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View Full Version : Somerfield gets meaning of easter *slightly* wrong


Killyp
Apr 8, 2007, 04:26 AM
mmmmmmm very clever:


Supermarket firm Somerfield has apologised after it said Easter eggs were to celebrate the "birth" of Jesus.
Ironically the public relations slip-up came as it sought to publicise a survey suggesting a high level of ignorance about Easter's religious significance.

Bosses at the company blamed the blunder on a typing error in a press release sent out earlier this week.

"It's a mistake. We hold up our hands to that," said Pete Williams, whose office was responsible for the blunder.

Apology

Mr Williams, who referred to himself as the "shame-faced head of PR" at the firm, said the member of his team whose mistake appeared to back-up the survey's findings about the public's poor religious knowledge was "very embarrassed."

"This was a simple and genuine typo and for that we apologise," he said.

What the firm meant to say, he explained, was that the eggs were a symbol of the resurrection or "rebirth" of Jesus after his crucifixion.

Pollsters for the chain found that while 75% of people would be spending the holiday weekend with friends and family, only one in five would be going to church.


linky (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6526337.stm)

This is where we need an applause emote, like this one: http://www.boshty.co.uk/forums/images/smiles/applause.gif

Counterfit
Apr 8, 2007, 09:50 AM
This somewhat reminds me of an article (http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/12/12/Dobbs.Dec13/index.html) Lou Dobbs wrote for cnn.com back in December. He called Christmas Christians' "holiest day of the year". :confused:

Thomas Veil
Apr 8, 2007, 10:07 AM
Well, if somebody makes an honest mistake and apologizes for it, they're all right with me.

FleurDuMal
Apr 8, 2007, 10:08 AM
Oh yeah, I forgot that Easter was about Jesus...

Abstract
Apr 8, 2007, 10:44 AM
Jesus loves chocolate, and that's why Christians celebrate with chocolate.

joepunk
Apr 8, 2007, 11:56 AM
I celebrate easter by biting the head off of the chocolate easter bunny

someguy
Apr 8, 2007, 12:05 PM
Pollsters for the chain found that while 75% of people would be spending the holiday weekend with friends and family, only one in five would be going to church.
Is that 1 in 5 regular church-goers that would be going to church today, or 1 in 5 people, period? I'd be surprised if 1 in 5 people even go to church at all.

xJulianx
Apr 8, 2007, 12:11 PM
Oh yeah, I forgot that Easter was about Jesus...

Jesus? He only wrote one book. Or was that God? Meh.

Is that 1 in 5 regular church-goers that would be going to church today, or 1 in 5 people, period? I'd be surprised if 1 in 5 people even go to church at all.

I think it must mean people in general...though 1 in 5 seems far too high.

GFLPraxis
Apr 8, 2007, 12:20 PM
It's not like the Easter celebration has anything to do with Jesus. It was adopted by the Catholic church so they could convert people from other religions without having to make them give up their holidays.

The roots can be traced all the way to Babylon; they had the exact same holiday, thousands of years before Jesus.

What do chocolate eggs have to do with Jesus, after all? They were part of a celebration to a fertility goddess. Unless someone can show me that Jesus talked about eggs somewhere.

PlaceofDis
Apr 8, 2007, 12:23 PM
It's not like the Easter celebration has anything to do with Jesus. It was adopted by the Catholic church so they could convert people from other religions without having to make them give up their holidays.

The roots can be traced all the way to Babylon; they had the exact same holiday, thousands of years before Jesus.

What do chocolate eggs have to do with Jesus, after all? They were part of a celebration to a fertility goddess. Unless someone can show me that Jesus talked about eggs somewhere.

well its the convergence of the two that caused the association of the easter 'bunny' with Jesus.

but saying that its about the 'birth' of Jesus isn't all that far wrong, i mean in all technicality its about the 're-birth' of Jesus... no?

/shrug i'm not a Christian/Catholic anymore so i don't know

calculus
Apr 8, 2007, 12:24 PM
Jesus had a lot of bad luck when you think about it - born at Christmas, died at Easter...

TheAnswer
Apr 8, 2007, 12:25 PM
Let us not forget, if Jesus were alive today....this is what he'd be listening to: oyTunes (http://www.aprilwinchell.com/).

Thomas Veil
Apr 8, 2007, 12:57 PM
Jesus? He only wrote one book. Or was that God? Meh.If you ask the Mormons, He wrote a sequel.

Didn't sell particularly well, though.

xJulianx
Apr 8, 2007, 12:59 PM
If you ask the Mormons, He wrote a sequel.

Didn't sell particularly well, though.

Sounds like he just threw that sequel together in a couple of weeks.


Lazy.:rolleyes:

QuarterSwede
Apr 8, 2007, 01:33 PM
It's not like the Easter celebration has anything to do with Jesus. It was adopted by the Catholic church so they could convert people from other religions without having to make them give up their holidays.

The roots can be traced all the way to Babylon; they had the exact same holiday, thousands of years before Jesus.
This may be true, but Jesus was crucified on the Friday before Easter (his resurrection) which occurred in April.


Jesus had a lot of bad luck when you think about it - born at Christmas, died at Easter...
Just for clarification, he died on Good Friday which is the Friday before Easter.

And no, I don't celebrate his ressurection with Easter eggs or the blasted Easter bunny. I would refer to that as the bastardization and commercialization of a religious holiday. Pagan rituals always make there way into Christian holidays.

SMM
Apr 8, 2007, 01:46 PM
This may be true, but Jesus was crucified on the Friday before Easter (his resurrection) which occurred in April.



Just for clarification, he died on Good Friday which is the Friday before Easter.

And no, I don't celebrate his ressurection with Easter eggs or the blasted Easter bunny. I would refer to that as the bastardization and commercialization of a religious holiday. Pagan rituals always make there way into Christian holidays.

I gave up on Easter when no one could explain where the bunny was getting the eggs.

zap2
Apr 8, 2007, 02:14 PM
Jesus had a lot of bad luck when you think about it - born at Christmas, died at Easter...

Ya, he missed the 2 best days of the year, free candy and presents!

psychofreak
Apr 8, 2007, 02:20 PM
Luckily South Park has provided me with the connection between Jesus and chocolate Easter eggs...

dornoforpyros
Apr 8, 2007, 02:38 PM
Bart Simpson: "Aren't we forgetting the true meaning of Christmas? The birth of Santa?" :D

weldon
Apr 8, 2007, 08:13 PM
As an aside, there are more than a few scholars that think Jesus was more likely born near Passover too. Something about the shepherds being out in the fields with their flocks at night instead of huddled in caves around Bethlehem as well as other clues.

And while several pagan traditions have been incorporated into Easter (and other Christian holidays) over time, it's kinda unfair to say that Passover existed before Judaism or Easter before Jesus. They are both pretty distinctive religious observances even if other earlier religions do celebrate a spring holiday.

Abstract
Apr 8, 2007, 09:07 PM
If you go into the history section of a bookstore, you won't find much on Jesus and Easter. If you go into the Children's Fiction section of a bookstore, you'll likely find tonnes of books about Easter.

I find that kind of fitting. :p


I gave up on Easter when no one could explain where the bunny was getting the eggs.

The egg was already there. There was no chicken before it.

comictimes
Apr 9, 2007, 10:13 AM
Easter and Jesus... makes me think of the Robin Williams skit:

"Here's my one question: how do you get crucifixion resurrection, and then chocolate bunnies, colored eggs? Wild stretch! Even kids are going "rabbits don't lay eggs... this is a real stretch, where are you going with this?"

QCassidy352
Apr 9, 2007, 11:18 AM
the significance of the eggs, bunnies, chicks, etc. is that they are symbols of fertility, and by extension, rebirth. There's no direct connection between Jesus and eggs, and clearly there's some paganism tucked in to the holiday as it exists now, but I don't see how that in any way diminishes the religious significance for those who want to celebrate it as a religious holiday.

dmw007
Apr 9, 2007, 09:29 PM
the significance of the eggs, bunnies, chicks, etc. is that they are symbols of fertility, and by extension, rebirth. There's no direct connection between Jesus and eggs, and clearly there's some paganism tucked in to the holiday as it exists now,

Good point.


but I don't see how that in any way diminishes the religious significance for those who want to celebrate it as a religious holiday.

Quite true, I completely agree with you QCassidy352. :)

ezekielrage_99
Apr 10, 2007, 08:16 AM
Easter is cancelled

http://www.ebaumsworld.com/images/easter.jpg

gauchogolfer
Apr 10, 2007, 08:44 AM
Pagan rituals always make there way into Christian holidays.

I would actually phrase it the other way around: Christian holidays always make their way into pagan rituals.

But that's just me. :)

Macaddicttt
Apr 10, 2007, 09:20 AM
You gotta love how any mention of religious holidays on this forum is seen as an invitation to make smug comments about religion. :rolleyes:

Cowards if you ask me. Make cheap potshots from the comfort of their own couches to make fun of others and make themselves feel better.

Counterfit
Apr 10, 2007, 09:38 PM
I would actually phrase it the other way around: Christian holidays always make their way into pagan rituals.

But that's just me. :)

Christmas was moved in the calendar, and I'm sure some minor ones were moved as well. Easter hasn't been, and most likely never will (unless they discover that Passover changed at some point since Jesus' time, but I don't think that's the case). You don't mess with a religion's most important day.

dmw007
Apr 10, 2007, 09:42 PM
Easter is cancelled



Ah, who is the mean person who ran over the Easter Rabbit? :mad: ;) :D

ezekielrage_99
Apr 10, 2007, 11:33 PM
Ah, who is the mean person who ran over the Easter Rabbit? :mad: ;) :D

It wasn't me ;)

weldon
Apr 11, 2007, 09:33 AM
Christmas was moved in the calendar, and I'm sure some minor ones were moved as well. Easter hasn't been, and most likely never will (unless they discover that Passover changed at some point since Jesus' time, but I don't think that's the case). You don't mess with a religion's most important day.
As an aside, this is the reason that the Russian Orthodox Church celebrates Christmas in January. Russia didn't switch to the Gregorian calendar until the Bolshevik Revolution (in part because they were suspicious of the west in general and Catholic's motives in changing the calendar - England was also a late adopter). Because the switch only happened less than 90 years ago, and because it was sponsored by godless Communists, the Russian Orthodox Church continued to celebrate Christmas on the same day, even though the Gregorian calendar now called that day January 7th.

I'm not sure if there are differences in the date of Easter (I see the Russian Orthodox date was also April 8th this year) but I imagine that this would be unusual because the date is determined by finding the start of Passover based on the Jewish lunar calendar and then picking the next Friday for Good Friday on the Gregorian Calendar. I suppose at some time the Julian and Gregorian calendars will drift apart to where they will disagree as to when the first Friday falls after the start of the Passover.

Counterfit
Apr 11, 2007, 04:55 PM
As an aside, this is the reason that the Russian Orthodox Church celebrates Christmas in January. Russia didn't switch to the Gregorian calendar until the Bolshevik Revolution (in part because they were suspicious of the west in general and Catholic's motives in changing the calendar - England was also a late adopter). Because the switch only happened less than 90 years ago, and because it was sponsored by godless Communists, the Russian Orthodox Church continued to celebrate Christmas on the same day, even though the Gregorian calendar now called that day January 7th.

I'm not sure if there are differences in the date of Easter (I see the Russian Orthodox date was also April 8th this year) but I imagine that this would be unusual because the date is determined by finding the start of Passover based on the Jewish lunar calendar and then picking the next Friday for Good Friday on the Gregorian Calendar. I suppose at some time the Julian and Gregorian calendars will drift apart to where they will disagree as to when the first Friday falls after the start of the Passover.

As a further aside, Easter is a month before Passover next year.

takao
Apr 16, 2007, 04:35 PM
6. January is still a national holiday here called Dreikönig ("Three Kings") but the correct name is still Epiphany

that said chocolate or more specially cacao is considered suitable for the period of lent by papal decree from the 16 or 17th century

slayr-cxf50
Apr 17, 2007, 11:09 PM
Which is more evil, religion or the commercialism that has eaten the holiday?
Gotta have one evil force in the world, I spose.

ridingnowhere85
Apr 18, 2007, 04:19 AM
You gotta love how any mention of religious holidays on this forum is seen as an invitation to make smug comments about religion. :rolleyes:

Cowards if you ask me. Make cheap potshots from the comfort of their own couches to make fun of others and make themselves feel better.

What can we do that's not cowardice? Not like we can vote on it. We can have a war with it, but religious nuts are always so willing to die for a book. (though Breakfast of Champions may be worth the sacrifice ;) ) It's a pretty played out idea anyway...

Any ideas?

Queso
Apr 18, 2007, 04:23 AM
Jesus had a lot of bad luck when you think about it - born at Christmas, died at Easter...
When I was very young I thought it amazing that he did all that in only four months :D

BTW, the egg/bunny thing comes originally from Persia/Iran, which celebrates its New Year at the spring equinox. Parents would hide eggs in the bushes as part of the celebrations and kids would go looking for them, scaring the rabbits that normally lived in the bushes and causing them to run into the open. So the kids were told that the rabbits were the ones leaving the eggs.

Macaddicttt
Apr 18, 2007, 11:02 AM
What can we do that's not cowardice? Not like we can vote on it. We can have a war with it, but religious nuts are always so willing to die for a book. (though Breakfast of Champions may be worth the sacrifice ;) ) It's a pretty played out idea anyway...

Any ideas?

I don't even know if I should dignify this with a response. Are you on a personal war against religion?

I wasn't saying that you're not allowed to argue your opinion. The problem here was that there was no intelligent discussion. It was just potshots. If you want to intelligently discuss religion, start a thread in the political forum. Otherwise, keep it to yourself. Christians on this forum don't go around telling people that atheism is the root of all evil (or if they do, they're promptly banned), yet people on MacRumors are making cheapshots at religion and insulting millions of people without even a good understanding of what they're making fun of, and call it the root of all evil.

Somehow it's tolerated. I'd like to see what you guys did if someone made disparaging comments about atheism in random threads.

Queso
Apr 18, 2007, 11:18 AM
Macaddicttt, posters may be saying it in a jokey way, but however you look at it Easter is a combination of all sorts of cultural and religious celebrations. So The True Meaning of Easter doesn't involve Christian faith,, just like The True Meaning of Christmas. The only truth is that it means different things to different people.

I'm not sure whether I spy any direct attacks on Christians prior to your first post, just a bit of banter. I know that other threads have attracted posts as you describe, but this one seems harmless enough to me.

Macaddicttt
Apr 18, 2007, 11:31 AM
I know, and I can take a joke. I was referring to the "scholarship" in this thread that says that Easter has nothing to do with Jesus (i.e. post #9) and this particular post:

If you go into the history section of a bookstore, you won't find much on Jesus and Easter. If you go into the Children's Fiction section of a bookstore, you'll likely find tonnes of books about Easter.

I find that kind of fitting. :p

Sorry if I overreacted. I just see so many anti-religion posts on MacRumors, and for some reason it's totally accepted.

obeygiant
Apr 18, 2007, 11:43 AM
Easter is a combination of all sorts of cultural and religious celebrations. So The True Meaning of Easter doesn't involve Christian faith,, just like The True Meaning of Christmas..

The days that Christmas and Easter fall on coincide with other ancient rituals ect., that is correct. The true meaning of Easter is the resurrection of christ and the true meaning of Christmas is the birth of christ. Its not really about the Easter Bunny and Santa, just FYI.

Queso
Apr 18, 2007, 11:54 AM
The days that Christmas and Easter fall on coincide with other ancient rituals ect., that is correct. The true meaning of Easter is the resurrection of christ and the true meaning of Christmas is the birth of christ. Its not really about the Easter Bunny and Santa, just FYI.
OK, under those names you are right, but they are still holidays purloined by the early Church from other religions/cultures. So we can celebrate how we want whatever we choose to call them, and preferably without organisations berating us for forgetting a "true meaning" that really only applies to those with Christian faith.

Sorry if I overreacted. I just see so many anti-religion posts on MacRumors, and for some reason it's totally accepted.
Point taken. I for one will attempt to be more respectful of others belief systems in future, although I know it will be difficult at times :)

notjustjay
Apr 18, 2007, 12:09 PM
Sorry if I overreacted. I just see so many anti-religion posts on MacRumors, and for some reason it's totally accepted.

I think those of us with religious beliefs learn to grow a thick skin about it. That doesn't excuse it, but I'm confident enough in what I believe in (and why I believe in it) that I accept that people can question it and, yes, make fun of it.

What does bother me are those that insist that religion and scientific fact are somehow 100% diametrically opposed, that religious folks are all closed-minded zealots, and those that insist that one side or another is completely wrong without having done any research to back it up (yes, including aforementioned religious zealots :( ). Those that think that somehow it was proven long ago that Jesus never existed and the Bible is a work of fiction, and, say, Intelligent Design is such a ludicrous theory that it's not even worth scientific merit, but if YOU want to go ahead and wallow in your ignorance and believe it, then go right ahead... Uh, hello, WHO is ignorant (and closed-minded, to boot)?

(Edit: As a fellow Mac user, I think you know exactly what I'm talking about :D)

But anyway. The crass commercialization of Easter. Yeah, sucks, doesn't it. ;)

weldon
Apr 18, 2007, 07:30 PM
OK, under those names you are right, but they are still holidays purloined by the early Church from other religions/cultures. So we can celebrate how we want whatever we choose to call them, and preferably without organisations berating us for forgetting a "true meaning" that really only applies to those with Christian faith.
I don't think your position on Easter is really defensible. You almost sound like you are saying that there is a universal spring religious holiday that was co-opted by Christianity to become Easter. Easter comes from very specific events in the Jewish and Christian traditions. If the Christian holiday has adopted some of the ritual from other traditions, that doesn't mean that the whole notion was "purloined" from someone else.

It would be much more fair to say that Christianity celebrated Easter from the death of the founder which happened during Passover, just before the Jewish Sabbath began, which had been celebrated since Moses led the Hebrew people out of Egypt. Then other cultures brought some of their traditions to Easter celebrations as they adopted Christianity.

The same general principle applies to Christmas, although this one is less clear because there is no direct evidence for when Jesus was born but there is circumstantial evidence that he was most likely born in the springtime. Because the date for his birth is unknown, it is more clear that the early church adopted the date of December 25th from another tradition. Still the Christian meaning behind Christmas is separate from other religious traditions and was well established before the date of 12/25 was adopted.

Queso
Apr 19, 2007, 04:02 AM
I don't think your position on Easter is really defensible. You almost sound like you are saying that there is a universal spring religious holiday that was co-opted by Christianity to become Easter. Easter comes from very specific events in the Jewish and Christian traditions. If the Christian holiday has adopted some of the ritual from other traditions, that doesn't mean that the whole notion was "purloined" from someone else.
So you think that Christmas falling at the winter solstice and Easter at the Spring equinox are just co-incidence then? I'm not saying that there was a universal spring religious holiday at all. I'm saying there were a number of very close religious and cultural holidays, most likely based on the time of the equinox that had been identified two millenia before by the Babylonians and Egyptians, pulled together onto one date when the Roman Empire decided to convert to Christianity. Easter was most likely selected by the Christians to be at this time because of Passover (Pascha in Greek, hence Easter being known as Pascua in Spanish, Pasqua in Italian and Paqués in French) and because the pagan fertitliy goddess Ostara (note the word similarity there) was particularly associated with the Vernal Equinox, where the rebirth (note the idea similarity) of the Earth was celebrated.

takao
Apr 19, 2007, 06:26 AM
So you think that Christmas falling at the winter solstice and Easter at the Spring equinox are just co-incidence then?

eastern falls on spring equinox ? since when ?
the earliest date possible date for easter is the 22. march and the latest on the 25. april


solstices always have been the more important dates compared to equinox

weldon
Apr 19, 2007, 09:33 AM
So you think that Christmas falling at the winter solstice and Easter at the Spring equinox are just co-incidence then?
I already said the date for Christmas was likely chosen to coincide with another holiday because the date of Jesus' birth is not known. Easter is different.
Easter was most likely selected by the Christians to be at this time because of Passover (Pascha in Greek, hence Easter being known as Pascua in Spanish, Pasqua in Italian and Paqués in French) and because the pagan fertitliy goddess Ostara (note the word similarity there) was particularly associated with the Vernal Equinox, where the rebirth (note the idea similarity) of the Earth was celebrated.
As I explained before, Easter is celebrated at Passover because that is when Jesus died. It's obviously connected to Jewish holidays because all his followers were Jewish and they were celebrating Passover with Jesus before he was killed. It wasn't changed later to coincide with Passover. The four Gospels document that Jesus was executed by the Romans on the Friday afternoon before the Passover Sabbath began at sundown on Friday. Easter is celebrated on Sunday, rather than the Jewish sabbath (Friday night to Saturday) because that is the day he appeared to his followers after his death. The calculation of the date of Easter was changed a bit with the Gregorian calendar, but it's still based on the same principle of celebrating the first Sunday after Passover begins.

Queso
Apr 19, 2007, 09:40 AM
As I explained before, Easter is celebrated at Passover because that is when Jesus died. It's obviously connected to Jewish holidays because all his followers were Jewish and they were celebrating Passover with Jesus before he was killed. It wasn't changed later to coincide with Passover. The four Gospels document that Jesus was executed by the Romans on the Friday afternoon before the Passover Sabbath began at sundown on Friday. Easter is celebrated on Sunday, rather than the Jewish sabbath (Friday night to Saturday) because that is the day he appeared to his followers after his death. The calculation of the date of Easter was changed a bit with the Gregorian calendar, but it's still based on the same principle of celebrating the first Sunday after Passover begins.
On this point I stand corrected, but I don't concede that just because people choose to not follow the Christian model of celebration they should have this True Meaning of Easter mantra constantly dragged up. If those who follow the faith want to celebrate it that way, go ahead. Personally I'd rather take a long weekend and eat some Lindt chocolate bunnies.

robPOD
Apr 19, 2007, 03:45 PM
Lol at the easter is canceled, some people are idiots.