Apple iPhone Backstory? Mac OS X Tie ins?

[MacRumors]

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

Appleinsider has posted (http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=2283) an interesting tale of the progression of the Apple iPhone (smart phone) project which has reportedly been ongoing for at least the past three years.

According to the rumor site, Apple reportedly started showcasing a prototype of their proprietary smart phone in the early summer of 2005. At the time they were shopping for both wireless partners as well as contractors. The interface of the phone was based on the one-click simplicity of Front Row along with extensive integration with Mac OS X. This integration came in the form of new .Mac functionality, iTunes syncing, and full iChat functionality.

Two features described in more detail include a "call ahead" feature:

Similarly, a "call ahead" feature would allow users of the phone to pre-record a video clip that could then be transmitted to mobile phone at the receiving end, where it would play before the a call was answered.


and video iChat functionality:

A source familiar with the development efforts said Apple had tapped third parties to lend a hand with certain protocols that would allow for iChat video conferencing between the handset and desktop Macs.

Despite the work done, according to Appleinsider's source, Steve Jobs reportedly was unhappy with the device and insisted on a ground up resdesign in order to meet his requirements.

While the details of this report will be difficult to corroborate, some aspects of it correspond with some previous reports:

LoopRumors.com previously claimed (http://www.looprumors.com/LoopBlackPopup.php?ichat-enabled-iphone,2795766658) that an Apple iPhone would come with iChat AV (videoconferencing capabilities), and in March ThinkSecret reported (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2006/03/20060330174059.shtml) that Apple's phone project was encountering "significant technical hurdles" and it was being designed "from the ground up".

[sartinsauce]

These iPhone rumors are great, but they're really starting to get out of hand. I can't tell if this is a media blitz, or just hype. I'm thinking hype.

[woxel1]

These iPhone rumors are great, but they're really starting to get out of hand. I can't tell if this is a media blitz, or just hype. I'm thinking hype.Right now, they're just rumors. But interesting ones.

[Rojo]

Hmm... The "call ahead" feature sounds neat, but I can't really see a useful/practical reason to use it. I can see JUST sending video messages -- but why prior to making a call?

But I would be ALL OVER video ichat capability. Bring it on!!!!

[supermacdesign]

Get it right or not at all. Apples perfect reputaion of perfect products can't afford a dud product. Take yout time Apple, take your time, my money can wait.

[emotion]

Interesting. I'd like to see all that, esp. the linking with osx. Not sure if we'll see that in this upcoming device (maybe the later one with that "delayed" nvidia chip in it).

.mac is crying out for an overhaul/rethink. Maybe this is the reason that is well overdue?

[hyperpasta]

If AppleInsider says it, it must be so! Check this out:

http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=2016

In this article, AppleInsider flawlessly predicted the iTV, iTunes Movie Store, and Merom iMac.

They have the best reliability in the biz, and I trust this new rumor. I would now bet money on an iPhone at Macworld... it looks to be real this time!

[i_am_a_cow]

oh my

[Bobjob186]

I have a feeling, the iphone is going to be trying to do too much of everything without doing a few things really well, all this stuff sounds good and all but it just doesn't seem probably with the cell phone carriers of today. If it was just a really good looking phone that was combined with an ipod then that would be great, but if it's throwing together video conferencing and data exchange over a wireless network it's either going to be really expensive or it's going to be really difficult it get it right. But in the end it's apple and they always figure a way to do something out of control, maybe this will be a new gadget that will take the wold by storm like the ipod was. I'm excited for 2007.

[airkarol]

iChat Video Chats!! $99 a month!!!

[Scarlet Fever]

they had better hurry up, my shoddy Ericsson T290i is breaking up, and i need a new phone.

Hmm... The "call ahead" feature sounds neat, but I can't really see a useful/practical reason to use it. I can see JUST sending video messages -- but why prior to making a call?

i went to an afi gig recently, and i had to call up my dad to tell him to pick me up. It was only a 10-15 second call, but it probably cost me $0.50 to make. If i could send a short video or something, he would know to come and pick me up without actually answering the phone.

[Fredou51]

It is definitely looking good for January. I think it's starting to explain everything we saw.
.mac is crying out for an overhaul/rethink. Maybe this is the reason that is well overdue?
I think .mac is pretty good. Maybe double the space and the bandwidth but apart from that, the features are pretty good.

Frederic

[dizastor]

I wouldn't doubt the part about Steve being unhappy with the product and calling for a "ground-up" redesign.

This leads me to hope that the iPhone will be everything I've been waiting for since my Cingular contract has run out and my SE T610 is getting VERY long in the tooth.

[clcnyc]

I hope the next item I read in here is actually an announcement, and not the 40,000th iphone "theories". This is torture!

[Flowbee]

For as much as we've been overloaded with iPhone rumors for the past (how many?) years, I find I'm really enjoying these slightly more detailed offerings.

That said, if the phone doesn't come by MacWorld, I'm swearing off iPhone rumors forever.

[solowCX]

If i could send a short video or something, he would know to come and pick me up without actually answering the phone.

Ever hear of a text message?

[ziwi]

That does appear to Job's hand..."I don't like it - take it away and start over" - so to me that adds creedence.

[kddpop]

yes, more detailed rumors are great.

but for those who think this means "definately iphone for mw07"...

there is nothing in the article that says the ground up redesign is finished or met with jobs' approval. could be. but still, this is not conformation of emminent release. only the story of why we have waited this long (and perhaps why we'll continue to wait0>

~kyle

[technocoy]

I hope it's got the email/chat capabilities of my smartphone whilst working as my iPod nano/phone replacement.

I bet iTV will have location based services... you'll be able to stream your content to your iPhone. ooohhhh... i can't wait.

[xloveaffliction]

all this is sounding really great. but i have a question, will the iPhone be available in Apple Retail Stores?
if the iPhone is going to be available to all providers, wouldnt the simplest thing (and most lucrative) for apple to do is simply sell the unlocked iPhone in its retail stores, in both CDMA and GSM flavors?

I'm using a sidekick 3 right now, and i hate it. It's awful. But i'd like an unlocked apple iphone so i can simply get a simcard and not have to extend my contract again, since i just started in July.

any comments?

-Brendan

[bigandy]

i'm starting to believe... finally.

however, the way everything's coming out i haven't much doubt in my mind that it's a PR stunt to build up the hype for MWSF.

even if it's not going to have an iPhone :rolleyes:

[MattyMac]

I love love love hearing and reading all of these iPhone rumors.

The day it is released can't come fast enough!

[longofest]

I'm still a skeptic about the video-enabled iChat in the iPhone. I could be wrong, and AppleInsider having a source definitely does bring some credibility to the story, but it takes a bit of horsepower to do real-time compression, and then you will need a decent amount of duplex bandwidth available in order to hold a video conference (current services like VCast from Verizon which feature multimedia content are primarily simplex traffic in that it is one-way communication. you are primarily watching pre-recorded content).

I just don't think that the current crop of 3G or 2.75G networks will be able to hold up to people having video-chats like that, and even so, the video would have to be compressed out the wazoo, most likely making the picture look kinda bad. I could be wrong, and God knows I hope I'm wrong...

Sightly off my previous thoughts... IF true, this begs all kinds of ethical/legal/whatever questions. I mean, obviously it is hard enough for some people to drive and talk at the same time, imagine people driving and trying to iChat-AV at the same time. Oh, the pain!

EDIT: Just read the full article. Heh.. figures the source never saw the video iChat enabled phone prototype :)

[drewyboy]

That's very intersting thought. What if Apple just decided to only sell unlocked phones? That would totally screw the cell companies over for them not wanting apple's phone cuz of the itunes and stuff. Plus it would allow ANYONE to get the phone and use it...wider consumer market. I can see it now "iPhone. Anyone, Anywhere, Any service."

[OdduWon]

perhaps this is why we havent seen a increase in the toe .Mac storage at the same price point. they are waithing to say "oh and one more thing" if you have .Mac and aroung a wifi source you can make free calls/text/chats. and i think that having a good camera will provide people on the go with a "usable" way to document their day and keep people in touch via mobile podcasting. also a mini imovie would be greate for this. we need a device that can do more than just create playlists:D

[szark]

if the iPhone is going to be available to all providers, wouldnt the simplest thing (and most lucrative) for apple to do is simply sell the unlocked iPhone in its retail stores, in both CDMA and GSM flavors?

Hopefully, a single iPhone will be able to use either CDMA or GSM networks -- that would be the best solution. It would make the phone a bit more expensive, though.

If they come out with a decent iPhone, which can be used on both CDMA and GSM networks, with all the functions listed above...I'd buy one.


IF true, this begs all kinds of ethical/legal/whatever questions. I mean, obviously it is hard enough for some people to drive and talk at the same time, imagine people driving and trying to iChat-AV at the same time. Oh, the pain!

Headset with built-in iSight? ;)

[Thanatoast]

I bet iTV will have location based services... you'll be able to stream your content to your iPhone. ooohhhh... i can't wait.
Now that would be a killer app. Talk about a "wireless" iPod. It wouldn't need a hard drive at all. No syncing, just broadband.

This is, of course, a bit beyond our technology but we're getting there. Definitely forward-looking.

[Scarlet Fever]

Ever hear of a text message?

yea, but for me, they take a while to create, and don't you agree that video messages would be much quicker and easier?

[weg]

This integration came in the form of new .Mac functionality, iTunes syncing, and full iChat functionality.


If they really wanna be successful with that phone they'll have to provide syncing with Windows/Outlook... I'm wondering if that will happen..

[weg]

It wouldn't need a hard drive at all. No syncing, just broadband.


I already own a device like that. It's called a "radio" :D

[OdduWon]

the video would have to be compressed out the wazoo, most likely making the picture look kinda bad. I mean, obviously it is hard enough for some people to drive and talk at the same time, imagine people driving and trying to iChat-AV at the same time. Oh, the pain!:)

can there be higher volumes of data sent via wifi? and if this is a conferemcind device most often those who need to conference are around some type of wifi. and if wifi (ahem .mac) is required then ther may be no drive chat:D thay would be scary :eek:

[macfan70]

I hope the next item I read in here is actually an announcement, and not the 40,000th iphone "theories". This is torture!

Nooo... It's Tortora, Jesse Tortora. :D

[weg]

Similarly, a "call ahead" feature would allow users of the phone to pre-record a video clip that could then be transmitted to mobile phone at the receiving end, where it would play before the a call was answered.


Very useful for advertising, indeed. I can already see the offers: "Free calls if you send our advertisements to everybody who calls you".

Actually, I don't see any other use for that. Why would I want to watch a video before I'm talking to somebody..

[BWhaler]

I really we hope we see this soon. The phone is such as critical tool, and it simply sucks that everything on the market is so bad.

I was blown away by those ideas. I hope Apple is truly trying to leave their mark on the world with this product.

My only concerns:

1. The hype is so insane, that even a decent phone will be a massive disappointment. (To Apple employees, customers, media, and Wall Street)

2. Apple quality since late 2005 has been horrific--notably in the portable line. Because there is such a low tolerance for flaws in things like phones--it's a safety devise--I worry that Apple can pull this off. Sure, the current manufacturers are terrible at innovation, but they do their boring, 6 sigma, CMM Level 5 quality assurance well. Not flawless, but not in the same ball park at the quality seen in the MB and MBP line this year.

Fingers crossed...

[1000masks]

This has to be the most hyped Apple product of all time. It also has the biggest potential for success or failure. They can turn the cell phone industry in the US upside down. The anticipation is killing me already.

[sterno74]

I have a feeling, the iphone is going to be trying to do too much of everything without doing a few things really well, all this stuff sounds good and all but it just doesn't seem probably with the cell phone carriers of today.

This may be more indicative of the fact that we're dealing so heavily in rumors than the design of the phone itself. That is, if at some point somebody explored the possibility of some kooky video system for it, it would make it into the rumored features of the phone even if it never made it past the R&D lab in the real phone.

I suspect that we'll see a simpler phone + ipod type device early next year. Then late next year, they can release a smart phone which I suspect will essentially be ILife + IPod + Cellphone. That makes sense with the camera/video integration, address book, etc.

[twoodcc]

Right now, they're just rumors. But interesting ones.

yeah they are just rumors, and they're very interesting. i just hope they turn out to be true, and that i can get my hands on a new phone when it comes out

[iJaz]

Too much hype is definitively not good, the disappointments will be too big. :cool:

[Object-X]

Very useful for advertising, indeed. I can already see the offers: "Free calls if you send our advertisements to everybody who calls you".

Actually, I don't see any other use for that. Why would I want to watch a video before I'm talking to somebody..

For porn of course! Oh, mom...uh, hi..sorry....:o

[sterno74]

Sure, the current manufacturers are terrible at innovation, but they do their boring, 6 sigma, CMM Level 5 quality assurance well. Not flawless, but not in the same ball park at the quality seen in the MB and MBP line this year.

Tell that to Sony's laptop battery department :)

The thing is, in spite of Apple having some problems, they are still perceived, by and large, as making quality products (primarily from the stellar reputation of the IPods). The good sign here is that they are being patient. The instinct is to rush something out for christmas, but they definitely didn't do that.

[sbrhwkp3]

Oh man, call ahead sounds so sweet!

[breal8406]

Glad to see Steve is getting all the attention for being so involved in this project. Gives me that much more reason to think we're in for something real good! Can't wait...already got the money saved to buy one.

[lmalave]

Sorry, folks, but if the article is to be believed, then the revolutionary and "from the ground up" iPhone Rev. 2 won't be available until fall of 2007.

What we're talking about for January is the simpler "iPhone" which is just going to be an iPod nano based slider phone. You know what, though? I'll still get it - it'll still be a significant improvement over my SonyEricsson. I know it will be a great simple phone and MP3 player. It should have great iSync integration, of course. I'm less sure about 2 things: 1) camera and 2) web browsing. I don't use my phone's camera all that much, but I would still like the iPhone to at least have a VGA camera. For web browsing, I think they should just make sure that Java performance on the phone is good, and then bundle Opera mini with the phone. I just think it's unlikely Apple can improve on what Opera is already providing. Plus, if the phone has good Java performance then it will be better for games and 3rd party apps (e.g. mobile Gmail, mobile Google maps).

So I will probably just get the iPhone immediately and then maybe get the PDA Rev. 2 iPhone down the road. Maybe I'll suck it up and just pay full retail price for the PDA version, and give the iPhone to my mom (she'd love it).

[jazman]

For those of you having trouble with the Call Ahead feature, just think of it as a video caller-id or phone avatar. I think it would be very functional and fun. Just think of all the creative stuff that people would do to announce their call. Some will probably reformat clips of music videos and movies to represent them. I would probably do something geeky to make a person lol in a meeting.

[iJaz]

Sorry, folks, but if the article is to be believed, then the revolutionary and "from the ground up" iPhone Rev. 2 won't be available until fall of 2007.

I agree, the smart iPhone wont be here in a while, while the simple iPhone will.

I don't use my phone's camera all that much, but I would still like the iPhone to at least have a VGA camera.
I agree with most you wrote but not with this. I would rather see no camera than a VGA camera! I just looked at some pictures taken with my SE phone (VGA) and the quality suck so hard! At least 1.3 MP or no camera at all!

[iJaz]

For those of you having trouble with the Call Ahead feature, just think of it as a video caller-id. I think it would be very functional and fun. Just think of all the creative stuff that people would do to announce their call. Some will probably reformat clips of music videos and movies to represent them. I would probably do something geeky to make a person lol in a meeting.

Oh, what would RIAA say!? :eek:

[scu]

when this puppy comes out look for AAPL to go past $150.:D

These things will sell like hot cakes. I know plenty of people who would dump their blackberries for a phone like this.

[jazman]

Oh, what would RIAA say!? :eek:

How would they know unless you called one of them? :)

[shrimpdesign]

I already own a device like that. It's called a "radio" :D

Radio is great if you want to be a tool.

Seriously, Clear Channel owns almost every radio station in the country, there's only a few indie ones left. Unless you like generic simplistic corporate crapola ...

Apple quality since late 2005 has been horrific--notably in the portable line.
No, only in the portable line. There have been NO widespread reported problems with the 2G Shuffle, the 5.5G iPod, the 2G Nano, the Intel Mac Mini, the Mac Pro, the Intel iMac, Intel Xserve ... need I go on?

All the problems with the MacBooks and MBPs were heat and processor releated because of Apple's small expirience with their new Intel processors... and the short time they had to cram all that into a PowerBook case.

As long as Apple makes the iPhone like they make the Nano (aluminum enclosure) then you have nothing to worry about. They have good expirience with aluminum enclosures.

I mean, c'mon. Are you really worried that Apple can't make a better phone than Kyocera or Audiovox?

[NewSc2]

yea, but for me, they take a while to create, and don't you agree that video messages would be much quicker and easier?

actually, not really. especially if you were at a concert or other loud place, video messages would be much harder to create.

this is why phones should have keyboards, too. predictive text only gets you so far before you start to get annoyed.

Apple better release its smart phone soon -- my Razr's dying on me and if no word comes out of an iSmartPhone by MWSF, I gotta go with Treo.

EDIT: And also, I wouldn't want *too* much iChat functionalilty. I really like my Adium, and I never use iChat on OSX.

[Thanatoast]

I already own a device like that. It's called a "radio" :D
A radio that only plays the songs and tv shows you want to see and hear!

[matthewHUB]

[QUOTE=NewSc2;3122484]this is why phones should have keyboards, too. predictive text only gets you so far before you start to get annoyed.


Hmmm i'm from UK and i now live in New York. I've realised that Americans simply don't text as much as we do in Europe. I used to send at least 20 a day. And they are soooo clow at texting it's like it hasn't even really caught on yet. God and some of my friends can't work predictive text to save their lives!

Dunno what the new iphone would have in store but i find texting with a number keypad more than adequate.

[Goldfinger]

Yeah predictive input works perfectly. It doesn't take a genious to handle it.

[matthemercyless]

I don't know about anyone else, but I'm getting pretty excited about this. :D We're definately seeing more and more rumours than ever before surrounding this product, and rumour sites are getting more and more accurate with their predictions (pretty much).:D

I read a little of the latest patent document filed by Apple and think the phone could shape up to be quite awesome.
2 versions sounds like a good idea, one straight up cell phone, with the usual media features and a smartphone following later in the year. This would allow Apple to test the waters with a fairly simple model first, and provided sales were good, they could release a more expensive smartphone later.

The construction technique sounds pretty cool, allowing for the exterior to be almost seamless, like the ipod mini.:cool: It could also have wifi, but the references to radio frequency functionality could just be bluetooth.

The idea of holding a video conference between a cell phone and desktop sounds sweet, if it uses an nvidia video chip, it could be damn powerful too!

[BWhaler]

No, only in the portable line. There have been NO widespread reported problems with the 2G Shuffle, the 5.5G iPod, the 2G Nano, the Intel Mac Mini, the Mac Pro, the Intel iMac, Intel Xserve ... need I go on?

All the problems with the MacBooks and MBPs were heat and processor releated because of Apple's small expirience with their new Intel processors... and the short time they had to cram all that into a PowerBook case.

As long as Apple makes the iPhone like they make the Nano (aluminum enclosure) then you have nothing to worry about. They have good expirience with aluminum enclosures.


First off, you're wrong:

-- The Mac mini Intel revision had massive airport and bluetooth problems
-- The screen line has massive problems
-- iTunes needed a .1 emergency patch since it was losing music and corrupting libraries
-- The 5.5g iPod and nano Rev b. are markedly slower at transfers. Apple has acknowledged this problem.

etc., etc., etc...

Second, even if you WERE correct, the fact that Apple is "only" having massive problems with it portable line is EXACTLY THE POINT. A phone is a mobile device, subject to the same micro-engineering challenges a laptop is.

Remember, real Apple supporters keep the company honest and demand only the very best from them.

[backsidetailsli]

this definetly sounds good to me

[MacViolinist]

I've been getting pretty excited about the rumors. I haven't seen anyone post this yet, but I may have missed it. With the two price points so close to current offerings, is there any chance that Apple will offer two completely different cell-phone options?

One would be the lower end, nano form factor and be a pretty basic iPod+phone, with syncing of contacts and calendar.

Then there would be the full-sized iPod+smartphone with all the bells and whistles. So you get the best of both worlds. Some people want an iPod that also happens to make calls. Others want a PDA that also happens to be a phone and an iPod. Why not make both?

It's only two products and that makes for a pretty simple lineup, and everyone ends up happy with exactly what they want. Sort of.

[asphalt-proof]

I really hope we get more juicy information soon. I have to make a decision in the next couple of weeks to replace my current phone or wait till January after the announcements. Its just killing me to wait!! My biggest fear is that the conference will come and go and nary an iPhone product is seen. Then I will have gone yet another month with a craptastic Treo 600.

[shrimpdesign]

-- The Mac mini Intel revision had massive airport and bluetooth problems
-- The screen line has massive problems
-- iTunes needed a .1 emergency patch since it was losing music and corrupting libraries
-- The 5.5g iPod and nano Rev b. are markedly slower at transfers. Apple has acknowledged this problem.

I believe we're talking about hardware problems, not iTunes problems. Why did you list an iTunes problem?

The problems with the Intel Mini, 5.5G iPod and 2G Nano are minor problems ... I haven't even heard about them before. And what does "screen line has massive problems" mean? What screen? What product?

Out of the 4 problems you listed, only 3 make sense, only 2 are applicable, and only 1 has been acknowledged by Apple.

Second, even if you WERE correct, the fact that Apple is "only" having massive problems with it portable line is EXACTLY THE POINT. A phone is a mobile device, subject to the same micro-engineering challenges a laptop is.

Notebooks are handeled different than mobile phones. There's different teams and departments in Apple. Why would the notebook team work on the iPhone? Wouldn't the iPod team/department work on it? Despite the 1G Nano's case being scratched easily, iPods have had few major problems. I suspect the iPhone will have a minor problem or two, but nothing to stop sales. I am willing to bet that the iPhone will have no major problems.

[SeaFox]

The interface of the phone was based on the one-click simplicity of Front Row along with extensive integration with Mac OS X. This integration came in the form of new .Mac functionality, iTunes syncing, and full iChat functionality.

I want address book syncing without a Mac. I'm sick of so many of Apple's services requiring access to a Macintosh to use. iCal does me little good when I can't edit calendars while I'm at work (on a PC).

I remember when web mail for .Mac mail first came out it had no spell checker. I complained and the response I got back was that I should just use OSX's built-in spell checker instead. Gee, if I'm on my own Mac why do I need to use Webmail?

[darwen]

The iChat functionality does not excite me as of now. I cannot really see a reasonable application for it.

This does make a lot of sense now... the phone has gone through a bunch of revisions because apple knew if the first version messed up, it could not be fixed in the second one. The second one will obviously be more appealing than the first but the first still needs to be attractive enough to take over the market. This needs to be the new razor ... or I guess the chocolate is a better example now.

[darwen]

A radio that only plays the songs and tv shows you want to see and hear!

I dont get it... so you are saying this will play the ones you dont want to hear?

[sartinsauce]

\I have to make a decision in the next couple of weeks to replace my current phone or wait till January after the announcements.

Why do you have to make the decision now? Is there a gun to your head? Are you impatient? Young? Prone to instant gratification?

Are you one of those people who won't buy a new MacBook because there might be a newer one coming in the next six months?

Sorry, not trying to bash or flame.

Back on topic... I like the idea that this phone may be unlocked. It's so bothersome to have technology tied to long service contracts. It's such a painful business strategy for the consumers. Similarly, I'm excited by the rumors that there will be both CDMA and GSM versions of the product. Everyone wins that way. Not just everyone in America, but most of the world. That's the rumor I want to believe in the most.

[ChrisA]

...I'm sick of so many of Apple's services requiring access to a Macintosh to use.

That's the whole point. They want you to buy a Mac.

BTW, Apple remote desktop allows you to access your Mac from anyplace. and remote desktop is just Apple's version of VNC which is free.

[Goldfinger]

Back on topic... I like the idea that this phone may be unlocked. It's so bothersome to have technology tied to long service contracts. It's such a painful business strategy for the consumers. Similarly, I'm excited by the rumors that there will be both CDMA and GSM versions of the product. Everyone wins that way. Not just everyone in America, but most of the world. That's the rumor I want to believe in the most.

I'm pretty sure that it'll be unlocked. Apple(steve) wants to be in control.
It would even suprise me A LOT if it were a locked phone. Thank god we don't have locked phones over here (they're illegal).

[Goldfinger]

That's the whole point. They want you to buy a Mac.

BTW, Apple remote desktop allows you to access your Mac from anyplace. and remote desktop is just Apple's version of VNC which is free.

Sure, if your work PC has to necessary ports opened up and if your Mac is running and if you have a fixed IP at home (which most people do not have) and if you have the money to burn on ARD.

[jmbear]

Make a phone that has the following:

Tri-Band (World Phone)
Wi-Fi/Wi-Max
iChat, Google Talk, MSN Messenger etc...
Skype
iTunes and mp3 playback
Camera
Video Confering
Email
Web Surfing

You have my money

Basically, when the phone detects Wi-Fi/Wi-Max it connects and you have free (or almost free) outgoing calls through Skype (or similar services), otherwise it works on GSM or CDMA. When you have Wi-Fi/Wi-Max you can do video conferering (that would be so sweet).

I know people say that Wi-Fi/Wi-Max sucks battery life, but guess what? YOU CAN TURN IT OFF! I don´t really need a phone with more than a 12 hours of battery life, because whenever I am on the car or in my house I charge it. Battery life should only be meaningful for people that have access to the power grid every 4 days!

[BWhaler]

I believe we're talking about hardware problems, not iTunes problems. Why did you list an iTunes problem?

The problems with the Intel Mini, 5.5G iPod and 2G Nano are minor problems ... I haven't even heard about them before. And what does "screen line has massive problems" mean? What screen? What product?

Out of the 4 problems you listed, only 3 make sense, only 2 are applicable, and only 1 has been acknowledged by Apple.



Notebooks are handeled different than mobile phones. There's different teams and departments in Apple. Why would the notebook team work on the iPhone? Wouldn't the iPod team/department work on it? Despite the 1G Nano's case being scratched easily, iPods have had few major problems. I suspect the iPhone will have a minor problem or two, but nothing to stop sales. I am willing to bet that the iPhone will have no major problems.

Great. An Apple Apologist.

Lovely.

[theBB]

Make a phone that has the following:

Tri-Band (World Phone)
Wi-Fi/Wi-Max
iChat, Google Talk, MSN Messenger etc...
Skype
iTunes and mp3 playback
Camera
Video Confering
Email
Web Surfing

There are no mobile WiMax networks, yet. What good will it do to have it on your phone? Maybe in a few years, but not now.



I know people say that Wi-Fi/Wi-Max sucks battery life, but guess what? YOU CAN TURN IT OFF! I don´t really need a phone with more than a 12 hours of battery life, because whenever I am on the car or in my house I charge it. Battery life should only be meaningful for people that have access to the power grid every 4 days!
I don't wanna deal with charging everyday.

[Hami]

It occurred to me yesterday on the walk home from work as I listened to my iPod that Apple may have given a hint to a feature in the upcoming iPhone and/or 6g iPod.

iTunes 7 introduced a new feature of Transfer Purchased Songs from "Your iPod Name Here". This is a good feature but I think there might be more behind it.

Imagine if the iPhone is able to browse the Internet and the specifically the iTunes Store (either by Wifi hotspot or using your carrier's network). You then could purchase music from where ever you are, download and listen to it on you iPhone and when you get home easily transfer you newly purchased music to your iTunes.

I for one am hoping see a forth coming option of Transfer Purchased Songs from "Your iPhone Name Here", that and a whole host of other features.

Am I off the mark? Thoughts?

/ Hami

[shrimpdesign]

Great. An Apple Apologist.

Lovely.

I like how you responded to my points instead of making a personal attack. :rolleyes:

Serously, if you can't support and argue your point, do you really understand it? Or believe it?

I just don't follow your logic, and even some of your points. Screen line? I still don't know what screen line is, and how will I know if you call me names instead of telling me? And I don't get why the notebook division of Apple would be making the iPhone ... :confused:

I'm not an Apple apologist. I know Apple isn't perfect. I know 3 people who have gotten MBPs .. they have all gotten replacements. I just don't follow your arguement. And if you actually had reasons do believe what you do, why don't you give them instead of personally attacking me?

[WildPalms]

Ever hear of a text message?

Grab a stopwatch, start typing an SMS text message and note the time.
Now, speak the same thing and time that.

Get it now?:cool:

[WildPalms]

Great. An Apple Apologist.

Lovely.
Actually, I thought shrimpdesign was making logical and factual statements and they all checked out. I read much more emotion in your post, BWhaler. Perhaps this site might be more up your alley http://www.microsoft.com/windowsvista/
:p

[thejadedmonkey]

Grab a stopwatch, start typing an SMS text message and note the time.
Now, speak the same thing and time that.

Get it now?:cool:

You're right. It is quicker to text my dad than to try to call him up and wait for him to answer and tell him.
I completely missed your point? Maybe on the old T9 input, but iTap made texting about a billion times faster.

[WildPalms]

You're right. It is quicker to text my dad than to try to call him up and wait for him to answer and tell him.
I completely missed your point? Maybe on the old T9 input, but iTap made texting about a billion times faster.

I'm afraid you did miss the point.....

The debated point was whether typing an SMS was quicker than hitting a Record button, speaking then sending (like a text message) that recording to an entry/person in your address book. Not a regular phone call, or waiting for 'your dad' to answer the phone. I'm sure I responded in context...

[jmbear]

There are no mobile WiMax networks, yet. What good will it do to have it on your phone? Maybe in a few years, but not now.


Maybe not in the US, but all of Mexico City is covered by a Wi-Max network (thats about 22M potential customers that pay way too much with Telcel and Telmex).

And if you have Skype-In and Wi-Max, you basically got a cellphone with the cheapest calling rates ever. Apple and many other US firms need to pull their heads out of their collective asses and realize there is tremendous growth potential in countries outside the US. Just because in the US you don't have Wi-Max or still have crappy CDMA, it doesn't mean you have to cripple your products (specially in the mobile phone market in which the US is behind Europe and some of Latin America)

I don't wanna deal with charging everyday.

Lazy bum

[princealfie]

Maybe not in the US, but all of Mexico City is covered by a Wi-Max network (thats about 22M potential customers that pay way too much with Telcel and Telmex).

And if you have Skype-In and Wi-Max, you basically got a cellphone with the cheapest calling rates ever. Apple and many other US firms need to pull their heads out of their collective asses and realize there is tremendous growth potential in countries outside the US. Just because in the US you don't have Wi-Max or still have crappy CDMA, it doesn't mean you have to cripple your products (specially in the mobile phone market in which the US is behind Europe and some of Latin America)


Lazy bum

Amen, amen.

[koobcamuk]

[QUOTE=NewSc2;3122484]this is why phones should have keyboards, too. predictive text only gets you so far before you start to get annoyed.


Hmmm i'm from UK and i now live in New York. I've realised that Americans simply don't text as much as we do in Europe. I used to send at least 20 a day. And they are soooo clow at texting it's like it hasn't even really caught on yet. God and some of my friends can't work predictive text to save their lives!

Dunno what the new iphone would have in store but i find texting with a number keypad more than adequate.
I agree. I hope apple has done their homework as America is far behind regarding cell phones and the culture that drives it. I just hope it's not a dud.

[Carefulle]

I think with the recent acquisition between google and youtube -and the fact that the CEO of google is a board member of Apple- will only mean some interesting type of video access.
Question Is the H.264 a better compression than whatever youtube has?

[asphalt-proof]

Why do you have to make the decision now? Is there a gun to your head? Are you impatient? Young? Prone to instant gratification?

Are you one of those people who won't buy a new MacBook because there might be a newer one coming in the next six months?

Sorry, not trying to bash or flame.

Back on topic... I like the idea that this phone may be unlocked. It's so bothersome to have technology tied to long service contracts. It's such a painful business strategy for the consumers. Similarly, I'm excited by the rumors that there will be both CDMA and GSM versions of the product. Everyone wins that way. Not just everyone in America, but most of the world. That's the rumor I want to believe in the most.

No gun nor is it an instant gratification thing (I am married so I know all about delayed gratification;) ). Its more of a work thing. My phone is dying. I don't need a phone as much as I need an organizer for work. I am due for an upgrade with CIngular so I have to decide if I wait till January (and us a paper organizer in the meantime) or if I go ahead and get a 3125. I am not good with paper organizers but I can make due for a few weeks. There are also a couple of related work-specific reasons as well.

[kristoffer4]

I hope it will be something like this, spec wise!
http://www.gsmarena.com/lg_ke800-1765.php
Just with either 4 or 8GB :)
Come on Apple put in the camera! :)

[emotion]

I think with the recent acquisition between google and youtube -and the fact that the CEO of google is a board member of Apple- will only mean some interesting type of video access.
Question Is the H.264 a better compression than whatever youtube has?

I was about to post something along these lines. It seems to me that iChat(AV) could be used more by people instead of Skype and other options. In the university environment especially. The fact it's so closed will always limit it's deployment. Teaming up with google might help here.

[JMax1]

Headset with built-in iSight? ;)

Not a bad idea! Car steering wheels with build in iSight.

See Futurama episode "Put Your Heads on My Shoulder"

http://www.gotfuturama.com/Multimedia/FrameGrabs/2ACV07/Grabs/pic00183.jpg

[pizzy]

what if the iPhone has wi-fi and iChat A/V capabilities are available when the phone has a wi-fi connection, therefore not using cellular networks to transmit all that data which would be cumbersome and difficult. Furthermore, a device that has the ability to switch between cellular networks and VOIP would be very powerful and extremely useful and benneficial. I believe this is the path Apple will take, politics permitting. The device could act like a Skype phone at home on your wi-fi connection and make cellular calls when roaming about. imagine.

and tight integration with OS X is a given. There is no way this phone will not sync tightly with Address Book, Mail and iCal. not to mention the possibility for selecting finder folders which the user wishes to have automaticall sync up with the iPhone as well. And of course iTunes integration - identical to the way syncing is currently done with the iPod.

[jthrasher]

did anyone else see Jay Leno last night? He mentioned the Apple iPhone in his monologue saying that "Apple is coming out with a new product in time for the holidays called an iPhone"

[sartinsauce]

No gun nor is it an instant gratification thing (I am married so I know all about delayed gratification;) ). Its more of a work thing. My phone is dying. I don't need a phone as much as I need an organizer for work. I am due for an upgrade with CIngular so I have to decide if I wait till January (and us a paper organizer in the meantime) or if I go ahead and get a 3125. I am not good with paper organizers but I can make due for a few weeks. There are also a couple of related work-specific reasons as well.


In that case, I say wait. If you think you can hang on for a few more weeks, wait and see. If you're anything like me, you'd kick youself for running out and buying a new phone, only to have Apple release something cool a couple of weeks later.

Worst case scenario, no Apple Phone comes, and you get a post-holiday discount at Cingular.

[emotion]

did anyone else see Jay Leno last night? He mentioned the Apple iPhone in his monologue saying that "Apple is coming out with a new product in time for the holidays called an iPhone"

This is a carefully stage managed hype campaign then?

It's working on me it has to be said :)

btw. my phone no longer charges. Apple get a move on!

[Bubbasteve]

With all the ongoing rumors of the iPhone I have a few things I would love to see it "sport" -- and very easy to accomplish...

1.) Headphone jack (as used for the iPods)

2.) Charged through iPod USB Cable, hence the iPhone would have a dock connector

3.) You could listen to your phone calls through the headphones -- furthermore you could have one hell of a speaker phone if you plugged your iPhone into say an FM transmitter or cassette player thingy (or a home stereo system or speaker set for the iPod)

4.) You can play music through things like an iTrip or some other device so if you're with your friends and they don't have a certain song on there iPod you can plug in your iPhone and select the song from your library.

5.) I would like it if it had a QWERTY keyboard so I could text people free of charge in selected Wi-Fi hotspots (through iChat mobile?)

I would really like the first 4 but the 5th would be a true luxury (to me at least)

Moral of the story -- MacWorld can't come soon enough!

[bfineman]

Carriers: Someone early in the thread speculated that it would be great if Apple released a pair of unlocked phones that would work on the wireless carrier of your choice. While I agree that this would be great, it will not happen. Wireless carries are extremely conservative about what phones they will allow on their networks. For example, Verizon (the largest US carrier) puts all of its phones through a rigorous certification process before it releases them, as well as loading them with custom Verizon firmware. They do not allow non certified phones to be activated on their network. So, if they ever did release the iPhone, it would be a Verizon version purchased from Verizon, probably with a featureset limited by Verizon.

WiMax. Someone said they wanted a WiMax enabled phone, which I agree would be sweet, but it's also not going to happen yet. There is no mobile WiMax chipset yet. Yes, there are a couple cities that have WiMax deployed, but you need an external receiver box and antenna to use it - it's to mount on the outside of you house, no so conducive to laptops (or phones).

Videoconferencing. This could be the killer app if they do it right. Someone mentioned the asymetric bandwidth issue, with which I totally agree - phone companies aren't interested in giving you much upload bandwidth. However, someone else speculated that video could be an option that's only enabled when you're connected to WiFi - this seems the most likely implementation to me. While I'm sure with a dedicated chip they could pull off compression decent enough to send video over a cellular link, the other problem that they'd run into is latency, and I don't know how they would solve that on the cellular link. Then again, they're smarter than me, so maybe they'll figure it out.

Random comments. Battery life - sure, 200 hours of standby time is nice, but really, is it so much to ask to charge your phone every night? It's a rare night that I sleep away from a power outlet. And if I'm camping, I'm not taking my precious iPhone along. Skype - iChat has built in voice functionality and Skype is a competitor in that space. Of course what we're looking for is a VoIP client that can call regular phones so we can avoid fees, but the wireless carriers will sure push back hard on that one - once you no longer need their network, you no longer need them. I'm sure Apple could set up VoIP -> POTS calling in iChat AV, but I don't think they're interesting in getting into that space. I agree it would be sweet though. Presence - this will be important. Being able to set your "available/away" status, or even better, available for "text/voice/video" escalating presence. iChat AV already has this, so I would be surprised if they didn't carry this over. One idea that I thought would be neat would be to set your presence automatically using your iCal calendar. ie, if I have a meeting from 1pm-2pm, the phone automatically sets my presence to "Available - Text" for that period, and back to "Available - Video" when I'm done.

Oh, and the Slingbox style streaming form iTV is a great idea too.

[koobcamuk]

Carriers: Someone early in the thread speculated that it would be great if Apple released a pair of unlocked phones that would work on the wireless carrier of your choice. While I agree that this would be great, it will not happen. Wireless carries are extremely conservative about what phones they will allow on their networks. For example, Verizon (the largest US carrier) puts all of its phones through a rigorous certification process before it releases them, as well as loading them with custom Verizon firmware. They do not allow non certified phones to be activated on their network. So, if they ever did release the iPhone, it would be a Verizon version purchased from Verizon, probably with a featureset limited by Verizon.

WiMax. Someone said they wanted a WiMax enabled phone, which I agree would be sweet, but it's also not going to happen yet. There is no mobile WiMax chipset yet. Yes, there are a couple cities that have WiMax deployed, but you need an external receiver box and antenna to use it - it's to mount on the outside of you house, no so conducive to laptops (or phones).

Videoconferencing. This could be the killer app if they do it right. Someone mentioned the asymetric bandwidth issue, with which I totally agree - phone companies aren't interested in giving you much upload bandwidth. However, someone else speculated that video could be an option that's only enabled when you're connected to WiFi - this seems the most likely implementation to me. While I'm sure with a dedicated chip they could pull off compression decent enough to send video over a cellular link, the other problem that they'd run into is latency, and I don't know how they would solve that on the cellular link. Then again, they're smarter than me, so maybe they'll figure it out.

Random comments. Battery life - sure, 200 hours of standby time is nice, but really, is it so much to ask to charge your phone every night? It's a rare night that I sleep away from a power outlet. And if I'm camping, I'm not taking my precious iPhone along. Skype - iChat has built in voice functionality and Skype is a competitor in that space. Of course what we're looking for is a VoIP client that can call regular phones so we can avoid fees, but the wireless carriers will sure push back hard on that one - once you no longer need their network, you no longer need them. I'm sure Apple could set up VoIP -> POTS calling in iChat AV, but I don't think they're interesting in getting into that space. I agree it would be sweet though. Presence - this will be important. Being able to set your "available/away" status, or even better, available for "text/voice/video" escalating presence. iChat AV already has this, so I would be surprised if they didn't carry this over. One idea that I thought would be neat would be to set your presence automatically using your iCal calendar. ie, if I have a meeting from 1pm-2pm, the phone automatically sets my presence to "Available - Text" for that period, and back to "Available - Video" when I'm done.

Oh, and the Slingbox style streaming form iTV is a great idea too.

In the UK and many other leading cellular phone countries (where we actually use our phones a lot more than Americans) unlocked phones are commonplace. America might tie it to a contract but Apple can't use Verizon in the UK... so whom? Needs to be unlocked and sold in Apple stores. If it's sold in phone shops, to specific network (s) I will be angry.

[jmbear]

WiMax. Someone said they wanted a WiMax enabled phone, which I agree would be sweet, but it's also not going to happen yet. There is no mobile WiMax chipset yet. Yes, there are a couple cities that have WiMax deployed, but you need an external receiver box and antenna to use it - it's to mount on the outside of you house, no so conducive to laptops (or phones).


Wrong! Look at what Motorola is planning (http://www.wirelessweek.com/article/CA6387853.html?spacedesc=Features;cfC0C1CF97=314574092!Mzg3MTMxMjpyYWRpdXM6d5Kt5ceyGZU2d/9gTTO7dw==).

"WINMAX PROTOTYPE ON THE WAY With Motorola as a main infrastructure provider for Sprint's planned WiMAX network, what does the company have up its sleeve for phones to support that network? Shaddock says his division will have a prototype WiMAX phone that can be used for trial purposes in the first half of 2007. That would meet expectations for Sprint's plans to have a soft WiMAX in some markets by the end of next year".

A Wi-Max/Wi-Fi GSM/CDMA phone would be a killer phone. You could deploy it globally with few compatibility issues. Moreover, integration with VoIP services like Skype would make every intelligent consumer switch to that phone regardless of their carrier. And for the dumb consumer, just add an iPod to the phone!

I know battery life might be an issue, but you don´t really need more than 24 hours. I would not mind to charge my phone every day if I get lower rates through VoIP. Hell, electricity is way cheaper than what Nextel charges me!

[rtharper]

Carriers: Someone early in the thread speculated that it would be great if Apple released a pair of unlocked phones that would work on the wireless carrier of your choice. While I agree that this would be great, it will not happen. Wireless carries are extremely conservative about what phones they will allow on their networks. For example, Verizon (the largest US carrier) puts all of its phones through a rigorous certification process before it releases them, as well as loading them with custom Verizon firmware. They do not allow non certified phones to be activated on their network. So, if they ever did release the iPhone, it would be a Verizon version purchased from Verizon, probably with a featureset limited by Verizon.



1) As mentioned before, unlocked phones are a lot more commonplace outside of the US.

2) You cited one carrier that uses a technology that does not allow SIM card swapping (indeed, there are no SIM cards at all). Anyone know if the GSM networks in the US have this restriction on their phones? What about other CDMA providers? I doubt you'll find that your specific case generalises very well.

[BWhaler]

Perhaps this site might be more up your alley http://www.microsoft.com/windowsvista/
:p

Clever.

http://crunchgear.com/page/2/

Apparently Apple is stopping production on the matte MBP portable line until issues are resolved.

Small is hard. Apple isn't good at it. That my point, and the reason why I am worried that their phones will suffer from the same problems...

[benbow]

As one of the last cellphone holdouts, I am puzzled by the extra loud and usually obnoxious ringtones most cell phone users have set up. Not to mention the reflex panic and cluelessness that occurs in public when users want to turn off their ringing cell phone. Usually the less skilled users just end up answering the call to quiet the damn ringing.

What might the iPhone offer? a tiny ping like I get with an incoming email? Or do we have to wear a bluetooth gadget in our ear at all times to get those non-public alerts of incoming iPhone calls?

Innovation is sorely needed in the ringtone control department.

[inlimbo]

Innovation is sorely needed in the ringtone control department.

No what we sorely need is legislation in the ringtone department. :p Preferably banning a lot of them. Or imprisoning people who don't know how to use the 'silent' feature on their cell phones (particularly those who catch my early train into the city!)

[bfineman]

jmbear: I stand by my WiMax statement, which was "not yet". The quote that you cited said maybe by the end of next year, which sounds perfectly reasonable, but the end of next year is about a year off, which I think qualifies as "not yet". Of course Apple has pushed the technology envelope before, so who knows. Prove me wrong Apple!

rtharper: If we start looking "outside the US" there are myriad mobile technologies that us US customers only dream of. Since I live in the US, for my purposes, that's what I'm talking about. I agree that it would be possible to see an unlocked iPhone that you can activate on the GSM network of your choice. What sucks is that Verizon still has the superior national coverage area, which is why I still use it even though I despise them. Cingular's network is quickly catching up though, so if it came down to it, I'd be happy to jump ship for an iPhone. Perhaps this would give Verizon the kick in the pants that it needs to revise its manipulative certification policies.

[Goldfinger]

Carriers: Someone early in the thread speculated that it would be great if Apple released a pair of unlocked phones that would work on the wireless carrier of your choice. While I agree that this would be great, it will not happen. Wireless carries are extremely conservative about what phones they will allow on their networks. For example, Verizon (the largest US carrier) puts all of its phones through a rigorous certification process before it releases them, as well as loading them with custom Verizon firmware. They do not allow non certified phones to be activated on their network. So, if they ever did release the iPhone, it would be a Verizon version purchased from Verizon, probably with a featureset limited by Verizon.

If they want to succeed in the cell phone market then it WILL be an unlocked phone. Sold through Apple without any ties to cell phone carriers. Stop thinking so US-centric.
It will be an unlocked phone available in CDMA and GSM versions. Unless Apple screws over the rest of the world again. Maybe we can wait anther 2 years... Who knows.

WiMax. Someone said they wanted a WiMax enabled phone, which I agree would be sweet, but it's also not going to happen yet. There is no mobile WiMax chipset yet. Yes, there are a couple cities that have WiMax deployed, but you need an external receiver box and antenna to use it - it's to mount on the outside of you house, no so conducive to laptops (or phones).
WiMax would be cool but I doubt it, except for maybe the high end model. I personally don't really care for it.

Videoconferencing. This could be the killer app if they do it right. Someone mentioned the asymetric bandwidth issue, with which I totally agree - phone companies aren't interested in giving you much upload bandwidth. However, someone else speculated that video could be an option that's only enabled when you're connected to WiFi - this seems the most likely implementation to me. While I'm sure with a dedicated chip they could pull off compression decent enough to send video over a cellular link, the other problem that they'd run into is latency, and I don't know how they would solve that on the cellular link. Then again, they're smarter than me, so maybe they'll figure it out.
Cell phone plans that offer the possibility/capacity for videoconferenceing are prohibitively expensive every where. Would be cool if the phone allowed for it but most people wouldn't use it anyway because of cost.

Random comments. Battery life - sure, 200 hours of standby time is nice, but really, is it so much to ask to charge your phone every night? It's a rare night that I sleep away from a power outlet. And if I'm camping, I'm not taking my precious iPhone along.
I for one would not touch a phone with a ten foot pole if it had less than 200h of stand by time. Running out of battery is the most annoying thing ever. I never lug around my charger everywhere I go. It almost defies the point of having a portable phone. I love to go away for 5 days without needing a charge.
I'll bet you that if this iPhone has a crappy battery nobody will buy it. Except for people who don't care about having a crappy battery and Apple fan boys who'll buy it anyway.

Plus, a battery only has x-number of cycles untill it dies. And knowing Apple it will probable have a fixed battery like the iPod. So being able to do as long as possible on a single charge is a plus.

I agree it would be sweet though. Presence - this will be important. Being able to set your "available/away" status, or even better, available for "text/voice/video" escalating presence. iChat AV already has this, so I would be surprised if they didn't carry this over. One idea that I thought would be neat would be to set your presence automatically using your iCal calendar. ie, if I have a meeting from 1pm-2pm, the phone automatically sets my presence to "Available - Text" for that period, and back to "Available - Video" when I'm done.
Would be great. But not a single non-Apple phone would be compatible with that.

[Goldfinger]

As one of the last cellphone holdouts, I am puzzled by the extra loud and usually obnoxious ringtones most cell phone users have set up. Not to mention the reflex panic and cluelessness that occurs in public when users want to turn off their ringing cell phone. Usually the less skilled users just end up answering the call to quiet the damn ringing.

What might the iPhone offer? a tiny ping like I get with an incoming email? Or do we have to wear a bluetooth gadget in our ear at all times to get those non-public alerts of incoming iPhone calls?

Innovation is sorely needed in the ringtone control department.

What you want is possible on just about any phone out there. Most people just don't change their ringtone settings or they even like the loud obonxious ringtones.
There is not much left to innovate in the ringtone department.

[lmalave]

Clever.

http://crunchgear.com/page/2/

Apparently Apple is stopping production on the matte MBP portable line until issues are resolved.

Small is hard. Apple isn't good at it. That my point, and the reason why I am worried that their phones will suffer from the same problems...

Huh??????????? :confused: :confused: :confused:

Apple isn't good at small??!!??? M'kay.

Never mind that they are currently the undisputed leaders of "small" in:

Hard-drive based iPods: nothing touches the 30 GB and 80 GB iPods for compactness.

15.4" and 17" laptops: no one comes close to 1" thin and 5.6 or 6.8 lbs. respectively.

And with the iPod nano, MacBook, iMac, and Mac mini, they may not be *the* smallest, but they are still the leader in combining smallness with quality and style.


And folks, Apple does *NOT* have quality problems compared to the rest of the industry!!!!!!!!!!! Quite frankly, Apple customers are just more whiny. There is just NOT a culture of PC users complaining on "dellforums.com" or "vaioforums.com". Such forums exist, of course, but not to the same degree. Plus every survey I've read says that Apple has the LOWEST defect rate in the entire computer industry. No one else has a lower defect rate. Not Dell, not HP, not Gateway, not Acer, not Sony, not Fujitsu, not Toshiba, etc.

Apple is the quality leader, folks. I trust scientific consumer surveys which ask objective questions (e.g. how many times the product had to be sent for repairs). Anecdotal evidence is interesting and is certainly influential on a personal level (e.g. if you have a friend that had problems with a particular brand), but it is NOT the measure of quality.

[BWhaler]

Huh??????????? :confused: :confused: :confused:

Apple isn't good at small??!!??? M'kay.

Never mind that they are currently the undisputed leaders of "small" in:

Hard-drive based iPods: nothing touches the 30 GB and 80 GB iPods for compactness.

15.4" and 17" laptops: no one comes close to 1" thin and 5.6 or 6.8 lbs. respectively.

And with the iPod nano, MacBook, iMac, and Mac mini, they may not be *the* smallest, but they are still the leader in combining smallness with quality and style.


And folks, Apple does *NOT* have quality problems compared to the rest of the industry!!!!!!!!!!! Quite frankly, Apple customers are just more whiny. There is just NOT a culture of PC users complaining on "dellforums.com" or "vaioforums.com". Such forums exist, of course, but not to the same degree. Plus every survey I've read says that Apple has the LOWEST defect rate in the entire computer industry. No one else has a lower defect rate. Not Dell, not HP, not Gateway, not Acer, not Sony, not Fujitsu, not Toshiba, etc.

Apple is the quality leader, folks. I trust scientific consumer surveys which ask objective questions (e.g. how many times the product had to be sent for repairs). Anecdotal evidence is interesting and is certainly influential on a personal level (e.g. if you have a friend that had problems with a particular brand), but it is NOT the measure of quality.

Um. Did you actually read the link?

When this hits the major new cycles, remember this post.


(But I did enjoy the numerous repeating exclamation points and question markets.)

[Squonk]

I was just thinking that clearly, Apple will offer cell phone charging via USB on the iPhone akin to iPods. Would this be the first cell phone on the market with computer charging of the phone?

And, do y'all think that the iPhone will have the iPod dock connector on it? How sweet will this be??? You know all of those alarm clock/stereo combo's that charge your iPod too? Well, I'll buy one in a heartbeat if it meant that my phone is charging overnight on the nightstand in a docked fashion!!! That is one less cord laying around in the bedroom.

Oh yeah - bring it Steve!!! :cool:

[lmalave]

I was just thinking that clearly, Apple will offer cell phone charging via USB on the iPhone akin to iPods. Would this be the first cell phone on the market with computer charging of the phone?

And, do y'all think that the iPhone will have the iPod dock connector on it? How sweet will this be??? You know all of those alarm clock/stereo combo's that charge your iPod too? Well, I'll buy one in a heartbeat if it meant that my phone is charging overnight on the nightstand in a docked fashion!!! That is one less cord laying around in the bedroom.

Oh yeah - bring it Steve!!! :cool:

No there are plenty of other phones with USB charging. And not only that, but they use a standard mini-USB connector rather than a propietary iPod dock connector.

The prime example would be Blackberry phones. I think the HTC "Windows Media" phones on T-Mobile, Cingular, etc. also use a standard mini-USB (e.g. T-Mobile SDA and MDA, T-Mobile Dash, Cingular 8125, etc.)

I think the iPhone will definitely use the standard iPod dock connector, though. I think it will be a *full* member of the iPod family. I think that will be a huge advantage for the iPhone, actually. I expect 3rd party iPod accessories to work right off the bat, which means the iPhone will instantly have vastly more accessories than just about any phone (except maybe Treos).

[emotion]

I charge my ancient T610 using usb. Most phones can do it.

[lmalave]

Um. Did you actually read the link?

When this hits the major new cycles, remember this post.


(But I did enjoy the numerous repeating exclamation points and question markets.)

You still make no logical sense. So Apple has a reported production issue. You think this is unique to Apple? Again, these things happen ALL the time, the visibility is just 10x when Apple is involved.

Furthermore, you still make no sense: The 15.4" and 17" MBPs have a hiccup, so now their ability to produce an iPhone is in question? Wouldn't the iPod experience be more relevant? How many issues have there been with the iPod? Sure, there have been issues with batteries and supposed scratch-proneness, but I still maintain that these issues are reported because of some "Apple" effect. Nobody cares if SanDisk or Samsung has some issues with their MP3 players. The only company that has the same scrutiny as Apple is Microsoft, and look at how their Zune launch went :rolleyes:

When Apple sells 10 million iPhones in 2007 with industry-leading build quality, remember this post. :rolleyes:

(but yes I do quite enjoy multiple exclamation points and question marks, not to mention all caps)

[Squonk]

No there are plenty of other phones with USB charging. And not only that, but they use a standard mini-USB connector rather than a propietary iPod dock connector.

I think the iPhone will definitely use the standard iPod dock connector, though. I think it will be a *full* member of the iPod family. I think that will be a huge advantage for the iPhone, actually. I expect 3rd party iPod accessories to work right off the bat, which means the iPhone will instantly have vastly more accessories than just about any phone (except maybe Treos).

I charge my ancient T610 using usb. Most phones can do it.

I don't know why I never thought of usb charging before today... :confused:

Emotion, what do you use for your T610? I have a T637. Thanks! :)

[shrimpdesign]

Clever.

http://crunchgear.com/page/2/

Apparently Apple is stopping production on the matte MBP portable line until issues are resolved.

Small is hard. Apple isn't good at it. That my point, and the reason why I am worried that their phones will suffer from the same problems...

You really should use permalinks.
http://crunchgear.com/2006/12/06/rumor-problems-with-non-glossy-macbook-pro-display/

So. Apple isn't good at small. Hmm. That's a new argument. Ok, so let's just ditch all the discussion so far. Don't address my points, just make a general statement to cover it all up. Good idea.

Okay. Apple isn't good at small.

Yeah, that Nano is friggin huge and has tons of problems. Same with the Shuffle. And when I show people my iMac and say "Yup, that's the whole compter." They simply respond, "Wow that's huge!"

Seriously, your argument that "small is hard" is reasonable, but when you follow it with "Apple isn't good at it" ... it just makes you look like a douche.

Apple has a great track record with "small." The iPods get progressively smaller. Same with the iMac. The Cube. The Mac Mini.

It seems that the only major problem Apple has had lately with "small" is their notebook computers.

I still don't follow your "notebooks are like cellphones" logic. OK, they're both small, but the comparison ends there. It's like saying the iTV will be riddled with problems because it will be aluminum like the MBPs.

As for the blog post you referenced... why is that bad again? Apple is halting shipments of MBPs because they have a problem with the matte screens. Darn that Apple and their rapant quality control, stopping faulty machines from shipping! Personally I'd rather them ship the faulty machines. :rolleyes: ... oh, and you do know that the problems with matte screens is a rumor, right? If you go to the Gizmodo post, is says "MacBook Pros Temporarily Halted by Apple?" NOT "MacBook Pros Temporarily Halted by Apple" Big difference.

[rtharper]

rtharper: If we start looking "outside the US" there are myriad mobile technologies that us US customers only dream of. Since I live in the US, for my purposes, that's what I'm talking about. I agree that it would be possible to see an unlocked iPhone that you can activate on the GSM network of your choice. What sucks is that Verizon still has the superior national coverage area, which is why I still use it even though I despise them. Cingular's network is quickly catching up though, so if it came down to it, I'd be happy to jump ship for an iPhone. Perhaps this would give Verizon the kick in the pants that it needs to revise its manipulative certification policies.

As I recall, your original point is that unlocked phones were unrealistic; my point is that they are not. So far you have cited on carrier about this issue, who is currently in the middle of litigation about their cell-phone crippling policies. I am fairly sure an unlocked CDMA phone could manage to go a long way in the US eventually, if not now. As for GSM, there is still plenty of GSM coverage in the US, with a non-trivial customer base. An unlocked GSM phone would definitely be profitable for Apple.

[jmbear]

I for one would not touch a phone with a ten foot pole if it had less than 200h of stand by time. Running out of battery is the most annoying thing ever. I never lug around my charger everywhere I go. It almost defies the point of having a portable phone. I love to go away for 5 days without needing a charge.
I'll bet you that if this iPhone has a crappy battery nobody will buy it. Except for people who don't care about having a crappy battery and Apple fan boys who'll buy it anyway.

Plus, a battery only has x-number of cycles untill it dies. And knowing Apple it will probable have a fixed battery like the iPod. So being able to do as long as possible on a single charge is a plus.


The point is, that if you have Wi-Fi/Wi-Max, you can turn it off to save battery life. The same as you could just not listen to music to save battery life. A phone could still carry these technologies and have around 200hr stand-by time.

Whatever happens with the fabled iPhone, I am pretty sure it will be awesome. Apple is known for looking at the market and saying "Why does it have to be this way, how can it be better?" and then they deliver something exciting. They did it with the iPod, they did it with iLife, and I am pretty sure they will do it with the iPhone!

[mongoos150]

Bfineman is correct: VZW does have superior coverage but their business model coupled with their equipment policies start a BURNING hatred for Verizon in myself. I simply cannot stand how VZW cripples all of its equipment due to brew contracts, ie OBEX profiles being disabled, no java, etc... I'm about to switch to Cingular or T.Mobile because they let their customers do what they want with their own equipment - that is PURCHASED AND OWNED by their customers. It burns me up - and with VZW, being a CDMA provider, I have no option of buying an unlocked phone with tons of features overseas.

[Goldfinger]

The point is, that if you have Wi-Fi/Wi-Max, you can turn it off to save battery life. The same as you could just not listen to music to save battery life. A phone could still carry these technologies and have around 200hr stand-by time.

Whatever happens with the fabled iPhone, I am pretty sure it will be awesome. Apple is known for looking at the market and saying "Why does it have to be this way, how can it be better?" and then they deliver something exciting. They did it with the iPod, they did it with iLife, and I am pretty sure they will do it with the iPhone!

I never said that anything about wifi sucking battery. And of course you could turn it off. I'm just afraid that Apple would release a phone that has crappy battery life just working on GSM. They're capable of doing that.

Also I highly doubt that it would even have wifi. While cool it's an added cost that doesn't make sense today since there are only very few free wifi/wimax networks in the world. A feature that only 1% of the users would use isn't a good idea. That said, I wouldn't mind if they put it in as long as it doens't influence the price point of the phone too much.

[thecritix]

Hi
I'm going to america in early february, is the iphone likely to be out?
and if i buy it there will it work in the uk?

Thanks
Nick

[Jasonbot]

Hi
I'm going to america in early february, is the iphone likely to be out?
and if i buy it there will it work in the uk?

Thanks
Nick

It should be GSM so you should be able to just put your SIM in and it should work.