completely to lash out at your own kind.

e

How would you feel if you had strong sexual urges toward children? Most people would be utterly disgusted with themselves and many would probably be outspoken against paedophilia. The fight without is a sign of the struggle within and all that.

Paedophiles are like homosexuals, or heterosexuals for that matter in that they can't help their orientation. None of us can, really. It just so happens that the former is morally objectionable, while the latter two are of no great consequence.

Now Haggard is a deeply religious man and probably feels the same way about homosexuality as the rest of us do about paedophilia. I'd imagine he's pretty screwed up because of it.

Put yourself in those shoes and tremble.

Give the guy a break. He's said terrible things, but now we know why he felt he had to say them. He must be so screwed up inside.

Gay people often say that being outed is one of the worst things that can happen to them. Can you imagine how bad it is to be outed like this?

The best thing for him would be for people to allow him to live as a gay man without hassle. The guy is a reasonably effective speaker and could, if given the chance, become an effective advocate for homosexual rights.

[Eraserhead]

How would you feel if you had strong sexual urges toward children? Most people would be utterly disgusted with themselves and many would probably be outspoken against paedophilia. The fight without is a sign of the struggle within and all that.

Paedophiles are like homosexuals, or heterosexuals for that matter in that they can't help their orientation. None of us can, really. It just so happens that the former is morally objectionable, while the latter two are of no great consequence.

Now Haggard is a deeply religious man and probably feels the same way about homosexuality as the rest of us do about paedophilia. I'd imagine he's pretty screwed up because of it.

Put yourself in those shoes and tremble.

Give the guy a break. He's said terrible things, but now we know why he felt he had to say them. He must be so screwed up inside.

Gay people often say that being outed is one of the worst things that can happen to them. Can you imagine how bad it is to be outed like this?

The best thing for him would be for people to allow him to live as a gay man without hassle. The guy is a reasonably effective speaker and could, if given the chance, become an effective advocate for homosexual rights.

That's a very interesting argument, I'm tempted to agree with you, it seems to be true that conventional religious wisdom is that homosexuality is bad, even though it isn't. He's going to have a rough time from his own community about this, and that's a total understatment.

[Queso]

If he'd been honest about his own personal struggle whilst condemning, it wouldn't have been a problem. Instead, he rallied against The Gays at every chance he got whilst, and here's the important bit, regularly indulging his own desires. There wasn't a struggle in his mind, only a public cover-up of his actions. That's nothing but utter hypocrisy, and I'm glad he was outed in this way.

Also if his alleged Christianity leads him to equate paedophiles and gays as Agathon theorises, then it would just show how messed up religion is and how people can pervert it to suit their own ends.

I offer him no sympathy. Nor should anyone else. He's made a lot of money out of being a lying fraud.

[FleurDuMal]

If he'd been honest about his own personal struggle whilst condemning, it wouldn't have been a problem. Instead, he rallied against The Gays at every chance he got whilst, and here's the important bit, regularly indulging his own desires. There wasn't a struggle in his mind, only a public cover-up of his actions. That's nothing but utter hypocrisy, and I'm glad he was outed in this way.

Also if his alleged Christianity leads him to equate paedophiles and gays as Agathon theorises, then it would just show how messed up religion is and how people can pervert it to suit their own ends.

I offer him no sympathy. Nor should anyone else. He's made a lot of money out of being a lying fraud.

Amen.

Anyway, 'his community' should surely forgive him for what he did. After all, his community is Christian, and I was always taught that Christianity was built on forgiveness. But then again, I was always taught that Christianity was about loving your fellow human being - and in my book, equating someone with a pedophile is not love.

Luckily I'm no longer Christian, so I don't have to forgive him.

[Agathon]

Also if his alleged Christianity leads him to equate paedophiles and gays as Agathon theorises, then it would just show how messed up religion is and how people can pervert it to suit their own ends.

Please be clear that I certainly don't equate the two. Many people like Haggard do, and many of them do not do so out of spite, but out of a sincere conviction.

Presumably, all of us have a sincere conviction about the moral wrong of paedophilia. Well, if you want to get inside the head of people like Haggard, just imagine you felt the same way about homosexuality – that's the point of the comparison.

[Queso]

Please be clear that I certainly don't equate the two. Many people like Haggard do, and many of them do not do so out of spite, but out of a sincere conviction.

Presumably, all of us have a sincere conviction about the moral wrong of paedophilia. Well, if you want to get inside the head of people like Haggard, just imagine you felt the same way about homosexuality – that's the point of the comparison.
Don't worry. I got exactly what you meant. :)

[Dont Hurt Me]

If he'd been honest about his own personal struggle whilst condemning, it wouldn't have been a problem. Instead, he rallied against The Gays at every chance he got whilst, and here's the important bit, regularly indulging his own desires. There wasn't a struggle in his mind, only a public cover-up of his actions. That's nothing but utter hypocrisy, and I'm glad he was outed in this way.

Also if his alleged Christianity leads him to equate paedophiles and gays as Agathon theorises, then it would just show how messed up religion is and how people can pervert it to suit their own ends.

I offer him no sympathy. Nor should anyone else. He's made a lot of money out of being a lying fraud. I agree but thats what the holy rollers do, even in todays elections my mom was more concerned about Gays, the Black Caucus and Safety. I pointed out to her or asked her Mom have gays ever threatened you or anyone? No.
Has the black caucus been able to do anything at all with Republicans running all of govt? NO
Are you safe because Bush/Republicans have let in millions of illegals? NO
Wedge issues with little substance just as this hypocrit preached how gays were such a threat to society. Sad thing is for most Christians this stuff works because they have been brainwashed by the churches. Its how they think. Now that I have told you what you wanted to hear please send your hard earned $$$ to our ministry while I go screw this guy & do drugs.:confused:

[leekohler]

How would you feel if you had strong sexual urges toward children? Most people would be utterly disgusted with themselves and many would probably be outspoken against paedophilia. The fight without is a sign of the struggle within and all that.

Paedophiles are like homosexuals, or heterosexuals for that matter in that they can't help their orientation. None of us can, really. It just so happens that the former is morally objectionable, while the latter two are of no great consequence.

Now Haggard is a deeply religious man and probably feels the same way about homosexuality as the rest of us do about paedophilia. I'd imagine he's pretty screwed up because of it.

Put yourself in those shoes and tremble.

Give the guy a break. He's said terrible things, but now we know why he felt he had to say them. He must be so screwed up inside.

Gay people often say that being outed is one of the worst things that can happen to them. Can you imagine how bad it is to be outed like this?

The best thing for him would be for people to allow him to live as a gay man without hassle. The guy is a reasonably effective speaker and could, if given the chance, become an effective advocate for homosexual rights.

I don't even know where to start with this, so here we go:

I'm gay, was raised in a strict religious family and also wrestled with the same things. I DID NOT, however, publicly condemn people like me, try to pass laws against people like me, try to psychologically harm people like me by advocating "conversion therapy" and then make tons of cash while saying it. I made healthy decisions about how to live my life instead.

This man deserves to rot in hell for what he's done. I agree with you, he's definitely screwed up, but that is HIS fault, not mine. If he wants a break then he needs to beg for one and renounce all he's done against people like me. Otherwise, I see no reason to forgive anyone like this man, whose main motivation believe me, is greed.

BTW- he was outed because of the harm he was doing. If that hurt him, oh well. Cry me a damn river. He has the freedom to make informed decisions like the rest of us. He made the wrong ones.

And please don't even compare pedophilia to homosexuality again. I understand your point, but there should be a better way to make it. There is no healthy way to be a practicing pedophile.

EDIT: This just in! Have fun Teddy, you deserve all the conversion therapy you can get. ;)
http://www.advocate.com/news_detail_ektid39209.asp

[scem0]

Yeah, I have no compassion for Haggard. I have understanding and compassion for those who grew up in a household with a dark-ages mentality, and they grow up hating themselves. But I lose that compassion when they work hard to cause pain to other homosexuals because of their own bitterness.

I have compassion for his situation. I grew up in a very open minded family and in a very open minded community; but like any homo, I know what it's like to not be accepted for your sexual orientation. I can imagine how damaging it would be to grow up in a family that you have to hide from, in a community that you have to hide from. But that doesn't excuse Ted Haggard's actions for half a second.

e

[Agathon]

I don't even know where to start with this, so here we go:

I'm gay, was raised in a strict religious family and also wrestled with the same things. I DID NOT, however, publicly condemn people like me, try to pass laws against people like me, try to psychologically harm people like me by advocating "conversion therapy" and then make tons of cash while saying it. I made healthy decisions about how to live my life instead.

This man deserves to rot in hell for what he's done. I agree with you, he's definitely screwed up, but that is HIS fault, not mine. If he wants a break then he needs to beg for one and renounce all he's done against people like me. Otherwise, I see no reason to forgive anyone like this man, whose main motivation believe me, is greed.

BTW- he was outed because of the harm he was doing. If that hurt him, oh well. Cry me a damn river. He has the freedom to make informed decisions like the rest of us. He made the wrong ones.

And please don't even compare pedophilia to homosexuality again. I understand your point, but there should be a better way to make it. There is no healthy way to be a practicing pedophile.

EDIT: This just in! Have fun Teddy, you deserve all the conversion therapy you can get. ;)
http://www.advocate.com/news_detail_ektid39209.asp

This news just in, Lee.

Not everyone is like you. Some people have a harder time dealing with their own proclivities than others. Some people are weak, others (like you) are strong. It makes no sense to punish people for being weak. They deserve our help to become better people, not our scorn.

I don't excuse his past actions; I just think that whipping the guy would be both unproductive and churlish.

[leekohler]

This news just in, Lee.

Not everyone is like you. Some people have a harder time dealing with their own proclivities than others. Some people are weak, others (like you) are strong. It makes no sense to punish people for being weak. They deserve our help to become better people, not our scorn.

I don't excuse his past actions; I just think that whipping the guy would be both unproductive and churlish.

And I just told you- if the guy apologizes for what he's done, I'll be more than glad to forgive him. However, if you read the link I provided, that's not likely to happen soon if ever. I bet you he's back in the pulpit preaching how he's been "healed" and back to his old tricks sooner, rather than later.

And you missed my earlier point too- this guy is driven by greed and power, not by trying to perform good works and live a good life.

[Agathon]

And I just told you- if the guy apologizes for what he's done, I'll be more than glad to forgive him. However, if you read the link I provided, that's not likely to happen soon if ever. I bet you he's back in the pulpit preaching how he's been "healed" and back to his old tricks sooner, rather than later.

I think he's finished as a church leader with that church.

And you missed my earlier point too- this guy is driven by greed and power, not by trying to perform good works and live a good life.

So are lots of people. I'm betting his homophobia is largely self directed.

Still, lets see what happens. Hopefully, he comes to accept himself and becomes a better person.

[scem0]

I think he's finished as a church leader with that church.



So are lots of people. I'm betting his homophobia is largely self directed.

Still, lets see what happens. Hopefully, he comes to accept himself and becomes a better person.


He won't be able to accept himself without apologizing first. I wouldn't count on either of those things happening.

Oh, and I wouldn't be so sure that he is done as a church leader.

e

[leekohler]

I think he's finished as a church leader with that church.

Trust me, Dobson will find a place for him- probably as part of the "ex-gay" movement.



So are lots of people. I'm betting his homophobia is largely self directed.

Still, lets see what happens. Hopefully, he comes to accept himself and becomes a better person.

As long as greed and power are his gods, no way. He's had 50+ years to figure it out. I don't think he's gonna change.