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MacRumors
Jul 26, 2003, 10:37 PM
Inforworld (http://www.infoworld.com/article/03/07/25/29OPcurve_1.html) takes a tour of the Fishkill plant, but notes:

Our tour guide confided that the PowerPC 970 chip (Apple’s G5) is not yet in production in Fishkill, but it takes no time at all to get a new chip into the line.

The Fishkill plant was touted as the location for production of the PowerPC 970's. While the article was published on July 25th, 2003 -- it's uclear when the "tour" was given.



applemacdude
Jul 26, 2003, 10:39 PM
How the how is it not in production? What about all the g5's with the 970's in macworld? Does this mean that they could start whenever they want? If they havn't why not?

arn
Jul 26, 2003, 10:40 PM
well, this is on page2 cause it's of uncertain significance.

Who knows when the tour was given.

I wouldn't read too much into this. PowerMac G5's will likely arrive as advertised.

arn

EponymousCow
Jul 26, 2003, 10:54 PM
Remember that one 300mm wafer produces about 100 PPC970 chips. So production may not have made it out of the R&D labs yet. A starter run of 100 wafers would produce 10,000 chips, which would provide Apple enough to get their production lines going. Once the Fishkill plant starts cranking them out, they can probably produce 3 months worth of chips for Apple in less than a week.

Supply on the PowerMac G5s might be tight until production ramps up at Fishkill, but once Fishkill gets moving, the bottleneck will be Apple's production lines (which I think are in Sacramento).

JtheLemur
Jul 26, 2003, 11:06 PM
Yes, but isn't it true that even though a wafer may yield about 100 physical processors, only 50-75 of them are actually good enough to make it into machines?

EponymousCow
Jul 26, 2003, 11:16 PM
Originally posted by JtheLemur
Yes, but isn't it true that even though a wafer may yield about 100 physical processors, only 50-75 of them are actually good enough to make it into machines?

*SHRUG* Who knows what IBM's yields are. But even with a 50% yield, that means 200 wafers for 10,000 processors. I still think it is reasonable to think that the inital processors may have already been made in a facility other than Fishkill.

It is also possible that the early 970 processors will be made on 200mm wafers at another facility. In that case, they are only going to get about 40 processors per wafer (best case), but that is probably still OK for fulfilling initial demand from Apple.

Freg3000
Jul 26, 2003, 11:21 PM
And remember that Steve what playing around with one of those wafers at WWDC, showing everyone what "they make G5s on." I don't think they are not in production.

Arn, do you know how long Fishkill has been open and operational? If it was only opened recently I might have more doubts as there would not have been much more time for a tour.

Then again, if you can just start producing the chips whenever you want, it might not be such a big deal.

bennetsaysargh
Jul 26, 2003, 11:39 PM
i never thought about taking a tour there. maybe i should go one day. take a 970 wafer or 2;)

i am curious as to know when the tour was.

vannote
Jul 27, 2003, 12:10 AM
Originally posted by EponymousCow
the bottleneck will be Apple's production lines (which I think are in Sacramento).

I could be wrong, but I was under the impression that Apple assembled out of Taiwan. Thats exactly where my last PowerBook shipped out of about a year ago. Or am I mistaken and only certain models are assembled there?

WM.
Jul 27, 2003, 12:55 AM
Originally posted by EponymousCow
Supply on the PowerMac G5s might be tight until production ramps up at Fishkill, but once Fishkill gets moving, the bottleneck will be Apple's production lines (which I think are in Sacramento).
I think they used to be, but IIRC there was a ThinkSecret article a while back about all these layoffs in Sacramento, and in any case I don't think they were making Power Macs there. At this point I think almost all Apple hardware is made in Taiwan, as vannote says. (My Pro Mouse was made in Malaysia, though...)

HTH
WM

iJon
Jul 27, 2003, 02:33 AM
Originally posted by WM.
I think they used to be, but IIRC there was a ThinkSecret article a while back about all these layoffs in Sacramento, and in any case I don't think they were making Power Macs there. At this point I think almost all Apple hardware is made in Taiwan, as vannote says. (My Pro Mouse was made in Malaysia, though...)

HTH
WM
laptops are, i believe the powermacs are made in cupertino, and the old imacs were made in mexico.

iJon

GregGomer
Jul 27, 2003, 02:46 AM
I got the impression from the quote that they were saying the 970 weren't being produced in that facility yet. Doesn't mean that they couldn't be, nor does it mean that aren't being produced in a different or older facility.

I agree with Arn and the others though, not really significant, could just be bum info. Either way, not too significant, as either way we still have G5s, I don't care where they are made, as long as they are here.

Greg

Niknar
Jul 27, 2003, 06:25 AM
Originally posted by WM.
I think they used to be, but IIRC there was a ThinkSecret article a while back about all these layoffs in Sacramento, and in any case I don't think they were making Power Macs there. At this point I think almost all Apple hardware is made in Taiwan, as vannote says. (My Pro Mouse was made in Malaysia, though...)

HTH
WM

My Pro Mouse was assembled in China, my Pro Keyboard in Malaysia, my iMac in Taiwan, my iBook in Taiwan.

So they assembled them in alot of places.

BigJayhawk
Jul 27, 2003, 09:05 AM
More than likely, Apple goes through a bid process whenever they are starting a new product line (similar to anyone else that doesn't OWN their own facilities). So, depending on where the bids come in from, the products could probably be made in my garage like the first Mac Product bid winners. heh;)

BigJayhawk
Jul 27, 2003, 09:07 AM
I meant to say "a garage" not "my garage." Last I checked MY net worth the word BILLIONS was nowhere to be found. :(

caveman_uk
Jul 27, 2003, 10:58 AM
Originally posted by iJon
laptops are, i believe the powermacs are made in cupertino, and the old imacs were made in mexico.

iJon
I think it depends for powermacs. My Dualie PM G4 was assembled in Ireland. I think Apple has centralised production for laptops as the big laptop manufacturers are all in Taiwan. The PM I think is assembled by Apple itself - this is just a guess, I may be wrong but Apple's Euro presence is in Ireland...I always get to speak to nice Irish girls when I call;)

wirewyrm
Jul 27, 2003, 12:00 PM
The PowerMacs are indeed built in Ireland. The plant itself is in Cork. This information is probably entirely correct, as the G5 has not entered full scale production. All of the G5's seen at Macworld were hand built pre-production machines, though most were built to production spec. At the moment the plant is just beginning to run out the first machines, while more machinery and tools specific to G5 production is moved in and fitted and the parts are awaiting delivery. Full scale production of the PowerMac G5 is expected to begin at the Cork plant during the first or second week of August, plenty of time to fulfill those orders.

So it is entirely possible that the 970's have not entered production proper either!!

EponymousCow
Jul 27, 2003, 02:26 PM
IIRC, PowerMacs and XServes are built in both Sacramento and Cork. Apple still has plenty of "Inventory Control Coordinator" and "Inventory/Operations Analyst" and "Material Processor A" type jobs available in Sacramento that make me think they are still doing manufacturing there.

In fact, Material Processor A "May require operation of some machinery (robots)."

Powerbooks, iBooks, iMacs, eMacs, iPods, keyboards and mice are contract manufactured in Asia.

vulturecentral
Jul 28, 2003, 01:42 AM
It's quite simple. The 970 won't go into production until early-mid August. IBM will ship to Apple in time for a late August ship date for the Power Macs - with some configurations sliding into September, I reckon.

Remember, just because Apple launches a machine *doesn't* mean it can ship one. The 970 in early G5s were pre-production samples - which is why Apple hasn't let anyone fully review a G5 yet.

IBM is following the schedule it laid down at Microprocessor Forum last October. Nothing has changed just because Apple has launched hardware based on the chip.

whooleytoo
Jul 28, 2003, 05:52 AM
Originally posted by caveman_uk
I think it depends for powermacs. My Dualie PM G4 was assembled in Ireland. I think Apple has centralised production for laptops as the big laptop manufacturers are all in Taiwan. The PM I think is assembled by Apple itself - this is just a guess, I may be wrong but Apple's Euro presence is in Ireland...I always get to speak to nice Irish girls when I call;)

Originally, both the PCB manufacture (logic boards) and assembly were done in Cork for the European market, and Sacramento (I think) for the US, but since the PCB manufacture has been moved to the Pacific Rim for cost savings, plus some of the laptop assembly.

Currently, I think all Euro desktops (and possibly some of the laptops, I'm not sure) are assembled in Cork, which also now has the Euro store and support call centre, systems test (testing pre-release h/w and s/w) plus some localisation and other functions.

Oh, and trust me, the call centre girls look even better than they sound!! :-)