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MacRumors
Jan 14, 2007, 03:12 PM
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David Pogue posted (http://pogue.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/01/13/ultimate-iphone-faqs-list-part-2/) a followup question and answer list about the Apple iPhone with some additional details. The highlights include:

- NO Java, MAYBE Flash, according to Jobs
- “How does the iPhone charge?” –It comes with a white charging/syncing dock, just like an iPod.
- Calendar program isn’t finished yet, but I did see an “add new event” icon on the placeholder graphic.
- “Can the pinch gesture be used on Web pages?” –Yes! Also on email!
- [The screen is the] same polycarbonate that’s used for iPod screens, although apparently the coating has been substantially improved.
- [The screen responds] ONLY to skin touch. I couldn’t use my fingernail, for example. And you certainly can’t use a stylus.

Full list of questions can be found at his blog (http://pogue.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/01/13/ultimate-iphone-faqs-list-part-2/). Part 1 (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2007/01/20070112031931.shtml) was posted a few days ago.



kildraik
Jan 14, 2007, 03:18 PM
I'm glad to see that there was an improvement on that department. I suppose we'll see this on a new model iPod, when released. x]

javabear90
Jan 14, 2007, 03:18 PM
Didn't another guy say that java and flash will be supported?

gogoman
Jan 14, 2007, 03:18 PM
Skin only huh? I was hoping for some use of Inkwell or handwriting recognition for quick notes or handwriting to text message application. Can't see writing with my finger tho, but who knows.

redAPPLE
Jan 14, 2007, 03:19 PM
days after the announcement of the forthcoming product "iPhone"...

was it not maybe better for Apple to promise to introduce the product information every few weeks, instead of how they introduced it last week?

does the speculation on features, what it can do or not do etc. create negative vibe about the phone?

gogoman
Jan 14, 2007, 03:20 PM
Javascript is said to be supported but I haven't heard a definitive on JAVA.

Metatron
Jan 14, 2007, 03:21 PM
Ok stevey...going to have to support java to call it a full featured web browser.

Bosunsfate
Jan 14, 2007, 03:23 PM
Everyone is freaking that there is no Exchange integration. From everything that I have read so far, this is really incorrect.

It was clearly stated by Apple and Jobs that IMAP is supported and that included exchange servers. What you don't get is the "push" like you get with a Blackberry or with the Yahoo.mail.

An IMO...who cares...bring on the iPhone!

Frisco
Jan 14, 2007, 03:28 PM
Why would Apple announce the iPhone 5+ months in advance? Wouldn't that give the competition 5+ months to copy it?

abrooks
Jan 14, 2007, 03:32 PM
Why would Apple announce the iPhone 5+ months in advance? Wouldn't that give the competition 5+ months to copy it?

Because the competition would copy even quicker if the FCC published detailed reports of the phone before it was even announced.

And 5+ months is not long enough for a company to copy a product which took 2+ years to complete.

psychofreak
Jan 14, 2007, 03:32 PM
Look at the bottom right pic just below the vid. I dunno if this has been seen, but it is really funny.

uNext
Jan 14, 2007, 03:33 PM
Some of you are acting like if the iPhone is a revolutionary device.

This is nothing but an attractive encased piece of ****.

599.99? for a dervice that wont support 3rd party?

People where talking bout how crippled the zune was with its wifi
and people are not saying nothing about this?

Weak people fall for jobs RDF

justflie
Jan 14, 2007, 03:33 PM
Why would Apple announce the iPhone 5+ months in advance? Wouldn't that give the competition 5+ months to copy it?

Probably for marketing purposes. I think Steve could have said he was going to give away Macs to the masses at MWSF and people would still have been disappointed without an iPhone introduction. And besides this (hopefully) gives Apple another 5 months to sneak in a few new features or something for an extra "Wow" factor come june.

PS: Go Pats!

xfiftyfour
Jan 14, 2007, 03:33 PM
Why would Apple announce the iPhone 5+ months in advance? Wouldn't that give the competition 5+ months to copy it?

Yeah I didn't understand this either.

If not in regards to their competitors, also because the hype will die down. If Steve had announced the iPhone and said that as soon as his keynote was through, it could be ordered - can you imagine how many would have been sold? Now by the time its released, it'll almost be a "yeah.. that's old news" type thing.

They killed the impulse buy - now people have 6 months to realize they probably shouldn't spend $600 on a phone that is lacking a few features they'd really like to see.

Abstract
Jan 14, 2007, 03:35 PM
If they didn't say anything, people would think it doesn't exist, and their stock value would drop because all they introduced at MWSF 07 was Apple TV when what everybody wants and expects is an iPod Phone.


Didn't another guy say that java and flash will be supported?

Actually, it was that both were NOT supported. This is where the information gets a bit blurry. Maybe it's Java-script that's supported, not Java. This would make more sense in a way, but not for the user, who wants it all to work.

twoodcc
Jan 14, 2007, 03:44 PM
well these details seem pretty good. getting kinda tired of hearing about a product that isn't being released for another 6 months though....

SoldOutMatinee
Jan 14, 2007, 03:49 PM
When txt messaging and you flip the iPhone to landscape mode, will the screen adapt? You know, so one can txt like if using a Sidekick so the onscreen QWERTY will be longer and easier to use.

sky131
Jan 14, 2007, 03:50 PM
Why would Apple announce the iPhone 5+ months in advance? Wouldn't that give the competition 5+ months to copy it?

This was answered specifically by Jobs in the keynote...

People constantly find out about new cellular phones through FCC applications, so he wanted Apple to announce this to the world officially and not have it "leak" via the FCC...

jialuolu
Jan 14, 2007, 03:52 PM
The details on charging the iPhone are still pretty unclear. The iPod (I'm assuming 5G) does not ship with a dock, only a USB cord to sync/charge via your computer and no wall charger

I hope they realize that even if the iPhone does come with a dock, a lot of people aren't going to want to have to charge their cell phone via their computer

50548
Jan 14, 2007, 03:56 PM
Everyone is freaking that there is no Exchange integration. From everything that I have read so far, this is really incorrect.

It was clearly stated by Apple and Jobs that IMAP is supported and that included exchange servers. What you don't get is the "push" like you get with a Blackberry or with the Yahoo.mail.

An IMO...who cares...bring on the iPhone!

Yep, it was clearly stated already that Exchange is supported, so I don't see the point...the only ones denying this are probably:

1) PC fanboys;
2) traditional MR whiners;
3) those that prefer ugly Treos over the quantic leap called iPhone.

PLiK
Jan 14, 2007, 03:58 PM
The iPhone is a cell phone. Apple has to submit it to the FCC to be approved before it can be sold. All FCC submissions are public documents. Who would you rather have announce the iPhone? Apple or the FCC?

caliguy
Jan 14, 2007, 04:02 PM
The details on charging the iPhone are still pretty unclear. The iPod (I'm assuming 5G) does not ship with a dock, only a USB cord to sync/charge via your computer and no wall charger

I hope they realize that even if the iPhone does come with a dock, a lot of people aren't going to want to have to charge their cell phone via their computer
I agree. For $599 I really hope that Apple decides to ship them with regular power chargers like every other company, maybe even a dock.

When txt messaging and you flip the iPhone to landscape mode, will the screen adapt? You know, so one can txt like if using a Sidekick so the onscreen QWERTY will be longer and easier to use.
Good question. I really hope so.

BillyShears
Jan 14, 2007, 04:29 PM
When txt messaging and you flip the iPhone to landscape mode, will the screen adapt? You know, so one can txt like if using a Sidekick so the onscreen QWERTY will be longer and easier to use.

FTFA:

“Any word on whether the keypad will be available in the horizontal screen mode allowing larger keys, albeit a smaller text window?” –That orientation wasn’t available in the prototype; Apple hasn’t decided whether or not to add the landscape keyboard layout. (Also, interestingly: rotating the iPhone to change the screen orientation only works counterclockwise–and only, as Mr. Jobs said, “When it makes sense.” That is, not all programs rotate.)

Bosunsfate
Jan 14, 2007, 04:31 PM
Some of you are acting like if the iPhone is a revolutionary device.

This is nothing but an attractive encased piece of ****.

599.99? for a dervice that wont support 3rd party?

People where talking bout how crippled the zune was with its wifi
and people are not saying nothing about this?

Weak people fall for jobs RDF

I really didn't want to respond to this, but why not.

If you are that disappointed with the iPhone thats fine, it didn't meet your expectations. I guess you find a gold bar and complain that it wasn't large enough.

You tell me what product on the market today can equal the iPhone, becuase the answer is easy, nothing can deliver all of what the iPhone will deliver.

Does it have absolutely every single option that a Blackberry or some other phone does...no...and so what....this isn't about trying to make an Apple branded Blackberry.

Apple is about defining a whole new paradigm...and they are doing that.

Just enjoy the ride and stop asking when we are going to get there...cuz Dad isn't going to turn the car around and head home..:p

LaDirection
Jan 14, 2007, 04:32 PM
Why would Apple announce the iPhone 5+ months in advance? Wouldn't that give the competition 5+ months to copy it?

It took MS 7 years to copy OS X. And they STILL didn't get it completely right!

Rychiar
Jan 14, 2007, 04:35 PM
eh doesnt everyone already have regular power chargers and docks from ther old iPods to use. i know my original iPod photo came loaded...course for $600 it damn well should have, lol

peharri
Jan 14, 2007, 04:47 PM
You tell me what product on the market today can equal the iPhone, becuase the answer is easy, nothing can deliver all of what the iPhone will deliver.


It's kind of funny, because there are plenty of phones out there that are unlike everything else. Nokia's Communicator series. The Blackberry. etc. No product on the market today can equal these, because nothing delivers that they deliver.

The question at the end of the day for most people is going to be "Here we go again. Is this particular combination of technologies something that'll suit me".

The really interesting question, for me, is how much of this will trickle down to regular phones. My Motorola and my wife's Motorola are nothing like the first phone I had, which at the time was a mainstream Motorola phone. I've had various phones since, and certain features have creeped into them, and then become a part of them. My 9290 seemed pretty radical when I got it. Flimsy piece of crap though, and curiously I'm just not that upset about the fact it doesn't work any more, because my V635 does the important things it did. But the former is a communicator, a smartphone, and the latter... well, it's just a phone.

It's a very strange market. I think at $5-600 locked and subsidized, and being larger than a full size iPod, the iPhone, quite honestly, is a dud. It'll fail miserably as a product. Anyone who believes otherwise is seriously delusional. If the iPhone itself succeeds, it'll succeed only because the price has been dropped to below $250 before the end of the year. It will not succeed at its current price point.

As a technology demo though, its utility remains to be seen, and it may well inspire some great things in the mobile phone industry. I hope it does. It might even be iPhone 2 that it inspires.

Cocobolo
Jan 14, 2007, 04:48 PM
I suspect the reason why they would introduce the iPhone 6 months in advance is to get people excited about it and hold off purchasing another device in the interim. It also allows time for people to switch over to Cingular instead of renewing their contracts with their current provider. My T-Mobile account renews in March, and I will now go month-to-month instead of renewing for a full year or two.

combatcolin
Jan 14, 2007, 04:48 PM
I quite like Stylus's, works well on the DS.

As long as there's a slot to keep it there fine.

Of course there not cool, so Apple can never use one.

cloudnine
Jan 14, 2007, 05:11 PM
The details on charging the iPhone are still pretty unclear. The iPod (I'm assuming 5G) does not ship with a dock, only a USB cord to sync/charge via your computer and no wall charger

I hope they realize that even if the iPhone does come with a dock, a lot of people aren't going to want to have to charge their cell phone via their computer

Is this seriously a concern? I mean, come on now... it has a 30-pin ipod adaptor port just like any ipod... you'll be able to charge it anywhere you charge your ipod... I have two ipod docks at home (nano and 60gb photo) and an ipod cable at work connected to the little power adaptor (so you don't have to connect it to the computer), and an ipod adaptor in the car. You'll be able to charge it anywhere you can charge your ipod.

Common sense, people.

gwangung
Jan 14, 2007, 05:18 PM
It's a very strange market. I think at $5-600 locked and subsidized, and being larger than a full size iPod, the iPhone, quite honestly, is a dud. It'll fail miserably as a product. Anyone who believes otherwise is seriously delusional.

Um, Thread #500.

Anyone who's convinced it WILL be a dud is seriously delusional.

Whether or not it'll find a market is unclear--it's just that as marketers, most posters here make good hot air generators....

cloudnine
Jan 14, 2007, 05:19 PM
It's a very strange market. I think at $5-600 locked and subsidized, and being larger than a full size iPod, the iPhone, quite honestly, is a dud. It'll fail miserably as a product. Anyone who believes otherwise is seriously delusional. If the iPhone itself succeeds, it'll succeed only because the price has been dropped to below $250 before the end of the year. It will not succeed at its current price point.

You clearly underestimate the Apple buyer market... heh. I mean, think about it. We as Apple customers buy computers at almost double PC prices because of the quality that Apple provides. Constantly, Apple provides quality hardware, software, and the integration between the two. Being that they're providing the same integration with the iPhone, Apple customers (and switchers... remember his numbers from the keynote speech?) are gladly going to pay the premium for the iPhone, because they'll be bringing to the cellphone market what they've been providing to the personal computing market for years...

cloudnine
Jan 14, 2007, 05:24 PM
I suspect the reason why they would introduce the iPhone 6 months in advance is to get people excited about it and hold off purchasing another device in the interim. It also allows time for people to switch over to Cingular instead of renewing their contracts with their current provider. My T-Mobile account renews in March, and I will now go month-to-month instead of renewing for a full year or two.

Yeah, it was definitely a good marketing ploy for them, for a few reasons...

1. Introduce the product before people find out about it from the FCC
2. Lets people spread the hype through word of mouth, resulting in even more customers when the time comes
3. Gives people time to cancel their own plans and prepare to switch to Cingular
4. If they want to do more research on what their customers want, and get feedback on what they want, they can easily do so within 5 months

I, personally, am hoping to get an 8gb model the day it's released... so I'm glad they're waiting to perfect the product before it's released... and my TMobile contract is up in May, so it'll be perfect timing and I won't have to pay any cancellation fees... heh :)

jialuolu
Jan 14, 2007, 05:30 PM
Is this seriously a concern? I mean, come on now... it has a 30-pin ipod adaptor port just like any ipod... you'll be able to charge it anywhere you charge your ipod... I have two ipod docks at home (nano and 60gb photo) and an ipod cable at work connected to the little power adaptor (so you don't have to connect it to the computer), and an ipod adaptor in the car. You'll be able to charge it anywhere you can charge your ipod.

Common sense, people.

It won't be an issue for people that have multiple computers, a wall charger or car adaptor for their iPod but it'll be a pain for those who don't

I only have one computer with only one free USB port that I have to swap out between a whole myriad of gadgets as necessary and don't know what I would do if I had to charge my cell phone via my computer as well since you'd have to do it almost everyday. Just antsy that it wasn't mentioned in the keynote when he normally does make a small note of these things

Bosunsfate
Jan 14, 2007, 05:32 PM
It's kind of funny, because there are plenty of phones out there that are unlike everything else.


The question was what product "equaled" the iPhone...none of what you listed equaled the iPhone...


Nokia's Communicator series. The Blackberry. etc. No product on the market today can equal these, because nothing delivers that they deliver.


And if the "only" thing you cared about was the push from an Exchange server then that's fine..cuz that's "really" the only thing they offer that the iPhone doesn't.


The really interesting question, for me, is how much of this will trickle down to regular phones.


Some will, of course, but who cares? This is like trying to ask, what improvements will there be for my 8-track player now that we have CD-players coming out.


It's a very strange market. I think at $5-600 locked and subsidized, and being larger than a full size iPod, the iPhone, quite honestly, is a dud. It'll fail miserably as a product. Anyone who believes otherwise is seriously delusional.


Call me one of the delusional.

But the difference here is that you see this as a "phone", rightly so given its name.

However, the reality is that the power and the future of this device has very little to do with it being a "phone".

The future is not evaulating what we have today and were we have been...its about seeing where things will go...

This is the single biggest reason why Apple sees this as the next big "thing" next to the Mac and the iPod...has very little to do with it being a phone..

cloudnine
Jan 14, 2007, 05:33 PM
It won't be an issue for people that have multiple computers, a wall charger or car adaptor for their iPod but it'll be a pain for those who don't

I only have one computer with only one free USB port that I have to swap out between a whole myriad of gadgets as necessary and don't know what I would do if I had to charge my cell phone via my computer as well since you'd have to do it almost everyday. Just antsy that it wasn't mentioned in the keynote when he normally does make a small note of these things

http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore.woa/wa/RSLID?mco=D8E8F6B&nplm=MA592LL%2FA

There you go :)

Bosunsfate
Jan 14, 2007, 05:34 PM
Now, if they had a better browers...I wouldn't have had these bad posts. :)

Bosunsfate
Jan 14, 2007, 05:34 PM
Sorry Arn.

Bosunsfate
Jan 14, 2007, 05:36 PM
Do you really think that Apple will sell a product that can't be charged except if it is connected to a computer?:eek:

Seriously people...think about the question...

They would sell a mobile phone that couldn't just be plugged into the wall and charged?

Seriously people...

cgc
Jan 14, 2007, 05:37 PM
Some of you are acting like if the iPhone is a revolutionary device.

This is nothing but an attractive encased piece of ****.

599.99? for a dervice that wont support 3rd party?


It's not that the iPhone is revolutionary, it does what other phones have been able of doing for years and made them much more user friendly, intuitive, and pretty.

I find it ironic to think people would want to add third-party apps to a phone/iPod. Do you currently have 3rd party apps on your iPod? What do you need on your phone that you currenty don't have? If you must add apps, maybe you need a PDA which is a different market.

Finally, I think it's funny when they talk about cell phones they NEVER mention voice quality. It's always on the bells and whistles. I have yet to find a cell phone and carrier that provides great voice clarity (5x5 so to speak).

peharri
Jan 14, 2007, 05:37 PM
Um, Thread #500.

Anyone who's convinced it WILL be a dud is seriously delusional.

Whether or not it'll find a market is unclear--it's just that as marketers, most posters here make good hot air generators....

Thread #500 is irrelevent and I'm getting tired with people raising it every other post. Just because many were wrong about iPod doesn't mean it's not possible to say some products are (almost certainly) duds. There is absolutely no way a $500-600 plus two year commitment phone is going to be a roaring success. Jobs himself has said as much, he's only expecting a 1% marketshare (which actually probably means he's expecting 2%, but, whatever.)

iPhone 2 may be a success. iPhone with heavy price cuts may be a success. iPhone at $500-600 plus Cingular charges for two years will not be. End of story. It's not going to sell.

iPhone's real legacy, and real measure of success, will be on the effect it has on phones from now on.

Stella
Jan 14, 2007, 05:43 PM
There's a lot of clueless people on here. They seem to think that iPhone can bring functionality that no other phone has ever before.

To these people: Go and look at the specs of other smarthones. You'll see they are in every way as functional as the iPhone. In fact, the delivery far more functionality than the iPhone.

The only thing the iPhone has going for it is the GUI. You pay a high price for a phone with a very nice GUI and limited functionality ( Apple inflicted ).

No one is forcing any one to install 3rd party apps - those who should, shouldn't be stopped. If they do , then perhaps they will lose their right to technical support when the phone is FUBAR'ed. It really is called flexible.

I really don't know why people are comparing iPod and third party apps.

Jobs said iPhone is a smartphone. Smartphones can install 3rd party apps. People expect this.

The web browser is nothing new in the iPhone either since Nokia uses webkit.

DanielJen
Jan 14, 2007, 05:46 PM
I really hope iphone supports both JAVA and Flash because it seems that most entertainment/fun websites out there use one or the other. It will be a really crippled web browser otherwise, only good for reading the news and such.

Chaszmyr
Jan 14, 2007, 05:49 PM
It's not that the iPhone is revolutionary, it does what other phones have been able of doing for years and made them much more user friendly, intuitive, and pretty.

It is that the iPhone is revolutionary. It's not revolutionary because it does a bunch of other things that other products can't do. It is revolutionary because it does what other products have been attempting to do for years. It is an all-in-one device that is easy to use and does all of its functions efficiently.

I think this would be easier to see if it was broken from the phone mold. I understand it can't be used without activating it as a phone, but I'd buy one even if it had no phone capabilities (I'm sure some people would prefer buy it if it didnt have phone capabilities).

peharri
Jan 14, 2007, 05:49 PM
The question was what product "equaled" the iPhone...none of what you listed equaled the iPhone...

I wasn't trying to answer your question, I was pointing out that the question itself is meaningless. The two phones I described cannot be equalled either. The iPhone will only meet the same needs of Nokia Communicator users in the same way as the Nokia Communicator meets the needs of iPhone users. The same goes for the Blackberry. There are plenty of "revolutionary" phones out there that cannot be equalled.

This concept is foreign to Mac users because they're not used to it. Back in the 1980s, we may have had a wide variety of different types of computer, but that age disappeared a long time ago. When people compare Macs to PCs, they're comparing desktops to desktops, desktops that have more in common than they have different.


Some will, of course, but who cares? This is like trying to ask, what improvements will there be for my 8-track player now that we have CD-players coming out.


Boy, you're not even trying to understand are you?

I wasn't trying to answer your question. Your question made no sense so it wasn't answerable. There is nothing that will match the iPhone, but there is nothing that matches the Blackberry or the Communicator either.


But the difference here is that you see this as a "phone", rightly so given its name.

No, I'm not. And I find it ironic. If I was, I wouldn't be telling you your question makes no sense.

This is a device that will not take off. It's being sold at $600 plus contract. iPhone's successor may well take off, but this one will not. It's a concept device, not a product. Even Jobs knows that this'll flop. He's predicting 1%. I think he thinks it'll be more like 2, though I'm having doubts even 1% is achievable given the attempt to sell it the way it is.

What comes after it from Apple is open to question. I can see a $500 unit with no phone functionality (except perhaps VoIP) being a success. I can see a $250 plus contact (say, $600 unlocked) unit incorporating the phone, and being slightly smaller, being a success.

Either way, to say "There is nothing in the market like this" is a nonsense. It's not that it's not true, it's that it's irrelevent. There's nothing in the market like the Nokia Communicator, and nothing in the market like the Blackberry. There's nothing in the market like the Nokia 770 (or 800)

You need to be more than unique to sell, and if you're going to market yourself as a phone, you need to be a product that fits within that market. By being huge, and being expensive, the iPhone just doesn't cut it.

In reality, the iPhone's achievements will be in terms of what it does to the phone market, not whether it sells.

Bosunsfate
Jan 14, 2007, 05:50 PM
There's a lot of clueless people on here. They seem to think that iPhone can bring functionality that no other phone has ever before.

To these people: Go and look at the specs of other smarthones. You'll see they are in every way as functional as the iPhone. In fact, the delivery far more functionality than the iPhone.

The only thing the iPhone has going for it is the GUI. You pay a high price for a phone with a very nice GUI and limited functionality ( Apple inflicted ).

No one is forcing any one to install 3rd party apps - those who should, shouldn't be stopped. If they do , then perhaps they will lose their right to technical support when the phone is FUBAR'ed. It really is called flexible.

I really don't know why people are comparing iPod and third party apps.

Jobs said iPhone is a smartphone. Smartphones can install 3rd party apps. People expect this.

Hmm.

Reason Mac was successful - User Interface.

Reason iPod was successful - User Interface.

Reason iPhone will be sucessful - User Interface.

--They are, of course, not the only reasons...but pretty big ones..

Stridder44
Jan 14, 2007, 05:58 PM
Some of you are acting like if the iPhone is a revolutionary device.

This is nothing but an attractive encased piece of ****.

599.99? for a dervice that wont support 3rd party?

People where talking bout how crippled the zune was with its wifi
and people are not saying nothing about this?

Weak people fall for jobs RDF


Who pissed in your frosted flakes?

MrCrowbar
Jan 14, 2007, 06:03 PM
The details on charging the iPhone are still pretty unclear. The iPod (I'm assuming 5G) does not ship with a dock, only a USB cord to sync/charge via your computer and no wall charger

I hope they realize that even if the iPhone does come with a dock, a lot of people aren't going to want to have to charge their cell phone via their computer

http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore.woa/wa/RSLID?mco=D8E8F6B&nplm=MA592LL%2FA
those things are tiny and work as they should:
http://a248.e.akamai.net/7/248/2041/1185/store.apple.com/Catalog/US/Images/ma592_125.jpg

MacEyeDoc
Jan 14, 2007, 06:06 PM
Yeah I didn't understand this either.

If not in regards to their competitors, also because the hype will die down. If Steve had announced the iPhone and said that as soon as his keynote was through, it could be ordered - can you imagine how many would have been sold? Now by the time its released, it'll almost be a "yeah.. that's old news" type thing.

They killed the impulse buy - now people have 6 months to realize they probably shouldn't spend $600 on a phone that is lacking a few features they'd really like to see.

Could the answer be partially that he didn't want the FCC to let out the news, and partially that they have nearly 200 patents on this device? It's apparently going to be very hard to copy this thing - legally, at least.

gwangung
Jan 14, 2007, 06:06 PM
Thread #500 is irrelevent

No, it isn't. :D

and I'm getting tired with people raising it every other post. Just because many were wrong about iPod doesn't mean it's not possible to say some products are (almost certainly) duds. There is absolutely no way a $500-600 plus two year commitment phone is going to be a roaring success. Jobs himself has said as much, he's only expecting a 1% marketshare (which actually probably means he's expecting 2%, but, whatever.)

Thread #500. :D

iPhone 2 may be a success. iPhone with heavy price cuts may be a success. iPhone at $500-600 plus Cingular charges for two years will not be. End of story. It's not going to sell.

iPhone's real legacy, and real measure of success, will be on the effect it has on phones from now on.

Like I said, most posters here make better hot air generators than they do marketers. One reason is that they don't have a good grasp of markets. They tend to think of singular, monolithic markets consisting of all possible users.

That's not how markets work, and that's not how marketers work. Products don't define markets; users define markets. Folks who start from the product and try to forecast from that are doomed to failure (particularly when they ignore that the vast amount of cell phone users actually DO pay for two year contracts from their cell providers). And THAT is the real lesson from thread #500.

Bosunsfate
Jan 14, 2007, 06:15 PM
I wasn't trying to answer your question, I was pointing out that the question itself is meaningless.


I guess I was confused when you quoted my original post. My experience has been that when someone quotes your post they are responding to it.

I certainly didn't realize that you were not actually trying to answer what I had raised...:p


There is nothing that will match the iPhone, but there is nothing that matches the Blackberry or the Communicator either.

Outside of pushing email from an exchange server what do these phones offer?

But lets move beyond that for a moment.

Think about the market that Jobs presented as the growth potential for the iPhone.

That set of slides was right out of just about every coorporate marketing presentation I've ever seen...my company included.

IMO, it was done becuase it is what the Wall Investors understand..and you saw the success of that message in the stock price.

What we haven't seen is the real market Apple is going after...and that's becuase you can't define yet...much as you couldn't define the Mac market or the iPod market.

As a reference, I recall back in 2003 reports were saying that the iPod market was tapped out. Apple had 80% of the market and you just couldn't really gain much in market share..

What they missed was the addressable market, which is what we have here.

They are relating the market to the mobile industry..that's just becuase that's the only thing you can acutally measure....or more aptly, that is what many people can relate too...the real market has yet to materialize and is much harder to define.

And that is where I totally agree with you...the 2nd gen, 3rd gen, etc will be even better than what we see today.

But calling this 1st gen a flop is just short sighted becuase you have to understand the market that Apple is going after.

And if I could eloquently define that here...then I'd be working in the Apple Marketing department and not posting on macrumors. :D

nFace
Jan 14, 2007, 06:16 PM
Some of you are acting like if the iPhone is a revolutionary device.

This is nothing but an attractive encased piece of ****.

599.99? for a dervice that wont support 3rd party?

People where talking bout how crippled the zune was with its wifi
and people are not saying nothing about this?

Weak people fall for jobs RDF

I completely agree with this one. The only thing that is revolutionary about iPhone is its graphics chip. Nvidia and their subsidiary will be realising new chips for mobile phones shortly so around June you will be seeing several high end phones with thick coating of eye candy. This might be the reason why Apple announced the phone now. The graphics are revolutionary now but around June / July major players have announced their OpenGL ES 2.0 phones which will be amazing (do we actually need all that eye candy :confused: ) I have to say that without 3rd part support and applications, lack of Java or Flash and overall closed development environment iPhone isn't what I expected. This means there won't be GPS navigation (integrated gps and navigation will be more and more popular during 2007) or any cool apps or games that really could use the power of that great graphics chip. Think about it, even the mobile phone giants are relying on 3rd party developers to provide applications for their products. So how on earth relatively small company that is also manufacturing computers and now various other consumer products can produce everything internally. We also need to think ahead because in mobile phone business life span of the product is much shorter then in computer business. Apple needs to be releasing new products at least every three to four months if they want to keep up with the development and even then can they achieve the needed volume to make it profitable. If their US model of relying on one service provider is a hint what can be expected in other markets then they have chosen a rocky road that every single mobile phone manufacturer tries to avoid (service providers and their requirements are royal pain for all the manufacturers and single provider solution is big no no when you think about volumes). One could also speculate that Apple is relying on other market areas to sell the product unlocked but then the price might be too high for consumers (phone is consumer oriented) and might create a grey market in their local market. Anyway, even if iPhone flops one good thing will come out of it. Better graphics chips and OpenGL ES 2.0 will be implemented very soon to majority of smart phones and this opens up better possibilities for using mobile phones as real gaming platform (during 2007 there will be some interesting releases for Symbian (series 60 3rd edition, series 80, UIG) and Win mobile).

Unfortunately at its current state iPhone won't be joining my collection of Apple gear. In all honesty I don't expect any great "last minute" changes in the product since the hw development team needs to be finalising the rev. b if they want to hit their targets and without 3rd party sw developers what can we expect? Skype for iPhone :D

mstecker
Jan 14, 2007, 06:42 PM
deleted

Stella
Jan 14, 2007, 06:59 PM
There's a huge difference:

Mac -> Like any desktop OS, Apple allow 3rd party apps, restrictive.
iPod -> UI - yes.
iPhoto -> Nice UI - but once again, all other smartphones allow an open platform. When people think smartphones they ( who have used them ) think open platform.

5% world market share for Mac OS. If you want to view that as success, then by all means, do so.

Its funny, Apple say they don't care about market share, yet SJ drones on about iTunes and iPod marketshares at every opportunity. Of course Apple care about marketshare - if OSX had none, no one would write apps. Without marketshare your product will die. Its just convenient for them to say that when it comes to OSX. SJ full well knows OSX will never make a significant impact on Windows. I'd guess OSX will never grab > 10% marketshare worldwide. It may come close, but not exceed it.

Hmm.

Reason Mac was successful - User Interface.

Reason iPod was successful - User Interface.

Reason iPhone will be sucessful - User Interface.

--They are, of course, not the only reasons...but pretty big ones..

Hattig
Jan 14, 2007, 07:06 PM
I'm hoping that in the long run that other applications will be available for the iPhone (and other iPhone OS X based systems).

I imagine that Apple will have the final say on all such applications.

Initially Apple will make iPhone optimised widgets available for download from the iTunes Store, possibly for a small fee, or to add value to the iPhone.

Then Apple will make certain Apple applications available in iPhone optimised form - iWork comes to mind. Again these will be available for a fee on the iTunes Store. iWork-based 'document viewers' will be free on the iPhone, again a value added proposition. Apple might even have to include it in the price - MS Smartphones come with Mobile Office (however craptastic and unusable on a 320x240 screen it is!).

Then Apple will allow third party development, not just anyone, and Apple will vet the applications so they meet a certain standard so that they don't affect the usability of the iPhone. Apple will sign the binaries and make them available on iTunes Store. This is what we had all better hope for anyway - whilst many corporations will lock their smartphones against third party application installs, individuals will desire this functionality.

Shame that 'iTunes' isn't really the ideal name for an iPhone synchronisation application. Music and video is only a fraction of the functionality of the iPhone. Still ... as long as it works reliably (better than ActiveSync, not that hard IMO).

I'm sure that a lot of the work that Apple put into creating an optimised compact necessaries-only version of OS X for the iPhone has also been put to use on the AppleTV too. Again a system I think V.2 or V.3 will be awesome, but has a good future...

As for success - Apple is very good at marketing, and good at making devices that people desire when they see them. It won't be an overnight success, but it won't be a dud. It is a limited appeal market (unless the contract plan is very appealing in terms of pricing) because most people make do with the subsided phone option, or maybe up to $100 above that. $600 is a tough sell for 98% of people. There will be a lot of buyers still. Not me though, I desire it but cannot justify it.

weave
Jan 14, 2007, 07:10 PM
Gessh, no bluetooth syncing. So I'm guessing the only way to sync contacts and calendar entries is through itunes.

When Tiger came out, .mac and device syncing were separated into two separate processes, one through the .mac sys pref applet, the other through the isync application. So now we will have a third method of syncing.

Getting ugly...

Xyl
Jan 14, 2007, 07:14 PM
This is a device that will not take off. It's being sold at $600 plus contract. iPhone's successor may well take off, but this one will not. It's a concept device, not a product. Even Jobs knows that this'll flop. He's predicting 1%. I think he thinks it'll be more like 2, though I'm having doubts even 1% is achievable given the attempt to sell it the way it is.

I think this is an invalid argument. Before I get into it, this is my opinion: I don't think the iPhone will be a success, but it won't be a flop either.

Anyhow, you are talking as if the iPhone will always be selling at a $600 contract, and that this is the only revision that will ever come out. The first generation iPod wasn't wildly successful either, but now it IS wildly successful. If you are solely ONLY talking about the first revision iPhone and ONLY at the $600 price point, I don't know what's your point is of this argument.

Oh, I just saw this: "iPhone's successor may well take off, but this one will not." Great, end of argument, I don't know why you're arguing about how the iPhone at $600 won't take off, because undoubtedly a) the price will drop, b) new features will be added. Your argument is valid, but a waste of time, because THERE WILL FOR SURE be price drops, new revisions, etc. This is like arguing that ice cream won't sell in Winter - well DUH!? it's -20 degrees outside, but Summer DOES come, which means it will sell in due time.

Even Jobs said it himself with an interview (with forgot what news channel) - he said something to the likes of "I don't know who wouldn't want one of these in a couple of years when the price drops and the tech gets better".

Hattig
Jan 14, 2007, 07:30 PM
Another no-brainer features for the iPhone, or iPhone V.2: GPS.

According to http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=36943 GPS chips are currently $5 apiece, and they'll be $2 in 2008. The iPhone's 480x320 screen is a great size for displaying maps in your typical in-car GPS mechanism, and the 8GB (16GB in 2008?) memory can hold a lot of maps! So maybe a $100 (mapping software, maps + hardware) addition to the price could add a lot of value to someone who would otherwise buy a dedicated unit for $300. Also you wouldn't leave it in the car to be stolen because it's your phone. Also a nice touch screen interface for hands-free phone call operation...

It'd also make the Google Maps widget instantly useful.

And as for $600 ... look at the Nokia N93i (1GB flash) - http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=36944 & http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/news/item/4737_Enter_the_Nokia_N93i.php
Yeah, nice camera functionality I'm sure, and wireless, but otherwise nothing. I'm sure networks will knock it down to $400 with contract, but if you're paying that much, $600 isn't that much more of a stretch. Oh wait, the N93i is €600, that's even more that $600...

Bosunsfate
Jan 14, 2007, 07:44 PM
There's a huge difference:

5% world market share for Mac OS. If you want to view that as success, then by all means, do so.

....I'd guess OSX will never grab > 10% marketshare worldwide. It may come close, but not exceed it.

The OSX market share has a very important relationship to what will be the potential and future for the iPhone.

One of the failures of Apple in the 80's was that they did not partner with IBM. At that time, despite how wonderful the Mac was, "Business" did not buy it. I'll spare the lecuture on why as that has been written about quite extensively.

This relationship, however, is why I think Apple ulitimately did not go on their own and did partner with Cingular. That bet being a transition of cellular users to a single system..from this fractured system we still have in the US.

What you have to see with the iPhone is not so much about market share, but as it being a product that does leap way ahead of what other companies are producing.

It doesn't have to be fully realized with the 1st gen..only the concept...and with this we can see a whole range of possibilities that no one else right now can come close too.

amoda
Jan 14, 2007, 07:54 PM
Don't know if this has been mentioned since i didn't read through the 3 pages but here goes.

Quote:
ONLY to skin touch. I couldn’t use my fingernail, for example. And you certainly can’t use a stylus.

From another source:
Input on the screen must be made using direct finger contact, and does not work with gloves or a stylus.

I see this as a huge deterrent for people in cold countries...like Canada. I just can't imagine pulling this out from my pocket and having to take my gloves off in order to answer/make a phone call and other stuff. I'd rather get a pearl and be able to keep my gloves on.

Chupa Chupa
Jan 14, 2007, 08:02 PM
you have to understand the market that Apple is going after.

And if I could eloquently define that here...then I'd be working in the Apple Marketing department and not posting on macrumors. :D

Yes, you would because I don't even think Apple's marketing team can define the iPhone's market. It's too expensive for teen set (except for maybe some very affluent pockets), overkill for the avg consumer, and yet too lacking in features business people depend on (like Exchange compatibility or true push email).

I'm a huge Apple fan, but not at the expense of productivity. Heck, I love Apple because their products help me to be productive because they are easy to use. But I just don't get the iPhone. It's pretty. It's cool. Lots of nice eyecandy. I was hoping it would kill the Treo in functionality. But when you start asking the hard questions you discover the iPhone lacks a whole lot. Maybe Apple is holding back until it gets FCC approval, but at a min. the iPhone needs a true bulletproof browser, not some poser web browser that freezes @ the first hint of java or flash.

nFace
Jan 14, 2007, 08:08 PM
Another no-brainer features for the iPhone, or iPhone V.2: GPS.

According to http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=36943 GPS chips are currently $5 apiece, and they'll be $2 in 2008. The iPhone's 480x320 screen is a great size for displaying maps in your typical in-car GPS mechanism, and the 8GB (16GB in 2008?) memory can hold a lot of maps! So maybe a $100 (mapping software, maps + hardware) addition to the price could add a lot of value to someone who would otherwise buy a dedicated unit for $300. Also you wouldn't leave it in the car to be stolen because it's your phone. Also a nice touch screen interface for hands-free phone call operation...

It'd also make the Google Maps widget instantly useful.

And as for $600 ... look at the Nokia N93i (1GB flash) - http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=36944 & http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/news/item/4737_Enter_the_Nokia_N93i.php
Yeah, nice camera functionality I'm sure, and wireless, but otherwise nothing. I'm sure networks will knock it down to $400 with contract, but if you're paying that much, $600 isn't that much more of a stretch. Oh wait, the N93i is €600, that's even more that $600...

The GPS features are are already becoming standard on smart phones. Manufacturers are in most cases using navigation software from Garmin, TomTom, Navicore etc. In future there will be more and more OEM deals between the navigation software and mobile phone manufacturers.

Regarding the pricing the n93 is 600€ unlocked. In Europe you can have n93 even free with two year contract but then again subsidised pricing is always open to debate (nothing is free...). Anyway, the Nokia counterpart currently for iPhone would probably be Nokia n95 (http://www.nokia.com/nseries/index.html?loc=inside,main_n95&lang=en&country=GB). Anyway, I could roughly say that iPhone design and GUI with n95 feature set would truly make an ultimate smart phone.

imacdaddy
Jan 14, 2007, 08:33 PM
I see this as a huge deterrent for people in cold countries...like Canada. I just can't imagine pulling this out from my pocket and having to take my gloves off in order to answer/make a phone call and other stuff. I'd rather get a pearl and be able to keep my gloves on.

This is very true. I'm also curious if I were stick a layer of protective film over the screen will prevent the touch-screen to work properly.

Anyway, I'm sure Apple has figured all of this out. And I'm sure they have something up their sleeves like some new state-of-the-art voice command/recognition /navigation app where you won't need to touch the phone. They did say their apps for the iPhone is "5 years ahead". ;)

stealthman1
Jan 14, 2007, 11:19 PM
Wi-Fi + Bluetooth + GPS? Do you really want to carry an extension cord everywhere you go? Why not just add an electric razor to the bottom so you can keep that baby soft look all day long???:rolleyes: With Google Maps do you really need GPS, surely you can read the sign on the corner you're standing on! I don't think the unit is meant to help you through the wilds of the Amazon. Sure it would be nice, but I think you're looking 2015, not 2007. Most people I know with Treos don't open excel docs on them, sure some do, but most don't. Most switchers find out quickly that they very, very rarely need MS Office at home, hence why most home computers don't come with it. Treos have become the trend phone for people who just want a tad smarter phone than the free ones with service contracts. This phone will sell like hot cakes, it does everything a large segment of the cell phone customer base needs. No doubt people will adapt to the higher pricing, because they are getting more. $600 is a lot of money for a significant market segment, but there is a big niche market that $600 for a phone is no different than a nice pair of shoes. 1% market share, at these prices is billions in revenue. Apple is very smart to stay in these niche markets and not try to compete in the 'commodity' phone markets. I can't wait to get mine. :D
While I personally will have no problem charging with the 30 pin, I do believe it is an oversight to not allow for mini-USB charging. I have tried very hard to reject all products that don't allow me to charge via mini-USB. Apple has to realize (as Motorola finally did) the endless maze of chargers is a problem...

bmoseley07
Jan 14, 2007, 11:39 PM
It's kind of funny, because there are plenty of phones out there that are unlike everything else. Nokia's Communicator series. The Blackberry. etc. No product on the market today can equal these, because nothing delivers that they deliver.

The question at the end of the day for most people is going to be "Here we go again. Is this particular combination of technologies something that'll suit me".

The really interesting question, for me, is how much of this will trickle down to regular phones. My Motorola and my wife's Motorola are nothing like the first phone I had, which at the time was a mainstream Motorola phone. I've had various phones since, and certain features have creeped into them, and then become a part of them. My 9290 seemed pretty radical when I got it. Flimsy piece of crap though, and curiously I'm just not that upset about the fact it doesn't work any more, because my V635 does the important things it did. But the former is a communicator, a smartphone, and the latter... well, it's just a phone.

It's a very strange market. I think at $5-600 locked and subsidized, and being larger than a full size iPod, the iPhone, quite honestly, is a dud. It'll fail miserably as a product. Anyone who believes otherwise is seriously delusional. If the iPhone itself succeeds, it'll succeed only because the price has been dropped to below $250 before the end of the year. It will not succeed at its current price point.

As a technology demo though, its utility remains to be seen, and it may well inspire some great things in the mobile phone industry. I hope it does. It might even be iPhone 2 that it inspires.

Wow, that started off kind of rational and unpartronizing in the beginning until you got to the part where you call people delusional for thinking it will succeed.

I don't know if you know anything about the Ipod or the Thread #500. I do and I just joined the forums. The Ipod didn't sound like the greatest thing ever at the time and people like you didn't think it was going to do well because it was too expensive and too big or not enough memory.

Hm.. what again happened to the Ipod? Oh yea, that's right.

A lot of people that I've talked to said they want to get one of these. Here's some of the reason it will succeed.

-It's Apple. That right there will get some of the shelves.
-It's looks like nothing else out there and works like nothing else out there. The combined beauty and ingenuity or the iPhone is amazing, and I was completely astounded by it upon watching the Keynote.
-Apple puts thought into every aspect of everything they make, so you know you're getting above top of the line quality.
-Features: what phone has visual voicemail? or full-view browser? or widescreen video? or is as simple to use as the iPhone?

It will succeed. It may not succeed at exactly $500-600 but it definitely won't have to get down to $250 before it does. Take off a hundred or maybe 150 and it'll do more than fine.

Yes, the contract sucks, but people will look over that. Almost all phones come with 2 year deals and most people end up using their phones for two years, so I can't really see it flopping like some people think.

nFace
Jan 14, 2007, 11:56 PM
Wi-Fi + Bluetooth + GPS? Do you really want to carry an extension cord everywhere you go? Why not just add an electric razor to the bottom so you can keep that baby soft look all day long???:rolleyes: With Google Maps do you really need GPS, surely you can read the sign on the corner you're standing on! I don't think the unit is meant to help you through the wilds of the Amazon. Sure it would be nice, but I think you're looking 2015, not 2007.

GPS navigation allows automatic routing so you can use your phone as car navigator. This is very much 2007 (actually its been here before then that but not as integrated application). Q1 2007 sees several phones with GPS / integrated navigation being released. Unfortunately automatic routing in Amazon is bit more difficult since there are no accurate mapping data available let alone vector maps with routing data... :D Anyway, Google maps is like a yellow pages but it won't get you there like a real navigator does.

stealthman1
Jan 15, 2007, 12:17 AM
GPS navigation allows automatic routing so you can use your phone as car navigator. This is very much 2007 (actually its been here before then that but not as integrated application). Q1 2007 sees several phones with GPS / integrated navigation being released. Unfortunately automatic routing in Amazon is bit more difficult since there are no accurate mapping data available let alone vector maps with routing data... :D Anyway, Google maps is like a yellow pages but it won't get you there like a real navigator does.
If you can afford a $600 phone you can afford an OEM navigation system. Using a 3.5 inch screen for navigation while driving is dangerous. God forbid people are using maps on the 2.5 inch screens to drive by, I've used maps on my MDA and I sure as hell wouldn't feel safe squinting at them while driving. The rest of us would feel safer if you got a map! Seriously even the 7 inch screens associated with OEM Nav are problematic from a safety point of view. HUD would be substantially better. God forbid people are driving around looking at their phone in the passenger seat....:eek: :eek:

ddubbo
Jan 15, 2007, 01:55 AM
Why would Apple announce the iPhone 5+ months in advance? Wouldn't that give the competition 5+ months to copy it?
Of course. At 2007 it's just a time to change mantra "MS copying us" to "Nokia copying us"
I see only the reason that they introduced it half an year before its release because this product so far from completion, but Jobs have nothing other in the sleeve to hold a media attention on the Apple.

timb
Jan 15, 2007, 03:35 AM
Am I the only one seriously bothered by the whole "lack of modem connectivity"? If I can't connect this to my MBP via BT and get online, well, that's a SERIOUS problem that needs to be fixed.

ccn
Jan 15, 2007, 05:04 AM
Am I the only one seriously bothered by the whole "lack of modem connectivity"? If I can't connect this to my MBP via BT and get online, well, that's a SERIOUS problem that needs to be fixed.

It will connect automatically to a Wireless Network from the EDGE network so that you don't use up your Cingular data limits. Bluetooth would be much slower than WiFi, but than it could more easily support wired houses. For me personally, this is definitely not a serious issue because I have wireless everywhere I go.

nFace
Jan 15, 2007, 08:42 AM
It seems that Amazon.de is already taking pre-orders. The price for unlocked version in Germany as follows: iPhone 8 GB 999€ and iPhone 4 GB 899€ (http://www.amazon.de/s/ref=nb_ss_ce/028-8176459-6298128?__mk_de_DE=%C5M%C5Z%D5%D1&url=search-alias%3Delectronics-aps&field-keywords=iphone&Go.x=0&Go.y=0&Go=Go)(around $ 1291 for 8 GB and $ 1162 for 4 GB version).

CJD2112
Jan 15, 2007, 12:42 PM
It seems that Amazon.de is already taking pre-orders. The price for unlocked version in Germany as follows: iPhone 8 GB 999€ and iPhone 4 GB 899€ (http://www.amazon.de/s/ref=nb_ss_ce/028-8176459-6298128?__mk_de_DE=%C5M%C5Z%D5%D1&url=search-alias%3Delectronics-aps&field-keywords=iphone&Go.x=0&Go.y=0&Go=Go)(around $ 1291 for 8 GB and $ 1162 for 4 GB version).

Wow... wow... that's rid-ic-u-lous. I like the thing, but $1,000+, no way.

CJD2112
Jan 15, 2007, 12:44 PM
If the iPhone is anything like the iPod screens but "improved", and as the iPod screens scratch just by breathing on them, how much improvement are we talking for a touch screen system? Since it only responds to the human touch (no materials, etc.) it seems that putting a film over the screen may not be an option. Apple must have worked this out, otherwise if this thing scratches even 1/10 of the iPod screen, I'm not buying. :eek:

CJD2112
Jan 15, 2007, 01:11 PM
“Why is everyone missing the fact that this phone/device will seamlessly switch between Edge and Wi-Fi saving big $$$ on data rates?” –Because nobody bothers to post about what they LIKE. If Internetters can’t say something disparaging, they say nothing at all.

EXACTLY

firewire2001
Jan 15, 2007, 02:10 PM
wow, considering all of its java features, it really sounds like the iphone is running os x. this is pretty pathetic.

liberty4all
Jan 15, 2007, 03:35 PM
It looks like Apple is using Synaptics touch screen technology like the Synaptics Onyx phone...

http://news.com.com/1606-12994_3-6150132.html?tag=ne.video.6150150

matticus008
Jan 16, 2007, 04:59 AM
Maybe it's Java-script that's supported, not Java. This would make more sense in a way, but not for the user, who wants it all to work.
Javascript and Java are radically different. Javascript IS supported by the iPhone, but whether or not there will be a Java VM implementation is still unknown. Look no further than the New York Times website demo--their site uses Javascript all over the place.


I only have one computer with only one free USB port that I have to swap out between a whole myriad of gadgets as necessary and don't know what I would do if I had to charge my cell phone via my computer as well since you'd have to do it almost everyday.
Buy a USB hub. Sounds like you need one anyway, if you're that hard-pressed for free USB ports. My main desktop has 8, with an additional pair on the monitor, and I still need a hub.

There is absolutely no way a $500-600 plus two year commitment phone is going to be a roaring success. Jobs himself has said as much, he's only expecting a 1% marketshare (which actually probably means he's expecting 2%, but, whatever.)
Define 'roaring success.' A 1% market share for ANY smartphone would be heretofore unachieved heights and an unparalleled success in the market. As for the price, it's not the first phone to enter the market at this price point. The past several years have seen many high-priced launches. Blackberries have been introduced at much lower prices lately because their market was floundering; the Q and the Blackjack are both heavily subsidized by their carriers--selling at $299 locked, retail. It's not known what amount of subsidizing, if any, Cingular has taken on with the iPhone. The German launch doesn't necessarily reflect a final price for comparison.


iPhoto -> Nice UI - but once again, all other smartphones allow an open platform. When people think smartphones they ( who have used them ) think open platform.
Actually, 'open platform' didn't really occur to the non-geek users at all before their geek friends decided to complain about the iPhone's closed system. In a building full of smartphone users, no one ever really thinks to install all kinds of random crap. They're used for handling contact information, calendars and reminders, taking down quick notes, sending maps and directions, keeping up with email out of the office, web browsing, making calls, and often playing a few short games or some music.

The iPhone does all of this (not to mention its photo management and extremely user-friendly dashboard-style widgets). Almost no one I know uses the Office mobile--they ruin the files and even worse, lack any real features that can't be replaced by any basic text editor or an HTML table. A few people have selected a few applications to add, but apart from Salling Clicker and, humorously enough, a photo slideshow app, people don't install anything too exciting. Joe Smith's app of the week certainly doesn't make an appearance on any professional's smartphone. So long as Apple makes available useful applications for download or sale, not many people will care.

It's a bit disappointing for geeks, I'll give you that, but it's really not going to bother any real-world professionals. The iPhone offers almost everything that real people use smartphones for on a day-to-day basis, and if it lobs off some of the rarely-used features and makes the device accessible to a wider audience, it will more than compensate for that loss.

CrazyWingman
Jan 16, 2007, 07:29 AM
What you don't get is the "push" like you get with a Blackberry or with the Yahoo.mail.

An IMO...who cares...bring on the iPhone!

I'll tell you exactly who cares: those looking for best battery life. This was the first thing my boss (power smartphone user) jumped on, and the net seems to confirm it. Push is just less power hungry than IMAP.

So, you can expect to see quite a bit more bitching about this in the coming months.

liberty4all
Jan 16, 2007, 11:07 AM
No Java?! This is truly a problem, IMHO -- as will be if Apple locks down these devices to not add apps and not encourage a vibrant mobile application market like the Treo has.

It is also ridiculous that Apple is not releasing HSDPA on the first iPhone -- so much for Apple being the "industry leader"...

Why is it that nobody makes a phone with all the features I would buy today? *sigh*

liberty4all
Jan 16, 2007, 11:11 AM
Another thing Apple forgot is IR -- I think people would love to use the phone as a remote for their AV equipment.

What Apple needs to do is make one phone that can work as a home VoIP phone, cell phone and remote control. (Not forgetting video chat with rotatable camera, 3G, GPS and other current features)

psychofreak
Jan 16, 2007, 11:27 AM
Another thing Apple forgot is IR -- I think people would love to use the phone as a remote for their AV equipment.


I smell decreasing battey life...