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MacRumors
Jul 10, 2007, 12:45 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

MacScoop claims (http://macscoop.com/articles/2007/07/10/ultra-thin-and-ulra-light-notebook-coming-end-year-sources) that according to "trusted sources" Apple is planning on releasing "a notebook that is so small and light that it could redefine the standards of ultra-portable computing."

The upcoming Apple notebook is said to feature a 12" display, 0.6-0.7 inches thick, and weigh less than 3 pounds. MacScoop's sources are unclear if an optical drive will accompany this ultra-portable notebook, but do feel it is likely to come by year's end (2007).

For reference, Apple's current 15" MacBook Pro weighs 5.4lbs with a 1 inch thickness.

Rumors of a ultra-portable Apple laptop have been ongoing since late 2006. MacScoop reported (http://www.macrumors.com/2006/12/04/ultra-thin-12-macbook-pro/) in December 2006 about the upcoming 12" ultra-portable MacBook Pro with additional details (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/02/16/apple-sub-notebook-nearing-release/) provided by Appleinsider in February. There are some conflicting reports with one summary (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/05/11/macbook-macbook-pro-and-ultra-portable-updates/) that believed the ultra-portable would carry a 13" LED display.

Article Link (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/07/10/ultra-thin-and-ultra-light-mac-notebook-in-2007/)



epochblue
Jul 10, 2007, 12:47 PM
If all it takes is a "trusted source" to get on the front page of MacRumors, I'm going to start spreading rumors from a "trusted source" that Apple is building a rocket ship and flying me to the moon.

NtotheIzoo
Jul 10, 2007, 12:48 PM
count me in...especially since my 12" PB just died a couple of days ago!!!

Jon'sLightBulbs
Jul 10, 2007, 12:49 PM
Wait for it...



Boys, it is officially time to unload those 12 in powerbooks.

Poff
Jul 10, 2007, 12:49 PM
It will be either this or the Asus Eee (http://www.hothardware.com/Articles/Hands_on_with_the_ASUS_Eee/) for me.. (7" and 2pounds) Now that rumors has it the Eee will be as expensive as almost $500 i Europe, compared to the $200 in the USA.

Eagerly awaiting this. :)

emotion
Jul 10, 2007, 12:49 PM
I just wish Apple would get on with releasing some exciting computers again, y'know with exciting new designs etc.

As for this particular device, this is something I've been personally hankering for since I replaced my 12" powerbook with this c2d blackbook.

I know many others feel the same.

RZetlin
Jul 10, 2007, 12:50 PM
This is almost a good enough reason to wait for the a new notebook.

I really hope it's the 12" ultra portable model.

I don't like the current 13" wide screen models.

Capt Underpants
Jul 10, 2007, 12:51 PM
A true replacement for the 12" Powerbook! Looks like I may be getting a new computer by the year's end :)

emotion
Jul 10, 2007, 12:52 PM
If all it takes is a "trusted source" to get on the front page of MacRumors, I'm going to start spreading rumors from a "trusted source" that Apple is building a rocket ship and flying me to the moon.

Unless Intel have been working on some cheap way to build rockets the small form-factor laptop is still a lot more likely :).

In fact given Intel's concept for it's own laptops recently I think Apple is very likely to release a laptop like this.

Rocketman
Jul 10, 2007, 12:52 PM
I would like to see it have EDGE/5G amd wimax (early intel version). We could possibly see the clamshell variant with dispays on both sides, one of which is your virtual keyboard. The larger size will allow more fully finger shaped keys to be practical. It may be only 10" diagonal however so it is abit 3x the size of an iPhone interface.

Rocketman

arn
Jul 10, 2007, 12:54 PM
If all it takes is a "trusted source" to get on the front page of MacRumors, I'm going to start spreading rumors from a "trusted source" that Apple is building a rocket ship and flying me to the moon.

MacScoop's had its moments in the past. Their record isn't perfect, but significantly better than guy-with-blog.

arn

kainjow
Jul 10, 2007, 12:54 PM
Add in a multi-touch screen for writing... I'd buy that in a second :cool: :apple:

Thanatoast
Jul 10, 2007, 12:56 PM
i agree with the post above. think 12" iPhone. No cover, glass top, multi-touch.

Badass. :cool:

egdiroh
Jul 10, 2007, 12:57 PM
Be prepared to wait until October for this one. Otherwise 10.5 will be delayed further to get 10.4 to run this.

epochblue
Jul 10, 2007, 12:59 PM
Unless Intel have been working on some cheap way to build rockets the small form-factor laptop is still a lot more likely :).

In fact given Intel's concept for it's own laptops recently I think Apple is very likely to release a laptop like this.

I'm not trying to say that this rumor doesn't have any merit at all, just that I've read hundreds of rumors that all say "We have it on authority" or quote some kind of "insider" or "trusted source" and about 98% of them turn out to be complete crap....

....I'm just lookin' for something to complain about, really ;) I'd love if Apple announced something like this, if the truth be told.

Poff
Jul 10, 2007, 01:00 PM
i agree with the post above. think 12" iPhone. No cover, glass top, multi-touch.

Badass. :cool:

as long as you can connect it to your bluetooth keyboard and mouse when at home or in office, I'm game! :)

eddietr
Jul 10, 2007, 01:03 PM
Add in a multi-touch screen for writing... I'd buy that in a second :cool: :apple:

No way. I'll be in line ahead of you. :)

PlaceofDis
Jul 10, 2007, 01:05 PM
make it a reasonable price apple and i'll jump on it.

rosalindavenue
Jul 10, 2007, 01:07 PM
I'm a big fan of the 12" ibook form factor; so big that I can live without the performance boost of the macbook. I don't care about the widescreen either (although I guess I'm in the minority there); I have no desire to watch movies on it (other than maybe twice a year on a plane). This is the best rumor to come down the pike in a long, long time. I hope that they keep the optical drive, and that it runs really cool.

LostPacket
Jul 10, 2007, 01:08 PM
I think "trusted source" says more about the poster than the source. Gullible.

I wouldn't consider a 12" laptop "ultra protable" anyway. Nevermind a 13". a half inch thickness and a few pounds doesn't make it any easier to put in my back pack.

A full featured 10" would be cool, but I can't see Jobs going for the smaller keyboard. I'm looking for a device that I can use while on cycle tours. An iPhone would almost be functional enough to do regular blog entries and check email. A 10" ultra portable would be perfect.

mcorange
Jul 10, 2007, 01:11 PM
Think they'll outshoot the brilliant ultra-portable vaio?

hotdamn
Jul 10, 2007, 01:12 PM
Where does it say that 12" has to be 4:3 necessarily.

4:3 is a thing of the past. Apple themselves are praising their 16:10 screens.

ajhill
Jul 10, 2007, 01:13 PM
Oh, my gosh a story about one of Apple's biggest profit centers THE MAC. As a matter of fact it's the fastest growing Mac segment, Macbooks!

With all this iPhone hype we shouldn't forget that the Mac is Apple's bread and butter (for now) and that this particular segment is growing by leaps and bounds.

I bet this doesn't get half the attention that it deserves.

Here's looking forward to Apples computer market share blowing past 10% on its way to 15.

How do you like them Apples?

nagromme
Jul 10, 2007, 01:16 PM
My credit card just leapt out of my wallet like a spawning salmon.

If this is true, Apple just lost an iPhone sale :) Until I can save up again...

I'll gladly accept an external optical drive I can leave home when not needed. I just hope the GPU is better than GMA950! I want PRO features in an ultraportable, as much as possible. Not a consumer ultraportable. And I do like my gaming on the go :)

I'll also accept the smallest screen I can get: 12", 9", whatever. I can always attach a display when at home. I want TINY!

Cloudsurfer
Jul 10, 2007, 01:23 PM
It will be either this or the Asus Eee (http://www.hothardware.com/Articles/Hands_on_with_the_ASUS_Eee/) for me.. (7" and 2pounds) Now that rumors has it the Eee will be as expensive as almost $500 i Europe, compared to the $200 in the USA.

Eagerly awaiting this. :)

That big black frame makes that Asus look like one of those kids educational laptops. It's ugly.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to that new MacBook. Even though I probably won't get one, if it lacks a cd drive.

uNext
Jul 10, 2007, 01:23 PM
Blah who cares..if full sized mac notebooks have problems imagine thin ones...

Cfour
Jul 10, 2007, 01:25 PM
I'd like to see it having an external optical drive because the amount of time I use it it's harly worth luggining it around and taking up vital milimeters! :)
I hope they come up with something really innovative, well it is Apple, I don't need to hope.

macshark
Jul 10, 2007, 01:28 PM
I thought Apple already released something so small and light that it could redefine the standards of ultra-portable computing: It is called the iPhone!

:-)

Bye Bye Baby
Jul 10, 2007, 01:29 PM
I just wish Apple would get on with releasing some exciting computers again, y'know with exciting new designs etc.

As for this particular device, this is something I've been personally hankering for since I replaced my 12" powerbook with this c2d blackbook.

I know many others feel the same.


I couldn't agree more!! All this crapping on about nothing, let's get back into the computer business again!!!

Ireland
Jul 10, 2007, 01:32 PM
.6 thick? Should be nice and toasty!

Donnacha
Jul 10, 2007, 01:34 PM
... I knew this would happen as soon as I finally went ahead and ordered my MBP :mad:

Oh well, that's what ebay is for!

Personally, I want to see this thing come with the full, wonderful MBP keyboard, I don't care where they stick the speakers instead.

The GPU needs to be capable of simultaneously driving both it's own screen and an external 24" monitor, preferably even a 30".

Finally, the biggest problem with the MBP is that small but useless Express Card port that none of the 3G providers here in Europe offer a card for, only those horrible USB dongles. I want this ultra-portable to come with 3G built-in, as originally planned for Santa Rosa, so that I can simply slip in my SIM and get to work.

50548
Jul 10, 2007, 01:35 PM
I just wish Apple would get on with releasing some exciting computers again, y'know with exciting new designs etc.

As for this particular device, this is something I've been personally hankering for since I replaced my 12" powerbook with this c2d blackbook.

I know many others feel the same.

I feel the same way, and would really love to buy an ultralight note from Apple (and not minuscule 10" inch crap from the PC world, please). However, I am extremely skeptic about it...MacScoop is far from reliable, and 1000 similar rumors have already circulated before...I will believe when I see it.

shigzeo
Jul 10, 2007, 01:35 PM
yuppers. if the price is not too irrational, i may supplement my mbp with a nice small macpod. it will be released, i am sure apple have plans for this: when is another matter. i shall not start burning any bridges, but this year would be great.

as for touchscreen etc and too many features in such a small package. i am sure apple would charge robbery prices for bells and whistles if released in such a form. either way, this will be a nice change from their 'usual' which we have seen naught but in the last 4 years or so..

syklee26
Jul 10, 2007, 01:36 PM
i dont understand all these fascination about ultraportable laptops...

I once had Sony x505. It might have that wow factor and might serve as female magnet but as far as practicality goes it's not all that. you have to sacrifice so much to have notebooks that thin. Small hard drives, no graphics card, limited I/O, and no optical drives...

sure, it's about 3 lbs lighter and it's easier on your back, but really, if you are going to complain about 5lb notebook being too heavy, what you need is a dumbbell, not a notebook.

being a gadget collector is one thing, being a geek is another. if you can't handle the extra 3lbs, you really need to hit the gym.

Yankees 4 Life
Jul 10, 2007, 01:36 PM
prolly just another "throw it on the wall and hope it sticks" rumor.... Ultra portable would be nice though :)

Aniej
Jul 10, 2007, 01:39 PM
If you want to see almost exactly what you are going to get with only some slight modifications, Intel has already given you a giant hint (http://www.slashgear.com/intel-wows-with-ultra-thin-notebook-245425.php).

Compare the specifications listed by MacScoop and those set out in the intel prototype. Then look at the design and its distinctively Mac (sans the OS displayed). Watch and you will see this morph into your new ultra light, portable notebook. Below is just one of the images to whet the appetite.

princealfie
Jul 10, 2007, 01:40 PM
Make this cost $500 and I'm game for this laptop! :D

pagansoul
Jul 10, 2007, 01:40 PM
I'm waiting for an iphone without the phone. I don't need a cd drive because I rip all my video to digital as it is and use flash drives to pass files. I need a reader that I can write notes on and highlight. A place to store books and even write on. I would love a 10" screen, VT keyboard but with enough USB slots for a hookup of externals when I'm home. I want it wide open, like a standard computer. At least 2GB ram, 120 or more HD, removable battery. Sorry to say this but it is going to cost over 1k. Small computers are very expensive, not cheaper than full size.

Poff
Jul 10, 2007, 01:43 PM
That big black frame makes that Asus look like one of those kids educational laptops. It's ugly.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to that new MacBook. Even though I probably won't get one, if it lacks a cd drive.

I agree they could have placed the speakers on the Asus Eee a better place than on side of the screen, and that way cut the size of the machine somewhat. I guess that's what you get paying $200 for a full-featured laptop - some ugliness, but a lot of cool stuff aswell. Flash-disk, expandable memory, Wireless network, USB, it has pretty much everything. And it's small.

I wish Apple would release an 8-inch portable or something. Would be really cool. CD-drives are for whimps. Who uses CDs nowadays? I thought they were obsolete.. Anyway, you can just connect an external drive the few times you need one.

princealfie
Jul 10, 2007, 01:43 PM
i dont understand all these fascination about ultraportable laptops...

I once had Sony x505. It might have that wow factor and might serve as female magnet but as far as practicality goes it's not all that. you have to sacrifice so much to have notebooks that thin. Small hard drives, no graphics card, limited I/O, and no optical drives...

sure, it's about 3 lbs lighter and it's easier on your back, but really, if you are going to complain about 5lb notebook being too heavy, what you need is a dumbbell, not a notebook.

being a gadget collector is one thing, being a geek is another. if you can't handle the extra 3lbs, you really need to hit the gym.

Hmm... so I guess that you don't want the 14 hours battery life? :) Ultraportables get much better battery life than the heavy duty 19" lappies.

I'm waiting for an iphone without the phone. I don't need a cd drive because I rip all my video to digital as it is and use flash drives to pass files. I need a reader that I can write notes on and highlight. AQ place to store books and even write on. I would love a 10" screen, VT keyboard but with enough USB slots for a hookup of externals when I'm home. I want it wide open, like a standard computer. At least 2GB ram, 120 or more HD, removable battery. Sorry to say this but it is going to cost over 1k. Small computers are very expensive, not cheaper than full size.

If it ain't cheap then Asus is the way to go.

Clive At Five
Jul 10, 2007, 01:44 PM
*sigh* Not again...

Listen. Apple will first release a MBP with a 13" screen but with all the bells and whistles of an MBP. Not 12". Not 14". 13". Why? To keep their inventory simpler. They already have a 13" form-factor. Keep it simple, stupid. It will be a 13" MBP. The end.

THEN (not before) Apple will release a new MB ("mini?") that will have all the ultraportable features you want.

Why do I believe it will be this way? Because Apple knows you can't have an ultra-portable powerhouse machine. If you want a lightweight machine, you first need to cut the size of the humongous battery in half... but if you want it to last more than a half hour you'll need smaller/less powerful, more energy-efficient components. You can't run a C2D in a tiny case. It just won't work well.

Apple already knows it's possible to run a C2D in a 13" enclosure. This makes it an obvious step (to bring the MBP to a 13" screen). It'll work and it'll bring Apple part of the way to bridging the gap to an ultra-portable device.

I'll gladly accept an external optical drive I can leave home when not needed. I just hope the GPU is better than GMA950! I want PRO features in an ultraportable, as much as possible. Not a consumer ultraportable. And I do like my gaming on the go :)

I'll also accept the smallest screen I can get: 12", 9", whatever. I can always attach a display when at home. I want TINY!

*laughs*

What, you don't think they can fit a C2D into an iPod? Slap on a full-screen, use a SSD card for RAM, add Wi-Fi and there ya go. Ultra-Portable. Use it to run Photoshop, Final Cut, and Shake simultaneously. Plus, you could stack a bunch of them up and create an iPod server.

Get real.

You can't make a PRO ultra-portable. You have to sacrifice portability or power. That's always, always, ALWAYS the case.

-Clive

Gymnut
Jul 10, 2007, 01:47 PM
If you want to see almost exactly what you are going to get with only some slight modifications, Intel has already given you a giant hint (http://www.slashgear.com/intel-wows-with-ultra-thin-notebook-245425.php).

Compare the specifications listed by MacScoop and those set out in the intel prototype. Then look at the design and its distinctively Mac (sans the OS displayed). Watch and you will see this morph into your new ultra light, portable notebook. Below is just one of the images to whet the appetite.

Looks pretty nice although I wonder if it has an optical drive. The article does mention that Intel and Ziba admits the cost of production version would be "painfully" high, so I wonder how if Apple were to produce one, where it would fall in their lineup. I have to wonder though, whether that magnetically-attached portfolio sheath is the major reason why it would be so expensive to produce.

iMichael72
Jul 10, 2007, 01:48 PM
might serve as female magnet.

That's all I needed to hear!

Just kidding.

I would love to get this though, depending on the price.

plumbingandtech
Jul 10, 2007, 01:48 PM
If you want to see almost exactly what you are going to get with only some slight modifications, Intel has already given you a giant hint (http://www.slashgear.com/intel-wows-with-ultra-thin-notebook-245425.php).

Compare the specifications listed by MacScoop and those set out in the intel prototype. Then look at the design and its distinctively Mac (sans the OS displayed). Watch and you will see this morph into your new ultra light, portable notebook. Below is just one of the images to whet the appetite.

regarding the pic of the "green" cover showing a screen in back of the main screen...

make that small one "multi-touch" and let a person access their email, events etc.. and that would be a killer feature.

nagromme
Jul 10, 2007, 01:50 PM
Get real.

You can't make a PRO ultra-portable. You have to sacrifice portability or power. That's always, always, ALWAYS the case.

No it isn't. You have to sacrifice power. You do NOT have to sacrifice too much for pros unless you define "pro" to make that the case.

Intel has great mobile processors, much faster than many pros were using a year ago for Photoshop and the like. That leaves only connectivity and 3D. Connectivity can be done with a dock if needed, and Intel has much better integrated GPUs than the GMA950 now.

Aniej
Jul 10, 2007, 01:53 PM
Looks pretty nice although I wonder if it has an optical drive. The article does mention that Intel and Ziba admits the cost of production version would be "painfully" high, so I wonder how if Apple were to produce one, where it would fall in their lineup. I have to wonder though, whether that magnetically-attached portfolio sheath is the major reason why it would be so expensive to produce.

Well said, I think the three things that would be removed from the devise would be the leather, the magnetic sheath, and the exterior screen. I am not completely sure on the external screen, as crazy things have happened in the past, but while I know people will list all their reasons after I post this, having an external screen to me seems pretty useless most of the time. It also exposes the device to many more situations where it can be damaged. Efficiency arguments of the external screen don't really move me as most people who would need to check info that could be displayed on a screen like that are able to do so with a blackberry or iPhone and have the added benefit of being able to interact with those two devices.

plumbingandtech, I hadn't thought of multitouch, which adds an interesting side to the debate, but I would still err on the side of what I wrote above regarding damage, unless apple puts in a glass cover like the iphone. Regarding the rest, I would still tend to lean towards no external window, but who knows.

jakebot
Jul 10, 2007, 01:56 PM
it definitely shows how longs it been since apple has released new hardware (computer-wise) as the same rumors just keep coming over and over and over.

we really need something new. lol

Dagless
Jul 10, 2007, 01:58 PM
God I hope so. I'm not into MacBooks (keyboards) or larger MacBook Pro's. Give me a 12" display and I'm there! I hope it's true and these "sources" really are reliable.

Poff
Jul 10, 2007, 01:58 PM
it definitely shows how longs it been since apple has released new hardware (computer-wise) as the same rumors just keep coming over and over and over.

we really need something new. lol

rumors of products actually coming tend to come over and over until the product is released, while rumors people made up come once or twice and never again. At least that's my experience, and the reason this rumor exites me. :) Just hope it will be without optical drive, and with flash-drive instead of harddisk. :) (I'm really hoping for 11" widescreen aswell, not 12", as 11" would give us a computer approximately as wide as the 12" powerbook - which seems a lot smaller than the current Macbook.)

sigamy
Jul 10, 2007, 01:59 PM
I can't wait to see this. I'm sure Apple has learned a ton by doing the iPhone. For me the iPhone is much more of a handheld Mac than a phone. I'm still amazed by it.

It will be great to see what they do in the ultra portable laptop space. Skip the optical drive, put some microdrives and/or flash memory in and you are ready to go.

buffalo
Jul 10, 2007, 02:04 PM
If true, who sees this being released with the new iMac? Both of these updates seem to significant to just pop up on Apple.com, so it seems like an event could be dual purpose.

Anyone agree??? Of course the "if true" is assuming a very large "if."

iSee
Jul 10, 2007, 02:04 PM
This would be very, very nice (if true).

Already people have generated unreasonable expectations for this, though.
$500?!? "Pro" class?!? SIM cards?!? Not gonna happen...

ErikCLDR
Jul 10, 2007, 02:05 PM
I am happy to see that apple is actually working on new redesigns their computers instead of focusing mainly on iPods, iPhones, and :apple:TV's.

Poff
Jul 10, 2007, 02:07 PM
If true, who sees this being released with the new iMac? Both of these updates seem to significant to just pop up on Apple.com, so it seems like an event could be dual purpose.

Anyone agree??? Of course the "if true" is assuming a very large "if."

I'm guessing we'll have to wait till a later event.

My .02

yadmonkey
Jul 10, 2007, 02:09 PM
I'd really rather have a 13.3" MBP, but something tells me this will be off the charts desirable.

briansolomon
Jul 10, 2007, 02:09 PM
I would be all over this... Bring it on!

MrCrowbar
Jul 10, 2007, 02:11 PM
If you want to see almost exactly what you are going to get with only some slight modifications, Intel has already given you a giant hint (http://www.slashgear.com/intel-wows-with-ultra-thin-notebook-245425.php).

Compare the specifications listed by MacScoop and those set out in the intel prototype. Then look at the design and its distinctively Mac (sans the OS displayed). Watch and you will see this morph into your new ultra light, portable notebook. Below is just one of the images to whet the appetite.

It really does look like a mac. The hinge construction, the integrated ports, material... hmmm maybe.

EDIT: I mean this one here:
http://att.macrumors.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=79094&stc=1&thumb=1&d=1184092752

Clive At Five
Jul 10, 2007, 02:13 PM
No it isn't. You have to sacrifice power. You do NOT have to sacrifice too much for pros unless you define "pro" to make that the case.

Intel has great mobile processors, much faster than many pros were using a year ago for Photoshop and the like. That leaves only connectivity and 3D. Connectivity can be done with a dock if needed, and Intel has much better integrated GPUs than the GMA950 now.

Well, yes, technically you're correct. Mobile technology tends to be a year behind the latest tech... but you're basically saying that last year's pros will be satisfied using today's mobile technology. This, I feel, would not be the general consensus among pros. The workload of a pro increases with their work capabilities. They can photoshop more photos per hour. They can render more scenes quicker. Etc. They're not going to say, "Oh, all I ever wanted was to render scenes at 2GHz and now that I can, I'm perfectly content. I'll never need a new computer again."

The computing needs of pros and gamers increase with what is available. You won't be able to convince me otherwise.

-Clive

Shinjinho
Jul 10, 2007, 02:13 PM
This ultra-portable obviously will be 16:10 (4:3 is a dead format) 12 or 13". I hope 12".
I think the MacBookPro name will not be used, because it won't be powerful as a MacBook 13"... They probably will use low voltage processors, like the L7300 or L7500 (1.4 or 1.6 GHz Core 2 Duo with 4MB and 15W TDP), the GMAx3100 graphics, a 1.8" or FLASH based harddisk, and no optical drive.
3G connectivity is not a must, there are many phones that can be used as a bluetooth modem without any usb or pc-card adapter.
I think it will be a great (but expensive) machine. Nothing under 1500$ for sure.

Lyle
Jul 10, 2007, 02:15 PM
I don't understand all this fascination with ultraportable laptops...It hasn't quite clicked with me, either. From my perspective, it's just a watered down notebook that I'm still going to have to lug around in a laptop bag of some sort. With a PDA (or an iPhone) I can put in my pocket, there's a whole other degree of "portability" that I can appreciate and for which I'm willing to sacrifice some functionality.

Having said that, I know that there are a lot of people interested in these things, so they must have something going for them.

buffalo
Jul 10, 2007, 02:16 PM
I'm guessing we'll have to wait till a later event.

My .02

Another possibility is to announce it in conjunction with the iMac, but not ship until later in the year. Apple has been announcing before shipping lately (MacBook Pro, :apple:TV, iPhone).

sikkinixx
Jul 10, 2007, 02:16 PM
well if that comes out my new MBP will be sold faster than I can blink :D

kutzcd
Jul 10, 2007, 02:17 PM
Apple's smallest portable just came out - the iPhone. Why would they create a 10" ultraportable? I haven't seen a single one used out in public. Ultraportables are a great idea and so is the tablet pc, but neither are practical, thus, no large scale markets. No markets, no dinero. I truly believe the iPhone is Apple's entry in both the cell phone, pda, and ultraportable markets. Look at all the rumors that lead up to the iPhone release. Nearly every filing is a feature that you now see in the iPhone.

Plus, what peripherals would be available for such a device. Are all the plugs and cord inputs that small - not everything is usb, ya know. Also, you would have to plug everything in just to use it - external drives, keyboards, monitors - who needs the hassle.

I think they are going to take what they learned from the iPhone and AppleTV and build on compatibility and consistency with those items.

Fairly
Jul 10, 2007, 02:22 PM
Hey why not make a slab as big as a laptop today (15" or whatever) but give it the iPhone interface?

Poff
Jul 10, 2007, 02:25 PM
Apple's smallest portable just came out - the iPhone.

The iPhone still lacks stuff, like word-editing, for instance. A UMPC would have standard OS X, which I would need. (for instance for running Coda or Pixelmator)

iSee
Jul 10, 2007, 02:31 PM
...Why would they create a 10" ultraportable? I haven't seen a single one used out in public. Ultraportables are a great idea and so is the tablet pc, but neither are practical, thus, no large scale markets. No markets, no dinero...

That's a really good point that is often ignored:

As neat-o-keen as they are, no one actually wants to buy an ultra-portable.

Clive At Five
Jul 10, 2007, 02:36 PM
Hey why not make a slab as big as a laptop today (15" or whatever) but give it the iPhone interface?

What would the point of that be? If you could only use web apps, how would you access word documents? How would you game? How would you do all those things that laptops can do that the iPhone can't?

If you're going to carry around a 15" slab, carry one that'll do most everything you want it to.

-Clive

Roba
Jul 10, 2007, 02:37 PM
Based on what has been speculated in terms of the size and weight i doubt that this ultraportable would be high powered enough for me. I have ordered a Dell 1330 but if Apple was to bring out an ultraportable with a dedicated GPU i would consider selling my laptop.
It seems like quite a lot of people want a fairly high powered ultraportable with a dedicated GPU but based on these specs i doubt that this ultraportable will be it.

Porchland
Jul 10, 2007, 02:38 PM
i agree with the post above. think 12" iPhone. No cover, glass top, multi-touch.

Badass. :cool:

Hey why not make a slab as big as a laptop today (15" or whatever) but give it the iPhone interface?

That sounds suspiciously like a tablet.:D

DaBrain
Jul 10, 2007, 02:38 PM
Make this cost $500 and I'm game for this laptop! :D

In Your Dreams!:rolleyes:

Digital Skunk
Jul 10, 2007, 02:39 PM
Apple's smallest portable just came out - the iPhone. Why would they create a 10" ultraportable? I haven't seen a single one used out in public. Ultraportables are a great idea and so is the tablet pc, but neither are practical, thus, no large scale markets. No markets, no dinero. I truly believe the iPhone is Apple's entry in both the cell phone, pda, and ultraportable markets. Look at all the rumors that lead up to the iPhone release. Nearly every filing is a feature that you now see in the iPhone.

Plus, what peripherals would be available for such a device. Are all the plugs and cord inputs that small - not everything is usb, ya know. Also, you would have to plug everything in just to use it - external drives, keyboards, monitors - who needs the hassle.

I think they are going to take what they learned from the iPhone and AppleTV and build on compatibility and consistency with those items.

I agree with you but the iPhone sucks as a smartphone, and smartphones are as close as you can get to an UMPC. So the iPhone will never be a Mac Ultra portable. No word editing, no apps, no real software in general not to mention no flash, java on the safari and you have to buy a contract to use it... NO WAY YUCK! That is not how a real computer workds

That's a really good point that is often ignored:

As neat-o-keen as they are, no one actually wants to buy an ultra-portable.

Yeah... but there are plenty of people in the real world that don't use a lot of the stuff that Apple and other companies make. The iPhone may be in the hands of half a million people but in a country with 300 million people that is a very small number, and there are a lot of people who think the iPhone is useless and want an UMPC from Apple instead... like the millions of 12" PowerBook users that don't want a fat MacBook that is heavier and larger. They want a true ultra portable Mac. Niche markets can make Apple money if they do it right. Users of $600 phones are a niche market and look where it's going for Apple.

Based on what has been speculated in terms of the size and weight i doubt that this ultraportable would be high powered enough for me. I have ordered a Dell 1330 but if Apple was to bring out an ultraportable with a dedicated GPU i would consider selling my laptop.
It seems like quite a lot of people want a fairly high powered ultraportable with a dedicated GPU but based on these specs i doubt that this ultraportable will be it.

The 1330 isn't it either... it's the first Dell with a real design to it but it is no where near an ultra-portable. I do like that you can outfit it with a SSD though.

As for the ultra-portable Mac.... let's look at some crappy mock-ups and pick and fight about which one makes the most sense :)

Spades
Jul 10, 2007, 02:40 PM
The iPhone doesn't work. A 2 year contract and not being allowed to install third party apps make it unacceptable as an ultra-portable computer. As many other people have said, if only I could get the iPhone without the phone...

I hope to hear more about this by August. I'm planning on buying an Asus Eee (nobody buys ultraportables, eh?), but would love to go with an Apple ultraportable instead. If there's some reliable confirmation that an ultraportable is inevitable, I can wait.

Cheffy Dave
Jul 10, 2007, 02:42 PM
I thought Apple already released something so small and light that it could redefine the standards of ultra-portable computing: It is called the iPhone!

:-)

EGG-SACK-LEE!:apple:Rocks

Black Belt
Jul 10, 2007, 02:44 PM
No one uses Ultra Portables? Says who! I'd love an Ultra 10" instead of lugging around a full laptop. I would just like more power than the Sonys have, and Sony is really slow on keeping that line upgraded with better chips.

killerrobot
Jul 10, 2007, 02:46 PM
How does knocking off 3 lbs. and .4" make this thing really that revolutionary?
I thought the iPhone was suppose to be the revolution...no wait, the iPod ... no wait the mouse....
When Apple (or someone claiming that Apple) claims everything to be revolutionary and the future, it kind of looses its effect.

Clive At Five
Jul 10, 2007, 02:46 PM
That's a really good point that is often ignored:

As neat-o-keen as they are, no one actually wants to buy an ultra-portable.

Agreed, it is often an overlooked point. Still one has to consider...

I wouldn't have bought an MP3 player before the iPod, I was never moved to buy a game console before the Wii, and I never lusted after a PDA/smart phone before the iPhone. Sometimes a market direction has to be established or reestablished before a successful market exists.

I think Apple *could* do this with a tablet (especially now with a killer touch interface) but I am skeptical about an ultra-portable laptop. Seems a little too clunky for Apple to take part in.

-Clive

plumbingandtech
Jul 10, 2007, 02:52 PM
Agreed, it is often an overlooked point. Still one has to consider...

I wouldn't have bought an MP3 player before the iPod, I was never moved to buy a game console before the Wii, and I never lusted after a PDA/smart phone before the iPhone. Sometimes a market direction has to be established or reestablished before a successful market exists.

I think Apple *could* do this with a tablet (especially now with a killer touch interface) but I am skeptical about an ultra-portable laptop. Seems a little too clunky for Apple to take part in.

-Clive

I'd cream my pants if apple put multi-touch in this thing.

oh wait. too much information huh?

RZetlin
Jul 10, 2007, 02:54 PM
If Apple does go for the ultra they might go with a 32 GB flash drive to make it thin.

My ultimate hope is Apple will produce a tablet ultra-thin notbook.

Kwill
Jul 10, 2007, 02:55 PM
said to feature a 12" display, 0.6-0.7 inches thick, and weigh less than 3 pounds.

Personally, I would rather have an Apple notebook computer that withstands damage (like the Toughbooks) than follow the obsession for smaller and flimsier designs. :eek::p:cool:

leekohler
Jul 10, 2007, 02:58 PM
Personally, I would rather have an Apple notebook computer that withstands damage (like the Toughbooks) than follow the obsession for smaller and flimsier designs. :eek::p:cool:

Ditto- A durable pro laptop has been missing for far too long. Please Apple! Give us one!

oscuh
Jul 10, 2007, 03:00 PM
How does knocking off 3 lbs. and .4" make this thing really that revolutionary?
I thought the iPhone was suppose to be the revolution...no wait, the iPod ... no wait the mouse....
When Apple (or someone claiming that Apple) claims everything to be revolutionary and the future, it kind of loses its effect.


When everything you do is revolutionary, it looks like some people become complacent with it ... :rolleyes:

How can 3 lbs and almost a half-inch NOT be something worth talking about? You're talking about something HALF the thickness of a MB and less than half the weight. All with OSX and all the bells and whistles that come with a Mac.

And all those products you mentioned WERE revolutionary.

from dictionary.com:

rev·o·lu·tion·ar·y [rev-uh-loo-shuh-ner-ee] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation adjective, noun, plural -ar·ies.
–adjective
1. of, pertaining to, characterized by, or of the nature of a revolution, or a sudden, complete, or marked change: a revolutionary junta.
2. radically new or innovative; outside or beyond established procedure, principles, etc.: a revolutionary discovery.

iPod/iPhone ... revolutionary? I think so ...

dernhelm
Jul 10, 2007, 03:03 PM
Geez - another rumor about the Mac? I'm getting bored with this. Lets see more articles on the iPhone or something...

:D

oscuh
Jul 10, 2007, 03:04 PM
That's a really good point that is often ignored:

As neat-o-keen as they are, no one actually wants to buy an ultra-portable.

No One? I think you underestimate the market. If no one bought UPs, then why do so many of them get built and sold every year?

I for one would buy one in a heartbeat. As long as I could hook it up to a larger monitor for home use, I'll break out the checkbook.

rdowns
Jul 10, 2007, 03:06 PM
make it a reasonable price apple and i'll jump on it.

Surely you jest. This is Apple, of the $600 cell phone, Apple. :D

Donnacha
Jul 10, 2007, 03:06 PM
As long as I could hook it up to a larger monitor for home use, I'll break out the checkbook.
Agreed, that's essential.

That and built-in 3G or WiMax.

Vidd
Jul 10, 2007, 03:08 PM
I'm wondering where Apple will go with this.
Is it going to be a "pro-sumer" laptop or one simply for the basics on the go?

oscuh
Jul 10, 2007, 03:10 PM
I'm wondering where Apple will go with this.
Is it going to be a "pro-sumer" laptop or one simply for the basics on the go?

I'd expect two variants. Apple does a good job of coming up with a spectrum of offerings within each product line to appeal to as many buyers as possible, but without making it overly complex (hello, Dell?!)

Antares
Jul 10, 2007, 03:12 PM
That's a really good point that is often ignored:

As neat-o-keen as they are, no one actually wants to buy an ultra-portable.

I would. I have my main computer to work with daily. An ultra-portible Mac would be perfect to take on the plane and watch movies, do some word processor/Excel stuff, e-mail and be able to completely use the web. Any Photoshop, design, dvd burning, heavy processing work, gaming, etc. would be done on my main computer at home. I don't need the overkill of the Macbook Pro (I would, though, if it was my main computer like my old Pismo Powerbook once was). I just need something to take on trips (work or otherwise) to do some very light duty tasks. An ultra-portable Mac would be perfect for my "travel needs."

BornAgainMac
Jul 10, 2007, 03:25 PM
Possible Specs:

2.0 Ghz Intel Core 2 Duo
32 GB Flash Hard Drive
Multi-touch 12 Inch Display
2 USB
1 Firewire (?)
Bluetooth
802.11n
Optical DVD-RW Drive?
Integrated Graphics
$1,799

oscuh
Jul 10, 2007, 03:27 PM
Possible Specs:

2.0 Ghz Intel Core 2 Duo
32 GB Flash Hard Drive
Multi-touch 12 Inch Display
2 USB
1 Firewire (?)
Bluetooth
802.11n
Optical DVD-RW Drive?
Integrated Graphics
$1,799

I think you're close. I'd have a feeling that the trackpad would be "multi-touch," not the whole screen. *starts saving pennies*

Vidd
Jul 10, 2007, 03:32 PM
I'd expect two variants. Apple does a good job of coming up with a spectrum of offerings within each product line to appeal to as many buyers as possible, but without making it overly complex (hello, Dell?!)

As cool as that would be, I really doubt it. At least not too soon; it'll have to be one or the other for a good while.

Marx55
Jul 10, 2007, 03:36 PM
YES, YES, YES.

Apple ultra-portable.

Please!

NewSc2
Jul 10, 2007, 03:37 PM
Possible Specs:

2.0 Ghz Intel Core 2 Duo
32 GB Flash Hard Drive
Multi-touch 12 Inch Display
2 USB
1 Firewire (?)
Bluetooth
802.11n
Optical DVD-RW Drive?
Integrated Graphics
$1,799

bahahahahahahahaha. omg. $1799? DVD-RW? Multi-Touch?

If all those were there, it'd cost $2499, easily, and up.

deadkenny
Jul 10, 2007, 03:37 PM
More than that the 12" device will have a octo-core G5 trusted sources say.

joelmejiaganan
Jul 10, 2007, 03:37 PM
...but with enough USB slots for a hookup of externals when I'm home....

NO!!! All we need is 1 USB, Power, Maybe FW, Audio In/Out and Video Out. On the go you'll only need one of each. Now, when we're at home all we'll need is a DOCK with all those ports, so we only need to hook the thing and start using all the peripherials.

We coul'd even hook it up to our main mac at home to sync all the info and to use it as a multitouch input device for it. THAT would be very nice.

Shinjinho
Jul 10, 2007, 03:37 PM
Possible Specs:

2.0 Ghz Intel Core 2 Duo
32 GB Flash Hard Drive
Multi-touch 12 Inch Display
2 USB
1 Firewire (?)
Bluetooth
802.11n
Optical DVD-RW Drive?
Integrated Graphics
$1,799

32GB is too little... I think they will use a 1.8" 80GB harddrive at least. And a 1.6GHz Core 2 Duo LV. The 34W Core 2 Duo is too hot for an ultra-portable.
No multitouch I think.

oscuh
Jul 10, 2007, 03:38 PM
As cool as that would be, I really doubt it. At least not too soon; it'll have to be one or the other for a good while.

I guess what i meant was you'll have processor options, HDD options, etc. That way if you need more horsepower, you can get it, if you don't, they you don't :) I can't see them delivering ONE package and saying "this is it!"

nels0360
Jul 10, 2007, 03:39 PM
In order to maintain that form factor, they will probably have to go with something along the lines of an Ultra Low Voltage processor. I just think that anything else would produce too much heat.

Also, I hope it has something faster than a 1.8" 4200 RPM hard drive. Those things are incredibly slow.

yadmonkey
Jul 10, 2007, 03:39 PM
I have a theory: Mac users spend way too much time sitting at a desk, to the point where their arms have become very weak. That must be the market for an ultra-portable.

Otherwise, I don't get it. I'd much rather have a fully-functional 12" or 13.3" MBP with real designated video and an optical drive and the works. If they can make it smaller and lighter, then great, as long as they're not giving up battery life, power, functionality, etc.

But is it really so difficult to lug around a computer which is an inch thick and weighs a few pounds? Would a half-inch, half-functional computer be that much better?

impierced
Jul 10, 2007, 03:40 PM
That's a really good point that is often ignored:

As neat-o-keen as they are, no one actually wants to buy an ultra-portable.

Perhaps that's true of the majority, but I can say I'd order half a dozen the day they were announced for myself and staff.

I'd pay $2500 apiece for an ultra-portable with a docking station from Apple and not bat an eye.

Hell, I'm still purchasing 12" refurbished PowerBooks when I can.

regan
Jul 10, 2007, 03:43 PM
The question is...will this ultra slim laptop be the new macbook?

Or will it be a separate entity altogether? Thus keeping the current macbook and macbook pro line up unchanged.

Or who thinks that these "ultra" portables WILL become the new macbooks? And that the current 13" size screen will move to the macbook pro lineup?

I think on the one hand the average consumer WANTS portable. Because would a 12" screen and no optical drive really be useful for a pro? I think pro mac users need a smaller option like the 13" macbook, so maybe this will be true.

But then the question becomes, do ALL the average consumers want to sacrifice the optical drive and larger screen?

Thats why I believe Apple will release this as a separate entity like a "macbook lite"...perhaps call it a macbook mini.

It might actually sell for MORE than the macbook due to its size.

What are all your thoughts on how an ultra portable will fit in the current line up of Mac portables?

I personally like the 13" size screen of the current macbook...BUT I don't want integrated graphics chip. Because I like to work on projects on the road. So an ultra portable which would be good for your basic emailer and websurfer would not do for me with its too small screen and no optical drive. And since I don't want a larger laptop like the 15" or ugh 17" macbook pro...I'd be stuck with a macbook.

Don't get me wrong. I love the macbooks style. I am just going to wait till September to see if apple gives the macbooks santa rosa with a dedicated graphics chip like the pros.

deadkenny
Jul 10, 2007, 03:45 PM
I'd instantly sacrifice my optical drive for more battery power and I'd like something sexier than the current MacBook. Just as well I would go for a 1.3 or 1.6 ULV instead of the >= 2.0 Core2Duo. More than enough power for my casual tasks. If you are used to a 12" system than larger ones are not so appealing. So I would be the first one to buy this thing. But honestly and sadly I think the ultra portable falls into the same category as the G5 Powerbook.

dongmin
Jul 10, 2007, 03:45 PM
Possible Specs:

2.0 Ghz Intel Core 2 Duo
32 GB Flash Hard Drive
Multi-touch 12 Inch Display
2 USB
1 Firewire (?)
Bluetooth
802.11n
Optical DVD-RW Drive?
Integrated Graphics
$1,799

It'll be Penryn for sure. The current C2Ds run too hot, so you'd have to go with a ULV part. But why not just wait for Penryn which promises major gains in power management?

A Pittarelli
Jul 10, 2007, 03:45 PM
super iphone?

Jesus
Jul 10, 2007, 03:47 PM
If you want to see almost exactly what you are going to get with only some slight modifications, Intel has already given you a giant hint (http://www.slashgear.com/intel-wows-with-ultra-thin-notebook-245425.php).

Compare the specifications listed by MacScoop and those set out in the intel prototype. Then look at the design and its distinctively Mac (sans the OS displayed). Watch and you will see this morph into your new ultra light, portable notebook. Below is just one of the images to whet the appetite.

look at this image:

http://www.slashgear.com/gallery/data_files/7/4/Intel_Mobile_Metro_Notebook_4.JPG


That bezel looks uncannily like that of the iPhone. A clue me thinks.

iSee
Jul 10, 2007, 03:54 PM
Perhaps that's true of the majority, but I can say I'd order half a dozen the day they were announced for myself and staff.

I'd pay $2000 apiece for an ultra-portable with a docking station from Apple and not bat an eye.

Hell, I'm still purchasing 12" refurbished PowerBooks when I can.

No One? I think you underestimate the market. If no one bought UPs, then why do so many of them get built and sold every year?

I for one would buy one in a heartbeat. As long as I could hook it up to a larger monitor for home use, I'll break out the checkbook.

Well, ok, "no one" is an exaggeration. But the market seems very small compared to the conventional notebook market. Laptops are everywhere and are useful for all kinds of things. Ultra-portables are rare and pack so many compromises they are hard to justify.

Right now, we can imagine that this Apple ultra-portable is everything we want in a UP, with no fatal flaws. So what if each of us is imagining a difference computers? :D
But if it comes out, it will doubtless have numerous compromises each one of which excludes a portion of the interested market, until hardly anything remains.

Well, maybe Apple will come out with a "low-compromise" ultra-portable, but it is going to be really tough.

Aniej
Jul 10, 2007, 03:58 PM
look at this image (http://www.slashgear.com/gallery/data_files/7/4/Intel_Mobile_Metro_Notebook_4.JPG)

That bezel looks uncannily like that of the iPhone. A clue me thinks.

I could ask for no better support to my point than Jesus quoting and referencing my post.

To save you time, here are the multiple images (http://www.slashgear.com/intel-wows-with-ultra-thin-notebook-245425.php) we are referencing.

Spades
Jul 10, 2007, 04:21 PM
Maybe part of the reason people don't see the point of an ultra-portable is because they're thinking of it the wrong way. I think one key to ultra-portables is that they should not do everything. You have a desktop for the heavy work, and then an ultra-portable for travel. If you need to do heavy work on the road, you go back to your desktop...

...from your notebook.

Consider two of the features coming in Leopard; screen sharing and Back To My Mac. If you had easy access to your desktop while on the road, how much power does your laptop need? Not much. If you run into anything the laptop isn't good enough for, your desktop is just a few mouse clicks away. That's how I use my laptop now, using SSH and VNC.

Jesus
Jul 10, 2007, 04:22 PM
I could ask for no better support to my point than Jesus quoting and referencing my post.

To save you time, here are the multiple images (http://www.slashgear.com/intel-wows-with-ultra-thin-notebook-245425.php) we are referencing.

I am in much demand. I'm off now to appear in a tortilla.

safXmal
Jul 10, 2007, 04:26 PM
I'd like a tablet with a screen size between 8'' and 11''. It doesn't have to be more power than a macbook. If it is powerful enough to run the iLive and iWork suites that would be more than sufficient.

What if iLive is so late in development because they are converting the programs to be used on this tablet - all functions touch screen driven and no more menu's.

A touch screen tablet with the UI of the iPhone extended in both the iLive and iwork suites. Now wouldn't that be sweet!

yadmonkey
Jul 10, 2007, 04:27 PM
I am in much demand. I'm off now to appear in a tortilla.

LOL!! Say hi to Elvis next time you find yourself in a bag of potato chips.

FleurDuMal
Jul 10, 2007, 04:27 PM
Isn't the iPhone ultra-thin and ultra-portable enough? :confused:

Antares
Jul 10, 2007, 04:30 PM
More than that the 12" device will have a octo-core G5 trusted sources say.

You have to be kidding. One, the G5 is a PowerPC. Two...Octocore? Before any of the desktops? Three, how much heat would something like that put out? No way. Not for many years. Either you're kidding or your so-called "trusted sources" cannot be trusted....

plumbingandtech
Jul 10, 2007, 04:32 PM
Isn't the iPhone ultra-thin and ultra-portable enough? :confused:

Does it run photoshop or a web editor?

WilliamLondon
Jul 10, 2007, 04:35 PM
i dont understand all these fascination about ultraportable laptops...

Small hard drives, no graphics card, limited I/O, and no optical drives...

being a gadget collector is one thing, being a geek is another. if you can't handle the extra 3lbs, you really need to hit the gym.

I for one am someone that does go to the gym and yet I still yearn for an ultraportable - you'd be hard pressed to call me a wimp.

My best mate has one of the Sony VIAOs and it is brilliant (I picked it out for him) - he loves it and I am hugely jealous of it. It's not just the weight (and sending people to the gym is missing the point I think) but more it's the size - especially when traveling.

Don't need an optical drive; it's an ultraportable why do you need a graphics card; small hard drive - it's all relative.<grin>

This isn't a computer that is your only computer - it is an ultraportable and for me would be just that, ultra-portable.

Clive At Five
Jul 10, 2007, 04:38 PM
32GB is too little... I think they will use a 1.8" 80GB harddrive at least. And a 1.6GHz Core 2 Duo LV. The 34W Core 2 Duo is too hot for an ultra-portable.
No multitouch I think.

No no no. You can't run an OS off a 1.8" HDD. They die too easily. You must either use a 2.5" or SSD. I think 32GB is plenty for a portable SUPPLIMENT to your desktop (or even your full-time laptop). That's what you get an ultra-portable for: suppliment. Not replacement. I think people don't get this. An ultra-portable shouldn't be an entire solution. Why don't you people get it?!

Stop trying to have your cake and eat it too! You can't run photoshop, final cut and WoW on an ultra-portable. NOW GET OVER IT!

I *could* fathom a portable that, like the iPhone, would run one major application at a time. Whenever Photoshop is up, that's all you get. Single-tasking only. That way, you could survive on a Core Solo or some other lightweight processor. Meanwhile, have an ARM in there for iTunes playback in the background... ;) rock out while you Photoshop. That's the way, uh-huh, I like it.

-Clive

emotion
Jul 10, 2007, 04:43 PM
If you want to see almost exactly what you are going to get with only some slight modifications, Intel has already given you a giant hint (http://www.slashgear.com/intel-wows-with-ultra-thin-notebook-245425.php).

Compare the specifications listed by MacScoop and those set out in the intel prototype. Then look at the design and its distinctively Mac (sans the OS displayed). Watch and you will see this morph into your new ultra light, portable notebook. Below is just one of the images to whet the appetite.

That's exactly what I was aluding to in my post. If Apple could bring that out I'd be happy.

danielwsmithee
Jul 10, 2007, 04:46 PM
No no no. You can't run an OS off a 1.8" HDD. I find everything about this thread extremely odd. There is nothing revolutionary about any of the specifications here. My employer bought me a Dell D420 with the exact specs this thread is mentioning. 12" screen, 1.8" hard-drive, 2.7 lbs, 1.2 GHz Core Duo etc. The thing is extremely light especially when you compare it to my 13" MacBook. Too bad it is ugly and runs Windows :mad:.

As far as performance is concerned my biggest complaint is the slow 4200 rpm 1.8" HD. I think if you added 4-8GB of solid state memory for the OS and most used apps it would improve performance quite a bit.

Rocketman
Jul 10, 2007, 04:51 PM
Apple's smallest portable just came out - the iPhone. Why would they create a 10" ultraportable?

Plus, what peripherals would be available for such a device. Are all the plugs and cord inputs that small - not everything is usb, ya know. Also, you would have to plug everything in just to use it - external drives, keyboards, monitors - who needs the hassle.

I think they are going to take what they learned from the iPhone and AppleTV and build on compatibility and consistency with those items.

Agreed. I clipped the parts I disagreed with. The external device interface will be a dock and/or 802.11n wifi. AppleTV uses wifi interfaces to hard drives and monitors for moderately high bandwidth. That could be the interface to either a printer or to a printer on an ethernet network or a USB hub as well.

Soon each peripheral will be addressed via IP address over the internet anyway and the whole physical connection paradigm will die.

Rocketman

Aniej
Jul 10, 2007, 04:57 PM
I'd like a tablet with a screen size between 8'' and 11''. It doesn't have to be more power than a macbook. If it is powerful enough to run the iLive and iWork suites that would be more than sufficient.

What if iLive is so late in development because they are converting the programs to be used on this tablet - all functions touch screen driven and no more menu's.

A touch screen tablet with the UI of the iPhone extended in both the iLive and iwork suites. Now wouldn't that be sweet!

Never going to happen as long as Steve Jobs runs Apple.

Bellow is a brief excerpt explaining why, you can read his entire article here (http://technology.guardian.co.uk/weekly/story/0,,1981815,00.html). By the way, since someone is bound to just wave what this article say away as just some guy pontificating, he is the former head of apple's federal government division, you know the group that supplies all our scientists and researchers.

First, he said, the wireless bandwidth for huge images, plus the security needed to successfully do what NIH wanted, was just not on the horizon. (Apple staff had been notably fuzzy earlier in the briefing about wireless standards after 802.11b.) Plus, tablets' screen resolution was nowhere near that required for NIH's high-quality medical images. Finally, any product designed to work in the medical field would attract significant liability. The hint was that Apple wasn't interested in anything with that kind of potential liability. That pretty well shut down the issue.

bdkennedy1
Jul 10, 2007, 05:01 PM
By "redefine", I'm guessing this means it will not come with a physical keyboard, but a touch-screen one.

Clive At Five
Jul 10, 2007, 05:01 PM
Maybe part of the reason people don't see the point of an ultra-portable is because they're thinking of it the wrong way. I think one key to ultra-portables is that they should not do everything. You have a desktop for the heavy work, and then an ultra-portable for travel. If you need to do heavy work on the road, you go back to your desktop...

...from your notebook.

Consider two of the features coming in Leopard; screen sharing and Back To My Mac. If you had easy access to your desktop while on the road, how much power does your laptop need? Not much. If you run into anything the laptop isn't good enough for, your desktop is just a few mouse clicks away. That's how I use my laptop now, using SSH and VNC.

Exactly what I've been saying. Also, spot on about the "Back to My Mac" feature. I wrote about this in my iMac prediction (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=3896175#post3896175) post (the part about "Option B"). The only con is that you would require a high-speed internet connection, which isn't always available... especially on those long trips you speak of.

-Clive

joelmejiaganan
Jul 10, 2007, 05:04 PM
Another rumor tells that Apple is about to release a new sleeker keyboard. Maybe this new keyboard and an ultraportable/multitouch laptop is this new keyboard !!!!

The keyboard can be just a 12" widescreen screen with a dock. When docked, this multitouch screen will display a full keyboard to use with your main mac. It can have a proximity sensor like the iPhone to save power. It can serve as an multitouch input for your leopard Mac.

We can only dream until Apple make this true.

r4m3n
Jul 10, 2007, 05:06 PM
this is great news. finally, a true successor to the Powerbook 12". if apple prices this thing just right, i can finally replace my aging 12" pbook

killerrobot
Jul 10, 2007, 05:07 PM
2. radically new or innovative; outside or beyond established procedure, principles, etc.: a revolutionary discovery.

iPod/iPhone ... revolutionary? I think so ...

I'm sorry, but is Apple the first (supposedly by the way) to market an ultra-portable laptop?

iPod/iPhone -- no doubt, because they were the first (well, with iPod the first to really make it work well) :)

emotion
Jul 10, 2007, 05:09 PM
Exactly what I've been saying. Also, spot on about the "Back to My Mac" feature. I wrote about this in my iMac prediction (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=3896175#post3896175) post (the part about "Option B"). The only con is that you would require a high-speed internet connection, which isn't always available... especially on those long trips you speak of.



3G ie. HSDPA and HSUPA. Maybe? Europe/Asia it would work out well.

I guess it could go one of two ways. An ultraportable to do as you say. Which would be pretty neat.

OR

Something close to that Intel prototype. Again probably something I'd consider as it has different strengths.

If it's the latter I'd hazard an optomistic guess at the 1.8GHz 17w TDP Merom LV (L7700). Due out in September.

emotion
Jul 10, 2007, 05:14 PM
Another rumor tells that Apple is about to release a new sleeker keyboard. Maybe this new keyboard and an ultraportable/multitouch laptop is this new keyboard !!!!

The keyboard can be just a 12" widescreen screen with a dock. When docked, this multitouch screen will display a full keyboard to use with your main mac. It can have a proximity sensor like the iPhone to save power. It can serve as an multitouch input for your leopard Mac.

I guess you don't type much? That doesn't sound like a comfortable setup to me.

Clive At Five
Jul 10, 2007, 05:18 PM
Another rumor tells that Apple is about to release a new sleeker keyboard. Maybe this new keyboard and an ultraportable/multitouch laptop is this new keyboard !!!!

The keyboard can be just a 12" widescreen screen with a dock. When docked, this multitouch screen will display a full keyboard to use with your main mac. It can have a proximity sensor like the iPhone to save power. It can serve as an multitouch input for your leopard Mac.

We can only dream until Apple make this true.

Don't take this as an insult, but I can tell that you're a newbie. You haven't been flamed enough for radically impossible ideas.

Let me say this swiftly: No. Just... No.

Who the hell wants to type all day on a 12", tactile-feedback-less slate? Plus, if you're never going to use it as a portable, there's no point in paying the $$ for it. Besides, keyboards are so cheap to make anyway (unless you're the Optimus -- let's not go there again :rolleyes:) so it would be irrelevant to cut out such a low-cost bundled item for a higher-cost one that may or may not be used to its potential.

There. I tried to be as nice as possible with your ridiculous idea. Others will not be as kind as I, so be fore-warned next time you have a thought about a break-through Apple product...

-Clive

sushi
Jul 10, 2007, 05:22 PM
A full featured 10" would be cool, but I can't see Jobs going for the smaller keyboard.
Apple always seems to keep full sized keyboards of some sort.

So while I agree with you on the 10 inch screen, and would like to see it, I believe that the ultra-portable will use a 12 inch screen.

Clive At Five
Jul 10, 2007, 05:24 PM
3G ie. HSDPA and HSUPA. Maybe? Europe/Asia it would work out well.

I don't know about you, but I sure as hell don't want to pay some cell carrier data rates so I can work on my laptop anywhere...

-Clive

Black Belt
Jul 10, 2007, 05:34 PM
Apple always seems to keep full sized keyboards of some sort.


'cept for the iPhone :p

sushi
Jul 10, 2007, 05:35 PM
Apple always seems to keep full sized keyboards of some sort.
'cept for the iPhone :p
Good point! :)

Black Belt
Jul 10, 2007, 05:36 PM
You have to be kidding. One, the G5 is a PowerPC. Two...Octocore? Before any of the desktops? Three, how much heat would something like that put out? No way.

When has a little heat ever stopped Apple? ;)

I mean those iPhones are hot enough, but have you felt the Apple TVs? Sweet mama those suckers run hot!

safXmal
Jul 10, 2007, 05:43 PM
Never going to happen as long as Steve Jobs runs Apple.

Bellow is a brief excerpt explaining why, you can read his entire article here (http://technology.guardian.co.uk/weekly/story/0,,1981815,00.html). By the way, since someone is bound to just wave what this article say away as just some guy pontificating, he is the former head of apple's federal government division, you know the group that supplies all our scientists and researchers.
[/I]

Two things. That was 2002 and we all know how long Jobs' definite no's last.
Secondly, I believe that with the development of the iPhone UI, Apple has solved more than only cell phone interfaces. I really believe that the UI can be used for small form tablets too and would solve a lot of the current problems with tablet computers.

Don't think of the tablet as a general computer but more as a dedicated machine that only does certain things (organize your pictures, PDA functionality, presentations etc) but does them well.
Also, as it is already now in the iLive suite, all programs on the tablet would work together seamlessly

emotion
Jul 10, 2007, 05:49 PM
I don't know about you, but I sure as hell don't want to pay some cell carrier data rates so I can work on my laptop anywhere...


Flat data rates are here now. Everyone will have their 3G data plans anyway when they get their iPhones.

Or are you in the US? :)

coffey7
Jul 10, 2007, 05:54 PM
SWEET! This would be cool. I just love a reason to buy a new product. :)

joelmejiaganan
Jul 10, 2007, 05:55 PM
Don't take this as an insult, but I can tell that you're a newbie. You haven't been flamed enough for radically impossible ideas.

Let me say this swiftly: No. Just... No.

Who the hell wants to type all day on a 12", tactile-feedback-less slate? Plus, if you're never going to use it as a portable, there's no point in paying the $$ for it. Besides, keyboards are so cheap to make anyway (unless you're the Optimus -- let's not go there again :rolleyes:) so it would be irrelevant to cut out such a low-cost bundled item for a higher-cost one that may or may not be used to its potential.

There. I tried to be as nice as possible with your ridiculous idea. Others will not be as kind as I, so be fore-warned next time you have a thought about a break-through Apple product...

-Clive

Thanks. Don't worry, words don't kill. I know I'm a newbie, but... you're right, maybe 12" is small, maybe it can be larger, but my point is that you can get rid of the keyboard and use this thing, and when you go out you take it with you as a portable. Not any mac will come with this as a keyboard, that's obvious, but you can use it as one. Finally, this is not an impossible idea, it's just a software update away if it comes out as a portable. We are now hearing people accepting the iPhone tactile-feedback-less keyboard, so why wouldn't us accept a full keyboard like this?

I'm just defending my idea. Thanks for your advice. I'll take care from now on.

PS. You all were newbies someday !!! forgive us !!!

quandmeme
Jul 10, 2007, 06:01 PM
When I was in highschool I thought that the duos were the most intelligently designed computers ever. random picture of dock (http://www.vectronicsappleworld.com/profiles/392.html)

They would beautiful if Apple did that again! I'd take multitouch but just want Leopard. I'd probably add 3G if they would just give me an Express 32 slot that didn't make the card protrude. I'm afraid though that it would be default so that Apple can say, you don't need a hard drive, you can just use web2.0 apps!

Dreamail
Jul 10, 2007, 06:06 PM
Stop trying to have your cake and eat it too! You can't run photoshop, final cut and WoW on an ultra-portable. NOW GET OVER IT!

Of course you can have your cake and eat it.
It will just be very expensive.

- There are ultra-thin 11" OLED displays from SONY (rumored to arrive later this year) which use a lot less space (just 1mm thin) and a lot less electricity, meaning the battery would last longer. Other manufacturers managed 160dpi OLEDs in sizes up to 14".
- There are battery technologies that offer higher electrical densities than current ones and are pliable into any shape so they could fill every nook and cranny to optimally use available space in a case; of course such a battery would not be user-replacable.
- SSDs are available in almost any size, it just gets expensive fast

My point is, it will depend on which market segment Apple wants to fill.

If Apple wants the cheap mass market a la MacBook then the ultra portable will be just that ultra portable - but not very powerful.

But if Apple goes for the higher end market, the ultra portable could easily have the same power and features as a current MacBook Pro at a fraction the size, but at 150-200% the cost.

Seeing rumors about the next iMac going 'upscale' with an aluminium case and seeing that the iPhone is in the upper price segment, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple opted for the 'luxury' category with a truly stunning and powerful ultra portable - costing $2999+.

emotion
Jul 10, 2007, 06:10 PM
But if Apple goes for the higher end market, the ultra portable could easily have the same power and features as a current MacBook Pro at a fraction the size, but at 150-200% the cost.

Seeing rumors about the next iMac going 'upscale' with an aluminium case and seeing that the iPhone is in the upper price segment, I wouldn't be surprised if Apple opted for the 'luxury' category with a truly stunning and powerful ultra portable - costing $2999+.

I'd still be interested in that. It'd beter be good for that price but it's not an impossible machine to create.

APPLENEWBIE
Jul 10, 2007, 06:15 PM
I'm thinking (not that this is original) basically a 12" iPhone. Multi-touch. Bluetooth wireless mousie and keyboard, solid state memory. No optical drive(built into the dock), one USB, one Firewire, one ethernet, speaker out, microphone in. Dock includes one HDMI out / monitor out and maybe built in hard drive? iSight on face. Dock also is a stand for desktop use. Same styling as the iPhone. Pro-sumer. Perhaps cell phone network access for data only? (hopefully not just ATT)

It seems to me that most all of the development costs have already been spent, on iPhone. This would just be an iphone with a larger case and some peripherals. If Iphone can be sold at $600, this should not be much more than $1800. (Probably wildly wrong on price.)

1984
Jul 10, 2007, 06:15 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

Apple is planning on releasing "a notebook that is so small and light that it could redefine the standards of ultra-portable computing."

The upcoming Apple notebook is said to feature a 12" display, 0.6-0.7 inches thick, and weigh less than 3 pounds.

These two comments contradict each other unless it includes a built-in slot-loading drive. Otherwise it's been done before.

MrCrowbar
Jul 10, 2007, 06:17 PM
What's up with people putting '12" multitouch screen' on the expected specs? Go ahead and strech out your arms and fumble around your Macbook's screen with your fingers. Notice something? Arms can be heavy, right?

Multitouch is great for handhelds or tablets. But as soon as you have an upward screen, it's damn horrible. Even Microsoft understood that and has that coffee-table-touchscreen ("Surface") on a horizontal plane. Jeff Han has it pretty horiontal most of the time too.

it just wouldn't work on a laptop at all. A 12" Mac tablet would be quite cool tho... Spice up leopard with interface ideas from the iPhone (touch keyboard when required and you can drag it to where it's convenient for you, magnifying glass for precise pointong, flick-to-scroll, pinch-to-zoom, etc.) and you got yourself a damn good computer.

Who knows, that might be the iMac of the future. The computer is in the screen, but this time, the keyboard and mouse are gone. Put both your hands flat on the screen and the keyboard is resized and curved to match your hands. When typing, the error correction could gradually alter the virtual keyboards geometry to put the 'keys' where you expect them, maybe even changing the key layout a bit if necessary. Or just put one hand flat on the display to bring up a one hand keyboard. Multitouch is a powerful technology that requires drastic changes in the overall concept of computer design and interaction. Don't be afraid of it, the mouse was scary at first too.

APPLENEWBIE
Jul 10, 2007, 06:27 PM
When has a little heat ever stopped Apple? ;)

I mean those iPhones are hot enough, but have you felt the Apple TVs? Sweet mama those suckers run hot!

I try really hard not to hold my AppleTV in my lap....

macidiot
Jul 10, 2007, 06:29 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

MacScoop claims (http://macscoop.com/articles/2007/07/10/ultra-thin-and-ulra-light-notebook-coming-end-year-sources) that according to "trusted sources" that Apple is planning on releasing "a notebook that is so small and light that it could redefine the standards of ultra-portable computing."

The upcoming Apple notebook is said to feature a 12" display, 0.6-0.7 inches thick, and weigh less than 3 pounds. MacScoop's sources are unclear if an optical drive will accompany this ultra-portable notebook, but do feel it is likely to come by year's end (2007).

For reference, Apple's current 15" MacBook Pro weighs 5.4lbs with a 1 inch thickness.

Rumors of a ultra-portable Apple laptop have been ongoing for since late 2006. MacScoop reported (http://www.macrumors.com/2006/12/04/ultra-thin-12-macbook-pro/) in December 2006 about the upcoming 12" ultra-portable MacBook Pro with additional details (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/02/16/apple-sub-notebook-nearing-release/) provided by Appleinsider in February. There are some conflicting reports with one summary (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/05/11/macbook-macbook-pro-and-ultra-portable-updates/) that believed the ultra-portable would carry a 13" LED display.

Article Link (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/07/10/ultra-thin-and-ultra-light-mac-notebook-in-2007/)

My bold prediction: Apple, and Steve Jobs, will soon declare the optical drive obsolete, much like with floppies. Thinking about 12 months from now...

safXmal
Jul 10, 2007, 06:30 PM
Who knows, that might be the iMac of the future. The computer is in the screen, but this time, the keyboard and mouse are gone. Put both your hands flat on the screen and the keyboard is resized and curved to match your hands. When typing, the error correction could gradually alter the virtual keyboards geometry to put the 'keys' where you expect them, maybe even changing the key layout a bit if necessary. Or just put one hand flat on the display to bring up a one hand keyboard. Multitouch is a powerful technology that requires drastic changes in the overall concept of computer design and interaction. Don't be afraid of it, the mouse was scary at first too.

Lovely

Spades
Jul 10, 2007, 06:30 PM
If Apple is taking the route I suggested and is designing the software to support using a notebook as a supplemental machine, that may be a part of the delay in iLife. Using iLife and using a notebook together is a little annoying. I want to keep all my files in one place; on my desktop. But while on vacation I store photos on the laptop. To get the photos to the desktop I have to manually copy the files. Maybe the next iLife will include syncing between computers for iPhoto and iTunes. Just dreaming. :cool:

My bold prediction: Apple, and Steve Jobs, will soon declare the optical drive obsolete, much like with floppies. Thinking about 12 months from now...

You mean they aren't already?

ziggyonice
Jul 10, 2007, 06:32 PM
this will be wonderful

macidiot
Jul 10, 2007, 06:34 PM
You mean they aren't already?

exactly.

pimentoLoaf
Jul 10, 2007, 06:38 PM
Does this mean Apple is buying out Palm so that the latter's recent toy (http://www.palm.com/us/products/mobilecompanion/foleo/index.html?creativeID=US_BB_foleo_announcement) will be reflagged and reworked to ...

Er, um... sorry. I forgot about the iPhone. :o

Seriously, since I have two 17" laptops, something this small would be nice for travelling.

QuarterSwede
Jul 10, 2007, 06:48 PM
But if Apple goes for the higher end market, the ultra portable could easily have the same power and features as a current MacBook Pro at a fraction the size, but at 150-200% the cost.
That would go against Apple's current pricing model for ALL of their devices. The smaller they get the cheaper they are (iPod, MacBook, iMac, etc.).

However, I do hope that this rumor is true even at the expense of the seldom used CD drive (I'd buy an add-on if I had to). I haven't bought a MacBook partly because of the size as I currently own a 12" PB and love it.

twoodcc
Jul 10, 2007, 06:50 PM
well I would love to see this happen very soon. But im sure it will be awhile

MrCrowbar
Jul 10, 2007, 06:53 PM
Lovely

A even more radically approach would be to introduce some kind of sign language. Deaf people have it and communication works pretty well with it; They can communicate as fast as talking people.

You basically lay out whole words with one gesture. Using Huffman coding (short, simple gestures for often used wirds, longer, complicated ones for rarely used terms). The computer can assist with error correction and grammar.

I agree this type of input has a greater learning curve but more and more of our communication goes through computers. We learned to talk to people when we were young, why not learn to 'talk' to a computer while we're at it? Besides, sign language is taught at a lot to babys in the US because it's easier for the parents to understand a gesture than some baby-babbling. In the long run, this type of input can get considerably faster than typing or even talking. The cool thing is that a computer can assist you in so many ways, once it understands what you mean, which should happen before the year 2040 according to Ray Kurzweil.

Roba
Jul 10, 2007, 07:19 PM
If this is true i do think that the MacBook's (which are after all consumer laptops) will continue as they are but the GPU chip will be updated but they will still be using integrated graphics.
If Apple bring out something like the Sony TX that uses integrated graphics then apart from a size difference what is this really going to offer that the MacBook does not offer?

I think that the LG R200 maybe the only 12.1 notebook that offers dedicated graphics but then it is not that thin the casing looks similar in size to the old 12 PB's.

People really haven't been asking for an ultraportable with integrated graphics on Mac related boards.

I think that Apple should bring out a "thin and light" MBP 13incher with a dedicated GPU think of the Sony SZ or the Dell 1330. This would distinguish it from the MB and it would be a pro/business computer.

CEAbiscuit
Jul 10, 2007, 07:34 PM
well I would love to see this happen very soon. But im sure it will be awhile

I agree.

To make things simple, just breakout some old 12 PB cases and shove intel ships in 'em. That would be just fine, just fine...

winterspan
Jul 10, 2007, 07:36 PM
I'm sure Apple will cook up something great, but it seems many of you have been looking for something similar for awhile now. In the US/Can at least, we don't see alot of small subnotebooks, I mean REAL subnotebooks.
I don't know how many of you are familiar with this site: www.dynamism.com (http://www.dynamism.com), but they sell
English language converted Asian electronics.. Laptop/UMPC/Cellphones
Now I think a few of these or similar models are sold in the USA, but check out some of these specs:

Almost all of these fit within these specs:

Processors:
Intel Core Solo U1400 1.2 GHz / U1500 1.33 Ghz
Intel Core 2 Duo ULV U7500 1.06 Ghz / ULV U7600 1.2 Ghz
Ram: 512MB -> 1GB
Storage: 40-100GB HDD or 32-64GB SDD (flash)
Network:802.11B/G, Bluetooth 2.0, 3G (some)
Battery 4-10 hours REALISTIC times, many get 6-8 hours of moderate use.

Look at these screen specs and dimensions:

Panasonic T5
12.1" 1024x768
10.55 x 8.27 x 1.25" / 2.26 pounds

Toshiba RX1
12.1" 1280 x 800 pixels
11.1 x 8.5 x ~0.8"/ 1.88 pounds

Sony Vaio G1
12.1" 1024x768
10.9 x 8.5 x ~0.98" / 2.15 pounds

Flybook V5
8.9" 1024 x 600 pixels touchscreen
9.3 x 6.4 x ~1.18" / 2.6 pounds

Kohjisha SH1
7.0" 1024 x 600 pixels
8.6 x 6.4 x ~1.0" / 2.2 pounds

Fujitsu U8240
5.6" 1024 x 600 pixels
6.7 x 5.2 x ~1.04" / 1.28 pounds

FlipStart (this is the company that Paul Allen[original microsoft guy] invested in)
5.6" 1024x600
5.9 x 4.5 x 1.6" / 1.75 pounds


Check em out:


Sub-notebooks
http://www.dynamism.com/Notebooks/Subnotebooks/categorygroup.shtml

UMPC
http://www.dynamism.com/Notebooks/UMPC/categorygroup.shtml

ziggyonice
Jul 10, 2007, 07:37 PM
hmm

dogcowabunga
Jul 10, 2007, 07:46 PM
I hope/expect the ultraportable will draw from the iPhone as far as its screen.

If I am figuring it correctly, a "laptop" screen at the same dense resolution as the 3.5" diagonal iPhone would result in a 10.5" screen and 1440x960 dimensions. That would be outstanding resolution (almost the same as the current 15" MacBook Pro), very readable/usable, yet very, very portable.

breath of apple
Jul 10, 2007, 07:51 PM
Does this mean Apple is buying out Palm so that the latter's recent toy (http://www.palm.com/us/products/mobilecompanion/foleo/index.html?creativeID=US_BB_foleo_announcement) will be reflagged and reworked to ...

Er, um... sorry. I forgot about the iPhone. :o

Seriously, since I have two 17" laptops, something this small would be nice for travelling.

I am glad that someone else has made the Palm Foleo connection, as this was my first thought with all of this revived talk of portability and tablets. And to think that Palm was blasted pretty severely following its WDC announcement. Interesting that Palm recently has hired ex-Apple thinktanks into its camp. Could the Foleo have been a response to Palm's "wind" of an upcoming Apple iphone - ultraportable companionship? Hmmm.....just food for thought. Of course, anything that Apple designs, and including multi-touch, is always heads above Palm. :)

Interesting thread.

I need the power of a MBP on the road, but am excited to see the upcoming hardware that Apple comes out with! Would be great to access power apps via "Back to my Mac." or VPN and to be able to take presentations, documents, and spreadsheets on the road in a light package. Go, Apple! :apple:

guzhogi
Jul 10, 2007, 08:01 PM
I can see this as the laptop version of the Mac Mini or Power Mac Cube: really cool, but won't last too long. Either Apple'll say it's not successful enough or is cannibalizing the MB/MBP's sales.

Aniej
Jul 10, 2007, 08:05 PM
Two things. That was 2002 and we all know how long Jobs' definite no's last.
Secondly, I believe that with the development of the iPhone UI, Apple has solved more than only cell phone interfaces. I really believe that the UI can be used for small form tablets too and would solve a lot of the current problems with tablet computers.

The article was written in 2007, thus suggesting the author thought about the 2002 encounter's applicability to today's world. And Job's definite no does last, it's the ambiguous "who knows" and other such comments that don't last.

while your point regarding the UI is fair, it ignores the the entire other side of why apple would reject a tablet, namely its form factor and the lack of utility. If Apple didn't include a stylus with the iPhone and rejected such tablet ideas when the major us research group requested it, I think it is a safe bet that we will not see tablets. Far down the road we might see some sort of single slab of hardware such as the readers we are seeing now, but I highly doubt any tablet in the current form.

Don't think of the tablet as a general computer but more as a dedicated machine that only does certain things (organize your pictures, PDA functionality, presentations etc) but does them well.
Also, as it is already now in the iLive suite, all programs on the tablet would work together seamlessly

This is even less support for a tablet. Apple is not going to make a device that only serves as basic set of application features and call it a computer. That would be like calling apple tv a mac mini, which it is not. Apple understands utility and functionally by way of great GUI and hardware that is both aesthetically pleasing and useful.

Poff
Jul 10, 2007, 08:05 PM
My bold prediction: Apple, and Steve Jobs, will soon declare the optical drive obsolete, much like with floppies. Thinking about 12 months from now...

I doubt it, as they are in the Blu-ray camp.

My opinion, however, is that any kind of optical drive belongs to the last millenium. They're dinosaurs. We'll soon even get HD-movies through iTunes! We download our software. Whatever would we need an optical drive for?

dontwalkhand
Jul 10, 2007, 08:21 PM
I doubt it, as they are in the Blu-ray camp.

My opinion, however, is that any kind of optical drive belongs to the last millenium. They're dinosaurs. We'll soon even get HD-movies through iTunes! We download our software. Whatever would we need an optical drive for?

Reinstalling tiger/leopard when you feel like starting off with a clean computer :D, though ever since I have switched to mac, I have never found this necessary.

meagain
Jul 10, 2007, 08:33 PM
I would like to see it have EDGE/5G amd wimax (early intel version). We could possibly see the clamshell variant with dispays on both sides, one of which is your virtual keyboard. The larger size will allow more fully finger shaped keys to be practical. It may be only 10" diagonal however so it is abit 3x the size of an iPhone interface.

Rocketman

I want a Sim card slot. :) And/or easily link to the iPhone for when a larger screen is desired.

brguitarist
Jul 10, 2007, 08:55 PM
Will be upgrading my PB soon, this would be perfect. Sweet!

Ludaru
Jul 10, 2007, 09:05 PM
How about two 10-12 inch screens fitted close to eachother? One LED and one multitouch. The same shape as an ordinary laptop, but the multitouch takes the ordinary keyboard spot. In that way you can use it as a normal laptop AND use it as a tablet while in 180 deg. This may be a bit far out considering battery issues, but does an "on the go"-laptop have to last for 10 hours?

Dr.Gargoyle
Jul 10, 2007, 09:11 PM
And Job's definite no does last, it's the ambiguous "who knows" and other such comments that don't last.
It wasn't long ago when Jobs said that people should stick with Treo phones and be happy, when asked about a whether Newton would make a come back. iPhone is basically a Newton II with phone capabilities.

Moreover, Job also said that computers never should have TV. Now we have Apple TV. Perhaps not a computer with a TV, but pretty damn close.

I am sure Apple sooner or later will make a tablet, but it will be a Apple tablet and they will sure as hell not call it a tablet.

Learn that Job is all about smoke and mirrors.

pimentoLoaf
Jul 10, 2007, 09:13 PM
Enough of all this computer speculation ... I demand an ultrathin translucent Bondi blue waffle iron! :p

macidiot
Jul 10, 2007, 09:28 PM
Reinstalling tiger/leopard when you feel like starting off with a clean computer :D, though ever since I have switched to mac, I have never found this necessary.

yeah, not much need for that with osx. But pretty much a once a year or less job with windows. I remember the first time my windows-using friend said he was going to wipe and re-install. I asked him why would you do that. He said it was a regular maintenance thing... I just shook my head in bewilderment.

winterspan
Jul 10, 2007, 09:30 PM
My opinion, however, is that any kind of optical drive belongs to the last millenium. They're dinosaurs. We'll soon even get HD-movies through iTunes! We download our software. Whatever would we need an optical drive for?

1) OS Installation
2) Cheapest/easiest form of 10's of GB of backup data
3) HD Video/Movies - with the state of our monopolistic telecom industry in the USA, It's gonna be MORE THAN A WHILE until everyone downloading 20GB HD movies is the norm... that'd require at least 75-100Mbps FTTH connections

Also think about the extremely low costs of distribution continuing into the future with 200 GB blue ray discs, 500GB-1000GB Holographic Versatile Discs,
and multi-Terabyte Protein coated discs....

No flash memory is going to touch that for a long time.... Although the form factor of these things may change away from a rotating spiral disc into something more like a flash memory card.... aka holographic versatile disc
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:HVC.svg,
but the mechanism behind it will be similar (aka read head & optical/magnetic media) instead of solid state transistors....

bwanac
Jul 10, 2007, 09:30 PM
been waiting for this.

hope it still packs a punch.

Tastannin
Jul 10, 2007, 10:18 PM
A even more radically approach would be to introduce some kind of sign language. Deaf-Mutes people have it and communication works pretty well with; They can 'talk' as fast as talking people.

Oh my, are we still living in the 1700-1800's? Do you think that just because some people don't have working ears, their vocal cords don't work either? Get with the times, that term is antiquated, and considered offensive (http://www.nad.org/site/pp.asp?c=foINKQMBF&b=103786) by deaf people.

Please don't use that phrase again, thank you. Just "deaf" works for me. :D

guzhogi
Jul 10, 2007, 11:12 PM
1) OS Installation
2) Cheapest/easiest form of 10's of GB of backup data
3) HD Video/Movies - with the state of our monopolistic telecom industry in the USA, It's gonna be MORE THAN A WHILE until everyone downloading 20GB HD movies is the norm... that'd require at least 75-100Mbps FTTH connections

Also think about the extremely low costs of distribution continuing into the future with 200 GB blue ray discs, 500GB-1000GB Holographic Versatile Discs,
and multi-Terabyte Protein coated discs....

No flash memory is going to touch that for a long time.... Although the form factor of these things may change away from a rotating spiral disc into something more like a flash memory card.... aka holographic versatile disc
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:HVC.svg,
but the mechanism behind it will be similar (aka read head & optical/magnetic media) instead of solid state transistors....

I agree. Optical drives will be here for awhile. Downloading HD movies would take forever, even on the fastest cable/DSL modems. I can see an ultra-portable having flash memory, no hard drive or optical drive. If you need to reinstall software, they can get an external drive, or maybe external flash drive? dealram.com has 16GB flash drives for like $139. They also have a 64GB one for over $5,000, but that's a bit much. Holographic discs & protein coated discs look cool. Lots of memory & fast transfer rates. Just a few years away, unfortunately. I know Macs since the first iMacs can boot off of a network server using netboot (really cool technology), but the server still needs storage space and a hard drive is the only thing big enough right now. Besides, networking is still too slow to boot a whole OS. Can't wait for OC-3072 to be hooked into each home & office!

OutThere
Jul 10, 2007, 11:46 PM
If you want to see almost exactly what you are going to get with only some slight modifications, Intel has already given you a giant hint (http://www.slashgear.com/intel-wows-with-ultra-thin-notebook-245425.php).

Yes. That thing is so sick, so apple. I can see something SO similar coming straight out of Apple's R&D. I haven't had fantasies about how cool it'd be to have a computer in a long time, but that really does it for me. I picture at my desk plugged into the 20", then on the run with a computer thinner than a (paper) notebook.

Apple's smallest portable just came out - the iPhone. Why would they create a 10" ultraportable? I haven't seen a single one used out in public. Ultraportables are a great idea and so is the tablet pc, but neither are practical, thus, no large scale markets. No markets, no dinero. I truly believe the iPhone is Apple's entry in both the cell phone, pda, and ultraportable markets. Look at all the rumors that lead up to the iPhone release. Nearly every filing is a feature that you now see in the iPhone.


Apple's smallest portable just came out, but that doesn't mean that they won't come out with a larger portable. :D

10" would be useless. I'm thinking they will go with the smallest screen that they can fit with a full keyboard. 12" widescreen? I'd be set with that.

like the millions of 12" PowerBook users that don't want a fat MacBook that is heavier and larger. They want a true ultra portable Mac.

This is less of a niche market than people say....just the smallest PRO level notebook computer that is feasible. The 12" is a beautiful size, give it a widescreen and dedicated GPU and shave a little off the thickness and you have a very portable MBP. Asking for power in a smaller form factor is NOTHING new, unlike some people in the thread seem to believe. They've already given it to us in the form of the 12" PB. It was almost on the level of the higher end powerbooks, just small.


If something specced like this showed up my wallet would open up like a hooker's legs:

Intel Penryn ULV Processor
80 GB 1.8" Hard Drive
Multi-touch trackpad
12" display
Firewire + USB
Mini-dvi out
Dedicated GPU
Bluetooth/WiFi

I'd say top end $2,200 low end $1,800 for starters?

mickeymikey
Jul 10, 2007, 11:49 PM
Maybe part of the reason people don't see the point of an ultra-portable is because they're thinking of it the wrong way. I think one key to ultra-portables is that they should not do everything. You have a desktop for the heavy work, and then an ultra-portable for travel. If you need to do heavy work on the road, you go back to your desktop...

...from your notebook.

Consider two of the features coming in Leopard; screen sharing and Back To My Mac. If you had easy access to your desktop while on the road, how much power does your laptop need? Not much. If you run into anything the laptop isn't good enough for, your desktop is just a few mouse clicks away. That's how I use my laptop now, using SSH and VNC.

Well put. Some of us here actually need/use multiple machines for different missions. I'm 100% for a smaller and LIGHTER machine for travel duty and meetings. Heavy work can be offloaded to the powerhouse machines at home/office. I could see doing this with both the full OS X or a updated version of the iPhone OS X.

I am continually amazed at how many people on these forums criticize Apple for not coming out with products that do EVERYTHING or at least exactly what THEY want. I wonder if those same people have ever considered that a company like Apple might actually do market research when developing new products, either for the masses or a particular niche.

verniesgarden
Jul 11, 2007, 12:12 AM
i think it will be a 11.5" mactablet, it will be just big enough to have a full page displayed and have space for some tool bars, will have an iphone like interface. it would have either a full fledged superdrive or just a cd burner. it will be all about .mac think wacom's cintiq meets iphone

i would get one to complement my mac pro

but would never want it as a stand alone computing device

WildPalms
Jul 11, 2007, 12:16 AM
Think they'll outshoot the brilliant ultra-portable vaio?

The Sony VAIO doesnt run OS X. So thats a moot question.

WildPalms
Jul 11, 2007, 12:27 AM
Does it run photoshop or a web editor?

Thats a lame retort. Photoshop or web editor on a tiny screen. :rollseyes:

ankh
Jul 11, 2007, 12:29 AM
Why not? Give us the upgrade to the capability of the Mini in a small portable with a bump in capacity plus a decent screen and keyboard for travel purposes, and the prospect of attaching a really nice screen and keyboard and external drives ....

Else, Apple's going to lose out to the little *nix laptops for sure. They can't keep selling to five percent of the users forever, young people keep coming along who can't afford Apple's stuff til they get old.

And _nobody_ who's young expects to get old enough to afford Apple's computers, because nobody who's young expects to get old period.

cliffjumper68
Jul 11, 2007, 12:56 AM
Why not? Give us the upgrade to the capability of the Mini in a small portable with a bump in capacity plus a decent screen and keyboard for travel purposes, and the prospect of attaching a really nice screen and keyboard and external drives ....

Else, Apple's going to lose out to the little *nix laptops for sure. They can't keep selling to five percent of the users forever, young people keep coming along who can't afford Apple's stuff til they get old.

And _nobody_ who's young expects to get old enough to afford Apple's computers, because nobody who's young expects to get old period.

The likelihood of this being a affordable laptop are pretty slim considering the market for ultra portables. I would pay a higher price for more portability. Hopefully it will have built in WAN so that I can bury my crackberry. :0

ed.sg
Jul 11, 2007, 01:57 AM
My prayers are answered. Please have it released with the New Leopard!

ajhill
Jul 11, 2007, 02:16 AM
Well, many have tried and few have succeeded in this market bringing new products to market. If the recent iPhone is any indication Steve Jobs is also about to take the ultra portable/laptop market another 5 years ahead in a leap of technology.

Funny thing is that the only really groundbreaking thing about the iPhone is the multitouch interface and the software. Everything else is pretty much off the shelf. Apple has combined them to create something the is much greater than the sum of it's parts.

Look for this new spirit of Steve Jobs to permeate the Mac market next with several large leaps forward that will get people rethinking Macintosh and Apple Inc. iPhone was the first salvo, or shot across the bow if you will. The Mac/PC market is the Holy Grail and Steve is just getting started.

He wasn't kidding when he said that they have some great new products coming out this year. And the year is just half over. We still have back to school and Christmas seasons to go. I can't wait.

Sure glad Steve Jobs is on our side.

koobcamuk
Jul 11, 2007, 03:20 AM
i dont understand all these fascination about ultraportable laptops...

I once had Sony x505. It might have that wow factor and might serve as female magnet but as far as practicality goes it's not all that. you have to sacrifice so much to have notebooks that thin. Small hard drives, no graphics card, limited I/O, and no optical drives...

sure, it's about 3 lbs lighter and it's easier on your back, but really, if you are going to complain about 5lb notebook being too heavy, what you need is a dumbbell, not a notebook.

being a gadget collector is one thing, being a geek is another. if you can't handle the extra 3lbs, you really need to hit the gym.

Legendary post. :rolleyes:

RoDe
Jul 11, 2007, 03:22 AM
If it has an optical drive it would be a killer!

koobcamuk
Jul 11, 2007, 03:42 AM
I think you're close. I'd have a feeling that the trackpad would be "multi-touch," not the whole screen. *starts saving pennies*

I have always thought that the next generation of trackpads on laptops have to be multitouch like on the iPhone. Zooming in regarding resolution independence... awesome.

Imagine having mouse shortcuts, to compliment your keyboard ones... :rolleyes:

mpw
Jul 11, 2007, 03:52 AM
Wooaboutf**kingtimeHoo!

I know I'd be buying this in a second, funds allowing. At last I can stop lusting after the Asus UF1 and Vaio TZ range.

I know of one person who on reading this is gonna suddenly get all indecisive over a 15" of 17" MBP too.:D

ozontheroad
Jul 11, 2007, 03:52 AM
I love my 12" PB and would buy one of these in a heartbeat.



Oh my, are we still living in the 1700-1800's? Do you think that just because some people don't have working ears, their vocal cords don't work either? Get with the times, that term is antiquated, and considered offensive (http://www.nad.org/site/pp.asp?c=foINKQMBF&b=103786) by deaf people.

Please don't use that phrase again, thank you. Just "deaf" works for me. :D

What ever made you think that you have the right to tell someone what they can or can not say ? Get over yourself buddy. Politically correct is just a mater of opinion.

miniConvert
Jul 11, 2007, 04:08 AM
Well, despite just buying a SR MBP I can't say that I wouldn't be tempted to get an Apple ultraportable. I've always wanted one, so I guess it's inevitable that I'll buy one if it gets released.

I'll probably wait for a while, though, unlike with the SR MBP, as I don't have an urgent need. Or, if the spec isn't quite what I'd expect, I'd be tempted to hold out for something more palatable.

dcv
Jul 11, 2007, 04:10 AM
I know of one person who on reading this is gonna suddenly get all indecisive over a 15" of 17" MBP too.:D

Cheeky ;)

I've been waiting for an ultra-portable or at least 12" PowerBook replacement of sorts for so long now. Gave up hope and went for the 15" MacBook Pro but 3 lemons in a row mean I've given up on them for a while now and am back to using my old 12" PowerBook again. If this 12" (or whatever) machine did happen then yes yes yes I'd be all over it. And maybe get the 17" HD MBP too...


</indecisive>

mpw
Jul 11, 2007, 04:21 AM
i dont understand all these fascination about ultraportable laptops...

...you really need to hit the gym.
How's working out gonna shave over an hour off of my travel time Jersey-London?

Aniej
Jul 11, 2007, 04:32 AM
It wasn't long ago when Jobs said that people should stick with Treo phones and be happy, when asked about a whether Newton would make a come back. iPhone is basically a Newton II with phone capabilities.

Moreover, Job also said that computers never should have TV. Now we have Apple TV. Perhaps not a computer with a TV, but pretty damn close.

I am sure Apple sooner or later will make a tablet, but it will be a Apple tablet and they will sure as hell not call it a tablet.

Learn that Job is all about smoke and mirrors.

Respectfully, I really am unpersuaded by the examples you suggest support the point you are making. iPhone is is far from Newton II, not just in terms of utility differences, but also the entire technological approach to iPhone is different than Newton II. Moreover, the stick with treo comments were prior to Apple's not so great experience with Motorola.

Secondly, computers not having tv is very different than taking downloads of television shows and songs off of your computer and putting them back on the tv. I would actually say apple tv is illustrative of the fact that tv should not be on computers as it serves to get the data off the computer and back to the tv. iTunes selling movies and tv shows is a great business concept and it serves the purpose of distributing the media, but in many ways the iPod an apple tv are the second step that pull the content off the computer.

Could apple eventually make a tablet, I have to say yes because I am not in the apple division addressing those issues. Is it likely? I think it is not.

Jobs is not all smoke and mirrors. Consumers of high tech items and even consumers generally are not as stupid as people assume and aren't on some sort of Pavlonian response system. If the product is not quality people take note, even if it is quality people still complain (read some of the threads in here). Jobs is passionate, perhaps to a fault sometimes, about what he believes will best serve apple's customers. I would suggest renting pirates of silicon valley, it is not perfect, but a pretty damn good representation. Smoke and mirrors would imply the stuff we buy from apple is not to the level it is is made out to be. This is not the case, in my opinion. Does Jobs do an amazing job at selling and promoting items and garnering interest, yes, but there is nothing wrong with it and it, in all reality, is the very thing that gives rise to existence of a message board like this one.

Finally, I just want to be clear that recognize that Jobs and apple can obviously change direction overtime. Clearly as the industry changes considerations have to be made as to both what apple thinks is the right direction and the direction of the industry as a whole.

marcdeb
Jul 11, 2007, 04:40 AM
The upcoming Apple notebook is said to feature a 12" display, 0.6-0.7 inches thick, and weigh less than 3 pounds.

For reference, Apple's current 15" MacBook Pro weighs 5.4lbs with a 1 inch thickness.

For us europeans this really is rubbish. Please consider using the metric system, at least for weight.

Shinjinho
Jul 11, 2007, 04:41 AM
Possible specs (IMHO):

13" LED back-light display
ultra-thin aluminium enclosure
Core 2 Duo U7600 1.20GHz processor
GMAx3100 Integrated Graphics
1.8" 80GB HDD + 1-2GB Intel Turbomemory
up to 3GB RAM (1GB soldered + 1 SO-DIMM Slot)
no optical drive
10hrs battery life

about 1600-1700$

emotion
Jul 11, 2007, 04:41 AM
For us europeans this really is rubbish. Please consider using the metric system, at least for weight.

You not got a caclulator?

koobcamuk
Jul 11, 2007, 04:43 AM
A even more radically approach would be to introduce some kind of sign language. Deaf-Mutes people have it and communication works pretty well with; They can 'talk' as fast as talking people.

You basically lay out whole words with one gesture. Using Huffman coding (short, simple gestures for often used wirds, longer, complicated ones for rarely used terms). The computer can assist with error correction and grammar.

I agree this type of input has a greater learning curve but more and more of our communication goes through computers. We learned to talk to people when we were young, why not learn to 'talk' to a computer while we're at it? Besides, sign language is taught at a lot to babys in the US because it's easier for the parents to understand a gesture than some baby-babbling. In the long run, this type of input can get considerably faster than typing or even talking. The cool thing is that a computer can assist you in so many ways, once it understands what you mean, which should happen before the year 2040 according to Ray Kurzweil.

You scare me.

koobcamuk
Jul 11, 2007, 04:55 AM
And _nobody_ who's young expects to get old enough to afford Apple's computers, because nobody who's young expects to get old period.

Maybe when they're 10 years old... :rolleyes:

Roba
Jul 11, 2007, 04:57 AM
I don't really see this as a true PowerBook replacement based on the size, weight and speculated specs that were given. The PowerBook 12 inch had a dedicated GPU.
This though by the sounds of it is going to be a smaller factor maybe under powered MacBook but with better battery life and fancy casing.
A true replacement would be a smaller factor MBP with a dedicated GPU maybe with something like the 8400GS.

Cheeky ;)

I've been waiting for an ultra-portable or at least 12" PowerBook replacement of sorts for so long now. Gave up hope and went for the 15" MacBook Pro but 3 lemons in a row mean I've given up on them for a while now and am back to using my old 12" PowerBook again. If this 12" (or whatever) machine did happen then yes yes yes I'd be all over it. And maybe get the 17" HD MBP too...


</indecisive>

dcv
Jul 11, 2007, 05:02 AM
I don't really see this as a true PowerBook replacement based on the size and weight that were given. The PowerBook 12 inch had a dedicated GPU.
This though by the sounds of it is going to be a smaller factor maybe under powered MacBook but with better battery life and fancy casing.
A true replacement would be a smaller factor MBP with a dedicated GPU maybe with something like the 8400GS.

If that's the case though I'd still get one AND a MacBook Pro for more intensive stuff (but leave that one for use when at home). I'm planning on doing a bit more travelling in the near future so a 12" (or whatever) smaller/lighter form factor than the current notebook offerings would come in very handy indeed.

koobcamuk
Jul 11, 2007, 05:03 AM
You not got a caclulator?

It's about the only time I use the dashboard!

lelereb
Jul 11, 2007, 05:03 AM
ultra portable doesn't mean flash memory instead of hard disk

and for the cpu a 1.66ghz dual core (or a specialized ultra-portable cpu) can be a better choice than a faster one, to reduce price, energy drain and heat.

must have optical drive (no combo pleeeeeeeeeeeeese)

aLoC
Jul 11, 2007, 05:13 AM
Booorriiiing... Where are the *desktops* ?

Much Ado
Jul 11, 2007, 05:17 AM
Booorriiiing... Where are the *desktops* ?

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=326390

lelereb
Jul 11, 2007, 05:25 AM
anyway

a 1500$ 15" will meet much more needs than a handbag laptop

emotion
Jul 11, 2007, 05:29 AM
anyway

a 1500$ 15" will meet much more needs than a handbag laptop

Well go and buy one then. This thead is for the people wanting something different to what the hoards have.

To a lot of people 15" is a desktop replacement not a real portable.

verniesgarden
Jul 11, 2007, 05:58 AM
Oh my, are we still living in the 1700-1800's? Do you think that just because some people don't have working ears, their vocal cords don't work either? Get with the times, that term is antiquated, and considered offensive (http://www.nad.org/site/pp.asp?c=foINKQMBF&b=103786) by deaf people.

Please don't use that phrase again, thank you. Just "deaf" works for me. :D

wow that is insane. he said deaf-mute. what's offensive about that? political correctness has gone to far, it's offensive to me that people have to scrutinize what they say. it's amazing that being PC is touted by the same people that say smile on your brother

let it go... you'll be happier yourself

JobsRules
Jul 11, 2007, 06:12 AM
I've have a 'desktop replacement' 15" Powerbooksas a main machine and unless you're hooked up to a big screen it's always a bit cramped and I often still want a proper keyboard and mouse. When you are using it as a portable, well, it's a bit big and heavy.

For my next upgrade I'd prefer a Mac Pro. I'd still want a portable, but then the priority would be small size and good battery life not trying to outgun a big desktop. A lower-clocked cool running Core Duo would be ideal.

Apple still make nice latops but I think they need to pull out something groundbreaking to reclaim their crown and make the Windows crowd weep.

voncheech
Jul 11, 2007, 06:30 AM
it is just a iphone with a bigger screen...
it is a laptop that turns into a radio head unit with GPS... =)
it is also a floor cleaner and a dessert topping !!!

Digitalclips
Jul 11, 2007, 07:52 AM
as long as you can connect it to your bluetooth keyboard and mouse when at home or in office, I'm game! :)

And a stylus for onscreen art work ... :)

Digitalclips
Jul 11, 2007, 07:55 AM
it is just a iphone with a bigger screen...
it is a laptop that turns into a radio head unit with GPS... =)
it is also a floor cleaner and a dessert topping !!!

Noooo. It should project, using hologram technology, a screen that is up to 90" and allows Gestures in mid air.

Tastannin
Jul 11, 2007, 08:08 AM
What ever made you think that you have the right to tell someone what they can or can not say ? Get over yourself buddy. Politically correct is just a mater of opinion.

Well, it's because when someone talks like that, they are using an outdated and offensive term to people like myself. Would you say the same thing you just told me, to an African-American who objected to the use of the N-word? I think not. It's not being politically correct, and it's not a matter of opinion, it's a matter of respect.

Thanks.

MrCrowbar
Jul 11, 2007, 08:10 AM
Oh my, are we still living in the 1700-1800's? Do you think that just because some people don't have working ears, their vocal cords don't work either? Get with the times, that term is antiquated, and considered offensive (http://www.nad.org/site/pp.asp?c=foINKQMBF&b=103786) by deaf people.

Please don't use that phrase again, thank you. Just "deaf" works for me. :D

Sorry, didn't mean to offend anyone. I was just referring to the group of people that use the sign language when communicating with each other because they don't really have a choice. I'm aware the vocals chords of deaf (I looked it up, it's PC...) people are fine. It's more convenient for them to talk sign language to each other.

It's usually hard to understand someone who has been deaf since birth because s/he never had a chance to hear what spoken language sounds like. But you get used to it and they can read your lips pretty well. This is the group of people I was referring to. If you only say 'deaf', it could also refer to someone who blew out his/her eardrums. Those people talk pretty normally.

PS: I usually don't give a * for politically correctness myself. What's so wrong about referring to people based on their skin color? That's in no way offensive. If the word has become a swearword over decades, it's okay to avoid using it. But just because people don't like being called like this shouldn't matter.

MrCrowbar
Jul 11, 2007, 08:20 AM
Well, it's because when someone talks like that, they are using an outdated and offensive term to people like myself. Would you say the same thing you just told me, to an African-American who objected to the use of the N-word? I think not. It's not being politically correct, and it's not a matter of opinion, it's a matter of respect.
Thanks.

Since when are words outdated? Burning witches is outdated (at least in most places) but words? Is there a list somewhere with the politically incorrect words on the net? African-Americans use the N-word all the time... I feel discriminated because I can't say it. :p


Back to the topic:

Touchscreens don't work for laptops. I'd rather see a Mac tablet than a 12" laptop with a touch screen. The space saved by omitting the keyboard and the display hinge isn't bad at all. Only problem: LCDs don't like heat, the one on my Macbook has kinda lost its glue in one corner because the computer was getting too hot once... Now it's brighter in the corner. Imagine a display going right over the heatpipes...

janstett
Jul 11, 2007, 08:23 AM
The upcoming Apple notebook is said to feature a 12" display, 0.6-0.7 inches thick, and weigh less than 3 pounds.

Just like Columbus, we're celebrating Apple's discovery of something millions of people already know about :). The Thinkpad X61 features a 12" display, 0.8 inches thick, and weighs 2.7 pounds.

Well, if they can shave 0.1 - 0.2 inches off the thickness of an X61, that's not too bad even if it's not as groundbreaking as they present it.

Tastannin
Jul 11, 2007, 08:23 AM
wow that is insane. he said deaf-mute. what's offensive about that? political correctness has gone to far, it's offensive to me that people have to scrutinize what they say. it's amazing that being PC is touted by the same people that say smile on your brother

let it go... you'll be happier yourself

It's not insane. It's asking people not to use a term that promotes an incorrect image of deaf people. I happen to be deaf myself. I am NOT mute. I can communicate just fine. My vocal cords work just fine. Other deaf people are able to talk just fine. There's even an entire branch of deaf education that focuses on teaching them to communicate only by talking ("oralism") just like everyone else.

I'm not asking everyone to be politically correct for correctness' sake. I'm just asking people who happen to use an antiquated term to correct their description and not propagate a false stereotype of deaf people, thats all.

There's no excuse for insensitivity, especially when a member of that affected group asks that a certain term not be used anymore, because it does not describe that group in a positive and non-misleading manner.

Thanks!

emotion
Jul 11, 2007, 08:26 AM
Just like Columbus, we're celebrating Apple's discovery of something millions of people already know about :). The Thinkpad X61 features a 12" display, 0.8 inches thick, and weighs 2.7 pounds.

Well, if they can shave 0.1 - 0.2 inches off the thickness of an X61, that's not too bad even if it's not as groundbreaking as they present it.

If I could run OSX on that I'd be all over it like a rash.

I like Apple hardware but it's the OS I'm after.

Tastannin
Jul 11, 2007, 08:30 AM
Sorry, didn't mean to offend anyone. I was just referring to the group of people that use the sign language when communicating with each other because they don't really have a choice. I'm aware the vocals chords of deaf (I looked it up, it's PC...) people are fine. It's more convenient for them to talk sign language to each other.

It's usually hard to understand someone who has been deaf since birth because s/he never had a chance to hear what spoken language sounds like. But you get used to it and they can read your lips pretty well. This is the group of people I was referring to. If you only say 'deaf', it could also refer to someone who blew out his/her eardrums. Those people talk pretty normally.

PS: I usually don't give a * for politically correctness myself. What's so wrong about referring to people based on their skin color? That's in no way offensive. If the word has become a swearword over decades, it's okay to avoid using it. But just because people don't like being called like this shouldn't matter.

No problem. Apology accepted. If you want to make the distinction, you can always say deaf people who use sign language. There's still no need to use the word "mute" when referring to deaf people in general, unless they actually are missing vocal cords, and refer to themselves as mute. It carries a stigma and implied inability to communicate at all.

Talking to each other in sign language isn't convenient, it's necessary for some of us deaf people. ;)

MrCrowbar
Jul 11, 2007, 08:39 AM
No problem. Apology accepted. If you want to make the distinction, you can always say deaf people who use sign language. There's still no need to use the word "mute" when referring to deaf people in general, unless they actually are missing vocal cords, and refer to themselves as mute. It carries a stigma and implied inability to communicate at all.

Talking to each other in sign language isn't convenient, it's necessary for some of us deaf people. ;)

Thanks for the enlightment. I'll remember it. I just heard that sign language can be more efficient than spoken word. Too bad sign language isn't the same across the world. Well, I guess that's what english is for. ;)

inacoma
Jul 11, 2007, 09:14 AM
wohoo! Macbook Nano!

Aniej
Jul 11, 2007, 09:23 AM
alright you two already kissed and made up, now quit the useless banter that is filling up this thread and lets bring this back on point please.

AidenShaw
Jul 11, 2007, 09:51 AM
...they need to pull out something groundbreaking to reclaim their crown and make the Windows crowd weep.

Why would Windows users weep? If it's that good, we can just reformat the drive and run Vista.

No tears.

verniesgarden
Jul 11, 2007, 10:50 AM
It's not insane. It's asking people not to use a term that promotes an incorrect image of deaf people. I happen to be deaf myself. I am NOT mute. I can communicate just fine. My vocal cords work just fine. Other deaf people are able to talk just fine. There's even an entire branch of deaf education that focuses on teaching them to communicate only by talking ("oralism") just like everyone else.

I'm not asking everyone to be politically correct for correctness' sake. I'm just asking people who happen to use an antiquated term to correct their description and not propagate a false stereotype of deaf people, thats all.

There's no excuse for insensitivity, especially when a member of that affected group asks that a certain term not be used anymore, because it does not describe that group in a positive and non-misleading manner.

Thanks!


how is deaf-mute have negative connotation? deaf-mute with a hyphen as was placed can be just a range of communication barriers. no one ever deliberately attacked anyone, taking it as an attack is the first form of ignorance.. i have nothing against you, I'm just sick of the word police

oscuh
Jul 11, 2007, 10:53 AM
I'm sorry, but is Apple the first (supposedly by the way) to market an ultra-portable laptop?

iPod/iPhone -- no doubt, because they were the first (well, with iPod the first to really make it work well) :)

I didn't say Apple would be the first with an UP, just that their implementation would likely be "revolutionary." Were they the first to come out with a mobile phone? No ... but then again, I needn't go any further to rest my case :rolleyes:

BanjoBanker
Jul 11, 2007, 11:07 AM
If you want to see almost exactly what you are going to get with only some slight modifications, Intel has already given you a giant hint (http://www.slashgear.com/intel-wows-with-ultra-thin-notebook-245425.php).

Compare the specifications listed by MacScoop and those set out in the intel prototype. Then look at the design and its distinctively Mac (sans the OS displayed). Watch and you will see this morph into your new ultra light, portable notebook. Below is just one of the images to whet the appetite.
Look at the way the screen is attached. Apple has not used that style hinge since the Ti Book and I doubt they will go back to it.
I would love to have an ultra portable MacBook to replace my 12: Power Book. The Black MacBook I bought to replace it would be on e-bay in the morning if Apple came out with another ultra portable like the 12" PB.

tirerim
Jul 11, 2007, 11:09 AM
A even more radically approach would be to introduce some kind of sign language. Deaf people have it and communication works pretty well with it; They can communicate as fast as talking people.

You basically lay out whole words with one gesture. Using Huffman coding (short, simple gestures for often used wirds, longer, complicated ones for rarely used terms). The computer can assist with error correction and grammar.

I agree this type of input has a greater learning curve but more and more of our communication goes through computers. We learned to talk to people when we were young, why not learn to 'talk' to a computer while we're at it? Besides, sign language is taught at a lot to babys in the US because it's easier for the parents to understand a gesture than some baby-babbling. In the long run, this type of input can get considerably faster than typing or even talking. The cool thing is that a computer can assist you in so many ways, once it understands what you mean, which should happen before the year 2040 according to Ray Kurzweil.

Um... no. ASL (American Sign Language) isn't just gestures substituted for English words, it's an actual language, with its own grammar, vocabulary, etc., which bear no relation whatsoever to those of English. It would be like having to learn Japanese just to interact with your computer. Most people have a very hard time learning languages after early childhood. And, for that matter, how would the input even work? Through the iSight? That means solving computer vision, too, which we're nowhere close to doing.

Eventually, we will be able to communicate with computers in natural language, but it's a lot more likely that it will be in our native languages. And it may require strong AI before it happens; natural language processing has so far consistently been unable to bridge the gap between getting a reasonable amount of stuff right with a lot of errors and getting human levels of comprehension. (Not that human levels of comprehension are that good -- think of the frequency with which you mishear something or have to repeat yourself in the course of an ordinary conversation. Now imagine that interacting with your computer is like that. There are advantages to limiting the input to digital modes; they make it much easier to verify that you're telling the computer what you intend to.)

emotion
Jul 11, 2007, 11:11 AM
I think we cleared up the deaf thing so can we keep this on topic please?

Look at the way the screen is attached. Apple has not used that style hinge since the Ti Book and I doubt they will go back to it.
I would love to have an ultra portable MacBook to replace my 12: Power Book. The Black MacBook I bought to replace it would be on e-bay in the morning if Apple came out with another ultra portable like the 12" PB.


I don't think anyone is suggesting it's that device but in principle Intel seem to be on board with the approach Apple might take.

btw. I'm in the exact same position with this blackbook (had two 12" pbooks before it and miss the nice form factor).

MrCrowbar
Jul 11, 2007, 12:10 PM
Um... no. ASL (American Sign Language) isn't just gestures substituted for English words, it's an actual language, with its own grammar, vocabulary, etc., which bear no relation whatsoever to those of English. It would be like having to learn Japanese just to interact with your computer. Most people have a very hard time learning languages after early childhood. And, for that matter, how would the input even work? Through the iSight? That means solving computer vision, too, which we're nowhere close to doing.

Input would work with a multitouch-screen. Words would be made with fingertip gestures... Nevermind :)

Heinekev
Jul 11, 2007, 12:37 PM
Agreed, it is often an overlooked point. Still one has to consider...

I wouldn't have bought an MP3 player before the iPod, I was never moved to buy a game console before the Wii, and I never lusted after a PDA/smart phone before the iPhone. Sometimes a market direction has to be established or reestablished before a successful market exists.

I think Apple *could* do this with a tablet (especially now with a killer touch interface) but I am skeptical about an ultra-portable laptop. Seems a little too clunky for Apple to take part in.

-Clive


I used an IBM x22 for the longest time because of the small form factor. A 12" would be the best thing since sliced bread imo

Gurnatronic
Jul 11, 2007, 01:38 PM
Hey this is my first ever post so dont dont shoot me down lol.

Couple of points.... If they go away with the dvd drive an stuff, how are they goign to provide osx reinstall software and the bootable hardware tests?

Another thing i noticed is on that intel prototype the usb port looks to fit most of the height of the machine... well, how would this effect the mini-DVI port currently used on iMacs and Macbooks is almost a 3rd as chunky again..

Anyway id buy one in a flash

Karpfish
Jul 11, 2007, 01:46 PM
the mini-dvi port is barely taller than the usb ports. I too was a 12" PB user, then when apple went away with them I ended up with a Macbook. If an ultra-portable come out, I would sell my MB and get it. About the Optical Drive, then could have(Sell,unfortunately) a firewire DVD Drive. Could they include E-SATA?

Clive At Five
Jul 11, 2007, 02:45 PM
I used an IBM x22 for the longest time because of the small form factor. A 12" would be the best thing since sliced bread imo

Yes, since sliced bread...

...or at least since the 12" PB...

:rolleyes:

-Clive

dernhelm
Jul 11, 2007, 02:59 PM
the mini-dvi port is barely taller than the usb ports. I too was a 12" PB user, then when apple went away with them I ended up with a Macbook. If an ultra-portable come out, I would sell my MB and get it. About the Optical Drive, then could have(Sell,unfortunately) a firewire DVD Drive. Could they include E-SATA?

I'd love to see Apple support eSata. But few if any manufacturers are doing so as a built-in option. Still - Apple doesn't seem to shy away from adopting newer technology before complete general acceptance, so maybe they will.

It certainly would give you a high-speed external option for disk and DVD additions to your system.

Welly
Jul 12, 2007, 05:25 AM
the "trusted source" is getting more and more untrustworthy every day. this is the same trusted source that predicted aluminium imacs at WWDC and everything else. Not buying it. I don't believe for a second apple would release a 12" model anymore. I'd believe a 13.3" mbp *possibly* but I think this trusted source is more grasping at straws and generating rumours of what he/she would *like* not actually what apple are developing.

MrCrowbar
Jul 12, 2007, 07:50 AM
Hey this is my first ever post so dont dont shoot me down lol.

Couple of points.... If they go away with the dvd drive an stuff, how are they goign to provide osx reinstall software and the bootable hardware tests?

Another thing i noticed is on that intel prototype the usb port looks to fit most of the height of the machine... well, how would this effect the mini-DVI port currently used on iMacs and Macbooks is almost a 3rd as chunky again..

Anyway id buy one in a flash

hmmm... Intel Macs boot from USB. Apple yould just provide a USB ROM stick with the DVD-COntents on it.

KristieMac
Jul 12, 2007, 07:57 AM
I'm not sure I believe this one, but I'd certainly love an even smaller portable.

L3X
Jul 12, 2007, 08:25 AM
I'm white. :D

I think a lot of people are missing the point about this ultra-portable. Apple will come up with something that none of us have mentioned, just like the iPhone.

If it's going to redefine portable laptops, than it WILL redefine portable laptops just like the iPhone has redefined smartphones.

Lesser Evets
Jul 12, 2007, 09:40 AM
If you look at a current MacBook Pro you will notice .6" is if you lopped off the screen...

So if this is true, they probably will lop off the flip up screen, get rid of the drives, go almost all FLASH and Wifi and make a wireless screen with a USB or FW attachment or a few interface ports.

Hopefully Mac develops the multitouch into products like this and make a manageable note pad for writing and reading and using a multi-touch keyboard on the screen you can type and use it as an all around internet and business assistant. If I was still in an office, doing the office type tedium, I would love a device like that. If it can display documents, it would be an awesome 'book' to take around. *slobber*

Sadly.... Mac probably isn't going to release anything like that anytime soon.

Gurnatronic
Jul 12, 2007, 09:52 AM
You know in recent tray loading dvd writers and drives they have that cutouy for 8cm dvd's and cd's. Well, maybe they could include a blu-ray/hd-dvd drive that reads 8cm discs. Would help cut down on size an poss. power consumption

Is this a possibilty?

Spades
Jul 12, 2007, 11:40 AM
Couple of points.... If they go away with the dvd drive an stuff, how are they goign to provide osx reinstall software and the bootable hardware tests?

If the idea is to make this a supplemental machine, then you could use another computer to do the install. You either boot the notebook in firewire target mode and install to it via another computer, or boot the other computer in firewire target mode to use its DVD drive to reinstall. That's how I got tiger onto an iBook without a DVD drive.

You can also get an external DVD drive, or the install may be provide on a USB drive as somebody else said.

matznentosh
Jul 12, 2007, 11:57 AM
I'm white. :D

I think a lot of people are missing the point about this ultra-portable. Apple will come up with something that none of us have mentioned, just like the iPhone.

If it's going to redefine portable laptops, than it WILL redefine portable laptops just like the iPhone has redefined smartphones.

Don't forget Palm just came out with an ultra-light notebook, the Folio, mainly a keyboard, small screen, and easy sync with the Treo cellphone. But that was almost universally ridiculed. I was surprised by that, since Microsoft has been pushing the idea of tablets and of those little computers for a long time, why when Palm does it everybody thinks it's dopey. I wonder how an Apple product would be different, or if it would get the same sort of criticism. Would it also be a revolutionary product? Or has the Apple reality distortion field now extended over the entire surface of the planet.

Spades
Jul 12, 2007, 01:57 PM
The problem with the Foleo is that it's crippled. It's basically a glorified PDA. The first reaction to the Asus Eee was "This is the Foleo done right." An Apple ultra-portable would get the same response. An ultra-portable should at least still be a general purpose computer. That's why the iPhone and Foleo don't cut it.

princealfie
Jul 12, 2007, 02:09 PM
The problem with the Foleo is that it's crippled. It's basically a glorified PDA. The first reaction to the Asus Eee was "This is the Foleo done right." An Apple ultra-portable would get the same response. An ultra-portable should at least still be a general purpose computer. That's why the iPhone and Foleo don't cut it.

Perhaps iPhone + Asus Eee would work more awesomerly.

stefan15
Jul 12, 2007, 02:11 PM
This looks pretty good, too:
http://www.asus.com/products.aspx?l1=5&l2=23&l3=517&l4=2&model=1566&modelmenu=1

killerrobot
Jul 12, 2007, 02:16 PM
Perhaps iPhone + Asus Eee would work more awesomerly.

That's the awesomerlest quote ever:)

janstett
Jul 12, 2007, 03:04 PM
If I could run OSX on that I'd be all over it like a rash.

I like Apple hardware but it's the OS I'm after.

Well, I have run OSX on my Thinkpad. Toyed with keeping it on an external disk and switching to the Thinkpad full time.

matznentosh
Jul 12, 2007, 03:38 PM
The Eee looks sort of dorky, but the U1F looks pretty cool.

Catonow
Jul 12, 2007, 04:47 PM
My two cents' worth:

I've been looking to replace my 15" G4 PB and was tempted by the new 15" SR MBP, but I decided long ago that my next laptop would have to be smaller and, most importantly, weigh a lot less. I've been traveling more lately, and lugging that hunk of metal around the world (in addition to all of my other luggage) is just too cumbersome. And no, I'm not a 98-pound geek, I'm a stronger (and bigger) than average guy. Not only is the 15" form too heavy to carry for hours, but it's also too unwieldy to use in tight spaces like an airplane seat tray. I also like to work while lying down (and I bet I'm not the only one -- not good for my back to sit all day), and trying to balance a 15" 5-1/2 pound laptop on my chest isn't fun.

So, my hope for the smaller-form MBP is that it will weigh a lot less than any current Mac laptops. But I wouldn't want it to have anything less than a full-size keyboard. As far as I can tell, that means it shouldn't be smaller than 12". I'd almost prefer a 13" model, frankly, if the extra real estate doesn't mean more weight. (Maybe it can be thinner, then.) And I want it to be a full-fledged computer, with at minimum the same capabilities as a current MacBook.

I don't care, however, if it has an optical drive, I'd easily give that up in favor of less mass. You can always get an external DVD drive for those very few occasions you absolutely need it, perhaps Apple will make a really cool sleek one to go with. I'm more concerned that it has decent graphics capability, if not quite up to current MBP standards, at least better than the MB's. I don't even expect a massive hard drive, I'd settle for a smaller one (maybe 60 or 80 gb), once again, if it means less mass. (And, once again, if you need it, you can always get an external HD.) A SSD would absolutely rock. Not sure what a touchscreen would add other than wow factor, but I'm willing to be wowed.

maxtivoli
Jul 12, 2007, 06:19 PM
Now typing on my 12" PB, which is dying a slow death, longing for a decent replacement. See, I'm a novelist and take my laptop around the world, so it has to be light, but I never do much more than word processing and internet--but lots and lots of typing. An ultraportable with a full keyboard would be ideal. I don't care about optical drive (my backup is firewire anyway). But if the keyboard is small, or worse touch-sensitive--well you can't write novels on that.

I'm thinking I shouldn't depend on rumor and should just get a MacBook now. What do you think? I figure even if these come out, it won't be for a while and they'll be too costly.

mpw
Jul 12, 2007, 06:30 PM
...I'm thinking I shouldn't depend on rumor and should just get a MacBook now. What do you think?...

Well they won't be here before September at the extreme earliest I reckon and they will be expensive*, but the MacBook ain't no lightweight. I'm seriously impressed by the package offered by Asus in their UF1, less than half the weight of a MacBook.

*Go on Jobs, prove me wrong I dares ya'.

AidenShaw
Jul 12, 2007, 10:21 PM
Or has the Apple reality distortion field now extended over the entire surface of the planet.

No, some of us have a genetic immunity to the RDF.

offwidafairies
Jul 13, 2007, 02:06 AM
Be prepared to wait until October for this one. Otherwise 10.5 will be delayed further to get 10.4 to run this.

we need an october countdown (like the iphone one). im wetting my pants with anticipation.