PDA

View Full Version : the g5 look: it doesn't really matter


appleforlife14
Jun 26, 2003, 01:31 PM
the looks of a machine could be important, but all that really matters is that the g5 is the fastest personal computer ever made. if you dont buy it because you dont have the dough, fine. but if you dont because you dont like the looks? that seems a bit odd. and if you're buying for looks, why dont you buy an iMac??

altivec 2003
Jun 26, 2003, 02:28 PM
Your pretty much right, but i still do think that look is somewhat important. If you gave a person the option, i am sure they would choose a better looking computer over a computer of the same performance that looks like crap. Not to say that they g5 looks like crap. In fact, its look has been growing on me and I am sure that I wouldn't mind it in real life. I mainly hate what it looks like in the picutres cause on my monitor it looks like a solid color on the front that is really ugly while there are actually vents. Even if it looked worse i wouldn't mind having one ;), so i see what you are saying.

Mr. Anderson
Jun 26, 2003, 02:33 PM
Personally, I never liked the MDD macs (last set of G4 towers). When I saw the screen shots from WWDC of the new G5 enclosure I thought is was really a step backward. But after seeing it on the Apple website, I really like it.

And I think that everyone is going to have to go and see one of these in person. They are quite cool and I look forward to having one.....:D

D

Veldek
Jun 26, 2003, 03:26 PM
Originally posted by Mr. Anderson
They are quite cool and I look forward to having one.....:D

D

May I ask you, which model you plan to buy?

Mr. Anderson
Jun 26, 2003, 03:32 PM
Originally posted by Veldek
May I ask you, which model you plan to buy?

Dual 2.0 - I really need the power. I have a dual 1.25 at work but only a single 450 G4 at home (the G5 is for home). I rendered a 500 frame animation yesterday at work and it took 16 hours - and it was not all that special....:( A G5 would have done that in less than 4 hours, maybe even 3.

Unlike a lot of individuals running around here shouting 'Give me a G5!' - I think I'm in the minority that would actually use it to capacity - and running Folding@home doesn't count ;). Its still not fast enough though, nothing short of a render farm is yet. Maybe in 5 years or so there might be something I'd be happy with - but more than likely its going to be at least 10 before I get a single machine that can do things fast enough.

D

Skandranon
Jun 26, 2003, 03:59 PM
... that the way the iMac was parodied and snickered at when it's first Bondi Blue iteration released a few years back, the Power Mac G5 design has seen only the beginnign of a lot of cheese grater jokes from some folks.

Yet I believe it will one day be heralded for its pioneering design. A pragmatic, as opposed to an aesthetic, approach to design is one that might very well dominate industrial design in years to come. And people will look back and point at the G5 as one of the primary influences of said movement.

The other day I was admiring the translucent curves of the Nissan Altima's taillights... then remembered that it was Apple's landmark product design that made translucent plastics cool.

Laslo Panaflex
Jun 26, 2003, 04:02 PM
The new towers are awsome, and from what I read from the wired Ives interview, they are clean and easy to work on. I cannot wait for mine to arrive. . . whenever that may be.

Dont Hurt Me
Jun 26, 2003, 04:07 PM
I really thought/think apple can take the plastic flow look a long ways, maybe corporate/beuracratic/cold hard steel I mean aluminum for the pro's and soft shapely feel good plastic flow for us cooler consumers who do outnumber the pro's.....see Wintel market...... anyways apple keeps us guessing.

Dont Hurt Me
Jun 26, 2003, 04:08 PM
Originally posted by Laslo Panaflex
The new towers are awsome, and from what I read from the wired Ives interview, they are clean and easy to work on. I cannot wait for mine to arrive. . . whenever that may be. what speed did you get if i may ask??

Flowbee
Jun 26, 2003, 04:11 PM
I think, much like the aluminum powerbooks, the new G5 will look much better in person than it does on Apple's website. I'm looking forward to seeing one "in the flesh." Having said that, It does seem to be a poor match (style-wise) with Apple's current displays and keyboards/mice. I wouldn't be surprised if we were to see updates before the g5's ship.

Dont Hurt Me
Jun 26, 2003, 04:30 PM
Lets hope so, can you imagine a emac keyboard ? i guess they could paint it grey instead of white but i would like to see a keyboard like the one on the 17" powerbook! thats a keyboard! Lighted keys so you can see in the dark. and nice feel.

machinehead
Jun 26, 2003, 04:32 PM
Originally posted by Skandranon
A pragmatic, as opposed to an aesthetic, approach to design is one that might very well dominate industrial design in years to come. And people will look back and point at the G5 as one of the primary infuences of said movement.


Talk about pragmatic ... the asymmetric (left side) placement of the ports on the front is a real in-your-face gesture. It might have shortened the wiring to the circuit board, hinting that engineering trumped aesthetics.

No compromise. I love it. The drop-dead handsome actor with the off-center nose from a youthful bar brawl.

Laslo Panaflex
Jun 26, 2003, 04:50 PM
Originally posted by Dont Hurt Me
what speed did you get if i may ask??

I put a down payment for a dual 2gig, we don't have an apple store near here, but we do have a store called macsuperstore (http://www.macsuper.com). I put down 100 dollars and will pay for the rest when it arrives in store. I like supporting local businesses.

Dont Hurt Me
Jun 26, 2003, 05:36 PM
I noticed that link has a total different back look/ venting then what was in Apples's technology overview. the pdf showed 2 distinct exhaust fans where this link shows the whole back vented? Interesting! 2 gi vs single 1.8 & 1.6?? different cooling and fan lay out?

Sun Baked
Jun 26, 2003, 05:45 PM
It's also the first hint of any power management features, should be interesting to see what comes with the XServe. ;)Originally posted by dete:
Cool thermal management stuff:

"Thermal management isn't really about cooling, it's about noise."

(I'm going to assume that everyone knows the basic details: 9 fans, 4 zones, etc.)

The power supply zone has two fans which run at constant speed. The power supply runs along the bottom of the case and is very thin [probably similar/same to PS in Xserve].

The drive bay fans are controlled based on the exhaust temperature.

The PCI/AGP zone fans are controlled based on the power draw of the cards! They couldn't know where to put a sensor because any one of the cards could be hot, so they just count on the fact that the heat output is equal to the power draw.

The speed of the CPU fans is based on the internal temperature of the chips themselves. The four fan design (two push, two pull) significantly reduces noise since a vast majority of fan noise is due to back pressure. The two pull fans run in tandem, but each push fan is individually linked to one of the CPUs. In a single CPU system, there are only three fans (one push, two pull).

Normally, the machines are running at about 2/3 their total clock speed (for 2GHz machines, this is 1.4GHz), this jumps up to the full speed whenever it's required. The ramp time up or down is ~1ms, but the CPU is running normally during this time, so there is no performance "hiccup". This results in about 60% power/heat savings, which jumps up to about 85% savings if the machine is idle and they "turn on other power saving features". When idle, the CPU fans are barely turning.

The fans have Xserve-like monitoring. They know how much power they are putting into the fan and how many RPM they are running. So, if the fan fails, they know immediately. They also can warn the user if the fan is running more slowly than it should based on the power input (indicative of pending failure).

Tidbits: If you take the plastic air-channelling liner out of the machine, it will go to sleep and won't wake up until the liner is replaced. If the CPU fans are going full-blast and the CPUs are still over-heating, they will throttle back the CPU speed, or even go to sleep, rather than risk blowing the chip. (This is only likely to occur if you are exceeding environmental tolerances, i.e. it's in a stupidly hot room.)

During the Q&A session, Peter Sandon (thx MrNSX!) was asked about other power saving features. His response: "I can talk more about that in a couple of months."

Whew! Three long posts from a single session. :D

jbomber
Jun 26, 2003, 05:47 PM
The New Powermac G5

Shaves as close as a blade, or your money back.

blogo
Jun 26, 2003, 06:15 PM
Originally posted by Dont Hurt Me
I noticed that link has a total different back look/ venting then what was in Apples's technology overview. the pdf showed 2 distinct exhaust fans where this link shows the whole back vented? Interesting! 2 gi vs single 1.8 & 1.6?? different cooling and fan lay out?

Its the front, and that just some crappy imageconverting that made it look that way.

jefhatfield
Jun 28, 2003, 10:55 AM
Originally posted by appleforlife14
the looks of a machine could be important, but all that really matters is that the g5 is the fastest personal computer ever made. if you dont buy it because you dont have the dough, fine. but if you dont because you dont like the looks? that seems a bit odd. and if you're buying for looks, why dont you buy an iMac??

the g5 is certainly not as gracious or curvy as the previous g3 and g4 towers, but at this point i think many of us are happy that the g5 has the goods under the hood

Thom_Edwards
Jun 28, 2003, 11:25 AM
i like the look of the new powermacs, as most of us do. but for any "die-hard" mac user to suddenly say, "who cares if it's not so pretty" is just insane. how long have we (myself included) talked about those "fugly pc boxes" and how stylish and sexy our boxes are? i don't know if any of you have ever used the good looks of a (slow) mac as an argument for superiority, but i know most of us have!

i'm not trying to troll here or anything, but this is the kind of stuff that just ruins credibility. people can't rave on about the appearance of macs, saying it's sooo important, and then come out and say, "well, it's not so important after all now that they're fast." that's just saying to the rest of the world that macs were slow and all they had were good looks. a lot like a dingy blonde!?

i'm done. commence with the flames...

voicegy
Jun 28, 2003, 11:33 AM
At first look, I, like a lot of other's, blinked twice upon seeing the G5, and I had my reservations. Ugh! Cheese grater.

Same thing happened to me when I saw the first iMac. Ick! Dinosaur egg.

Not to mention the flat panel iMac. Hahaha! Lump, stick, rectangle.

The only machine that Apple has ever made, in my opinion, that could be considered a thing of beauty from a design standpoint right off the bat, with no hesitation, was the TAM. It still has the power to make me gasp, and it was the focal entertainment point in my home for guests for years. You just HAVE to admire it, right from the get-go.

Not that Apple was never "serious" about computing, they've realized that serious computing power should, well, look serious. Ever since the very first Mac, the PC world, and business world in general, have derided the Apple look as playful and toy-like, i.e., not a series of serious machines for serious work. Apple is dipping their toe in all things enterprise and attempting to woo customers whom they haven't played to very well in the past. The G5 is, upon a few days' reflection on my part, the most serious looking machine they've made for prosumer/desktop use, and it still doesn't look like all the other beige/black stupid boxes out there.

A new processor needed a new look. And along with the brains and the brawn of this big leap forward, the beauty is in the sleek, modern, hard look of this particular enclosure. Call it Steve's Reality Distortion Field...whatever it is, Apple's done it again...warmed me up to a machine that I did NOT like the looks of at first glance, for me anyway, to the point of admiration for the subtle psychology behind the enclosure.

Who else but Apple? :)

Dont Hurt Me
Jun 28, 2003, 11:46 AM
Originally posted by Eple
Its the front, and that just some crappy imageconverting that made it look that way. Thank you, i didnt know what i was seeing. Any comments on how tall this is compared to the current powermac? I saw a picture and noticed its to tall for my computer space. Did they really need to go this high?? My powermac fits with less then 1 inch to spare.

Dont Hurt Me
Jun 28, 2003, 12:47 PM
here is what i mean

ZildjianKX
Jun 28, 2003, 02:00 PM
Still feels weird to hear fellow mac users say they don't care about looks, when half the time they yell at PC users for saying PCs don't have the looks.

I still don't greatly care for how the tower looks, especially when I think the G4 towers look really cool and is smaller in size. I better buy the next ALbook that comes out before they make it look like a cheese grater :)

tazo
Jun 28, 2003, 02:46 PM
If a pile of dog crap contained the G5 you wouldnt care about the smell? Or its appearance on your desk next to your cinema display? Of course.

WannabeSQ
Jun 28, 2003, 10:12 PM
Originally posted by Dont Hurt Me
here is what i mean

You know, It almost looks as if a Firewire CD drive might fit on top of the case, but not be taller than the handle, so that should reduce some desktop clutter.

But damn, that thing is tall, you'd think they could have fit another CD drive and another 2 hard drive bays behind it. But oh well, I have been used to only one CD drive and only 3 pci slots, so its not a "downgrade" for me. I eagerly anticipate the day when I get one, provided I have enough dough.

BTW, does anyone know if this thing is gonna be hard to come by once it is shipping? I ask because I don't have the funds now to purchase, but will by the time they come out. Should I pre order one anyway even if I can't cover the charges? They wont bill me until it ships i bet.

iJon
Jun 28, 2003, 10:20 PM
im just glad it also has a clear sie window, cold cathode time and i can have it match my pc.

iJon

jbomber
Jun 28, 2003, 11:07 PM
Originally posted by Dont Hurt Me
here is what i mean


man, that thing is GINORMOUS!
it's never gonna fit on my desk....

jayscheuerle
Jun 29, 2003, 12:01 AM
...but not at the expense of functionality. At least the processor's up to snuff here, but I worry about dust collection on the front of the machine (not unlike the lint trap in my clothes dryer).

I'm betting that some 3rd party manufacter will come up with optical drives or even Zips that perfectly fit in the space created by the handle on top.

It will be interesting to see how the real-world shipping models behave. - j

WannabeSQ
Jun 29, 2003, 12:10 AM
Originally posted by jayscheuerle

I'm betting that some 3rd party manufacter will come up with optical drives or even Zips that perfectly fit in the space created by the handle on top.


I bet someone will come up with something. IIRC, someone made a floppy/zip drive bay that mounted on top of the original Blue and White G3 that used a USB-IDE bridge. Now with firewire, they could make a cool case that holds a 5.25" drive and a couple hard drives. I bet that would sell very well if it were priced right.

jbomber
Jun 29, 2003, 12:25 AM
hehehe... cheese grater. Ive has got to be rethinking some of those decisions right about now...

tjwett
Jun 30, 2003, 11:01 AM
Originally posted by jbomber
hehehe... cheese grater. Ive has got to be rethinking some of those decisions right about now...

yeah, he is rethinking them as he sits on his solid platinum toilet with the diamond-studded ivory seat, wiping his ass with hundred dollar bills. i don't think he's had to rethink a single decision yet. well, maybe the original clamshell iBook.

jbomber
Jun 30, 2003, 12:42 PM
Originally posted by tjwett
yeah, he is rethinking them as he sits on his solid platinum toilet with the diamond-studded ivory seat, wiping his ass with hundred dollar bills. i don't think he's had to rethink a single decision yet. well, maybe the original clamshell iBook.

Im guessing the toilet seat also has holes in it for maximum airflow..... :p

jayscheuerle
Jun 30, 2003, 12:49 PM
Originally posted by jbomber
Im guessing the toilet seat also has holes in it for maximum airflow..... :p

At least one... - j

Foxer
Jun 30, 2003, 01:49 PM
I had no idea it was so much larger than the G4. Glad my CPU satnd is adjustable!

jbomber
Jun 30, 2003, 02:36 PM
Originally posted by tjwett
yeah, he is rethinking them as he sits on his solid platinum toilet with the diamond-studded ivory seat, wiping his ass with hundred dollar bills. i don't think he's had to rethink a single decision yet. well, maybe the original clamshell iBook.

hehe, anyway i doubt Jonathan Ives wipes his own ass with hundred dollar bills...... Apple has interns, don't they? :D

Mr. Anderson
Jun 30, 2003, 02:42 PM
Originally posted by Dont Hurt Me
here is what i mean

Ouch! That's huge, I'm surprised its so much bigger....and all that extra space and you have less options.....weird.

D

jayscheuerle
Jun 30, 2003, 02:50 PM
I could see squeezing Play-Dough through those holes to make hair (like the Play-Dough Barber Shop)....

jbomber
Jun 30, 2003, 04:59 PM
you could use it to drain pasta, too.

agreenster
Jun 30, 2003, 05:25 PM
Originally posted by Mr. Anderson
Dual 2.0 - I really need the power. I have a dual 1.25 at work but only a single 450 G4 at home (the G5 is for home). I rendered a 500 frame animation yesterday at work and it took 16 hours - and it was not all that special....:( A G5 would have done that in less than 4 hours, maybe even 3.

Unlike a lot of individuals running around here shouting 'Give me a G5!' - I think I'm in the minority that would actually use it to capacity - and running Folding@home doesn't count ;). Its still not fast enough though, nothing short of a render farm is yet. Maybe in 5 years or so there might be something I'd be happy with - but more than likely its going to be at least 10 before I get a single machine that can do things fast enough.

D

Im with you there. It will be a long time till we see actual hardware rendering of complex imagery. The day is coming, but far off. Could you imagine animating with real time, fully rendered particles that interact with the animator as they keyframe? Hot damn. Animating Finding Nemo would be more like playing a video game.

PS: I actually LIKE the looks of the G5