Louis Theroux: The Most Hated Family In America

[BoyBach]

"God is your enemy." "You will eat your babies." "God hates fags." These are just a few of the extremist views held by the Westboro Baptist Church of Topeka, Kansas. Louis Theroux spent three weeks in their company, locking horns with its leaders and talking to the younger members of the family to find out if there's any chance of them escaping the influence of their elders.

- A link to BBC 2 with four short clips (http://www.bbc.co.uk/bbctwo/noise/?id=louis_theroux) from the documentary that may be not be safe for work.


Did anybody watch this on BBC 2 last night?

It was a Louis Theroux documentary about an extremist religious sect in the USA, founded and lead by Fred Phelps (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Phelps), that pickets the funerals of US soldiers killed in Iraq and Afghanistan with placards reading "GOD HATES FAGS" & "GOD HATES AMERICA", amongst others. They were also anti-semitic - " the Jew church" - plus anti- any Christian church/religion that wasn't their own take on the Scripture. And the whole time with their young children in tow.

It made for compelling but disturbing viewing.

Like my brother said: "You feel sorry for the children."

[Blue Velvet]

Was wondering whether someone would post about this. I didn't 'cos I don't have a telly, so I haven't seen it but would have liked to.

[Jaffa Cake]

I missed it, unfortunately – my work chums have been on about it this morning, though. It sounds quite horrific – the sort of thing that's engrossing but quite disturbing to watch.

I think it's being repeated a bit later in the week so I'll see if I can catch it then.

[Queso]

I'm surprised you didn't know about them already. The Phelps family are often discussed on this board. Their reaction to Hurricane Katrina was particularly endearing. Something about "rotting corpses floating in fag-semen stained waters".

Link (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=254603)
Link (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=257359)
Link (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=240437)

Yeah, don't you just want to hug them?

[Thomas Veil]

Ah, the lunatics from Westboro Baptist Church. How well we know them.

There was a funeral here in Ohio last week for a soldier killed in Iraq. Phelps and his crew of gay-haters were here to protest. Fortunately, we now have a law that keeps these cuckoos further away from funeral services.

But what was nice to read was that there was also a group at the burial called the Patriot Guard Riders (http://www.patriotguard.org/). They're a motorcycle group that also goes to military funerals and surrounds the family of the deceased with giant American flags to as to obscure the sight of the Westboro crazies.

You gotta love that! :D

[Father Jack]

Ah, the lunatics from Westboro Baptist Church. How well we know them.

There was a funeral here in Ohio last week for a soldier killed in Iraq. Phelps and his crew of gay-haters were here to protest. Fortunately, we now have a law that keeps these cuckoos further away from funeral services.

But what was nice to read was that there was also a group at the burial called the Patriot Guard Riders (http://www.patriotguard.org/). They're a motorcycle group that also goes to military funerals and surrounds the family of the deceased with giant American flags to as to obscure the sight of the Westboro crazies.

You gotta love that! :D

I watched a documentary on TV last night about them.

People have the cheek to say the Irish are stupid ..... What sort of feck wits are they? :confused:

Tossers the lot of them.

FJ

[dornoforpyros]

Why do people keep letting this nutters on TV? I mean even doing a "look at this horrible people" piece is still giving them their 15 minutes. These people are no better than that troll Anne Coulter, but at least she's making money off her BS attention grabs.

[BoyBach]

Why do people keep letting this nutters on TV? I mean even doing a "look at this horrible people" piece is still giving them their 15 minutes. These people are no better than that troll Anne Coulter, but at least she's making money off her BS attention grabs.


I, for one, am glad that people like Louis Theroux makes programmes about groups like these and exposes them for what they really are.


From an interview with Louis Theroux:

You say that in America the media tries not to give them the coverage, but aren't you just giving them a voice over here?

Viewers will have to see the show and judge for themselves how these people come across. Certainly this group view it as a platform and that's why they agreed to do the show. But I think what we did was something more than that. What we did, I think, was try to understand how a group like this operates; its group psychology, the way the beliefs are passed down the family, and how those beliefs can be held by very urbane, intelligent, professional people. So when you cover a group like this, you take a gamble that you will be able to get under its skin and reveal something about it, and something about us all as people, and I think we managed to do that.

...

What else do you tackle in the film?

What we're trying to do in the documentary is look at an activity that is so antisocial, so strange, so futile and at its worst, so cruel, and we're saying "Why? Why do that?", especially when you seem to be, for the most part, kind and sensitive people. We're exploring what is cruelty, trying to explain how something that really does very often just amount to cruelty could be perpetuated and passed down in a family. Why would nice people do such horrible things?

Do you think you've come to an answer?

Yes, I think we do. I think that the pastor is not a very nice person. I think he's an angry person who's twisted the Bible and picked and chosen verses that support his anger, that sort of justify his anger, and he's instilled that in his children and they've passed it on to their children. Although the second and third generation are by and large quite nice people from what I saw, they still live under the influence of their Gramps.

It shows you what strange avenues the religious impulse can take you down. I think another part of the answer is that parts of the Christian Bible are pretty weird. There's a lot of weird stuff in there and when you take that and you add this angry, domineering kind of a father figure, which is Gramps, and you add that he has sort of separated them off from other people, other families and driven them to achieve a lot, and he was kind of a charismatic guy, and still is up to a point. He was a very verbal, very persuasive, an extremely compelling speaker. All these things added together combined to make a powerful influence.

- BBC Interview (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/6507971.stm)

[Thomas Veil]

..... What sort of feck wits are they? :confused:...Well, it's a relatively small church, and many of the members are from the same family. So I suspect inbreeding. :D

[iBlue]

I saw it. Utterly horrifying.

What I don't understand is that with all the other nutters in the US why those lot aren't beaten within an inch of their miserable little hateful lives. I would not be surprised for a second if they were victims of a drive-by... and I can't say I'd feel a whole lot of pity for it either. I'd like to see them preach that venom in someplace like Los Angeles. ;) I don't know how people can turn so rotten, I can't even begin to understand.

[BoyBach]

I don't know how people can turn so rotten, I can't even begin to understand.


I think that that's down to the power and control that Gramps exerts over the 'family'.

Generations of preaching hatred until it becomes 'normal' behaviour and a sort of defence mechanism against the hostility that the rest of the world shows towards them. It has become a vicious circle of hate begets hate begets hate.

And that's the sad part. (The family's children who have only known hostility and hatred aimed towards others and then back at themselves.)

[princealfie]

I thought the most hated family in America was the Bush dynasty??? :eek: :eek: :mad: :mad:

[BoyBach]

I thought the most hated family in America was the Bush dynasty??? :eek: :eek: :mad: :mad:


When I read the title of the programme in the TV guide of the newspaper that's exactly who I thought it was about!

[TequilaBoobs]

i hate that man.

[princealfie]

i hate that man.

Yeah, how do you plan to stick it to the man? :cool:

[SMM]

I doubt if there are any scarier people, than the various Christian sects who have embraced fanaticism. This jerk-weed is no whackier than countless others running around loose. He is just stupid enough to draw attention to himself.

Utah has many morman groups practicing polygamy and inbreeding of minor children. Officially, it is against the law. But, the state is unofficially run by the church and they turn a blind eye to it. I seem to recall reading there has not been a single conviction, even though those engaged in it, freely admit their crime. However, get busted with a joint in SLC and you are lucky not to get the firing squad.

How many Christian cults have come to public attention over the past 20 years? Jim Jones, Jim and Tammy, Moonies, Branch Divinians, KKK, Skinheads, and the list goes on. I read a published FBI report which suggested there are upwards of 100,000 individuals associated with these various types of groups. I also suspect the quacks on the Trinity Broadcast Network, Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson, etc., have one foot out the door too.

[FleurDuMal]

I wasn't in last night so I missed it. But I really want to see it. You simply can't beat Louis Theroux (sp?!) for this type of thing.

[TequilaBoobs]

Yeah, how do you plan to stick it to the man? :cool:

i will hire a mercenary to take him out. maybe ill get someone big, like rosie o'donnell, to beat the living sugar out of him.
:D

[princealfie]

I doubt if there are any scarier people, than the various Christian sects who have embraced fanaticism. This jerk-weed is no whackier than countless others running around loose. He is just stupid enough to draw attention to himself.

Utah has many morman groups practicing polygamy and inbreeding of minor children. Officially, it is against the law. But, the state is unofficially run by the church and they turn a blind eye to it. I seem to recall reading there has not been a single conviction, even though those engaged in it, freely admit their crime. However, get busted with a joint in SLC and you are lucky not to get the firing squad.

How many Christian cults have come to public attention over the past 20 years? Jim Jones, Jim and Tammy, Moonies, Branch Divinians, KKK, Skinheads, and the list goes on. I read a published FBI report which suggested there are upwards of 100,000 individuals associated with these various types of groups. I also suspect the quacks on the Trinity Broadcast Network, Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson, etc., have one foot out the door too.

That's funny. I'm LDS and thanks for dissing my beliefs :p :p :p :p

It's strange but I always love people who make blanket statements. Keeps me on my toes :rolleyes:

[aquajet]

When I read the title of the programme in the TV guide of the newspaper that's exactly who I thought it was about!

When I saw the thread title, I immediately thought it would be about the Phelps clan.

As crazy and despicable as they are, I still find them immensely fascinating. The fact that Fred himself was a civil rights attorney for many years drips of irony. I don't mind hearing about their absurdities every now and again.

Apparently, there are several children from the rotted loins of Fred and his witch that have completely disassociated themselves from the family. I can't imagine what these poor folks have had to deal with and I wouldn't be surprised if some have gone as far as to legally change their names.

[QuarterSwede]

I thought the most hated family in America was the Bush dynasty??? :eek: :eek: :mad: :mad:

OT: I thought he was talking about either the Kennedy's or the Clinton's. LOL

But yeah, after reading about Phelps I would say most people would hate him even Christians (as they definitely don't subscribe to Christ's teachings).

[princealfie]

Hilarious but uh, in Massachusetts doesn't everyone worship the Kennedys like demigods?

[Father Jack]

I thought the most hated family in America was the Bush dynasty??? :eek: :eek: :mad: :mad:
Let's call it a draw :cool:

FJ

[SMM]

That's funny. I'm LDS and thanks for dissing my beliefs :p :p :p :p

It's strange but I always love people who make blanket statements. Keeps me on my toes :rolleyes:

I did not 'dis' your beliefs. And, I notice you did not actually take exception with the facts in my post. It is you who have taken a 'blanket statement' position. What I posted was based on a two-year relationship I had developing an ERP system with a SLC company. The owner is an LDS bishop, and still a friend, as are many of the guys I worked with. The fringe groups were a major news story when I was in SLC, and what I posted was straight from the news coverage. I also discussed this at great length with my friends.

There is nothing funny about it. It exists, is pitiful and a blight on the LDS church.

[edesignuk]

I too sat there stunned, not only by their views, but by the very fact that they've lasted so long. In a country where patriotism is everything (ok, perhaps a generalisation, but whatever :p) I'd have thought that walking around with the American flag tied to your feet while you stomp all over it, while flying an upside down American flag on a pole in one hand, and a "God hates America" sign in the other would be pretty much guaranteed suicide.

Where's a gun wielding murderous maniac when you need one eh?

[Thomas Veil]

Where's a gun wielding murderous maniac when you need one eh?Well let's not bring Cheney into this...

[princealfie]

I too sat there stunned, not only by their views, but by the very fact that they've lasted so long. In a country where patriotism is everything (ok, perhaps a generalisation, but whatever :p) I'd have thought that walking around with the American flag tied to your feet while you stomp all over it, while flying an upside down American flag on a pole in one hand, and a "God hates America" sign in the other would be pretty much guaranteed suicide.

Where's a gun wielding murderous maniac when you need one eh?

I think that there is no difference between patriotism and jingoism at all. On a practical level.

[zimv20]

I think that there is no difference between patriotism and jingoism at all. On a practical level.

eh? i think there's a huge difference.

my patriotic duties are to:
1. be informed
2. vote
3. adhere to the principles on which this country was formed*

* which i believe are freedom of expression, freedom to pursue my goals, open gov't, a press and populace that watches and challenges gov't and changes it when need be, and leaving others the **** alone while they leave me the **** alone

imho, jingoists, above all, don't get the "changing gov't" part nor the "leaving others the **** alone" part.

[princealfie]

eh? i think there's a huge difference.

my patriotic duties are to:
1. be informed
2. vote
3. adhere to the principles on which this country was formed*

* which i believe are freedom of expression, freedom to pursue my goals, open gov't, a press and populace that watches and challenges gov't and changes it when need be, and leaving others the **** alone while they leave me the **** alone

imho, jingoists, above all, don't get the "changing gov't" part nor the "leaving others the **** alone" part.

That's hilarious. Most of the people who claim to be patriotic aren't

1. informed but deceived by the media
2. vote for the wrong candidates (or any fool in office)
3. can't even recite the Constitution, structure of Congress, or even identify Louisana on a map.

Ouch. Hmm... poor Valley Girls eh?

[iBlue]

That's hilarious. Most of the people who claim to be patriotic aren't

1. informed but deceived by the media
2. vote for the wrong candidates (or any fool in office)
3. can't even recite the Constitution, structure of Congress, or even identify Louisana on a map.

Ouch. Hmm... poor Valley Girls eh?

What's this got to do with those absolute nutters spouting their venomous and depraved "religious" message? Did you even see the show?

There is quite a difference between being patriotic and respecting your country and being a jingoist or an outright criminal, which is what I think you were implying earlier.

A little jingoism might not be so out of order in this instance however. Bring it. :p

[solvs]

why those lot aren't beaten within an inch of their miserable little hateful lives.

Actually they are. By Fred himself. He's been arrested several times for abusing his wife, children, grandchildren... but he always finds a way to get off (that wasn't a pun, don't be so dirty). The Church is ridiculously small, and everything that is wrong with fundamental religious beliefs and believers. Thankfully, by using their free speech, they only point out their idiocy, and thankfully we can use our free speech to speak out against them.

But no, I don't hate them... I pity them.

[Jaffa Cake]

I wasn't in last night so I missed it. But I really want to see it...A quick heads up – if any fellow UKers are in the same position as me and FleurDuMal and missed the show but would like to have seen it, it's being repeated on BBC2 in just over ten minutes time.

I'm like the Radio Times, me. :)

[psychofreak]

Where's a gun wielding murderous maniac when you need one eh?

I'm busy right now...

[Desertrat]

Thinking Phelps and his crowd have anything to do with religion is about like saying Pol Pot was heavy into birth control.

I don't hate this clown, but I'd probably contribute to a fund to give him a gift certificate.

Either a lobotomy or a home visit from Dr. Kevorkian...

'Rat

[Zwhaler]

Those people are so ****ed up. I hope that they would have a gay son then they would realize how sicko they are.

[psychofreak]

It is on the internet and I will put up the link if it is not against site policy...please tell me, as I think it would be good for those who want to watch, but missed the show...

[skunk]

I'm like the Radio Times, me. :)Printed on really crap paper? :confused:

[psychofreak]

When the girl said that her father would be happy were she run over by a car, I wondered why the Phelps were not happy when the boy was hit with a drink while picketing...

[Jaffa Cake]

Printed on really crap paper? :confused:No, but I do double in size at Christmas. :o

Anyway, I'd heard a bit about Phelps before seeing the show, so I had an inkling of what to expect – but I was still taken aback by what I saw. Nutters the lot of them.

[solvs]

Those people are so ****ed up. I hope that they would have a gay son then they would realize how sicko they are.

They did.

They beat it out of him. :rolleyes: