Mac OS X Leopard 9a499 Visual Enhancements

[pengu]

Please, get real! You obviously don't get it!

Try working in a corporation using servers with a lot of files and folders. When using my home computer surfing the internet I don't need a pathbar, but when I use my Mac at work with coworkers! How do you tell someone where the file is on the server? You give them the path! (ex: Volumes/Client/2007/Project/Profile/Fonts/Helvetica Naue/ttf/ or ftp://username:password@mycomputer/theFolder) How do you get the path? On OS X you have to use automator actions or other apps. In windows you can copy/paste/write in the pathbar just like you can in Explorer/Safari/Firefox 's pathbar. Why should the filebrowser be any different? Can you imagine how annoying it would be to send a link to an image on the internet to a friend if you had to write the whole link every time?

Shift-Command-G.

[swingerofbirch]

I wonder if one could make a desktop image that would really take advantage of the 3D dock and add some realism to it. I am not a Photoshop master--I don't even have Photoshop--but I could imagine bending an image in such a way that it extends into the display the distance that the 3d dock goes in. If you imagine a breakfast tray for instance being held in front of you for example. Does this make sense to anyone?

[Wayfarer]

I'm getting fed-up with some of you nitpickers... :mad:

October isn't too far away, guys.

I wonder if one could make a desktop image that would really take advantage of the 3D dock and add some realism to it. I am not a Photoshop master--I don't even have Photoshop--but I could imagine bending an image in such a way that it extends into the display the distance that the 3d dock goes in. If you imagine a breakfast tray for instance being held in front of you for example. Does this make sense to anyone?

It makes sense to me. I'm sure that'll look very interesting. :)

[sneed]

Please, get real! You obviously don't get it!

Try working in a corporation using servers with a lot of files and folders. When using my home computer surfing the internet I don't need a pathbar, but when I use my Mac at work with coworkers! How do you tell someone where the file is on the server? You give them the path! (ex: Volumes/Client/2007/Project/Profile/Fonts/Helvetica Naue/ttf/ or ftp://username:password@mycomputer/theFolder) How do you get the path? On OS X you have to use automator actions or other apps. In windows you can copy/paste/write in the pathbar just like you can in Explorer/Safari/Firefox 's pathbar. Why should the filebrowser be any different? Can you imagine how annoying it would be to send a link to an image on the internet to a friend if you had to write the whole link every time?

I find it a little irritating when people, wanting certain functions, claim that their desired addition is important because they are pro users, and anyone who sees differently is just using their computer for surfing the web and email. I am a pro user and I find the simplicity of the mac interface appealing in that it allows me to easily choose/create my own processes rather than be limited by the OS designers' vision and/or compromises.

Considering that I don't have to send paths very often, I find a location bar ala windows a waste of valuable real estate, and even if I did send paths often, a location bar is a complete waste of time if I had to send it to anyone on a different platform. I could alter it to make it friendly to their platform, but we're talking about ease of use, right? If I found myself having to send paths a lot, I could dash out a quick applescript droplet that, put in the toolbar, could give me the path of any file in whatever format I needed it. 5-10 minutes, and I'd have a no cost, drag and drop solution that suit my needs perfectly without taking up a lot of space.

I am hoping that the pathbar in leopard can be disabled. I have little issue finding files as it is.

[macintel4me]

Shift-Command-G.

Yes, but you can NOT copy the selected path.

[F/reW/re]

I find it a little irritating when people, wanting certain functions, claim that their desired addition is important because they are pro users, and anyone who sees differently is just using their computer for surfing the web and email. I am a pro user and I find the simplicity of the mac interface appealing in that it allows me to easily choose/create my own processes rather than be limited by the OS designers' vision and/or compromises.
I never said that people not using a pathbar cant be a pro user. I'm talking about myself.

Considering that I don't have to send paths very often, I find a location bar ala windows a waste of valuable real estate,

I guess that's why you can choose to show/hide it as you want in Windows.

and even if I did send paths often, a location bar is a complete waste of time if I had to send it to anyone on a different platform. I could alter it to make it friendly to their platform, but we're talking about ease of use, right?
So how would you explain to a friend where to find something on the server? The default OS X way seems to me like a pretty decent way to do if no mather what platform your using. When I comes to ease of use, I find it much easier to have one pathbar that can paste/copy/goto just like in any browser, than having a pathbar at the bottom of the window, a different goToWindow and an Applescript for copying the path. Everyone who can use Safari with the pathbar there shouldn't have any problems doing so in Finder.

If I found myself having to send paths a lot, I could dash out a quick applescript droplet that, put in the toolbar, could give me the path of any file in whatever format I needed it.

If you read my posts you've read that I do use an AutomatorAction/Applescript to do this myself.

I am hoping that the pathbar in leopard can be disabled. I have little issue finding files as it is.
I'm glad Apple finally included a pathbar in Finder. A show/hide function would be nice.

[macintel4me]

I'm glad Apple finally included a pathbar in Finder. A show/hide function would be nice.
Yep, the pathbar show/hide function is there. It's under the View menu.

[F/reW/re]

Yep, the pathbar show/hide function is there. It's under the View menu.
Can you interact with it in any way? Can you click your way back in the breadcrumb?
Can the pathbar be visible in column-view?

[iJawn108]

So does Leopard Server not have the clear menu?

[macintel4me]

Can you interact with it in any way? Can you click your way back in the breadcrumb?
Can the pathbar be visible in column-view?
Interactions I have found so far...

1) Click on a Path Bar item : nothing...not even selecting it

2) Double-click on a Path Bar item (except for the last one) : goes to the folder in the current Finder window

3) Drop (no drag) : you can drag a file from a Finder window unto the item to move or copy that file

4) Right-mouse click on a Path Bar item : you get a context menu with items; Open, Open Enclosing Folder and Get Info

No way to copy the path to text without using Automator.

You can see the Path Bar in any view including column view

[Frisco]

Interactions I have found so far...

1) Click on a Path Bar item : nothing...not even selecting it

2) Double-click on a Path Bar item (except for the last one) : goes to the folder in the current Finder window

3) Drop (no drag) : you can drag a file from a Finder window unto the item to move or copy that file

No way to copy the path to text without using Automator.

You can see the Path Bar in any view including column view

Then the Pathbar is pretty useless.

[macintel4me]

Then the Pathbar is pretty useless.
As it stands right now in the latest Leopard beta build I agree, that the Path Bar isn't worth much.

[mkrishnan]

As it stands right now in the latest Leopard beta build I agree, that the Path Bar isn't worth much.

Can you still drag the path out of the *top* of the window like you can in Panther and Tiger?

[xUKHCx]

3) Drop (no drag) : you can drag a file from a Finder window unto the item to move or copy that file

Does this mean it is not spring loaded, i.e if you drag a file over a folder and hover it will open (i am assuming no hence your addition of no drag but just want clarification).

[macintel4me]

Can you still drag the path out of the *top* of the window like you can in Panther and Tiger?
I haven't used Panther or Tiger before, but yes, you can drag the path out of the *top" of the window.

[macintel4me]

Does this mean it is not spring loaded, i.e if you drag a file over a folder and hover it will open (i am assuming no hence your addition of no drag but just want clarification).
It is NOT spring loaded. However, I said "no drag" because you cannot drag a Path Bar item and drop it somewhere.

[zioxide]

I really hope their is an option to turn off that damn transparent menubar. It's so ugly.

Anyone who thinks otherwise is blinded by the RDF.

[pad07]

Does anyone know if Leopard is keeping the Aqua scrollbars or going for the iTunes 7 ones?

[izzle22]

I really hope their is an option to turn off that damn transparent menubar. It's so ugly.

Anyone who thinks otherwise is blinded by the RDF.

What's so ugly about it??? It's the same as the one in Tiger but a little transparent. Really not that big of a deal to me.

[mkrishnan]

I haven't used Panther or Tiger before, but yes, you can drag the path out of the *top" of the window.

Erm, okay, I'll just pass on the snide comments, but you've never used any Mac operating system *except* Leopard? :eek:

[zioxide]

What's so ugly about it??? It's the same as the one in Tiger but a little transparent. Really not that big of a deal to me.

http://bayimg.com/PAelBAabM

Look at that screenshot. The menubar looks so out of place and completely clashes with everything. It's just awful.

[macintel4me]

Erm, okay, I'll just pass on the snide comments, but you've never used any Mac operating system *except* Leopard? :eek:
I've used Mac System 4,5,6,7 and NeXTSTEP 2,3 and 4. I'm now getting back into the fold again with Leopard via WWDC. I never used Panther and I used Tiger for like an hour.

It's good to be getting back!! :cool:

[F/reW/re]

http://bayimg.com/PAelBAabM

Look at that screenshot. The menubar looks so out of place and completely clashes with everything. It's just awful.
Agree! Looks bad!
At WWDC, I thought Steve said that there's an option to turn the tranparancy on/off..?

[macintel4me]

Agree! Looks bad!
At WWDC, I thought Steve said that there's an option to turn the tranparancy on/off..?
If there is an option it's not in the System Preferences. Possibly hidden via some defaults setting, but definitely not a preference in the latest Leopard seed.

[Kilamite]

I'm loving the Dock, the transparent menu bar, everything looks so slick and sexy!

I HATE the new folder icons though. They are too plain and don't match up to the other icons that are shiny, 3D and full of colour.

But I suppose I haven't tried Leopard yet, so haven't seen the new folder icons in the desktop with other stuff around them to see how easy they are on the eye. Too much eye candy can be a bad thing I suppose, so maybe these folder icons might not be as bad as I think they are...I hope!

Count me in for buying Leopard on the release date!

[mkrishnan]

It's good to be getting back!! :cool:

Ahhh, wow, that's wild. But then, I think you're picking a very nice time to be "back!" So welcome back! :)

(I'm a switcher from the Panther era...I think 10.3.4 was the first OS X I've used, and I'm currently on 10.4.10 on both my Macs... no developer Leopard for me! :o )

[CJD2112]

I'm loving the Dock, the transparent menu bar, everything looks so slick and sexy!

I HATE the new folder icons though. They are too plain and don't match up to the other icons that are shiny, 3D and full of colour.

But I suppose I haven't tried Leopard yet, so haven't seen the new folder icons in the desktop with other stuff around them to see how easy they are on the eye. Too much eye candy can be a bad thing I suppose, so maybe these folder icons might not be as bad as I think they are...I hope!

Count me in for buying Leopard on the release date!

Something tells me that those are not going to be the final icons. Another Macrumors member mentioned the fact that while in Coverflow the icons are 2-D and would look much better in reflective 3-dimensional imaging. I do find it difficult to believe Apple would leave 3-D icons and imaging behind for a more flat and "bland" look in their new OS, especially as the Dock is now 3-dimensional. I have a strong feeling that Apple will release more towards October and we haven't seen everything under wraps just yet...

[crees!]

Who cares about folders and paths... Damnit, ThinkSecret. Stop taking your lousy time in posting those screen caps. The natives are restless.

[Wayfarer]

Who cares about folders and paths... Damnit, ThinkSecret. Stop taking your lousy time in posting those screen caps. The natives are restless.

Apparently you don't care, but others do. As an artist, even the tiniest of interface changes appeal to me.

Crosswalks and paths and new icons OH MY! :p

[macintel4me]

FWIW, I use the column view in the Finder and you can barely see what the folder icons looks like anyway. I never use the thumbnail or coverflow views which is really the only place you would see those icons with any clarity.

[javadesigner123]

Is there A WAY TO CHANGE RESOLUTION INDEPENDENCE ?

Meaning, I want to change the menu font to some arbitrary
size, window titlebars, window titles, buttons, dialog boxes,
etc., all to whatever font size I want (for example, say
30pt verdana).

I have been able to do this on windblows for over a
decade.

CAN I FINANLLY DO THIS ON THE CURRENT BUILD OF LEOPARD ???

[macintel4me]

Is there A WAY TO CHANGE RESOLUTION INDEPENDENCE ?

Meaning, I want to change the menu font to some arbitrary
size, window titlebars, window titles, buttons, dialog boxes,
etc., all to whatever font size I want (for example, say
30pt verdana).

I have been able to do this on windblows for over a
decade.

CAN I FINANLLY DO THIS ON THE CURRENT BUILD OF LEOPARD ???
Nope.

FYI, changing the menu font is not Resolution Independence.

[inkhead]

I think it should have to show next to people's name's if they actually used the build or NOT, because most of the comments people are making about this, or that, is not something easily judged by a simple PNG :)

For example, the little "light" under applications that are running. From the pictures they don't look like a great idea. But once you actually use the build you find you are more productive. Same thing with the transparent menubar (499 it's actually fixed to work properly) but The idea is to not have the dock & the menubar staring you in the face, and to keep you focused on your application windows.

It works FANTASTICALLY. At first I didn't like either of them, or the new folder icons. But after a week of usage you realize you are more productive, and that little icons (the folders small have different icons) are much, much quicker to find.

You really need to try it for yourself before you judge. Besides that's why people customize OS X. But I think out of the box, Leopard is much, much better with the dock, menubar & finder windows/icons.

I find that I can't go back to tiger for browsing files or managing documents, it just feels much more difficult.

Leopard is all about usability speed.

[macguysoft]

*sigh* CJD2112 is exactly right on the continual pattern here at MacRumors.

All this bitching about how everyone thinks Leopard is ugly. I'll reference another Macrumors' comments that this is typical fare:

1) New OS beta shown, everyone bitches about OS
2) OS come out
3) Everyone begins to use the OS and loves it
4) New OS announced, repeat steps 1-3



Not only that, many here probably haven't even used Leopard and simply bring their subjectivity into this forum. As proof of this, why don't you all look at the reaction from mac users on the iPod? It is really pathetically similar to this thread.

People also have high expectations for Apple which is really ridiculous. They clearly can't do everything perfect or something in order to satisfy a group of people. I guarantee you that there will always be someone who will dislike what Apple puts out.

For all the noobs who didn't notice, this build is a BETA. How hard is that to understand? They're clearly continually doing GUI improvements so cut the crap. Get a life too.

[rob@robburns.co]

Everyone has their own opinions on what looks good as a desktop background - I for one, think the wet grass looks gorgeous. Everybody has a different taste. If Apple made the wet grass the ONLY background, that would be something to complain about. If you don't like it, just change it! No big deal.

Nature pictures have been in OS's since back in the 90s. Nothing "copycatting" there. And Vista's default wallpaper is abstract.

On the "wet grass" default desktop photo, I got the impression sitting in the WWDC keynote audience that Jobs has become annoyed every time he walks by a Mac and sees the default desktop instead of a personalized desktop. Perhaps their putting something there that users will not want to keep on purpose. This way you'll put your girlfriend, or your kids or your parents, etc.

[chabig]

When Windows Vista SP1 is released and Microsoft decides to turn their default desktop green, it's going to be very hard for them to convince anyone that they're not copying Apple.

[crees!]

Apparently you don't care, but others do. As an artist, even the tiniest of interface changes appeal to me.

Crosswalks and paths and new icons OH MY! :p

And, as an artist myself, I want to see more of the pie.

[djinn]

Are the current seeds of Leopard running in a debug mode? I remember trying 9A466 and it ran kind of slow for me. Then again, I did an upgrade, not a fresh install.

[akac]

Is there A WAY TO CHANGE RESOLUTION INDEPENDENCE ?

Meaning, I want to change the menu font to some arbitrary
size, window titlebars, window titles, buttons, dialog boxes,
etc., all to whatever font size I want (for example, say
30pt verdana).

I have been able to do this on windblows for over a
decade.

CAN I FINANLLY DO THIS ON THE CURRENT BUILD OF LEOPARD ???

This is not RI. Its just font customizations. RI is different and not even Windows has this. It has part of what's needed, though. At the moment RI in Leopard is done through a dev utility. My thoughts are that its going to be in the OS at 10.5.00 but won't be a user changeable option until more apps support Leopard and then in a .x update it will be made into a user option.

[rob@robburns.co]

Is there A WAY TO CHANGE RESOLUTION INDEPENDENCE ?

Meaning, I want to change the menu font to some arbitrary
size, window titlebars, window titles, buttons, dialog boxes,
etc., all to whatever font size I want (for example, say
30pt verdana).

I have been able to do this on windblows for over a
decade.

CAN I FINANLLY DO THIS ON THE CURRENT BUILD OF LEOPARD ???

Many have already answered you on this, but I'll say it too. That's not resolution independence. Resolution independence could be in the October release of Leopard, but many app developers are dragging their feet. I think Apple has made it so you can turn it on one App at a time. If some Apps drag their feet for too long they could find themselves showing up as tiny little windows next to high resolution - resolution independent apps.

[rob@robburns.co]

I never said that people not using a pathbar cant be a pro user. I'm talking about myself.


I guess that's why you can choose to show/hide it as you want in Windows.


So how would you explain to a friend where to find something on the server? The default OS X way seems to me like a pretty decent way to do if no mather what platform your using. When I comes to ease of use, I find it much easier to have one pathbar that can paste/copy/goto just like in any browser, than having a pathbar at the bottom of the window, a different goToWindow and an Applescript for copying the path. Everyone who can use Safari with the pathbar there shouldn't have any problems doing so in Finder.



If you read my posts you've read that I do use an AutomatorAction/Applescript to do this myself.

I'm glad Apple finally included a pathbar in Finder. A show/hide function would be nice.

I can understand why you want to do this. I think copying the filepath should be available in a contextual menu in the finder and in the info panel (even without a path bar). As for the use-case you mention, I also think it would be more Mac like to allow attaching filepaths (instead of actual files) upon dragging files from network shares. In other words Mail should ask whether you want the actual file or the file path pasted into the mail message (with optional hotkeys to force path or file).

Right now I usually drag a file into terminal and then copy the path to the clipboard as a hackish workaround (though I don't need it too often).

[CJD2112]

*sigh* CJD2112 is exactly right on the continual pattern here at MacRumors.




Not only that, many here probably haven't even used Leopard and simply bring their subjectivity into this forum. As proof of this, why don't you all look at the reaction from mac users on the iPod? It is really pathetically similar to this thread.

People also have high expectations for Apple which is really ridiculous. They clearly can't do everything perfect or something in order to satisfy a group of people. I guarantee you that there will always be someone who will dislike what Apple puts out.

For all the noobs who didn't notice, this build is a BETA. How hard is that to understand? They're clearly continually doing GUI improvements so cut the crap. Get a life too.

Amen to that. I've been using just about every beta of Leopard released over the past year, and just acquired 9A499. Without a doubt, I am very impressed, but I still do not forget that this is just a beta. It's great that everyone has an opinion and wants to debate certain issues on the OS, but it seems that there are more criticisms than praises for much of the work Apple releases (highly ironic from an Apple/Mac fan site).

[CJD2112]

Are the current seeds of Leopard running in a debug mode? I remember trying 9A466 and it ran kind of slow for me. Then again, I did an upgrade, not a fresh install.

Not to my knowledge. It runs very fast on my Mac Pro, especially compared to Tiger 10.4.10, although I always do a fresh install with each beta.

[Frisco]

Leopard Baby--Bring it on!!!!!!!!!!

Welcome Switchers!

[maxrobertson]

There's two sets of default folder icons, one slate coloured and the other sand.

http://img48.imageshack.us/img48/7207/picture1vn2.png

http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/7972/picture2yo4.png

I personally love them(and have been using the blue set).

how do you change the set?

[acslater017]

I really hope their is an option to turn off that damn transparent menubar. It's so ugly.

Anyone who thinks otherwise is blinded by the RDF.

it helps the flow of ideas to not disparage everyone who disagrees with you. (this IS a forum) :)

[iJawn108]

how do you change the set?

IconLite.app (http://www.freemacsoft.net/LiteIcon.html)

[Project]

Is there A WAY TO CHANGE RESOLUTION INDEPENDENCE ?

Meaning, I want to change the menu font to some arbitrary
size, window titlebars, window titles, buttons, dialog boxes,
etc., all to whatever font size I want (for example, say
30pt verdana).

I have been able to do this on windblows for over a
decade.

CAN I FINANLLY DO THIS ON THE CURRENT BUILD OF LEOPARD ???

That is not resolution independence.

[rob@robburns.co]

That is not resolution independence.

Perhaps you can think of it as resolution independence in the menu bar, but it's not what is normally referred to as resolution independence. There might be some hidden way to change this in Mac OS X now (some plist somewhere). It wouldn't require resolution independence, though it would require the system to respond to a larger font by making the white background of the menu bar larger and then requiring windows to stay clear of the larger menu bar. It wouldn't surprise me if OS X can handle this already.

Resolution Independence on the other hand allows a user to change the overall scale of the screen (larger or smaller) while keeping the relative proportions the same. Particularly with resolution independence, these changes in scale happen independent of changes in resolution. Right now you can make your display show content at twice the normal size, however the resolution will be one-half it's normal density (i.e., <em>overall</em> scaling and resolution are dependent).

[Evangelion]

Only Winblows users should like that ugly thing about file paths anyway...Apple's implementation has been much nicer for ages...who cares?

File paths can be VERY useful. Want to tell someone where some file is located? Copy/paste the path, and send it in IM or email. Quick and effective. What if you are the recipient of the forementioned email/IM? You can just copy/paste the path to your filemanager and be taken instantly to it. What if you want to enter the filepath to the Terminal?

Your rationale is basically that since Windows does display filepath and OS X does not, then filepath is not needed, since everything Windows has is crap, and OS X only has things that are actually useful and nothing else.

And pray tell: what exactly IS the "Apple's implementation" you are talking about? Like it or not, Apple uses the same paradigm as everyone else does: folders, subfolders and files in a hierarchy.

[AppleMatt389]

For example, the little "light" under applications that are running. From the pictures they don't look like a great idea. But once you actually use the build you find you are more productive. Same thing with the transparent menubar (499 it's actually fixed to work properly) but The idea is to not have the dock & the menubar staring you in the face, and to keep you focused on your application windows.


I know you say it's more productive, but to me (and as far as I can see) a lot of other people on these forums agree that the interface is no great leap over 10.4. It's nothing much after being baited with "Top Secret Features". About 4 new things were shown. To me it looks like the people at Apple were busy on the iPhone, forgot about Leopard and then threw together a seemingly updated GUI. It doesn't seem like they had productivity in mind, just change, to fool us into thinking some development happened. In short, they didn't innovate they just changed. Bit crappy considering how long we've now had to wait for Leopard.

[Tsurisuto]

I know you say it's more productive, but to me (and as far as I can see) a lot of other people on these forums agree that the interface is no great leap over 10.4. It's nothing much after being baited with "Top Secret Features". About 4 new things were shown. To me it looks like the people at Apple were busy on the iPhone, forgot about Leopard and then threw together a seemingly updated GUI. It doesn't seem like they had productivity in mind, just change, to fool us into thinking some development happened. In short, they didn't innovate they just changed. Bit crappy considering how long we've now had to wait for Leopard.

I agree that the "Top Secret" features have disappointed me (If all of them have been shown already), but with surely with any update of Mac OS X the main changes would be under the bonnet. I don't think we will see any major changes to the interface of the Mac Operating System until OS XI.

[Masquerade]

DA dock gots a crosswalk. i bet that Apple will patent this (graphic method to separe itens in a 3d view...) and will be macrumor's front page the next week.

[speakerwizard]

look at you guys, this is the most significant update to osx yet, the core animation, the 64 bit, the new (very snappy) finder and general tidying up (plus all updates for things such as native office '07 support and hddvd / BR etc make it brilliant, these other 'secret features' and snazzy looking docks etc are on the surface, so the idiots that dont understand the 2 years of work on the underpinnings can see its an update. I am extremly happy with the enhancements so far (and we all know jobs is keeping some stuff to announce with it) if you have ever discontected a networked computer or drive without out ejecting it 1st, then you will understand how good this update is lol

[I WAS the one]

I love and used this set of folders since I discovered in combination with pathfinder and UNO gui. And for real I think it looks better than the new Leopard GUI...

http://albertkinng.fatcow.com/Images/folders.jpg

[Frisco]

The love those folders "I Was the one" has.

[dr_lha]

It's nothing much after being baited with "Top Secret Features".
*AHEM*

"bated" not "baited". ;)

[mkrishnan]

"bated" not "baited". ;)

Actually, in this case, I think baited is correct.

[guzhogi]

Actually, in this case, I think baited is correct.

I think it's baited, but WHO THE ******* CARES?

look at you guys, this is the most significant update to osx yet, the core animation, the 64 bit, the new (very snappy) finder and general tidying up (plus all updates for things such as native office '07 support and hddvd / BR etc make it brilliant, these other 'secret features' and snazzy looking docks etc are on the surface, so the idiots that dont understand the 2 years of work on the underpinnings can see its an update. I am extremly happy with the enhancements so far (and we all know jobs is keeping some stuff to announce with it) if you have ever discontected a networked computer or drive without out ejecting it 1st, then you will understand how good this update is lol

I totally agree. So many people nowadays think that if they can't see it, it didn't happen. There are so many under the hood improvements, it'll be a whole lot better. Just wish text-to-speech was better. The voices still sound like cr**.

I love and used this set of folders since I discovered in combination with pathfinder and UNO gui. And for real I think it looks better than the new Leopard GUI...

http://albertkinng.fatcow.com/Images/folders.jpg

I like that too. Not really sure what all the things in the Shelf are. And I hope you can hide the info & preview parts.

[killmoms]

I love and used this set of folders since I discovered in combination with pathfinder and UNO gui. And for real I think it looks better than the new Leopard GUI...

http://albertkinng.fatcow.com/Images/folders.jpg

If by "looks better" you mean "looks like Linux" (which is the same as saying "ugly").

Seriously, there are ways to expose funtionality and information that don't involve cluttering up the screen with millions of buttons, bars, tabs, and such. That's what Apple is great at, and that is why the people at PathFinder will never work at Apple. It's also why most people will continue to ignore PathFinder.

[gloss]

*AHEM*

"bated" not "baited". ;)

Uh, I think the only correct usage for 'bated' is in the phrase 'with bated breath'.

Otherwise..."baited" is correct, as it is here.

[ilkevinli]

Do you have a link to download those icons ? Thanks.





I love and used this set of folders since I discovered in combination with pathfinder and UNO gui. And for real I think it looks better than the new Leopard GUI...

http://albertkinng.fatcow.com/Images/folders.jpg

[pengu]

If by "looks better" you mean "looks like Linux" (which is the same as saying "ugly").

Seriously, there are ways to expose funtionality and information that don't involve cluttering up the screen with millions of buttons, bars, tabs, and such. That's what Apple is great at, and that is why the people at PathFinder will never work at Apple. It's also why most people will continue to ignore PathFinder.

agreed. it looks very much like the linux-esque "look, we have EVERY POSSIBLE GUI CONCEPT... IN ONE WINDOW!"

[Nightkrawler]

look what ive found
http://bayimg.com/tag/9a499
(be sure to deactivate the filter in the settings, otherwise the screenshots aren't visible)

[hotdamn]

I love and used this set of folders since I discovered in combination with pathfinder and UNO gui. And for real I think it looks better than the new Leopard GUI...

http://albertkinng.fatcow.com/Images/folders.jpg

most hilarious post ever.

[shawnce]

I know you say it's more productive, but to me (and as far as I can see) a lot of other people on these forums agree that the interface is no great leap over 10.4. It's nothing much after being baited with "Top Secret Features". About 4 new things were shown. To me it looks like the people at Apple were busy on the iPhone, forgot about Leopard and then threw together a seemingly updated GUI. It doesn't seem like they had productivity in mind, just change, to fool us into thinking some development happened. In short, they didn't innovate they just changed. Bit crappy considering how long we've now had to wait for Leopard. You don't understand how much Leopard brings to the table.

It has many many under the hood enhancements and outright new features that make Leopard likely one of the biggest enhancements to Mac OS X so far to date.

Folks need to stop looking at the skin / face of Leopard as the only judge of what Leopard is... it took this long because a lot of work was done.

[Alloye]

I know you say it's more productive, but to me (and as far as I can see) a lot of other people on these forums agree that the interface is no great leap over 10.4. It's nothing much after being baited with "Top Secret Features". About 4 new things were shown. To me it looks like the people at Apple were busy on the iPhone, forgot about Leopard and then threw together a seemingly updated GUI. It doesn't seem like they had productivity in mind, just change, to fool us into thinking some development happened. In short, they didn't innovate they just changed. Bit crappy considering how long we've now had to wait for Leopard.

Did OS X really need a Vista-esque leap in interface design? I don't think so. All it needed was some refinement and consistency, and that's exactly what we're getting.

Even if you don't agree, you're still discounting everything that's changing under the hood. There are some really big wins here. Improvements to Objective-C and its runtime combined with new features like Core Animation and 64-bit frameworks are the kind of things that will enable next-generation applications. And isn't that what really matters?

Furthermore, the new Finder is a vast improvement over Tiger's. Stacks and Quicklook FTW. Safari 3 flat-out rocks. Mail and Preview have been greatly enhanced. Performance is up all over the place. Time Machine really works. And we're getting UNIX certification.

In other words, Apple didn't just throw this together at the last minute. Leopard is shaping up to be the biggest upgrade to OS X yet despite the subjective concerns over its UI.

[shawnce]

Did OS X really need a Vista-esque leap in interface design? I don't think so. All it needed was some refinement and consistency, and that's exactly what we're getting. Additionally Apple is making available many more "modern" controls and standard images, etc. to developers. Allowing better cross application consistency and easing development work by 3rd party developers.

Also I personally believe Interface Builder v3 is going to better open the market up to community developed widgets, etc. given its enhanced support for palettes (enhancement is an understatement). To me IB v3 is likely going to be one of the greatest wins for developers doing UI application development.

[F/reW/re]

You don't understand how much Leopard brings to the table.

It has many many under the hood enhancements and outright new features that make Leopard likely one of the biggest enhancements to Mac OS X so far to date.

Folks need to stop looking at the skin / face of Leopard as the only judge of what Leopard is... it took this long because a lot of work was done.
You should read AppleMatt389's post once more. I'm sure AppleMatt389 knows that Leopard is a giant leap forward, but as AppleMatt389 wrote, in Paris Steve said they had some top secret features they could not reveal yet, because of the copycats at Microsoft. Now we know that these so called top secret features is only a stack, a new background for the dock and some other gui stuff.. Do you really find it that strange that people get disappointed?

There is no doubt Leopard is going to be great, but Steve hasn't yet delivered what he promised when it comes to the top secret features.

To me there is no doubth that the iPhone have taken up alot of resources at Apple.

[shawnce]

There is no doubt Leopard is going to be great, but Steve hasn't yet delivered what he promised when it comes to the top secret features. What did he "promise" exactly? ... :rolleyes:

[Alloye]

There is no doubt Leopard is going to be great, but Steve hasn't yet delivered what he promised when it comes to the top secret features.

Did Steve ever really promise "top secret features?" The only statement I remember was from the WWDC '06 keynote where he said they were keeping some things "close to the vest." Next thing I knew, the forums were overflowing with unfounded hype.

[killmoms]

Yeah, the only people who assumed "top secret" to mean "world changing" were people on rumors sites. He didn't say that whatever he was holding back was going to change the world, he just said they weren't showing everything. WHY that was so is up for debate (personally I think it was because they didn't have everything READY to show, as Leopard's lengthened-development cycle suggests).

[numlock]

Yeah, the only people who assumed "top secret" to mean "world changing" were people on rumors sites. He didn't say that whatever he was holding back was going to change the world, he just said they weren't showing everything. WHY that was so is up for debate (personally I think it was because they didn't have everything READY to show, as Leopard's lengthened-development cycle suggests).

although im fairly content with the improvements leopard is supposed to bring ie screen sharing, recovering deleted files (if thats still in there), better parental controls, better automator, pathbar, improved sharing of folders etc. I would say that calling something "Top Secret" implies it is something pretty darn special and not just a see through menubar.

[macintel4me]

I think looking back that Steve/Apple didn't really know what features they could cram into Leopard given the iPhone and :apple:TV launches. I think "Top Secret" was Steve's way of saying "We really have no idea what the final feature set is, but we will let you know later when we figure it out".

In saying that I think there will be lots of great new features post 10.5.0 because Apple did just the minimum feature set to call it a victory.

[Alloye]

although im fairly content with the improvements leopard is supposed to bring ie screen sharing, recovering deleted files (if thats still in there), better parental controls, better automator, pathbar, improved sharing of folders etc. I would say that calling something "Top Secret" implies it is something pretty darn special and not just a see through menubar.

That's just it. When did Steve actually use the term "top secret?" I honestly can't recall. He did say they were keeping some things "close to the vest" at WWDC '06, but that's not the same thing. Perhaps this whole "top secret" mantra is nothing more than forum myth.

[SiliconAddict]

Well all this thread proves is that you will never please everyone.

Personally it's growing on me more and more. I could bitch about things, but I'll leave that until it comes out of development. I'm sure there's a lot of refinement to come before October.

The issue at hand is that Apple doesn't try to please ANYONE. They shove it down your throat and tell you if you don't like it tough [beep].

Apple could shut half the people on this thread up if they would...

1. FTFF

2. Add a theme engine (Like XP and Vista has.) into OS X so people could roll their own GUI. That way for those who like what Apple has to offer they will never touch the settings. For everyone else they can tweak the UI to their liking. The problem is that Apple and Jobs in particular are snobs. As such this will never happen. And people will continue to bitch. Why? Because people have their own tastes in UI. So from the standpoint of Apple they aren't thinking different. They are thinking conformist.

[maverick808]

That's just it. When did Steve actually use the term "top secret?" I honestly can't recall. He did say they were keeping some things "close to the vest" at WWDC '06, but that's not the same thing. Perhaps this whole "top secret" mantra is nothing more than forum myth.

WWDC '06...

http://www.roughlydrafted.com/RD/Home/BE094E37-2CE1-4720-B2D6-A591B4B212F7_files/topsecret.pnghttp://www.neyo.co.uk/blog/wp-content/wwdc06_top_secret.jpg

[Alloye]

WWDC '06...

http://www.roughlydrafted.com/RD/Home/BE094E37-2CE1-4720-B2D6-A591B4B212F7_files/topsecret.pnghttp://www.neyo.co.uk/blog/wp-content/wwdc06_top_secret.jpg

Well, even if he didn't use the words, that Keynote slide definitely has implications. I stand corrected.

[SiliconAddict]

That's just it. When did Steve actually use the term "top secret?" I honestly can't recall. He did say they were keeping some things "close to the vest" at WWDC '06, but that's not the same thing. Perhaps this whole "top secret" mantra is nothing more than forum myth.

He said top secret.

Heck. He even stamped it onscreen :P

http://www.neyo.co.uk/blog/wp-content/wwdc06_top_secret.jpg

At the end of the day top secret was Jobs's code word for features too buggy to demo. I'm 100&#37; certain of this. Microsoft couldn't give less of a crap about what eventually was announced for Leopard.

[BRLawyer]

File paths can be VERY useful. Want to tell someone where some file is located? Copy/paste the path, and send it in IM or email. Quick and effective. What if you are the recipient of the forementioned email/IM? You can just copy/paste the path to your filemanager and be taken instantly to it. What if you want to enter the filepath to the Terminal?

Your rationale is basically that since Windows does display filepath and OS X does not, then filepath is not needed, since everything Windows has is crap, and OS X only has things that are actually useful and nothing else.

And pray tell: what exactly IS the "Apple's implementation" you are talking about? Like it or not, Apple uses the same paradigm as everyone else does: folders, subfolders and files in a hierarchy.

Apple's implementation is exactly to tell you about a file path, without giving you the complications of dealing with it.

For 99&#37; of the cases, it's not necessary and just a waste of screen real estate. Even on the PC at work, I have perhaps used it ONCE to set up a new printer, as Windows can't really show you the easy way.

If I wanna send someone a file, I DRAG and DROP. If I wanna mail someone a file, I DRAG and DROP. And if you need constant access to an online folder, just make an alias. That's how Apple works for normal people.

Alternatives today?

http://www.macworld.com/forums/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=macgems&Number=499696&page=0&view=collapsed

[Alloye]

He said top secret.

Heck. He even stamped it onscreen :P

http://www.neyo.co.uk/blog/wp-content/wwdc06_top_secret.jpg

At the end of the day top secret was Jobs's code word for features too buggy to demo. I'm 100% certain of this. Microsoft couldn't give less of a crap about what eventually was announced for Leopard.

Yep. I already conceded the point. Plus I just checked the WWDC '06 video. I can certainly see how Steve's words may have driven expectations.

Nevertheless, as a developer, I am very happy with Leopard. The most important thing an OS can do is provide a foundation for great applications. That's the real win.

[Evangelion]

Apple's implementation is exactly to tell you about a file path, without giving you the complications of dealing with it

Oh yes, praise be Apple for not showing us the filepath, since we are such a morons that we would be confused by it! That is clearly the way to go! Since Apple does it, it HAS to be the right thing to do, right?

If I wanna send someone a file, I DRAG and DROP.

I'm not talking about "sending a file", I'm talking about telling others where some file resides. And why should I send someone a file, if the file resides on a network-server that the other user can access as well?

I deal with these issues on a weekly basis. If I want to tell users where some files are located in a network-server, how do I do it? Well, I copy/paste the filepath, and mail it to the users saying "the files are in here", the users would then copy/paste the filepath to their Explorer-window and be done with it. How would it work in OS X? I would have to type a mail saying "the files are in server Foo, in volume Bar, in folder XXXX", and the users would then manually browse to the cirrect folder. I guess you will now tell me how the Apple-way is obviously superior, right?

If I wanna mail someone a file, I DRAG and DROP.

Again: I'm not talking about sending anything. I'm talking about cases like where one Mac-user asks another one "hey, where is folder Foo located in OS X?", or "which network-share has these files?".

And if you need constant access to an online folder, just make an alias. That's how Apple works for normal people.

No, you just refuse to accept the fact that having filepath available is a good thing, since Windows has been doing that for year, whereas OS X does not. And you simply can't accept a situation where Windows does something better than OS X.

[Evangelion]

If by "looks better" you mean "looks like Linux" (which is the same as saying "ugly").

No, that is NOT the same. Linux can look whatever the user wants it to look.

That said: I'm anxiously waiting for Leopard, and I WILL be updating to it pretty quickly

[simontarr]

Overall I think I like the new look...I think none of us are used to the change. Its not exactly a subtle change either.

Anyhoo, I found some new screenshots from build 9a499 on this website (http://www.thetechblogger.com) I just come across. I've been looking at the menu bar pic posted a lot and I'm really starting to like it now. I like the fact there there aren't any rounded corners anymore- looks much more modern.

[F/reW/re]

Oh yes, praise be Apple for not showing us the filepath, since we are such a morons that we would be confused by it! That is clearly the way to go! Since Apple does it, it HAS to be the right thing to do, right?

I'm not talking about "sending a file", I'm talking about telling others where some file resides. And why should I send someone a file, if the file resides on a network-server that the other user can access as well?

I deal with these issues on a weekly basis. If I want to tell users where some files are located in a network-server, how do I do it? Well, I copy/paste the filepath, and mail it to the users saying "the files are in here", the users would then copy/paste the filepath to their Explorer-window and be done with it. How would it work in OS X? I would have to type a mail saying "the files are in server Foo, in volume Bar, in folder XXXX", and the users would then manually browse to the cirrect folder. I guess you will now tell me how the Apple-way is obviously superior, right?

Again: I'm not talking about sending anything. I'm talking about cases like where one Mac-user asks another one "hey, where is folder Foo located in OS X?", or "which network-share has these files?".

No, you just refuse to accept the fact that having filepath available is a good thing, since Windows has been doing that for year, whereas OS X does not. And you simply can't accept a situation where Windows does something better than OS X.
Couldn't have said it any better myself!

Sending e-mail with videofiles at 2GB would really make my system administrator happy. :rolleyes: I guess BRLawyer hasn't worked in a corporation working with video, internet, graphic design or anything like that. When working with stuff like that you often have alot of files linked up to a projectfile so you have to work on the file where it's located on the server, not on your own computer.

[CJD2112]

...the more I wonder what the fan base generally consists of. I'm surprised for a Mac/Apple based fan forum, that almost all of the comments are negative in nature, with most commentators moaning and bitching about every little thing they can possibly conjure in their minds. I realize constructive criticism is paramount for any company/product to succeed, but from most of the comments it appears people want Apple to:

1) Cure cancer
2) Develop world peace
3) Program an end to the Middle East conflicts
4) Write a personalized O.S. for everyone
5) Create cold fusion to produce free, renewable energy to stall global warming and give energy to those in need

...need I go on?

Personally, I've used every Leopard Beta developed thus far, including 9A499, and I refuse to use Tiger unless absolutely necessary. The transparent menu bar and 3-D dock seem to increase desktop work space and are less distracting than Tiger. Leopard is fast, jumping to different drives and networks without hesitation, and spaces is brilliant for increasing work flow, desk top real estate and efficiency. I also dislike Tiger's brushed aluminum finder, and have grown to love the adaption of iTunes 6-7 GUI throughout the system. Tiger's brushed aluminum finder and application windows seem bulky and take up a great deal of desktop real estate when compared to Leopards sleeker and sharper GUI. The "crosswalk" divider on the dock also serves as a quick way to resize the dock, by clicking on it and moving in or out, the dock size increases/decreases.

While there are a few things I take issue with, such as the bland 2-dimensional icons and a lack of a customizable GUI as Windows has had for years, Leopard is leaps and bounds better than Tiger. There is certainly more to come, such as improved integration with the iPhone/iPod/iTV, etc (I have been informed that the iPhone will eventually be opened up to be used as a hard drive and to allow dragging and dropping of individual files manually as well as ring tones and more bluetooth accessibility for ObEx, iChat, firmware update for video recording, etc.). Keep in mind, there is a long time before it is even released this Autumn, so let's not be so critical and just enjoy the ride.

[mavere]

To me, the lack of the filepath was the single worse thing about using a Mac (well, concerning UI anyway).

I switched over to OSX from Vista a couple months back. Vista's implementation of the filepath was extremely useful, or at least more so than XP's, so when I first went over, everytime I used Finder, it was a reminder that Apple has strayed too far to one side of the form vs function debate.

However, that should be solved come October. Apple, all I have to say is this: See! Pragmatism wasn't that bad now was it. ;)

[FunkyELF]

getting better,

just need to fix the default folder icons and I'll be happy

Are these not easy to change yourself?
I don't own a mac, so I don't know...but I would think should be easy to change.

[Fukui]

Are these not easy to change yourself?
I don't own a mac, so I don't know...but I would think should be easy to change.

Yea, it should be... its just some people would like the default to be to thier liking... (like me:))

[FunkyELF]

To me, the lack of the filepath was the single worse thing about using a Mac (well, concerning UI anyway).

Same for me but with Gnome. I'm not sure if it is possible, but I looked around for about 10 minutes to get the file manager in Gnome to show the whole path and not keep opening up new windows.

Great...I get a new window showing the contents of "bin".
Which "bin" is it?

Window's explorer has it right. Those who copy explorer have it right. I can't stand those who can't accept the fact that Microsoft has done at least one thing right.

[Evangelion]

Same for me but with Gnome. I'm not sure if it is possible, but I looked around for about 10 minutes to get the file manager in Gnome to show the whole path and not keep opening up new windows.

It's been a while since I used GNOME, but try hitting Ctrl+L. As to new windows (AKA: spatial filemanagement): that can be turned off. Use Gconf-editor and set /apps/nautilus/preferences/always_use_browser to true.

[Manic Mouse]

I'm going to admit it, I've really come around to the new GUI. Leopard looks niiiiice. Along with Spaces, Time Machine, Stacks and the new Finder it looks like Leopard is going to be an awesome update. I'm super excited!

[I WAS the one]

I like that too. Not really sure what all the things in the Shelf are. And I hope you can hide the info & preview parts.

Yes, you can hide all the features and just see it as the regular Tiger's window... it just let you do more. but I was talking about the folder's icons... The Leopard ones are not too Aqua-lish... they look windows-like for me... and I don't like it... the ones I used have more or less the look and feel of a new Aqua-like folder for this year. I think Apple is more worry about switchers than us the long time Mac users... thats why Leopard looks more Windows than Tiger ...

[ilogic]

The blue dots look great what is the problem everyone is having with them? Is it because they are not black triangles.

i like the blue balls... but creatively speaking, it would be cool if the icon sunk into the dock and started spinning like a CD.. i know it would get tiresome pretty fast, but its very cool...

OR

Have the icon become embossed on the dock with the blue light around it... like an aura..

October: 60 Days away.

[Nick12945]

Have the icon become embossed on the dock with the blue light around it... like an aura..


I think thats a great idea. It would look way better than those stupid blue balls...(teehee) in my opinion

[vandlism]

I believe Abbey Road just secured itself a spot in the Dock, nice.

The concept of quoting myself is hard to understand. Anyways, I was browsing the InsanelyMac forums and came across this bit of info. It turns out that the divider is actually named AbbeyRoad.png. How's that for awesomeness?

http://forum.insanelymac.com/index.php?showtopic=58554

[Project]

The concept of quoting myself is hard to understand. Anyways, I was browsing the InsanelyMac forums and came across this bit of info. It turns out that the divider is actually named AbbeyRoad.png. How's that for awesomeness?

http://forum.insanelymac.com/index.php?showtopic=58554


Thats just awesome. Great find.

[TMacDMB]

1) Apple I to open info.
2) Click and copy the icon
3) Open up preview, and go to File -> New from clipboard
4) Goto Tools -> Adjust color
5) Play around adjusting the color/brightness/etc.
-You can almost make any color I think

Here's the trick.

6) Now that you have your new colored icon. Copy it again within preview.
7) Goto File new from clipboard. (A new window pops up with your icon)
8) Copy this icon
9) Paste the icon back in the info window

Enjoy! :cool:

I downloaded the freeware blue icon set from this website:

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://grafikdesign.files.wordpress.com/2007/08/black-26blue-icons.jpg&imgrefurl=http://grafikdesign.wordpress.com/2007/08/22/free-mac-os-x-icons-download/&h=295&w=415&sz=53&hl=en&start=1&sig2=T3_eNIE6Avr68ARfVRkR0A&tbnid=oxm23lk0DJ5BbM:&tbnh=89&tbnw=125&ei=dGwkSJKpNI2QhAPNvOm2Dw&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dfre%2Bos%2Bx%2Bblue%2Bicons%26gbv%3D2%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG

Then I adjusted my other icons (Firefox, etc.) To be sweet blue / black. With an awesome blue black desktop background, and these icons, my setup is sweet.

[Ernest]

I already saw all of these changes on apple instructional videos on their site a few days ago. I like the "sidewalk".