Poll: Do Rumors hurt Apple?

[MacRumors]

Vote: Poll: Do Rumors hurt Apple? (http://www.macpolls.com/?poll_id=197&ref=forums.macrumors.com)

[chmorley]

I actually think they sometimes hurt, sometimes help...

The passion of the Mac community is contagious, an people anticipating what Apple will do next is a big part of that. However, I am probably not the only one waiting until the 970 (or whatever the next chip is) arrives before my next purchase. I think that hurts sales to some degree.

Chris

[arn]

true... though I guess answer what you feel the overall effect is.

arn

[Mudbug]

Originally posted by chmorley
I actually think they sometimes hurt, sometimes help...

The passion of the Mac community is contagious, an people anticipating what Apple will do next is a big part of that. However, I am probably not the only one waiting until the 970 (or whatever the next chip is) arrives before my next purchase. I think that hurts sales to some degree.

Chris

I agree with arn - your short-term purchase decision may be hindered by the upcoming news of (I hope) the 970, but your long term purchasing outlook still is in their favor. I think the rumors help Apple - they at least help me.

[maradong]

No, they neither hurt nor help

[skymaXimus]

I think that they help. They may be hurting current PowerMac sales, but at the same time persuading those who aren't satisfied w/ the current PowerMac line-up to hold off buying a Wintel box until the next processor comes out. If it weren't for rumors you would have no idea what was on the horizon and might have the perception that Apple is smug and just don't care about their processor speeds. I know thats what I thought when I bought my PowerBook and before I stumbled onto this site.

[vniow]

This is an intresting poll and no doubt biased since this is in fact a rumors site..

I'd have to say it depends on the rumors themselves, the 970 rumors are most definately halting Powermac sales because just about anybody who's been reading up on the latest Apple news (rumors or not) has heard something to the effect that this much more powerful chip is going to make its way into the next major Powermac revision so they put off their next big computer purchace until something is released that is more worth its price...

Rumors that other products are going to be updated soon (like the long awaited 15" Powerbook revision) probably hurt sales of that particular model a bit but since those rumors are more under the radar, I suspect that 15" Powerbook sales aren't quite as blah as the Powermac sales.

Other rumors such as new, unnanouced products that may or may not become an actual item for sale sometime in the future are more neutral, such as the rumored $599 G4 something-or-other, those sort of rumors are not going to hurt Apple I don't think because nobody's saving their hard-earned ca$h for it and putting off their next big computer purchace because no one's sure if it even exists or not!
The 970 rumors are a different story however, while there has been no official announcement, its a pretty sure bet that they're going to mak their way into future Macs so I can completely understand why people would hold off making a purchace because of that, but not a $599 G4 computer which may or may not have any basis in reality.

A lot of rumors are based off of plain common sense, the 15" Powerbook was last year's tech as soon as the 12"/17" Powerbooks were released, common sense states that that model is going to be updated soon to get it on par with the other two models soon, nobody knows exactly when, but soon.

Apple's products are typically on a 6-month cycle, not always, but more than not so common sense dictates that when a computer product is growing long in the tooth and in need of an update, maybe its not a good time to buy at the moment unless I really need it, something better is likely to come around soon so my money may be better served spending it later rather than sooner. Most of the update rumors provide an exact date of the release of the update, the possible specs of the updated model and/or whether its going to get a complete redesign or just a spec bunp of sorts, those sort of rumors just confirm what people's common sense tells them, this product is growing long in the tooth, its due for an update to get it up to par with the competition so maybe its a good idea to wait and buy.

So in short, I believe that some rumors hurt Apple in the short run because like with the 970 talk, they're most definately making the current stock of G4s stagnant, but they'll help them in the long run since people are likely to fight each other to be the first in line to buy, same with the 15" Powerbook rumors although to a lesser extent, that one's an intresting one because of the split of opinions on what processor its going to use, some say its a 970, others say its a plain G4 and the updates will be just to put it on the same level of tech as the 12"/17" so its a bit of common sense that its definately going to be updated soon, but nobody's sure what they're going to be so that one and how it either hurts or helps Apple is hard to pin down...
The regular product cycle update rumors are neutral, like I said before, these things go in cycles, updated product is released, sales rise, product hits mid-cycle, sales drop a bit, but remain steady, product reaches end of cycle, sales drop more, updated product is released, sales rise....


Werd.

[arn]

if we're breaking things down...

I'd say I feel that False Rumors may hurt Apple while True Rumors help or are neutral. ( the definition being rumors that turn out to be true or turn out to be false.)

I think many False rumors build up unrealistic hopes and cause a general sense of dissatisfaction.

On the flip side, you have to remember that not only Mac users are reading this site... many potential switchers are following along as well... so for them - instead of buying a new PC, they may be holding out for something they've heard about.

arn

[mymemory]

I think Apple is having a lot of fun with what is going on around here. Rummors are not a real influence on the market. In my country we have about 5 mac stores (in my city) and lots of Macs around and I'm the only one in mac rumors + another guy I know that eventually take a look to the site. If we take that figure we do not represent the 0,00001% of the Mac user population, that mean we have no influence on the market and neither the rumors we share.

Now, rumor sites are a good source for Apple to know what is going on out there.

In conclusion, rumors can be actually bad for Apple but we do not represent a problem for the company any way.

[punter]

I wasn't sure. But now I think they help.

These forums build hype and excitement about apple. They promote the Apple community. Hearing about these new products makes me excited to use macs.

Also I think the value added features of these sites, like community powered tech support, helps apple users, and so helps apple.

[alset]

If, for example, Apple doesn't deliver a 970 at WWDC, it'll hurt them in a bad way. Many Mac users are foaming at the mouth for this one. If it doesn't come throught, Apple will be blasted by people who listened to sites like MacBidouille.

Dan

[gerror]

I think any other computercompany would like to have customers(fans) like Apple has. But on the other hand I think Apple would like to have as much customers as as the pc companies ;)

[ssamani]

Originally posted by arn
if we're breaking things down...

I'd say I feel that False Rumors may hurt Apple while True Rumors help or are neutral. ( the definition being rumors that turn out to be true or turn out to be false.)

I think many False rumors build up unrealistic hopes and cause a general sense of dissatisfaction.

On the flip side, you have to remember that not only Mac users are reading this site... many potential switchers are following along as well... so for them - instead of buying a new PC, they may be holding out for something they've heard about.

arn

Arn,

I'm not sure that I agree with you. False rumors can harm Apple, e.g., the Universal take over really hit Apple's stock price and could have cut both ways with their dealings with other members of the Big Five.

But True rumors can hurt Apple as well through the whole pent up sales issue. Look at the new iPod - they sold 100,000 in the first week - how much pent up demand was that, when they'd sold 700,000 before that, how much inventory build up and quarters with missing revenue. Apple's tackling this by making small upgrades and even product releases throughout the year as the rumor sites used to focus on the conferences. But the rumor sites have caught on to this.

I think Apple needs to make more incremental upgrades, price drops etc, through the course of the year as supplier costs drop as do other PC manufacturers. This would make it non rumor site worthy and would reduce the feeling that any products were "long in the tooth" or now no longer value. I think they are trying to move in this direction but they probably don't get the price breaks they want and they like their fat margins!

So basically I think rumors hurt Apple, but that doesn't stop me checking half a dozen Mac sites a day... :D

[AppleMatt]

My opinion is, the active online Mac rumor community is large, very large infact, however it still represents a small percentage of mac users (although we spend $$$/£££!!!), those that are SO interested in Mac that we have taken steps to find out everything we can.

So many of the rumors will never reach 'normal' people, therefore I think the effect is little.

AppleMatt

[whooleytoo]

Originally posted by arn
if we're breaking things down...

I'd say I feel that False Rumors may hurt Apple while True Rumors help or are neutral. ( the definition being rumors that turn out to be true or turn out to be false.)


(I'm probably saying this to the wrong guy, but.. :)

I think any rumour can be harmful to Apple. If the rumours are false, they can lead to expectations being raised only to be dashed. If the rumours are accurate, they can still deflate the 'hype' once the product arrives. ("1.4, 1.6, 1.8GHz 970's? I knew about them months ago, I was hoping for a surprise!!").

I thought it was funny reading the As the Apple Turns article on 30/05 (euro date) talking about how tired they are of the 970 and moving on to 980 gossip!!

Mike.

[arn]

Originally posted by whooley
I think any rumour can be harmful to Apple. If the rumours are false, they can lead to expectations being raised only to be dashed. If the rumours are accurate, they can still deflate the 'hype' once the product arrives. ("1.4, 1.6, 1.8GHz 970's? I knew about them months ago, I was hoping for a surprise!!").


True... ;) Obviously, my comments may be too generalized.

arn

[kdickey]

Back in 94 or so I was in Jr High and got onto some rumors sites and IRC channels that had rumors. From that day on it made the Mac so much more fun to me. That helped make the Mac Fanatic I am today. With out the rumors sites, who knows.. It is great that there is more to the mac than just computers.. There is a sneaky you never know rumors side to enjoy too. Plus makes for great conversation at work with the PC boyz who do not have anything near as fun to talk about.

[yzedf]

The net effect of the rumors is probably hurting Apples sales. If the 970 does not come to fruition this year... they will be in a world of hurt with the hardcore users that are wired into the scene.

As others mentioned, iPod / PM / PB sales all slacked significantly in expectation of the next big thing. So far, only 1 of the 3 has been updated, with huge sales following. The recent price drop on PB's has me worried that nothing much is going to happen hardware wise at the WWDC. Not that it really should... being for developers and all. PM sales figures suck. Big time. Apple tried to mask this with the "year of the laptop" thing... but the glitter has worn off of that with the non-release of a update to the 15" model PB.

There are even stories of Apple's own salespeople (retail stores) telling customers to wait for the new release "next week" of product XYZ (which should be grounds for firing said salesperson)! The rumor mill is getting bigger than Apple is. I don't think Apple can keep up. The bar is not being raised by Apple anymore, but by the rumors. That is bad. Apple is supposed to be generating the excitement, not someone in France (sorry MacB).

[MorganX]

Given Apple's business model, rumors are inevitable whether they help or not.

It's unfortunate Apple can't provide a technology roadmap.

[jkojima]

I think rumors keep consumer interest up, and for a company like Apple that is heavily focused on marketing to sell its products, that can be a good thing. Rumors also have great effect in the financial market (some positive, some negative), as some people here have pointed out.

I voted "yes, they hurt" however, because if I were a competitor to Apple, I would surely spend a portion of my day surfing these sites. It's free competitive intelligence - sometimes highly accurate, and sometimes from close sources. Though I voted yes, really my vote would be for "sometimes they help, sometimes they hurt" to paraphrase Arn's earlier posting.

Apple has a response to the hurtful rumors though: they have a proficient legal team.

[Laslo Panaflex]

I use a mac at work, but have yet to buy a mac for home. Was going to buy a 1.4 dual Powermac, but saw rumors that a new chip "might" be mentioned or introduced at WWDC, or even possibly, the launch of a new product line. With the price of apple hardware, and considering how weak it is to a PC at the same price, I am holding off for a next generation mac, one that is more comporable to a PC in speed.

So in my case I voted for yes, rumors do hurt apple, but only limited to the number os people that do research to find such rumors.

[macnews]

I am going to disagree with those who have said the 970 rumors can hurt Apple by slowing current Powermac sales. It isn't the rumors, it is the fact the powermac line is greatly in need of a major speed bump!

Case in point, back when Apple introduced new models at the MacWorld's you would get some people that might wait for the newer model line. Apple would cut prices or create bundle deals that really made the decision to wait difficult. At that time, we knew any speed increase wasn't going to be major. You might just end up with a new fancy case (ie. Mirror Door Drive). So some would buy the discounted model because the reduced price outwieghed the smaller speed increase or anyother new widgets that might be included.

There is no question the current line up is hurting in speed. This has to be fixed and this is just one thing that is hurting current powermac sales. The other item that is hurting Apple is their recent introduction cycle and policy for system software. Apple hasn't been quite about 10.3 so many buyers know it will be coming out late summer. BUT you buy a powermac in June or July and you will have to pay $20 minimum or full price for 10.3. I know I am waiting to buy a powermac not just for the 970 but also for 10.3.

Anyway, my point is the 970 rumors don't hurt Apple - they have hurt themselves by not being able to stay in the speed game (and I'm not refering to the Mhz myth - I'm talking about actual speed).

[JeffRutan]

Rumors are to the Apple faithful what the Bible is to Christians - the food that keeps them dedicated, hopeful, happy and full of faith! ;)

[PretendPCuser]

that there are plenty of people who read rumor sites, there are plenty of people who will buy a powerbook because of the price drop who may have never bought a Mac and get onto a rumor site after Apple has released an update and complain that they didn't know that Apple was going to come out with something new, whereas we who read these are all expecting it. We aren't buying, but other people are. Based on the price drop, based on advertising, who knows.

The rumor community is probably not the majority of the Mac community. There are more Macpeeps that don't read rumor sites than those that do (i'm guessing, i don't have numbers). Granted, we that do, tend to throw our opinions far and wide to those that don't.

I'm sure that there are so many different variables regarding rumors and whether it's good for Apple (or any company), I'd only be guessing based on the limited information that i have.

BUT, WtF....i will anyway. SURE! It's gotta helP!! :cool:

[MacFan25]

I think that some rumors do hurt sales. Like the 970 hurting powermac sales. But, mostly, rumors build up anticipation. the people who follow Apple rumors know that they are going to eventually buy something from Apple. Its just a matter of time.

But, I think that the rumors build up anticipation and they make people like Apple, so they will buy stuff from them.

[MorganX]

Originally posted by Laslo Panaflex
I use a mac at work, but have yet to buy a mac for home. Was going to buy a 1.4 dual Powermac, but saw rumors that a new chip "might" be mentioned or introduced at WWDC, or even possibly, the launch of a new product line.

This would not exist if Apple were to build machines to an upgradeable motherboard standard. There's no reason why current owners of expensive PowerMacs can't purchase a 970 mobo to replace their current one.

There is no equivalent to motherboard and case standards that exist in the PC world. You can buy any standard PC and be pretty much assured that if you can't simply pop-in a new CPU, you can replace the motherboard.

Apple doesn't need a clone market for this, they could be the sole provider. However, because so many new Macs are sold to existing owners .... you get the picture.

As long as this exists, Apple will keep it's roadmap relatively secret and rumors will always exist. Some will hurt, some won't.

[wdlove]

I voted that it neither helps nor hurts. I'm not sure if that is my exact feeling though. If it wasn't for the rumors, I would not know what to expect from Apple. It seems that Apple is coming out more frequently with new and innovative products. If they are hurt it may only be in the short term. I'm a loyal Mac owner and will be purchasing within 6 months!

[StuPid QPid]

One of the reasons Apple is so secretive, is to stop any poaching of their ideas before their own product is released. For example: imagine if the plans for the LCD iMac had been leaked a few months before it was ready for release. You'd have had Gateway, Dell etc. all copying the design in next to no time. Fortunately, accurate rumors of Apple designs are virtually not existent. The design department must have very tight security - as with most innovative companies.
Same goes for software. Any new features rumored to be incorporated into Final Cut Pro, for example, will immediately be noted by Adobe (unless they already have inside knowledge? Of course M$ are ready to prey on any new information about OS X...
One area where I think rumors don't really hurt Apple long term is on the hardware front, as in principle they have monopoly. The worst that seems to happen is that people put off buying a few months. But as most people reading the rumor sites are going to buy Apple anyway, this probably doesn't harm them in the long term. In fact the main problem is often Apple underestimating demand when a new product is released. It's proably good that people know something big is coming (i.e 970's). It makes people wait, rather than going and buying a WinTel system...

[JeffRutan]

The reason PowerMac sales are bad has nothing to do with the rumored anticipation of the 970... It has everything to do with the fact that the current PowerMacs are half the performance of PCs at twice the price! This is not so much an issue for the consumer and portable lines (I love my PowerBook and I think all the Apple notebooks are good values). However, the professional market users are more pragmatic. The high end software (other than FCP) is nearly identical between Mac and PC, so it is just plain bad business sense to buy a PowerMac now. Apple will lose the creative professional market entirely if it can't deliver before the end of this year. I don't mind paying a premium for the "BMW" of computers, but I must have BMW performance, not Volkswagen!

I believe (with evidence of the expressed opinions of several creative professionals) that the rumor of an eminent 970 that may bring the PowerMac back to at least comparable real world performance with PCs running Adobe products is the ONLY thing keeping many of them from switching to PC and abandoning the Mac right now.

The evidence that the PowerMac has finally succeeded will be when Steve Job's Pixar engineers start switching from PCs to PowerMacs!

[york2600]

It gives people a hope and a dream that great stuff is going to come from Apple. Sometimes the stuff we hear really does come true, but even if it does it gives everyone hope. There are times as a Mac user (many thanks to Moto) that we need a bit of hope. Hearing about the 970 keeps many die hard Mac fans as die hard Mac fans. I see that as a good things. Take this from a guy that abandoned all hope that Apple was going to come out with anything worth using before OS X came out. I owned a PC for 2 years. Now I'm on a G4. These rumors keep me from buying a 3Ghz P4.

[Laslo Panaflex]

Originally posted by JeffRutan
The reason PowerMac sales are bad has nothing to do with the rumored anticipation of the 970... It has everything to do with the fact that the current PowerMacs are half the performance of PCs at twice the price!

Well, I agree that they are no where close to the power of a PC, but, I have not bought a powermac becuase I want to spend my money on something that will be a good investment, buying a powermac right now when a new generation is imminet would be a bad idea. The currentt powermacs aren't bad if, especially if need the power like me, I use FCP at work on an eMac, boy would I love to run it on a Dual G4. I am waiting, and if there is no mention of a 970 or next gen chip at WWDC, I will proabably buy a 1.4 powermac.

[wdlove]

Originally posted by JeffRutan
The reason PowerMac sales are bad has nothing to do with the rumored anticipation of the 970... It has everything to do with the fact that the current PowerMacs are half the performance of PCs at twice the price! This is not so much an issue for the consumer and portable lines (I love my PowerBook and I think all the Apple notebooks are good values). However, the professional market users are more pragmatic. The high end software (other than FCP) is nearly identical between Mac and PC, so it is just plain bad business sense to buy a PowerMac now. Apple will lose the creative professional market entirely if it can't deliver before the end of this year. I don't mind paying a premium for the "BMW" of computers, but I must have BMW performance, not Volkswagen!

I believe (with evidence of the expressed opinions of several creative professionals) that the rumor of an eminent 970 that may bring the PowerMac back to at least comparable real world performance with PCs running Adobe products is the ONLY thing keeping many of them from switching to PC and abandoning the Mac right now.

The evidence that the PowerMac has finally succeeded will be when Steve Job's Pixar engineers start switching from PCs to PowerMacs!

I also except quality. Never plan to switch to a PC.

It was suprise to me during the segment on Pixar that "60 Minutes" presented. I was expecting to see alot of Power Mac's. When I didn't see any, it was disappointed. I thought that Apple was superior to the PC in the multi media field!

[eric_n_dfw]

Originally posted by MorganX
This would not exist if Apple were to build machines to an upgradeable motherboard standard. There's no reason why current owners of expensive PowerMacs can't purchase a 970 mobo to replace their current one.

There is no equivalent to motherboard and case standards that exist in the PC world. You can buy any standard PC and be pretty much assured that if you can't simply pop-in a new CPU, you can replace the motherboard.

Apple doesn't need a clone market for this, they could be the sole provider. However, because so many new Macs are sold to existing owners .... you get the picture.

As long as this exists, Apple will keep it's roadmap relatively secret and rumors will always exist. Some will hurt, some won't. They kind-of do this now with the X-Serve, not upgrades but you can buy the guts for maintenance.

They're not going to do exactly what you are asking, though, because there's no money in it. That market will always be cut-throat with very low margins. That's not where Apple cares to be and their market share is too low to license other companies to sell Mac motherboards without them costing an arm and a leg to avoid shooting themselves in the foot.

As far as the poll goes, I voted that rumors hurt Apple, but they're big boys and girls and can hold there own I think. I almost voted "niether" as I'm sure that they account for them in their business plans.

[gopher]

Originally posted by JeffRutan
[B]The reason PowerMac sales are bad has nothing to do with the rumored anticipation of the 970... It has everything to do with the fact that the current PowerMacs are half the performance of PCs at twice the price...

And if you believe that, you are a troll.

Take a look at this page:

http://forgetcomputers.com/~jdroz/09.html

Half the performance at twice the price? I don't think so.

There are poorly ported applications, and then there are users
who have spent no time with the Mac platform just learning how to use it. Once they learn, they find performance for all applications is comparable at the same price if not faster, and their machines last longer meaning they spend less money keeping their machines updated. Explorer on the Mac is not the fastest web browser by any stretch of the imagination. We have all these web browsers that are faster:

Safari, Omniweb, Camino, Netscape, iCab, Mozilla, and Phoenix.

And if you are going to say Mac OS X is slow, XP has the same performance bottlenecks on older PCs.

Visit http://www.macmaps.com/Macosxspeed.html if you want to optimize Mac OS X. Plus multithreading of Mac OS X means you can do many more than two things at once with Mac OS X without slowdown. At a certain point multitasking of Mac OS X will mean you can do so many things at once you save time, which means your work is faster. The above quoted argument is so old it may have been true back in the days of MS-DOS, but it certainly isn't true today.

[MorganX]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by StuPid QPid
[B]One of the reasons Apple is so secretive, is to stop any poaching of their ideas before their own product is released. For example: imagine if the plans for the LCD iMac had been leaked a few months before it was ready for release. You'd have had Gateway, Dell etc. all copying the design in next to no time.<<

I think this is a silly myth. The IBM Net Vista came before the iMac and I liked it's design just as much as my 17" iMac. I actually liked the overall look a little better. Unfortunately it was underpowered in the non-upgradeable graphics department and low-profile PCI peripherals never took off. This left it overpriced. They killed the model due to lack of sales. Lack of upgradeability doesn't fly well in the PC world since Trash-80s (They still played a hell of a game of Trek). If I could find one cheap enought I'd probably buy one, but they still sell used/refurbished for $1600 (PIII 800).

Then came iMac. I bought one after the performance became acceptable. Does anyone go around saying the iMac was stolen from IBM, no. But there's a good chance it did provide a design starting point. Net Vista combined with Pixar's infamous Lamp.

People don't really steal that much. It's not logistically possible. They may preannounce to win mindshare, others release unfinished technology before they're finished just to say we did it first (cough, cough). If Apple releases a product, and competitors release weeks or a couple months later, believe they were already working on it. No one can go from concept to market that fast. No one.

I guess everyon stole from Univac, or that 4-bit kit thingy.

Apple's computer resembles IBM's NetVista X series the most out of existing competitors. This also would not be the first time Apple followed an IBM design innovation. IBM was the first major manufacturer to come out with notebooks with titanium-reinforced cases in April 2000. Apple then followed with a flashier use of the metal with the Titanium PowerBook in January 2001 that came in a shiny steel all-titanium case.

C|Net January 2002

[-hh]

Originally posted by chmorley
I actually think they sometimes hurt, sometimes help...

The passion of the Mac community is contagious, an people anticipating what Apple will do next is a big part of that. However, I am probably not the only one waiting until the 970 (or whatever the next chip is) arrives before my next purchase. I think that hurts sales to some degree.

Chris

I chose "help" because I'm assuming that we're being reasonably reponsible in the rumors.

As such, the net effect of the rumoring itself nets out to effectively neutral - - today's deferred purchase is tomorrow's sale - - so you have to then ask what effect the contagious commnity enthusiasm has, and IMO, this can only be good.

For example, a fence sitter who wouldn't have bought an iPod, but was convinced to do so because of enthusiasm expressed here is the *bonus* sale that Apple wouldn't have otherwise gotten. "Happy consumer testimonials" are one of the most powerful forms of advertising, and it doesn't cost Apple a dime.

-hh

[Centris 650]

I voted "It Hurts Apple" for the simple fact that I was about to purchase a new mac this past spring with the new iMac revision but now I'm waiting to see what happens with the 970.

Of course they are going to get my money either way this is just going to be later rather than sooner.

<sidenote> As I was typing this I realized that if I had bought that new iMac in the spring and the 970's were released this summer, I'd be pretty mad. So...maybe it's a little bit of both?

[coolfactor]

I voted that rumors do in fact hurt Apple. But I'm fascinated by the excitement in the Mac community. If Apple opened up the possibility of using ideas submitted from (anonymous) individuals in the community, I think we would accelerate past the PC world at warpspeed. Unfortunately, too many people would expect some personal compensation for their ideas. It would get way out of hand. In this respect, I think rumors sites do serve to provide Apple with a means of gathering ideas in an informal fashion and avoid the whole compensation issue. All people can say is "oh, I thought of that a few months ago".

Anybody care to create the site ideasforapple.com?

EDIT:
I wanted to clarify that my comments regarding Apple using ideas from users is in regards to hardware design, not software. They already have a top-knotch feedback system for their software.

[gopher]

Originally posted by MorganX
[QUOTE]Originally posted by StuPid QPid
[B]One of the reasons Apple is so secretive, is to stop any poaching of their ideas before their own product is released. For example: imagine if the plans for the LCD iMac had been leaked a few months before it was ready for release. You'd have had Gateway, Dell etc. all copying the design in next to no time.<<

I think this is a silly myth. The IBM Net Vista came before the iMac and I liked it's design just as much as my 17" iMac. I actually liked the overall look a little better. Unfortunately it was underpowered in the non-upgradeable graphics department and low-profile PCI peripherals never took off. This left it overpriced. They killed the model due to lack of sales. Lack of upgradeability doesn't fly well in the PC world since Trash-80s (They still played a hell of a game of Trek). If I could find one cheap enought I'd probably buy one, but they still sell used/refurbished for $1600 (PIII 800).

Then came iMac. I bought one after the performance became acceptable. Does anyone go around saying the iMac was stolen from IBM, no. But there's a good chance it did provide a design starting point. Net Vista combined with Pixar's infamous Lamp.

People don't really steal that much. It's not logistically possible. They may preannounce to win mindshare, others release unfinished technology before they're finished just to say we did it first (cough, cough). If Apple releases a product, and competitors release weeks or a couple months later, believe they were already working on it. No one can go from concept to market that fast. No one.

I guess everyon stole from Univac, or that 4-bit kit thingy.

Apple's computer resembles IBM's NetVista X series the most out of existing competitors. This also would not be the first time Apple followed an IBM design innovation. IBM was the first major manufacturer to come out with notebooks with titanium-reinforced cases in April 2000. Apple then followed with a flashier use of the metal with the Titanium PowerBook in January 2001 that came in a shiny steel all-titanium case.

C|Net January 2002


Netvista was still much later than Apple's 20th anniversary Mac, or the prototype http://www.theapplecollection.com/design/macproto/small/pomona2.jpg Pomona which Apple never released.

[MorganX]

Originally posted by gopher
Netvista was still much later than Apple's 20th anniversary Mac, or the prototype http://www.theapplecollection.com/design/macproto/small/pomona2.jpg Pomona which Apple never released.

The box is bigger than the screen. The innovation in NetVisa/iMac is the unobtrusive invisible desktop unit and the mobile flatscreen.

The anniversary mac was just a mac with an LCD.

[-hh]

Originally posted by Centris 650
I voted "It Hurts Apple" for the simple fact that I was about to purchase a new mac this past spring with the new iMac revision but now I'm waiting to see what happens with the 970.

Of course they are going to get my money either way this is just going to be later rather than sooner.


And if you end up buying a "bigger" 970 system instead of just the iMac, then its a net plus for Apple... :D


-hh