Dual 1.2 Ghz PowerMac [Archive]

sparkleytone

Feb 28, 2002, 08:57 AM

on a Mac, that 200MHz means a great deal. I would definitely worry about processor life, power usage, and heat with his computer tho, because of such a big increase. If he fries his processor, hes pretty much screwed because he has physically modified the daughtercard with a soldering iron. I don't think AppleCare covers that ;) Anyways its nice to see some brave folks out there in the Mac world overclocking their respective wares. :)

400 extra MHz...thats equal to the upgrade from 800MHz

mcbane

Feb 28, 2002, 09:28 AM

cool, I would be too worried to do anything like this though =(

AlphaTech

Feb 28, 2002, 09:42 AM

I have to hand it to him... he must have a pair of stainless ones to do that to a $3000+ computer.

Has anyone been running an overclocked TiBook??? I have my rev. a 500MHz, but since it is about to replace my tower I was thinking about MAYBE upping it a little... I would be concerned about generating too much heat and having it crash and melt (litterally)...

I also have installed a GIG of RAM into it, so I don't have any memory issues there :D.

Simon Liquid

Feb 28, 2002, 09:57 AM

Don't TiBooks run quite hot enough as it is? Seems to me overclocking a laptop risks not only expensive hardware, but also your priceless reproductive capabilities.

Simon

AlphaTech

Feb 28, 2002, 10:14 AM

True that.... It would be cheaper to just get a new system when it comes time. I fully intend to get a new tower by MWSF in 2003. That is, unless something in a release REALLY grabs my attention. Until then, I will 'suffer' with JUST one Mac :D.

The difference between nerds and geeks... geeks have the cool toys :D

LethalWolfe

Feb 28, 2002, 10:14 AM

Originally posted by sparkleytone
on a Mac, that 200MHz means a great deal. I would definitely worry about processor life, power usage, and heat with his computer tho, because of such a big increase. If he fries his processor, hes pretty much screwed because he has physically modified the daughtercard with a soldering iron. I don't think AppleCare covers that ;) Anyways its nice to see some brave folks out there in the Mac world overclocking their respective wares. :)

400 extra MHz...thats equal to the upgrade from 800MHz

I bet if you modded the case to and an extra fan you could get yer case temps down. And, as long as you can keep the heat down, I don't think this will wear on the proc too much. I mean, Intel and AMD chips usually come "underclocked" so I assume moto chips do to. By "underclocked" I mean they artifficially<sp?>
run the chip at a lower clock speed. For example, the 800mhz P3 I have running on a 133mhz FSB, is the same chip that Intel sold as a 600mhz proc running on a 100mhz FSB. But, since the G4 is nearing the end of it's product life this might be pushing the chip to its limits. In any case, as long as it's properly cooled I bet the chip life will only be shortened by a few years (and w/how often people get new comps this probably won't make that big a difference anyway).

Lethal

AlphaTech

Feb 28, 2002, 10:18 AM

Get a water cooling system (runs between $150 and $250 for a decent one at http://www.hardcorecooling.com/). You might need to do something to attach it to both your processors, but you could probably get an aluminum (or copper) plate from a local machine shop. Just ask for the alloy that will pull the most heat from the chip.

You will most likely also need to drill a pair of holes into the case to allow the radiator to sit outside of it. I would also place it as far from the case as you can, so that no heat from it, or anything else, will hinder the cooling process.

Macmaniac

Feb 28, 2002, 10:48 AM

That is really cool, wish I could do that!

Rocketman

Feb 28, 2002, 11:22 AM

Originally posted by AlphaTech
I have to hand it to him... he must have a pair of stainless ones to do that to a $3000+ computer.

Has anyone been running an overclocked TiBook??? :D.

You have to hand it to him and his SS balls. He did a methodical series of changes and documented his results for others to enter with open eyes. Cool. He obviously can solder, if nothing else.

I am wondering about what I can do with this Ti400 in a year or so when I wish I had a 1200 Mhz cooler chip in it. Can some hacker let me mail it to them to upgrade the chip, the drive and the memory?

I would probably then whoard RevA Ti400's :)

I am brave but not skilled.

Rocketman

:cool:

AlphaTech

Feb 28, 2002, 11:36 AM

I'd give it a shot in a year.... provided that you sign a waver :D...

I mentioned stainless steel, since brass is just too soft for doing an overclock on a not-so-cheap Mac...

It was even better that he has screen shots showing everything he did, as well as good photo's to show where he was working.

Soldering only takes a steady hand, and good eyes. Although experience teaches how much to do and when to stop (that's what makes people good at it).

CurtisWB

Feb 28, 2002, 12:49 PM

I must smile. The next Mac upgrade will be a 1200 Gig Power Mac. It will be in a few months. When you open the case, you will notice that they will have simply done a little soldering. ;)

SpiffyGuyC

Feb 28, 2002, 01:11 PM

Originally posted by AlphaTech
Has anyone been running an overclocked TiBook??? I have my rev. a 500MHz, but since it is about to replace my tower I was thinking about MAYBE upping it a little... I would be concerned about generating too much heat and having it crash and melt (litterally)...

Hey - thought I would add my two cents, but I take no responsibility for what you do to your machine based on reading this.

I saved roughtly $1000 over the summer by purchasing the stock 400MHz TiBook and upping it to 500MHz. Obviously it runs a little hot, but I have had *no* stability problems whatsoever - a beautiful machine.

I understand that the stock 500MHz models, like the one you have, include a few extra parts (especially under the keyboard) to help with heat distribution. Despite this, I wouldn't push the processor much further. I believe it can be clocked to 550MHz, and in fact this may be as far as the jumpers on the board will allow you to go.

If you're interested in instructions for the procedure, email me at spiffyguyc@mac.com and I'll help you through it as best I can. You'll need to be very comfortable and steady with a soldering iron, and the process is best done under a little bit of magnification - if you're not cool with that, you might want to look for a friend who is rather than attempting the mod yourself. The part's we're talking about are *tiny*...

Hope this helps your decision some.

-S

barkmonster

Feb 28, 2002, 01:40 PM

Originally posted by CurtisWB
I must smile. The next Mac upgrade will be a 1200 Gig Power Mac. It will be in a few months. When you open the case, you will notice that they will have simply done a little soldering. ;)

Judging by the 2 overclocking articles on previous G4s, It's probably the sad truth that that's all we've got to look forward to that is definately possible

look at the previous few overclocking attempts :

first we have a G4 733 Graphite. overclocked to 867Mhz by changing the multiplyer to 6.5x by some guy, 6 months or so and apple release an official 867Mhz G4.

next we have a G4 867 Quicksilver. overclocked to 1000Mhz by changing the multiplyer to 7.5x by the same guy, yet more months pass and apple release an official 1Ghz G4.

now we have a 1Ghz G4 overclocked to 1.2Ghz, I think it's a safe bet that the next G4s will be at least that speed.

You can find out about the older overclocking attempts on Xlr8yourmac's archive pages.

gandalf55

Feb 28, 2002, 02:03 PM

my reaction:

so what.

krossfyter

Feb 28, 2002, 02:14 PM

is it possible to over clock a 667 tibook. i wouldnt try it on my machine but i just want to know if it might be possible. i wonder if the processors in the revb tibooks are underclocked.

AlphaTech

Feb 28, 2002, 02:23 PM

In a previous thread someone did overclock their 550 TiBook to the 667 by changing the system bus rating.

The more I think about it, I think I will wait for an official speed bump. Then get the applecare protection for it. That way, if anything goes wrong with the hardware (other then from abuse) it's covered.

av11d

Feb 28, 2002, 03:52 PM

Anyone try upping the imac?? do you think it is possible, if i really rip the mac apart?

gandalf55

Feb 28, 2002, 04:10 PM

why are board bus speeds still soooo slow? i mean, intel is gonna release a 4ghz p4... but whats the point?

instead of working on processors, how about working on faster boards and couple that with ddr ram? get **** moving faster with the procs we got now...

imagine a 1ghz board! thats the barrier that would really mean something.

AlphaTech

Feb 28, 2002, 04:15 PM

Does anyone here care what intel is going to be coming out with???

Besides the fact that the last two chips that they put out (p3 and p4) got recalled immediately. Can you say crappy QC??? I know you can :D

As for the speeds being 'soooooo slow'... you try running at 133MHz... lets see how long you last... :D

me hate windows

Feb 28, 2002, 04:26 PM

if you want to know how to overclock the imac and most macs go to

www.bekkoame.ne.jp/~t-imai/maine.html

tobyglyn

Feb 28, 2002, 04:38 PM

Originally posted by AlphaTech
I have to hand it to him... he must have a pair of stainless ones to do that to a $3000+ computer.

Has anyone been running an overclocked TiBook??? I have my rev. a 500MHz, but since it is about to replace my tower I was thinking about MAYBE upping it a little... I would be concerned about generating too much heat and having it crash and melt (litterally)...

I also have installed a GIG of RAM into it, so I don't have any memory issues there :D.

I have overclocked my 500mhz Tibook. It's now a 550 and is fast and stable.
There have been no problems at all. That said, mine was one of the last of the rev 1 Titanium models shipped, I'm not sure how an earlier model might fare.

I also have also overclocked a DP1000. The only stable speed was 1067mhz. Hardly worth the effort and risk but the single 800 I have is running very nicely at 933mhz.

AlphaTech

Feb 28, 2002, 05:54 PM

Originally posted by tobyglyn

I have overclocked my 500mhz Tibook. It's now a 550 and is fast and stable.
There have been no problems at all. That said, mine was one of the last of the rev 1 Titanium models shipped, I'm not sure how an earlier model might fare.

I also have also overclocked a DP1000. The only stable speed was 1067mhz. Hardly worth the effort and risk but the single 800 I have is running very nicely at 933mhz.

I have an early rev a Titanium... Maybe I will give it a shot when the applecare has run out and/or when I get a new PowerBook (G whatever). Of course, I will pull everything out of it that can still be used, and make sure that I won't loose anything on the hard drive of value.

Could be an interesting winter project in about 2 years :D...

Onyxx

Mar 1, 2002, 12:00 AM

this is very good news. it means that the new appollo chips do run significantly cooler than the older chips. Did you read that he will "maybe try some thermal paste"!!! the guy isn't even useing any paste and he is achieving a 200mhz overclock. I'm smelling a chip with the capabilities to be overclocked pretty damn high, or maybe those are just the silicon fumes playing with my head ;)

Looks good to me. Lets see him boost that sucker up to 1.4 then we'll see just how efficiant these chips are.

davidc2182

Mar 1, 2002, 12:48 AM

Beyond overclocking computers does anyone know of any sites that deal with cosmetically altering your mac? i'm talking mostly of the new white ibooks! mine got seriously scratched up and i wanna know what type of customizations are out there to make these things look cool?

tobyglyn

Mar 1, 2002, 06:44 AM

Originally posted by Onyxx
this is very good news. it means that the new appollo chips do run significantly cooler than the older chips. Did you read that he will "maybe try some thermal paste"!!! the guy isn't even useing any paste and he is achieving a 200mhz overclock. I'm smelling a chip with the capabilities to be overclocked pretty damn high, or maybe those are just the silicon fumes playing with my head ;)

Looks good to me. Lets see him boost that sucker up to 1.4 then we'll see just how efficient these chips are.

1.2ghz is a big ask as it is. My DP1000 was only alive for a few seconds at 1.2 but it is fine at 1067. I know someone else who seems to have killed his DP1000 trying for 1.2 ghz. I will be very surprised if many people have success with a 1.2ghz clock.
Beware the silicon fumes.

MacAztec

Mar 1, 2002, 08:58 AM

Originally posted by tobyglyn

1.2ghz is a big ask as it is. My DP1000 was only alive for a few seconds at 1.2 but it is fine at 1067. I know someone else who seems to have killed his DP1000 trying for 1.2 ghz. I will be very surprised if many people have success with a 1.2ghz clock.
Beware the silicon fumes.

How do you know so many people that have this machine? And how do you know so many that have overclocked them? I mean, do you just buy new machine at every release or what?

I think you guys should get that internal water cooling system. Then we will see some serious overclockin. :p

tw9876z

Mar 1, 2002, 07:42 PM

hey, i have the 667 mz powerbook and i was wondering if there was a safe way to upgrade these to they dont melt or something. Also my friend has an old ibook and i want to get ti to work faster so how do i do that and the same for the new ibook

tobyglyn

Mar 1, 2002, 08:24 PM

Originally posted by Mac_User

How do you know so many people that have this machine? And how do you know so many that have overclocked them? I mean, do you just buy new machine at every release or what?

I think you guys should get that internal water cooling system. Then we will see some serious overclockin. :p

I buy every new model (really big smile).

With the current single processor models sharing the same heat sink as the DP, there is plenty of headroom for overclocking them.

Putting too much time or money into overclocking doesn't make sense to me. I just wait 3 months or so and the new faster model comes out:)

tobyglyn

Mar 1, 2002, 08:26 PM

Originally posted by tw9876z
hey, i have the 667 mz powerbook and i was wondering if there was a safe way to upgrade these to they dont melt or something. Also my friend has an old ibook and i want to get ti to work faster so how do i do that and the same for the new ibook

I wouldn't recommend it unless you can afford to spend big bucks if it goes wrong.

Laptops have little headroom for overclocking.

tobyglyn

Mar 1, 2002, 08:35 PM

Originally posted by tobyglyn

I wouldn't recommend it unless you can afford to spend big bucks if it goes wrong.

Laptops have little headroom for overclocking.

That said, it seems that most if not all rev1 400mhz Titanium G4s are capable of running at 500mhz (very easy mod see: http://www.voelker.com/service/void/powerbook/) and it may be that the new 550mhz model will run at 667/133.

A 400mhz rev1 Titanium is quite a nice little bargain when running at 500mhz. We have tried taking a 400 to 550 (I'm an optimist) but it was not stable.

King Cobra

Mar 3, 2002, 12:30 PM

When you purchase any portable computer and use it for a long time with the Hard Drive running, it is guaranteed to get very hot. I have a Firewire iBook 466 and it gets rather hot after working with Appleworks on it for hours.

By changing the configuration of the entire motherboard to hoard up a few extra megahertz is all of four things:

(1) It is risky.
(2) It is time consuming.
(3) It is extremely difficult.
(4) It requires the upmost of your patience.

If you are successful, you can go a little faster, but not by a whole lot. If you are unsuccessful, always visualize this message: Congratulations! You have voided your warranty and your Mac is doomed! Please insert 6000 quarters to play again!

If anything, overclock your Mac if absolutely necessary. And don't overclock portables by much because they can overheat and become a portable oven.

By the way, if you are looking to overclock a G3 Powerbook, do not go to far with it. According to my dad, Apple was trying to create a Leather G4 Powerbook (same casing as the Powerbook G3) at 500MHz, but the case melted. (Neat, huh?) This could happen to you if you take one of these portables and overclock them severely.

AlphaTech

Mar 3, 2002, 12:51 PM

Originally posted by davidc2182
Beyond overclocking computers does anyone know of any sites that deal with cosmetically altering your mac? i'm talking mostly of the new white ibooks! mine got seriously scratched up and i wanna know what type of customizations are out there to make these things look cool?

There is one that has skins for the G3 blue and white forward (anything that is in that style case). You can check them out at http://www.AppleSkinz.com/...I believe that they are working on skins for laptops too. I remember reading at another site about making the same towers side pannels clear so that you can do anything you like to them on the inside and colorize them. You can always take the pannels off, paint them up, or add graphics and then put them back on.

I just hope that Apple does something different for the next generation (not using the Gn label) tower. I know that I would like something that looks different. That way, you can tell just by looking at them that they are different.

Peace

tobyglyn

Mar 3, 2002, 05:34 PM

Originally posted by King Cobra
When you purchase any portable computer and use it for a long time with the Hard Drive running, it is guaranteed to get very hot. I have a Firewire iBook 466 and it gets rather hot after working with Appleworks on it for hours.

By changing the configuration of the entire motherboard to hoard up a few extra megahertz is all of four things:

(1) It is risky.
(2) It is time consuming.
(3) It is extremely difficult.
(4) It requires the upmost of your patience.

If you are successful, you can go a little faster, but not by a whole lot. If you are unsuccessful, always visualize this message: Congratulations! You have voided your warranty and your Mac is doomed! Please insert 6000 quarters to play again!

If anything, overclock your Mac if absolutely necessary. And don't overclock portables by much because they can overheat and become a portable oven.

By the way, if you are looking to overclock a G3 Powerbook, do not go to far with it. According to my dad, Apple was trying to create a Leather G4 Powerbook (same casing as the Powerbook G3) at 500MHz, but the case melted. (Neat, huh?) This could happen to you if you take one of these portables and overclock them severely.

(1)It can be risky but less so if you know what you are doing
(2) Sometimes as little as 10 min's
(3) The rev 1 Titanium 400-500mhz clock requires moving a single resistor
(4) If you get it wrong, definitely.

Some Macs have better overclocking potential than others. The single processor Quicksilver models have excellent potential and can often be taken up to the speed of the model above (eg:800-933) with no problems.
The rev 1 Titanium 400 is probably a 500mhz G4 underclocked to 400. The rev 2 Titanium 550 has the same 133mhz main board (and PC-133 RAM) as the more expensive 667 but is underclocked to 100mhz. The CPU may well also be a 667 but I have yet to confirm this.
Don't overclock a Mac that has not tested stable for several weeks prior.
Don't overclock a Mac if you don't have excellent soldering skills and good eyes. It's better to pay a tech to do the work for you and get it right.
Observe all antistatic precautions. Static can kill your Mac!

Xapplimatic

Mar 6, 2002, 11:50 PM

Originally posted by tobyglyn

..
With the current single processor models sharing the same heat sink as the DP, there is plenty of headroom for overclocking them.

Woah! Reading way too much into it... In all likelyhood, since Apple's DP models were introduced, Apple decided to use the same heatsink on the single processor as they do on the dual because its cheaper to build, ship, stock, and install one type of heatsink on all models, than to shave a few centimeters of cheap aluminum and have to maintain a seperate stock, seperate part numbers, blah blah blah.. businesses reuse things all the time to save engineering and overhead costs. I wouldn't assume there was more headroom on the dual just because the single shares the same heatsink.. that could be a very bad assumption.

As for the guy who said he would put Apple Care on his computer and then up the speed because if it blew up Apple Care would take care of it.. Apple Care does not cover modifications made to a computer.. if they smelled an overclock job, I guarantee they would charge every penny as if the policy didn't exist.. It's in their terms of coverage that they don't warantee modified or tampered equipment or upgrades not installed by an authorized Apple Service Center..

As for overclocking itself, I think in moderation it's fine.. I overclocked my iMac 500 to 550 and it's ran for months without problems. I haven't had the balls to try 600 MHz, but hey, 10% gain was 10% gain ya know..

Overclock your iMac G3 (http://www.mxormedia.com/OCiMac/)