those apple music comercials suck!

[codycartoon]

People singing with there iPods? what was apple thinking?...

here are my complaints with the commercials:

they don't even show the front of the ipod! so to someone who hasn't seen the new ipod they think its just like the old one!

they do not advertise the simplicity, elegance, hard drive space, or interface!Isn't that why you would buy one!

how does random people singing a song make you want to buy an iPod...the only resin that i see is to make the consumers curious enough to go to the site.

what I would do:

a series of commercials where a person goes through there typical day with an ipod connected to a Mac and how the ipod has made the day better...or something i duno...


I bought my ipod the first day they came out(15gb)...and I have been very happy with it...the commercials give it no justice

What do you think of the new commercials?

-cody

[voicegy]

Although I haven't seen the commercials, the thinking BEHIND advertising generally doesn't follow what one may think of as common sense.

When the automobile "Infinity" made its debut many years ago, it rocked the advertising world. It was a common practice to advertise an automobile by, well, at least SHOWING the damn thing, then going on about its features, etc. Instead, the Infinity commercials showed leaves falling from a tree, puddles in the ground, "new age" music in the background, and, well, that was about it.

The concept was genius. By NOT showing the product, it created an immediate buzz, and emotions invoked by the mysterious, beautiful and enticing imagery and music and sounds hit viewers to the core. Fortunately, the car itself DID turn out to be a beautiful machine, and continues to be a fairly well selling automobile.

As Apple enthusiasts, we want so desperately for the public to "get it", and we do tend to get harsh towards our beloved company when it comes to the ways Apple promotes, or doesn't promote, their machines and products. What may not be sauce for the goose (our perceptions) may very well be sauce for the gander (their target audience).

I leave my trust in their choices. After all, Apple could have, quite seriously, been long gone only a few short years ago. I'm quite content.

[bidge]

Don't you realise that the ads weren't advertising the iPods..

The ads were advertising the new music service, and inviting you do visit the site to see how to get individual songs for 99¢ each.

[DavisBAnimal]

I've seen a few of them and thought they were pretty good. I don't think they're supposed to be ads for the iPods - they're ads for the music store (they put up the URL for www.AppleMusic.com at the end). I think that's why the iPods aren't really shown.

But you're right - it would be nice to see a TV ad for the iPods.

Davis

[MacFan25]

Originally posted by codycartoon
how does random people singing a song make you want to buy an iPod...the only resin that i see is to make the consumers curious enough to go to the site.
Well, the ad is more for the music service, and not the iPods. Sure, Apple put the iPods in there to give them some publicity, but mostly the commercial is for the music service.

[erik1975]

Is it me or did the links for the TV ads disappear from Apple's website? I can't find them anymore.

I wanted one more laugh at the 'Baby Got Back' guy!

[Kwyjibo]

yeah the ads are gone, there has been alot of discussion on their absence. I like the commercials , they are attention getting. I think they shoudl show the ipod but if they dont' they don't. also if they get u to the msuic store, then bam BUY AN IPOD is a link...

[bidge]

If anyone wants a copy add me to their iChat Buddies list...

rbijl@mac.com

I'll give you the high quality one

[tazo]

Originally posted by bidge
If anyone wants a copy add me to their iChat Buddies list...

rbijl@mac.com

I'll give you the high quality one

shhhhh mr. pirate :D

[Kwyjibo]

hes not a pirate, apple wasnt' charging for the material hes offering.

[tazo]

Originally posted by Kwyjibo
hes not a pirate, apple wasnt' charging for the material hes offering.

good point. wwwwwwwooooooooooooooooosh :)

[MacFan25]

Originally posted by Kwyjibo
hes not a pirate, apple wasnt' charging for the material hes offering.
Plus its a commercial, so he is actually kind of helping Apple's marketing.:D

[bidge]

That's what I was thinking, it is beneficial for Apple for me to show them the trailer. Free marketing...

[Tequila Grandma]

Personally, I think the concept for the commercials is not a terribly bad one, but the excecution was incredibly poorly done. The songs and people they selected just didn't work at all. Sure, the concept of a twentysomething white male singing "Baby Got Back" might seem like an amusing idea, but unfortunately, it came off as incredibly annoying. A kid singing an Eminem song stil doesn't make Eminem's music any more tolerable. There was one spot I felt was done well, but now I don't remember which it was.

I can't help thinking how cool this campaign could have been had they done it L.A. karaoke lounge style, and had Japanese businessmen singing Western hit pop songs :D

Danke,
Brook

[coopdog]

I can't help thinking how cool this campaign could have been had they done it L.A. karaoke lounge style, and had Japanese businessmen singing Western hit pop songs

Thats always fun!!:D

Well I agee why not show itunes 4 and the ipod people. Apple should show people how easy it is to use their new service and show off their ipods. You know your doing well when people "pirate" your adds.

[dhdave]

I'm not as concerned with the content of the ads as I am with their frequency. I don't think Apple spends enough on advertising. These ads need to cover a wider area than they are covering and their number of views needs to be many times what it is now. I hardly ever see the ads.

--dh

[applemacdude]

i hate the new commercials

[pduck]

I think just by the fact that people here don't know if the commercials are advertising the ipods or the new music service show that Apple has missed.

Personally, I think that Apple should be much more aggressive in their advertising. When you're behind, you need to be hard hitting. Define the difference, show your audience how Macs are better and how they will better their lives. And don't try to be so cute, unless we get Ridley Scott to direct another commercial.

[andrewlandry]

i also think the ads blow - except the ones with the girls singing. the ones that were trying to be funny just missed the mark a bit.

[Sun Baked]

For some reason the commercials make me want to walk up to these people and...

[moose]

Originally posted by bidge
Don't you realise that the ads weren't advertising the iPods..

The ads were advertising the new music service, and inviting you do visit the site to see how to get individual songs for 99¢ each.

If you have to explain the ad, then it is a failure. Simple as that.

The reason I don't like the Apple ads is that, contrary to their intent, they make Apple users appear different, and somehow more eccentric than "normal" people. Which, I would think, is just the image that Apple should be trying to shed when attempting to embrace a wider audience. I think that the visual device of talking directly into the camera that Errol Morris used to such great effect in his documentaries of a myraid of screwballs, has a similar effect on otherwise potentially normal individuals. As a viewer of one of these ads, it is very off putting, and disconcerting having someone you don't know proselytizing directly at you.

The iTunes Music Store ads do nothing to remedy this by awkwardly injecting you into what is framed as an otherwise private enjoyment of music. Does one honestly stare at people as they sing to themselves in the Subway or on the bus? I think not. Its generally a mildly embarassing experience, and certainly not one that would make me interested in whatever product (or substance abuse) resulted in this loss of pride and body control. The idea probably sounded nice, no pun intended, in the advertising presentation to Apple... gyrating, awkward freak singing to self whilst suspended in The Void. Yeah, that's a target demographic.

[LethalWolfe]

Originally posted by moose
If you have to explain the ad, then it is a failure. Simple as that.

The reason I don't like the Apple ads is that, contrary to their intent, they make Apple users appear different, and somehow more eccentric than "normal" people. Which, I would think, is just the image that Apple should be trying to shed when attempting to embrace a wider audience. I think that the visual device of talking directly into the camera that Errol Morris used to such great effect in his documentaries of a myraid of screwballs, has a similar effect on otherwise potentially normal individuals. As a viewer of one of these ads, it is very off putting, and disconcerting having someone you don't know proselytizing directly at you.

The iTunes Music Store ads do nothing to remedy this by awkwardly injecting you into what is framed as an otherwise private enjoyment of music. Does one honestly stare at people as they sing to themselves in the Subway or on the bus? I think not. Its generally a mildly embarassing experience, and certainly not one that would make me interested in whatever product (or substance abuse) resulted in this loss of pride and body control. The idea probably sounded nice, no pun intended, in the advertising presentation to Apple... gyrating, awkward freak singing to self whilst suspended in The Void. Yeah, that's a target demographic.

I don't see how hard it is to understand what the ads are selling. "Applemusic.com" appears in really big letters at the end each ad and by going to Applemusic.com I get to learn about the Music Store, iTunes 4 and the iPod. And Apple's demographic isn't a "wide audience" any more than BMW or Mercedes is a wide audience. Apple isn't trying to compete w/Dell or Gateway to sell stripped down computers at bargin basement prices to the masses. For lack of a better term Apple is selling "luxury" computers and is trying to establish that a Mac is more than just a computer thus we are getting more creative and "off-beat" commercials rather than the hard-sell approach used in most commercials.

People say these ads and the switch ads sucked but how much word of mouth did the switch ads create? How many people talked about them? How many switch parodies were people making? How often do you see an ad campaign get that much attention? I don't know how many computers those ads sold but I know there was a lot more talk about Apple and Macs than usual because of those adds.


Lethal

[moose]

Originally posted by LethalWolfe
I don't see how hard it is to understand what the ads are selling. "Applemusic.com" appears in really big letters at the end each ad and by going to Applemusic.com I get to learn about the Music Store, iTunes 4 and the iPod. And Apple's demographic isn't a "wide audience" any more than BMW or Mercedes is a wide audience. Apple isn't trying to compete w/Dell or Gateway to sell stripped down computers at bargin basement prices to the masses. For lack of a better term Apple is selling "luxury" computers and is trying to establish that a Mac is more than just a computer thus we are getting more creative and "off-beat" commercials rather than the hard-sell approach used in most commercials.

People say these ads and the switch ads sucked but how much word of mouth did the switch ads create? How many people talked about them? How many switch parodies were people making? How often do you see an ad campaign get that much attention? I don't know how many computers those ads sold but I know there was a lot more talk about Apple and Macs than usual because of those adds.


Lethal

Speaking as a designer, you learn very quickly not to question human nature in advertising, or you will fail very quickly. It doesn't matter if you feel you are plainly stating in cold hard text that it is an ad for Applemusic.com. If people don't get, they don't get it. Get thee to the drawing board and work the problem itself: the ad is not communicating. Never, ever blame the audience, or expect them to just "get it".

Secondly, I don't think that all attention is necessarily good attention. I think the parodies, and ridicule, even within the Mac ranks bears this out. Further, the numbers bear it out even worse. If, at the end of the day, as an ad campaign comes to close, or morphs into its next cycle as it is with the iTunes ads, and you look back to see if you are now making more money after these ads, or that you have laid a solid foundation for future sales and the answer is no, then in the most basic business sense it was a failure.

And Apple's demographic isn't a "wide audience" any more than BMW or Mercedes is a wide audience. Apple isn't trying to compete w/Dell or Gateway to sell stripped down computers at bargin basement prices to the masses.
Thirdly, are you implying that Apple's only competitor is itself, if indeed they are not marketing to PC users with a campaign entitled "Switchers" featuring "average users"? That certainly paints a picture of a company attempting to reach a "wide audience" to me. If, as you say Apple's demographic is not a larger audience then Apple will never gain market share, and the label of elitist computing is well applied to us. I guess the eMac is a low cost elite product?

No, I think that at its core, pun intended, Apple is extremely interested in bringing in new blood. If I may be so bold as to read a little into your response, you seem to imply that Apple targeting a "wider audience" is somehow a bad thing. If I am wrong, forgive me, otherwise, I'll say that businesses exist for one purpose: to make as much money as possible. If Apple sells more computers to more users, and spreads our brand of computing to as many people as they can then so much the better. But to imply that the status quo, and a limited market share is somehow acceptable is laughable from a purely business perspective. Thankfully for us, I don't think that is the case.

And as an aside, you would do well to note that your anecdote of both Mercedes and BMW have vastly expanded their base (and revenue) by creating low cost models to appeal to audiences far from their more traditional lofty markets. I like the parallel with Apple in so far as the implication is one of a finely honed, well engineered experience that goes beyond utility into the realm of the emotional, but to think that protection of the Apple brand as a "luxury" marque while simultaneously advertising to bristly beard hippies and stoned students is a lesson in wearing the Emperors clothes...

[tazo]

Originally posted by moose
Speaking as a designer, you learn very quickly not to question human nature in advertising, or you will fail very quickly. It doesn't matter if you feel you are plainly stating in cold hard text that it is an ad for Applemusic.com. If people don't get, they don't get it. Get thee to the drawing board and work the problem itself: the ad is not communicating. Never, ever blame the audience, or expect them to just "get it".

Secondly, I don't think that all attention is necessarily good attention. I think the parodies, and ridicule, even within the Mac ranks bears this out. Further, the numbers bear it out even worse. If, at the end of the day, as an ad campaign comes to close, or morphs into its next cycle as it is with the iTunes ads, and you look back to see if you are now making more money after these ads, or that you have laid a solid foundation for future sales and the answer is no, then in the most basic business sense it was a failure.


Thirdly, are you implying that Apple's only competitor is itself, if indeed they are not marketing to PC users with a campaign entitled "Switchers" featuring "average users"? That certainly paints a picture of a company attempting to reach a "wide audience" to me. If, as you say Apple's demographic is not a larger audience then Apple will never gain market share, and the label of elitist computing is well applied to us. I guess the eMac is a low cost elite product?

No, I think that at its core, pun intended, Apple is extremely interested in bringing in new blood. If I may be so bold as to read a little into your response, you seem to imply that Apple targeting a "wider audience" is somehow a bad thing. If I am wrong, forgive me, otherwise, I'll say that businesses exist for one purpose: to make as much money as possible. If Apple sells more computers to more users, and spreads our brand of computing to as many people as they can then so much the better. But to imply that the status quo, and a limited market share is somehow acceptable is laughable from a purely business perspective. Thankfully for us, I don't think that is the case.

And as an aside, you would do well to note that your anecdote of both Mercedes and BMW have vastly expanded their base (and revenue) by creating low cost models to appeal to audiences far from their more traditional lofty markets. I like the parallel with Apple in so far as the implication is one of a finely honed, well engineered experience that goes beyond utility into the realm of the emotional, but to think that protection of the Apple brand as a "luxury" marque while simultaneously advertising to bristly beard hippies and stoned students is a lesson in wearing the Emperors clothes...

wow someone took some writing classes. :(

[5300cs]

Originally posted by Tequila Grandma
I can't help thinking how cool this campaign could have been had they done it L.A. karaoke lounge style, and had Japanese businessmen singing Western hit pop songs :D


Ugh, if ever there was a way to not sell iPods. My friend used to live across from this watering hole where all the old Japanese businessmen geezers used to drink until 3am and sing. Made him wish firearms were legal in Japan:mad: then for an encore they stumble out onto the street and keep singing ... :rolleyes:

I dothink it would make a cool commercial, though.

[Flowbee]

I think the ads are meant to be a bit ambiguous. They don't give you any details about how to get songs for 99 cents. They don't show the iPod very clearly. I think they want to make people curious. Curious enough to visit applemusic.com. I don't think any of us can judge whether the ads are a success or not unless we know if Apple's web traffic and sales are increasing.

Just because people don't 'get' an ad, doesn't necessarily mean it's a failure.

[yzedf]

I am just tired of the $2 ad style. It was cute for the switch campaign, but no it just feels old and tired. What happened to the interesting ads? One can hope the rumored 2004 Super Bowl ad (20th anniversary of the best ad ever) will be the segue into a new style campaign.

http://www.yzedf.com/vids/adverts/1984%20Macintosh%20Ad.mov

[andrewlandry]

moose, do you think the VW commercials are terrible too? they also depict sometimes awkward twenty-somethings and they are pretty quirky.

isn't that a coveted demographic?

should apple try to be the computer for senior citizens in South Dakota?

and i don't think that the sole function of a business should be to make money. you must make money, but it shouldn't be the only thing guiding the decisions of a company that is in the business of creating beautiful machines.

microsoft has kind of cornered the market on the 'we are the normal computer' thing. if apple tries to be grandma's computer, it will look lame. i think offering an alternative computer culture is a good thing with room for growth as average people i've talked to are getting comfortable enough with computers to consider trying other operating systems and comment that macs look nice.

also, something to consider - rules of design are not the same as the rules of advertising. i can think of a million stupid ads by huge corporations that were considered to be successful. sorry to blab for so long :)

[Eniregnat]

I think that the commercials are aimed at the 30-50 crowd. My parents who are over 50 don't understand why somebody would use a Walkman, let alone sing with headphones on. The 30-50 crowd is not as accepting of new technologies, as compared to the 18-29, and are an untapped audience as far as on-line music sales are concerned.

I kind of like them. They embarrass me, particularly the "I like big butts and I can not lie.", because I can see myself doing that.

[cubist]

yzedf, when I try to follow your link I get an error that your site does not allow image linking.

[tazo]

The people they picked IMHO are pretty cool in that they are so average and believable. I like the one where the teenager kid is singing the eminem song, that takes guts for anyone to try and rap. lol

[LethalWolfe]

Originally posted by moose
Speaking as a designer, you learn very quickly not to question human nature in advertising, or you will fail very quickly. It doesn't matter if you feel you are plainly stating in cold hard text that it is an ad for Applemusic.com. If people don't get, they don't get it. Get thee to the drawing board and work the problem itself: the ad is not communicating. Never, ever blame the audience, or expect them to just "get it".

Secondly, I don't think that all attention is necessarily good attention. I think the parodies, and ridicule, even within the Mac ranks bears this out. Further, the numbers bear it out even worse. If, at the end of the day, as an ad campaign comes to close, or morphs into its next cycle as it is with the iTunes ads, and you look back to see if you are now making more money after these ads, or that you have laid a solid foundation for future sales and the answer is no, then in the most basic business sense it was a failure.


Thirdly, are you implying that Apple's only competitor is itself, if indeed they are not marketing to PC users with a campaign entitled "Switchers" featuring "average users"? That certainly paints a picture of a company attempting to reach a "wide audience" to me. If, as you say Apple's demographic is not a larger audience then Apple will never gain market share, and the label of elitist computing is well applied to us. I guess the eMac is a low cost elite product?

No, I think that at its core, pun intended, Apple is extremely interested in bringing in new blood. If I may be so bold as to read a little into your response, you seem to imply that Apple targeting a "wider audience" is somehow a bad thing. If I am wrong, forgive me, otherwise, I'll say that businesses exist for one purpose: to make as much money as possible. If Apple sells more computers to more users, and spreads our brand of computing to as many people as they can then so much the better. But to imply that the status quo, and a limited market share is somehow acceptable is laughable from a purely business perspective. Thankfully for us, I don't think that is the case.

And as an aside, you would do well to note that your anecdote of both Mercedes and BMW have vastly expanded their base (and revenue) by creating low cost models to appeal to audiences far from their more traditional lofty markets. I like the parallel with Apple in so far as the implication is one of a finely honed, well engineered experience that goes beyond utility into the realm of the emotional, but to think that protection of the Apple brand as a "luxury" marque while simultaneously advertising to bristly beard hippies and stoned students is a lesson in wearing the Emperors clothes...

I'm ordering my response so that my paragraphs resond directly to yours (so my first paragraph responds to your first paragraph, my 2nd responds to your 2nd, etc.,).

1. I think people are getting it. But the people who get it are less likely to post "Hey I like the new ads" (unless they, really, really like the new adds) than the people who don't like the new ads. Just like people are more likely to post and complain about their Mac when it's not working right than when everything is working fine. I agree that you should never just "expecpt your audience to get it" but on their are almost just as many dangers by staying on the beaten path (so to speak).

2. I can't comment on this more than I have because I don't closely follow Apple's finnacials nor do I have access to documents pretaining to the effectiveness, or ineffectiveness, of the last and current ad campaigns. All I know is what I saw and what I saw was a lot more people talking about Apple than usual. Even at the PC forums I hit there seems to be more respect given to Macs now, after the switcher ads, than before. Not directly because of the ads, but people would start a thread bashing the ads, it would turn into a Mac vs PC debate (sometimes a flame war, sometimes not) and the Mac minority, myself included, would be able to clear away some of the old myths and misconceptions. Of course not all the talk generated by those ads was good talk, but they did get a lot of people talking about Macs who normally wouldn't so I fail to see it as a complete failure.

3. Of course Apple wants to expand it's user base, but its goals and its target audience are not the same as Dells or Gateways. Apple's goal is not to build budget PCs and sell them at the lowest possible prices. Thus Apple is eliminating itself from a target audience that Dell, and Gateway, and HP are slugging it out for. To hit the car metaphor again yes BMW and MB have released lower priced "entry level" cars, but those "low end" models are still way more expensive then the low end offerings from Ford or GM. I'm not trying make Macs out to be some elitist<sp?> computer or anything, but I don't think you'll ever see a "budget" Mac to compete w/Dells $499 PC. Apple just doesn't cater to that market.


Lethal

[moose]

Originally posted by andrewlandry
moose, do you think the VW commercials are terrible too? they also depict sometimes awkward twenty-somethings and they are pretty quirky.

isn't that a coveted demographic?

should apple try to be the computer for senior citizens in South Dakota?

I love VW's ads. They are consistently one of the hallmarks of the advertising industry IMO. Their ability to match music, cinematography, emotion, gimmick, social relevance and message is equaled only by Nike.

Anywho, If you read back through my comments vis-a-vis the post I was responding to, you will see that my beef is not with the choice of demographics, or with the fact that the individuals might be quirky, but with the advertisements themselves and the manner in which they, to quote myself, take "potentially normal individuals" and make them appear eccentric and weird through both freeform dialogue and especially through the visual device of looking into the camera when speaking. It really should come as no surprise that this is a common casual reaction to the ads, not just limited to myself, since the renowned documentarian Errol Morris who was tapped to film the commercials has made a name for himself interviewing oddballs and freaks. This is getting off-topic, but he really is an amazing documentary maker, and I would highly suggest people not familiar with his work to look up "The Thin Blue Line," "A Brief History of Time," "Mr. Death," and whole series of brilliant documentaries that he filmed for the Bravo network. You will consequently find that he definitely has an eye for exaggerating to almost comic proportions, the eccentricities of a given interviewee.

Originally posted by andrewlandry
and i don't think that the sole function of a business should be to make money. you must make money, but it shouldn't be the only thing guiding the decisions of a company that is in the business of creating beautiful machines.

If you think that businesses should have a primary goal other than that of making money then you are calling into question the entire commercial and mercantile system. If you are arguing that ethics and solid engineering (and thus customer satisfaction) are somehow divorced from the overarching concern of the almighty dollar, then I beg to differ. I fail to see how, as you seem to suggest, the pursuit of of computing perfection is not anything more than a business objective to attract users such as ourselves. Creating desirable products is, at its most base level, good business. After all, if you don't make any money, then your company, and those brilliant products will cease to exist.

Originally posted by andrewlandry
also, something to consider - rules of design are not the same as the rules of advertising. i can think of a million stupid ads by huge corporations that were considered to be successful. sorry to blab for so long :)

And yes, I agree, the rules of design are not the rules of advertising, however, they are an intimate facet to be leveraged in the execution of a given campaign and thus absolutely essential. I too, can think of a whole litany of ads that I found extraordinarily annoying but were huge successes. The Dell dude immediately springs to mind. And that really is my point: even if I have an aesthetic issue with the ads, thats really just my problem, but when the ads are odd, AND show no tangible evidence of having increased revenue as is the case here, then one must question their viability and success. The Dell dude annoyed the crap out of me, but he was also responsible for what was quoted in the WSJ as an over 200% increase in sales. I honestly would have never guessed that to be possible. I shudder to think what Carrot Top has done for 1-800 CALL ATT.

Originally posted by andrewlandry
microsoft has kind of cornered the market on the 'we are the normal computer' thing. if apple tries to be grandma's computer, it will look lame. i think offering an alternative computer culture is a good thing with room for growth as average people i've talked to are getting comfortable enough with computers to consider trying other operating systems and comment that macs look nice.

At the end of the day, I feel that the beauty of Apple, and Apple products is not in their uniqueness per se, but in the unique way in which they are so very normal and intuitive. We may be getting into semantics here, but IMO what is really revolutionary about Apple is that they have such a phenomenal understanding of what a user really wants and needs from their system. From a product standpoint, I feel this is their great gift. The resultant Apple advocacy culture, and the unparalleled loyalty is a a direct result of that core understanding. Thus, I think it is a mistake to advertise the culture, when really the impetus is the product. People don't like being preached at. The "Switcher" style ads are akin to proselytizing in the confrontational way that they are filmed. Just think Jehovah's witnesses, and I think we are starting to get close to how many PC users view Mac advocates. Have you been saved (from PC hell)? ;)

You think you "blab long"? Sheesh... sorry. Lethal, I'll respond tomorrow. Beddy time.

[moose]

Originally posted by LethalWolfe
I'm ordering my response so that my paragraphs resond directly to yours (so my first paragraph responds to your first paragraph, my 2nd responds to your 2nd, etc.,).

1. I think people are getting it. But the people who get it are less likely to post "Hey I like the new ads" (unless they, really, really like the new adds) than the people who don't like the new ads. Just like people are more likely to post and complain about their Mac when it's not working right than when everything is working fine. I agree that you should never just "expecpt your audience to get it" but on their are almost just as many dangers by staying on the beaten path (so to speak).

2. I can't comment on this more than I have because I don't closely follow Apple's finnacials nor do I have access to documents pretaining to the effectiveness, or ineffectiveness, of the last and current ad campaigns. All I know is what I saw and what I saw was a lot more people talking about Apple than usual. Even at the PC forums I hit there seems to be more respect given to Macs now, after the switcher ads, than before. Not directly because of the ads, but people would start a thread bashing the ads, it would turn into a Mac vs PC debate (sometimes a flame war, sometimes not) and the Mac minority, myself included, would be able to clear away some of the old myths and misconceptions. Of course not all the talk generated by those ads was good talk, but they did get a lot of people talking about Macs who normally wouldn't so I fail to see it as a complete failure.

3. Of course Apple wants to expand it's user base, but its goals and its target audience are not the same as Dells or Gateways. Apple's goal is not to build budget PCs and sell them at the lowest possible prices. Thus Apple is eliminating itself from a target audience that Dell, and Gateway, and HP are slugging it out for. To hit the car metaphor again yes BMW and MB have released lower priced "entry level" cars, but those "low end" models are still way more expensive then the low end offerings from Ford or GM. I'm not trying make Macs out to be some elitist<sp?> computer or anything, but I don't think you'll ever see a "budget" Mac to compete w/Dells $499 PC. Apple just doesn't cater to that market.


Lethal

1. Not to give myself too much credit, but I think I am a pretty savvy consumer and critic of advertising (since thats my biz). I didn't get it at first. I feel a little dumb admitting this, but I actually thought it was an ad for the iPod. By the time the Apple store text popped up, I had already convinced myself of that. It took watching it a second time to "get it." I hope I'm a rare exception, but I fear I am not.

2. People talking about Apple is great. People have been talking about Apple for ages, usually in the same dire tones. IMO, the main reason those tones have mellowed or reversed is because of OS X, and the respect it commands as a trump OS. I think the advertising has played an extremely minor role in legitimizing Apple as a computing alternative to the Windows world. Furthermore, I don't think that the talk you speak of, especially in a Mac or PC online forum, can be taken as an average consumer response. I would wager that the people on PC forums jawing about Macs will have somewhat more general computer savvy than the audience that the ads are targeting. But if all they do is talk, and don't act on that buy impulse then the marketing gears are not meshing.

3. I disagree. The number one goal of Dell, Gateway, and Apple, is to make money. If that means Apple should mine new audiences, and seriously investigate a radical change of strategy (separate software and hardware divisions), then so be it, if for no other reason than to keep Apple viable as the markets ebb. Gradually Apple, and Apple advocates are coming around to the realization that a budget PC is not necessarily a low quality PC, and there is no reason that the stigma cannot be dispelled. Dell has proven that conclusively. And that is one of the biggest markets out there for home computing, and potentially a fantastic revenue stream. The eMac is evidence that Apple realizes the potential there (although its telling that it took customers notifying Apple that they wanted in on this "education-only" Mac before Apple made it available to the general public... further evidence that there remains room for much improvement in the way Apple analyzes the market), and great eMac sales stand in testimony to the success of this strategy.

[LethalWolfe]

Originally posted by moose
You think you "blab long"? Sheesh... sorry. Lethal, I'll respond tomorrow. Beddy time.

Hey, no sweat. Rome wasn't built in a day. ;) It better be long though. 'Cause if it's not long I'm gonna feel cheated. :p


Lethal

[moose]

Originally posted by LethalWolfe
Hey, no sweat. Rome wasn't built in a day. ;) It better be long though. 'Cause if it's not long I'm gonna feel cheated. :p


Lethal

I lied. Still awake. :D See above post...

[LethalWolfe]

Originally posted by moose
1. Not to give myself too much credit, but I think I am a pretty savvy consumer and critic of advertising (since thats my biz). I didn't get it at first. I feel a little dumb admitting this, but I actually thought it was an ad for the iPod. By the time the Apple store text popped up, I had already convinced myself of that. It took watching it a second time to "get it." I hope I'm a rare exception, but I fear I am not.

2. People talking about Apple is great. People have been talking about Apple for ages, usually in the same dire tones. IMO, the main reason those tones have mellowed or reversed is because of OS X, and the respect it commands as a trump OS. I think the advertising has played an extremely minor role in legitimizing Apple as a computing alternative to the Windows world. Furthermore, I don't think that the talk you speak of, especially in a Mac or PC online forum, can be taken as an average consumer response. I would wager that the people on PC forums jawing about Macs will have somewhat more general computer savvy than the audience that the ads are targeting. But if all they do is talk, and don't act on that buy impulse then the marketing gears are not meshing.

3. I disagree. The number one goal of Dell, Gateway, and Apple, is to make money. If that means Apple should mine new audiences, and seriously investigate a radical change of strategy (separate software and hardware divisions), then so be it, if for no other reason than to keep Apple viable as the markets ebb. Gradually Apple, and Apple advocates are coming around to the realization that a budget PC is not necessarily a low quality PC, and there is no reason that the stigma cannot be dispelled. Dell has proven that conclusively. And that is one of the biggest markets out there for home computing, and potentially a fantastic revenue stream. The eMac is evidence that Apple realizes the potential there (although its telling that it took customers notifying Apple that they wanted in on this "education-only" Mac before Apple made it available to the general public... further evidence that there remains room for much improvement in the way Apple analyzes the market), and great eMac sales stand in testimony to the success of this strategy.

1. Did you think it was an iPod ad because of the ad or because the new iPods just came out and you expected to see iPod ads? I guess my piont is did you misunderstand the ad because of the ad or because of your preconcieved notion of what the ad was for? When I first saw the ads I didn't know what they were for until the end when the URL came up. I knew of the store and the new iPods but when I hit apple.com to view the ads I was still of mind set, "I wonder what these ads are selling." For the average consumer who doesn't keep tabs on Apple 7 days a week (like many of us do) I don't think they will bring w/them any baggage that could "spoil" the ads for them.

2. I agree.

3. I agree in part. I think the goal is to sell a product (which in turn makes money). For better or for worse Apple sells an image not just a computer. You see it in their marking, programs, industrial design, and web site layout. And the trend for the Apple stores is to put them into upper/upper-middle class areas. The Apple store here in Indianapolis was put into an upper/upper-middle class mall even though it will get much less foot traffic than if it was in put into one of the "middle-class" malls. And I think Apple's main demographic is, to coin a friend's term, the "Sharper Image crowd" (people who have enough money that they can afford form as well as function). Apple's goal is not to sell computers. Apple's goal is to sell Macintosh computers. No one is going to be able to "out Dell" Dell. Gateway tried and they are on the rocks and currently redefining their image by stressing quality computers and distancing themselves from the budget PC prices wars.

OMG I've rambled so long that I don't even remember what my point was. :o Hopefully you get the jist of what I'm saying 'cause I'm not sure if I do anymore...


Lethal

[bertagert]

All of you are wrong!

These ads are working correctly. How do I know this? Well, as the only owner of a new ipod in my circle of friends and family, I have been asked by 5 people, "whats with that new 99 cent song thing"?

Just from that question you can tell two things:

1. They obviously know this is from Apple! If they thought it was from someone else they wouldn't ask the Apple guru in the crowd, they would have ask my IT friend.

2. It wasn't an ipod commercial and they know that. They weren't asking about the ipod, they were asking me about the 99 cent songs.

If this ad campaign wasn't working, my friends, who don't give a hill of beans about computers, wouldn't be asking me questions. They don't ask about the imac, powerbook or anything else. They want to know about the music.

Apple will get a lot of switchers from this if a itunes windows version doesn't come about. Even if it does, Apple will make big money. My friends galk at my ipod. Its only a matter of time before they pick one up and want to get music from the music store.

Apple isn't dumb. These ads will work as planned.