HELIO OCEAN - besting the iPHONE 24/7...?

[Cleverboy]

So, I was recently browsing a Mac centric website, and ran across an ad for Helio (clearly the best places for competitors to advertise, no doubt). The ad read:
Don't Buy a Cell Phone
E-Mail + Photo + Surf + IM + Call. Helio Ocean: Don't Call It a Phone.
HELIO.com/Ocean
And then linked to this page:
http://compare.helio.com/
Here is the comparison chart in its entirety.

http://www.myphonewar.com/img/comparisonChart.jpg

Why on GOD's green EARTH, would ANYONE choose an iPhone if all these things are true? Reading the comparison, you'd have to be coo-koo to choose an iPhone over this thing of genius. Well, look at the plans too...


Helio Ocean - only $295, with new activation and 2 year agreement

$65/mo. - 500 minutes
$85/mo. - 1000 minutes
$100/mo. - 1500 minutes
$145/mo. - Unlimited minutes
All plans include:

Text messaging - Unlimited
Picture/Video messaging - Unlimited
Mobile MySpace - Unlimited
Web browsing - Unlimited
High Speed 3G - Unlimited
GPS-enabled Google Maps - Unlimited
Nights + Weekends - Unlimited
Mobile to Mobile - Unlimited
$6 device protection program if lost (nothing like that on the iPhone!), $6 TV programming for Comedy Central, Adult Swim, VH1 content and more. Bluetooth Stereo headset at $95. Sweet!

Nice checkout options too... look... expand to 2GB of SD memory for $45 or 1 GB for $30. $30 activation fee (compared to AT&T's $35... not bad). Shipped FedEx 2Day. Neat!

CNET rates the device 8.3 out of 10 (the iPhone only (http://reviews.cnet.com/smart-phones/apple-iphone-8gb/4505-6452_7-32309245.html?tag=pr) scored an 8.0), which is simply EXCELLENT!
http://reviews.cnet.com/cell-phones/helio-ocean/4505-6454_7-32390958.html

THE BIG QUESTION: HUH?

So... I ask you iPhone enthusiasts and non-iPhone enthusiasts... why hasn't this phone completely blown the iPhone out of the water, turning its media hype into a whirlwind of shame? Why isn't this phone just trampling the iPhone underfoot like a rampaging bull elephant? Is it just missing the "Apple" logo? Helo quite cleverly referred to the iPhone everywhere as the AT&T iPhone (although that's sure not to fool many).

At the end of the day... what's the deal here?

CNET noted iPhone's negatives as: "The Apple iPhone has variable call quality and lacks some basic features found in many cell phones, including stereo Bluetooth support and 3G compatibility. Integrated memory is stingy for an iPod, and you have to sync the iPhone to manage music content."

CNET noted the Helio Ocean's negatives as: "The Helio Ocean is a bulky device with a poorly designed numeric keypad. Streaming video quality was not the best and photo quality was mediocre. It also has not yet implemented the Microsoft Exchange ActiveSync application that many mobile professionals would covet."

Where'd Helio even come from, you'd think... why didn't Apple just do a deal wtih them? One analyst, Pam Duffey, a telecom analyst at Visiongain, at some point last year, thought that would be EXACTLY what would happen. March 2006, so, don't be to hard on her:
"There exists a relationship between Apple and Helio management that goes back to the ROKR iTunes phone, and Helio has declared a target audience identical to iPod's existing market. Helio's top rank executives have also publicly voiced frustration with mainstream carriers and appear to be on a crusade to radically shake-up the industry," adds Duffey.Sounds like Apple to me! MobileTracker.com wrote her opinion in brief this way:
Apple will design and brand its own mobile phone and that this handset will launch with upstart MVNO Helio. Helio is the partnership between Earthlink and SK Telecom that aims to bring high-tech Korean phone technology and services to US consumers.

I have an iPhone, so I'm biased on the face of it, but open minded and almost preternaturally addicted to looking at the opposite side of an opinion to see both sides. I've heard about the Helio Ocean for months and months, and kept comparing it to the iPhone and wondering. The let's go mobile website reveals some specs:
http://www.letsgomobile.org/en/cellular/0981/helioocean/

WHAT SUCKS ABOUT THE HELIO OCEAN

Reviewing Helio's website and looking around the net, we can start
seeing the possibly serious downsides in my book:

MVNO if you want out early, you'll need to get another Helio phone that does even less. Uses Sprint for voice and Verizon for data, but can change these things and manage them as business needs see fit (the recent YouTube cur-fuffle was somewhat telling (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/exclusive/helio-fights-apple-with-official-youtube-over-3g-and-the-genius-of-the-iphones-25gwifi-271109.php)).
Battery - With 3G, etc, etc... the talk time is only 5 hours vs iPhone's 8 hours. Start browsing the net, and who knows.
240x320 screen, much smaller than the iPhone's 480x320
NOT touchscreen, buttons all the way, baby!
Default 200MB, whoopee! That's like 40 songs or a 10 minute movie... sweet! NOTE: I heard that its supposedly 512MB (though the spec says otherwise), but in any case, I love how its ambiguous with many of these phones.
Maxes out at 2GB at a time, even though it features removeable memory
No WiFi, but unlimited 3G. That counts right? Who needs local networking?
Nice and thick, like 2 packs of cards glued together and busting the seems in your pants pocket, unless you're slick and dapper, sporting your cargo pants.
Does NOT sync your calendar OR your contact to Outlook. Only to Helio's website (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/step_by_step/how-to-sync-your-contacts-with-the-ocean-259518.php), which you can upload information to in CSV format. Yikes! NO THANKS!
Still no Flash support. Does YouTube through 3GP, and only recently stopped blocking customers from accessing it after paying up.
AccuWeather - $3.99/mo. paying FOR THE WEATHER. That's not cool.
Personal Organizer, Meh - Gizmodo writes (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/review/helio-ocean-feature+by+feature-review-259545.php) "Nobody wants to maintain two different calendars with their schedules on it. There's also no task list, so if you wanted to use this phone as an organizer, it'd be kind of a stretch."
Browser Zoom, nice try (http://www.smartdevicecentral.com/slide/Helio+Ocean/207110_207559_20_0.aspx), but its NO iPhone
Buy music tracks over the air at $1.99 a pop. Nice, huh? No? What's wrong?
Coverflow? Where for art thou?
Supports Yahoo Music and a couple of other DRM formats. No iTunes though (understandably).
Web browser ALWAYS starts in Google "mobilizer" mode, chopping full HTML down to mobile sizes. You can choose "full HTML" but it stays only for the rest of that session. Give that "mobilized" content is the default, it gives you an idea of how inconvenient full-HTML browsing is on the Helio compared to the iPhone. AS shown in this Gizmodo video on YouTube, it looks like Craig's list full-html becomes a nightmare (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlt6P_IENjY). Imagine telling the browser to jump from control to control, section to section with no screen tapping. Click-click-click-click-click-click-click-click... almost there!
No specific podcast support.
Ah, yes... NO MAC Sync SUPPORT. (feel free to Bluetooth though)


VERDICT: WHY I CAN'T BRING MYSELF TO CARE

I'll be honest... I'd love to applaud Helio and their Ocean. I'd love to cheer and shout, and hoot. I'd love to say, "way to GO!" and "Sticking it to the man!" I really would. At the end of the day? At the end of the day, HELIO is just another suped-up version of the same phones I didn't want to use anymore. Why? All the reasons above.

I just want to tap on the screen and have a decent size to navigate through. Give me my 480x320 media browsing and podcast support! I use these things, you know? How many clicks does it take to use this phone every day? 2,000? 3,000? I'll probably stop using the features long before that. Scroll to the top and bottom of an iPhone web page, I'll say it will beat a clicker-phone any day. I liked this review here, called "Why I Won't Buy the Helio Ocean (http://jonsnetwork.com/2007/06/why-i-wont-buy-the-helio-ocean/)". Apple takes features that already exist in other products and reduces the cost of using them, i.e. makes them more usable. Simple idea, but the results are magical. That is the reason people that switch to Macs become evangelists and why Apple has fan boys. And that is why the iPhone will shake the market.
He added in the comments: --it was the interface of the Ocean that I didn’t like. Too much clicking. This is why I don’t have a smart phone now and why I don’t use all the cool features on my Nokia. They are a pain to use.Amen, and amen. Isn't the devil just totally in the details? Perhaps Helio is a cautionary tale of the rumored Apple MVNO. Not exactly where Apple would want to position itself. Not exactly the kind of device Apple believes would "shake up" the industry.

I see the Helio as "more, better, different". This is the hallmark of evolutionary change. I see my iPhone as something revolutionary. It is something I ALWAYS find myself picking up, and looking for if misplaced. I've sat in my car for 30 minutes before going in the house, surfing my WiFi connection, knowing that the second I step in the house, I'd have other things to do. For the most part, I'll even browse the web on my iPhone while sitting IN FRONT OF THE COMPUTER, its so natural. I don't think I'll EVER return to wanting to browse the web on a device with a click-button 4 direction system. The amount of times I've held the iPhone with one hand in landscape or portrait, and wanded my finger to scroll through the page... I can appreciate HTC Touch mimicking the behavior that had audiences clapping furiously in January.

If anything, Apple's little wonder is the true quickening of the singularity (http://www.aleph.se/Trans/Global/Singularity/) in my opinion. For all its quibbles, its on the stage by itself, and competitors are dreading each and every new feature addition it picks up. I thought my iPod was useful and great... but looking back, I hadn't seen anything yet. :apple:

~ CB

[janey]

One long (nice and not as biased as I thought) post. Short reply:

The iPhone is more intuitive to use.

Enough said.

Don't really care about some of those other extras, but Apple does UIs best.

[Sobe]

Ask anyone who really loves their iPhone and I would almost guarantee you that there is an emotional almost visceral attachment to it.

No IMs? Bah I don't need em that much, can use web 2.0

No gps? who needs it

and on ad infinitum for each weakness of the iPhone.

And hey I count myself in this group. I'm an extremely logical person 99% of the time, but tell me how the iPhone can't do such and such (when it should matter) and I simply won't care.

I love the iPhone so much for what it does right that I don't care if some other phone does things the iPhone can't (yet).

So I would put this seemingly nifty gadget (the Helio) into that category -- it sounds great but it's not an iPhone.

Not entirely logical, but there we are.

[Cleverboy]

No IMs? Bah I don't need em that much, can use web 2.0 Yeah. I mean, the coming of Trellian Astra aside... I've been hearing people around the forum mention BeeJive. I thought... "Meh, whatever... must be like that iPhoneChat... kind of experimental, etc, etc." I thought Meebo will work for me (secretly thinking that its a bit of a pain, being a full website page and a custom environment, etc)!

So, in reality... I've never been that impressed with Web 2.0 progress with IM on the iPhone, until recently. Yesterday I tried BeeJive (http://iphone.beejive.com/ - AOL/GoogleTalk/ICQ/Jabber/MSN Messenger/Yahoo support) on my iPhone for the first time. Oh... my... GOD. END GAME. I'm done. I don't need anything else. :D This positively THE BEST IM client I've ever seen on a mobile phone, and I have a hard time reconizing that I'm still in Safari. iPhone interface, great controls, well... well... WELL... thought out interface. Portrait/Landscape... however I want, it just works! I can't imagine the 1.0 Blackberry version of the service even looks half as good.

I'm not sure Apple can actually introduce a better solution either, given the nature of iChat and the lameness of the "connectivity" agreements the big companies have tried with each other. I have the feeling that Apple's AOL agreement actually prevents it from simply adding an easy "Google Talk" button, considering it already works with Jabber, its a bit silly. Someone uploaded a video demo on YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2FaR6G1Di4), but I'm tempted to make one that's much more descriptive a walk-thru and less noisy and uncoordinated (but it gives you an idea).

No gps? who needs itTo be honest... GPS would be nice. I would even be satisfied with Bluetooth receiver support. That'd be FINE! GPS can be built-in for the next iPhone, I just don't want Apple to leave us first buyers out in the cold. Nothing like a universal "You-Are-Here". I agree though "need" is not part of that equation. If I can pull-over and use Google Maps, I'll figure out EXACTLY where I am. It's almost ONLY just a time saver.

I love the iPhone so much for what it does right that I don't care if some other phone does things the iPhone can't (yet). So I would put this seemingly nifty gadget (the Helio) into that category -- it sounds great but it's not an iPhone. Not entirely logical, but there we are.I think you sell yourself short. I think, even logically, the iPhone is simply a superior CLASS of product. Even the HTC Touch costs MORE than the iPhone, and HTC has been in the business for a while making far more capable devices. Why should it cost MORE? To me it just sounds like a lot of effort and premium is placed on products with an interface that much superior to the other categories. I'm still compiling a large comparison chart, and there is a specific NEXUS of features that automatically put phones into the same class as iPhone, and they're not cheap.

~ CB

[elppa]

iPhone was never the best featured phone on the market.

Can you show us demos of the software and how it works?

The hype about the iPhone is not just to do with features, it's to do with how easy those features are to use.

Some of those comparisons are misleading marketing, for example the iPhone only has a "HTML browser" whereas the do-it-all-for-under-300-dolars device has a "full HTML browser", whatever the difference is.

Has the do-it-all-for-under-300-dolars device got a glass screen? good battery life? seamless integration with the desktop? enchanting user experience? easy to roll out software and firmware updates?

Looks like there little table has a few omissions.

Anyone can produce tables which makes their product looks better than the competition, here is Apple's effort:

http://images.apple.com/pr/library/2007/06/competitivedatachart2.jpg

[defeated]

http://images.apple.com/pr/library/2007/06/competitivedatachart2.jpg

lol, this chart isn't much more fair than Helio's chart

You should at least list the detail of the size rather than only thickness.
You should at least list the network they are running on, rather than ignore it
You should at least find some source of battery information rather than say nothing, and make sure people understand which phone's battery is user replaceable
You should at least indicate the resolution of the screen

I mean, be a little bit fair is all this post about.

For Helio, It has no Wi-Fi. I haven't got information about what engine its browser is using.

[Gonzlobo]

lol, this chart isn't much more fair than Helio's chart

You should at least list the detail of the size rather than only thickness.
You should at least list the network they are running on, rather than ignore it
You should at least find some source of battery information rather than say nothing, and make sure people understand which phone's battery is user replaceable
You should at least indicate the resolution of the screen

I mean, be a little bit fair is all this post about.

For Helio, It has no Wi-Fi. I haven't got information about what engine its browser is using.

Charts are like statistics, they can be skewed to point to one's advantage. My choice was strictly made on wifi. My second choice, the 95, has it, but I would've selected a helio too.

[Cleverboy]

For Helio, It has no Wi-Fi. I haven't got information about what engine its browser is using. With unlimited 3G, I guess that's not supposed to matter. The browser ****s ****s in my opinion (NOTE: fake censorship). If it always starts in "mobile mode" until I "reset" it to "HTML" mode, requires I "click around" through the DOM "tab order" before I can activate a control at the bottom of a large page, and no one seems willing to disclose exactly what the rendering engine is (which doesn't matter at this point), I think I'd already be looking elsewhere. Imagine pulling up Mac Rumors forum and seeing a long list of threads for "what's new". Pick the thread in the middle of the list with the Helio controls. God forbid you run into a line of too many controls/links (like a calendar). I'll come back in five minutes.

Watch Gizmodo navigate Helio's Surf browser to Craig's list in the YouTube video. It's amazing how no one talks about this, simply because that's exactly what you're limited to:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlt6P_IENjY

~ CB

[Dermot81]

Excellent comparison--shows why looking good on a comp sheet doest equate to a better device.

Lack of touch screen, poor resolution, bulky frame, and limited browser are deal breakers for me

[plumbingandtech]

You ever see those lists from car makers like Hyundai that show that it has more "features" then a BMW sedan?


It's all in the details my friend.......the iphone just runs better...

phhtt.. but go ahead and buy a ocean.. whenever i pass by them at the mall they are so lonely and look like they could use a sale.

[FleurDuMal]

Yeah, but that Helio Ocean thing looks monstrously ugly.

The iPhone looks like something your average teenager might pull out of their pockets. The Helio Ocean looks like something only an accountant would use without blushing. Superficial, I know, but still important.

[constant L]

holy crap that beejive is awesome. Just set it up and booked mark it. Definately the best iphone chat website I have seen so far. The UI is great and feels like an iphone app. Thanks!

(posted from my iPhone)

[zap2]

No Wi-Fi, no iTunes Support, no touch screen.

No deal.

[plumbingandtech]

The iPhone looks like something your average teenager might pull out of their pockets.

Nahh.. Since its 500-600 bucks and something like this has not seen before, teenagers, are not the first demo group for this and to me are not the first type of person that comes to mind when i think of the iphone.

In fact the ocean reminds me what a teenager would pull out of their pocket as the sidekick has become very very popular among the teenybopper crowd.

the iphone speaks of people with taste, who want the best, who do not want to settle...

[plumbingandtech]

Very true,

without wifi and without a real browser... the ocean is not even in the same league IMO...

[Sutekidane]

It's a different phone, for a different market. Simple as that. Not everybody wants to spend $500-$600 on a phone and also jump into a 2 year contract. Also, some people require a physical keyboard. No comparisons are fair because they are 2 very different devices.

[marksman]

I would say any phone with a hardware keyboard is a loser.

By the way I agree with Cleverboy. IM was my biggest missing link on the iPhone and Beejive pretty much fills the bill. Would a native app be appreciated? Sure. Can I do everything I need to do with BeeJive? Yes. And fairly easily.

[Starfall]

Ask anyone who really loves their iPhone and I would almost guarantee you that there is an emotional almost visceral attachment to it.

I think that says it.

I've owned a lot of high-tech devices over the years, which I've eagerly demoed to other people. I have never seen one that has the instantaneous appeal of the iPhone.

Within ten seconds of showing someone my iPhone, the reaction is almost invariably "Wow. That is the coolest thing I've ever seen!" or something similar. I've even had people say, after all of the pre-release build up, "That's so much cooler than I expected it to be". It just has this "object from the future" quality that is not apparent on a feature grid.

Really, any list of iPhone features goes out the window as soon as people see how it actually works in person, which is why Apple can successfully advertise it by simply showing someone using it. What other phone (or high-tech device, for that matter) has been advertised by showing it's user interface?

[Cleverboy]

It's a different phone, for a different market. Simple as that. Not everybody wants to spend $500-$600 on a phone and also jump into a 2 year contract. Also, some people require a physical keyboard. No comparisons are fair because they are 2 very different devices.Oh, its the exact same market. I'd say Apple has an even wider net, but it certainly encompasses the full breadth of Helio's target market. Anyone paying $295 for a phone could easily consider paying more, if they see what they want. Just a little more saving. You have to remember as well... First, that Helio themselves are the ones drawing comparisons (they made the chart above)... not Apple... not a 3rd party, so its not really forced comparison of any kind. Second, I can guarantee you that NO ONE *wants* to spend $500-$600. Who would *want* to spend that?

The question will always be, how much are you *prepared* to spend, to get what you want? I personally know people that paid $175 to end their previous phone plans (like from Sprint for instance), even within months of expiration just to get their new iPhone. Oddly, when push comes to shove, monthly fees on the Helio start at about $60 more "per year" than the iPhone, without purchasing memory upgrades it can't hold much of your music/media either. --So you're already saving money there. Look at it this way:

$499 iPhone / 4GB Flash
$0 extra yearly service expense ($60/mo.)
$5 extra activation cost ($35)
------------
$499 Total

$295 Helio Ocean
$90 2 x 2 GB SD
$60 extra yearly service expense ($65/mo.)
$0 extra activation cost ($30)
------------
$443 Total

Not that far apart price wise, right...? It's like 60 bucks difference. You throw in all the stuff the Helio does, and its not very compelling to most people, weighed against what its lacking (bigger screen, touchscreen, nice browser with auto-zooming/multi-touch, slim form factor, etc.) You can access MySpace from the iPhone's Safari browser if you want, why is Helio advertising "MySpace integration"? You have full instant messaging support from programs like BeeJive for iPhone (or the coming Trellian Astra), so nothing lost there. Would you really value the ability to "beg" your other Helio-having friends for music?
Not everybody wants to spend $500-$600 on a phone and also jump into a 2 year contract.Want to guess how long the Helio membership plan is? Want to guess how much you'll pay for breaking it? Also, note that you could sell your iPhone at a discount, keep your plan, and use ANY other AT&T compatible phone you want (there's quite a wide selection, including Treos and Blackberries). Unlike the urban legend is implying, there's no actual penalty that I know of tying you to using the iPhone for 2 years (although you have a limited amount of changes I believe).
http://www.helio.com/page?p=terms
THE COMMITMENT: A 2 year initial term ("Initial Term") will apply to your account, unless you sign up under a special “no term” promotion or arrangement when you activate service. It is up to you to provide copies of web pages or other documents showing you signed up under a special “no term” promotion or arrangement. If no such documents can be provided, it will be assumed that the 2 year Initial Term will apply to your account(s). This Agreement will continue on a month-to-month basis after the Initial Term is completed, if applicable. You agree to PAY US $175 PER WIRELESS NUMBER OR OTHER ACCOUNT AS AN EARLY TERMINATION FEE IF YOU CHOOSE TO END YOUR SERVICE BEFORE COMPLETING YOUR INITIAL TERM, OR IF WE CHOOSE TO TERMINATE YOUR SERVICE EARLY FOR GOOD CAUSE.It's strange to me that everyone has become HYPER aware of these standard industry terms with the iPhone, to the degree that they completely forget that everyone else has them too...
No comparisons are fair because they are 2 very different devices.That makes no sense to me. They're phones. Everyone comparing the iPhone to other phones has compared it to devices EXACTLY like the Helio. Recently someone had an entire thread saying how his Chocolate phone was leagues better than the iPhone he returned. I think its a fair argument to make, whether it holds up under scrutiny or not.

~ CB

[elppa]

lol, this chart isn't much more fair than Helio's chart

You should at least list the detail of the size rather than only thickness.
You should at least list the network they are running on, rather than ignore it
You should at least find some source of battery information rather than say nothing, and make sure people understand which phone's battery is user replaceable
You should at least indicate the resolution of the screen

I mean, be a little bit fair is all this post about.

For Helio, It has no Wi-Fi. I haven't got information about what engine its browser is using.

You've missed the point of my post which states that any manufacturer can use a chart to show their product in a favourable light:

Every(one) can produce tables which makes their product looks better than the competition

[LillieDesigns]

I've been torn between the Ocean and the iPhone for awhile, but I have to say, Helio is a lot cheaper. There are promo codes all over the internet that give you $75 off the Ocean, $25 off the first 4 months of the bill, free memory etc. Also, MySpace is running a promo that waives an early cancellation with the Helio service.

Anyway, I've held from both for now because I am stuck. I was in the market for a new computer last year and was stuck between a pimped out Windows machine or an iMac. I decided to go with the iMac and am 100% satisfied with the endless creativity it's allowed me enjoy (iMovie, iDVD, Garageband, etc.). I am looking at the phones this way (as in "why settle"), BUT I don't know if the iPhone is going to allow me to do so.

My main gripe is that the iPhone, save the touch screen, beautiful UI, and iPod/Safari, is a lot of cash (ATT :mad:) for something that may not allow me be free with the machine. I can probably not worry about the Ocean falling off my bed, throwing it in my bag, or losing it as much as an iPhone.

In the end it's a tough choice so I think I'm going to wait - the iPhone is wantable though and I don't want to crave the iPhone if I go with the Ocean.

Bottom line: I think the iPhone is just a superior product and technology wise a revolutionary device; it just needs some fine-tuning.

Edit: I realized I typed a lot and said pretty much nothing so I wanted to throw in the choice has to be made on money and benefits. A mac has creative benefits out of the box that no Windows computers do, however, at this point in time it's hard to justify the iPhone due to it's lack of apps in its early stages.

[note235]

love my iPhone
but how big is the helio?

[stealthman1]

Watch Gizmodo navigate Helio's Surf browser to Craig's list in the YouTube video. It's amazing how no one talks about this, simply because that's exactly what you're limited to:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlt6P_IENjY

~ CB

That's just painful to watch and my EDGE is faster than that.

[defeated]

$90 2 x 2 GB SD
------------
$443 Total[/B]



lol,
1x4GB $38, http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820208086

2x2GB, 2x$16.5=$33 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820134445

Grand total would be $391 or $386.

Oh, yeah, also you can do

16GB (4X4G or 8x2G) if you need, or 32GB.

edit, I don't know what this is, but apparently they have a sale, Helio Ocean for $195
http://www.finawireless.com/

[zap2]

Ocean, while looks cool isn't anything massivly new.


Sidekick for helio....that what I'd call it

[MacRumorsReader]

Being someone who loves tech, I can say that Apple seems to do something that no one else has done:

You have to have it :drool: .

I was one of the skeptical ones. I was one of the ones who said "A phone? Heck no. Apple is not that stupid. Why would they enter such a highly fragmented market."

I was one of the ones, whom after watching the keynote said ""Well, that's just the RDF kicking in."

I was one of the ones who went to the Apple store a little more than a week after launch to go see what piece of crap all those crazies bought.

And, I am one of the (almost a) million happy iPhone owners.

I was literally blown away. The first "must have" piece of personal tech I owned was my BlackBerry (about 3 years ago). It was cool. It was functional. And at times it made me curse like a sailor.

But, the iPhone is not flawless. My blackberry did email a lot better than it does. I'm not an IM-er and I think GPS on phones is a poorly timed joke. However, the iPhone's screen is almost worth the price of admission. The iPod functions are phenomenal. And everyone who uses mine, wants one. It is no small kind of "want", either.

The kind of want that says "I'm going down and getting one in the near future"

For me, here is the best part: My wife wants one too. But she doesn't need to be cutting edge. "I'll just take yours after you upgrade."

I'm so in love with her.

[Cleverboy]

lol,
1x4GB $38, http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820208086

2x2GB, 2x$16.5=$33 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820134445

Grand total would be $391 or $386.

Oh, yeah, also you can do

16GB (4X4G or 8x2G) if you need, or 32GB.

edit, I don't know what this is, but apparently they have a sale, Helio Ocean for $195
http://www.finawireless.com/You might as well start invoking the name of eBay if you want to go there. I was just pulling prices directly off of the Helio website. Just because people are unloading them and Helio relies on selling through promotions... Doesn't quite move me towards endoess purchasing research when making a basic point on a forum. I'm sure all the eBay speculators that thought supply of iPhones would be low are stinging too. Let's see what that landscape looks like in two months. So not the point though is it? The point is NOT "how low can you bargain hunt a Helio?" its really "Why isn't the Helio Ocean heralded as more of a game changer than the iPhone, and why aren't more iPhone buyers interested?"

~ CB

[Clix Pix]

That Helio Ocean thing is UGLY!!! Why would I want something like that?!

[defeated]

You might as well start invoking the name of eBay if you want to go there.

I don't think Helio produce SD card, does it?

Sure, if you can pull different price for iPhone, please help yourself.

Im obviously not saying Helio Ocean is better than iPhone, but if you want to play price card, then please be professional and realistic.

Finally, please do admit the difference between ebay and newegg, newegg.com is a respected onine retail store, not an auction service.

[Cleverboy]

I don't think Helio produce SD card, does it?
Sure, if you can pull different price for iPhone, please help yourself. If you actually read what I wrote up (not sure why I'm bothering to type this), I was going through the checkout process on Helio's website... you know? The same one the AD I saw lead to? The one that put me on the comparison page in the first place? If you think I'm making random points about value, and how to use Google to look up better pricing... then I'm officially informing you... no... I'm not. There's a magazine called the Want Advertiser where I live... I use it all the time. That's not part of the discussion as I see it.
Im obviously not saying Helio Ocean is better than iPhone, but if you want to play price card, then please be professional and realistic.Obviously I AM saying the Helio has MORE FEATURES than the iPhone, and I'm leaving it up to people to say what they think is better and why more features might not "win out". You should be "professional" (bucko!) I'll just end with that, as I think you're "scribbling" your argument to the point of simply being contrarian (as opposed to listening and rebutting)... which unfortunately is useless to me. Oh, well.

I'm reminded of the old Monty Python sketch where the guy wants to buy an argument. That always makes me laugh.

~ CB

[MacRumorsReader]

Professional? We get paid to be here?

:D

[Cleverboy]

Professional? We get paid to be here? :D Well, sure... uh, oh... Nevermind.

~ CB :D

[defeated]

I think its fair to assume most people are shopping around to get best deal rather than hang on the same tree, right?

Its fine apple has only one payment option, as long as users don't care (or they have no choice to care), but that doesn't mean other products' flexibility shouldn't be counted in as advantages, right?

Please laugh as you want, Im just putting myself on a buyer's position. Maybe that is funny, but I guess its better than spending more than necessary.

Professional? We get paid to be here?
for those large piece of posts, people should get paid for sure. :)

[MacRumorsReader]

I've seen this quesion asked a couple of times and the answer seems difficult to come by;

But I found yet another chart (http://applephones.blogspot.com/2007/05/apple-iphone-vs-helio-ocean.html).

Here are the size details from it;

Helio ocean:
Size: 4.33 x 2.20 x .86 inches
Wght: 159 grams (5.61 ounces)
Screen: 240 x 320, 260K colors (2.4 sq in)

Apple iPhone
Size: 4.5 x 2.4 x 0.46 inches
Wght: 135 grams (4.8 ounces)
Screen: 320 by 480 at 160 ppi (3.5 sq in)

edit: And Oh NOES!!!" the Ocean uses a :gasp: proprietary OS! <Insert random OS related question here>

[MacRumorsReader]

<snip>
For those large piece of posts, people should get paid for sure. :)

Wouldn't that be nice....

[ollie3856]

definitely agree on the 'wow' and 'must-have' nature of apple products, helio just doesnt quite get there, regardless of how great the device is, Apple has a knack for making their products 'covetable'. Not to mention the power that the apple brand has for future partnerships/new applications, and the fact that Helio is burning through hundreds of millions of dollars (last i heard, they burned through the near $450 million they received initially and had just secured another $200 million) and accounted for 97% of earthlink's Q1 losses. With the recent amp'd disaster, I 'd say their future is less than certain, whereas i'm totally confident that apple will continue to product better and better iPhone related products.

[defeated]

Wouldn't that be nice....

I m sure I would be encouraged :D, greatly.

And Oh NOES!!!" the Ocean uses a :gasp: proprietary OS!
not to dispute other statements you made, as of proprietary OS, iPhone's isn't exactly open neither.

[plumbingandtech]

I 'd say their future is less than certain

Yikes! That's for sure.

http://biz.yahoo.com/e/070507/elnk10-q.html

Maybe palm will buy them so they can lose money even faster.

[MacRumorsReader]

I m sure I would be encouraged :D, greatly.


not to dispute other statements you made, as of proprietary OS, iPhone's isn't exactly open neither.

Sorry, but you must have your sarcasm detector turned off.... :rolleyes:

That was my point.

I've read in a few places that the iPhone should be avoided because of OS X's closed environment.

But then, how are new apps place on the Ocean. Is there a SDK or something of the sort?

[MacRumorsReader]

Yikes! That's for sure.

http://biz.yahoo.com/e/070507/elnk10-q.html

Maybe palm will buy them so they can lose money even faster.
From the filing:


The increase in overall operating costs and expenses and net losses of HELIO caused overall profits to decrease during the three months ended March 31, 2007 compared to the prior period.


and

We also expect HELIO to incur additional losses in the remainder of 2007 due to the continuing start-up nature of its business. We record our proportionate share of HELIO's losses in our results of operations, so our results of operations in 2007 will also be adversely impacted because of HELIO's losses

[plumbingandtech]

From the filing:



and

ya.that's what i meant. (it was snark.)

[Cleverboy]

I think its fair to assume most people are shopping around to get best deal rather than hang on the same tree, right?Its fine apple has only one payment option, as long as users don't care (or they have no choice to care), but that doesn't mean other products' flexibility shouldn't be counted in as advantages, right?Let's try this. I'm going to AGREE with you. I'm going to say, YES... let's put Helio at an even LESS expensive mark.

If you read the title of this thread, you can see I'm asking about "perceived value". The fact that you can get Helio for even less only serves to underscore my damning question of WHY Apple is being seen as so much more appealing and valuable?

So, just so we're clear... I'm with you, Helio's cheaper. I was never arguing this. The only thing I was saying earlier with price, is attempting to offer a hypothetical argument as to why someone might dismiss it. If even that fails, the question remains... WHY BUY THE IPHONE? Make sense? I'm looking at my apathy towards the Helio Ocean objectively and wondering why companies like Helio make me raise my guard, and why Apple inspires such confidence.
Yikes! That's for sure.
http://biz.yahoo.com/e/070507/elnk10-q.html
Maybe palm will buy them so they can lose money even faster.See, I was pretty sure the economics weren't making any sense. They're really trying to just lock customers in and NOW make money LATER somehow. Sounds "expirimentish". As an MVNO network reseller, I had a distinct feeling they're being screwed on the back-end. Oh, that's a bad metaphor. Sorry.

~ CB

[defeated]

But then, how are new apps place on the Ocean. Is there a SDK or something of the sort?

If any of my posts in this topic makes you think Im a Helio expert, I offer my apology.

I'm with you, Helio's cheaper. I was never arguing this.

Thanks. Good to know. iPhone is better than Helio, for what I need. Like I said, I can't imagine myself buying a device w/o wi-fi.

[MacRumorsReader]

If any of my posts in this topic makes you think Im a Helio expert, I offer my apology.


What? Then I am going to have to ask MacRumors to not pay you for those posts then.

It was a generic question of sorts. I could pod around on "teh intraweb" and find the answer but I don't ... what's the word... Oh yeah "care", that much.

:):D

[plumbingandtech]

See, I was pretty sure the economics weren't making any sense. They're really trying to just lock customers in and NOW make money LATER somehow. Sounds "expirimentish". As an MVNO network reseller, I had a distinct feeling they're being screwed on the back-end. Oh, that's a bad metaphor. Sorry.

My prediction is that Earthlink etc. will turn off the spigot within 2 or 3 quarters... then Helio will announce another round of investment by some 3rd party that is barely into mobile or even a VC firm.

Then it will get even worse as Apple will have a cheaper iphone out soon after that (summer '08) and or a iphone with just the ipod/phone/ and texting.. (for 249$?)

[Cleverboy]

My prediction is that Earthlink etc. will turn off the spigot within 2 or 3 quarters... then Helio will announce another round of investment by some 3rd party that is barely into mobile or even a VC firm.

Then it will get even worse as Apple will have a cheaper iphone out soon after that (summer '08) and or a iphone with just the ipod/phone/ and texting.. (for 249$?)I see their content licensing deals drying up, and possibly less than desireable rates being given to existing customers as their contracts run out, and new customers getting the "good" rates unde the heading "cost of acquisition". If see the "churn" at Helio becoming utterly untenable as their customers are "poached" by offerings from Verizon, their data partner (with newer, focused, more feature packed phones on the same network). As it stands, existing Helio service members appear to have to pay $415 for the device, while its new activations that pay $295.

I think it was a nice idea. Yeah, you hear "post mortem" in my "voice". I don't think Helio has much of a future. If they were truly innovative, maybe... but its the same old phone... just with "more". If this strategy had them on some clear path towards profitability, and the buzz was glorious... that'd be hopeful... but the buzz is just SO MUTED.

Here's something interesting... Digg article:
http://digg.com/hardware/Unboxing_of_the_Helio_Ocean
In the comments at the bottom, two interesting ones:
DO NOT GET A HELIO!! THEY ARE PIRATES!!!! They're "Guarantee" is completely bollocks! I 10000% guarantee that if you aren't quite satisfied with their phone/service you will get absolutely NOTHING back, you will get an endless array of "customer service" sidesquidges, back-bumpers and all-around please-call-back-again-so-we-can-again-tell-you -to-sod-off routine! They'll gladly receive your returned phone (they acknowledge that proudly) and will promptly NEVER give you a refund for said instrument and or attached services of any kind whatsoever.[--SNIP--][--SNIP--]I ordered Helio's Ocean and have been using it for about 4 days now and I gotta tell you, its a good phone but there are issues. Hopefully they can tweak the software and fine tune the users experience. The phone has a simple interface UNTILL you use the web browser. It is beyond confusing as to how to get to some of their touted features. The browser needs better forward and back page buttons. It has a back button but needs a forward. The video stream link section forces you to scroll through pages of video clips you are not even interested in just to get to the ones you want. It would be nice if they grouped the videos by show names first and then list each episode. The main web page isn't customizable so you cant just quick pick the sites you use daily. You are forced to save them through a bookmark listing in a menu. Very annoying considering how much clicking it takes to navigate web pages.[--SNIP--]I Googled "helio ocean refunds", and the Digg article came up first, then this one:
http://www.slashgear.com/helio-ocean-264476.php
In the comments area:
1) The Helio Ocean goes black at random times and just shuts down. This happened to mine the second day I had it. I called them and this is a known problem, even though they don’t tell people.
2) I tried to return it, but their customer service is complete crap. They refuse to take my belt pouch back and give me a refund for it. They want to charge me for the minutes I used on the phone during the two days before I found out that their phone is a piece of crap — oh yea, that’s right, don’t call it a phone, call it a piece of crap.LOL I just got the Ocean about two weeks ago and it is perfect! The only problem is that it won’t download free videos. I am guessing this is for legal reasons, since I have not seen this phone having problems downloading even relatively large files (let’s say 4000 KB), such as a Youtube video from their Video Viral service or from the Helio Store. Does anyone know for sure why this is?There are some other more positive comments in there too, and one by user "Tiger168", who has some interesting comments about the iPhone and the politics of where all of this is headed. Also, I liked this comment about Helio's "target market" :) :
Nadia, Helio isn’t going after the GSM market. I agree with Dustin, the Ocean is marketed towards rich kids with more money than god. If you’re going to complain about about the Ocean not working outside of the US, you can pretty much bitch about all the handsets offered by Sprint and Verizon.I checked out one more review before calling it quits. This one, by Yahoo:
http://tech.yahoo.com/blog/patterson/1442
I jumped to the web browser section, and caught this chilling comment: "Also, the browser struggled to render full HTML pages correctly; it couldn't display the Yahoo! front page at all, and the IMDB front page looked jumbled (Nokia's Web browser breezed through those tests). Still, I'll take the Ocean's browser over almost any other mobile browser out there, including the Sidekick's."

It "struggles" to render HTML??? And that's a *winning* browser? Yikes. Why is this acceptable...? --then the reviewer says "I'll take the Ocean's browser over almost any other mobile browser out there"! Did they change reviewers in mid-paragraph or something? I just jumped to Yahoo on my iPhone and I lost 3 minutes becoming engrossed in the content, forgetting I was testing anything. To be fair... this review was in May, so I checked to see if the same reviewer "Ben Patterson", also tried the iPhone browser. Ah... I see it. His unequivocal statement (http://tech.yahoo.com/blogs/patterson/2857)... "the mobile Safari Web browser puts every other phone browser (including even Nokia's) to shame" in an article titled, "Apple iPhone: Why I Bought One". :rolleyes: It sounds as if he's straddling an iPhone and a Treo at the same time, too. Interesting.

~ CB

[plumbingandtech]

Whoah.

Your post should be req'd reading for possible helio buyers.

There is a Helio store at my local mall. Kinda sad. Empty all the time....

(oh and i was lined up in front of them all day during i-Day. They passed out Jane magazines and free water or some such... they ALL had a look of resignation to them. I bet a few of them already sent their resume to the apple store a few doors down.)

I know that not everyone is happy with ATT (i'm fine) but one thing to keep in mind is that they are not going anywhere. Something else to keep in mind when choosing a provider.

[beate]

Ask anyone who really loves their iPhone and I would almost guarantee you that there is an emotional almost visceral attachment to it.


Wow - keen observation - visceral - that about covers it for me.

[ekpil2000]

I am.
The deciding factor for me was gps because knowing where I am immediately is that important to me.
I like the slide out keypad more than iphone's virtual keypad.
I like iphone's big beautiful screen and its simple double touch zoom interface.
There is no doubt in my mind that either device would have served me well.
I have had a bad history with at&t and was looking forward to switching to verizon, when fate seemed to conspire. I met some people with helio and was informed coverage was very good, and I had the opportunity to look over helio's phones. I personally find both phones aesthetically pleasing, though I have to give the nod again to the iphone. A replaceable battery is an important feature to me that I felt was worth mentioning again here. Helio is trying to capitalize on the, mostly warranted, hype surrounding the iphone. I don't much care for that kind of tactic but I can hardly blame them.

I think both of these devices challenge the market in their own ways. I like the dual slider and I like the touch screen interface. I hope to one day own a device that posses the best of each. But what we see from both these devices is a glimpse of the future that they are unfolding before us. And I for one and excited to see what further development will follow.

[Karpfish]

Nahh.. Since its 500-600 bucks and something like this has not seen before, teenagers, are not the first demo group for this and to me are not the first type of person that comes to mind when i think of the iphone.

In fact the ocean reminds me what a teenager would pull out of their pocket as the sidekick has become very very popular among the teenybopper crowd.

the iphone speaks of people with taste, who want the best, who do not want to settle...
So not true. Pretty much any teenager would want one of these, but money and current provider are the 2 big issues.

[mcdj]

I had no idea Fisher-Price was making such sophisticated phones. The last one I had from them in the '70s had a pop-up clown.

[ekpil2000]

Whoah.

Your post should be req'd reading for possible helio buyers.

There is a Helio store at my local mall. Kinda sad. Empty all the time....

(oh and i was lined up in front of them all day during i-Day. They passed out Jane magazines and free water or some such... they ALL had a look of resignation to them. I bet a few of them already sent their resume to the apple store a few doors down.)

I know that not everyone is happy with ATT (i'm fine) but one thing to keep in mind is that they are not going anywhere. Something else to keep in mind when choosing a provider.

AT&T wireless has folded once already taken over by cingular. I still have one of their phones running on that old network which I am in the process of replacing . My experience with AT&T has been a sad one indeed.

[BWhaler]

Have you ever used one?

They are cheap pieces of plastic.

Oh, and the ability to seemless tie to your music, videos, etc., is a joke.

And dont even get me started on battery life.

[jonsnetwork]

Ask anyone who really loves their iPhone and I would almost guarantee you that there is an emotional almost visceral attachment to it.


This is so so true. I just posted along these lines. Thanks for the great thread.

http://jonsnetwork.com/2007/07/my-preciousssss-iphone/

[Sobe]

http://www.popgadget.net/2007/07/solve_this_sms.php

Shows you how smart the iPhone truly is!

Now we just need a setting to stop it from sending messages to Treos =D

[AJsAWiz]

I am.
The deciding factor for me was gps because knowing where I am immediately is that important to me.
I like the slide out keypad more than iphone's virtual keypad.
I like iphone's big beautiful screen and its simple double touch zoom interface.
There is no doubt in my mind that either device would have served me well.
I have had a bad history with at&t and was looking forward to switching to verizon, when fate seemed to conspire. I met some people with helio and was informed coverage was very good, and I had the opportunity to look over helio's phones. I personally find both phones aesthetically pleasing, though I have to give the nod again to the iphone. A replaceable battery is an important feature to me that I felt was worth mentioning again here. Helio is trying to capitalize on the, mostly warranted, hype surrounding the iphone. I don't much care for that kind of tactic but I can hardly blame them.

I think both of these devices challenge the market in their own ways. I like the dual slider and I like the touch screen interface. I hope to one day own a device that posses the best of each. But what we see from both these devices is a glimpse of the future that they are unfolding before us. And I for one and excited to see what further development will follow.

Good luck to ya! ;)

[rubeeen]

Reviewing Helio's website and looking around the net, we can start
seeing the possibly serious downsides in my book:

MVNO if you want out early, you'll need to get another Helio phone that does even less. Uses Sprint for voice and Verizon for data, but can change these things and manage them as business needs see fit (the recent YouTube cur-fuffle was somewhat telling (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/exclusive/helio-fights-apple-with-official-youtube-over-3g-and-the-genius-of-the-iphones-25gwifi-271109.php)).
Battery - With 3G, etc, etc... the talk time is only 5 hours vs iPhone's 8 hours. Start browsing the net, and who knows.
3G can be switched to 1X to conserve battery life, in fact on my next charge i will turn it off when not needed to see what kind of a difference it does make on the battery. ill be back to report
240x320 screen, much smaller than the iPhone's 480x320
touche
NOT touchscreen, buttons all the way, baby!
yea! smudges rock!
Default 200MB, whoopee! That's like 40 songs or a 10 minute movie... sweet! NOTE: I heard that its supposedly 512MB (though the spec says otherwise), but in any case, I love how its ambiguous with many of these phones.
this is kinda pointless since its 2gb micro sd card can be changed up
Maxes out at 2GB at a time, even though it features removeable memory
yep, bought my stick for 7.95 :]
No WiFi, but unlimited 3G. That counts right? Who needs local networking?
eh, i got my laptop if i need wifi
Nice and thick, like 2 packs of cards glued together and busting the seems in your pants pocket, unless you're slick and dapper, sporting your cargo pants.
more like a pack and a 1/4
Does NOT sync your calendar OR your contact to Outlook.
it DOES sync with mircosoft exchange now
Only to Helio's website (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/step_by_step/how-to-sync-your-contacts-with-the-ocean-259518.php), which you can upload information to in CSV format. Yikes! NO THANKS!
Still no Flash support. Does YouTube through 3GP, and only recently stopped blocking customers from accessing it after paying up.
i wasnt aware the iphone could play flash? [not being sarcastic]
AccuWeather - $3.99/mo. paying FOR THE WEATHER. That's not cool.
why would i pay 3.99/mo if i can go to weather.com?
Personal Organizer, Meh - Gizmodo writes (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/review/helio-ocean-feature+by+feature-review-259545.php) "Nobody wants to maintain two different calendars with their schedules on it. There's also no task list, so if you wanted to use this phone as an organizer, it'd be kind of a stretch."
Browser Zoom, nice try (http://www.smartdevicecentral.com/slide/Helio+Ocean/207110_207559_20_0.aspx), but its NO iPhone
not going to lie, i like the zoom on the iphone WAY better
Buy music tracks over the air at $1.99 a pop. Nice, huh? No? What's wrong?
buy music? LOL!
Coverflow? Where for art thou?
probably the most useless thing ever, but pretty to look at.
Supports Yahoo Music and a couple of other DRM formats. No iTunes though (understandably).
Web browser ALWAYS starts in Google "mobilizer" mode, chopping full HTML down to mobile sizes. You can choose "full HTML" but it stays only for the rest of that session. Give that "mobilized" content is the default, it gives you an idea of how inconvenient full-HTML browsing is on the Helio compared to the iPhone. AS shown in this Gizmodo video on YouTube, it looks like Craig's list full-html becomes a nightmare (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlt6P_IENjY). Imagine telling the browser to jump from control to control, section to section with no screen tapping. Click-click-click-click-click-click-click-click... almost there!
again, something that should be improved. but the mini-map helps a lot.
No specific podcast support.
useless to me, i have an ipod if thats ever needed
Ah, yes... NO MAC Sync SUPPORT. (feel free to Bluetooth though)


i will add, that getting to my contacts is WAY easier on my helio than on the iphone. i jsut have to type the name from the home screen and it will bring them up as i type.

i also have aim and yahoo to play with at work when i get bored.

just a couple things id like to put in. kna mean?

i like the iphone, but for everything BUT the phone lol.
i think ill wait till the new ipod comes rolling around which im predicting will be same touchscreen device w/ wifi for much less than 600 dollars.

speaking of money
no one i know has bought their helio ocean for the 295 list price. in fact most people got it for under $200. in fact i read that on slickdeals.net theyve got it for 147 and 10 bucks off your bill for the first year. chunky!

and you cant beat the plans with the iphone.

i think helio swallows the iphone when it comes to its actual use, and thats A PHONE!

for 65 bucks, you get unlimited data, text, picture, video messaging and 500 mins + free nights and weekends.

believe me im a huge mac fan in a geek closet, but some people put things way too high up on their envy list.

[rubeeen]

Reviewing Helio's website and looking around the net, we can start
seeing the possibly serious downsides in my book:

MVNO if you want out early, you'll need to get another Helio phone that does even less. Uses Sprint for voice and Verizon for data, but can change these things and manage them as business needs see fit (the recent YouTube cur-fuffle was somewhat telling (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/exclusive/helio-fights-apple-with-official-youtube-over-3g-and-the-genius-of-the-iphones-25gwifi-271109.php)).
Battery - With 3G, etc, etc... the talk time is only 5 hours vs iPhone's 8 hours. Start browsing the net, and who knows.
3G can be switched to 1X to conserve battery life, in fact on my next charge i will turn it off when not needed to see what kind of a difference it does make on the battery. ill be back to report
240x320 screen, much smaller than the iPhone's 480x320
touche
NOT touchscreen, buttons all the way, baby!
yea! smudges rock!
Default 200MB, whoopee! That's like 40 songs or a 10 minute movie... sweet! NOTE: I heard that its supposedly 512MB (though the spec says otherwise), but in any case, I love how its ambiguous with many of these phones.
this is kinda pointless since its 2gb micro sd card can be changed up
Maxes out at 2GB at a time, even though it features removeable memory
yep, bought my stick for 7.95 :]
No WiFi, but unlimited 3G. That counts right? Who needs local networking?
eh, i got my laptop if i need wifi
Nice and thick, like 2 packs of cards glued together and busting the seems in your pants pocket, unless you're slick and dapper, sporting your cargo pants.
more like a pack and a 1/4
Does NOT sync your calendar OR your contact to Outlook.
it DOES sync with mircosoft exchange now
Only to Helio's website (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/step_by_step/how-to-sync-your-contacts-with-the-ocean-259518.php), which you can upload information to in CSV format. Yikes! NO THANKS!
Still no Flash support. Does YouTube through 3GP, and only recently stopped blocking customers from accessing it after paying up.
i wasnt aware the iphone could play flash? [not being sarcastic]
AccuWeather - $3.99/mo. paying FOR THE WEATHER. That's not cool.
why would i pay 3.99/mo if i can go to weather.com?
Personal Organizer, Meh - Gizmodo writes (http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/review/helio-ocean-feature+by+feature-review-259545.php) "Nobody wants to maintain two different calendars with their schedules on it. There's also no task list, so if you wanted to use this phone as an organizer, it'd be kind of a stretch."
Browser Zoom, nice try (http://www.smartdevicecentral.com/slide/Helio+Ocean/207110_207559_20_0.aspx), but its NO iPhone
not going to lie, i like the zoom on the iphone WAY better
Buy music tracks over the air at $1.99 a pop. Nice, huh? No? What's wrong?
buy music? LOL!
Coverflow? Where for art thou?
probably the most useless thing ever, but pretty to look at.
Supports Yahoo Music and a couple of other DRM formats. No iTunes though (understandably).
Web browser ALWAYS starts in Google "mobilizer" mode, chopping full HTML down to mobile sizes. You can choose "full HTML" but it stays only for the rest of that session. Give that "mobilized" content is the default, it gives you an idea of how inconvenient full-HTML browsing is on the Helio compared to the iPhone. AS shown in this Gizmodo video on YouTube, it looks like Craig's list full-html becomes a nightmare (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlt6P_IENjY). Imagine telling the browser to jump from control to control, section to section with no screen tapping. Click-click-click-click-click-click-click-click... almost there!
again, something that should be improved. but the mini-map helps a lot.
No specific podcast support.
useless to me, i have an ipod if thats ever needed
Ah, yes... NO MAC Sync SUPPORT. (feel free to Bluetooth though)


i will add, that getting to my contacts is WAY easier on my helio than on the iphone. i jsut have to type the name from the home screen and it will bring them up as i type.

i also have aim and yahoo to play with at work when i get bored.

just a couple things id like to put in. kna mean?

i like the iphone, but for everything BUT the phone lol.
i think ill wait till the new ipod comes rolling around which im predicting will be same touchscreen device w/ wifi for much less than 600 dollars.

speaking of money
no one i know has bought their helio ocean for the 295 list price. in fact most people got it for under $200. in fact i read that on slickdeals.net theyve got it for 147 and 10 bucks off your bill for the first year. chunky!

and you cant beat the plans with the iphone.

i think helio swallows the iphone when it comes to its actual use, and thats A PHONE!

for 65 bucks, you get unlimited data, text, picture, video messaging and 500 mins + free nights and weekends.

believe me im a huge mac fan in a geek closet, but some people put things way too high up on their envy list. :apple:

oh and p.s: about the wow factor, i had 2 reps at apple ask to see my phone while compairing.

[subl1me]

i will add, that getting to my contacts is WAY easier on my helio than on the iphone. i jsut have to type the name from the home screen and it will bring them up as i type.

Hey, I can access any one of my contacts with one, maybe two, taps of my thumb and possibly a quick swipe of my thumb, for at most 3 input actions. I think it's much easier on the iPhone, if not equally easy.



i think helio swallows the iphone when it comes to its actual use, and thats A PHONE!

What a silly comparison. The actual use of the phone function of both phones are EXACTLY the same. You either pick a contact and call, or you punch 10 digits and call. I fail to see how either one could swallow each other in that respect.



oh and p.s: about the wow factor, i had 2 reps at apple ask to see my phone while compairing.

Asking to see another persons phone does not automatically imply they are WOW'd by it. I think you might be a little full of yourself here. If I knew you had an Ocean, I'd ask to see it too, but only to verify the ugliness and clunkiness that I've been seeing in photos on Engadget and here on MR.

[rubeeen]

Hey, I can access any one of my contacts with one, maybe two, taps of my thumb and possibly a quick swipe of my thumb, for at most 3 input actions. I think it's much easier on the iPhone, if not equally easy.



What a silly comparison. The actual use of the phone function of both phones are EXACTLY the same. You either pick a contact and call, or you punch 10 digits and call. I fail to see how either one could swallow each other in that respect.



Asking to see another persons phone does not automatically imply they are WOW'd by it. I think you might be a little full of yourself here. If I knew you had an Ocean, I'd ask to see it too, but only to verify the ugliness and clunkiness that I've been seeing in photos on Engadget and here on MR.

i guess thats a preference issue. but adding contacts is way easier on the ocean.

call quality is garbage on the iphone. nothing like gsm buzz to wake you in the mornin.

how am i full of myself? plenty of people ask to see my phone. and being as its the first dual slider EVER, i think you can give it some kind of credit :rolleyes:

ugliness and clunkiness? lol, at least i can drop it without having to worry about how im going to afford another.

another + for the ocean, insurance is avail.

im not here to prove that the ocean is better, im here to state facts about the ocean that people use in comparison. if youre going to compare things, at least get it right. am i wrong?

i think YOU sir, are full of it. but i guess thats expected if you paid 600 bucks for an uber sensitive phone :P

[bousozoku]

I wonder why you would buy either phone.

The iPhone is clearly not finished but if you have to be noticed, I suppose that's a reason. The Ocean looks like an expensive version of the Virgin Switchback (half the price) but does have EV-DO performance and it doesn't take long to see how much faster that is compared to EDGE.

For $299 (or $199, as I saw discounted), I'd rather have a nicer built, nicer looking phone.

[Vladimer]

The thing that sold me the most when I read up and found all of the missing features was this:

Free Software/Firmware Updates

I mean seriously.

[infamous]

hah... clevergirl