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View Full Version : Definately no PowerBooks on monday, because...


groovebuster
Jun 22, 2003, 02:51 AM
I got an e-mail last night from Apple Germany (Apple Store eNews Juni 2003), promoting the PowerBooks, saying that now is the best time to buy a new PowerBook after the prices were lowered.

This is an almost a 100% sure indication, that neither there will be an anouncement for new PowerBooks tomorrow, nor will they be shipped anytime soon. Otheriwse they wouldn't have made a mailing like that (contraproductive).

So new PowerBooks maybe in 6-8 weeks, but definately not now!

Anybody who is interested, I made the E-Mail a PDF and made it available for download:

The eNews PDF... (http://www.k-media.de/download/enews.pdf)

Let's hope the PowerMacs are coming at least...

groovebuster

Edit: Sorry, the link didn't work right in the beginning because of a nasty line break I didn't see...

QCassidy352
Jun 22, 2003, 02:58 AM
good lord, the 15" powerbook is SO overdue... it's 7 months old now. I really can't believe that if it's going to be another 6-8 weeks that Apple didn't even bring the 15" in line with the others with Al, BT, AE, etc. the Tibooks are really looking dated. Even the "new" powerbooks are at 5+ months now.

solvs
Jun 22, 2003, 03:19 AM
The longer we wait, the better the new ones will be. :D

pianojoe
Jun 22, 2003, 03:21 AM
I love how the email says: "The Apple Store - the number one place to look for lots of fun!"

They must be referring to the leaked specs of course.

maradong
Jun 22, 2003, 04:34 AM
Originally posted by pianojoe
I love how the email says: "The Apple Store - the number one place to look for lots of fun!"

They must be referring to the leaked specs of course.
probably..
thought i still hope that the 12'' pb will be released.
For the german friends.
die hoffnung ist jenes, welche als letztes stirbt.
;-)

vollspacken
Jun 22, 2003, 06:16 AM
Originally posted by maradong
For the german friends.
die hoffnung ist jenes, welche als letztes stirbt.
;-)

;)

Golem
Jun 22, 2003, 09:15 AM
Originally posted by groovebuster
Otheriwse they wouldn't have made a mailing like that (contraproductive).


If they are bringing out new pbooks soon. Now would be a great time for them to sell old stock. But despite your reasoning I sort of agree with you about the timing.

Its past time for 1Ghz G4 15'' ally book The logical time for that was 5 months ago with a slight delay to clear old stock.

The G4 used in 1.25 mdd macs seems to run too hot to be used in a pbook and to the best of my understanding is 1Ghz overclocked anyway.

So that leaves a 970 pbook or a newer model G4 Chip and the next G4 chips are rumored to be months away.

So if no new pbook tomorrow then it will be at least 6-8 weeks before it gets updated

EDIT Mind you definitily this year sometime it is the year of the Powerbook after al. mmmm Big guess Special Event announced with SJ Keynoting 10.3 Is released for retail sales and by the way here is the new 970 Powerbook.

koncept
Jun 22, 2003, 09:29 AM
I don't agree with you because i received the same e-news that only repeats that the prices of the PB were lowered a few weeks ago. The e-news are always late.
I don't think this mail means anything about new PB presentation or not.

Freg3000
Jun 22, 2003, 10:12 AM
Think of it this way. The longer we wait, the more probable a 970 will make its way into a PowerBook!

illumin8
Jun 22, 2003, 10:51 AM
Originally posted by koncept
I don't agree with you because i received the same e-news that only repeats that the prices of the PB were lowered a few weeks ago. The e-news are always late.
I don't think this mail means anything about new PB presentation or not.
I also disagree with him. I just read an Appleinsider forum thread and someone said that an Apple rep came into their store and took all their inventory of 15" PowerBooks on Friday. He said they didn't want anyone to buy one and be angry on Monday. If that's not confirmation that a new 15" PowerBook will be available on Monday, I don't know what is. I'll find the link in just a minute.

QCassidy352
Jun 22, 2003, 11:43 AM
Originally posted by illumin8
I also disagree with him. I just read an Appleinsider forum thread and someone said that an Apple rep came into their store and took all their inventory of 15" PowerBooks on Friday. He said they didn't want anyone to buy one and be angry on Monday. If that's not confirmation that a new 15" PowerBook will be available on Monday, I don't know what is. I'll find the link in just a minute.

uh, that sort of thing has never concerned apple though. They'll sell you a g4 tower at current price right up until 1 minute before the keynote.

CoffeeMMM
Jun 22, 2003, 11:56 AM
I'm no Sherlock Holmes, but maybe I can do some deductive reasoning for this whole "new PowerBook at WWDC" quandary.

The first thing we know is that Apple is having huge issues pushing the 15" PowerBooks, as the super-sleek 12" and 17" models have all but stopped the previously stagnating sales of the older model Ti-Book. This shortage, in conjunction with huge product surpluses, tells us that Apple had no intention of introducing a 15-incher at the last Macworld expo, but wanted to slowly reduce stock levels until it could do something wonderful with a computer that is almost 3-4 years outdated design-wise.

Now, with all the indications that stock levels are low, we are bound to see at least *something* at WWDC, even if it is just a tantalizing "first look" at a newer product. Some options:

1) Apple ups the processor speed/basic specs on the entire PowerBook line (think more RAM, faster SuperDrive, or *slightly* faster processors) and drops the prices a little more. This to spark sales even more in "The Year Of The Notebook" until a newer 15" AiBook is introduced, or the 970/G5 makes its way to the PowerBook line this fall. I don't see this as a realistic possibility as:
-Apple has just slashed prices 10%-15% on the 12" and 15" models, meaning they are due for some form of update or processor bump just based on the lower prices.
-Let's face the facts, all of us who buy the "reduced price model" right before a MacWorld Expo have kicked ourselves after the Keynote, right?
-Apple has gone to all the trouble of draining stock levels so low on 15" TiBooks, now the least-sexy of the PowerBook line, why would they fill the supplier and reseller channels with more "outdated" models, only to have to go through the same stock-purging next fall with the advent of the 970 PB?

2) Apple already concedes that the 12" and 17" PowerBooks aren't really a "true PowerBook", as they both fit somewhat smaller "niche markets" (CS Students/Those who want a PowerBook on the cheap buy the 12", publishing/design/offline video editing professionals buy the 17"). As per Apple standards (and common business practices for "model overlap/separation"), the 15" PowerBook is supposed to meet the needs of 60% of the Pro customer base (best mix of features and price) while the other models are only supposed to capture 15%-25% of the market *each* (i.e. those who want to spend less for less, or those who want to spend *way* more and get more).

Thus, Apple introduces a new version of the 15", possibly with a Titanium casing, possibly with an updated black-anodized Titanium casing, or probably with the "new school" aluminum casing, to update - and raise the bar for - the PowerBook line. It may or may not include the PPC 970, although my bet is that it does, as Apple has set the stage with Panther, price cuts, supply shortages, and customer purchasing frenzy just perfectly. We could also see a newer, lower-power variant of the higher-speed IBM chips running at 64-bits to supplant the 970 line in the Pro desktop line. The other models will probably be updated with faster processors and minor updates to main-board infrastructure (DVI for the 12", USB 2.0, etc.) but will be overshadowed with the introduction of the new "gold standard" PowerBook. This seems like the most reasonably possibility to me because:
-As already mentioned, the price drops and supply shortages have been long in the making. Apple would be naïve to not use this opportunity to push dozens of thousands of new 970-based PowerBooks to hungry customers who have been holding off on replacing their outdated 15-inchers. They would fly off the shelves.
-Again, it has been more than 3 years since the line has seen an update. If they left the PowerBook line as it is until September - or later - they'd better have a darn good reason to do so.
-Let's think about "The Year Of The Notebook". Steve's essentially been juicing us up for a 15" update since the January Keynote when he introduced what he deemed "The Year Of The Notebook". Do you think he would introduce two such marvelous products right at the start of the year, then wait until the end of said year to update the flagship product? If he wants to deliver some serious "we sold x number of PowerBooks last year" numbers in the "state of the Mac" address next January, he'd better give us something to drool, dream, and die for ASAP! Steve's too good a marketing/PR genius to screw this much hype up. He's got us convinced we want a new PowerBook this year, and the 12" and 17" were for the users who haven't wanted a PowerBook before. He met their needs, now he's going to give every die-hard PowerBook user out there a reason to miss a couple of months of rent.
-With the new PPC chips all but certain in their imminent arrival, why would another boring speed bump in the G4 arena be even *remotely* a possibility?
-The introduction of a new chipset/architecture to the flagship model will give the PB design team some time to give the new chip a "real world run" so they can optimize it for introduction in the 12" and 17" models in January/Next summer.
-Steve likes surprises. He likes it when the crowd stands up and screams. He likes standing ovations and good reviews, and even more than the attention he likes giving CS nerds and Wintel Lusers alike something to kick themselves for: not buying a Mac.

3) Apple rolls the entire PowerBook line to 970/Gobi/Whatever and updates internal architecture and the case on the 15-incher to compare with the other 12" and 17" models. Speed bumps and a new trick or two (DVI on the 12-incher, fiber-optic keyboard on the 15-incher) round out the updates. I think this is highly improbably because:
-Simply put, Steve wouldn't throw another product into the ever-more-complicated Apple product lineup that would disturb the installed customer base like this brazen move. 6 months after introducing the newest members of the PowerBook line, Steve would have to have cojones like grapefruits to obsolesce that many products (and customers). Just think how pissed dozens - if not hundreds - of thousands of customers would be if they dropped between $2K and $4K and then saw their recent investment wither to nothing? And don't forget how cool-conscious Apple customers are. People would take outright offence to it; there would be mutiny! Steve's too good at politicking to piss off that many people in hopes of enticing a couple more "switchers" to the Mac side with bigger processor numbers and so on.

So there you have it, my relatively-informed and pseudo-objective take on the PowerBook situation. Let's all hope for something "too cool for school" on Monday!

Keeping my fingers crossed...

-JK

maradong
Jun 22, 2003, 01:44 PM
Originally posted by vollspacken
;)
well there is still a typo ;-)
=> should be :
die hoffnung ist jenes, welches als letztes stirbt.

maradong
Jun 22, 2003, 01:46 PM
Originally posted by CoffeeMMM
I'm no Sherlock Holmes, but maybe I can do some deductive reasoning for this whole "new PowerBook at WWDC" quandary.

The first thing we know is that Apple is having huge issues pushing the 15" PowerBooks, as the super-sleek 12" and 17" models have all but stopped the previously stagnating sales of the older model Ti-Book. This shortage, in conjunction with huge product surpluses, tells us that Apple had no intention of introducing a 15-incher at the last Macworld expo, but wanted to slowly reduce stock levels until it could do something wonderful with a computer that is almost 3-4 years outdated design-wise.

Now, with all the indications that stock levels are low, we are bound to see at least *something* at WWDC, even if it is just a tantalizing "first look" at a newer product. Some options:

1) Apple ups the processor speed/basic specs on the entire PowerBook line (think more RAM, faster SuperDrive, or *slightly* faster processors) and drops the prices a little more. This to spark sales even more in "The Year Of The Notebook" until a newer 15" AiBook is introduced, or the 970/G5 makes its way to the PowerBook line this fall. I don't see this as a realistic possibility as:
-Apple has just slashed prices 10%-15% on the 12" and 15" models, meaning they are due for some form of update or processor bump just based on the lower prices.
-Let's face the facts, all of us who buy the "reduced price model" right before a MacWorld Expo have kicked ourselves after the Keynote, right?
-Apple has gone to all the trouble of draining stock levels so low on 15" TiBooks, now the least-sexy of the PowerBook line, why would they fill the supplier and reseller channels with more "outdated" models, only to have to go through the same stock-purging next fall with the advent of the 970 PB?

2) Apple already concedes that the 12" and 17" PowerBooks aren't really a "true PowerBook", as they both fit somewhat smaller "niche markets" (CS Students/Those who want a PowerBook on the cheap buy the 12", publishing/design/offline video editing professionals buy the 17"). As per Apple standards (and common business practices for "model overlap/separation"), the 15" PowerBook is supposed to meet the needs of 60% of the Pro customer base (best mix of features and price) while the other models are only supposed to capture 15%-25% of the market *each* (i.e. those who want to spend less for less, or those who want to spend *way* more and get more).

Thus, Apple introduces a new version of the 15", possibly with a Titanium casing, possibly with an updated black-anodized Titanium casing, or probably with the "new school" aluminum casing, to update - and raise the bar for - the PowerBook line. It may or may not include the PPC 970, although my bet is that it does, as Apple has set the stage with Panther, price cuts, supply shortages, and customer purchasing frenzy just perfectly. We could also see a newer, lower-power variant of the higher-speed IBM chips running at 64-bits to supplant the 970 line in the Pro desktop line. The other models will probably be updated with faster processors and minor updates to main-board infrastructure (DVI for the 12", USB 2.0, etc.) but will be overshadowed with the introduction of the new "gold standard" PowerBook. This seems like the most reasonably possibility to me because:
-As already mentioned, the price drops and supply shortages have been long in the making. Apple would be naïve to not use this opportunity to push dozens of thousands of new 970-based PowerBooks to hungry customers who have been holding off on replacing their outdated 15-inchers. They would fly off the shelves.
-Again, it has been more than 3 years since the line has seen an update. If they left the PowerBook line as it is until September - or later - they'd better have a darn good reason to do so.
-Let's think about "The Year Of The Notebook". Steve's essentially been juicing us up for a 15" update since the January Keynote when he introduced what he deemed "The Year Of The Notebook". Do you think he would introduce two such marvelous products right at the start of the year, then wait until the end of said year to update the flagship product? If he wants to deliver some serious "we sold x number of PowerBooks last year" numbers in the "state of the Mac" address next January, he'd better give us something to drool, dream, and die for ASAP! Steve's too good a marketing/PR genius to screw this much hype up. He's got us convinced we want a new PowerBook this year, and the 12" and 17" were for the users who haven't wanted a PowerBook before. He met their needs, now he's going to give every die-hard PowerBook user out there a reason to miss a couple of months of rent.
-With the new PPC chips all but certain in their imminent arrival, why would another boring speed bump in the G4 arena be even *remotely* a possibility?
-The introduction of a new chipset/architecture to the flagship model will give the PB design team some time to give the new chip a "real world run" so they can optimize it for introduction in the 12" and 17" models in January/Next summer.
-Steve likes surprises. He likes it when the crowd stands up and screams. He likes standing ovations and good reviews, and even more than the attention he likes giving CS nerds and Wintel Lusers alike something to kick themselves for: not buying a Mac.

3) Apple rolls the entire PowerBook line to 970/Gobi/Whatever and updates internal architecture and the case on the 15-incher to compare with the other 12" and 17" models. Speed bumps and a new trick or two (DVI on the 12-incher, fiber-optic keyboard on the 15-incher) round out the updates. I think this is highly improbably because:
-Simply put, Steve wouldn't throw another product into the ever-more-complicated Apple product lineup that would disturb the installed customer base like this brazen move. 6 months after introducing the newest members of the PowerBook line, Steve would have to have cojones like grapefruits to obsolesce that many products (and customers). Just think how pissed dozens - if not hundreds - of thousands of customers would be if they dropped between $2K and $4K and then saw their recent investment wither to nothing? And don't forget how cool-conscious Apple customers are. People would take outright offence to it; there would be mutiny! Steve's too good at politicking to piss off that many people in hopes of enticing a couple more "switchers" to the Mac side with bigger processor numbers and so on.

So there you have it, my relatively-informed and pseudo-objective take on the PowerBook situation. Let's all hope for something "too cool for school" on Monday!

Keeping my fingers crossed...

-JK

WOW !
now that has certainly been a big bunch of work. how long has it taken to write all that ?:eek:

thought it is a really good mirror of what I think, but forumlated in a genius way. it s really wonderful.

P.s. Where from ? Is english your first language?

Sun Baked
Jun 22, 2003, 02:31 PM
Wow is right...

That blows away in pure length the simple explanation of it just being part of the keep OS 9 alive another 6 months by the marketing department.

Sort of like building a Rube Goldberg explanation. :eek:

But rumor mongering is so much more fun than the truth... wonder what they'd do for the education market who wants to retain OS 9 bootablility. ;)

CoffeeMMM
Jun 22, 2003, 03:21 PM
Originally posted by maradong
WOW !
now that has certainly been a big bunch of work. how long has it taken to write all that ?:eek:
...
P.s. Where from ? Is english your first language?

I didn't really even notice how long it was until I submitted it. Time flies when you're having fun (wildly speculating on the ever-amazing Steve Jobs, that is). Sorry if it was a little long-winded, I just wanted my first post on this forum to make sense.

I'm a Canadian, eh. Hail from Toronto, but go to school in Halifax, eh.

Originally posted by Sun Baked
That blows away in pure length the simple explanation of it just being part of the keep OS 9 alive another 6 months by the marketing department.
...
But rumor mongering is so much more fun than the truth... wonder what they'd do for the education market who wants to retain OS 9 bootablility.

As much as I'd like to believe the "OS9" argument, I eventually had to rule it out for two reasons:

-Firstly, Apple's been hankering to drop OS9 for two years now. As much as the backward-compatibility issues seem to arise with legacy customers (especially education), Apple always likes to drag customers kicking and screaming into "a new age of technology." It happened when they discontinued the floppy, the ADB, and SCSI for the CD-RW, USB, and FireWire. Now we can't live without it all, and Wintel "lusers" who mention "parallel cables" or "PS/2 mouse ports" are laughed out of the conversation by Apple "purists." With G5 imminently around the corner, Apple would like nothing better than to excise it's "Patchwork Legacy" of OS9 and step boldly into a pure-UNIX-based system. Just think: no backwards compatibility *at all*! Grab some competent computer science students and pay them minimum wage to recode everything else out there that runs in Classic, then spend the next decade living in the beautiful stability of an inherently more reliable system architecture.

-Secondly, although a Uni student with a PowerBook (albeit an outdated one), I rarely see compadres with anything other than an iBook or iMac. The price of the entry-level systems appeal to cheap university students, un-paid TA's, and underpaid professors rather than the sleek sexiness of the TiBook/AiBook family. Also, as the production manager of our University's student Magazine and Paper, I can categorically affirm that once we get our 3-dozen licenses of Quark 6 for OSX to run on all our new G4 towers and iMacs, OS9 will only be a bitter, bug- and crash-ridden memory at the back of my mind as I seamlessly publish the paper single-handedly and from my PowerBook in a sunny café. The computer specialist for my school and I are in agreement, and - no offence intended - if the temptations of Panther and the imminent G5's don't want to make you refuse to run *any* application in Classic ever again, you must be CRAZY! Running OS9 at a school where CS is taught on Sun UNIX machines just makes me cringe.

Farewell, System 9, I knew thee well.

Originally posted by Sun Baked
Sort of like building a Rube Goldberg explanation.

Well, an English/Business Major with a background in CS is a dangerous thing on a lazy pre-WWDC Sunday afternoon. :D

-JK

Sun Baked
Jun 22, 2003, 03:36 PM
>CoffeeMMM

See you're looking at it from the viewpoint of the University as an education market, there is still a whole world of education before you get to college.

A lot of these schools are in budget crisis mode in the US and still have old equipment and software, dragging these schools into the 21st century may mean a switch to Windows if you push hard enough.

Apple made huge mistakes recently in the education market here that killed their traditional market share, killing OS 9 here may be another mistake.

Heck, ask some of the young people still in school here. Not all the schools are running the latest hardware and software, making them buy new computers that no longer work with the equipment the do have, may be blessing for MS vendors (remember all the scanners, printers, etc. that didn't work under OS X)

groovebuster
Jun 23, 2003, 12:16 AM
Originally posted by maradong
well there is still a typo ;-)
=> should be :
die hoffnung ist jenes, welches als letztes stirbt.

Still sounds a little bit too complicated and funny somehow. Nobody would talk like that nowadays anymore and even poets from old times wouldn't say it like that, since it just doesn't sound good. Or do you have a source? Maybe you know my language better than I do! ;)

Just say:

Die Hoffnung stirbt immer zuletzt!

That's short and precise and nobody look weird at you if you would say that in public! ;)

groovebuster

groovebuster
Jun 24, 2003, 12:39 AM
So my conclusions were right! :)

Regards,

groovebuster

CoffeeMMM
Jun 27, 2003, 02:53 AM
Originally posted by groovebuster
So my conclusions were right! :)


Seems like I seem to know the system better than Steve. Or he's just not playing by the same rules as he used to. I mean, no new 15-incher and we're already halfway through the "year of the notebook"? Sheesh!

They're probably having problems porting the new '57 G4 to the smaller form factor. Really, who knows.

I guess hindsight is, as they say groovebuster, 20/20. At least one of the two possibilities you presented was right. :p

Keep hoping everybody,

-JK