Any Word On An Xbox360 Revision?

[SamIchi]

Should I wait or just buy now? I know the HD-DVD add on came out recently, but do you think they'll ever include the drive into the console?

[pgc6000]

Depends. If your dieing to game on it, then buy it now. A revision hasn't even been confirmed yet (as far as I know). If you don't feel you need to play any particular game, I don't think it would hurt to wait, if not just to find out if a revision is going to happen or not. I do myself have a 360 and love it, if that helps :p

[cantthinkofone]

There are rumors that the next revision will have built in HD-DVD, HDMI, and the processors will be 65 instead of 95 so they wont run as hot. Microsoft denies all of this of course but its supposed to happen Q1 of this year.

[MacRumorUser]

If they make a revision you can guarantee it wont include the HD-DVD drive anyway. There is simply no reason for them to do so.

Besides there is an article over on ign, where they say their sources are saying the bigger HDD will be released Q3/4 07 and will replace the $100 HDD add-on, and will not be included as standard with the normal premium.

So other than 65nm technology and possibly a harder to flash dvd drive [to cut down piracy] I doubt your going to see any major change.

People expecting massive changes are going to be left sorely dissapointed i would wager.

[wwooden]

If they make a revision you can guarantee it wont include the HD-DVD drive anyway. There is simply no reason for them to do so.

Besides there is an article over on ign, where they say their sources are saying the bigger HDD will be released Q3/4 07 and will replace the $100 HDD add-on, and will not be included as standard with the normal premium.

So other than 65nm technology and possibly a harder to flash dvd drive [to cut down piracy] I doubt your going to see any major change.

People expecting massive changes are going to be left sorely dissapointed i would wager.

Exactly, I don't know why people think Microsoft is going to add all the features into the system. I have no doubts they will update the processor to run cooler, all consoles have done that as technology gets better and easier to produce. I highly doubt they will ever include the HD-DVD into the system as it is not needed to play games, it is only there to play movies.

Either Microsoft will release an HDMI cable for the 360s or it will never get HDMI, they won't create a new system and leave everyone who has one now out in the cold. They have said in many interviews that the 360 can do digital out but they are waiting for the right time and for the market to be right to release the HDMI cable.

I also doubt they will bundle a bigger harddrive with the 360. I think they will just release a larger size to buy.

[islandman]

A revision will be out eventually, but you can play awesome games NOW. Don't wait!

[AvSRoCkCO1067]

Exactly, I don't know why people think Microsoft is going to add all the features into the system. I have no doubts they will update the processor to run cooler, all consoles have done that as technology gets better and easier to produce. I highly doubt they will ever include the HD-DVD into the system as it is not needed to play games, it is only there to play movies.

Either Microsoft will release an HDMI cable for the 360s or it will never get HDMI, they won't create a new system and leave everyone who has one now out in the cold. They have said in many interviews that the 360 can do digital out but they are waiting for the right time and for the market to be right to release the HDMI cable.

I also doubt they will bundle a bigger harddrive with the 360. I think they will just release a larger size to buy.

Exactly - they'll be releasing an entirely new console in 2009 (and thus beginning to market in late 2008/early 2009) so they'll be focusing quite a bit of their energies on that product.

Any revision to XBOX 360 will be price/design-based, like the slim PS2.

[Afro1989]

This better happen soon because I need a reliable 360 console without having to use Nyko Intercoolers. I'm on my fifth 360. :rolleyes:

[MacRumorUser]

This better happen soon because I need a reliable 360 console without having to use Nyko Intercoolers. I'm on my fifth 360. :rolleyes:

How many of those have you run with the Nyko intercoolers ? They may be doing more damage than good. Does your 360 not have any ventilation ? Mine has plenty and has never crapped out on me since launch dec 2005

[greatdevourer]

This better happen soon because I need a reliable 360 console without having to use Nyko Intercoolers. I'm on my fifth 360. :rolleyes: Are you using the Nyko Intercooler yourself? Because they're actually damaging to the unit, screwing around with the PMU

[holamiamigos]

so 299 for current premium and 399 for the new one??

[2nyRiggz]

Those intercooler things are not good for the 360...I would suggest you get rid of it.

The xbox work much harder with those cooler things n the system.



Bless

[TrenchMouth]

many people dont think MS will include an HD-DVD player in whatever revision they make, but I tend to think they might. If they can use a 65nm chip, throw in a larger HD and the HD-DVD player, and still manage to charge less than Sony does for their top of the line, then they would have a ps3 competitor on every level for a lower price. that would be kinda nice.

however, that being said, and getting back to the OP, get one now. It is going to be a while before MS admits that they are working on any of these advances and even longer for them to bring it to market. imagine how long you would have waited for the slim PS2 if someone told you that it might come out, only a year after the original PS2 was released...:rolleyes:

[raggedjimmi]

Wait. Wait with me.

Interestingly, and a little OT, but today's issue of Live had the games review section reinstated. Lost Planet was given 3/5 whereas WarioWare 5/5 :eek: I'm waiting till they get some stonker games. And looking at the upcoming lineup it'd probably be after the big revision.

[pgc6000]

Those intercooler things are not good for the 360...I would suggest you get rid of it.

The xbox work much harder with those cooler things n the system.



Bless
I use one on my 360, is this reason for concern? What exactly does it do thats harmful to the xbox?

[wwooden]

I use one on my 360, is this reason for concern? What exactly does it do thats harmful to the xbox?

Well, some say that since it is using the same power supply as the 360, the 360 itself is not getting all the power it needs all the time and can freeze at random times. I don't have the intercooler so I don't much knowledge on it. My 360 works perfect so I never thought of getting one.

[MacRumorUser]

Wait. Wait with me.

Interestingly, and a little OT, but today's issue of Live had the games review section reinstated. Lost Planet was given 3/5 whereas WarioWare 5/5 :eek: I'm waiting till they get some stonker games. And looking at the upcoming lineup it'd probably be after the big revision.


Having played both games, I certainly wouldnt put any merit in those reviews. :rolleyes:

On every level LP is the better game.

Jimmi the day you get a 360 is the day they invent pigs with wings ;)

[jaw04005]

I wouldn't expect any major revisions until the end of the year towards November. We will find out in May what they are planning for Q4 07.

The current 360 cannot support HDMI because of the limitations of its scaler. This is also the reason Microsoft continues to spread FUD about the unimportance of HDMI. However, there are leaked versions of the HDMI-enabled 360 on the net that Microsoft has confirmed as "real" and for "testing purposes."

There will never be an HDMI cable for any of the current 360s. Why would there be leaked photos of a new 360 if the current 360 will support HDMI with just a cable swap? Shouldn't there be leaked photos of the new cable instead?

Nope, just like the IPTV feature (due to be released later this year) will also not support current retail 360s.

I predict you will see an IPTV-enabled 360 with HDMI and at least a 100GB hard drive by the end of the year available from AT&T in select markets only.

[raggedjimmi]

Having played both games, I certainly wouldnt put any merit in those reviews. :rolleyes:

On every level LP is the better game.

Jimmi the day you get a 360 is the day they invent pigs with wings ;)

I'm just waiting to be bowled over. The original Xbox did, hell the PSP did! Why isn't the 360 :(

I was even bowled over by Apple when I hated their line up! the day the G5 tower was first shown around college I melted. In that instant second I got into Apple products and saw through the myths and lies spread over time.

[SamIchi]

so 299 for current premium and 399 for the new one??

Yea, but Circuit City has a bundle and it's on sale this week $40 off

Xbox 360 Premium
Gears of War
Xbox Live Silver
Wireless Controller
Headset
Play & Charge Kit

Orig. - 529.99
Sale - 489.99
Use the $40 off coupon from CAG = $449.99
Which is a really great deal

Hmm I'll think about it a little bit more. I'm not dying to play any of the games, but we still play halo 2 and we recently sold the old Xbox... sooo I'm thinkin about it.

[pgc6000]

Well, some say that since it is using the same power supply as the 360, the 360 itself is not getting all the power it needs all the time and can freeze at random times. I don't have the intercooler so I don't much knowledge on it. My 360 works perfect so I never thought of getting one.
That may explain why my 360 has frozen twice.

[pcypert]

Get it now and start gaming. Plenty of incredible games out already. Any changes will be minor. I live in a country whose "cool season" goes down to maybe 80 degrees, but regularly stays around 95-105 and have not had heat issues. Just keep the thing out so it can cool itself and things are peachy.

Paul

[MacRumorUser]

I live in a country whose "cool season" goes down to maybe 80 degrees, but regularly stays around 95-105 and have not had heat issues. Just keep the thing out so it can cool itself and things are peachy.

Paul

The only person I know who had 'heat' issues, was someone who kept his 360 sandwiched in-between a dvd player and a sky digibox, in a glass cabinet. Practically no ventilation and the heat of two other machines to contend with.

:rolleyes:

Oh and like others have said. Dont buy those 3rd party coolers, they dont help and they add to the noise. It's just not worth bothering with them.

[raggedjimmi]

I don't know if it was a heat problem but my brother had to replace his 360, though it was very swift. Replaced within the hour after breaking (GameStation=gods). But none I've known have had heat problems. But they've always been on a desk, in an open place (nowhere near something else hot).

[whooleytoo]

Isn't it far too soon in the 360 lifecycle to be releasing a revision? A hard disk upgrade would be nice, but would alienate early adopters.

Incidentally, would HDMI support require a console upgrade, or could it simply be provided with a cable/adaptor from MS?

[SpankyPenzaanz]

They have already done a minor revision with a quieter disc drive in the unit. I could see them including a wireless adapter or finally making that integrated, however wireless is useless for me because of cable internet comes in by the tv and I have my router right there behind the TV and just run a 3foot ethernet cable to it from the xbox.

[MacRumorUser]

Incidentally, would HDMI support require a console upgrade, or could it simply be provided with a cable/adaptor from MS?

MS have repeatedly stated on record, that they could and WILL release a cable when they think the market or the machine really needs it. I guess it would require a firmware update.

Doubters say it would require hardware change. But the same doubters also said the 360 could never do 1080p.

I'd say M$ know more about the system than them, and that a cable will probably bw released sometime this year..

[2nyRiggz]

^Agreed. I don't think MS wants to annoy 10+million people(They are doing this with XP now and I don't think they want to add 10 million more) by upgrading the system with new things the other 360 won't be compat with. I Think the 100gig HDD will be sold seperate and there might be a firmware update...not right now though.




Bless

[benpatient]

the HDMI thing has absolutely NOTHING to do with "doubters" opinions.

The fact of the matter is that there is no digital video output on the current 360. This is a chip at the end of the graphic pipeline, called a RAMDAC, which if you can believe it, takes an image from the video RAM and Converts it from Digital to Analog. This is what sends the signal out to the display device. It's not a matter of a firmware update, and a new cable end. There isn't going to be hdmi on the 360 until they put an hdmi port on the back of the thing and update the graphics subsystem to output digitally.

I've got a graphics card in my PC that has 2 DVI ports, but only 1 of them transmits an analog signal (it only has one RAMDAC, so only one of them will send VGA with an adapter. ) That port also has a DVI TMDS, (which is also what HDMI uses, BTW).

The 360 has the opposite situation. It ONLY has a RAMDAC, and there is, we know (thanks to some people who like taking things apart), that there is no TMDS chip anywhere in the 360.

There is a rumor that the graphics chip has a built-in, on-die TMDS processing unit, but since the pin-out of the 360 connector (when all audio and other signals are accounted for) doesn't have enough room there for HDMI (even without HDCP), it wouldn't matter so much if it did, except that would be one less thing MS has to change in the revision model of the 360.

We will see a 360 revision.

[zero2dash]

the HDMI thing has absolutely NOTHING to do with "doubters" opinions.

The fact of the matter is that there is no digital video output on the current 360.

It doesn't need one.
Is it an HD capable system? Yes.
Is a component video signal capable of carrying an HD signal? Yes.
Case closed. :D

Just because Sony decided to pony up more money and put HDMI in their system doesn't mean it needed it or required it. They're just suckering Ps3 buyers out of more money by exclaiming about "new features".

As for a revision - don't hold your breath. Microsoft already said numerous times now (how long does this "revision" idea have to be rehashed?) that the HDMI port 360 is a devkit prototype with no plans of public release. Read that again please...make a note of it. ;)

Also consider that the 360 is finally turning a profit for Microsoft, therefore, why would they want to double dip and take those (minimal) profits away by chucking more cost into the console, thereby causing them to lose money on the system again? Hello...? Can we say "dumb idea"?

I believe MRU when he says a larger HD won't be a part of the Premium pack and will be sold separately; that makes sense. As it is now - unless you spend too much money on HD movie rentals on XBLM, the 20 gig HD in the system is more than enough. Most people with mp3 collections use the media connect features and stream the music, and the IPTV features have already been stated (by Gates himself) as being a "stream" media type, not using the hard drive for anything whatsoever.

As for the HD-DVD drive being included...again...don't hold your breath. No games will take advantage of it (per Microsoft), and (again) including it would double dip into their profits and turn them into losses.

****

As for the Nyko Intercooler - the report I've heard said that it stole power that was going to the console (say, 230 watts) and sucked up 20 watts (for example), so the console only received 210 watts when it was supposed to get 230 watts. Consoles with the power supply inline Intercooler would fail and sometimes even the psu plug would melt. Apparently they released a new version that plugs into the USB ports, taking power from the USB port and is therefore safer, but...FWIW my console (bought in Nov06) has no heat issues and the DVD drive is very quiet (whereas a lot of launch console owners say theirs is obnoxiously loud). At this point in the game - IMO if you go buy a 360, you'll get a fairly cool running, low noise system since they've worked out the kinks.

If they do release a hardware revision, expect it to only be a cpu die process one (90nm->65nm) and nothing more.

[SpankyPenzaanz]

I think this thread will need to be closed soon because it is about turn into yet another flame war

[MacRumorUser]

I think this thread will need to be closed soon because it is about turn into yet another flame war

Basically this thread is solely about the 360.

Anyone who starts bringing in PS3 or Nintendo is doing so for no other purpose but to start a flame war, if that happens they will be reported and may find themselves with a 'time out' ;) :)

Keep on topic, and keep it friendly peeps please.

[fiercetiger224]

Well, it would be incredibly retardid for Microsoft to release a hardware revision with HDMI. Besides, even if they did do it, it would never have true 1080p output. It'll just be upscaled 720p/1080i.

As for the HD-DVD drive, very pointless. Basically if they did do that, they'd be losing money off each system they sell. Not only that, but everyone would be pissed off that they added that in if they've already got a 360. And they wouldn't be using it for games either...It would also cut into their online movie sales.

If they'd taken a few extra months and worked out the kinks, then they would have been on par with the PS3 in features, and they probably would have also kicked Sony's butt regardless. But now, since they took the risk of just releasing it early without HDMI and HD-DVD, Sony has some advantage in terms of features. Microsoft was under the impression that Sony would have released their system in spring of '06. That never happened, so the risk that they took was probably a wise one, but also problematic if you're looking at it from the perspective of rushing the system out. It's really too late for that now. They've got to stick with what they have.

[MacRumorUser]

Well, it would be incredibly retardid for Microsoft to release a hardware revision with HDMI. Besides, even if they did do it, it would never have true 1080p output. It'll just be upscaled 720p/1080i.

Not quite true actually, lost planet has a largely un-reported 1080p native support (not upscaled)

So there is a good chance a lot more 1080p native games will creep out there. It's just up to the developers to use it.

edit: But for the most part regardless - you'll be happy with the HD results via component and vga anyway.

[Coded-Dude]

where are you getting that info...I have heard much heresay, but no solid proof that the game is native 1080p(and not upscaled)

[MacRumorUser]

where are you getting that info...I have heard much heresay, but no solid proof that the game is native 1080p(and not upscaled)

On the back of the box of the collectors edition USA. Listed HDTV 720p/1080i/1080p

Think that says enough :)

[Coded-Dude]

no, actually that does not confirm native 1080p support, only that it can display in 1080p.
(remember - p stand for "parity" on the 360, not "progressive")

[MacRumorUser]

no, actually that does not confirm native 1080p support, only that it can display in 1080p.
(remember - p stand for "parity" on the 360, not "progressive")

?:confused: Since when ? :confused:

Also they only put the resolutions that are native on the back of the packaging. Hence some titles only listing 480p/720p when in fact they can be upscaled to 1080i or 1080p

If they were listing resolutions that can be upscaled to all 360 packaging would have 1080i/1080p on their too.

[Coded-Dude]

"Having queried the team: upscaled."

http://www.capcom.com/BBS/showthread.php?t=11037

Thats the closest thing I can get as "official" for now........I'll come back in a second with the parity info.

[zero2dash]

Besides, even if they did do it, it would never have true 1080p output. It'll just be upscaled 720p/1080i.

Please don't feed the FUD monster. Thanks. :rolleyes:

[Coded-Dude]

At their pre-TGS press briefing in Tokyo today, Microsoft announced that the Xbox 360 will support 1080p content through a software upgrade. The "p" stands for parity.

Microsoft's announcement -- which effectively parries Sony's bold claims regarding the merits of 1080p high definition content or, as Sony calls it, True HD -- is their latest move seeking to blunt the impact of the oncoming Sony PS3 hype-train. With the True HD cat de-clawed, Microsoft's mantra of choice will appear even more appealing. It's another bullet point taken out of the next-gen console war equation.

Joystiq spoke briefly with Shane Kim, General Manager of Microsoft Game Studios, about their announcements in Tokyo today. First off, Kim clarified that, while the software patch would upscale all content to resolutions as high as 1080p, Microsoft themselves had no plans to produce gaming content taking advantage of this ability. He was similarly convinced that very few other developers would see the value in producing 1080p games, with the singular exception of Sony's first-party studios, eager to validate the value of the capability.

Similar to the way the Xbox 360 upscales original Xbox games from 480p to 720p/1080i, you'll be able to enjoy your existing Xbox 360 games at the new resolution. As if you needed more proof that Microsoft's adoption of high definition HD-DVD is little more than a strategic move to limit Blu-ray's potential sphere of influence, Microsoft's 1080p software upgrade will also remove some of the value of their upcoming HD-DVD add-on by upscaling your existing DVD movies to HD resolutions, including 1080p.

So, Microsoft just announced that the Xbox 360 will play your existing DVDs back in high-definition -- in addition to being able to play back legitimate HD-DVD content if you're interested -- and they're gonna do it in 1080p. In the bullet point war, Sony better hope that extra Blu-ray disc space is worth it; they'll have a chance to prove it at TGS this week.joystiq (http://www.joystiq.com/2006/09/20/tgs-xbox-360-to-add-1080p-support-ps3-to-lose-bullet-point/)

Sounds more like the "software upgrade" will convert 1080i to 1080p

[darkwing]

MS have repeatedly stated on record, that they could and WILL release a cable when they think the market or the machine really needs it. I guess it would require a firmware update.

Doubters say it would require hardware change. But the same doubters also said the 360 could never do 1080p.

I'd say M$ know more about the system than them, and that a cable will probably bw released sometime this year..

I never said the 360 can't do 1080p. Mark my words though.. they can't do HDMI in the current configuration. They're lying. When they release a whole new 360 with an HDMI port or require you to ship your unit in for an upgrade, I'll say I told you so! If I'm wrong you can always make fun of me, but I won't be. :)

[SpankyPenzaanz]

"Begun the flame wars have"

...at least on this thread; hopefully the moderator will put it to an end before it can escalate

[MacRumorUser]

"Begun the flame wars have"

...at least on this thread; hopefully the moderator will put it to an end before it can escalate

Nah this is interesting because it's finding out somthing we didnt know. :)

This isn't flaming in any shape or form. No one is insulting anyone, we are sharing information and it has / is remaining on topic.

joystiq (http://www.joystiq.com/2006/09/20/tgs-xbox-360-to-add-1080p-support-ps3-to-lose-bullet-point/)

Sounds more like the "software upgrade" will convert 1080i to 1080p

So what's the difference between Parity & Progressive. ? :confused: I know I'm being thick, but I really dont know.

Are they calling it parity because its upscaling rather than native, but then even it its still upscaled it's still running in progressive isnt it (regardless if the initial res native res is 720p and its just been upscaled) ? :confused:

I never said the 360 can't do 1080p. Mark my words though.. they can't do HDMI in the current configuration. They're lying. When they release a whole new 360 with an HDMI port or require you to ship your unit in for an upgrade, I'll say I told you so! If I'm wrong you can always make fun of me, but I won't be. :)

I dont mind anyway. My 42" LCD and my HD Projector both only go upto 1080i so it's a non issue for me on either the 360 or the PS3 :)

[SamIchi]

So can I get some more opinions if I should wait or not?

[jono_3]

i saw a picture, possibly on ign - but somewhere of the back of the new rev. 360 with an hdmi port apparently with an 80 gig hd

[Coded-Dude]

Component 1080i is the max that AACS will allow over component, but it will do 1080p all day long! The problem is that HDTVs need new hardware to display it. Component video cables will go to a horizontal resolution of 2160 @ 30 frames per second in very short distances (1 meter or less) but it will send the video through its pipe.
Component is a very robust system with one problem, Hollywood can't control it.

So the answer is "yes" to is it physically possible to do 1080p over component, but protected movie content will still be subjected to 1080i over component (and less with higher restrictions set). Videogame output is still up to whatever the game designers feel obliged to target. Possibly homegrown hd videos burned to disc could still take advantage of 1080p over component, but likely that will be 1080i sourced anyways unless you are using very pro-level videocam equipment.

This is all from AVS

[Coded-Dude]

Nah this is interesting because it's finding out somthing we didnt know. :)

This isn't flaming in any shape or form. No one is insulting anyone, we are sharing information and it has / is remaining on topic.



So what's the difference between Parity & Progressive. ? :confused: I know I'm being thick, but I really dont know.

Are they calling it parity because its upscaling rather than native, but then even it its still upscaled it's still running in progressive isnt it (regardless if the initial res native res is 720p and its just been upscaled) ? :confused:



I dont mind anyway. My 42" LCD and my HD Projector both only go upto 1080i so it's a non issue for me on either the 360 or the PS3 :)

They haven't elaborated too much on that.....which makes me very skeptical.
I am researching it now.

[MacRumorUser]

So can I get some more opinions if I should wait or not?

At the end of the day it's your decission.

No-one here knows ANYTHING for sure about revisions. When / If / What will be released.

I think you have to just look at the software now and decide is there games you want to play now.

If so.. make your decision on that basis.

They haven't elaborated too much on that.....which makes me very skeptical.
I am researching it now.


Yeah that one has me perplexed to say the least :)

[zero2dash]

So can I get some more opinions if I should wait or not?

Buy it now if you're going to buy one. The likelihood of a revision with anything other than a cpu die shrink is little to none. What you can buy now is the same system they'll be selling for the next 3+ years (minus a possible shrunk cpu die size).

i saw a picture, possibly on ign - but somewhere of the back of the new rev. 360 with an hdmi port apparently with an 80 gig hd

I already covered this in my first post, but once again for those of you with the benefit of flash photography:
That is a devkit prototype that has already been confirmed as never seeing the light of day. Engadget got a picture of the unit and everyone and their grandma comes out with headlines saying "360 rev 2!". They will not release that console; at least they say they won't and they'd split the market if they did (as well as piss off everyone who already owns a 360 which is several million people). Why alienate their fanbase like that? They're not going to do it.

[SpankyPenzaanz]

no, actually that does not confirm native 1080p support, only that it can display in 1080p.
(remember - p stand for "parity" on the 360, not "progressive")

by definition doesn't parity mean equal or of comparable strentgh and integrity

by which I think they (MS) were saying "we are making things equal" contextually

[zero2dash]

Why is it so impossible to believe that the system is capable of rendering games at 1080p natively? The HD-DVD add-on does it, the recent system update makes the system itself do it now. Does it really matter either way any way? Sheesh. It's like some elitist cult where "nyaah nyaah my system does this and yours doesn't, I bite my thumb at you sir" :rolleyes:

Go enjoy your games people :D
enough with the bellyaching and one-upsmanship
Repeat after me..."all of the systems will have good games and sell well." :D
who cares what the numbers, sales charts, or BS-riddled press conference speakers say
are the games good? yeah? then stfu and go play some will ya? :p

[raggedjimmi]

Well, it would be incredibly retardid for Microsoft...

As "retardid" as spelling retarded wrong? If you're going to criticise something
at least put some proper effort into it. Right click, turn on the spelling checker in Safari.

I love all this bickering. Seeing this thread is about to be wastelanded... It's great how these Sony people keep bringing up all this 1080p business, as if it's helping the system shift more units than a system running a max of 480p.

Seriously. Some folk need to get a grip and go play Resistance or something.

[Coded-Dude]

MS dismissed 1080p saying it wasn't possible.

Now they say they support it, but we don't know for certain, because they won't elaborate on the process in which they accomplished such a feat.

IGN tried to clear things up, but it is still unclear.
(this is why this subject is so highly debatable)

IGN: Will games begin to be developed with 1080p as the native resolution, or is the 360's new 1080p support an advance in the console's internal scaling abilities?

Microsoft: If developed, the Xbox 360 will support playback of native 1080p games and all existing Xbox 360 titles can be up-scaled to 1080p.

IGN : Does the Xbox 360 have the internal bandwidth between CPUs and graphics processors necessary to move a full 1080p image? There's a big difference between 1080i and the 3GB/s of 1080p.

Microsoft: *updated* Yes, the Xbox 360 has the necessary internal bandwidth between CPUs and graphics processors to move a full 1080p image.

IGN: There are very few 1080p native HDTVs that accept 1080p via Component connections. The signal will only come in as 1080i and be de-interlaced back to 1080p. How is the 360's new 1080p support, in practical application, going to be any different than what was already possible?

Microsoft: We can offer 1080p support through both the VGA connection and the Component connection.

IGN: Could Microsoft theoretically release an HDMI dongle-cable like the various other cables already available for the console? Is the current 360 hardware able to output a digital signal, or is it restricted to analog?

Microsoft: Xbox 360 supports HD Component video output, which is compatible with nearly every HD ready TV on the market today. That's not yet true for HDMI. We are watching the market closely and will continue to evaluate our solution, in the face of consumer demand.

***Updated 9/28, 2:15 PM PST***

IGN: Can the X360 send out a digital signal now, or ever?

Microsoft Xbox 360 currently doesn't include a digital out connection for video. Our platform is flexible enough to allow support of a digital connection in the future should we choose to do so. When the Xbox 360 was being developed HDMI was nascent and with our current connections we support what the overwhelming majority of consumers have available to them. It's important to note that the market penetration of 1080p displays is in the single digits. Regardless, for those early adopters who have displays and projectors that support 1080p over VGA and component we have a solution and it is a free upgrade for them. We are watching the market closely and will continue to evaluate our solution in the face of consumer demand, but have no announcements regarding additional cables or connections.


Microsoft's current response doesn't yet explain how the company can rectify its claimed support of 1080p with the fact that the 360 doesn't support the connection (HDMI) that will actually allow most 1080p HDTVs to display the signal. While the VGA solution may work for a minority of 1080p HDTV owners, we're left wondering if Microsoft is promoting this new 1080p capability primarily to blunt the onslaught of the PlayStation 3, which supports HDMI and 1080p.

Back in the days before the 360 launched, Microsoft stated that HDMI wires for the Xbox 360 would be released "when the market called for them." If the Xbox 360 is really going to be a 1080p machine, we're pretty sure the market is calling for HDMI wires right now. The next question is whether Microsoft will hear it.source (http://gear.ign.com/articles/735/735860p1.html)

[fiercetiger224]

As "retardid" as spelling retarded wrong? If you're going to criticise something
at least put some proper effort into it. Right click, turn on the spelling checker in Safari.

I love all this bickering. Seeing this thread is about to be wastelanded... It's great how these Sony people keep bringing up all this 1080p business, as if it's helping the system shift more units than a system running a max of 480p.

Seriously. Some folk need to get a grip and go play Resistance or something.

Haha it's okay I know how to spell. I just don't give a crap if it's a forum or chatting online. Besides, you spelled "criticise" wrong. :p It's spelled criticize. BUT, it is the British variant of the word, so I'll give you that.

Anyway, back on topic. Regardless of what MS does, we just don't know if it's "true 1080p." It really doesn't matter. All I have to say is, I can definitely tell the difference between 1080i upscaled to 1080p and native 1080p, especially on the Gran Turismo HD demo. Jaggies are nearly non-existent in 1080p, whereas 1080i jaggies are more noticeable. Nevertheless, both still look incredible regardless.

[Coded-Dude]

Agreed...for most, the difference is marginal at best, but for us that would just like to know what's really going on(i.e. the TRUTH) - it is a tad frustrating.
To argue which looks better(on fourms) is a wast of time. IMHO'

But it would be nice to know the real "bottom line" without all the smoke and mirrors
(that goes for ALL companies)

[raggedjimmi]

Hang on, if it's so close that you can't actually tell that it's native (rather than upscaled) 1080p or not then doesn't that just how friggin unimportant it is? Have we just found another moot point, or do racing stripes actually make your car go faster?

and now now fiercetiger224, if you want to get into nitty gritty details - England has been speaking English longer than America has been. Why you changed it, god knows. We were right by just a bit more than you lot ;) It isn't the British variant of it; it's the British original.

[darkwing]

Hang on, if it's so close that you can't actually tell that it's native (rather than upscaled) 1080p or not then doesn't that just how friggin unimportant it is? Have we just found another moot point, or do racing stripes actually make your car go faster?

and now now fiercetiger224, if you want to get into nitty gritty details - England has been speaking English longer than America has been. Why you changed it, god knows. We were right by just a bit more than you lot ;) It isn't the British variant of it; it's the British original.

We kicked your ass, so you should speak it our way. ;)

But in all seriousness... If Square releases Final Fantasy in Japan and the US for NTSC, and then 5 years later finally get around to releasing it in Europe for PAL, is it wrong for the Europeans to call it the "Japanese version/variant?"

Though I agree that it's stupid to try and suggest Britain's English is anything but original in the context of saying things "wrong" by not doing it the American way.

[fiercetiger224]

Hang on, if it's so close that you can't actually tell that it's native (rather than upscaled) 1080p or not then doesn't that just how friggin unimportant it is? Have we just found another moot point, or do racing stripes actually make your car go faster?

and now now fiercetiger224, if you want to get into nitty gritty details - England has been speaking English longer than America has been. Why you changed it, god knows. We were right by just a bit more than you lot ;) It isn't the British variant of it; it's the British original.

Well, actually it is noticeable enough. 1080p looks cleaner too, thanks to it being progressive.

And as for English, Americans are silly and ignorant. They just like to say things the way they want. :D

[fiercetiger224]

We kicked your ass, so you should speak it our way. ;)

But in all seriousness... If Square releases Final Fantasy in Japan and the US for NTSC, and then 5 years later finally get around to releasing it in Europe for PAL, is it wrong for the Europeans to call it the "Japanese version/variant?"

Though I agree that it's stupid to try and suggest Britain's English is anything but original in the context of saying things "wrong" by not doing it the American way.

Haha! Do we have to kick ass again? :rolleyes:

[Coded-Dude]

for most, the difference is marginal at best

That doesn't quite make it a moot point.

We are discussing the Bottom Line capabilities of the hardware, and while MOST won't ever have any clue what we are talking about let alone the experience to notice the difference, that doesn't make it a moot point.

....but opinions do vary


I, personally, would like to know if its native or scaled. You may not care, but thats what these forums are for.

[gkarris]

Well, actually it is noticeable enough. 1080p looks cleaner too, thanks to it being progressive.

And as for English, Americans are silly and ignorant. They just like to say things the way they want. :D

Hey, I speak English really good... (they need to change it to "American") :p

BTW: now would be a good time for an XBox 360 with

HDMI Interface w/cable
Built-In HD DVD drive
120 Gig HD

Call it the Pro HD version for $499. Would be a good move now that Sony has essentially gotten rid of the $499 20Gig PS3 (none around here in Chicago and they're not realeasing it in Europe).