View Full Version : PPC 970 as Upgrade chips?
Jun 12, 2003, 03:19 AM
So let's say the PPC 970 does make it into the Power Mac line.
Do you think that the processor upgrade companys will be able to fit the chip into the quicksilver line?
Just wondering what other people thought about it.
Jun 12, 2003, 03:41 AM
The new 970 is a big (in terms of hype) chip.
And because it is big, everything around it would be presumed to be big.
If they just fit the new (or big :D) into an old (or small :D) computer, it wouldn't be as amazing.
That's just my expected outcome, I have no idea if they will revamp or have an option for an upgrade on existing PowerMacs, from a marketing view, probably not.
I have said big so many times you'd think I'm compensating for something.
Jun 12, 2003, 04:40 AM
You can have g4 upgrades in 601 powermacs, so maybe
Jun 12, 2003, 05:44 AM
Assuming a miracle of engineering is not forthcoming, in short - no.
Jun 12, 2003, 07:21 AM
maybe but it wouldnt not be able to plug into the same place of the g4, the pins are different
Jun 12, 2003, 07:34 AM
Originally posted by Eple
You can have g4 upgrades in 601 powermacs, so maybe
While I wont come right out with a flat out 'no'. One thing to keep in mind.
IIRC - all the PPC cpus up till this point (not 100% sure of the 601) have had one thing in common. The system bus - in laymens terms (since I am one) it is used for different areas of the computer (northbridge, southbridge, memory) to communicate with each other (and the CPU). The 970 will break that (and this IS a good thing) the MPX bus while at one time might have been considered 'fast' has NOT matured / evolved. This is why we are stuck using DDR ram and all the while the CPU itself can't take 'real' advantage of its benefits. The bus speed on the new PPC is (and again I'm no expert here) 800Mhz. Todays best G4 is running at what 166Mhz?
Think of it this way...
If you have a home with a 1/2 inch connection to city water. You then add on another level to the home with a 2nd bathroom and find you don't have enough water presure. So you go around and change all the pipes in the home from 1/2 inch to 2 inch...Problem is, it doesn't do you a bit of good since the feed from the street is still stuck at 1/2 inch.
Okay, not the best way to explain it but it'll do till someone else chimes in.... :D
Jun 12, 2003, 07:54 AM
I'd guess that any future Moto Gx (if they ever exist) will be used as an upgrade. And/or IBMs newer Gobi CPUs (or whatever else they come up with). I'm excited about those because, if the rumors are true, they will have Altivec. Though a G3 with Altivec isn't exactly a G4, they'd make iBooks MUCH faster, and probably still run cooler with less power. And hopefully cheaper.
Don't have a clue whether or not you can upgrade from G3/4 to a 970. Least not yet. Be cool if you could.
Think about it though, a 970 on the desk, a 750GX on the go. :drools:
Jun 12, 2003, 07:57 AM
Initially the upgrade market willnot have 970s. Some serious engineering must be done to get the chip to work. **IF** it can be wedged into a PM, then it will be for minimal performance gain, The current Mac mobo is not designed for the needs of the chip. I sus0ect the R&D for getting it to work would be high for the little -0 if any gain in performance.
Jun 12, 2003, 08:40 AM
The bus would be the stumbling block, the 601 to G3s used the 60x bus, and the G4 introduced the MPX bus -- but could also be used on the 60x bus. So there was some method to graft a fast chip onto a slooow bus.
The PPC 970 leaves these legacy buses behind, exactly what bus it is really hasn't been disclosed. But there is a good possibility that it'll need a bridge chip to work on the old bus.
Now, whether someone will make a chip is the question...
A bunch of upgrade companies could get together to do it, or a telecom could end up doing it.
Sort of comes down to, "Yes it can be done, but it'll only be done if somebody thinks they can make money or a market" -- this was the problem that nailed Apple when they included a new PDS slot in a specific machine that could be used for upgrades, and nobody made an upgrade for "that" machine -- and users demanded an upgrade via the courts.
Jun 12, 2003, 10:52 AM
I agree with the bus speed problems. But considering I have an 867mhz and the upgrade market is selling duel 1.33 ghz G4's, the bus does have room to grow.
I wonder, if the PPC 970 chips are cheap and could be wedged into the quicksilvers maybe they would sell one chip to max out the computer?
A phatty PPC 970 to max out all the old G4's at a reasonable price.
I can dream, but I'm not going to hold my breath.
Jun 17, 2003, 07:44 PM
the upgrade manufacturs will always find a way they will buy the first machines expect upgrades by summer.
they will bypass the slow bus by adding 2 slots for ddr400 directly to the cpu heatsink fan, this will disable your slower memory or make t a fast ram disk instead. just look at all the upgrades for almost 10 year old machines now where there is a will there is away.
Apple of course has arrangements with IBM ro keep the top chips in apple court first and they will scale fast.
t 10000 chips and only the slowest ones at that time after apple and ibm orders are filled first.
1.4 GHZ 970 upgrade for $499 for AGP powermac g4. $599 for BW and Biege G3 and 7300-9600 powermacs. ddr400 ram not included.
since the IBM 970 1.4GHZ is now only $185 in quanity it will probably be less then a $100 by then. giving sonnet and powerlogix huge profits.