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MacRumors
Apr 21, 2007, 11:53 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

Mercury News (http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_5722967?nclick_check=1) reports that based on their investigation, there is little evidence to support criminal charges against Steve Jobs for the stock-option backdating investigation that first made headlines in June 2006 (http://www.macrumors.com/2006/06/30/apple-computer-stock-option-irregularities/).

Despite Apple's disclosure that Jobs approved widespread backdating at Apple, there is no evidence he directed the backdating of his own grant or covered it up afterward, based on a review of regulatory filings and interviews with lawyers intimately familiar with the grant who asked not to be identified.


Mercury News provides an excellent summary (http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_5722967?nclick_check=1) of the history of the backdating irregularities at Apple. The main issue surrounds an initial meeting on August 29, 2001 where the board had discussed granting Steve Jobs 7.5 million shares, but negotiations continued, delaying the finalization of the stock options. The grant was finalized in December, but the options were backdated to October 2001 with falsified meeting minutes related to the options grant.

The article points out that backdating, itself, is not necessarily illegal, though who was responsible for the falsification of documents remains a point of contention.



DMann
Apr 21, 2007, 11:56 PM
Awesome news! This happens to be common practice with most corporations. Steve was not interested in reaping benefits from this in the first place. Glad to hear it!

dmw007
Apr 21, 2007, 11:57 PM
Good news, our beloved leader will not be charged. :)

iBookG4user
Apr 22, 2007, 12:13 AM
This is good news, I'm glad that Steve Jobs wasn't involved in this.

PlaceofDis
Apr 22, 2007, 12:15 AM
good news for apple overall.

steve jr.
Apr 22, 2007, 12:18 AM
Not out of the woods until the Feds say he's good to go.

mcarnes
Apr 22, 2007, 12:25 AM
False meeting minutes? Oh brother, all corporations do that. :rolleyes:

Talk about a witch hunt.

Doctor Q
Apr 22, 2007, 12:26 AM
It's not the crime, it's the lack of a cover-up.

mrkramer
Apr 22, 2007, 12:32 AM
This is good news, but who was it who voted this as negative???

bearbo
Apr 22, 2007, 12:37 AM
wait, i'm not getting it.... so backdating is not necessarily illegal?

AeronPrometheus
Apr 22, 2007, 12:37 AM
This is good news, but who was it who voted this as negative???

You gotta love that one person who trolls Apple forums and uses every opportunity to remind us that he/she believes that Steve Jobs should burn in hell.

Steve Jobs is pure hearted compared to most corporate big wigs.

:apple:

buddhagoth
Apr 22, 2007, 12:44 AM
It's not a matter of heart but how the laws are written and whether they were broken or not. The SJ Mercury News is usually pretty good about this kind of info, so it looks like Mr. Jobs is in the clear. Which makes me rather happy for many reasons. :)

However "mercurial" or whatever Steve Jobs may be, he apparently isn't a criminal or close to being charged as one. These days in Corpo-America, that really is saying something pretty darn amazingly good!

Cordially,
BG

MacinDoc
Apr 22, 2007, 01:22 AM
wait, i'm not getting it.... so backdating is not necessarily illegal?
Backdating is not illegal, but falsifying documents to cover up backdating is. It's all about the disclosure (at least as far as I understand it, but I'm no expert on the subject).

Stella
Apr 22, 2007, 01:31 AM
You gotta love that one person who trolls Apple forums and uses every opportunity to remind us that he/she believes that Steve Jobs should burn in hell.

Steve Jobs is pure hearted compared to most corporate big wigs.

:apple:

SJ acts in the best interests of Apple - just like any CEO would.

This is the problem with any Apple forum ( or ANY forum for that matter ): as soon as someone says anything negative about Apple - even if justified they are classed as a troll.

Get your head out of cloud 9.

Apple would definitely suffer if SJ was to be charged, so this is a good outcome.

winmacguy
Apr 22, 2007, 02:44 AM
The act of backdating share options is not illegal in itself, it is the process of correctly accounting for the expense to the company of awarding the shares from the time they were dated as being issued. Therefore if it was known at the time that the date that the shares were awarded which didn't match the date that they were expensed to the company on the balance sheet that would make the process illegal.

That is my understanding.

theheadguy
Apr 22, 2007, 04:37 AM
SJ acts in the best interests of Apple - just like any CEO would.

This is the problem with any Apple forum ( or ANY forum for that matter ): as soon as someone says anything negative about Apple - even if justified they are classed as a troll.

Get your head out of cloud 9.

Apple would definitely suffer if SJ was to be charged, so this is a good outcome.
Well said. It's not the place for a worthy debate.

Good outcome, anyway. It wouldn't do any of us current stockholders any good if he was charged with anything.

alansky
Apr 22, 2007, 04:59 AM
Steve Jobs is pure hearted compared to most corporate big wigs.

Which is exactly why he's a target. The cynical and corrupt can't stand the comparison—it's not good for business. But the good guys don't always finish last. I can hardly wait to see Steve Jobs vs. Bill Gates at the D Conference on May 30. Could be real blood bath.

Roller
Apr 22, 2007, 07:33 AM
False meeting minutes? Oh brother, all corporations do that. :rolleyes:

Talk about a witch hunt.

Try that excuse if you're audited by the IRS or stopped for speeding. :) But I agree that lack of prosecution of SJ, if it's confirmed, would be good for Apple.

So now can we move the Leopard release back to June? :)

Digitalclips
Apr 22, 2007, 09:15 AM
This is good news, but who was it who voted this as negative???

The same trolls who always do. It never ceases to amaze me that a group of Mac haters have so little to do in their lives that they can spend time posting anti Mac and Steve comments and voting negative to all great Apple news.

Unless of course they are paid to and live in Redmond :p

False meeting minutes? Oh brother, all corporations do that. :rolleyes:

Talk about a witch hunt.

So true! I have heard my accountants in the past comment that 'they forgot this or that' and they'd 'just pop in a back dated meeting where whatever was agreed here or there' and 'not to worry'. I'd always say is that OK? They'd always say 'Of course' as they'd pass a meeting minutes sheet for me and my executives to sign. 'We just had the meeting' they'd laugh. My degrees are not in accounting and that's why I paid the huge fees to accounting firms with large buildings downtown.

I think they must be taught how to do that sort of thing at CPA school in 101 ass covering.

I admit after Enron etc. I would not do this now but back then I honestly never gave it a thought assuming CPAs knew what they were doing.

The TV is full of shows about shady lawyers ... Now I am just waiting for the series about sleazy accountants ... lol

SJ acts in the best interests of Apple - just like any CEO would.

This is the problem with any Apple forum ( or ANY forum for that matter ): as soon as someone says anything negative about Apple - even if justified they are classed as a troll.

Get your head out of cloud 9.


So 10 negative votes can be seen clearly from reading the entire thread count can they? I don't see a negative comment anywhere yet 10 negative votes are shown (at this moment). If ten coherent, intelligent comments were here that 'justified' negative votes then perhaps you might have a point.

As it is can you explain the votes based on the actual threads that are here? I think perhaps it is you with your head up your ... sorry in your cloud.

yzp
Apr 22, 2007, 10:18 AM
good news indeed for the whole :apple: !

however, I never ever ear those saying?

is it normal?

freebooter
Apr 22, 2007, 10:56 AM
Steal an apple, get a criminal record. Steal millions, get...off the hook.

There are principals of justice that are applied vigorously to the commoner that are not applied to the aristocrats, for the "higher good". T'was ever thus.

Digitalclips
Apr 22, 2007, 11:09 AM
Steal an apple, get a criminal record. Steal millions, get...off the hook.

There are principals of justice that are applied vigorously to the commoner that are not applied to the aristocrats, for the "higher good". T'was ever thus.

While not entirely disagreeing with your somewhat radical, basic premiss in historical terms, please explain where SJ 'stole' anything in this specific case?

trevorlsciact
Apr 22, 2007, 11:20 AM
The TV is full of shows about shady lawyers ... Now I am just waiting for the series about sleazy accountants ... lol


What television needs is a really good corporate drama. I've always thought this, and it would do so well.

Lone Deranger
Apr 22, 2007, 11:23 AM
Perhaps it would be an idea for Arn to consider making the vote results public. Open it up to scrutiny. That way, over time, it would give serious forum users a clearer insight as to who they can take seriously and who's "contributions" to the forums to take with a grain of salt.
I'm sure the list of anti-voters would be remarkably consistant.

Anyway, it's good to hear things are looking up on this. The less destractions for Apple the better. Now let's have that Leopard. :)


The same trolls who always do. It never ceases to amaze me that a group of Mac haters have so little to do in their lives that they can spend time posting anti Mac and Steve comments and voting negative to all great Apple news.

Unless of course they are paid to and live in Redmond :p

AeronPrometheus
Apr 22, 2007, 11:25 AM
SJ acts in the best interests of Apple - just like any CEO would.

This is the problem with any Apple forum ( or ANY forum for that matter ): as soon as someone says anything negative about Apple - even if justified they are classed as a troll.

Get your head out of cloud 9.

Apple would definitely suffer if SJ was to be charged, so this is a good outcome.

Anyone who leaves a negative mark but doesn't back it up with an actual debate in the same thread is a troll.

Well said. It's not the place for a worthy debate.

This is a forum... it was built for debates and points of views... hence the word Forum (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/forum).

If ten coherent, intelligent comments were here that 'justified' negative votes then perhaps you might have a point.

Exactly.

Digitalclips
Apr 22, 2007, 11:29 AM
What television needs is a really good corporate drama. I've always thought this, and it would do so well.

Yes I agree. There was one in the UK back in the 60's I recall, can't remember the name now, but it was very good. Oh... I remember "The Power Game" wow, an old brain cell must have fired! OMG I just remembered an actress in it too; Rosemary Leech. I stopped drinking a week ago ... could there be a connection to my memory?

DeathChill
Apr 22, 2007, 11:50 AM
Which is exactly why he's a target. The cynical and corrupt can't stand the comparison—it's not good for business. But the good guys don't always finish last. I can hardly wait to see Steve Jobs vs. Bill Gates at the D Conference on May 30. Could be real blood bath.

I'm not sure what you meant, because Bill Gates certainly is an amazing person. He's donated tons of cash to many different causes and has done a lot of good with his money. Bill hasn't finished last though obviously, if that's what you meant and I do consider him to be a nice guy so...

Also, I'm curious as to who the hell keeps voting everything negative? I swear to God that the news could announce that Apple has cured cancer and AIDS and is giving it away for free and people would rate it negative: "GOD, APPLE IS JUST TRYING TO BE TOO COOL!"

BigPrince
Apr 22, 2007, 11:51 AM
Will the feds eventually make a statement saying hes clear or not? If so, what time frame?

kirk26
Apr 22, 2007, 12:01 PM
This should be more negative. Maybe with someone new at the helm, apple will start innovating again instead rehashing years old technology like the iPhone. iPhone-welcome to 2004.

Timeline
Apr 22, 2007, 12:25 PM
This should be more negative. Maybe with someone new at the helm, apple will start innovating again instead rehashing years old technology like the iPhone. iPhone-welcome to 2004.

Unless you know something I don't Apple has not completed the software on this device and it will likely do more than they originally announced so I don't see your point. Being OS X it's sure to be one of the most novel and handy devices we have ever seen for Mac users.:cool:

Digitalclips
Apr 22, 2007, 12:29 PM
This should be more negative. Maybe with someone new at the helm, apple will start innovating again instead rehashing years old technology like the iPhone. iPhone-welcome to 2004.

ROFL

Unless you know something I don't Apple has not completed the software on this device and it will likely do more than they originally announced so I don't see your point. Being OS X it's sure to be one of the most novel and handy devices we have ever seen for Mac users.:cool:

I think (hope) he was being sarcastically humorous ...

Dustman
Apr 22, 2007, 12:48 PM
omg.. when i first read that article i pointed at my screen angrily and was like "OMG MARTHA STEWART!!"

freebooter
Apr 22, 2007, 12:56 PM
While not entirely disagreeing with your somewhat radical, basic premiss in historical terms, please explain where SJ 'stole' anything in this specific case?

My basic assertion is painted with a wide brush--exceptions can be found--but it is only radical from the perspective of the historically/sociologically naive or amnesiac. (sorry if the bluntness offends)

Cheating for profit is fraud. Fraud is a form of stealing.

So-called white-collar crime is a smiled-at, wrist-slapped endeavor in which only the hired hands suffer any serious punishment, with very few exceptions.

IJ Reilly
Apr 22, 2007, 01:04 PM
Will the feds eventually make a statement saying hes clear or not? If so, what time frame?

At some point, the SEC will announce whether they plan on filing charges or taking some other action, or no action. I'd expect to see this within the next couple of months. The wild card in the mix is the number of backdating episodes they are currently investigating, which is vast. This argues both for the SEC taking its sweet time, and also for them ultimately letting current officers at Apple off the hook. The other wild card is the shareholder lawsuit on the same matter, and the talk about AGs from some states investigating the possibility of filing charges of their own. The bottom line is that this cloud is not going away quickly, but it looks like it might be starting to disburse. We'll see tomorrow, by how this news is received by the market.

shigzeo
Apr 22, 2007, 01:42 PM
i think that it might be someone who loves apple so dearly that s/he he is thinking: ' i cannot believe this is not over yet. go get em steve, wonderful steve. but damn the feds and anyone else who is dragging this out'. that person would vote this as negative. doesn't necessarily have to be a bad person or anti-apple. i did not vote

Stella
Apr 22, 2007, 02:30 PM
I was referring to EVERY topic, not just this one.

I know that some people click negative because the story doesn't interest them ( not something that I do,btw ) - and doing so does not infer trolling. There are many reasons why people may click negative, not just because they are trolls.

For example:
There was a topic that was about SJ was clear of his cancer ( or something related ). There were a lot of negatives. Why? People clicked negative not because there were sorry to him clear of cancer but clicked negative because - they thought that it was bad that he had cancer to begin with. The positive and negative can be interpreted in different ways. Its not black and white.

Sometimes, because of the ambiguous nature of the Positive and negative rating, I'm wondering why its there in the first place.


As it is can you explain the votes based on the actual threads that are here? I think perhaps it is you with your head up your ... sorry in your cloud.

czeluff
Apr 22, 2007, 04:09 PM
uh...correct me if i'm wrong, but we all wouldn't be typing up this info on our Macs WITHOUT Steve Jobs. Think of where computers might be at without him...

Keep him in. Who knows where our world would be in technology right now if it wasn't for his genius.

cz

Dont Hurt Me
Apr 22, 2007, 04:15 PM
Steal an apple, get a criminal record. Steal millions, get...off the hook.

There are principals of justice that are applied vigorously to the commoner that are not applied to the aristocrats, for the "higher good". T'was ever thus.
Bingo, you cut right through every fanboys spin.

theheadguy
Apr 22, 2007, 04:20 PM
This is a forum... it was built for debates and points of views... hence the word Forum (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/forum).
Read a little closer dude. This is certainly not the place for a worthy debate. If you argue otherwise you are just spinning your wheels. As I previously stated (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=3573055#post3573055), it's great that he is not going to be in the middle of a criminal investigation here. If we had a Martha Stewart on our hands, this forum might implode.

Oh, here you go (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/worthy).

gnasher729
Apr 22, 2007, 04:54 PM
wait, i'm not getting it.... so backdating is not necessarily illegal?

Backdating options means giving money to the employees getting the backdated options. Giving your employees money has never been illegal. You just have to fill out all the forms correctly and (important) record it as an expense and make sure that everyone pays their taxes.

Now on stock boards you always find the idiots who think it is wrong to give your employees money because it reduces profits. If these idiots were running companies, they would go bankrupt because nobody would want to work for them.

Stella
Apr 22, 2007, 05:53 PM
There are principals of justice that are applied vigorously to the commoner that are not applied to the aristocrats, for the "higher good". T'was ever thus.

Damned right. The law does not apply equally to all. There's an awful lot of famous people who have got off without jail time, where as, if a commoner committed the same crime, they'd be jailed instantly.

Snoop Dogg is one that springs to mind.

AidenShaw
Apr 22, 2007, 06:11 PM
This is good news, but who was it who voted this as negative???

Perhaps someone who considers it not positive that there's even the need for a discussion of a story that The Steve probably won't risk going to jail?

Or perhaps someone who understands that once the risk of criminal charges disappear, then the onslaught of civil lawsuits can begin?

calculus
Apr 22, 2007, 06:25 PM
uh...correct me if i'm wrong, but we all wouldn't be typing up this info on our Macs WITHOUT Steve Jobs. Think of where computers might be at without him...

Keep him in. Who knows where our world would be in technology right now if it wasn't for his genius.

cz

Are you saying that it's OK for some people to break the law? I'm not saying that Steve Jobs has, just trying to understand your argument.

Counter
Apr 22, 2007, 06:31 PM
It was a complete accident his 7.5 million shares were backdated massively in his favor. It's not his fault. These things happen when you're Steve Jobs. Petty, petty Feds. Don't they have bigger fish to fry? :D

EagerDragon
Apr 22, 2007, 07:08 PM
Great, maybe we can move on and get all those products going.

Hopefully he is not tainted.

EagerDragon
Apr 22, 2007, 07:10 PM
wait, i'm not getting it.... so backdating is not necessarily illegal?

Not if they declare it shortly after and the corporation pays the difference.

rezatayebi
Apr 22, 2007, 07:16 PM
isn`t there any more important topic to talk about?...

EagerDragon
Apr 22, 2007, 07:25 PM
You gotta love that one person who trolls Apple forums and uses every opportunity to remind us that he/she believes that Steve Jobs should burn in hell.

Steve Jobs is pure hearted compared to most corporate big wigs.

:apple:

I would not say he is pure hearted as I don't know him that well to make a statement like that.

I would say he is the soul of Apple, a great CEO and the best visionary I seen.

If I ever get to know him at a personal level, I may possibly agree.

Apple would suffer greatly without him, and the stock holders would also suffer a lot with a lost of 30 to 40% in stock value. This witch hunt is supposed to be to protect stock holders, but if these jerks go the wrong way, they will endup hurting the company and the stock holders they are suppoced to protect.

Glad news for now are good, now we need the feds to say the same.

twoodcc
Apr 22, 2007, 07:35 PM
this is very good news. hopefully he will avoid any criminal charges

EagerDragon
Apr 22, 2007, 07:39 PM
My basic assertion is painted with a wide brush--exceptions can be found--but it is only radical from the perspective of the historically/sociologically naive or amnesiac. (sorry if the bluntness offends)

Cheating for profit is fraud. Fraud is a form of stealing.

So-called white-collar crime is a smiled-at, wrist-slapped endeavor in which only the hired hands suffer any serious punishment, with very few exceptions.

I am not sure any of us has the actual facts of the case, so we really do not know one way or another for sure.

Lots of people have a tendency of beleiving someone is guilty because they are being investigated. Obviously they have the right to their opinion.

I reserve judgement even if he is cleared until I can read the facts.

Mean time he is innocent and one of the greatest CEO's

kcroy
Apr 22, 2007, 08:20 PM
I was wondering if anyone knows when the Feds will make up their mind on the matter? Is there a court date set? How exactly does that announcement work?

Steve is a great CEO. I'm looking forward to the Feds clearing him of any wrongdoing.

Good luck Steve!

IJ Reilly
Apr 22, 2007, 08:51 PM
I was wondering if anyone knows when the Feds will make up their mind on the matter? Is there a court date set? How exactly does that announcement work?

Question already asked and answered.

At some point, the SEC will announce whether they plan on filing charges or taking some other action, or no action. I'd expect to see this within the next couple of months. The wild card in the mix is the number of backdating episodes they are currently investigating, which is vast. This argues both for the SEC taking its sweet time, and also for them ultimately letting current officers at Apple off the hook. The other wild card is the shareholder lawsuit on the same matter, and the talk about AGs from some states investigating the possibility of filing charges of their own. The bottom line is that this cloud is not going away quickly, but it looks like it might be starting to disburse. We'll see tomorrow, by how this news is received by the market.

Spidermanjohn
Apr 22, 2007, 11:31 PM
Love the product, but just another rich man getting away with a crime.

gwangung
Apr 23, 2007, 02:46 AM
Love the product, but just another rich man getting away with a crime.

You do know that a lot of middle class workers get the benefit of backdating options, right? That we hear about this is that companie are required to report this? That many, many cases of backdating sail on by because they involve rank and file folks and not top officers?

Shagrat
Apr 23, 2007, 04:13 AM
...Also, I'm curious as to who the hell keeps voting everything negative?
http://www.jerrythefrogproductions.com/Puppets/Lord%20of%20the%20Rings/Troll.jpeg

johnee
Apr 23, 2007, 09:59 AM
I will proudly state that i voted this news negative just so everyone will complain. I mean, what's the big deal if I vote negative? it's my choice and i don't care what you think! haha

It's not clear to me yet WHY he was let off the hook.

I have no blind faith in apple (or anything else) and never will.

I suggest you seek out WHY he was let off the hook. I plan to.

You seriously need to question for the truth and NOT be fanboys/girls.

Gasu E.
Apr 23, 2007, 10:14 AM
Backdating is not illegal, but falsifying documents to cover up backdating is. It's all about the disclosure (at least as far as I understand it, but I'm no expert on the subject).

It's a little bit more complicated than that. One of the beauties about options is that they are a bit of a financial reporting dodge for a company-- even though they are a cost to shareholders, the company is not legally required to report it as a cost, therefore allowing them to overstate earnings (although many companies have recently been "voluntarily" reporting costs due to options). If you backdate, however, the company is legally obligated to report the difference between the current market value and the backdated value as a current expense. A few companies have been doing the backdating without the adjusted accounting, hence the scandal.

Gasu E.
Apr 23, 2007, 10:21 AM
Steve Jobs is pure hearted compared to most corporate big wigs.


LOL, I think you are overstating the case. I admire the Steve as a leader, and love Apple-the-company; but it's apparent to me that Steve is one of the world's great megalomaniacs. Yes, in contrast to Mr. Gates, Steve seems to have seen diminishing returns in terms of self-gratification after the first few hundred million dollars. But all the signs are there of someone who is intensely motivated by amassing power.

Gasu E.
Apr 23, 2007, 10:31 AM
It's not clear to me yet WHY he was let off the hook.


See my previous note. This all stems from a prior revelation by Apple that they needed to adjust earnings to account for backdated options. Several things to keep in mind:

1. Backdating options is legal.

2. Failure to account properly for backdated options is in and of itself is a technical violation of reporting requirements. It is not in and of itself criminal. Companies mistate earnings all the time, then go back and correct earlier reports.

3. Only the intent to defraud is criminal. It is very hard to prove intent. And here are some things that would mitigate against intent:


Reasonably prompt reporting/ correction of the error by the company itself
The fact that the decision-makers did not themselves directly profit from the error.

AidenShaw
Apr 23, 2007, 10:48 AM
http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_5730631

"The Securities and Exchange Commission is expected this week to bring its first legal action in the Apple backdating probe, targeting the company's former top lawyer for her alleged role in rigging options, according to sources familiar with the matter.

Former General Counsel Nancy Heinen's lawyers are vowing to fight any SEC charges, saying she's the scapegoat in an investigation that has generated unusual attention because it involves Apple and Steve Jobs, its famous CEO."

gnasher729
Apr 23, 2007, 10:58 AM
It was a complete accident his 7.5 million shares were backdated massively in his favor. It's not his fault. These things happen when you're Steve Jobs. Petty, petty Feds. Don't they have bigger fish to fry? :D

********.

1. The whole point of giving Steve Jobs stock options was so that he could profit financially. 2. The company had agreed on the exercise price for the options, but issuing the options took time. If they had issued the same options earlier under exactly the same conditions, they would not have been backdated. 3. When all this happened, the rules were different. 4. Steve Jobs returned all the stock options, so the strike price didn't make one bit of a difference. 5. It was Apple Inc. who started the whole investigation without being asked by the SEC or anyone else.

IJ Reilly
Apr 23, 2007, 11:02 AM
See my previous note. This all stems from a prior revelation by Apple that they needed to adjust earnings to account for backdated options. Several things to keep in mind:

1. Backdating options is legal.

2. Failure to account properly for backdated options is in and of itself is a technical violation of reporting requirements. It is not in and of itself criminal. Companies mistate earnings all the time, then go back and correct earlier reports.

3. Only the intent to defraud is criminal. It is very hard to prove intent. And here are some things that would mitigate against intent:


Reasonably prompt reporting/ correction of the error by the company itself
The fact that the decision-makers did not themselves directly profit from the error.


Thanks for this accurate, informed post. Though I suspect that Jobs isn't vulnerable to criminal charges, I would add that the article cites only unnamed sources. We've seen similar, if not quite so detailed, articles on this issue in the past. When they rely so heavily on confidential sources, you have to ask yourself who these sources might be, and why they will speak only off the record. The other things to consider is that the SEC isn't the only possible source of problems for Apple and Jobs, and also that criminality isn't the only potential cause for dismissal.

SiliconAddict
Apr 23, 2007, 11:42 AM
Hmm I wonder what license plates Jobs would punch out?

iPod1, MSSUKS, OSXRKS, OSX4EVR. :p :D

Jarcrew
Apr 23, 2007, 11:55 AM
Even if Jobs was guiltier than John Wilkes Booth, you can bet Apple would find a way to get him out of it smelling like roses. We've all see what happens to Apple when Jobs isn't there.

Clive At Five
Apr 23, 2007, 12:39 PM
So I want to know what will happen to Heinen and Anderson. A measly $50k fine? That's nothing to them. They require reconsequences that will repay the stockholders what they deserve for the damage that not only the "misreported" options caused, but also this investigation has caused on AAPL's stock price.

And for the record, if Steve is guilty, so be it. He should be punished accordingly as well. You know that after he serves his term (or fulfills whatever consequences he faces) Apple will take him back. Until then, Apple will have enough momentum to carry on.

-Clive

EagerDragon
Apr 23, 2007, 12:43 PM
http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_5730631

"The Securities and Exchange Commission is expected this week to bring its first legal action in the Apple backdating probe, targeting the company's former top lawyer for her alleged role in rigging options, according to sources familiar with the matter.

Former General Counsel Nancy Heinen's lawyers are vowing to fight any SEC charges, saying she's the scapegoat in an investigation that has generated unusual attention because it involves Apple and Steve Jobs, its famous CEO."

I hope she does not make a deal with the procecutors so she can get a lesser charge by implicating Steve. IMHO the feds would like to have something om Steve. Real or not, it would look real bad.

johnee
Apr 23, 2007, 01:07 PM
I hope she does not make a deal with the procecutors so she can get a lesser charge by implicating Steve. IMHO the feds would like to have something om Steve. Real or not, it would look real bad.

If she has information which does implicate Steve Jobs, then she is legally obligated to turn that info over, and I hope she does. Steve Jobs should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law just like any other CEO or corporate executive would be.

If Steve Jobs merely said backdating was ok, but didn't enforce their proper accounting, then what do you say to that? He is the CEO, he is ultimately responsible for everything apple does. It's his job to ensure every accounting detail is followed. The fact that he delegates the job to his CFO doesn't mean he's in the clear, he's the one in charge.

If he said backdating was ok, and specifically told the CFO via email or some other provable method to make sure the accounting was done correctly but it wasn't, then that's a grey area, and maybe this is why they are not pressing charges, which I might agree with. After all, he could have made it a point to verify the accounting was done properly knowing people go to jail for things like this.

Swift
Apr 23, 2007, 01:32 PM
Acccording to the Fake Steve Jobs website, the investigation has been kept alive by the Gonzales because Gore is on the board. Though that sounded laughable and pathetic satire when I first heard it, after the latest revelations, you've got to wonder.

milatchi
Apr 23, 2007, 01:42 PM
Jobs Likely to Avoid Criminal Charges in Options Probe

Thank the Lloyd.

IJ Reilly
Apr 23, 2007, 01:50 PM
Acccording to the Fake Steve Jobs website, the investigation has been kept alive by the Gonzales because Gore is on the board. Though that sounded laughable and pathetic satire when I first heard it, after the latest revelations, you've got to wonder.

What revelations?

SeanMcg
Apr 23, 2007, 01:52 PM
I'm not going to comment on the financial and legal issues here as I have no expertise in either. I want to say up front that I have used Apple products for over 25 years and continue to prefer them because of their quality. I would, however, like to make the following observation:

Those who say that Steve jobs is the Greatest CEO and then turn around and wonder what would happen to Apple without him have disproven their initial statement. I fully believe that Steve Jobs is a visionary. Whether or not he is a megalomaniac, I'm not sure, but he is legendary for being a perfectionist and a control freak, at least where his product is concerned. That has both positives and negatives.

Has he brought Apple back from the brink? Yes. Has he provided the guidance - the ideas, even - to produce some really revolutionary products? Yes. Is he the best at giving keynote presentations, presenting the public face of the company? Yes. Has he created a corporate culture or groomed a successor so he could step out and the innovation would continue apace? I don't know. A great CEO creates a company that can run without him. At the very least, he is complicit in tying Apple's fortunes to his presence.

And more to the point, he is human; therefore, he is fallible. Like I said, I'm not going to comment on the legal or financial issues in this case, but I won't say, "he wouldn't do that." Human history has shown too many examples to the contrary, and, again, Steve Jobs is human.

akadmon
Apr 23, 2007, 02:55 PM
Can we have some news, rumors... I'm sick of looking at this 4 day old headline. What, I'm supposed to be happy because SJ gets to live another day in obscene luxury? Get real people -- crooks belong in jail. There, I said it.

jrath1
Apr 23, 2007, 03:53 PM
This really sucks..i was hoping he was going to jail.:p

IJ Reilly
Apr 23, 2007, 07:27 PM
The market seemed to like this report -- AAPL was up nearly 3% on an otherwise down day. Volume was unexceptional, so we'll see how well it holds up when the trading gets heavy, or when the financial report comes out on Wednesday.

Cult Follower
Apr 23, 2007, 08:50 PM
Good news, i am glad steve didn't do anything
:) :)

ulyssespdx
Apr 24, 2007, 12:19 PM
once again, macrumors.com shows it's amateurishness.

Jobs was never at risk of "criminal charges."

also, Apple never said "Jobs approved widespread use of backdating."

for god's sake, will you guys drop the sensationalist nonsense and try writing some meaningful content?

IJ Reilly
Apr 24, 2007, 12:52 PM
once again, macrumors.com shows it's amateurishness.

Jobs was never at risk of "criminal charges."

also, Apple never said "Jobs approved widespread use of backdating."

for god's sake, will you guys drop the sensationalist nonsense and try writing some meaningful content?

Did you even look at the linked article?

WhiteShadow
Apr 25, 2007, 01:45 PM
good to hear, jobs can remain my deity.

Peace
Apr 25, 2007, 01:47 PM
Not sure if anybody's read this yet but.
Yesterday the SEC let Apple,Inc. off the hook (http://yahoo.reuters.com/news/articlehybrid.aspx?storyID=urn:newsml:reuters.com:20070424:MTFH42349_2007-04-24_18-04-15_WAT007385&type=comktNews&rpc=44).