Apple and a 3D Company?

[arn]

Architosh editor posted this rumor (http://forums.architosh.com/showthread.phtml?threadid=277) to their forums:

I have superb inside information that Apple is likely going to buy a market leading 3D modeling/rendering and animation application that is currently available for the Mac or Mac OS X.


While messageboard posts are generally the bottom of the rumor-barrel... posts from webmasters have a bit more credibility... and of course, the writer himself was not sure enough to make a full news story out of it.... so take it with a grain of salt....

[teabgs]

If this is true it would be really good for apple. As long as they crank out some newer, faster computers to handle the load of Maya specifically. Imagine Apple dominating the film industry withmost editing on Final Cut and all Maya work on Macs. That'd be great!

[unclepain]

I guess everyone assumes he is talking about Maya. What about Lightwave, or Electric Image? Either way, I think an Apple branded 3d App would be just fine, thank you. May I have some more please?

[Choppaface]

a render farm of G4s would be pretty expensive

[idkew]

Originally posted by unclepain
I guess everyone assumes he is talking about Maya. May I have some more please?

pretty sure maya is in bad financial troubles... bankruptcy maybe..... anyone know for sure?

-idkew:confused:

[gentry]

Working in high tech publishing, I can say that the 3d space is not as big as everyone had hoped. Many of the 3d companies are having issues, and the downturn in the economy certainly didn't help.

All of the 3d companies are showing signs of pain. Frankly, getting into 3d is probably a mistake froma roi position.

[takidenza]

What about nothingreal "www.nothingreal.com"?

[King Cobra]

It probably will not occur, but I would like to see Apple team up with Strata. I am using v3.5 of their free 3D software and it works very well, with a slight problem. It is Classic native. I want Apple to create some sort of Cocoa native 3D applications.

A fact: Adobe Atmosphere is a 3D modeling product, but I am not when it will become available.

A thought: What if Apple created their own 3D program: Appleworks 3D? Who would have thought?
________________________

Bill Gates: All you need to upload pictures from your camera is a fast PC and some boring software.

KC: Well I have a Mac, and the software I use operates in OS 10. Does that make me better than you?

[beigemac]

If it is true than i guess it is in Apples intrest only to aquire Maya or Lightwave, cause the industry only uses these two from the Mac platform. Oh and maybe Cinema 4d cause thats gaining real credit as a serious perfesional app.

[Mr. Anderson]

Bringing Apple into the 3d game would really stir things up. I started with 3d on Macs way back 10 years ago with Infinity 3d, then moved on to Strata Studio Pro. But 3 years ago I went out and bought Lightwave. A much more powerful package good for beginers and hardcore. Jimmy Newtron was created with Lightwave, for example.

If Apple went 3d, making a consumer 'i3D' package would be interesting as an expansion for iMovie or FinalCut Pro. I'll sit back and wait to see what happens. Maya would be nice, but its very pricy, lists at $5495.00. That's a nice G4 workstation. Lightwave is $2495.00, but interestingly enough, they have a new special. If you have a registered version of FinalCut Pro you can get it for $1495. That's an unbelievably good deal. And Newtek also has some other nice products too - Video Toaster (for the PC) among others.

[reyesg4]

It would be to port over whatever pixar uses to the mac and ad more features to it. They are not going to spend all this money to make a free iApp. Once all macs have good 3d hardware, they can offer a free app. But I think moving Pixar computers to Mac and make a movie on it would generate a tremendous amount of publicity.

[stoid]

I remember using the Video Toaster in a summer class once. The Video Toaster WAS digital video 15-20 years ago. If you wanted to do digital effects, you got the video toaster. I think the majority of early star wars effects used it. And the main reason that consumer 3D hasn't been doing so well is that the learning curve is sooooo steep. In order to do even remotely real 3d video/effects you have to have an expensive app and lots and lots and lots of time to learn how to use it. If apple can simplify a 3D program like they simplified video editing with iMovie, then the consumer 3d market will really take off.

[Mr. Anderson]

Newtek's Video Toaster is more like FinalCut Pro on steroids. Its simillar to an Avid or Media 100 system that uses hardware for realtime effects. Lightwave is just a small part, software, that comes with the system. FinalCut Pro has some simple realtime effects, but it relies on the capabilities of the machine, not an extra card or two to crunch the pixels.

To have a way to do flying 3d logos and titles, and mapping video clips to 3d surfaces and the like might be a way for Apple to go if they want to incorporate it with their iMovie and FCP software. Real 3d animation is not that practical for everyone, but simple shading and surface maps are realatively fast and can be done in real time (OpenGL).

The problem with that, though, is the whole anti-aliasing issue. You rotate a cube on the screen and try and get smooth, slick looking edges realtime, you have to up the processing. Anyone who argues that you don't really need faster machines, and I've seen some, don't realize that the more speed you have, the better the realtime graphics will be. The day that affordable realtime raytracing becomes possible is something I'm anxiously waiting for, but I know it won't happen anytime soon.

Give me the 1 THz Octo G7.

[Beej]

Originally posted by Choppaface
a render farm of G4s would be pretty expensive It would also be pretty quick!

[agreenster]

Originally posted by reyesg4
It would be to port over whatever pixar uses to the mac and ad more features to it. They are not going to spend all this money to make a free iApp. Once all macs have good 3d hardware, they can offer a free app. But I think moving Pixar computers to Mac and make a movie on it would generate a tremendous amount of publicity.

Pixar uses a proprietary piece of animation software called 'Marionette' (please excuse my spelling) and use PR Renderman (of course) for rendering. Both were developed in house, and only PR Renderman is for sale. I highly doubt Marionette's code will be sold any time soon. Most large 3D houses write their own animation software, use Renderman for rendering (Dreamworks/PDI, ILM, for example) and use Maya for modeling.

However, I would be interested to know Job's plan for Pixar's hardware. They use Sun for rendering (MP rackmounts) but still use SGI/Unix for all their animation. I hear they are looking at Linux though. But, since it is Steve Job's company, I would be interested to see if he moves them toward Apple since it is Unix.

Thats a good thought, but you have to remember one thing. Pixar makes a ***** load of money. They are all over their game and are making great films. So, why go dinking around with all kinds of changes and modifications to their hardware/software when what they are doing already works? Its suicide. But still, who knows.

A real possibility would be a 'dumbed down' version of Marionette for distribution by Apple. A 3D animation package that has been developed in part by some of the brains at Pixar, but without all the super high end stuff us laymen know nothing about. Still, Marionette I hear is a spectacular piece of software, and I doubt Pixar would want to divulge even a percentage of their trade secret.

[agreenster]

Originally posted by dukestreet
Anyone who argues that you don't really need faster machines, and I've seen some, don't realize that the more speed you have, the better the realtime graphics will be. The day that affordable realtime raytracing becomes possible is something I'm anxiously waiting for, but I know it won't happen anytime soon.

Give me the 1 THz Octo G7.

Amen brother. Not only that, but I cant wait to be able to rotate a scene in Maya/Cinema4D/Lightwave and not wait 5 (10, 15?) seconds for the redraw. Its like trying to animate with a handicap.

[Q-bert]

Originally posted by takidenza
What about nothingreal "www.nothingreal.com"?
Nothing Real isn't (wasn't) a 3D animation software company. They make 2D compositing software, totally different from something like Maya or Lightwave. It works WITH 3D programs, but it is not 3D itself.

[Mr. Anderson]

Originally posted by Q-bert

Nothing Real isn't (wasn't) a 3D animation software company. They make 2D compositing software, totally different from something like Maya or Lightwave. It works WITH 3D programs, but it is not 3D itself.

The rumor that started this thread was about a leading 3D software package soon to be bought, not something like the software Nothing Real had. Besides, that was old news, Nothing Real got bought out in February. Most likely to add in with iMovie and FCP.

[Q-bert]

Originally posted by dukestreet


The rumor that started this thread was about a leading 3D software package soon to be bought, not something like the software Nothing Real had. Besides, that was old news, Nothing Real got bought out in February. Most likely to add in with iMovie and FCP.

Yeah, I know. I was talking to the person who assumed Nothing Real is 3D software ("What about Nothing Real?"), which was a common misconception around the Mac forums after the purchase in February.

However, while we're on the subject, I doubt Apple has bought Shake to add into iMovie at all. I think it will be a new program that complements FCP at best. Compositing is not an easy subject, and Shake isn't the kind of program to create an "iApp" from.

[Mr. Anderson]

Final Cut Pro rocks. I've been using it since it came out, dropping Premere immediately. v3 has really worked out well, solving some issues the other versions had in the past. If Apple adds a litte 3d to this, I don't know if it will be worth while. I'll still use Lightwave for all the 3d animation, unless they can make something look great and save a huge amount of time rendering.

I'm taking a wait and see approach here.

[Ifeelbloated]

If this is true I bet anything that it's either going to be Lightwave or ElectricImage Universe. Maya is too much of SGI's baby, they won't sell it, no way. I know of ElectricImage Universe and it has hardly any marketshare. The company may make a deal with Apple. Who knows.

[Mr. Anderson]

Electric Image use to be the only high end 3D system for the Mac many years ago. They use to only be a rendering system, no modelling until recently.

This seems much more plausible than Lightwave or Maya.

Good call.

[mischief]

Apple is looking at adding a 3D display. Apple is looking at acquiring a 3D engine. OS X is running with a Beta top layer.

Apple is looking at being the first 3D OS.:eek: :cool: :D

[Mr. Anderson]

Originally posted by mischief
Apple is looking at adding a 3D display. Apple is looking at acquiring a 3D engine. OS X is running with a Beta top layer.

I think you might be tying the wrong strings together. To go to a stereoscopic display as a standard interface would be taking things a little too far. Besides, OpenGL is arleady incorporated to OSX, the 3D aspect is a software purchase, most likely for use with FCP and iMovie. As and R&D project, maybe.

Originally posted by arn
Apple is likely going to buy a market leading 3D modeling/rendering and animation application

You ever been on an SGI machine and run their little program that puts directory and file structure in a 3d environment? I saw that back in '93, it really never took off.

[mischief]

It was called "Button Fly" and was used heavily in movies like Johnny Mnemonic and Lawnmower Man to demonstrate an emmersed VR OS.

I think perhaps we may see Adobe Atmosphere tech as a replacement for both Quartz AND IE to make the first "seamless" 3D OS.

[Ambient303]

Apple will not purchase Maya. Alias Wavefront has lost so much money on account of their Maya 3.5 for mac, I dont think apple sees much hope in another incarnation of Maya. plus, about 95% of the 3D market is held by PC users. It wouldnt make sense to make it native for Apple.
Whether you want to admit it or not, Mac is not optimal for 3D. you can buy a 3D rendering machine(PC) for like $600, whereas, you need to spend about $2500 for a decent 3D mac machine. Unless they Alias wavefront and begin work on a 64-Bit G5 version of Maya, I dont see much happening.