iTunes to Windows [Archive]

MacRumors

Jul 29, 2003, 03:45 PM

PaidContent.org posted (http://www.paidcontent.org/pc/arch/2003_07_29.shtml#002622) some notes from Peter Lowe keynote speech at Jupiter Plug.In Conference (http://www.jupiterevents.com/plugin/summer03/agenda2.html#keyII). Peter Lowe is Apple's director of Marketing for Applications and Services.

Lowe reiterates that iTunes for Windows is still on track to launch by the end of the year and "certainly it is our intention to have broad music rights..."

Apple's iTunes Music Store offers relatively liberal rights as compared to other services -- including the recently launched BuyMusic.com. BuyMusic.com was unable to negotiate blanket licensing agreements for their music. Older rumors (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2003/05/20030512103510.shtml) hinted that Apple may face similar challenges in launching their Windows version of the iTunes Music Store.

Foocha

Jul 29, 2003, 03:46 PM

I just hope they get it out there soon before their share price starts to slip again!

Freg3000

Jul 29, 2003, 03:51 PM

Originally posted by Macrumors
"certainly it is our intention to have broad music rights..."

I certainly hope so...Apple needs to nail this. It worries me that they are still hoping. I had wished that apple might have had most of the legal stuff worked out. Maybe not though-does anyone when Apple got everything finalized with the iTMS before going public on 4-28? was it down to the wire?

Computer_Phreak

Jul 29, 2003, 03:52 PM

yep, this is turning out to be another classic example of "lets copy apple and gain huge market share!"'

i'd like to see competition... but buymusic.com, even the commercials, are practically a direct copy of ITMS

Java

Jul 29, 2003, 04:01 PM

Originally posted by Foocha
I just hope they get it out there soon before their share price starts to slip again!

So far, it seems as if buymusic.com is hurting themselves with varying DRM and a loud-mouth CEO.

I'm sure "Napster 2.0" will come out, a few people will buy songs, and it will do well in the short run, but it will not succeed compared to iTunes Music store.

A solid product (iTMS) will stand the test of time.

I'm sure Steve will have the same fair play rights for Windows as he does for the Mac users.

jaedreth

Jul 29, 2003, 04:02 PM

Yes it was.

I would think the hold up would be the Windows version of iTunes, QuickTime 6.

Keep in mind that this isn't simply a music player. It keeps track of your computer being *authorized* to play music by your ethernet hardware address.

Everyone, before you send your machines in for repair, de-authorize your computer. If they replace the mlb, Apple can't give you that authorization back that you will lose.

This may be an issue on PCs as well, when iTMS hits Windows.

Jaedreth

SiliconAddict

Jul 29, 2003, 04:23 PM

Originally posted by Computer_Phreak
yep, this is turning out to be another classic example of "lets copy apple and gain huge market share!"'

i'd like to see competition... but buymusic.com, even the commercials, are practically a direct copy of ITMS

I thought you guys were over reacting to the ads that they were putting out but I saw my first one last night while watching the SCIFI channel (StarGate SG1 RULES!) and I was totally blown away.
The brass pair on the marketing people at that company has to be about the size of Mount Everest. I just sat there jaw hanging open quietly laughing. :eek: Blatant rip-off nothing! They practically cut and paste scenes into the commercial. (OK maybe not that far but dang!) If there was any justice in this world, and there isn’t, buymusic.com will go under in a month.

MacFan25

Jul 29, 2003, 04:27 PM

I hope that iTunes for Windows blows away all the others. At least its still on track, and is expected by year's end. Apple needs to try to get it out before Microsoft comes out with something.

3xtrmn8r

Jul 29, 2003, 04:34 PM

Bah!

I've noticed most these download services are websites seperate from the playback app. The thing I like about iTMS is that integration, which the others lack. Convenience wins here!

jayscheuerle

Jul 29, 2003, 04:40 PM

It won't come out until after the 6 month trial period for Mac users is over. When was the iTunes store introduced? June 24th or so?

That's a little late for the "let me buy you a bunch of music files for Christmas" season...

But I'm guessing that Apple has to make it through this trial period with the security measures working before their model is released to the general PC population.

- j

PretendPCuser

Jul 29, 2003, 04:40 PM

There's the distinct possibility that Apple IMS (for Mac) might be the only one to succeed long term for the reason that the fanatical following of Appleheads made it a success. I don't see Windows peeps caring whether they buy their music from BuyMusic.com (whatever it is), Napster 2, or Apple. There's no loyalty and certainly where P2P is concerned, marketshare dictates that the majority of peeps P2P'ing are Windows users. Tougher for other services to convert P2P to P4S (Pay for service) this includes Apple when it comes to PC counterparts. There are still plenty of people who will pay, so it will all come down to the service, the user-interface, available music, and marketing/advertising.

Buymusic has been out for a week or so right? Has anyone heard how they are doing? How many downloads? Do they have the cajones to tell anyone? OR are they being silent cause they "Don't want to hurt Apple's feelings?" :rolleyes:

Joel Belog

Jul 29, 2003, 04:44 PM

Apple provides an ability to de-authorize a computer after you can no longer use it. Take a look at technote #93014: http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=93014.

jayscheuerle

Jul 29, 2003, 04:45 PM

There may also be the chance that these record companies agreed not to offer anyone else the rights that they've offered Apple until the Mac trial run is over. If that's the case, all of these other services will seem second rate.

snahabed

Jul 29, 2003, 04:53 PM

Am I the only one who sees the "certainly intend to have broad rights" language as foreshadowing the failure of this intention?

Clearly Apple is having difficulty obtaining the same rights on the Windows version. This quote seems to imply that they may have to make concessions, but they still want to keep the rights broader than buymusic, for example.

I think the record execs would be utter morons not to realize that the liberal DRM is what makes iTMS so popular.

tazo

Jul 29, 2003, 04:53 PM

Originally posted by Macrumors
PaidContent.org posted (http://www.paidcontent.org/pc/arch/2003_07_29.shtml#002622) some notes from Peter Lowe keynote speech at Jupiter Plug.In Conference (http://www.jupiterevents.com/plugin/summer03/agenda2.html#keyII). Peter Lowe is Apple's director of Marketing for Applications and Services.

Lowe reiterates that iTunes for Windows is still on track to launch by the end of the year and "certainly it is our intention to have broad music rights..."

Apple's iTunes Music Store offers relatively liberal rights as compared to other services -- including the recently launched BuyMusic.com. BuyMusic.com was unable to negotiate blanket licensing agreements for their music. Older rumors (http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2003/05/20030512103510.shtml) hinted that Apple may face similar challenges in launching their Windows version of the iTunes Music Store.

I cannot wait...for a solution to downloading music on the pc side; cuz surely a site such as buymusic.com is not the solution, but the inherent problem.

;)

psxndc

Jul 29, 2003, 04:55 PM

Head on over to MacSlash (http://macslash.org/article.pl?sid=03/07/29/1510211&mode=thread) and read about an artist (one of many apparently) that never authorized BuyMusic.com to sell his works and yet they are.

BM is (hopefully) going down.

-p

kcmac

Jul 29, 2003, 04:56 PM

Does anyone know how many songs Apple now has at the Store? They post new ones every Tuesday but I haven't seen where they have listed a new total.

jayscheuerle

Jul 29, 2003, 05:00 PM

Originally posted by snahabed
Am I the only one who sees the "certainly intend to have broad rights" language as foreshadowing the failure of this intention?

Clearly Apple is having difficulty obtaining the same rights on the Windows version. This quote seems to imply that they may have to make concessions, but they still want to keep the rights broader than buymusic, for example.

I think the record execs would be utter morons not to realize that the liberal DRM is what makes iTMS so popular.

Not at all. Apple's music store is all set to have the same rights when it opens up to the Windows world. It just needs to get through the probationary period with no big mishaps. They're "intending" to have the same rights, but if the rights system becomes circumventable by then, not only will Apple not offer a music store for Windows, but their own will be shut down as well, unless they negotiate a longer probationary period while they shore things up.

If you like Apple's music store, don't be worried about other music stores, be worried about hackers. They have the power to screw it up for everybody.

- j

iMax531

Jul 29, 2003, 05:06 PM

I don't remember exactly where I saw this, I think I followed a link from macsurfer, but it ahd a quote from the CEO of Buy.com saying that first day or first week sales were "not in the millions"

iTMS has sold 6.5+ million songs so far.

here's the quote:

"Apple has sold 6.5 million songs since April; BuyMusic won't release figures, but "it's not millions," Blum says."

the link is here:

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/2003-07-28-buymusic_x.htm

enjoy

bertagert

Jul 29, 2003, 05:07 PM

itunes for indows will be exactly the same thing as itunes for mac. There is obviousily a very good reason why the windows version is not out and I bet it has to do with hardware intergration. Windows machines carry anyone and everyones hardware. Thats probably the problem (making it work for all users).

I doubt the hold up is over whether or not the store is make expected sales or not. The RIAA already knows that music distrobution will be done on the web. Apple has already nailed it. These other companies using Microsoft's DRM have not.

Don't worry about itunes for windows. It will come in the next few months and windows users will down load it and start buying music in a major way.

The problem I see for Apple is, being able to share your music file between a PC and a Mac. However, the folks at Apple have always made it super easy to use things in every program they create. I don't see itunes for windows as the exception. When its ready, Apple will release and windows people will rejoice.

When X-mas rolls around this year, Apple Music will have so many sales that all competition will go away except for Microsoft. Microsoft will step up to the plate and play ball by end of 2004. When that happens, we'll truly see who will win the game.

Remember, its not Apple against buymusic/napster/etc. It's Apple against MS.

vrapan

Jul 29, 2003, 05:15 PM

I read both of these quotes today but I dont remember where and they may not be very accurate:

Gates about MS music store:
"Downloading might be something your platform has to offer but it is not a money maker"

Blum about how many songs they have sold:
" We have sold well but not millions"
On top of that due to a glitch songs downloaded from BuyMusic they couldn't be played in portable players - they are fixing it but guess how dissappointed people can get over this.

So in my opinion Apple is still in not pretty big trouble as long as they create an experience as close as possible to the one on the Mac platform. I think that they can afford to wait if that is going to help them get looser DRM deal.

And I have said that in a few other posts none offers a complete solution as Apple and none has better control over both software and hardware as Apple. On Windows it loses the control over the computer but still retains control over the portable player and software.

I don't see authorising - deauthorising computers to be a problem. Think about that: They can offer a service where using .Mac to synchronise between two PCs music libraries they can make it pretty easy to deauthorise the music there.... Give people two ways to deauthorise the hard way and a .Mac way. Great promotion of a high yield service.

Or again if they have to have strict DRM stick a little banner on iTunes - " You would be able to burn your music collection as many times as you wanted if you were using a Mac".....

arn

Jul 29, 2003, 05:37 PM

Originally posted by jayscheuerle
It won't come out until after the 6 month trial period for Mac users is over. When was the iTunes store introduced? June 24th or so?
- j

There is no "6 month trial period".

Labels signed on for 1 year.

Apple's iTunes Store was introduced in April.

arn

solvs

Jul 29, 2003, 05:45 PM

I'd like to quote, from MacSlash:

I'm on there, too... (Score:3, Interesting)

by brian on Tuesday July 29, @11:56AM (#45236)
User #1499 Info | http://www.circa75.com/

Ha. After reading and replying to this article, I decided to look myself up on buymusic. Lo and behold... there I am -- a college a capella compilation I sang on shows up on the list. But unfortunately I'm not really in any position to turn around and make threats to these guys, since we never had permission from the original author to record a cover of the song in the first place... but for everyone else -- go get 'em! it's time to turn around and use some of these crappy laws against the people they were designed to protect.

As if the RIAA really cares about the artists and people who work hard to actually create this music.

BuyMusic.com, doomed to failure.

arn

Jul 29, 2003, 05:47 PM

Originally posted by solvs
I'd like to quote, from MacSlash:

Seems this quote is very interesting. don't know the legalities of it all

Wasn't the whole point of the evil Digital Millenium Copyright Act that a copyright holder simply has to write a letter to an alleged copyright infringer, and they're required to remove all materials immediately or face massive damages?

I'm assuming Jody still owns the copyright to the material, in spite of whatever distribution deal existed with Orchard. If it applies here, there are lots of form letters available online he can use as an example. Send it certified or FedEx, and see what happens.

jaykk

Jul 29, 2003, 06:31 PM

According to Macobserver (http://www.macobserver.com/article/2003/07/29.6.shtml) , musicmatch is going to be a real competitor to iTMS. hurry up, apple.

"MusicMatch, the company that currently provides Apple with the software that allows Windows users to sync their iPods, said Monday that it plans to add a music store to its Jukebox software by the end of the year"
"We think generally people want to own music," Musicmatch senior vice president Bob Ohlweiler said Monday. "An a la carte service has a lot more to offer to the masses, and the potential for a much higher adoption rate."

e-coli

Jul 29, 2003, 06:34 PM

Originally posted by bertagert
Remember, its not Apple against buymusic/napster/etc. It's Apple against MS.

I would argue it's none of the above. It's consumer vs. RIAA. And Apple has come up with an innovative way to mediate between the two. The other music services don't pitch equally between the two parties. They play right into the wishes of the record companies at the expense of the consumer.

tizza

Jul 29, 2003, 07:05 PM

Originally posted by jaykk
According to Macobserver (http://www.macobserver.com/article/2003/07/29.6.shtml) , musicmatch is going to be a real competitor to iTMS. hurry up, apple.

"MusicMatch, the company that currently provides Apple with the software that allows Windows users to sync their iPods, said Monday that it plans to add a music store to its Jukebox software by the end of the year"
"We think generally people want to own music," Musicmatch senior vice president Bob Ohlweiler said Monday. "An a la carte service has a lot more to offer to the masses, and the potential for a much higher adoption rate."

If you read all the ipod forums, MusicMatch sounds like it has more problems than it's worth for windows ipod users (not that I've personally experienced using it). Maybe they've finally solved all the probs if they think they are goign to give iTMS for Windows a run for their money.

Phil Of Mac

Jul 29, 2003, 07:25 PM

Originally posted by Computer_Phreak
yep, this is turning out to be another classic example of "lets copy apple and gain huge market share!"'

Except, in true Microsoft fashion, they can't even do it as well as Apple :)

Originally posted by vrapan
Gates about MS music store:
"Downloading might be something your platform has to offer but it is not a money maker"

See? If this is true, MS isn't interested, because it won't make them enough money to be worthwhile. Apple doesn't really care about that, they want to change the world and make a nice profit on the side. Obviously, though, a music store like that will be immensely profitable for whoever runs it, especially if all the mainstream artists ditch their labels and go indie on iTMS, because that'll mean more money for artists and more money for Apple.

Snowy_River

Jul 29, 2003, 07:39 PM

Originally posted by tizza
If you read all the ipod forums, MusicMatch sounds like it has more problems than it's worth for windows ipod users (not that I've personally experienced using it). Maybe they've finally solved all the probs if they think they are goign to give iTMS for Windows a run for their money.

First, let me say that I've never even launched MusicMatch, so all I know about it is what I've read. However, base on articles like this one (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A48988-2003Jul26.html) I seriously doubt that MusicMatch will be serious competition for iTMS for Windows.

vrapan

Jul 29, 2003, 07:51 PM

In my PC days - till February this year - after that I bought a cute little PowerBook and got hooked to Apple big time MusicMatch was my music jukebox of choice. It is not bad software but:

1. It is not match for the elegance of iTunes not even close. in iTunes I had categorised and fixed my 1000+ songs in a couple of hours. In musicmatch I had kinda given up.

2. All the first major releases and the next two or three minor updates are unstable big time. I mean I started using it since 5.00 till the 5.2 no kidding it was crashing several times a day. Things got much better on 5.5 i think. Then the same with 6 - 6.2 and 7-7.2 and then now 8 my bro that still has a PC says it is crashing on him quite often. Never used it with a Windows iPod but after this sort of experience I am not sure I want to.

MrMacMan

Jul 29, 2003, 07:59 PM

Wow good news, if they have the same restrictions as the Mac Version, I and everyone else will be VERY, VERY pleased.

All we need to hear now is its coming sooner then expected.!

:D

bertagert

Jul 29, 2003, 11:52 PM

Originally posted by Phil Of Mac
See? If this is true, MS isn't interested, because it won't make them enough money to be worthwhile.

If that were true, Microsoft wouldn't be putting any money into DRM for audio or trying to get everybody to use its player. Don't let his quote fool you. There's a ton of money to be made, especially if your the one that controls how the music is played.

I would argue it's none of the above. It's consumer vs. RIAA. And Apple has come up with an innovative way to mediate between the two. The other music services don't pitch equally between the two parties. They play right into the wishes of the record companies at the expense of the consumer.

Apple isn't doing this to be mr. nice guy. They want money, and lots of it. Plus they don't want MS to have control over which format is used.

The RIAA is not some evil giant. They're just trying to make money like everyone else. If they make more than some other type of business, I'm happy for them. I buy 20 - 30 cd's a year ($300.00 or so). I get to listen and enjoy that music when ever or where ever I'd like for the rest of my life. I spend twice as much going skiing every year. How come no one bitches about the skiing industry?

Phil Of Mac

Jul 30, 2003, 12:34 AM

Originally posted by bertagert
The RIAA is not some evil giant. They're just trying to make money like everyone else. If they make more than some other type of business, I'm happy for them. I buy 20 - 30 cd's a year ($300.00 or so). I get to listen and enjoy that music when ever or where ever I'd like for the rest of my life. I spend twice as much going skiing every year. How come no one bitches about the skiing industry?

Because you can't get free skiing through piracy?

Snowy_River

Jul 30, 2003, 01:17 AM

Originally posted by bertagert
...Don't let his quote fool you. There's a ton of money to be made, especially if your the one that controls how the music is played...

Well, yes, there is, but most of the money is not in being a service provider for downloaded songs. Some money may be there to be made, but you can be sure that the labels are making a lot more than the service providers.

Apple isn't doing this to be mr. nice guy. They want money, and lots of it...

Well, yes, and a big part of how they win from this deal is the iPod. Make it easier to get music to your computer, and you want to be able to take it with you. Presto! More iPod sales. I don't think that Apple is making much money, net, from iTMS itself.

However, they are better able to make money when they keep their customers happy, and one of the best ways to do this is to be Mr. Nice Guy, as much as possible. They might be able to make more money off of iTMS if they weren't so nice about it.

The RIAA is not some evil giant. They're just trying to make money like everyone else. If they make more than some other type of business, I'm happy for them...

Even if they are making that money through illegal business practices? It's fairly well known (and there's even been a case or two about it) that the RIAA is guilty of price fixing when it comes to CDs. So, please forgive me if I have little sympathy for the 'Big Five'.

Docrjm

Jul 30, 2003, 01:35 AM

Originally posted by Phil Of Mac
Because you can't get free skiing through piracy?
Actually by hiking half way up a hill with midmountain lifts you can. Reason, mountains rarely check lift passes halfway up.;)

gwangung

Jul 30, 2003, 02:21 AM

Originally posted by Snowy_River
It's fairly well known (and there's even been a case or two about it) that the RIAA is guilty of price fixing when it comes to CDs. So, please forgive me if I have little sympathy for the 'Big Five'.

I wouldn't shed too many tears if the power of the RIAA is broken...but, in principle, I'd have to agree that piracy is not something to promote. And if the Music Store can start shifting the balance of power so that the labels have less power, and the artists more, I'm all for that.

But, in all likelihood, the RIAA, like the big media companies, will still be influential once things settle down. It's just that they're going to have to share some of that power....

Phil Of Mac

Jul 30, 2003, 02:42 AM

Originally posted by doc_mac
Actually by hiking half way up a hill with midmountain lifts you can. Reason, mountains rarely check lift passes halfway up.;)

Thanks for the tip! :)

Just kidding :D

Phil Of Mac

Jul 30, 2003, 02:48 AM

Originally posted by Snowy_River
Well, yes, there is, but most of the money is not in being a service provider for downloaded songs. Some money may be there to be made, but you can be sure that the labels are making a lot more than the service providers.

Yeah, until Britney Spears' contract with her label runs out and she ditches the label and signs on independently with iTMS (very plausible, if iTMS replaces conventional record stores 5 years from now). Apple and Britney split the savings. Now you're talking profit.

Originally posted by Snowy_River
Well, yes, and a big part of how they win from this deal is the iPod. Make it easier to get music to your computer, and you want to be able to take it with you. Presto! More iPod sales. I don't think that Apple is making much money, net, from iTMS itself.

And the iPod will come with iTunes for Windows once it's out, resulting in more iTMS users, more iTMS sales while the resultant market forces close down some record stores, forcing more people to choose iTMS, so more iPods, etc. It's a cascading effect that will conquer the world.

Originally posted by Snowy_River
Even if they are making that money through illegal business practices? It's fairly well known (and there's even been a case or two about it) that the RIAA is guilty of price fixing when it comes to CDs. So, please forgive me if I have little sympathy for the 'Big Five'.

I don't think condemning the RIAA is worthwhile. They're dead now anyway, thanks to iTMS. The only thing saving this venture is that the labels are too dumb to know it.

macnews

Jul 30, 2003, 03:11 AM

Originally posted by jaykk
According to Macobserver (http://www.macobserver.com/article/2003/07/29.6.shtml) , musicmatch is going to be a real competitor to iTMS. hurry up, apple.

Both are due out at year end so Apple should be fine so long as they meet the deadline and come out just before musicmatch.

Apple will also have almost 9 months of press and reputation to play on where Musicmatch won't be quit as established (in terms of an online download service).

Snowy_River

Jul 30, 2003, 03:16 AM

Originally posted by gwangung
I wouldn't shed too many tears if the power of the RIAA is broken...but, in principle, I'd have to agree that piracy is not something to promote. And if the Music Store can start shifting the balance of power so that the labels have less power, and the artists more, I'm all for that.

Forgive me, I didn't mean to sound like I was condoning piracy. In general, I am very against it. (Yes, I have downloaded songs, but a total of maybe a dozen. And of those, only a few were 'keepers', and, in general, those inspired me to buy the albums that they were on... used. ;) )

I actually got into quite a discussion about iTMS vs illegal downloading with a friend of mine over this last weekend. She said that she wouldn't pay $.99 for a song that she could download for free. That's an attitude that I don't agree with, but I guess it's her risk to take...

But, in all likelihood, the RIAA, like the big media companies, will still be influential once things settle down. It's just that they're going to have to share some of that power....

Oh, I'm sure that they will be, but they will also be a changed power. They won't have the absolute reign that they mostly have now.

It will be a good day, when it comes...

tduality

Jul 30, 2003, 03:26 AM

Originally posted by jaedreth

Keep in mind that this isn't simply a music player. It keeps track of your computer being *authorized* to play music by your ethernet hardware address.

Everyone, before you send your machines in for repair, de-authorize your computer. If they replace the mlb, Apple can't give you that authorization back that you will lose.

Jaedreth

The 'mlb' :confused: Sorry to ask as stupid question: What's the 'mlb'?

The computer is authorized by the ethernet hardware addess? Could I 'authorize' another computer by plugging in this ethernet card. This would deauthorize the other one so its not worth the trouble, just asking.

tduality

tduality

Jul 30, 2003, 03:40 AM

vrapan

Jul 30, 2003, 03:55 AM

I spend twice as much going skiing every year. How come no one bitches about the skiing industry?

Well you will pay at least 10 times that a year for a car but you won't bitch for a car either.

Let me give you an example. A few years back in UK car prices were sky high many models selling for as much as 75% higher than the same car in Europe. People went on and bought them form Europe. That was majorly inconvenient (had to find a dealer, have to have the cash for the car, deal with the steering wheel being on the opposite side than UK cars deal with customs and so on.) People went on with that though because they could save a lot of money. Point: people were "bitching" about hugely expensive cars and they found an inconvenient way to circumvent the price fixing and they went ahead. It was an abused market and someone had to do something about it.

The records market is just as abused. 20$ for a new CD no matter which. 20$ regardless if there is one song worth listening and 9 fillers or there are 9 good songs and one that you may not like. Have the record industry been less greedy and offered to people cheaper music, easier access to hits or compilations on the spot, more one song CDs and the price among CDs reflected their value things would be a lot different. Why would you want to waste time to find one song that someone ripped on his computer which has clicks and pops and sounds horrible on your stereo when you have an acceptable alternative? Sure some people might still prefer the free but with a well thought campaign against it and good service it would have been kept to a minimum. It is not like they dont have enough money to invest in such schemes it is that they were stubborn and greedy and hate change and want to play it tough. That does not do anything for their image and does not help to convert from freeto paying.

instantypo

Jul 30, 2003, 05:49 AM

Originally posted by Phil Of Mac
Apple and Britney
Please ... some integrity ;-)
And the iPod will come with iTunes for Windows once it's out, resulting in more iTMS users, more iTMS sales
Now that's a great thought. Indeed, which winuser would refrain from installing a free application knowing that it's supposed to be quite good? Even though they normally settle for mediocre stuff, they'll get hooked once they install winTunes ...

ewinemiller

Jul 30, 2003, 07:35 AM

Originally posted by jaedreth
Keep in mind that this isn't simply a music player. It keeps track of your computer being *authorized* to play music by your ethernet hardware address.

Everyone, before you send your machines in for repair, de-authorize your computer. If they replace the mlb, Apple can't give you that authorization back that you will lose.

This may be an issue on PCs as well, when iTMS hits Windows.

Jaedreth

I think it's something different than MAC address (the ethernet hardware address), or maybe some combination of things. I have Jaguar and 10.1 installed, if I reboot into the 10.1 install and try to play anything I've bought it won't saying I have to authorize that machine. If it was simply MAC address it would work because it's the same network card.

jayscheuerle

Jul 30, 2003, 08:49 AM

I'm guessing that Apple's had a Windows version of iTunes and the iStore ready to go from day one, they just haven't been allowed to release it yet.

How could they not? It's not like they came up with this overnight and just decided that "Hey, it's doing so well, let's release it to the other 90% of home users out there!".

It's sitting in the can, waiting for the green light.

- j

jaykk

Jul 30, 2003, 10:32 AM

I think apple won't be ready for windows till the end of year for 2 reasons. They are still negotiating with labels for a similar contract. I also doubt that windows version of itunes is nearly done.If iTunes for windows was ready why didn't they ship it instead of music match when they released windows version of iPod. Apple should have sold more iPods if they had iTunes ready to ship with them.

hayesk

Jul 30, 2003, 11:03 AM

Originally posted by tduality
The 'mlb' :confused: Sorry to ask as stupid question: What's the 'mlb'?

Main Logic Board. In most Macs, the ethernet card is on there.

Capt Underpants

Jul 30, 2003, 11:12 AM

Great news that it is still on track. Maybe it will come out before Christmas and I will get an iPod. That would be great! Well I ca nt wait for iTMS for windows. Apple needs to get a wider targetted audience.

Neotronik

Jul 30, 2003, 11:15 AM

Apple has been on the right track with the itunes music store.
For one; Itunes is a blast. It's incredible; I love it. I'm a dj/remixer/producer and use both mac and pee cee's. Well; partially; My mac experience has only been on the titanium g4 powerbook; but what an experience it's been; sad to say; I have to replace the logic board; someone tripped over the powercoard and the neckbone was connected to the backbone; yada., yada, yada, so while it's getting replaced; The hobbyist inside me prompted me to build a so called monster pee cee a few weeks ago; I ordered the abit at7max2 motherboard
with an amd 2800+xp processor One and a half gigs of pc 2700 ddr. Seagate 120 serial ata hard drive; and a western digital 80 gig (8mb cache) just for win xp pro OS and app installs. ati radeon 9700 pro; Sony 52x cdrw; All housed in the blue Thermaltake xaser III 2000 (the one with the window on the side)
I must tell you that the performance of this system was shocking.
AMD WOW!!!!!! I actually respected windows xp pro as an os.
Back to the topic at hand:
I needed some tunes in my ipod so; I downloaded music match; sadly updated the firmware in my ipod and had my first pee cee nightmare; Musicmatch IS HORRIBLE; it is nothing like Itunes and couldn't come close. File managment is horrible. I did manage to get my songs into the ipod; but my files and song genres; NOPE!!!
ITUNES is so advanced that it actually works the way a logical human being would. I can't begin to tell you how i miss the itunes experience. MusicMatch is terrible and poses no threat to apples itunes should it come out for windows.
I do think that apple should again think differently when crossing over to this dangerous murky os/computing platform. CHOICE!!!! Choice is key; itunes for windows should allow the user a choice of going to the Itunes music store or buymusic.com or napster 2 (when it comes out) to buy your music. People love choices not restrictions. If you chose the wmf format as your preferred format; after the rest of us finish gagging Itunes will direct you to buymusic.com a/k/a buymusic.com/acompleteitunesmusicstorerippoff. This would make it the ultimate software of choice for enjoying music.
Sadly; I regret to inform you that when plugging in my camcorder to the firewire port on the thermaltake case (top) which connected to the internal firewire pins on the abit motherboard; it froze; i rebooted; there wasn't even a POST. it was the last time I saw my pee cee working; switched graphics card to another motherboard and it was fine; this sucker died on me. I plugged this camcorder into my powerbook; used imovie and final cut with no problems and 0 configuration and 0 crashes. I was frustrated; I sent all the components back to where I bought them; crying; because i really do like AMD; again WOW!!!!! Anyhow I absorbed 140 dollars in restocking fees and went to www.apple.com and ordered a dual 2ghz g5 with a 17 inch apple display and apple care (i didn't purchase applecare with my powerbook and am suffering dearly) Anyhow the G5 will ship on or before october 2nd. So now I await my powerbook g4 500 to be resurrected and the g5 will soon be joining us with itunes and it's music store less musicmatch and systematic destruction when plugging in a firewire camcorder. Oddly; my pee cee solution which is still a workhorse is my original Micron Millenia Max pc pentium II 400 with ultra wide scsi controller, hd, cd-rom,external scsi cdrw running windows 98 se tweaked to death. Once AMD introduces the amd 64 I am going to attempt to build another monster and hopefully itunes for windows will be out!!!!! That's my choice hands down over all this other crap that's coming.

Apple for Life Baby!!!!!!!!!

Dephex Twin

Jul 30, 2003, 12:46 PM

Originally posted by SiliconAddict
I thought you guys were over reacting to the ads that they were putting out but I saw my first one last night while watching the SCIFI channel (StarGate SG1 RULES!) and I was totally blown away.
The brass pair on the marketing people at that company has to be about the size of Mount Everest. I just sat there jaw hanging open quietly laughing. :eek: Blatant rip-off nothing! They practically cut and paste scenes into the commercial. (OK maybe not that far but dang!) If there was any justice in this world, and there isn’t, buymusic.com will go under in a month. I first saw that ad last night, and I honestly thought it truly was an Apple ad. Then I started thinking "something is strange about the iPods they are holding... hmm" but still the idea never occurred to me this wasn't an Apple ad-- how could it not be?? Without the slightest exaggeration, EVERY aspect of the Apple ads is copied. Obviously at the end I saw it wasn't. Although I am pretty sure if, say, my mom saw that ad, she would be confused that it wasn't Apple.

Plus, Apple should really go after that "79¢" thing that flashes at the end of the buymusic.com ad. When Apple says "99¢", every single song you can buy is ALWAYS 99¢, no more no less. Buymusic does not have that 79 for every song by any means.

Since basically the copied style of that ad is saying "you know the iTMS? We are EXACTLY like the iTunes Music Store, but look, only 79¢". And it's not even true. In fact, the ad almost says "hey, maybe we *are* the Windows iTunes Music Store". Intentional brand confusion.

Okay I'm done.

ptd

Jul 30, 2003, 01:35 PM

Your mention of 9 months of reputation and press got me thnking. The best thing we should be doing as ITMS customers is show all of our friends how much this service rules. Show it off and get all of our friends counting down the days until the service opens.

Originally posted by macnews
Both are due out at year end so Apple should be fine so long as they meet the deadline and come out just before musicmatch.

Apple will also have almost 9 months of press and reputation to play on where Musicmatch won't be quit as established (in terms of an online download service).

Snowy_River

Jul 30, 2003, 02:33 PM

Originally posted by ptd
Your mention of 9 months of reputation and press got me thnking. The best thing we should be doing as ITMS customers is show all of our friends how much this service rules. Show it off and get all of our friends counting down the days until the service opens.

That's a great idea. The only downside that I've found is that most Windows users I talk to say that they couldn't care less about a service that charges $.99 per song when they can get it for free from P2P. :rolleyes:

Does this mean that Mac users are inherently more law-abiding? ;)

vrapan

Jul 30, 2003, 02:47 PM

Does this mean that Mac users are inherently more law-abiding?

That would give to the record industry something to think about. Just imagine copyright protected CDs only for PC users or "No online music stores allowed for Windows users." I am telling you tough DRM on Windows is the best advertisement for Macs :D

jaedreth

Jul 30, 2003, 02:48 PM

Actually, for the most part, yes.

PC users want it *cheap* if not free. (generalization)

Mac users want quality. Mac users expect to get what they pay for. They'd rather spend $0.99 and get a song in superb quality, than to get it for free and have to put up with the lack of quality.

Jaedreth

papaash

Jul 30, 2003, 02:57 PM

Originally posted by vrapan
In my PC days - till February this year - after that I bought a cute little PowerBook and got hooked to Apple big time MusicMatch was my music jukebox of choice. It is not bad software but:

1. It is not match for the elegance of iTunes not even close. in iTunes I had categorised and fixed my 1000+ songs in a couple of hours. In musicmatch I had kinda given up.

2. All the first major releases and the next two or three minor updates are unstable big time. I mean I started using it since 5.00 till the 5.2 no kidding it was crashing several times a day. Things got much better on 5.5 i think. Then the same with 6 - 6.2 and 7-7.2 and then now 8 my bro that still has a PC says it is crashing on him quite often. Never used it with a Windows iPod but after this sort of experience I am not sure I want to.

...I recently left the Wintel world, too (about two months ago, after a fifteen-year hiatus from Apple), and I think your post is spot on...

...my music jukebox of choice was RealJukebox...I was using a real older version, (4.0 or 5.0?), because everytime Real updated their software, it became more cumbersome, more restrictive and more buggy...it became, finally, a major pain in the behind to do anything with it - or that memory eater Windows Media Player - and other products like Winamp just didn't do it for me...

...but I can't think of a program in the Wintel world of audio software that works like iTunes...everything's done in the background, so there's very little for you to organize and such; you rip and fuggedaboutit...the "Shuffle" feature doesn't choose three hundred songs out of a library of 1500 and continuously loop them to your increasing consternation...the integration with the OS is hassle-free, and with Music Store it's virtually seamless; because OS X doesn't have all that stuff going on in the background screwing with your downloads (unlike Windoze), when you buy music it is on your hard drive within seconds...the way iTunes compliments my iPod is just phenomenal (and I do so love my iPod; it's just one more reason why - along with my iMac - Apple continues to prove itself as a world-class leader and innovator)...

...upon further reflection, and to be blunt, there is nothing in the Wintel world that can compete with iTunes for ease-of-use, intuitiveness and simplicity...it is not a chore to organize your music, burn it to CDs, copy it to your mp3 player, or add new tunes, as it is with every music organizer I've ever had the displeasure of using with Micro$oft...

...I don't think Apple has anything to worry about, as far as head-to-head competition goes...there will be a choice, to be sure, but I think that if Apple is able to make iTunes for Windoze resemble the Mac version as closely as possible (a chore, I know, considering how Windoze is supported by every two-bit computer manufacturer there is), and is - more importantly - able to highlight and stress those differences to its target audience through marketing and a grassroot word-of-mouth campaign, then the choice will be clear: do you want a substandard program and music store that restricts how you manipulate your content and is a dog to manuver through, or do you want a pristine program that combines simplicty with elegance and offers a great music-buying service, to boot?...