Mac Mini To Be Discontinued? [Archive]

MacRumors

May 24, 2007, 11:17 AM

http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

Apple's diminuitive Mac Mini's days are numbered (http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/07/05/24/closing_the_book_on_apples_mac_mini.html) according to Appleinsider.

Whether Apple will squeeze another revision from the mini, and how long it plans to allow existing models to linger, are both unclear. But as the extended Memorial Day break dawns upon us, the point being driven should be clear:

Ladies and gentlemen, AppleInsider believes in all sincerity that the Mac mini is dead.

The Mini, which is the last of Apple's computers to use Intel's 32-bit Core Duo processors, has gone 260 days since its last update, more than 100 days over its average update span according to our Buyers Guide (http://www.macrumors.com/buyersguide/#Mac_mini).

brad.c

May 24, 2007, 11:18 AM

I doubt it, but you never know. It makes perfect sense as a backup device/dedicated media terminal. If that market has proved too small to justify the continuity of the device, it's simply through lacklustre marketing, or failure to identify and target the demographic past "switchers".

If it does go the way of the Cube, I'll feel for the people who wanted one but who haven't pulled the trigger yet. On the other hand, should I ever part with my new living room pal, this may help the resale value.

Does anybody think this is just the first step in announcing a new mid-level box? Out with the old before the new is announced? Say, next month?

Mgkwho

May 24, 2007, 11:20 AM

wow

I've been hoping for an awesome revision to the mac mini to make it even smaller and more powerful.

I know Jobs has been reluectant to include any low offering their product line; hopefully they can revive the mac mini with a mind-blowing form factor and awesome performance.

-=|Mgkwho

epochblue

May 24, 2007, 11:20 AM

Think it's possible they'll just rebrand the mini as an AppleTV? AppleTV 2.0, perhaps? Give the current AppleTV a little more storage space and a little more OS X to it and ditch the mini?

kenzbud

May 24, 2007, 11:21 AM

I will be quite upset if they discontinued the Mini without replacing with a similar computer around the same price range.

Eidorian

May 24, 2007, 11:21 AM

And what's to replace the mini...

PlaceofDis

May 24, 2007, 11:21 AM

yes. and i hope this makes way for a mid-range tower. :p but thats just wishful thinking isn't it?

Turkish

May 24, 2007, 11:21 AM

Not surprising.

They aren't/haven't ever sold well and by the time you get one that has decent specs, you may as well get the $999 iMac.

kitki83

May 24, 2007, 11:22 AM

ahh I liked the mac mini, always thought it would be cool to run my server.

DeaconGraves

May 24, 2007, 11:23 AM

:confused: Is there any source or proof to this? Or is it just a slow news day?

Corrosive vinyl

May 24, 2007, 11:23 AM

I am very saddened by this, and was interested in owning one later down the road, the sub $800 small footprint machine indeed. It begs to bring up the question, is apple computer really just apple inc. a ghost of its former self. Is it taking so much fat off its bones that it is starving itself?

LoganT

May 24, 2007, 11:25 AM

God I hope so.

We need more room for a mid-range tower! :)

mashinhead

May 24, 2007, 11:25 AM

i read this before it was posted on MR and the impression i got from it is it's just AI speculation, It's not based on any source.

tyr2

May 24, 2007, 11:25 AM

longofest

May 24, 2007, 11:25 AM

:confused: Is there any source or proof to this? Or is it just a slow news day?

from AI:
Therefore, it comes as little surprise that sources, for whom AppleInsider holds the utmost respect, are now pointing towards the mini's impending demise.

TGM85

May 24, 2007, 11:26 AM

Not surprising.

They aren't/haven't ever sold well

What are you smoking man ?

The mac mini has helped tons of people make the switch to OS X... saying it wasn't a success is just wrong. I think dropping the mini would be a terrible decision, you are however right regarding the price, it does need a lower price-point...

Fahrwahr

May 24, 2007, 11:26 AM

And what's to replace the mini...

The Mac nano, of course! :p

Edit: Oops... methinks tyr2's post was merged into this thread before mine posted. Darn.

MrCrowbar

May 24, 2007, 11:27 AM

Hmm... why would they make the Apple TV and Airpot Extreme in the same format when they're planning on discontinuing the Mini.

It's true that the mini is kinda underpowered, I mean you get a Macbook with loads of power and a screen and keyboard and touchpad... you could just buy the base model macbook and use in with the lid closed.

I don't really think they want to discontinue the mini already. It's pretty popular, I want one for the TV and home server. :(

nbs2

May 24, 2007, 11:30 AM

GA! One of my first purchases after we buy a house was to be a Mac mini...

Here's to hoping that it will be around for a little while longer...

Eidorian

May 24, 2007, 11:30 AM

yes. and i hope this makes way for a mid-range tower. :p but thats just wishful thinking isn't it?Very wishful.

Not surprising.

They aren't/haven't ever sold well and by the time you get one that has decent specs, you may as well get the $999 iMac.Cheapest Mac ever and my department buys a boat load? :rolleyes:

BoRegardless

May 24, 2007, 11:30 AM

Unobtrusive, runs all normal applications just fine (similar to my early MacBook Pro), connects to every other device fine, & puts up great images on my Apple 23" LCD.

Mine sits almost unnoticed on top of a LaCie 500 GB HD the same size of the MacMini and does partitioned duty as alternate boot drive and backup for multiple machines. When it does just backup duty, an old 15" LCD does screen duty.

The world gets smaller. Why on earth would I want to go to an all-in-one iMac? That locks the processor with the LCD in a way I don't see as good.

I have an attorney friend who is preparing to buy 4 more.

I truly wonder whether the MacMini is REALLY going to be discontinued or it just represents an affordable COMMODITY that will likely not change much but will stay in the parts bin forever.

gregarious119

May 24, 2007, 11:31 AM

The Mac nano, of course! :p

Edit: Oops... methinks tyr2's post was merged into this thread before mine posted. Darn.

Dude that's not half bad an idea. Change the form factor - include some of the new Santa Rosa stuff, change the HD out for 32gb of Flash..

I'd be ALL over that.

Turkish

May 24, 2007, 11:31 AM

Foxglove9

May 24, 2007, 11:33 AM

If that happens I'd like to see:

-The AppleTV become the next 'mini'
-A lower priced (but more expensive and expandable than the mini) desktop machine

Darkroom

May 24, 2007, 11:34 AM

i hope they're replacing it with something soon (if indeed it is dead)... i have my own wall-mounted LCD screen, so i'm not getting an iMac, and Mac Pro is a little too much (and too expensive) for what i require...

princealfie

May 24, 2007, 11:36 AM

I want a mac mini... guess that I better get one now? :D

Corrosive vinyl

May 24, 2007, 11:37 AM

It would be absurd to get rid of the mini, and the 17" imac... that would mean that the lowest price desktop from :apple: would be almost $1,000 over the base price of the mini. And that is the base model! why would someone who knows nothing about macs plop down $1,500+ to "try it out". Hopefully this information is wrong or they are going to compensate us with a better computer. The later being very doubtful in my mind

mackensteff

May 24, 2007, 11:38 AM

No, it's a fact. It never has been a big seller.

Ever.

Companies don't drop products that are making money.

iPod mini anyone?

commander.data

May 24, 2007, 11:38 AM

The Mac nano, of course! :p

Edit: Oops... methinks tyr2's post was merged into this thread before mine posted. Darn.
This might be the perfect time for Apple to release their occasionally speculated about console to replace the Mac Mini. They could make it more full featured than the AppleTV at the price of the Mac Mini, basically bringing desktop gaming to the couch. And they could call it the iMacBox720. :eek:

yg17

May 24, 2007, 11:38 AM

yes. and i hope this makes way for a mid-range tower. :p but thats just wishful thinking isn't it?

But Apple would never put a midrange tower at the same price as the mini, and the low price of the mini is what got people to switch. I know my parents would have never bought a Mac if the mini wasn't as cheap as it was. Killing off the mini (and then the low end iMac too) would be a huge mistake IMO

Squonk

May 24, 2007, 11:40 AM

Maybe the current mini enclosure is being dropped. What if the new mini (mini 2) would have the same footprint as :apple:TV & Airport Express, perhaps twice the height with Core 2 processors. And maybe a bump up to 3.25" hard drives and perhaps a PCI slot?

With the rumors of the mini being dead and the 17 iMac going away, what is left for education markets? C'mon, they need something....

MrCrowbar

May 24, 2007, 11:40 AM

Almost exactly the plans I had :) Except minus the eye-TV. I just want to convert all of my DVDs to H264. Which so far is working great. The only problem is that making the Quicktime containers for all of my homebrew TV shows (so that they'll show up in iTunes) is kinda annoying.

Oene of those will save you lots of time.
http://elgato.com/index.php?file=products_eyetvturbo&newlang=en

kwong2006

May 24, 2007, 11:40 AM

iPod mini anyone?

They did replace it with iPod nano, so they replaced it with something similar. I think he meant dropping a product that sells and replace it with nothing.

richard4339

May 24, 2007, 11:40 AM

MacNut

May 24, 2007, 11:40 AM

How much money does Apple make on the mini or do they take a loss for every unit sold.

kainjow

May 24, 2007, 11:40 AM

I believe it.

Who is the target Mac mini audience? It seems like it's geeks that are most interested in it.

I would never recommend a Mac mini to a non-geek. Who actually has a nice monitor, a nice keyboard, and a nice mouse, all ready to go, to be connected to a Mac mini? Geeks! Everyone else just wants a full new computer - thus, the iMac.

They just need a lower-end iMac that has a price closer to the Mac mini.

kalisphoenix

May 24, 2007, 11:41 AM

No, it's a fact. It never has been a big seller.

Link?

J-Sun

May 24, 2007, 11:41 AM

If so, I too hope it is being discontinued ONLY to allow for an even more excellent miniature Mac.
:)

Squonk

May 24, 2007, 11:42 AM

iPod mini anyone?

Which was replaced by the nano. They didn't abandon a market segment.

MacNut

May 24, 2007, 11:42 AM

MagicWok

May 24, 2007, 11:43 AM

I just hope that this another mindless rumour. I'm eagerly awaiting updated to my first, and only mac purchase - my trusty G4 powerbook.

I'm waiting for a good Mac Mini update to serve as my media centre. Screw the :apple:TV as that product makes no sense for me, don't think I'll ever purchase one as what it offers just isn't enough. I want 1080p. A DVD drive and full OSX without having to mod a single thing - as do many others. Grrr lol :rolleyes:

I already have a monitor that is hooked up to either a PC or my PB. I don't want another monitor in the form of an iMac. I want a small form factor box that will finally bin my PC and sit quietly, integrated into my set up. I'm no geek/nerd - but MacNut is right, any geeky feelings that I may have would be served by the Mac Pro, not the Mini.

I'll be very sad if the Mini is discontinued, there's a definate market out there for that amazing little box regardless of what that article presumes.

I'm eagerly awaiting an update to the MBP's too. My hopes that the long wait for both product refreshes means we'll get something good at WWDC.

kainjow

May 24, 2007, 11:44 AM

I would think the geeks would rather have a Mac Pro, they can add stuff and tinker with it more.

Way too expensive to tinker with a Mac Pro. Have you seen people put a Mac Pro in their car or attach it their TV? :p

aquafina

May 24, 2007, 11:44 AM

I expect more from MacRumors. This is the most ignorant analysis I have seen to date. If their logic holds, then in addition to the Mini, also dead are all iPods except for the Shuffle, the iMac and the MacBook Pro, as all of these products are currently "overdue" for a refresh.

You know, it could just be that Apple is busy, what with the iPhone, AppleTV, Leopard and WWDC.

Give me a break.

FoxyKaye

May 24, 2007, 11:45 AM

Mixed feelings on this - the Mini has been the perfect replacement for aging Macs (the original Bondi iMac G3 - yes, they still run) at our nonprofit, and allowed us to have decent machines with the wide array of older monitors, keyboards and mice we have lying around and get really cheap or free from CraigsList.

Then again, I just recommended we move up to the iMac for the reasons of the LCD, iSight, and better processor for only a few hundred more dollars per computer (less if we buy refurbs and count the time and turnover of locating and replacing used monitors and keyboards).

It would sure be keen if Apple kept a low-end machine, though - maybe the 17" iMac in the old form-factor when this lineup is revised? Or, as others have suggested, replaced the Mini with a single model, moderately configurable "Mac Nano" or small-form tower?

I'll be sad to see it go, but take some heart in that it will live on in the refurb section of Apple's Web site for at least another 8 months (though only the original Core Duo isn't very attractive anymore without a steep discount).

capoditutti

May 24, 2007, 11:46 AM

No, it's a fact. It never has been a big seller.

Ever.

Companies don't drop products that are making money.

I beg to differ - Nokia discontinued the 6310i, (http://www.epinions.com/content_101245226628) quite possibly the best phone they've ever made.

I've had more than 10 new phones partnering my 6310i since i bought it in 2002, and all of them are now with new owners... 6310i still going strong. I call it my 'charge on a Sunday phone' hehehe :D :D :D

APPLENEWBIE

May 24, 2007, 11:46 AM

The Mac Mini was the Mac that bought me to OS X. At £320 it was cheap enough to 'have a go' with and try out OS X.

Me Too. It was a very good way to coax me into the fold. And, while I now have four other macs, the mini is still my favorite machine. Stable as a rock and perfectly capable of doing what I need it to do.

However, with iMac 17's being only a couple of hundred dollars (or Euros) more, and with the iMac delivering a bigger hard drive, faster processor, better graphics, a screen, keyboard, mouse, camera and that cool "where's the computer" experience, the mac mini did not make much sense in the product lineup. In my opinion, anyway.

It does make me think that the rumors of the demise of the iMac 17" might be wrong, though, since it will now be the price leader. If it is not updated with the rest of the iMac line up, I can see a bit of a price reduction.

cube

May 24, 2007, 11:46 AM

Good. Now Apple can make a REASONABLY small computer.

kalisphoenix

May 24, 2007, 11:47 AM

Agathon

May 24, 2007, 11:48 AM

IIRC, the CRT iMacs used to sell for $799 at one point. That was a pretty sweet price for an all in one computer. I know. I bought one when I was a student. It was a complete computer and lasted me for five and a half years. A friend has it now, and it is still going strong (albeit with a bigger hard drive I put in, Panther, and some more RAM).

Apple needs to aim its lowest complete consumer desktop at that price or not much above it. I'm guessing that the price of flat panels has been keeping the price higher than Apple would like it.

swingerofbirch

May 24, 2007, 11:50 AM

Object-X

May 24, 2007, 11:51 AM

Hmm... why would they make the Apple TV and Airpot Extreme in the same format when they're planning on discontinuing the Mini. :(

Actually, the AppleTV is an inch bigger than the mini and Airport Extreme. I wouldn't read much into the fact they share similar encolsures.

I would like to see them create a series of systems that would connect to the AppleTV. One could be a PVR, another could have a slot loading Blu-Ray player, another could just be a hard drive array for backup. Just add what you want and stack them.

Still, the mini has interesting uses. Maybe they should make an advanced mini/AppleTV with all the above features I mentioned: HDMI, PVR, Blu-Ray, large hard drive. Then again, it would be pretty expensive and the mini's strength, at least initially, was that it was cheap. Shame if they get rid of it.

Father Jack

May 24, 2007, 11:54 AM

The Mac Mini was the Mac that bought me to OS X. At £320 it was cheap enough to 'have a go' with and try out OS X. I've since purchased a Mac Pro and a MacBook so it worked out pretty well for Apple.

The Mini was also my first Mac after 20 years of using MS Windoze crap
The mini was followed by a 2 Ghz Power Mac G5, followed by Mac Pro. Also got 2 Mac Books here as well, one for the wife and the other for me. Apple has received a fair bit of my cash as well, but I'm so glad I switched :)

FJ

flopticalcube

May 24, 2007, 11:55 AM

Maybe it has to do with the fact that the Mini goes against everything Apple pushes in their latest ad campaigns.

Apple pushes how simple Macs are out of the box. Well granted the Mini is as simple as any other Mac to use, but you need to have your own monitor, keyboard, and mouse.

And Apple pushes that you can video chat out of the box. Well with the Mini there's no camera included let alone built in, and Apple apparently doesn't even sell a stand alone iSight anymore!

This ad describes what I mean:
http://movies.apple.com/movies/us/apple/getamac_ads2/box_480x376.mov

But if your PC dies, and they all do at some point and far sooner than most Macs, you have the screen/kbd/mouse already. It was a switchers machine from day one. If they do drop it and the 17" iMac, they must have something else in place for the low end. I can't see Apple abandoning the sub $1000 market altogether.

elppa

May 24, 2007, 11:55 AM

Maybe Steve just tired of saying BYOKDM or whatever that not-so-easy-to-roll-off-you-tounge abbreviation the marketing folks came up with was?

DakotaGuy

May 24, 2007, 11:58 AM

I would say depending on where Apple takes the next iMac it is very possible this rumor is true. If the cost of the iMac comes down and more options are available then it is better to sell an all-in-one to these customers. More profit for Apple and a simple machine for customers that are new to Apple to use.

If Apple ditches everything under the 20" iMac, then it will show that they want to focus only on the middle and upper end consumers. Fact is the most profit is made on the higher end models. Plus laptops have really taken over the market.

With laptops so popular maybe Apple only needs to offer 20 and 24 inch iMacs and a Mac Pro. From a business perspective I doubt Apple makes much money if any money at all on the Mac Mini.

p0intblank

May 24, 2007, 12:00 PM

Compile 'em all

May 24, 2007, 12:03 PM

I doubt it.

But if so, I'm glad I got one while they lasted. Mine is an amazing, trouble-free little machine and I'm going to run it until it explodes.

Edit: No way I'm believing this.

AppleInsider seems pretty confident about it :(

BenRoethig

May 24, 2007, 12:04 PM

I'm hoping that it's replaced by a new slightly larger machine running a G965 chipset and E4000 series CPUs with desktop hard drives. Then again, this is Apple we're talking about. they'll probably just discontinue the two Mac Minis and the bottom two iMacs and make the platform even more unaccessible for both the education market those who want to make the jump. One thing remains though that the Mini is a very flawed system and is not competitive due to that notebook hard drive. I hope Jobs and Co is capable of understanding that.

roland.g

May 24, 2007, 12:07 PM

A discontinuation of the Mini along with a midtower release would make sense. Essentially dropping the low end and introducing a more formidable desktop, ie. dedicated gpu, full size hdd, replacement.

cube

May 24, 2007, 12:09 PM

I really hope this isn't true... The only way I can see it becoming true is if Apple releases a headless iMac. Until we see that product released, I don't think the Mac mini is going away anytime soon.

Not headless iMac. Mini Mac (Pro), socket 775. The graphics card should be upgreadable, and it must have at least one additional PCIe slot.

zami

May 24, 2007, 12:10 PM

Please let this not be true. The Mini is my favourite Mac of all time, mine sits on top of a matching LaCie HD which in turn sits on a matching Belkin Hub thing with USB and FireWire available at the front as well.

I can use my favourite black Apple Professional keyboard, my own choice of monitor, my own five button Microsoft mouse and have two drives available right there. BTW it runs faster and better off the LaCie than it's own internal.

No wonder Jobs wants to ditch it and make us buy a 100% Apple machine like the iMac or MacBook!

gregorsamsa

May 24, 2007, 12:11 PM

If this turns out to be correct...it's a bummer! Despite the integrated graphics, the mini had some excellent features. But sadly, sales weren't exactly encouraging & it's no great surprise that it could be discontinued.

Maybe Apple now recognize the growing importance to many consumers of having discrete graphics in their desktop computers & will have the iMac as their lowest spec desktop.

Mac-Addict

May 24, 2007, 12:11 PM

Oh noes! I was going to make my mum get a Mac Mini now she will have to stay on the evil windows side. Noessssss! :(

LoganT

May 24, 2007, 12:12 PM

Not headless iMac. Mini Mac (Pro), socket 775. The graphics card should be upgreadable, and it must have at least one additional PCIe slot.

No it would just be called the Mac. The Apple Mac.

thejadedmonkey

May 24, 2007, 12:14 PM

No, it's a fact. It never has been a big seller.

Ever.

Companies don't drop products that are making money.

iPod Mini. 4gb/6gb. Best selling iPod. Ever.
Replaced with iPod Nano. :D

oscuh

May 24, 2007, 12:16 PM

Even with integrated graphics, it's not that bad of a machine (look at the MBs and low-end iMacs with IG). Apple needs to keep the Mini, or some other inexpensive (do not read <i>cheap</i>) smallish form factor machine to stay competitive. If they get rid of the Mini, it'll be a replacement to the existing form, not a wipe of the entire line, IMHO.

BenRoethig

May 24, 2007, 12:16 PM

If both of these rumors are true, it means that either there are replacements coming, Apple plans to license OS to take care of the traditional desktop segment, or that Steve's ego has grown so large that he as complete gone off his rocker. I see any of the three as very possible...especially the last one.

viperguy

May 24, 2007, 12:16 PM

Yeah, considering that they don't replace it, if we remove the 17'' iMac + mac minis from the market... then apple has no low end computers anymore.
Wich... doesn't sound like a great idea

iSee

May 24, 2007, 12:16 PM

Think it's possible they'll just rebrand the mini as an AppleTV? AppleTV 2.0, perhaps? Give the current AppleTV a little more storage space and a little more OS X to it and ditch the mini?

Yeah, that's what I was thinking ("Apple TV Extreme" was my name for it).

The mini is a great media server, but is too expensive and underpowered as a general computer (for the price of a Mini + Monitor + KB + Mouse you can get a much more powerful iMac that looks a lot nicer than a cheapo monitor.) I know there are some other niches for it besides a media server, but they are too small justify the product line.

An "Apple TV Extreme" would make sense though. I hope they don't cut out too much though. I'd want the full front-row experience, options for larger hard drivers, support for third-party apps, a web browser, email... Pretty much full OS X support. For my money they can drop the optical drive, though, and put in a low power CPU.

apachie2k

May 24, 2007, 12:17 PM

yay new from apple!!! check it out in the store!!! The New Apple Sphere!!! It is so much better than mini....NOT! hahahaha
i liked the idea though...

mrgreen4242

May 24, 2007, 12:22 PM

Not surprising.

They aren't/haven't ever sold well and by the time you get one that has decent specs, you may as well get the $999 iMac.
Which they are likely getting rid of as well...

Hmm... why would they make the Apple TV and Airpot Extreme in the same format when they're planning on discontinuing the Mini.

The AE and AppleTV are slightly different in footprint than the mini (ATV ~7.7"^2, mini 6.5"^2). I think it's more and more likely with each passing week with no mini update that there will be a big revamp of the mini line. I suspect it will be 7.7"x7.7"x4", and fill the roll of the old mini and the 17" iMac in the product line. A little more space means full sized HDD, and room for extra cooling so they can use a faster GPU, etc.

I'm predicting they drop the 17" iMac with the next revision, move the mini to a taller ATV box, and have two models at $499 and $749. The cheaper model being, more or less, the old mini with a C2D and more standard RAM, the more expensive one being the old iMac guts in a new box.

This would satisfy a lot of people without adding a new type of computer to the lineup, and without competing with the Mac Pro or iMac. Of course, those of us who want an iMac with an upgradable GPU are still out of luck, but it's an OK compromise.

iSee

May 24, 2007, 12:22 PM

belovedmonster

May 24, 2007, 12:22 PM

If the Mini has failed to sell as well as Apple hoped then they only have themselves to blame. Too often has the Mini slipped way behind the iMac.

Everytime the iMac has gotten a bump the Mini should have as well, and it hasnt been the case. A couple of times now the Mac Mini has slipped way behind the iMac only to then get a handsome bump that makes it half way competitive again. It seems rather stop start for the Mini rather than regular bumps like the other macs.

Bonte

May 24, 2007, 12:22 PM

How much money does Apple make on the mini or do they take a loss for every unit sold.

Can't be much profit on a Mini, Apple makes more on osX.

Low end machines will -like the Apple TV- geared towards special uses or be replaced by low-end machines from Dell with OEM osX license. :D

Lancetx

May 24, 2007, 12:24 PM

Big mistake if true. I personally know switchers that would still be using Windows PCs today if it weren't for the Mac mini. Apple needs to update the current mini as well as lower the price and they would sell a lot more of them. Right now it's underpowered and overpriced, and that's why they're not moving many of them, it's not because the mini is a failed idea...

MacFly123

May 24, 2007, 12:24 PM

I've been waiting forever for Apple to update the MacMini so I can buy one to put in my Infinity :) There's nothing better you could have installed in your car to pimp your ride ;)

oldwatery

May 24, 2007, 12:25 PM

Just want to add my groan to the list:(
I really hope this is a bad rumor......the whole mini concept was brilliant and I thought it had been good for Apple in several important areas.
Does anyone know any sales figures?
It certainly seemed to capture a lot of switchers.
I wonder if this has anything to do with the next iMac and it's groundbreaking new design?
Regardless, some kind of headless Mac in ultra small form factor is a piece of gear that I hope remains in the Apple portfolio.

guzhogi

May 24, 2007, 12:25 PM

Kinda sad to see it go if it does. My dad has an Intel Mac Mini and it works very well for him. All he does is surf the web, e-mail and word processing so the Mac Mini is perfect.

I read the article on Appleinsider and it says that Apple thinks there isn't much interest in it. I have a feeling that Apple doesn't think there's much interest in it so the Mini's not updated often. B/c it's not updated often, there's little interest in it which causes Apple not to update and keeps cycling like that. Maybe they can combine the Mac Mini & :apple: TV into the same product and hopefully add a TiVo/DVR functionality? That way, it can be used as both a computer & a TV set-top box. How successful that idea is, I don't know.

IMO, Apple should have 4 desktops: the low-end one like the Mac Mini, an iMac kind of one, a midrange tower and a high-end work station a little heftier than the Mac Pro (probably add SLI graphics and better graphics cards).

Turkish

May 24, 2007, 12:28 PM

iPod mini anyone?

Discontinued...

BenRoethig

May 24, 2007, 12:28 PM

Dark Dragoon

May 24, 2007, 12:30 PM

kingconsulting

May 24, 2007, 12:31 PM

Not surprising.

They aren't/haven't ever sold well and by the time you get one that has decent specs, you may as well get the $999 iMac.

Proof? Oh that's right.....

Vinnie_vw

May 24, 2007, 12:33 PM

If the Mini and/or the 17" iMac are gone, it will be interesting what Apple will do to fill the gap for that market. Would they expect everyone with a low budget to get a Macbook? Or an iPhone? I agree that it's unlikely that both will be discontinued, but one.. maybe.

Ha ze

May 24, 2007, 12:34 PM

That was the most Emo computer article ever.
Waaaaaaay to emotional.

I've been waiting forever for Apple to update the MacMini so I can buy one to put in my Infinity :) There's nothing better you could have installed in your car to pimp your ride ;)

I was contemplating doing this too, then i thought about the :apple:TV but no one make an HD head unit yet (i dont think). Also, from a fellow Infiniti owner, the cars are spelled with an "i" not a "y"

cloudnine

May 24, 2007, 12:34 PM

sounds like a bunch of bullcrap to me... just because it hasn't been updated in its "average update timeline period yadda yadda yadda", doesn't mean they're not updating it again, jeez. get a grip, people...

i will admit, though, that since the announcement of the iphone, it seems as though everything else has been placed on the backburner, which is not only disconcerting as a consumer, but also as an (dare i say it?) apple fanboy... i don't really want to look forward to apple placing their focus on the cell phone market. while i'm ecstatic about the iphone, and i'll be one of the first to get one, my main interest is in their computers, and it would stink if updates/refreshes get overlooked because of a cell phone; which already looks to be the case with leopard and mac mini refreshes.

*sigh*

i0Nic

May 24, 2007, 12:35 PM

The first thing that comes to mind when I hear "No more Mini" is "AppleTV". They've hacked that box so much that it basically is a MacMini. More than likely, the Mini isn't really going away, but will simply become a higher-end AppleTV and be branded as such.

This is what I think will happen too. If you look at the AppleTV page on Apple's website, it has a similiar format of product pages that have multiple versions (ipod, imac etc) rather than a single product (airport).

If they introduce a higher spec AppleTV, this will be too close to a mac mini so they may decide to just drop the mini and grow the appletv brand.

Ofcourse, the other option of making a mini2 in the same form factor as the appletv and airport also makes sense, to cater toward the edu market and to switchers/media box enthusiasts.

Ibjr

May 24, 2007, 12:36 PM

Businesses use the mac mini for word processing stations. This will only push them to PCs.

Turkish

May 24, 2007, 12:36 PM

Proof? Oh that's right.....

Don't believe it? Go stand in an Apple Store on a Saturday and see how many mini's roll out the door...

If it's such a hot seller, why haven't they put a C2D into it or larger drives?

It's got no future. Dead product.

shabbasuraj

May 24, 2007, 12:38 PM

The mini addresses a gaping hole in the Mac lineup. I would even argue that with the mini, there is still a gap, and removing it can only hurt the overall corporate project of getting more people on OS X.

One way Apple can address this gap is by eventually bringing down the prices of its MacPro.

.02

iBunny

May 24, 2007, 12:39 PM

I hope they do kill the mini.

And Introduce a Real Machine. Mid Range Mac with no Display.

BRLawyer

May 24, 2007, 12:39 PM

It'll be sad to see the Mini go.

My first Mac was a Mac Mini G4, I was looking at reviews for Shuttle cube computers and stumbled on the Mini, after 3 months of thinking about it I bought one. Best computing decision I've made.

After that I bought a Mac Pro and quite a few other Apple products (my Mini's now connected to a TV). Without the Mini I would still be using/buying PC's.

I gave a G4 Mini to my Dad some time ago, and it was his intro to the Mac world as well...it works just fine...

Anyway, it's funny to see people defending the Mini now that it's pronounced dead...many pundits in THIS forum have always bashed it because it's not "powerful enough"...just silly.

What's REALLY gonna happen:

The same as happened with the iPod Mini...it's gonna be replaced by something EVEN better...wait and see.

MacNut

May 24, 2007, 12:40 PM

They sell it for what 500, how much do the they pay for the processor, hard drive, memory, they can't be making much money off of it.

LoganT

May 24, 2007, 12:42 PM

They sell it for what 500, how much do the they pay for the processor, hard drive, memory, they can't be making much money off of it.

They sell it for 600.

FireArse

May 24, 2007, 12:43 PM

Just a quickie,

I have 'switched' 8 people in the last 2 years. 4 of them bought Mini's. Including my brother with his 1.66GHz. They are fantastic little machines, and I'm pretty sure after this long Apple must have had enough cost-reduction projects to pull a profit from them.

I'm also pretty sure you can ouput 1080p (through VGA?) from them no probs. (please correct if I'm wrong)

I have always had my eye on a Mini as a server. The lack of a gaming GPU ensures use for little else. Can anyone on here photoshop a cube-sized aluminium Mini/Cube hybrid? I think that (as the a new hybrid :apple:TV / Mini) would look so cool.

Common Apple, geeks love the Mini too, just allow it to support more RAM and the newer Intel Chips! :)

johnee

May 24, 2007, 12:45 PM

aside from cost, i don't see a valid customer base for it. it's like a imac on training wheels that's not to be trusted to be given a real design point.

Ibjr

May 24, 2007, 12:47 PM

aside from cost, i don't see a valid customer base for it. it's like a imac on training wheels that's not to be trusted to be given a real design point.

PR firms that have the LCDs and keyboards but need a word processing station. 599 vs 1k? Ya, they'll go for 599.

Rocket Rion

May 24, 2007, 12:51 PM

plinden

May 24, 2007, 12:51 PM

I hope not too! I have fairly grandiose plans for a mini once I have enough money to buy one, a couple of 1TB drives, and an eye-TV. ....perhaps you can see where I'm going with that.

I just bought a refurb Mini to use as a media server (third Mac in 18 months - not because of any trouble with the other two) Currently, I have a four year old SDTV with s-video and composite inputs, so no :apple:TV for me. When we upgrade to a HD TV the Mini will be able to drive video to it.

It only has a 60GB HDD so I only have our music (27GB), some movies, TV shows, and the complete Dora the Explorer seasons 1 and 2 on it, but I'll either upgrade the drive (WD have recently announced a 250GB 2.5" drive @ $200) or get an external ministack enclosure and stick a 750GB drive in it ($300 for enclosure + drive). Maybe I'll do both, but I'll probably wait till I need the space, and prices will be much lower towards the end of the year. Then I'll get an Elgato EyeTV so we can use it as a DVR and get rid of our VCR.

It's absolutely silent, and I am also using it as a media server freeing up space on our main Mac. Sharing its iTunes library, video, even 1080p content downloaded from the Apple website, and music plays flawlessly, and wirelessly, on our other Macs. I don't have a keyboard/mouse connected, rather I control content by VNC'ing from my iMac. I tried a few third party remote control extenders and settled on RemoteBuddy.

Even if I had an :apple:TV-compatible TV I think I would get the mini. Although I like the idea of the :apple:TV I prefer for our digital content to be on a computer not used for other things.

kalisphoenix

May 24, 2007, 12:52 PM

Anyway, it's funny to see people defending the Mini now that it's pronounced dead...many pundits in THIS forum have always bashed it because it's not "powerful enough"...just silly.

And as always, the uninterested 90% have simply passed right by.

And pundits have done this? Really?

mrowl

May 24, 2007, 12:52 PM

this has been pretty obvious for awhile... and it is a good move.

I bet this leads the way to new version of the :apple: tv

rob finch

May 24, 2007, 12:54 PM

I love my Intel Mini. My first Mac and the reason I switched. I use it as a HD & SD media server as well as for email/web/the usuals and it's perfect sitting there looking cool and being silent under my LCD TV.

Regarding the lack of sales, I have no figures at all, but consider the range of aftermarket Mini accessories there are. If it sold badly, this market would not exist. That doesn't rule out it not being a profitable line for Apple, but many have gone on to purchase their other offerings.

Having said all that, I'd love for a Santa Rosa based version with h264 decoding onboard to be released. If the Mini does leave the Apple line up, something to entice potential switchers and the media player users to the Apple brand needs to appear in it's place. If :apple:tv can't satisfy the HD needs of the latter group, something (with a consumer and prosumer version) needs to arrive to appeal to both these new customer groups.

Evan_11

May 24, 2007, 12:55 PM

Steve Jobs probably wants to stream the product line down. The mini and AppleTV are too similiar in characteristics. While I think the mini is a pretty cool idea, most people who buy their first Macs are doing so with an iMac or MacBook/Pro thus defeating its real purpose.

Hell, all I really want is for them to bring the MacPro prices down.

stompy

May 24, 2007, 12:55 PM

They also tried to make the Mini as small as they could instead of making it as usable as they could in a small package. Apple's experiments usually don't turn out so well.

So true. Apple could have made a slightly bulkier mini with a 3.5" drive. This alternative may have even been cheaper for Apple to manufacture, but was likely not sexy enough for Steve.

Everyone has their own ideas about how the mini could be improved, a 3.5" HD would have done this at the same price point.

kalisphoenix

May 24, 2007, 01:00 PM

I hope it's true because Apple has to dumb down OSX in order to handle the slower machines. With them out of the way, Apple's next cat can hopefully make a bigger leap without the mini weighing it down.

A ridiculous assertion. If my dual-core 1.67GHz/1.25GB machine is really holding the OS back, then I'm terrified to see what's coming down the pipeline. Perhaps every image will be vectorized with procedurally-generated sound effects to match, and we'll have a 3-D dock, checksummed swap reads/writes, and all kernel messages will be encrypted?

Edit: Core FinalCutPro?

fletcher.mcbeth

May 24, 2007, 01:01 PM

But on second thought, if they replace it with a nano, pico, femto, whatever, that would be great. I do engineering design services and travel often between customers and a remote design center. The Mac Mini is my primary design platform and intrepid travel companion. Everyone has monitors, keyboards and mice available to use while visiting which makes toteing just the headless Mini around quite viable and pleasant travel experience. Being that I regularly consume ALL of the Mac Mini IO plugs, having good IO is important to me. I could live with or without the CD/DVD player. If the Mac Mini is replaced with, let's theoretically say, the iPhone, I'd use it as my primary design/travel companion if it could sport the same or better processor power and maybe a full-featured docking station. I can only hope.

Fletcher

pseoudynman

May 24, 2007, 01:02 PM

yetanotherdave

May 24, 2007, 01:03 PM

The mini G4 was my switching machine. A KVM so I could easily switch between that and my linux box and it was a good choice. an all in one was too expensive and I just didn't have the space for a iMac and another monitor.
Since then I've bought an iPod and a MacBook. This is going to be added to with the next rev iPod, another MacBook (when the wife has the money to buy mine to replace the mini, I'll buy the new latest MacBook.) and a nano for my wife.
This of course is only our immediate plans. I have a two year old, in five or so years he'll be needing a computer for school, which will be a mac. All my future machines will be macs (unles I have a very specific reason for it not to be, like wanting to run a VMS cluster on itanium chips or something)
Even if apple take a loss on the mini, they certainly have follow up and future purchases worth that loss out of me! I think it's a great entry point computer.

Evangelion

May 24, 2007, 01:04 PM

Then again, I just recommended we move up to the iMac for the reasons of the LCD, iSight, and better processor for only a few hundred more dollars per computer (less if we buy refurbs and count the time and turnover of locating and replacing used monitors and keyboards)..

but the thing is that not everyone can afford that "few hundred dollars" more. some are looking for a cheap machine, and paying a bit more even though you might get a lot more is simply not an option.

the mini does have one problem: it's too expensive. when they moved to intel, they increased the prices. back when i got my 1.25ghz g4 mini, it was so cheap that i could buy it without a second thought. had i hated it, the loss would not have been that great. bu now it costs so much that impulse-buys like that are not an option. apple: drop the price of mini by 100-150 bucks, and then things become interesting again. and dvd-writer wouldn't really cost you anything extra. hell, you could keep rest of the machine more or less unchanged!

it would be a real shame if the mini got killed. i seriously love mine, and i'm thinking of putting one in the living-room as well.

freddiecable

May 24, 2007, 01:06 PM

exactly! I think Apple is lining up a quite extensive product launch in the coming weeks/months. this could actually mean:

1. new mac mini concept
2. new imac concept
3. new mbp's (Flash-disks, LED etc)?

/F

And what's to replace the mini...

plinden

May 24, 2007, 01:09 PM

I'd just like to say, the Mini was my introduction to Macs too (well, after the iPod). Not that I bought one before this week, but when they were released, I thought it was cool that Apple could put a real computer in such a small, quiet package.

I considered buying one, then looked up specs on other Macs and settled on an iMac instead. So, some successful upsell there ...

Also, I know two people (software engineers) who did switch by buying a Mini first, then bought MBPs later. Still, for every person I know who bought a Mini, there must be twenty who bought a PC instead.

So all we have here is anecdotal evidence either way. No one but Apple knows how successful the Mini is. You have to get up early to get a refurb though ... they go very quickly.

Counter

May 24, 2007, 01:10 PM

Mac Pro Mini pls, k, thx.

danny_w

May 24, 2007, 01:11 PM

My first Mac was a G4 Mini, and without that I probably would never have given Apple a second thought. I have since bought several others (20" G5 iMac for my son, 17" G5 iMac for when he's home from college, 15" PB, 17" C2D iMac for my wife, and now a new C2D MB for myself). Apple would have had none of these sales if it were not for the mini.

EDIT: The part that really blew me away (besides the fact that "it just worked") was the absolute quiet of the Mini. I had been used to a PC tower that sounded like a jet plane taking off.

iJawn108

May 24, 2007, 01:12 PM

NanoMac ;)

Seriously whatever happens that will cause their price to drop, so be it. I want to buy a used one but I'm not paying it's current price. $300 mini would be great

Rocketman

May 24, 2007, 01:13 PM

A low end product serves a marketing purpose. An advertised starting point above which buyers compare other models and which ones to upgrade to on the price-feature ladder.

It may not be a grand seller, but it serves a purpose. What about a 12V DC Mac-Mini? For cars.

Rocketman

GekkePrutser

May 24, 2007, 01:19 PM

Somehow I had a feeling that this might happen. I was really waiting for the C2D mini but I was afraid this would happen for a while now.

So last week I was in PC world and got the current low-end mini while it was discounted (they were overstocked or something).

It still would be awful to see it go though, I have 2 mini's and they are my main machines. My powerbook has been surpassed by the mini G4 as it is a much handier desktop mac, and now I only use it while on the road. The mini is so quiet, low-power (a big advantage in this time of rising energy cost) and convenient to bring along that I need it :) Maybe I'll quickly buy another one when they get axed.

strydr

May 24, 2007, 01:19 PM

The mac mini has helped me switch 3 of my friends over to Mac. Most people that use a computer for the simple things don't need a power house, they just want to surf the web, and play with their digital camera. The mini is perfect in this role. Please Apple, don't kill it off, or at least, replace it with something similar, maybe with better video ;)

haoqfu

May 24, 2007, 01:20 PM

WTF! they are going to put iMac as their lowest end product?! iMac is so gay!

tristan

May 24, 2007, 01:21 PM

Apple Insider has been right a lot lately. Say your prayers, little guy. We're going for a ride tonight. You might want to bring a shovel.

chubad

May 24, 2007, 01:21 PM

Good. It's very over priced and sadly under powered.

JuanC

May 24, 2007, 01:21 PM

I hope they don't discontinued MacMini series.

I have one and it is the best computer I had.

kingconsulting

May 24, 2007, 01:22 PM

Don't believe it? Go stand in an Apple Store on a Saturday and see how many mini's roll out the door...

If it's such a hot seller, why haven't they put a C2D into it or larger drives?

It's got no future. Dead product.

Thanks for proving my point.

Still waiting for numbers...

Kwill

May 24, 2007, 01:22 PM

And what's to replace the mini... Judging by the price points and development effort, the iPhone will replace the Mac mini.:)

newmacuser13

May 24, 2007, 01:24 PM

It would be a shame to lose the mini.

I purchased a mini for my wife last Fall, after tiring of her constant need for assistance to do simple things on a windows machine. I didn't know if she would be any less computer phobic on an apple, but at the low price point, it was worth the shot.

That low price point, plus the availability of procare, was what sold me on trying her out with an Apple Mini.

And of course, she loves now her Mini, I am no longer bombarded with "how do I do this" questions.

That converted me to Apple (MacBook), and I also converted my parents this winter (iMac).

So please, Apple, don't eliminate the easiest/least expensive way to try the Apple experience - it leads to great things happening.

guzhogi

May 24, 2007, 01:25 PM

archurban

May 24, 2007, 01:27 PM

well, if it is true, people will miss it. but I think that Apple will bring small compact desktop but different name, and more powerful. they know how much mac mini has been popular so far. it actually fills with most people's satisfaction in terms of price, performance because generally people just use it for lighter stuff.

skellener

May 24, 2007, 01:28 PM

Mac-mini EXTREME? :eek: :D

kalisphoenix

May 24, 2007, 01:29 PM

I'd be interested in seeing acomputer the size of an iPod. No keyboard, mouse, monitor, optical drive. Just a USB port, Firewire port, power plug & mini DVI port on the outside. Inside, 1.8" hard drive or flash. Otherwise, a full fledged computer.

Everyone would... but those little hard drives couldn't take that much wear and tear, not to mention the size requirements for other components needed for a general purpose computer.

Of course, you can run Linux on an iPod :)

CptnJustc

May 24, 2007, 01:31 PM

That would be a crying shame... I was hoping one day it would get a Blu-ray drive. My Mac Mini is not the computer I use the most, but it is the only one that plays a really unique role in my house. It's my print and file server, iTunes library master / iPod syncer, DVD / other format video player, always-on net service provider, and occasional oldschool game player through emulators (very cool when hooked to the LCD TV).

None of my other computers (and very few computers in general) can do what the mini does because it's a) unobtrusive -- I can leave it running all the time, even if I have a guest sleep in the living room with it; b) small, of course, but with plenty of ports -- fits nicely into my media center, and can managed a lot of devices / external storage; c) relatively low power -- so I don't feel too guilty about it :D; d) Front Row-enabled.

I guess if the worst did happen, I could buy a MacBook or some such to do more or less the same stuff... but I'd probably be paying twice as much for fewer ports, and probably more noise when it gets ramped up. =/

If/when I do replace it, the old Mini will be welcome in any number of other roles, being so small, silent, and -- dare I say it -- cute. :cool:

hooch

May 24, 2007, 01:31 PM

I hope this is false. I too want to get one in time to play with. Can you get any better of a machine to play with??? Small, powerful, beautiful...should I keep going?

danny_w

May 24, 2007, 01:33 PM

but those little hard drives couldn't take that much wear and tear
Tell that to IBM/Lenovo. The X40/X41 series (great little machines!) had a 1.8" hard drive. The weighed on a 2.7 pounds too!

kalisphoenix

May 24, 2007, 01:33 PM

Don't believe it? Go stand in an Apple Store on a Saturday and see how many mini's roll out the door...

Jesus :( You've actually done that?

chillywilly

May 24, 2007, 01:34 PM

Say it ain't so.... The Mac mini is an awesome computer. It's on all the time, rarely has any issues and just simply runs.

I recently did the upgrade to 1gb (1.42Ghz model) and am ready to do a hard drive and DVD-R drive upgrade soon.

I was looking forward to seeing a Core 2 Duo upgrade, looking to add another Mini to the household.

If the Mini really is gone, what's with all of the rumors about Apple dumping their low end machines? First the low-end iMac and now the mini. Pretty soon, it's going to be $2,000 just to get into a Mac... which would really take 80% of the Mac line out of reach of most individuals for personal use.

skellener

May 24, 2007, 01:34 PM

it actually fills with most people's satisfaction in terms of price, performance because generally people just use it for lighter stuff.
Exactly. Not everyone needs a hardcore machine. My mom and aunt do email, surf the web, uses iTunes and iPod nano and transfers photos from a digital camera. You don't need too much of a computer to do that. A mini is perfect.

drumforfun19

May 24, 2007, 01:35 PM

yes. and i hope this makes way for a mid-range tower. :p but thats just wishful thinking isn't it?

that would be nice.

danny_w

May 24, 2007, 01:35 PM

So please, Apple, don't eliminate the easiest/least expensive way to try the Apple experience - it leads to great things happening.
Agree 100%. See my post above. I (and probably many, many others) would never have ever tried Apple if the Mini did not exist.

Turkish

May 24, 2007, 01:35 PM

Thanks for proving my point.

Still waiting for numbers...

Keep on waiting...

Mine will be proved when they axe the mini... just wait. ;)

Evangelion

May 24, 2007, 01:37 PM

Good. It's very over priced and sadly under powered.

instead of killing it, why not simply fix it's problems? if apple can earn money with $299 appletv that has nvidia graphics, why couldn't they earn money with $449 mini that has integrated graphics?

apple: make the mini affordable. specs are important, sure, but focus on making it cheaper.

kalisphoenix

May 24, 2007, 01:38 PM

Tell that to IBM/Lenovo. The X40/X41 series (great little machines!) had a 1.8" hard drive. The weighed on a 2.7 pounds too!

Good lord! That's amazing. Hmm. I suppose I'll have to reconsider my premises. I spoke based on what I've heard from other people in these forums -- that you shouldn't boot OS X off your iPod, etc, for that reason.

Bregalad

May 24, 2007, 01:39 PM

If they're doing away with the Mac Mini and the 17" iMac, I hope they replace them with a Mac Tower. The new "Mac" would basically be a low-end PowerMac with lower end and lower priced components and a limited, but still acceptable, upgrade path so as not to eat into sales of the PowerMac. Prices could start at $600-700 without a keyboard and monitor, and go up to just below the low range of a PowerMacs cost.

I'll take mine in Black.

Exactly!

Intel already has reference motherboards Apple could use by simply swapping the BIOS for Apple EFI. Such a board would probably have most everything the "I want a mid-range tower" crowd wants, but have enough limitations to prevent cannibalizing Mac Pro sales. Specifically it would have PCI-express slots, but only one CPU socket and probably only 2 RAM slots. I envision a mini-tower with 3 drive bays, one with the HD, one with the DVD-RW and an empty 5.25" bay that could accommodate either a second HD or a Blu-ray drive. It would use Intel motherboard video to keep the price down, but users could add a video card for improved performance.

So what of the Mac Mini? It's position as a computer is easily replaced by the mini tower. The use of high volume components in a standard form factor would allow it to be priced very aggressively. The Mini's role as a media center is easily taken by a better version of the Apple TV.

Two very important factors to consider when dissing the mini-tower idea:
1. people tend to buy what they're familiar with. Switchers have PC towers at home and/or work.
2. the mid-tower hole in Apple's lineup is currently being partially filled by used towers. There are tens of thousands of Mac users who never buy hardware from Apple. That's a terrible lost opportunity.

Finally, having a consumer machine with upgradeable video would breathe some life into the business of providing Mac compatible video cards.

Turkish

May 24, 2007, 01:41 PM

Jesus :( You've actually done that?

Yes, I've stood at the door on a busy Saturday and counted. :rolleyes:

Of course I haven't, but it would stand to reason that the hour I was in there at the Genius Bar, they might have sold at least ONE. About 3 iMacs, 2 MBPS, 2 MBs and one MP.

Not purely scientific, obviously, but anyone that thinks this has been a top seller is nuts.

Just wait until its discontinued...

cube

May 24, 2007, 01:41 PM

instead of killing it, why not simply fix it's problems? if apple can earn money with $299 appletv that has nvidia graphics, why couldn't they earn money with $449 mini that has integrated graphics?

apple: make the mini affordable. specs are important, sure, but focus on making it cheaper.

Fix the problems, yes: make it bigger.

And thus the mini is killed.

Evangelion

May 24, 2007, 01:43 PM

If the Mini really is gone, what's with all of the rumors about Apple dumping their low end machines? First the low-end iMac and now the mini. Pretty soon, it's going to be $2,000 just to get into a Mac... which would really take 80% of the Mac line out of reach of most individuals for personal use.

well, the rumor about apple dumping the 17" imac states that the reason for it would be the fact that 20" imac would cost about as much as 17" would cost. in short: low-end imac would cost as much as low-end imac costs today, it would just have a 20" screen instead of 17" screen.

tristan

May 24, 2007, 01:46 PM

WTF! they are going to put iMac as their lowest end product?! iMac is so gay!

Please post messages like this in the "your computer is gayer than mine" thread so that everyone who is interested in the relative homosexuality of the various mac models can enjoy it.

Note that same thread can also be used for any bi-curious mac models.

benpatient

May 24, 2007, 01:46 PM

I am waiting for a new mini to power my media center. If they cancel it, I'll have to get one of those ultra-small PCs instead.

I'm not putting a macpro in my entertainment center. i already have a 50" screen there, so why would i want to buy another one (macbook or imac)?

without the mini, Apple doesn't have a solution to my problem.

because we all know the Apple TV isn't solving anyone's problems! I'm sure mini sales are at least on par with aTV sales...

Evangelion

May 24, 2007, 01:48 PM

Fix the problems, yes: make it bigger.

And thus the mini is killed.

you do not need to make it bigger in order to fix its problems. the problem is mostly price. desktop hd might help out a bit, but not that much. mini was cheaper in the past, and it could be cheper again.

and even if they made it bigger so it could house a desktop-drive, it wouldn't have to be THAT much bigger than it is today.

danny_w

May 24, 2007, 01:48 PM

well, the rumor about apple dumping the 17" imac states that the reason for it would be the fact that 20" imac would cost about as much as 17" would cost. in short: low-end imac would cost as much as low-end imac costs today, it would just have a 20" screen instead of 17" screen.
But not everyone wants or has space for a 20" screen. My wife for example, who preferred the 17" recently when I offered to get either one for her.

FJ218700

May 24, 2007, 01:48 PM

perhaps version 2 of the iPhone (WWDC 08?) will have a 32 Gb Flash HD with its dock sporting a mini DVI and USB outputs.

= new mini :confused:

Lepton

May 24, 2007, 01:49 PM

The Mini is a little too small. It is very hard to grow it. I think there will be a replacement that is a little bigger, but still smaller than a mini-tower. Perhaps the size of a Mini or AppleTV but twice the height.

This will be released along with their new line of Multi-Touch displays. I predict that, Multi-Touch support in Leopard as one of its top secrets, and other stuff, in this article (http://www.myallo.com/article?artid=2208652).

arkmannj

May 24, 2007, 01:49 PM

No Worries, it's being replaced by te super-mini.......I hope
or perhaps... Return of the Cube !!!!

cube

May 24, 2007, 01:50 PM

you do not need to make it bigger in order to fix its problems. the problem is mostly price. desktop hd might help out a bit, but not that much. mini was cheaper in the past, and it could be cheper again.

and even if they made it bigger so it could house a desktop-drive, it wouldn't have to be THAT much bigger than it is today.

Bigger means desktop hd, desktop CPU, desktop optical, desktop RAM, so it would be much cheaper and performant.

pixmhang

May 24, 2007, 01:53 PM

I recall a recent article explaining Intel's failed roadmap for integrated graphics cards: http://news.com.com/Intels+chipset+road+map+lacks+a+driver/2100-1006_3-6184483.html?tag=item
With all the new horsepower that Vista and Leopard's new Core Graphics will require, it is quite likely that Apple cannot hit the $800 price point and go with a dedicated card, while Intel's poor products like the 965 just won't cut it.

I own a G4 mini, the last with a dedicated graphics solution. I always felt that offering a BTO dedicated card was a good solution, but it never materialized. Sure, it would put the price at $1200 for a mini, but all those with home theater aspirations would gladly spend the money. Something under the $2500 Mac Pro tower needs to be offered. I just don't need 4 internal drives. Make a smaller case apple! Guess we'll wait for June 11th to see what Steve unveils. A new $999 cube, maybe?

Stonecoldcleric

May 24, 2007, 01:54 PM

Why would apple introduce TWO MAJOR branded items (AppleTV and Airport Extreme) with the 6.5" form factor if they intend to kill the mini?

I am surprised no one at AI thought "diminutive" apple was dead on such dimutive evidence. Kasper Jade, go find hard evidence - and while your at it, go find a new name, even if Kasper Jade is a pseudonym...

...

robertnq

May 24, 2007, 01:54 PM

I love my mac mini, although i bought months before they switched to intel...i wasnt hooked on macrumors yet! but i wouldnt mind if they tossed it i probably could sell mine on ebay for what i paid for it....but i would then like to see a sub-800 iMac...apple doesnt need to make sure they dont surrender all those potential people who want to atleast try OSX...

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 01:56 PM

Think it's possible they'll just rebrand the mini as an AppleTV? AppleTV 2.0, perhaps? Give the current AppleTV a little more storage space and a little more OS X to it and ditch the mini?

It would be too soon to update the Apple TV but it is very possible in the future and it makes more sense to me. I think the underpowered Mini was obsolete before it's time. Once it switched over to Intel I think the Mini was heading for the grave. The Intel chips just didn't power many PPC programs under Rosetta well enough and it just lagged in graphics. Not to mention adding a decent set of periphs pushed the price to the cost of an all-in-one iMac so WTF. The computer just seemed to be a bit out of place in this new world of Intel and Windows virtualization.

The best thing for apple to do is axe it and put the same components in a slightly bigger and much more capable AppleTV 2.0. Bigger HDD, optical slot, maybe a FW400 port (take it out if it saves money), and usability with a keyboard and mouse so you can surf the web from your TV.

Ding Dong the Witch is DEAD :(
Now give me a mini tower without a HEAD :D

I love my mac mini, although i bought months before they switched to intel...i wasnt hooked on macrumors yet! but i wouldnt mind if they tossed it i probably could sell mine on ebay for what i paid for it....but i would then like to see a sub-800 iMac...apple doesnt need to make sure they dont surrender all those potential people who want to atleast try OSX...

I agree... add to those people the ones that want to get a Mac for a premium but not a fortune. Rumor has it that the 17" iMac may get the axe to, but if they can get the price down on it, sell it for under $800 and watch every other PC maker's price fall due to switchers sitting on the price fence.

- - OR - -

Get the price of the 20" down to around a grand. Since I don't think anyone wants to buy a desktop starting at $1500 and call it a budget or price conscious PC. I don't think Apple can get it down that low, a $500 price decrease... not happening... Apple wants to make money and I want them to as well.

skellener

May 24, 2007, 01:58 PM

Why would apple introduce TWO MAJOR branded items (AppleTV and Airport Extreme) with the 6.5" form factor if they intend to kill the mini?
AppleTV isn't 6.5" form factor. It's 7.7"
http://www.apple.com/appletv/specs.html

CptnJustc

May 24, 2007, 02:01 PM

The best thing for apple to do is axe it and put the same components in a slightly bigger and much more capable AppleTV 2.0. Bigger HDD, optical slot, maybe a FW400 port (take it out if it saves money), and usability with a keyboard and mouse so you can surf the web from your TV.

Er, yeah, I agree. Also, three more fully-functional USB ports.... :o

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 02:02 PM

Why would apple introduce TWO MAJOR branded items (AppleTV and Airport Extreme) with the 6.5" form factor if they intend to kill the mini?

I honeslty have to say so what. Apple can release any size they want too. Maybe Apple will be combining all three machines into one do it all device and sell it for $500. They could call it the Airport Extreme Pro. It will have all the features of a MacMini, Apple TV, and a WiFi Draft N router in one device.

Go figure.

Stonecoldcleric

May 24, 2007, 02:03 PM

AppleTV isn't 6.5" form factor. It's 7.7"

you right - I thought it was bigger until a friend told me the other day that he bought one and it was the same size - he does not have a mini to compare it to but I wrongfully trusted him...I stand corrected - nevertheless, the new base station IS 6.5. If they kill it I still think that whatever replaces it will be in similar form factor...

with that I am...

cube

May 24, 2007, 02:03 PM

A new $999 cube, maybe?

I have a Cube. From experience I can tell you it's very nice but not practical. A new machine has to be a bit bigger and more expandable than that.

- Limited choice of graphics cards because smaller than standard size
- No good SCSI solution.
- Limited choice of optical drives, slower, and more expensive.
- Constrained in CPU upgrades

Zigster

May 24, 2007, 02:03 PM

Manic Mouse

May 24, 2007, 02:04 PM

Intel's poor products like the 965 just won't cut it.

But the GMA950 in the "new" MacBooks will?

Stonecoldcleric

May 24, 2007, 02:04 PM

I honeslty have to say so what. Apple can release any size they want too. Maybe Apple will be combining all three machines into one do it all device and sell it for $500. They could call it the Airport Extreme Pro. It will have all the features of a MacMini, Apple TV, and a WiFi Draft N router in one device.

Go figure.

I was wrong about the AppleTV but the device you describe would be cool...

isgoed

May 24, 2007, 02:05 PM

I must say I am very fond of my mini. But I will probably be fond of any mac I would own. Let's hope that its successor will please the headless iMac complainers.

Respect.

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 02:06 PM

I have a Cube. From experience I can tell you it's very nice but not practical. A new machine has to be a bit bigger and more expandable than that.

- Limited choice of graphics cards because smaller than standard size
- No good SCSI solution.
- Limited choice of optical drives, slower, and more expensive.
- Constrained in CPU upgrades

Sounds like an iMac without a monitor... may work for some.

Apple needs to take the MacPro and cut all of it's features in half. One chip processor, 2 PCIx slots, 8GB of RAM, two HDD slots, 1 optical bay... and cut the price in half to about $1200 and they will have a winner for most geeks and gamers out there.

I was wrong about the AppleTV but the device you describe would be cool...

Yes it would... My nipples were getting hard just thinking about it... :D

Okay that may have been a bit over the top... sorry.

As a matter of fact.... make it so that I can stick that Airport Express Pro inside of the MacPro Mini and I will buy two of them Apple, one to use and one to never take out of the box. Come on Jobs you can do it... make my techie dreams come true. I wanna watch TV, edit HD footage with FCP and play Sims 2 Open for business all at the same time while streaming music to my other TV in my bedroom.

guzhogi

May 24, 2007, 02:08 PM

Please post messages like this in the "your computer is gayer than mine" thread so that everyone who is interested in the relative homosexuality of the various mac models can enjoy it.

Note that same thread can also be used for any bi-curious mac models.

Plus, who really cares. Sure, homosexuality is against many religions and whatever, but if something's gay, I don't care. I have a lot of homosexual friends are act just like straight people. They don't grope everyone of the same sex they see; as I said they act just like straight people, they're just interested in the same sex. Besides, what you find gay another might not.

haoqfu

May 24, 2007, 02:09 PM

Why would apple introduce TWO MAJOR branded items (AppleTV and Airport Extreme) with the 6.5" form factor if they intend to kill the mini?
...

Exactly, I'm surprised that no one points out this.

donlphi

May 24, 2007, 02:10 PM

I better get one before they disappear. I was hoping to install one in my car, but was waiting for a processor upgrade.

OH WELL

If we get an ULTRA PORTABLE soon, I'll be fine.

Can't we just go back to the old commodore 64 (keyboard computers)? They were terrific.
I smell a hack coming on.

ricosuave

May 24, 2007, 02:10 PM

Mac-mini EXTREME? :eek: :D

:apple: TV Pro

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 02:11 PM

Exactly, I'm surprised that no one points out this.

because it doesn't matter. Maybe that is just the size of the future like the letter "i" is the prefix of the future.

iPod, iMac, iCan't stand that iStuff

biturbomunkie

May 24, 2007, 02:12 PM

ciao MM.

hello apple teevee.

Stonecoldcleric

May 24, 2007, 02:13 PM

Sounds like an iMac without a monitor... may work for some.

Apple needs to take the MacPro and cut all of it's features in half. One chip processor, 2 PCIx slots, 8GB of RAM, two HDD slots, 1 optical bay... and cut the price in half to about $1200 and they will have a winner for most geeks and gamers out there.

Now you are talking crazy - that is too close to their current line up in MacPro. Too many people are like me - As soon as my wife's desktop crashes again she wants a mini - we don't need all the expandibility of a MP all we need is a dependable replacement for our PC for email and ebay. Period. The mini is perfect.

My theory is that all their attn. has gone into iphone and keeping the laptops up to snuff. Mini has been ignored. Soon, they will come out with one with wireless N, core 2, etc. Just watch and pray...

bow in reverence to ...

trevorlsciact

May 24, 2007, 02:13 PM

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 02:14 PM

Plus, who really cares. Sure, homosexuality is against many religions and whatever, but if something's gay, I don't care. I have a lot of homosexual friends are act just like straight people. They don't grope everyone of the same sex they see; as I said they act just like straight people, they're just interested in the same sex. Besides, what you find gay another might not.

Let's keep it clean here guys....

Oh wait... I had the nipple comment.... okay moderators... you can remove it if you wish.

cube

May 24, 2007, 02:16 PM

Sounds like an iMac without a monitor... may work for some.

Apple needs to take the MacPro and cut all of it's features in half. One chip processor, 2 PCIx slots, 8GB of RAM, two HDD slots, 1 optical bay... and cut the price in half to about $1200 and they will have a winner for most geeks and gamers out there.

The Cube might not be very practical, but it's better than an iMac without monitor because there are several PC graphics cards that can be made to work.

What you describe is about what all of us so-called "whiners" have been clamoring for in these forums for ages. You could even drop a Kentsfield if you wanted to kind of waste money in four cores with poor bandwidth.

Squonk

May 24, 2007, 02:16 PM

guzhogi

May 24, 2007, 02:17 PM

IMO, the Mini is good for people who just type letters, check e-mail & listen to music. The iMac is good for all that plus some casual gaming. As for the Mac Pro, it should be scrapped and 2 new kinds of desktops should be available in its place. One would be a midrange tower, 2 optical drives, 2 hard drives, 3 PCIe (2 in SLI mode and another 1 for whatever) and 1 proc. The other tower should be the workstation with 3+ optical bays, ~4 hard drives, 2+ multi-core procs, & ~4 PCIe (2 SLI & 2 others for whatever). I'd also like the optical drives in the towers to be easily user replaceable like in regular PC ATX cases.

cube

May 24, 2007, 02:19 PM

Kill the AppleTV and sell a proper mac mini with its media features.
Call it MacTV so people will not confuse this with a real headless Mac.

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 02:21 PM

Now you are talking crazy - that is too close to their current line up in MacPro. Too many people are like me - As soon as my wife's desktop crashes again she wants a mini - we don't need all the expandibility of a MP all we need is a dependable replacement for our PC for email and ebay. Period. The mini is perfect.

My theory is that all their attn. has gone into iphone and keeping the laptops up to snuff. Mini has been ignored. Soon, they will come out with one with wireless N, core 2, etc. Just watch and pray...

bow in reverence to ...

You missed the point. I was commenting on someone saying that the Cube was this and that and what he described as limitations were the same limitations in the iMac..

Apple could make a headless mini tower that slide right between the 24" iMac and the MacPro. I agree with you on the mini issue, but the mini is a bit of a precarious little device that had seen it's hayday. I don't see anyone really needing to get a fresh Mac for $600 when they could pay the extra $300 for the 17" iMac and get better specs, and a monitor mouse and keyboard. When the 17" iMac was still $1200 it might have been more plausible and when the mini's specs were close to the iMac's then it was a bargain, but now it is just an old machine used for novalty stuff. The original creators of Cash Cab stuffed them into a cab and used them to wirelessly transmit footage from inside the cab to the chase vehicle for editing. Works better than an iMac... but for home, student, family, use... meh... your better off getting a used eMac... it comes with a monitor.

Stonecoldcleric

May 24, 2007, 02:23 PM

So a great replacement for the current mini would have:

* form factor of the :apple: TV [edit: just taller]
* larger capacity hard drive
* full version of OS X
* retain the video card and HDTV outputs
* Core 2 Duo CPU

2.0GHz/1GB/120GB/combo $599
2.16GHz/1GB/160GB/super drive $799

dudes?

Nah...I am not sold that the 7.7" form factor is gong standard. I also dont thnk that apple ever intended that the appletv be sitting in your home office - I guess I am ust stuck on why they would introduce a 6.5" extreme if 6.5" form is dead.

Your other stats look good - I just think they'll do that in a 6.5" box.

you can now send money to...

Stonecoldcleric

May 24, 2007, 02:25 PM

You missed the point...

i gotcha...

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 02:25 PM

The Cube might not be very practical, but it's better than an iMac without monitor because there are several PC graphics cards that can be made to work.

What you describe is about what all of us so-called "whiners" have been clamoring for in these forums for ages. You could even drop a Kentsfield if you wanted to kind of waste money in four cores with poor bandwidth.

The Cube was not better than an iMac... changing a graphics card and what else though... besides... it based off of some elses opinion. The Cube was limited he said... the limitations listed sounded like the exact limitations of the iMac.

And I want the whiners to get what they want too, and it would make it easier for me to convince the geeks and gamers to switch to Mac if there was a computer with MacPro expandibility and iMac price for them to play with. As for the MacMini... if Apple updates it, then great... if they don't then great... give me the next budget Macintosh Computer which gives good reason for discontinuing the MacMini... I think the net revision of the Apple TV may just have the mini's features... same size same parts... just make it thicker for the optical drive to watch BlueRay movies on and TiVo features and Apple's a shoe in.

cube

May 24, 2007, 02:28 PM

The Cube was not better than an iMac... changing a graphics card and what else though... besides... it based off of some elses opinion. The Cube was limited he said... the limitations listed sounded like the exact limitations of the iMac.

The iMac has the TERRIBLE limitation of including its own monitor. Even if you made it headless, you can't upgrade the graphics. I'm on my third gfx for the Cube, going for a fourth.

DMann

May 24, 2007, 02:29 PM

:apple: TV Pro

The Mini is here to stay.......... :apple:TV Pro would be a likely metamorphosis.

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 02:29 PM

i gotcha...

I also agree with you on the iPhone bit... They need to premier Leopard at WWDC and forget about this iPhone Santa Rosemary stuff... give me software!!! :mad:

iLife 08
iWork 08
Logic 08
FCX 08
Leopard
Server 08
Aperture updates
QuickTime updates
Make bootcamp work like Parallels so I can have an actual factual Windows machine to run games without booting into that God awful Windows OS.

Santa Rosa and hardware isn't why I switched... it was the software.

MacIke

May 24, 2007, 02:30 PM

I would think the geeks would rather have a Mac Pro, they can add stuff and tinker with it more.

Actually it is the true geek who wants a computer in the car (got one) one at the TV (oops another one there) and who knows where else doing . . . if you will simple jobs.

My wife (non-geek) has one and loves it.

corywoolf

May 24, 2007, 02:31 PM

Apple just needs to give it better specs and update it more frequently. Why not have just one edition of the mini like they did with the Mac Pro:

2 Ghz Core 2 Duo
1 GB RAM (expandable up to 2)
120 GB 2.5" hard drive
Intel GMA graphics
Optional 256 MB ATI Radeon x1600 ($200)
HDMI out (converters for component avail.)
DVI out
4 USB 2.0 ports
1 FW 400 port
5.1 surround sound support (through HDMI connection)
Apple TV menu replaces Front Row
Double Layer Super Drive 8x
Optional HD DVD drive ($200)
Mac OS X Leopard 10.5
Apple Remote

$699

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 02:32 PM

The iMac has the TERRIBLE limitation of including its own monitor. Even if you made it headless, you can't upgrade the graphics. I'm on my third gfx for the Cube, going for a fourth.

I never said the iMac should be headless. And the fact that it is an all in one COMSUMER machine doesn't make it a limitation. If you need to upgrade graphics cards get a MacPro...

Still using a Cube? Maybe it's time for a new computer... only so much beating a dead horse can take..

DMann

May 24, 2007, 02:33 PM

I also agree with you on the iPhone bit... They need to premier Leopard at WWDC and forget about this iPhone Santa Rosemary stuff... give me software!!! :mad:

iLife 08
iWork 08
Logic 08
FCX 08
Leopard
Server 08
Aperture updates
QuickTime updates
Make bootcamp work like Parallels so I can have an actual factual Windows machine to run games without booting into that God awful Windows OS.

Santa Rosa and hardware isn't why I switched... it was the software.

Very true. However, if Santa Rosa and hardware upgrades will make these high-end apps run well, then bring on the hardware that'll make'em scream.

MacSamurai

May 24, 2007, 02:33 PM

mac mini replacement = new ipod :eek:

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 02:34 PM

Apple just needs to give it better specs and update it more frequently. Why not have just one edition of the mini:

2 Ghz Core 2 Duo
1 GB RAM (expandable up to 2)
120 GB 2.5" hard drive
HDMI out (converters for component avail.)
DVI out
4 USB 2.0 ports
1 FW 400 port
5.1 surround sound support (through HDMI connection)
Apple TV menu replaces Front Row
Double Layer Super Drive 8x
Optional HD DVD drive ($200)
Mac OS X Leopard 10.5
Apple Remote

$699

Goodbye AppleTV sales. If they replace it, it's gonna have everything you say sans Apple TV menu, HDMI out, 5.1, and anything else that makes it compete with the Apple TV.

And Apple supports Blue Ray... no HD DVD either.

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 02:35 PM

Very true. However, if Santa Rosa and hardware upgrades will make these high-end apps run well, then bring on the hardware that'll make'em scream.

Touche.... I won't pick on Santa... bring it on with the software.

Squonk

May 24, 2007, 02:36 PM

mac mini replacement = new ipod :eek:

You do mean the iPhone, right? :D

Stonecoldcleric

May 24, 2007, 02:36 PM

They need to premier Leopard at WWDC and forget about this iPhone Santa Rosemary stuff... give me software!!!

no doubt.

yagran

May 24, 2007, 02:37 PM

2 Ghz Core 2 Duo
1 GB RAM (expandable up to 2)
120 GB 2.5" hard drive
Intel GMA graphics
Optional 256 MB ATI Radeon x1600 ($200)
HDMI out (converters for component avail.)
DVI out
4 USB 2.0 ports
1 FW 400 port
5.1 surround sound support (through HDMI connection)
Apple TV menu replaces Front Row
Double Layer Super Drive 8x
Optional HD DVD drive ($200)
Mac OS X Leopard 10.5
Apple Remote

so this would no longer be called the mac mini, but appletv plus right?
product differentiationis pretty key. they will kill off mini or MOVE IT AWAY from te AppleTV not give it a hdmi etc, and a optional gfx card? in a mini?pointless if you ask me.

oscuh

May 24, 2007, 02:39 PM

bdj21ya

May 24, 2007, 02:41 PM

For all those worried about losing the mini, don't worry, it will be replaced by the all new "Mac Invisisi", so small you can't even see it and capable of holding your entire library of ripped DVD's. How do you plug in peripherals you ask? No need. Just leave the ends of the cable exposed and the new Mac Invisi will float around the room rapidly to interface with each of them.

oscuh

May 24, 2007, 02:42 PM

WTF! they are going to put iMac as their lowest end product?! iMac is so gay!

Is that "Gay" Gay or "Stuck alone together late at night on a CompUSA shelf" Gay?

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 02:43 PM

They would never use the same enclosure as the MacPro ...

Issue #1 would be brand dilution.
Issue #2 would be cost
Issue #3, with it being stripped down, why use that large an enclosure?

Expect a Minitower or such other form, perhaps Aluminum a la the purported new design direction for iMacs, or the frosty plastics a la current iMac/MBs

I want my headless Mac to be a round orb floating above my desk wirelessly connected to everything (including power source) NO forget the power source... my Mac is nuclear and doesn't need a power cord. And give it the option of running either the latest Intel chips or that new IBM 4.7GHz PPC chip. And it can make me a peanut butter and jelly sandwich... And hack the iPhone so it can use the Sprint network.

Yeah.. I will buy that.

mklos

May 24, 2007, 02:43 PM

What are you smoking man ?

The mac mini has helped tons of people make the switch to OS X... saying it wasn't a success is just wrong. I think dropping the mini would be a terrible decision, you are however right regarding the price, it does need a lower price-point...

Simple business practices tells everyone that if a product isn't selling or making the enough to keep it going then its not worth it to keep producing it. So obviously if true, the MacMini didn't sell very well. Its a low end computer and by the time you get a keyboard, mouse, and display, you're in iMac territory as far as price goes and the iMac is a far better computer than the MacMini. Yes, the MacMini has its places, but more often than not, people will go for the iMac instead. Its an end to end solution.

Take this for example, why was the MacMini originally released? It was to TRY and compete in the low end computer segment. Mainly the $499 Dell type thing. Well compared to a Dell, the MacMini isn't a very good deal at all. The Dell is an end to end solution. It comes with everything you need right out of the box. The MacMini doesn't, plain and simple.

I honestly can't see the MacMini as being a money maker for Apple. This is why it doesn't come with a keyboard and mouse. Apple had to design a package that would not cost them as much for shipping (which is a big cost for Apple) to make as much money off this as possible. Yes, the MacMini did switch a bunch of people, but so did lots of other Macs. It wasn't just the MacMini that did so. In business, if a product isn't making you any money, or not enough money to keep it going you kill it no matter how well people like it. Apple is in business to make money, not keep a select group of people happy.

I'm sorry that it was a good computer for you and some others here, but sometimes you just gotta let things go. Some things don't last forever.

BTW...the iPod Mini was probably the best selling iPod until it was replaced by the iPod Nano. Everywhere I go I see people with iPod Mini's, not regular iPods or iPod Nanos. I don't know what people are trying to get at there. It was kind of funny because people thought it wouldn't sell very well at all because it was only $50 less expensive than a 20GB iPod and it only had 4GB of HD space, yet it was Apple's best selling iPod. It out sold the the regular iPod by a bunch.

Also, nobody has true numbers of any types of sales because Apple doesn't release those numbers.

BRLawyer

May 24, 2007, 02:44 PM

And as always, the uninterested 90% have simply passed right by.

And pundits have done this? Really?

Sorry, forgot the marks...I mean the "specialists"... :rolleyes:

cube

May 24, 2007, 02:44 PM

I never said the iMac should be headless. And the fact that it is an all in one COMSUMER machine doesn't make it a limitation. If you need to upgrade graphics cards get a MacPro...

You're getting into the fanboy talk realm...

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 02:44 PM

Is that "Gay" Gay or "Stuck alone together late at night on a CompUSA shelf" Gay?

I think he means "Happy" Gay.... because he is Gay enough to post comments without thinking.

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 02:46 PM

You're getting into the fanboy talk realm...

So not... getting into the let's keep it real realm. Economy, market strategies and what not. I am a fanboy but I have learned to control my powers.

Most users (general users) don't upgrade anything on their machines, maybe RAM or HDD space... most use their machines through the warranty then buy new ones... in about three --> four years.

My father used his HP laptop for almost 10 years before he bought a new one (he was broke as was I) and he never once thought about upgrading a thing... what for after something is older than it's projected life...

For computers... that is 3 --> 4 years. If that.

Stonecoldcleric

May 24, 2007, 02:46 PM

For all those worried about losing the mini, don't worry, it will be replaced by the all new "Mac Invisisi"...

LOL. I think you're on to something - have you ever read about NT Dokomo's finger whisper (http://www.gizmag.com/go/2434/) phone?

-hh

May 24, 2007, 02:47 PM

Not surprising.

They aren't/haven't ever sold well and by the time you get one that has decent specs, you may as well get the $999 iMac.

The dumb thing is that if they were such poor sellers, then how come I can't find one on eBay really, really cheap?

I've been keeping an eye out for a G4 mini "on the cheap" to use for running old PPC software as a way to keep my office from being too cluttered, because when its time for me to do my PPC->Intel chip transition, I want to keep a PPC machine around (for old software) and my G5 PowerMac is a big on the LARGE size. It seems that a "good" price for a G4 mini is still $350-$400, which is 75% of original price on a 2 year old computer. YMMV, but that level of value retention is extraordinary in electronics...very much like the 12" G4 Powerbook.

-hh

Stonecoldcleric

May 24, 2007, 02:48 PM

LOL. I think you're on to something - have you ever read about NT Dokomo's finger whisper (http://www.gizmag.com/go/2434/) phone?

I guess that's NTT DoCoMo...

oscuh

May 24, 2007, 02:48 PM

Sounds like a purely business decision to me. Mac mini apparently doesn't sell well, and I'm sure the profit margin is pretty tight. Why keep it around? You can "switch" for 1000 with a macbook.

My thoughts exactly ... perhaps Apple is basing decisons strictly on price points? For a few hundred more $ than a mini you get way better performance. Want a larger screen? Drop $200 and get a 19" lcd, then you get a nice machine, PLUS portability, and the keyboard comes included! ;)

oscuh

May 24, 2007, 02:49 PM

I want my headless Mac to be a round orb floating above my desk wirelessly connected to everything (including power source) NO forget the power source... my Mac is nuclear and doesn't need a power cord. And give it the option of running either the latest Intel chips or that new IBM 4.7GHz PPC chip. And it can make me a peanut butter and jelly sandwich... And hack the iPhone so it can use the Sprint network.

Yeah.. I will buy that.

*LOL* As would I

Marx55

May 24, 2007, 02:49 PM

The Mac mini is the best Mac ever created by Apple. Powerful, small and quiet. Besides, being modular to use large Apple Cinema Displays with it. Great. I only hope that if Apple discontinues it, it is to introduce the Mac supermini, with eSATA (four ports) and FireWire 800 (four ports), as well as faster and larger disks (one or two 1TB 7,2000 rpm inside).

The new headless Mac should be like THIS!
http://apple.weblogsinc.com/entry/1128136479381114/

Original at
http://www.mackompass.de/index.php?option=content&task=view&id=52&Itemid=2

Bizmac

May 24, 2007, 02:51 PM

Let's face it no more mini :mad: ....... But now "Cube 2" ;)

oscuh

May 24, 2007, 02:51 PM

Simple business practices tells everyone that if a product isn't selling or making them enough to keep it going then its not worth it to keep producing it.

It's called a loss-leader or earn em and grow em approach. GOBS of companies do it ... you've probably heard of a few of them, like Ford, Chrysler, GM ... do you think Chevy makes a single DIME on a Cobalt? No ... but the idea is that once you're "in", you'll eventually upgrade to a product that makes them money. Buy a Mini .. oh, you like it? Well here's a snazzy MBP!

Tara Davis

May 24, 2007, 02:52 PM

If this happens, I'm going to be all over the clearance sale.

I was waiting for the "next" mini to replace my dual-G5 Tower. I was hoping for something that would be a quieter "upgrade" that could dual-boot for games, but I'll settle for a "sidegrade" to the current mini if they sell them off cheap enough.

mrgreen4242

May 24, 2007, 02:52 PM

Yes, I've stood at the door on a busy Saturday and counted. :rolleyes:

Of course I haven't, but it would stand to reason that the hour I was in there at the Genius Bar, they might have sold at least ONE. About 3 iMacs, 2 MBPS, 2 MBs and one MP.

Not purely scientific, obviously, but anyone that thinks this has been a top seller is nuts.

Just wait until its discontinued...

Not only not scientific, but completely irrelevant. You spent one hour at one store on one day and are basing the sales of an entire product, which has had 6 different versions over 3 years and has been on sale on every continent, as well as Apple's (massively successful) online store? Just stop before you dig yourself in any more.

IMO, the Mini is good for people who just type letters, check e-mail & listen to music. The iMac is good for all that plus some casual gaming. As for the Mac Pro, it should be scrapped and 2 new kinds of desktops should be available in its place. One would be a midrange tower, 2 optical drives, 2 hard drives, 3 PCIe (2 in SLI mode and another 1 for whatever) and 1 proc. The other tower should be the workstation with 3+ optical bays, ~4 hard drives, 2+ multi-core procs, & ~4 PCIe (2 SLI & 2 others for whatever). I'd also like the optical drives in the towers to be easily user replaceable like in regular PC ATX cases.

Never used a mini, have you? I'm a pretty high level nerd, a database admin by profession, and I've only ever come up with one thing my G4 mini couldn't do: play games. So I bought an Xbox360 and connected it to my Dell 19" LCD via VGA (mini on DVI) and it's quite perfect.

Aside from email, listen to music, "writing letters: (:eyeroll:), I write and host (for testing purposes) websites which use PHP scripting and SQL db's, I use the Gimp and PS for mid level photo work (not just cropping and color balancing - image compositing, "artistic" manipulation, etc), I use iMovie to create original stop-motion animation (in HD) and iDVD to burn them to disc, I do a ton of video conversion (all legal - sans DCMA which I chose to ignore - TiVo and DVD to iPod), and probably a ton of other things I can't think of right now.

I'm looking forward to upgrading to an Intel mini sometime soon... I've been holding off for an update to see if I want a new one, or just get an even better deal on the current generation. Having 3x the CPU power and 2x the RAM (plus an audio input) will be terrific!

If Apple discontinues the mini and doesn't replace it with another sub-$1000 headless Mac, the (current low-end model) mini I'm going to buy soon will be my last Mac purchase... maybe ever. I'd honestly build a "hackintosh" with a cracked copy of OS X before I bought an AIO desktop or spend over $2000 on a computer.

gkarris

May 24, 2007, 02:53 PM

At first, I thought it was a bad idea.

But, Apple has been known to "get rid of stuff".

1. Macintosh - they got rid of the 5.25" floppy.
2. iMac - they got rid of the floppy altogether.
3. iMac G4 - they got rid of the CRT.

Now, could they be getting rid of the optical drive?

Use an :apple:TV enclosure, but with C2D, up to 2Gigs RAM, and trade out the component video ports for USB and FW.

You can add an external optical drive if you want one...

Call it :apple:Mac

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 02:53 PM

The dumb thing is that if they were such poor sellers, then how come I can't find one on eBay really, really cheap?

I've been keeping an eye out for a G4 mini "on the cheap" to use for running old PPC software as a way to keep my office from being too cluttered, because when its time for me to do my PPC->Intel chip transition, I want to keep a PPC machine around (for old software) and my G5 PowerMac is a big on the LARGE size. It seems that a "good" price for a G4 mini is still $350-$400, which is 75% of original price on a 2 year old computer. YMMV, but that level of value retention is extraordinary in electronics...very much like the 12" G4 Powerbook.

-hh

Value retention on electronics is actually quite poor. They deteriorate the quickest. And if you are trying to reduce clutter than you're better off just running the PPC apps through rosetta on the Intel machines. And Ebay is not a market analyst site, you can't really base how well a machine is doing by what you can buy off of Ebay.

The Mini did sell well though, just that recently... it isn't doing too good. And if Apple updates the specs and keeps the price the same, getting a decently outfitted machine will push the price to the 17" iMac specs, so you are better off getting an iMac that is one unit. Unless you want to stick the mini somewhere you can't fit an iMac like your car or under your TV.

Turkish

May 24, 2007, 02:54 PM

The dumb thing is that if they were such poor sellers, then how come I can't find one on eBay really, really cheap?

What does that have to do with how well they sold/sell? :confused:

iKwick7

May 24, 2007, 02:58 PM

Haven't read through the whole thread, so don't know if anyone had made this point or not....

Unless they are cancelling the Mac Mini to merge the mini and apple tv line, I don't see it happening. I really see that merger happening, but not just a discontinuing of the mini.

I really, really loved my mini and plan on getting one again some time in the future as a kitchen server or something. Truely a great little computer.

oscuh

May 24, 2007, 02:59 PM

What does that have to do with how well they sold/sell? :confused:

It's a direct indicator of popularity! Like trying to find a decent used Prius.

Stonecoldcleric

May 24, 2007, 03:00 PM

Now, could they be getting rid of the optical drive?
You can add an external optical drive if you want one...

Uh...are you sure you want to commit to such an asinine thought at the advent of HDDVD and Blu-ray? And take us back to 1992 for a optional external optical drive? You're probably listening to REO speedwagon or similar right now. Hit pause and rethink your comment.

No really. There is no way they'd get rid of an optical drive with so many of us still puchasing software and movies that we need a drive for.

TechnoLawyer

May 24, 2007, 03:00 PM

According to Apple Insider, the Mini is dead!!!!

This is very bad news if true. We have 3 Mac minis at our company, including our file server. It's a great computer for general office work.

cube

May 24, 2007, 03:00 PM

So not... getting into the let's keep it real realm. Economy, market strategies and what not. I am a fanboy but I have learned to control my powers.

Most users (general users) don't upgrade anything on their machines, maybe RAM or HDD space... most use their machines through the warranty then buy new ones... in about three --> four years.

My father used his HP laptop for almost 10 years before he bought a new one (he was broke as was I) and he never once thought about upgrading a thing... what for after something is older than it's projected life...

For computers... that is 3 --> 4 years. If that.

So what you are saying is that everyone who doesn't want a toy or overkill should get a PC. Excellent business thinking.

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 03:01 PM

I'm looking forward to upgrading to an Intel mini sometime soon... I've been holding off for an update to see if I want a new one, or just get an even better deal on the current generation. Having 3x the CPU power and 2x the RAM (plus an audio input) will be terrific!

If Apple discontinues the mini and doesn't replace it with another sub-$1000 headless Mac, the (current low-end model) mini I'm going to buy soon will be my last Mac purchase... maybe ever. I'd honestly build a "hackintosh" with a cracked copy of OS X before I bought an AIO desktop or spend over $2000 on a computer.

You make the most sense, and I am with you on the Hackintosh thing, got any linkies? :confused:

At first, I thought it was a bad idea.

But, Apple has been known to "get rid of stuff".

1. Macintosh - they got rid of the 5.25" floppy.
2. iMac - they got rid of the floppy altogether.
3. iMac G4 - they got rid of the CRT.

Now, could they be getting rid of the optical drive?

Use an :apple:TV enclosure, but with C2D, up to 2Gigs RAM, and trade out the component video ports for USB and FW.

You can add an external optical drive if you want one...

Call it :apple:Mac

I think they will do this on the MacBook Mini ultra portable laptop. I think most machines still need their optical drives until the price of flash drives comes down enough to put an entire OS on one, and the quality of online movies meets the standard set by HD discs. But even then they will still be needed for other reasons here and there... we can always make the dics and drives smaller though. Imagine a drive specifically for the mini discs. Blue Ray mini disc could hold 12GB of stuff. And a dedicated drive would be half the size.

-hh

May 24, 2007, 03:03 PM

Simple business practices tells everyone that if a product isn't selling or making the enough to keep it going then its not worth it to keep producing it.

True, if that's the limit of the business's vision.

Yes, the MacMini has its places, but more often than not, people will go for the iMac instead. Its an end to end solution.

Exactly - - but could it have been the mini's low price that prompted the trip to the store to buy the iMac?

Take this for example, why was the MacMini originally released? It was to TRY and compete in the low end computer segment. Mainly the $499 Dell type thing
...
I honestly can't see the MacMini as being a money maker for Apple.

The problem is that it is hard to determine what percentage of your customers only considered your product because of the enticement of the low priced product {the mini}, but then decided (maybe with prompting) to move to a more upscale, more profitable machine.

This happens all the time with premier products ... its not a coincidence that Porsche has models that are cheaper than the 911, for example.

FWIW, don't think that Dell or HP don't do the same thing too...its just a lot less obvious when all of their designs are the same form factor and equally ugly.

In business, if a product isn't making you any money, or not enough money to keep it going you kill it no matter how well people like it.

True, but the challenge is in trying to measure a product's worth on the relatively intangible factors. Do you really think that all Chevy Corvette owners were financially {willing or able} to go straight to the Vette without having a Camaro first?

-hh

kalisphoenix

May 24, 2007, 03:03 PM

What does that have to do with how well they sold/sell? :confused:

Because if there is low demand for a given supply, the prices will adjust downward. eBay's prices remain high. Ergo, demand is still pretty danged good for two year-old Mac minis, enough to keep them at 80% of their original sales price.

Fahrwahr

May 24, 2007, 03:04 PM

I never said the iMac should be headless. And the fact that it is an all in one COMSUMER machine doesn't make it a limitation. If you need to upgrade graphics cards get a MacPro...

Still using a Cube? Maybe it's time for a new computer... only so much beating a dead horse can take..

I think cube's point was that the iMac has the additional limitation (beyond the cube) of having a built-in monitor. If the monitor goes south, you have the mini-DVI port as an option, but your computer is a big waste of space. Likewise, if the computer itself is irreparable, too expensive to repair, or obsolete but the screen is still in pristine condition, tough nuggies.

Why does CONSUMER necessarily have to mean all-in-one? Yes, many consumers want simplicity, but many may not want that at the expense of flexibility and reusability. Supposing some of the "secret features" of Leopard prompt interest in more Windows users, we may see potential switchers who already have relatively recent displays and want a desktop in their price range with competitive performance.

I think the bottom line is the Mac mini couldn't have been a contender simply because the small form factor (or price tag?) placed too many limitations on performance, both for the consumer and for Apple. We don't know for sure, but perhaps the Core 2 Duo would have been too hot to put in such a tight enclosure with all the other heat-generating components. (Yes, the Core 2 Duo are tightly-packed in the MacBooks, but the components are distributed horizontally rather than stacked.) Additionally, the miniaturized components may have pushed production costs to the point that the margins are too tight for Apple's comfort. Could it be that a slightly larger enclosure would have allowed the specs to be more competitive with comparably-priced desktops and with better margins for Apple? Maybe the "Wow! This thing is SMALL!" factor doesn't mean as much as Apple initially thought.

Turkish

May 24, 2007, 03:04 PM

It's a direct indicator of popularity! Like trying to find a decent used Prius.

No, it can merely mean that the people who own them hold onto them... there's no supply shortage of mini's...

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 03:05 PM

So what you are saying is that everyone who doesn't want a toy or overkill should get a PC. Excellent business thinking.

No, you are just making an assumption purely based on how you feel.

A 24" iMac is not a toy just because you can't upgrade anything but the memory. Neither is a 20" iMac or MacMini. Obviously you haven't done much work on a computer lately. You don't need the latest greatest graphics card to make a hit movie, go to an Indie festival and what the highschoolers run circles around the pros.

Honestly... I don't see how your comment makes any sense or relevance to the discussion... sounds like you are just mad.

Turkish

May 24, 2007, 03:06 PM

Because if there is low demand for a given supply, the prices will adjust downward. eBay's prices remain high. Ergo, demand is still pretty danged good for two year-old Mac minis, enough to keep them at 80% of their original sales price.

eBay is certainly no gauge for economics... when I can sell a 16-month old PowerBook G4 for what I paid for it...

Like I said, we'll see who's right when it's gone, but I hope I'm wrong. I like the mini.

aftk2

May 24, 2007, 03:06 PM

Never used a mini, have you? I'm a pretty high level nerd, a database admin by profession, and I've only ever come up with one thing my G4 mini couldn't do: play games. So I bought an Xbox360 and connected it to my Dell 19" LCD via VGA (mini on DVI) and it's quite perfect.

Seriously. It's amusing to me that, while computers get faster and faster, the tasks that "low-end" users are supposedly restricted to performing with their "low-end" hardware never changes. In 2000 I was having a blast learning how to record multi-track audio with my 400Mhz PowerMac, a machine which I used as a web developer for around 6 years (w/Photoshop, programming, etc...)

(Granted, this was in OS 9 - but the OS X bloat factor can't have completely wiped that all away ;-) ).

This is a pity, if it's true - I was looking at purchasing a Mac Mini to use primarily as a recording machine (with a wireless connection to my iMac, which would then be the machine reponsible for mixing, effects, etc...)

cube

May 24, 2007, 03:07 PM

A 24" iMac is not a toy just because you can't upgrade anything but the memory.

OK, let's not call it toy. Let's call it (eco-unfriendly) crap (for me).

oscuh

May 24, 2007, 03:08 PM

No, it can merely mean that the people who own them hold onto them... there's no supply shortage of mini's...

Sooo ... that means they're not popular with their owners? You're rather obtuse sometimes, you know that?

That was my point, people who own them love them, thus they keep them.

-hh

May 24, 2007, 03:08 PM

Originally Posted by Turkish
What does that have to do with how well they sold/sell?

Because if there is low demand for a given supply, the prices will adjust downward. eBay's prices remain high. Ergo, demand is still pretty danged good for two year-old Mac minis, enough to keep them at 80% of their original sales price.

Exactly.

While I'll admit that eBay isn't necessarily a great example, the classical rules of supply & demand would say that when demand is low, the sellers shouldn't be able to receive such a relatively high price.

Another example of this is the 12" G4 Powerbook.

EDIT: I just did a quick count of mini's on eBay (all types): currently, there's 88 of them listed for sale.

-hh

peharri

May 24, 2007, 03:09 PM

Well, I can't say I'm surprised. Apple produced it, but never seemed to know what to do with it. And I think the Mac mini suffered as a result. The decision to put laptop graphics in it with the Intel refresh was the point I, personally, stopped seeing any point in it.

The @TV is not an ideal replacement. There is a need for a mid- or low- end headless Mac, but the Mac mini, being as closed and underpowered as it was, was never that Mac.

I can't say I'm that saddened by the loss. What's more saddening is the notion that Apple is going to give up rather than work on understanding the need.

ncbill

May 24, 2007, 03:09 PM

I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see the Mini go away.

Comparing the prices for the Mini and the iMac it's clear Apple makes far more money on the base iMac (a Mini w/ a screen, keyboard, and mouse, none of which costs Apple very much)

The new, base 20" iMac could cost as low as $1099 (if only to sell to edu for $999), but it would have a 160GB hard drive, combo optical drive, and integrated graphics (more likely priced @$1199)

For an extra $200 over the low end you get 250GB, a 8x Superdrive, and a dedicated (but modest) graphics chip on the middle iMac.

The 24" iMac remains pricey ($400-$500 more) than that.

mklos

May 24, 2007, 03:09 PM

It's called a loss-leader or earn em and grow em approach. GOBS of companies do it ... you've probably heard of a few of them, like Ford, Chrysler, GM ... do you think Chevy makes a single DIME on a Cobalt? No ... but the idea is that once you're "in", you'll eventually upgrade to a product that makes them money. Buy a Mini .. oh, you like it? Well here's a snazzy MBP!

Its never been in Apple's practices to do this. You can't sell a computer at a loss for very long. Apple isn't Microsoft has billions up on billions of dollars to do this. Neither you nor I know what Chevy makes off the Colbalt.

w8ing4intelmacs

May 24, 2007, 03:09 PM

... a la iSight?

Turkish

May 24, 2007, 03:10 PM

You're rather obtuse sometimes, you know that?

So what were you hoping to accomplish by saying that?

bit density

May 24, 2007, 03:12 PM

I didn't have a need for a mac-mini until after 150 days since upgrade. I have just been waiting patiently for the upgrade to jump-in. Sheesh.

It won't go to any other mac than a mini. I guess I can start looking at wintel/linux boxes.

Cripes this is just too dumb.

iJawn108

May 24, 2007, 03:12 PM

I remember reading an article a few months ago about how FORD is using mac minis on it's assembly lines.

oscuh

May 24, 2007, 03:12 PM

Its never been in Apple's practices to do this. You can't sell a computer at a loss for very long. Apple isn't Microsoft has billions up on billions of dollars to do this. Neither you nor I know what Chevy makes off the Colbalt.

$6 Billion in the bank isn't enough for you? And yes, they can.

And yes, I have a pretty decent idea of margins on products like the Cobalt. My main client is the auto industry and a coworker spent 30 years in GM as a product line manager. Don't make assumptions about what others do or don't know. It's bad form, and you end up looking foolish.

Digital Skunk

May 24, 2007, 03:13 PM

I think cube's point was that the iMac has the additional limitation (beyond the cube) of having a built-in monitor. If the monitor goes south, you have the mini-DVI port as an option, but your computer is a big waste of space. Likewise, if the computer itself is irreparable, too expensive to repair, or obsolete but the screen is still in pristine condition, tough nuggies.

Why does CONSUMER necessarily have to mean all-in-one? Yes, many consumers want simplicity, but many may not want that at the expense of flexibility and reusability. Supposing some of the "secret features" of Leopard prompt interest in more Windows users, we may see potential switchers who already have relatively recent displays and want a desktop in their price range with competitive performance.

I think the bottom line is the Mac mini couldn't have been a contender simply because the small form factor (or price tag?) placed too many limitations on performance, both for the consumer and for Apple. We don't know for sure, but perhaps the Core 2 Duo would have been too hot to put in such a tight enclosure with all the other heat-generating components. (Yes, the Core 2 Duo are tightly-packed in the MacBooks, but the components are distributed horizontally rather than stacked.) Additionally, the miniaturized components may have pushed production costs to the point that the margins are too tight for Apple's comfort. Could it be that a slightly larger enclosure would have allowed the specs to be more competitive with comparably-priced desktops and with better margins for Apple? Maybe the "Wow! This thing is SMALL!" factor doesn't mean as much as Apple initially thought.

I don't think the all-in-one design is a limitation at all... Okay... let's look at the facts. The original iMac comes out in 1999... eight years later Apple still makes a consumer all-in-one desktop that pushes most of their marketshare along with their all-in-one laptops.

The whole this going up and that going up relates to many other types of machines as well, so it really holds no weight. I do get Cubes point, the G4 cube had limitations like the iMac except that you could replace the graphics card and monitor... that's good. The MacMini has those same limitations, but adds only the benefit of added your own monitor.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - (-_-)

So where is this going Cube?

Apple axed the Cube (it was deemed a failure), and will axe the Mini as well (only rumored of course) But have made three revisions to the iMac model that had been an all in one for 8 years, and laptops also have no problem with an all in one design, and these all in ones have driven Apples marketshare along with the all in one design of the iPod and future iPhone.

I am starting to forget about where this discussion originated.

gkarris

May 24, 2007, 03:13 PM

Uh...are you sure you want to commit to such an asinine thought at the advent of HDDVD and Blu-ray? And take us back to 1992 for a optional external optical drive? You're probably listening to REO speedwagon or similar right now. Hit pause and rethink your comment.

No really. There is no way they'd get rid of an optical drive with so many of us still puchasing software and movies that we need a drive for.

What?

I purchased a Thinkpad and a Tablet PC just a few years ago - without an optical drive...

There are many laptops and portable computers out there now without optical drives...

It's not like the optical drive will no longer be available. Dude, just go buy one...

Actually, I was listening to the B-52's...