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MacRumors
May 19, 2003, 10:13 AM
MacOSRumors updates (http://www.macosrumors.com/) after a long hiatus, and claims that they have seen early builds of Panther. In the brief report, the claim speed improvements as well as no Piles feature currently available.

In addition, they report that upcoming machines may employ the use of processor names/numbers rather than the "G" (G3, G4) names.



macphisto
May 19, 2003, 10:20 AM
Well, like anything Apple, I highly doubt that Apple would show any new and/or groundbreaking to the media. Look at what happened with the iTunes Music Store. The LA Times leaked it and everyone already knew what was coming. That would take all of the suprise and fun out of it. And we all know how Apple loves to suprise us.

Mal
May 19, 2003, 10:20 AM
Yeah, whatever. I guess that confirms that we're getting piles in Panther, since MacOSRumors said we're not.

JW

NitzerX
May 19, 2003, 10:27 AM
never mind...

cubist
May 19, 2003, 10:27 AM
OK, the body text appeared later. Never mind.

cubist
May 19, 2003, 10:30 AM
It looks like there is an html error in the body text.

dongmin
May 19, 2003, 10:35 AM
There's still a chance it might take a little longer than the PowerMacs and Xserves, but the Powerbook will not only move to PowerPC 970 processors very quickly....it may even employ dual PPC 970 processors as well as an impressively updated system architecture in the 17-inch Powerbook as soon as next January.

That alone is enough to discredit this report. Dual 970 in a Powerbook??? This implies .09-process 970s as a minimum condition, and, from what I've read, Jan. is way too soon for mass production of .09-process 970s.

And no MacOSRumors does not qualify as 'the media,' even if you have a truly low esteem of the media. MacOSRumors, in my book, as one of the worst records of any rumors sites. I cannot remember the last time they've been right in the last two plus years I've been actively following the rumor scene.

iSmell
May 19, 2003, 10:42 AM
That's funny, when I read the headline, I got completely the wrong impression of what was meant by "naming processors."

For a second I was envisioning a utility that would allow you to assign names to each processor on your mac, so if you had a dual, you could call one 'jimmy' and one 'joe-bob' and then when you looked at CPU usage in other utilities, you could see how busy jimmy and joe-bob were. That would make it a lot more personal than just calling them processor 1 and 2.

Oh well, it will probably never happen. It probably wouldn't be too hard to make a Konfabulator widgit that would do something like this though...









kmonkey

DGFan
May 19, 2003, 10:48 AM
So if Piles are out, what are we really to expect in features from Panther? I guess we'll get more insight from WWDC but right now it will be a hard sell.

"No new features but gosh-darn it's faster"

iSmell
May 19, 2003, 11:08 AM
Maybe they'll just call it 10.2.7 and it will be available via software update immediately.
I'd be down with that.
Are people really excited about 10.3? I feel like there was much more excitement this time last year.
Maybe after the WWDC we'll have something to be excited about (apart from 970s - I'm talking software), but I'm not sure what it will be.








bored monkey

Jerry Spoon
May 19, 2003, 11:18 AM
Originally posted by iSmell
Are people really excited about 10.3? I feel like there was much more excitement this time last year.

I'm excited about 10.3, mostly b/c of the possibility of piles and other new quirks that might make my mac experience easier (althought I know many of you said you had no interest in piles).
The reason I was much more interested in 10.2 though is b/c I really needed a speed boost over 10.1. I'll take speed over piles and other nifty features. Those are just icing on the cake.:D

Jerry Spoon
May 19, 2003, 11:23 AM
Originally posted by iSmell
Are people really excited about 10.3? I feel like there was much more excitement this time last year.

I'm excited about 10.3, mostly b/c of the possibility of piles and other new quirks that might make my mac experience easier (althought I know many of you said you had no interest in piles).
The reason I was much more interested in 10.2 though is b/c I really needed a speed boost over 10.1. I'll take speed over piles and other nifty features. Those are just icing on the cake.:D

j33pd0g
May 19, 2003, 11:32 AM
I hope iSmells prediction pans out and 10.2.7 will be available via software update. And hopefully it'll fix my "Pulling the power cord to restart my brand spanking new 1.25 dp power mac because it is too tired to wake up from sleeping".

noverflow
May 19, 2003, 11:44 AM
The best thing that they ever reported was after they released the 733 power mac.

They claimed that a dual 1.oghz powerbook would be on its way in 6-9months...

For anyone new.
MacOSRumors is NOW the worst rumors site in the known internet.

you have a better chance of getting things right buy spinning a selection wheel

LostInAMac
May 19, 2003, 12:07 PM
I'm just sitting here laughing at the anti MacOSRumors, expect to see piles because MacOSRumors say you shouldn't! hehe

boobers
May 19, 2003, 12:12 PM
Originally posted by j33pd0g
I hope iSmells prediction pans out and 10.2.7 will be available via software update. And hopefully it'll fix my "Pulling the power cord to restart my brand spanking new 1.25 dp power mac because it is too tired to wake up from sleeping".
1. don't pull the powercord. It corrupts the HD and you will have severe disk damage. Just hold the power button down for about 5 seconds and she'll rebooty
2. This only confirms my experience with sleep mode..since os7 i have never been able to get it to be stable enough so i don't do it..drive stays spinning and computer stays awake..only thing that gets to shut her eyes is the monitor.

Chef Ramen
May 19, 2003, 12:14 PM
for what its worth, MOSR wasnt always a crock of **** like most believe they are now. remember when the B&W Powermac G3s came out? they had rough sketches up the night before they were out, and i think they had correct specs too maybe.

Kid Red
May 19, 2003, 12:14 PM
Originally posted by DGFan
So if Piles are out, what are we really to expect in features from Panther? I guess we'll get more insight from WWDC but right now it will be a hard sell.

"No new features but gosh-darn it's faster"

If you read the article is says 'plenty of new features' but they can't say what they are until more is made public. I guess an attempt to legitimize their info.

As for piles, it could well be added later. We only know Apple has a patent, no real word if piles will ever make it to X.

arn
May 19, 2003, 12:42 PM
Originally posted by Chef Ramen
for what its worth, MOSR wasnt always a crock of **** like most believe they are now. remember when the B&W Powermac G3s came out? they had rough sketches up the night before they were out, and i think they had correct specs too maybe.

Actually - Appleinsider had sketches of the B&W PowerMac... not MOSR.

That being said... MOSR did used to have some accurate info...

arn

arn
May 19, 2003, 12:43 PM
Originally posted by Kid Red
If you read the article is says 'plenty of new features' but they can't say what they are until more is made public. I guess an attempt to legitimize their info.

As for piles, it could well be added later. We only know Apple has a patent, no real word if piles will ever make it to X.

Actually 2 places claim that Piles will be coming to Mac OS X

MacEdition and eWeek had articles indicating so.

arn

strider42
May 19, 2003, 12:59 PM
Originally posted by Chef Ramen
for what its worth, MOSR wasnt always a crock of **** like most believe they are now. remember when the B&W Powermac G3s came out? they had rough sketches up the night before they were out, and i think they had correct specs too maybe.

MOSR was my introduction to the rumor scene (along with appleinsider). Seemed to be relatively accurate back then, about 4 or 5 years ago. At least there stuff wasn't totally far fetched and didn't seem like rampant speculation. Once I found macrumors though I never really looked back. I check MOSR every now and again just to see what they say, but never really pay that much attention to them or put any stock in what they say.

visor
May 19, 2003, 01:01 PM
Originally posted by iSmell

Are people really excited about 10.3?


Well, i guess there's not to much worth beeing exited about if you don't get new hardware with it.
If they finally have a good unplug and go away support, it will be worth buying though.
I really hate all the problems the system has when you forget to unmount a networkshare before you switch - networks.

j33pd0g
May 19, 2003, 01:03 PM
Originally posted by boobers
1. don't pull the powercord. It corrupts the HD and you will have severe disk damage. Just hold the power button down for about 5 seconds and she'll rebooty
2. This only confirms my experience with sleep mode..since os7 i have never been able to get it to be stable enough so i don't do it..drive stays spinning and computer stays awake..only thing that gets to shut her eyes is the monitor.

1. Thanks for the info. The 5 second (tried a whole minute too) didn't work for me though. I know pulling the plug is bad. So from now on I'll just leave the beast running.

2. My 350 g4 never had this problem.

Jerry Spoon
May 19, 2003, 01:12 PM
Originally posted by Chef Ramen
for what its worth, MOSR wasnt always a crock of **** like most believe they are now.

If this rumor would have come from a rumor site with a better track record, would it have made the main page, or would this still be a page 2 worthy rumor?:confused:
Just wondering.

DGFan
May 19, 2003, 02:04 PM
My earlier comments in this thread notwithstanding....the rumour did not say that piles will not be included in Panther. It said that that last week's builds did not contain them. The latter statement might imply, but certainly does not guarantee, the former.

noverflow
May 19, 2003, 02:04 PM
Originally posted by boobers
1. don't pull the powercord. It corrupts the HD and you will have severe disk damage. Just hold the power button down for about 5 seconds and she'll rebooty
2. This only confirms my experience with sleep mode..since os7 i have never been able to get it to be stable enough so i don't do it..drive stays spinning and computer stays awake..only thing that gets to shut her eyes is the monitor.



reason for your number 2 is you PCI cards... you must have something in there that does not support deep sleep. Check for firmware upgrades from the companys, there may be new ones that support deep sleep

arn
May 19, 2003, 02:12 PM
Originally posted by Jerry Spoon
If this rumor would have come from a rumor site with a better track record, would it have made the main page, or would this still be a page 2 worthy rumor?:confused:
Just wondering.

If it had come from a site which had been more accurate, it probably would have been posted on the main page. However, parts of this do contradict some other rumors out there.

The whole page1/page2 thing is an arbitrary thing, and just a guide based on my personal impression of things. Factors involved include the obvious - what site is posting the info.

Also, other factors include the actual content of the rumor, associated with collaborating information from other sites, as well as any other tidbits I might have heard but hadn't or couldn't publish.

But - it's not entirely an accuracy thing... small tidbits of info - even considered likely accurate, may just show up on Page 2... as it just doesn't seem like it would warrant an entire article.

arn

mcs37
May 19, 2003, 03:17 PM
More details will be published throughout the week on Panther as well as Apple's use of the PowerPC 970. Not only might not the 970 be called a "G5" (Apple may drop the label altogether, calling chips by their names -- new chips in the PPC 750 family from IBM will exceed 1GHz, include 512K-1MB of on-chip L2 cache, and eventually even include a Velocity Engine unit, dropping the Altivec name as Motorola is wiped completely out of Apple's system lineup).....it may show up in Powerbooks a lot sooner than once thought. There's still a chance it might take a little longer than the PowerMacs and Xserves, but the Powerbook will not only move to PowerPC 970 processors very quickly....it may even employ dual PPC 970 processors as well as an impressively updated system architecture in the 17-inch Powerbook as soon as next January.

This is exactly what I was predicting! Apple needs to use that extra area they get inside the 17" PowerBook frame, and no one in the world would have a dual 64-bit processor laptop, let alone a dual 64-bit PowerPC 17" laptop! I was hoping to get a Dual PPC 970 17" PowerBook about 1 year from now when I graduate college. I think my dad would be OK with a $3,300 graduation gift. :D

Boy I hope this is correct! I want this machine! I'm a Cornellian CS major, dammit. After suffering ulcers, insomnia, and perpetual stress, I deserve it!

big
May 19, 2003, 04:01 PM
you'll also desrve a massive battery storage, now try burning a cd with that and you could keep the sucker powered for , say , 30 mins...

(dont get me wrong, it does sound awesome!)

wrc fan
May 19, 2003, 04:15 PM
An install was attempted on a PowerMac 9600/200MP which has ran all the previous versions of Mac OS X...and we were surprised to discover that Panther simply would not install -- the installation CD would have a severe kernel panic on boot every time, whereas there was not a single problem with any other of the seven systems we installed Panther upon.

Further proof they are full of it. 10.2 will not run on a 604e. It has to be upgraded to a G3 or G4 processor (see http://eshop.macsales.com/OSXCenter/XPostFacto/framework.cfm?page=Compatibility.html), so of course Panther won't run on a 604e either.

madamimadam
May 19, 2003, 04:37 PM
I hate to be logical instead of skeptical (although I have no belief for those PPC rumours) but doesn't Apple always send out different builds to different developers with each build being slightly different so that if the build gets leaked they have some ability to try and track down who is leaking.

It is more than likely that, if Piles have been added to 10.3, the build MOS received does not have them.

Zeke
May 19, 2003, 04:48 PM
Originally posted by mcs37
I'm a Cornellian CS major, dammit. After suffering ulcers, insomnia, and perpetual stress, I deserve it!

I'm Cornellian Applied Physics. That's pretty cool to find another macrumors fan.

mustang_dvs
May 19, 2003, 04:49 PM
An install was attempted on a PowerMac 9600/200MP which has ran all the previous versions of Mac OS X...and we were surprised to discover that Panther simply would not install -- the installation CD would have a severe kernel panic on boot every time, whereas there was not a single problem with any other of the seven systems we installed Panther upon.

This is exactly what may be the nail in the coffin for MOSR. For one, I highly doubt that Apple or even an Apple developer under an NDA would be willing to show Panther to anyone with the sterling reputation of MOSR. But, to have us believe that ANYONE from Apple would even consider installing, let alone making an example of installing any version of OS X onto a pre-G3 machine really takes the cake. And you'll never convince me that someone from Apple would risk the wrath of Steve by giving a bungling rumor/fiction site a pre-developer build of Panther.

As it is, MOSR it seems, has not learned the importance of setting their site permissions to ensure that the public can actually see their page, let alone sneak into Cupertino's laboratories. For a site so dependant upon donations, it seems that they do like to make it difficult to give them money.

The death knell for MOSR's lackluster credibility was about six months ago, when they clearly and emphatically stated that there would not be any new iBook revisions for at least two to three months and the next day, Apple revised the iBook. (IIRC)

Personally, I'd put more stock in www.CrazyAppleRumors.com than MOSR (which doesn't even own www.mosr.com anymore).

Spart
May 19, 2003, 05:17 PM
I think MacRumors needs a Page 3 or "wild fantasy" page for idiots like Meader. His rants deserve Page 2 coverage about as much as the quarterly earnings of Frito Lay, Inc. Both are equally irrelevant. In fact, I would venture to say that I would rather see the quarterly earnings of Frito Lay, being as Meader's (MOSR's) crap is a form of anti-info.

Stop linking to the guy's site and let it die. :D

Yarddog
May 19, 2003, 05:19 PM
Look, I read MOSR for the same reason I read the page 2 rumors here. Don't insult my intelligence by posting over and over that MOSR is crap and haven't been right for many moons. I know that, but I choose to read them anyway. I don't buy anything based on their recon, and don't delay buying anything based on their recon. As far as rumor sites, go we all know that MacRumors and Thinksecret are the best. There is no need to keep rehashing the same old tired stuff every time someone posts a quote from MOSR.

That being said, I find a few things wrong with their article posted today (19th). I find it laughable that Apple will start naming their processors by name rather than Gen #. I can't see them calling the new powermacs the Powermac 970 or PM 7450, etc. That is too Dell for me to believe.

Also, I could care less about piles. However, I don't see the lack of piles in the build that MOSR saw (?) as any evidence as to the lack of this feature in 10.3. But it does seem to make it less likely. I remember the "minimize in place" feature was taken out of late Jaguar builds and everyone thought they would make it back. Well they haven't yet.

It is interesting to think about an altivec enabled G3 iBook also. This might also make for an interesting multimedia settop box.

Yes it was AppleInsider that posted the pics of the B&W Powermac the night before they were released.

What every happened to Apple Recon anyway? With Rob whats-his-name. I miss those guys too. I remember he almost died from pancreatitis once and took a long hiatus. He's been off the scene for a long time now. Did he die? Does anyone know? He was a bit hard to read, but seemed to have a handle on some of apple's longer term strategy. Made for some interesting reading.

barkmonster
May 19, 2003, 05:52 PM
I think MacRumors needs a Page 3 or "wild fantasy" page

You don't realise how funny thought sound in the UK, we already have the babelicous wallpaper thread so that's close to page 3 if only there were more b00bies on display ;)

jettredmont
May 19, 2003, 06:35 PM
Originally posted by Yarddog
I find it laughable that Apple will start naming their processors by name rather than Gen #. I can't see them calling the new powermacs the Powermac 970 or PM 7450, etc. That is too Dell for me to believe.

You know, when I read that, I thought more like naming their machines and advertising as such ... you know, like "The New Apple Macintosh 'Hole Ripper'" or, less poetically, "Meet the new Mac: Jack. And cousin, Steve." 'Course, it's only a matter of time before some marketing genius just jumps the shark completely and names the latest "Truck".

I dunno ... sounds just a hair more probable than "PowerMac 7450" to me ...

Jimong5
May 20, 2003, 05:48 PM
I think Apple will take an approach with the PowerMacs similar to the rest of the Line. Its not the iMac G4, Or Power Book G4 (anymore) Its just iMac and Powerbook. And know apple, to describe the 970: " A blazingly Fast Power PC processor with velocity engine" or they may just call it a 970, but i cant see dropping G3/G4...

mcs37
May 21, 2003, 08:00 AM
Originally posted by Zeke
I'm Cornellian Applied Physics. That's pretty cool to find another macrumors fan.

Hey Zeke! Good to see another Cornellian on the site. I'm a rising switcher (err, "mixer" I suppose). I'm on coop with IBM this semester but when I'm done in August and head back to Ithaca, I hope to be armed with a 12" PowerBook Rev B. Hopefully with a PPC 970 processor, but at least a 1 GHz G4 w/ 1 MB of L3 cache.

Go Big Red!

Wonder Boy
May 25, 2003, 12:30 AM
Originally posted by noverflow
The best thing that they ever reported was after they released the 733 power mac.

They claimed that a dual 1.oghz powerbook would be on its way in 6-9months...

For anyone new.
MacOSRumors is NOW the worst rumors site in the known internet.

you have a better chance of getting things right buy spinning a selection wheel

I don't know, macwhispers is pretty bad too...