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mcwinterr
May 3, 2003, 10:45 AM
i am definitely interested in "re-switching" back to the mac side o' things and getting a 12" powerbook when i return to school in the fall. however, i have heard people talking about overheating problems, "warping" problems with the chassis, etc.

i was wondering if anyone has heard when the second revison of the 12" powerbook is due, and what sort of specs it's supposed to have.

thanks!

hugemullens
May 3, 2003, 01:58 PM
for what its worth, i own a 12 inch pb and i have had none of those problems. I would rate it as one of the finest laptops ever.

arn
May 3, 2003, 02:08 PM
Originally posted by mcwinterr
i am definitely interested in "re-switching" back to the mac side o' things and getting a 12" powerbook when i return to school in the fall. however, i have heard people talking about overheating problems, "warping" problems with the chassis, etc.

i was wondering if anyone has heard when the second revison of the 12" powerbook is due, and what sort of specs it's supposed to have.

thanks!

http://buyersguide.macrumors.com summarizes all that info. So far, no word on 12" revisions.

arn

evil
May 3, 2003, 02:53 PM
i also have a 12 inch powerbook and have no heat problems.
its a great product.

Parsa
May 7, 2003, 01:51 AM
I went into a CompUSA today to feel the 12" PB for myself. I'm in the same PB vs. iBook debate as a lot of folks on this forum. The 12PB there was connected to an AC power supply, and didn't seem very hot at all, even after being on all the time. Of course it's not playing a DVD for a couple hours, but it felt a bit cooler than the 12" iBook next to it. (The 15" Powerbook felt metal-cold below the keyboard.)

When did you guys buy your 12" powerbooks? Maybe Apple quietly fixed the problem by tweaking the power manager or something (without admitting there was a problem with earlier models). Are there reports of 12PB's purchased in April overheating?

Parsa

petercw2
May 7, 2003, 07:03 AM
Originally posted by mcwinterr
i am definitely interested in "re-switching" back to the mac side o' things and getting a 12" powerbook when i return to school in the fall. however, i have heard people talking about overheating problems, "warping" problems with the chassis, etc.
i was wondering if anyone has heard when the second revison of the 12" powerbook is due, and what sort of specs it's supposed to have.
thanks!


I have had my 12" PB for about two months now. I can say that the "heat issue" is not something that you should worry about.

Yes, it unit gets warm to the left of the touchpad and underneath, but I do not find it unbearable. This is also dependant on what surface you have the PB sitting on. If you have it sitting on carpet it will get hotter, if you have it sitting on a glass top table it will be cooler.

In the end it shouldn't be a reason that you decide to not by this great piece of computing power and convinence.

peet

firestarter
May 7, 2003, 08:28 AM
Had mine for a week now - it's a fantastic machine.

If you look on the Apple forums, there are rumors about some background improvements to build quality, and software upgrades like 10.2.5 that seem to cure battery and excessive heat problems. Mine seems fine.

Sure it gets a bit warm, but all laptops have to get rid of excess heat, and personally I prefer a slightly warm laptop that's silent 95% of the time, to one running a fan continuously (like my old IBM thinkpad).

iPat
May 7, 2003, 08:43 AM
Just picked up a 12" PowerBook last week. The first week I had it the case got very warm after just mins and stayed very warm no matter what I did. Starting on Saturday the case has never gotten above a normal warm temp and the fan comes on much more often.

Now, the funny thing about the heat issue is mine is actually much cooler when I run CPU intensive apps like Folding@home because the fan comes on almost immediately and stays on. The case is barely warm to the touch after an hour.

The other thing I had noticed last week was when the case was very very warm (almost too warm) and the fan came on, it cooled very quickly to a normal warm temp.

Seems to me that the biggest problem they have is a reluctancy for the fan to come on (which by the way is very quite when it is on). Don't know why my fan comes on much more often now than it did last week but the case is much much cooler.

cb911
May 8, 2003, 03:27 AM
i was reading a timeline for Apple's new releases on PowerPage.org. it wasn't official or anything, so you'll just have to take it as a, um, rumor.

it mentioned that the next revision of the 12" PowerBook would be in the last quarter of 2004, around November/December, i think.

but the 12" PB was just released anyway, so if you get one now, you can rest assured that it won't be updated the next month after you get it. :)

mcwinterr
May 8, 2003, 10:48 AM
Originally posted by cb911
mentioned that the next revision of the 12" PowerBook would be in the last quarter of 2004, around November/December, i think.

yeah, but i'm not getting a machine now. i will get one around august for school in the fall. if these rumours are correct, i'll be in a catch 22 situation. i will need a computer for school, but by then there will be revisions right around the corner.

any tips on what i could do? is there anyplace to temporarily "lease" a computer?

alkil47
May 13, 2003, 03:14 AM
If they do come out in november and you really need one cash in and try and get a couple things free , maybe like a free HD up grade or RAM up grade the last couple of times I have bought apples for work , (design studio , we love apple ) they were always about to be up grade and the store guys know you know so ask them hey dude what else can you give us before this out dates next month ... things they have given us , free ram , zip drives , up grades on HD and a couple had processor upgrades of up to 100mhz more , give it a go you might be lucky ...

The Walrus
May 13, 2003, 03:38 AM
from personal experience the 12 inch powerbook has several problems:
it can get unbearably hot on the lap
the case warps
the rubber feet on the bottom fall off
the battery isn't flush and causes the powerbook to have a bit of a wobble
the plastics in the case especially around the screen seem to have moved away from the aluminium skin, would look much better if it were totally flush

appart from these minor issues which will no doubt be addressed in the next revision, the 12" AlBook is a fantastic machine, no other computer company can come close to this marvel of apple engineering.

petercw2
May 13, 2003, 05:04 AM
Originally posted by The Walrus
from personal experience the 12 inch powerbook has several problems:
it can get unbearably hot on the lap
the case warps
the rubber feet on the bottom fall off
the battery isn't flush and causes the powerbook to have a bit of a wobble
the plastics in the case especially around the screen seem to have moved away from the aluminium skin, would look much better if it were totally flush


For the record, I have none of these problems other than the "warm issue".

cb911
May 13, 2003, 05:08 AM
all of those small problems should be fixed in the 2nd revision of the PB, or at least fixed up to a better standard.

and i think you should be able to find somewhere to lease a PB. in Brisbane here i know you can lease them, but it's only available to businesses. it would be well worth finding out if you can lease one from somewhere.

anthonymoody
May 13, 2003, 07:28 AM
I have been itching to buy one, but the three I tried here in NYC:
1 in the SoHo store
1 in TekServe
1 in CompUsa

were all WAY too hot in the left palm rest. Uncomfortably so for typing. Other people in the various stores agreed with me. Until that's definitively fixed, I'm not buying. For those w/o the problem, you are lucky.

TM

ian559
May 13, 2003, 07:43 AM
I have had mine for over 2 months now.
is it hot? No!!!! Warm? Yes!! It is a great system. My only problem is I lost one of the rubber feet.......
I would recomend it to anyone looking for a system. I have found its only warm when charging

yzedf
May 13, 2003, 09:25 AM
Every time I have visited a store the 12" PB is much warmer than the 12" or 14" iBook. This is on the left palm rest area, which is where the harddrive is. The only thing running is the demo screensaver type thing. Aluminum conducts heat easily (partially due to its low density) when compared to the plastic in the iBook series. Excessive heat can cause warpage.

Those damn rubber feet fall off of all of the Mac laptops, iBook or PB, regardless of revision.

bellis1
May 13, 2003, 10:20 AM
The heat issue is kind of ridiculous. I have a 12" PB and have used it constantly for the past few months. People seem to be blowing the heat out of proportion. It does not get unbearably hot or even uncomfortably warm. I think I can count the times my fan has come on with one or two hands. It will sometimes come on when you are playing a DVD or burning a few CD's. My only complaint are the rubber feet which Apple needs to address. I glue the things back on just send me the adhesive. Other than that I think it is a fantastic machine and you will not be disappointed. As for waiting for updates you can play that game as long as wish. But try to use some judgement and not base your hopes off of rumors.

mstecker
May 13, 2003, 10:42 AM
I need to agree with the previous poster. I'm tired of people who don't own these machines, who walked up to one in a store saying "It's too hot to type on!", or "It's unbearable".

Sure, mine is warm. Warm like the soft happy warmth of the fireplace at christmas.

I had a friend who was about to buy a new mac for the first time in 10 years. He wanted a 12"pb, but was so spooked by reading all of the "It's too hot" stories, that he must have called me 10 times to ask about it. The day after I finally convinced him to take the plunge, he called me up and said "I don't know what the big deal is about. Sure it's warm, but it's not hot".

I think that this is the common thread here. People who actually own and use the machine think the warmth is just fine, while people who just played with it for five minutes turn up their noses, and, in their best comic-book-guy-from-the-simpsons voice decry it as unbearable.

How many people who actually own and use one are really bothered by the heat?

evil
May 13, 2003, 11:10 AM
i would like to agree with the above poster. i also own a 12 pbook and have no problems with heat at all.
it does get a bit warm, but come on people. i have had a compaq laptop that literally left red marks on my thigh from the excessive heat. the 12pbook comes no where near that type of heat. its just warm, not hot. there is a difference.

AppleMatt
May 13, 2003, 11:14 AM
Originally posted by mstecker
How many people who actually own and use one are really bothered by the heat?

I own and use one, and I completely agree with you. Before buying I read all the "horror stories", including recorded temperatures but also knew that:

A) People were exaggerating
B) If they took the time to read forums, they would see a number of possible solutions (delete power management prefs, reset power management, upgrade to 10.2.5 etc)

And yes is gets hot, but so does every other laptop I've ever used, it's not a big deal at all, and when running on batteries for everyday tasks, it doesn't even get warm.

Plus....the fan doesn't turn on! Soooooo quiet! I'd have that over a bit of heat (I like my laptops warm) anyday.

AppleMatt

ian559
May 13, 2003, 03:24 PM
As I said Hot NO!!!!! Warm Yes!!! The only time it gets remotely warm is when its charging the battery. I luv this machine. Want hot???? Try my old IBM thinkpad!!!!!! Damn thing ws hot and ungly as hell. Of course the ibook is cooler running its plastic and its a G3.
I think people need to lay off the 12" powerbook. It's a awesome machine. By far the best laptop my money could buy

anthonymoody
May 13, 2003, 03:33 PM
All of you current owners who are happy should consider yourselves lucky and not berate those who have TRIED the 12" and found it too hot for practical use. Say what you like about YOUR Powerbook or ones you've tried, but the ones I have tried have all been too hot. I would not buy one until there is a definitive fix. Even the salesman in the Apple Store in SoHo (named John...you can ask for him) admitted that the problem is very variable and there's no way to tell until the machine is fired up and left on for a while whether it has the problem. But when it does have the problem, he admitted that it's really bad.

And if you've seen the counter surfaces at that store, you'd know that the computers should be about as cool as possible. I'm telling you, you wouldn't want to rest your palm on the thing to type for more than a few seconds. It's that uncomfortable. Go see for yourself.

TM

QCassidy352
May 13, 2003, 06:40 PM
one other thing to keep in mind is that people tend to get a bit defensive about their own computers... (I know that I've been guilty of it recently, on the 12" vs. 14" ibook thread :eek: ) I think it's a natural tendency for people to defend their own choices, but sometimes this may lead current owners to turn more of a blind eye to problems than a prospective owner would.

On the other hand, current owners do know these computers better than someone who has just tested one in a store. So I'd say that you need objective reviews and opinions of a product as well as owner testimonials to get the real truth of what owning a particular machine is like.

ian559
May 13, 2003, 10:15 PM
I have posted the truth of my machine. I have a right to say that it is not to hot for me.... May it be to hot for someone else? Who knows that is subjective. I have been to many apple stores in my travels. I have never seen one to hot. Maybee I am more tolerant. But I can say that my 12 inch is nowhere near as hot as my IBM was. I also use it without the power cord on 90% of the time. It gets hotter when plugged in. But remember the metal disapates the heat inside. So I will have my opinion and thats my opinion if you dont want my opinion dont ask......