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MacRumors
Aug 1, 2007, 11:59 AM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com)

In wake of rumors that Apple would be releasing a Mac OS X 10.4.11 update, Apple has already seeded developers with 10.4.11 (8S2138/8S138).

A list of bug fixes has been publicly circulating, and include: AFP Server, CUPS and IPP, dyld and prebinding, CoreTextFont, ImageIO, dyld and threaded programs, SearchKit, enabling/disabling Bluetooth, CoreAudio and Safari, CoreAudio and decoding iTunes Plus files, File Manager and POSIX volumes, Daylight Savings and New Zealand time zones, Networking and Cisco VPN, Networking and UDP packets,HFS and non-existent blocks, Directory Services, AFP X Client and Kerberos, SearchKit and Zip disks, and Service Manager.

Apple last updated Mac OS X 10.4 (Tiger) on June 20th, 2007 (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/06/20/apple-releases-mac-os-x-10-4-10/).

Article Link (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/08/01/apple-seeds-mac-os-x-10-4-11-8s2138-8s138/)



uv23
Aug 1, 2007, 12:03 PM
Please God, let them fix the energy saver "screen dimming" bug.

mkrishnan
Aug 1, 2007, 12:09 PM
Surprising! It's nice to see continuing development on cleaning up the Tiger codebase. :)

parapup
Aug 1, 2007, 12:10 PM
A list of bug fixes has been publicly circulating, and include: AFP Server, CUPS and IPP, dyld and prebinding ...

Article Link (http://www.macrumors.com/2007/08/01/apple-seeds-mac-os-x-10-4-11-8s2138-8s138/)

Yeah, I sure hope they mean to fix the nasty dyld/prebinding bug - that one has eaten up various of people's files leaving unstartable apps. (This occurs when updating OSX - If you are say, using Mail.app at the time when it does "Optimizing Performance" you are in bad luck - Mail.app will no longer start next time.)

This bug has impacted me recently during the 10.4.9 update.

G4DP
Aug 1, 2007, 12:14 PM
With all of these recent updates, seems Apple is starting to tie up all the loose ends. Although the testers here have reported 10.5 is still buggy, progress is obviously being made. So hopefully no more delays, and I can by that new MacPro in October.

BWhaler
Aug 1, 2007, 12:14 PM
While bug fixes are always great, for me the BEST part of having 10.4.10 or 10.4.11 releases is it will put to an end, once and for all, the dumbest thread/postings in the Apple Kingdom.

There was nothing worse, and it happened ever time the OS version number got to .8 or .9 to see people debate endlessly if .10 was possible.

Is it a decimal? Wouldn't that be the same as .1?

It was painful.

Thank you Apple for the bug fixes and ended this thread all in one swoop.

HyperX
Aug 1, 2007, 12:18 PM
I really hope its fixes the HORRIBLE 8600M GT Drivers.

bradc
Aug 1, 2007, 12:21 PM
I want 10.5 to come out solely for the eye candy, I'm getting bored of the Genie Effect.

cliffjumper68
Aug 1, 2007, 12:24 PM
It is interesting that a OS that works as well as OSX would have so many "bugg" fixes. I guess that just illustrates the eternal advance to perfection.

kalisphoenix
Aug 1, 2007, 12:28 PM
While bug fixes are always great, for me the BEST part of having 10.4.10 or 10.4.11 releases is it will put to an end, once and for all, the dumbest thread/postings in the Apple Kingdom.

There was nothing worse, and it happened ever time the OS version number got to .8 or .9 to see people debate endlessly if .10 was possible.

Is it a decimal? Wouldn't that be the same as .1?

It was painful.

Thank you Apple for the bug fixes and ended this thread all in one swoop.

Seems to me that you're sustaining it.

CrackedButter
Aug 1, 2007, 12:28 PM
I like the fact that Apple are prepared to fix the current operating system knowing they are soon to release a new one. Unlike MS whose attitude differs somewhat on how to get a fix for a software problem, they force you to buy the new version!

daneoni
Aug 1, 2007, 12:31 PM
I really hope its fixes the HORRIBLE 8600M GT Drivers.

Are you saying the drivers are subpar?

trevorlsciact
Aug 1, 2007, 12:34 PM
Please God, let them fix the energy saver "screen dimming" bug.

What is the bug :confused:

Eidorian
Aug 1, 2007, 12:35 PM
What is the bug :confused:I'd like to know as well.

kalisphoenix
Aug 1, 2007, 12:38 PM
I'd like to know as well.

1. Tell your MacBook/? not to dim the screen after being idle for a while (not switch off the backlight, just dim it).
2. Reboot.
3. Repeat step 1, saying "Didn't I just @#$%ing tell it not to do that?"
4. Repeat step 2, and then 1 again.
5. Skip to step 6.
6. If you drink the Kool-Aid, turn to page 23. If you politely refuse, turn to page 12.

(At least, if this is the bug I'm thinking of)

iSee
Aug 1, 2007, 12:38 PM
While bug fixes are always great, for me the BEST part of having 10.4.10 or 10.4.11 releases is it will put to an end, once and for all, the dumbest thread/postings in the Apple Kingdom.

There was nothing worse, and it happened ever time the OS version number got to .8 or .9 to see people debate endlessly if .10 was possible.

Is it a decimal? Wouldn't that be the same as .1?

It was painful.

Thank you Apple for the bug fixes and ended this thread all in one swoop.
Are you, like, a professor or something?

I'm just curious.

The reason I ask is...

because that's ancient history! :rolleyes:;):D:)

Ha ha ha ha, I'm a card! :D

TuffLuffJimmy
Aug 1, 2007, 12:38 PM
What is the bug :confused:

It's the bug where when you set the screen to not automatically dim to save power, but when you restart the computer it switches back to dimming.
The bug I want fixed is when you change your junk mail to automatically delete the junk when mail is quit it only works once, the next time you start mail it is back to do nothing.

Eidorian
Aug 1, 2007, 12:40 PM
1. Tell your MacBook/? not to dim the screen after being idle for a while (not switch off the backlight, just dim it).
2. Reboot.
3. Repeat step 1, saying "Didn't I just @#$%ing tell it not to do that?"
4. Repeat step 2, and then 1 again.
5. Skip to step 6.
6. If you drink the Kool-Aid, turn to page 23. If you politely refuse, turn to page 12.

(At least, if this is the bug I'm thinking of)1. I like auto dimming
2. No laptop :p

HyperX
Aug 1, 2007, 12:40 PM
Are you saying the drivers are subpar?

Are you saying system Lockups in open GL, slower then X1600 performance, and stupid amounts of heat are par? ;P

It feels like I am on an ATI card in Ubunutu ;P

Yankees 4 Life
Aug 1, 2007, 12:42 PM
about time. My mac has been really bogged down the past couple of weeks.

kalisphoenix
Aug 1, 2007, 12:43 PM
1. I like auto dimming

I hate it. I spend most of my day staring at the screen in confusion and dismay, and it distracts me for it to dim. I start thinking the world as a whole suddenly got brighter, and then I start looking under the desk and in the closets for tiny hippies that might've invaded and started trying to change things. Damn hippies and their "free love." Got me nowhere.

Eidorian
Aug 1, 2007, 12:44 PM
I hate it. I spend most of my day staring at the screen in confusion and dismay, and it distracts me for it to dim. I start thinking the world as a whole suddenly got brighter, and then I start looking under the desk and in the closets for tiny hippies that might've invaded and started trying to change things. Damn hippies and their "free love." Got me nowhere.I'm sure you don't touch your input devices then.

daneoni
Aug 1, 2007, 12:45 PM
Are you saying system Lockups in open GL, slower then X1600 performance, and stupid amounts of heat are par? ;P

It feels like I am on an ATI card in Ubunutu ;P

I didnt really know about the issues. Honest question it was, i dont own an SR MBP.

If this is the case then hopefully Apple addresses this in the update

kalisphoenix
Aug 1, 2007, 12:47 PM
I'm sure you don't touch your input devices then.

Not constantly. I mean, I read and deliberate more than I do anything else. I use a small font scaling so I can fit more words on the screen and move less often. Moving is a pain in the ass. So I read a page or so of an article or draft, think about it, and then the screen goes dim. I tap the trackpad, think about it, and then the screen goes dim. I write a few paragraphs, think about it, and then the screen goes dim. And so forth. It's irritating because it's a distraction, and I already have a cat that likes to climb on my head while I'm trying to write.

k2k koos
Aug 1, 2007, 12:49 PM
It's great to see Apple still fully supporting Tiger, and still fixing it, eventhough Leopard is around the corner.

Tiger has been and is a great OS, I just hope that Leopard will be as stable as Tiger in it's current incarnation, otherwise we are going to get all the same threads again, as we had when transitioning from Panther to Tiger (Tiger sucks, not stable, wish I had not upgraded, Apple sucks etc etc). So here is a pre warning to all those who judge before they think.

When Leopard is released, there are bound to be a few bugs, and other issues you'd like to have fixed. These will be fixed over time, and Tiger is living proof of how well Apple does it. So if it is not up to your expectations, you have two choices:

A: Embrace it and enjoy it, despite bugs etc, knowing you have the planets most advanced OS on your machine
B: Wait a few revisions, and then upgrade. Just don't come to these forums moaning and grunting.

:apple:

Mitthrawnuruodo
Aug 1, 2007, 12:50 PM
Please God, let them fix the energy saver "screen dimming" bug.

What is the bug :confused:

I'd like to know as well.

Intel-based Macs: Built-in display dims before sleep (http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=304092)

Eidorian
Aug 1, 2007, 12:51 PM
Not constantly. I mean, I read and deliberate more than I do anything else. I use a small font scaling so I can fit more words on the screen and move less often. Moving is a pain in the ass. So I read a page or so of an article or draft, think about it, and then the screen goes dim. I tap the trackpad, think about it, and then the screen goes dim. I write a few paragraphs, think about it, and then the screen goes dim. And so forth. It's irritating because it's a distraction, and I already have a cat that likes to climb on my head while I'm trying to write.I can understand it could be annoying but my Energy Savers aren't set to kick in so quickly.

cleanup
Aug 1, 2007, 12:51 PM
Is this going to fix that debilitating wireless-signal-dropping bug on 10.4.10 MacBooks?

I had to downgrade to 10.4.9 and delete 10.4.10 from my Software Update just to avoid this.

G-Force
Aug 1, 2007, 12:52 PM
Please God, let them fix the energy saver "screen dimming" bug.
I agree with you there, this feature hasn't worked without problems for ages in my experience. First it didn't work at all when you clicked it once (like Mitthrawnuruodo stated, you had to click it twice to make it effective) and now with 10.4.10 it does work for me, until I restart the computer... what's up with that. My iMac doesn't need screen dimming, it's really annoying when watching YouTube videos...

I also would like to see this Safari (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=238911) bug fixed. And yes, it is a bug, I filed it at Apple and I got the response that Apple Engineering knew about the problem and was investigating it. :)

iBunny
Aug 1, 2007, 12:56 PM
I really hope its fixes the HORRIBLE 8600M GT Drivers.

Yes. Lets hope

overcast
Aug 1, 2007, 12:58 PM
I like the fact that Apple are prepared to fix the current operating system knowing they are soon to release a new one. Unlike MS whose attitude differs somewhat on how to get a fix for a software problem, they force you to buy the new version!
What the hell are you carrying on about? Microsoft supports their OS's for at least ten years. There are STILL updates to XP and Vista is out. There are even STILL updates for Windows 98 released! The MAC community in large is so disillusioned to anything outside of Apple it makes me feel sick sometimes to be a part of it.

Nappi
Aug 1, 2007, 12:58 PM
I hope this will finally allow me to transfer songs to my mp3-player in OS X. I'm tired of running XP just because of that.

There seems to be a problem with the recognition of some usb hard-drives and similar devices with the current version of OS X. According to some posters in Apple forums the problems started after they updated their machine to 10.4.10. I haven't tested whether it all worked smoothly in the earlier versions, all I know is that OS X doesn't recognize my Samsung YP-Z5F.

trevorlsciact
Aug 1, 2007, 12:58 PM
Is this going to fix that debilitating wireless-signal-dropping bug on 10.4.10 MacBooks?

I had to downgrade to 10.4.9 and delete 10.4.10 from my Software Update just to avoid this.

Haha, your avatar made me think their was a bug on my screen :p :apple:

HyperX
Aug 1, 2007, 01:00 PM
I didnt really know about the issues. Honest question it was, i dont own an SR MBP.

If this is the case then hopefully Apple addresses this in the update

Me too, it is REALLY REALLY BAD! Most Gaes, Second Life, hell even Motion are unstable... they dont even crash just locks the WHOLE system! You can backdate to 10.4.9 but if you did the EFI update the system performance is HORRIBLE.. so either Ibook G4 1ghz speed or The Spped you paid for with daily crahes. In regards to open GL...

It is sad how much time I am being forced to spend in Vista ;\

alec
Aug 1, 2007, 01:01 PM
Well, still another few months until 10.5. At least they aren't keeping us in purgatory with a lack of software updates.

CmdrLaForge
Aug 1, 2007, 01:05 PM
I guess no one care but I reported 10.4.11 already on July 11th on my Blog (http://www.maccast.de/).

kalisphoenix
Aug 1, 2007, 01:09 PM
I can understand it could be annoying but my Energy Savers aren't set to kick in so quickly.

Mine are set for three hours. I close the lid when I want it to go to sleep/dim the screen.

tubagruv
Aug 1, 2007, 01:12 PM
Not constantly. I mean, I read and deliberate more than I do anything else. I use a small font scaling so I can fit more words on the screen and move less often. Moving is a pain in the ass. So I read a page or so of an article or draft, think about it, and then the screen goes dim. I tap the trackpad, think about it, and then the screen goes dim. I write a few paragraphs, think about it, and then the screen goes dim. And so forth. It's irritating because it's a distraction, and I already have a cat that likes to climb on my head while I'm trying to write.

Had the same problem.

http://www.lightheadsw.com/caffeine/

Not a real bug fix, but a solid workaround.

notjustjay
Aug 1, 2007, 01:16 PM
10.4.11, eh? I guess it's finally time to upgrade from Panther? :D

A shame, I bought a Tiger install DVD off eBay like a year ago with the hopes that "any day now" I would find time to wipe my hard drive and reinstall fresh... but I've been so busy I haven't found time to do so. Now with Leopard around the corner I wonder if I might just skip Tiger entirely.

phanboyjohn
Aug 1, 2007, 01:19 PM
What the hell are you carrying on about? Microsoft supports their OS's for at least ten years. There are STILL updates to XP and Vista is out. There are even STILL updates for Windows 98 released! The MAC community in large is so disillusioned to anything outside of Apple it makes me feel sick sometimes to be a part of it.

I agree that we shouldn't let fanboy-ism dominate us, but let's take a step back here. Windows 98 is no longer supported in any way, shape, or form--because of the lack of updates, it's now an extremely insecure way of doing business. It's good that there are still updates to XP, but let's not take this too far.

And as sick as fanboys may make you, doesn't the fact that you have a nice user experience make up for it? :)

As much as it pains me sometimes to hear the crooning of the fanboy, as a recent switcher, I'd never go back. It'd be like punching myself in the face in an attempt to have fun.

kalisphoenix
Aug 1, 2007, 01:20 PM
Had the same problem.

http://www.lightheadsw.com/caffeine/

Not a real bug fix, but a solid workaround.

Ooh. Thanks :)

MacTCP
Aug 1, 2007, 01:22 PM
It will be good to see Tiger being updated again. 10.4.10 didn't seem like a final update. It doesn't seem as stable as it could be yet.

seashellz
Aug 1, 2007, 01:22 PM
So shouldnt this new update be called 10.4.10.1? ;-)

Lycanthrope
Aug 1, 2007, 01:26 PM
So shouldnt this new update be called 10.4.10.1? ;-)

Nah, 10.4.10 should have been 10.4.A and now .11 .B ;)

uv23
Aug 1, 2007, 01:26 PM
1. Tell your MacBook/? not to dim the screen after being idle for a while (not switch off the backlight, just dim it).
2. Reboot.
3. Repeat step 1, saying "Didn't I just @#$%ing tell it not to do that?"
4. Repeat step 2, and then 1 again.
5. Skip to step 6.
6. If you drink the Kool-Aid, turn to page 23. If you politely refuse, turn to page 12.

(At least, if this is the bug I'm thinking of)
Yup, that's the one. Drives me absolutely batty. Especially since I've reported it numerous times to Apple, and if I remember correctly, it's been a bug all the way back since Panther.

phanboyjohn
Aug 1, 2007, 01:41 PM
Ooh. Thanks :)

Maybe try Jiggler, as well? I use it to make sure nothing like a screensaver pops up during DVDs and such.

BWhaler
Aug 1, 2007, 01:50 PM
What the hell are you carrying on about? Microsoft supports their OS's for at least ten years. There are STILL updates to XP and Vista is out. There are even STILL updates for Windows 98 released! The MAC community in large is so disillusioned to anything outside of Apple it makes me feel sick sometimes to be a part of it.

1. The reason why Microsoft supports their OS's for that long is because the US Government made them. (Part of their anti-trust settlement.)

Before the FTC made Microsoft, they were quick to obsolete their products and screw-over their customers

2. It's "Mac," not "MAC." MAC is a network technical term.


I agree that SOME Mac fanboys are annoying. As John Gruber at daringfireball.net once pointed out, the true Apple fans are the ones who continually push Apple to do better and can see their faults. (And with Apple's sloppy quality of late, particularly in their laptop line and with the displays, it's getting easier and easier

But what is worse are the haters who treat the Mac community as a singular unit, all people being the same, and makes generalizations which are generally fabricated and filled with hatred.

Understand this: you have zero basis for your claim, "The MAC community in large is so disillusioned to anything outside of Apple" Could you possible generalize more about millions of people an unfounded personal opinion?

At least those that are part of the Apple community are passionate, not filled with hate and come here to have fun, not say condescending this.

Remember that next time time you want to post something like that.

Quillz
Aug 1, 2007, 01:51 PM
Surprising! It's nice to see continuing development on cleaning up the Tiger codebase. :)

I see no reason why it wouldn't. Leopard still isn't due for another two months, and even then, most people aren't going to move to Leopard right away. After all, Tiger works fine, nothing outright wrong with it. It's like how Microsoft is actively marketing Vista, but is still continuing to support XP, at least for the next few years. I imagine Apple will continue to support Tiger for at least the next year or so.

Le Big Mac
Aug 1, 2007, 01:55 PM
I guess no one care but I reported 10.4.11 already on July 11th on my Blog (http://www.maccast.de/).

When are you predicting 10.4.12? Surely we'll need that at/around release of Leopard.

Penryn
Aug 1, 2007, 02:10 PM
The reason why Microsoft supports their OS's for that long is because the US Government made them. (Part of their anti-trust settlement.)

Is this true to Apple aswell, seems that support for Panther stoppen at .9?

But good to see that some more bugs are sorted out (Y).

tuck1989
Aug 1, 2007, 02:14 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/420+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Mobile/1C25 Safari/419.3)

to those who talk about tiger's "stability"...

I am a big apple fan have been for years. But I have got to say that despite all of apple's software updates for their current os, I get A LOT of randomly crashing applications. I'm not talking about poorly coded shareware either, I'm talking final cut pro, color, livetype. I just made the switch to the mbp st, and while I adore thesl speed I get twice as many lockups and crashes. Tiger, stable?not for me... Maybe this new update wipl alleviate some of my concerns..

fastbite
Aug 1, 2007, 02:17 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/420+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Mobile/1C25 Safari/419.3)

to those who talk about tiger's "stability"...

I am a big apple fan have been for years. But I have got to say that despite all of apple's software updates for their current os, I get A LOT of randomly crashing applications. I'm not talking about poorly coded shareware either, I'm talking final cut pro, color, livetype. I just made the switch to the mbp st, and while I adore thesl speed I get twice as many lockups and crashes. Tiger, stable?not for me... Maybe this new update wipl alleviate some of my concerns..
Run Main Menu -- it may help.:)

HyperX
Aug 1, 2007, 02:24 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/420+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Mobile/1C25 Safari/419.3)

to those who talk about tiger's "stability"...

I am a big apple fan have been for years. But I have got to say that despite all of apple's software updates for their current os, I get A LOT of randomly crashing applications. I'm not talking about poorly coded shareware either, I'm talking final cut pro, color, livetype. I just made the switch to the mbp st, and while I adore thesl speed I get twice as many lockups and crashes. Tiger, stable?not for me... Maybe this new update wipl alleviate some of my concerns..

Do you mean MBP SR? Cause if you do it randomly crashes alot on EVERYONE. The Nvidia Drivers are very very poor.

circusbass
Aug 1, 2007, 02:28 PM
Is this going to fix that debilitating wireless-signal-dropping bug on 10.4.10 MacBooks?

I had to downgrade to 10.4.9 and delete 10.4.10 from my Software Update just to avoid this.

I hope this gets fixed too. My Powerbook g4 has been doing that since I upgraded to 10.4.10. It is annoying as hell.

tuck1989
Aug 1, 2007, 02:29 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/420+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Mobile/1C25 Safari/419.3)

ah! Drivers... Haha that's probably it. Would display drivers be a problem for fcp though? I didn't think that was very GPU dependent. And yes, I meant mbp SR, typing on an iPhone :-)

Compile 'em all
Aug 1, 2007, 02:32 PM
Surprising! It's nice to see continuing development on cleaning up the Tiger codebase. :)

Not really. Not all people switch to the next new OS once it is released. I bet there are still many Panther and OS 9 :eek: users out there .

HyperX
Aug 1, 2007, 02:34 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/420+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Mobile/1C25 Safari/419.3)

ah! Drivers... Haha that's probably it. Would display drivers be a problem for fcp though? I didn't think that was very GPU dependent. And yes, I meant mbp SR, typing on an iPhone :-)

Too be honost I am not sure how GPU dependant it is. I know its very GPU dependant as soon as any effects are applied. I am sorta in stuck mode since AVCHD is not working so well in 6.0.1 it crashes ALOT. Voltaic just updated so I may get back to editing here shortly.

tuck1989
Aug 1, 2007, 02:38 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/420+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Mobile/1C25 Safari/419.3)

that sucks about avchd. I mostly edit for DVD so I'm always working with mpeg2...

HyperX
Aug 1, 2007, 02:42 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/420+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Mobile/1C25 Safari/419.3)

that sucks about avchd. I mostly edit for DVD so I'm always working with mpeg2...

Well yeah, AVCHD is really only used in a couple high end consumer camcorders anyways. It doesnt affect MPEG2 at all.

Seems like apple just quit getting anything right for a year for Iphone crappyness ;\ All there new products have been buggy at best and it's making me very unsatisfied!

tuck1989
Aug 1, 2007, 02:47 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/420+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.0 Mobile/1C25 Safari/419.3)

oh, you're talking about import problems. At least apple is better than avid, they still won't support my xh-a1's 24f mode :-(

InLikeALion
Aug 1, 2007, 02:53 PM
So the 10.4.10 wireless bug affects powerbooks too, not just intel machines? My wife's powerbook has been really inconsistent since we moved to our new apartment, and i assumed that it was the new place. I hadn't realized it could have been the update. Anyone confirm?

Le Big Mac
Aug 1, 2007, 02:54 PM
Is this true to Apple aswell, seems that support for Panther stoppen at .9?



they updated it in February

http://www.apple.com/support/downloads/securityupdate2007002panther.html

Although one needs to distinguish between updates and support. Apple supports Panther and other OS's, they just don't add new features to them any more. Microsoft stopped updating XP with new features several years ago.

Analog Kid
Aug 1, 2007, 03:04 PM
(This occurs when updating OSX - If you are say, using Mail.app at the time when it does "Optimizing Performance" you are in bad luck - Mail.app will no longer start next time.)
Oy! Hadn't heard about that one! Wish I had though...
I'm sure you don't touch your input devices then.
Is that how the kids refer to it these days?
I am a big apple fan have been for years. But I have got to say that despite all of apple's software updates for their current os, I get A LOT of randomly crashing applications. I'm not talking about poorly coded shareware either, I'm talking final cut pro, color, livetype. I just made the switch to the mbp st, and while I adore thesl speed I get twice as many lockups and crashes. Tiger, stable?not for me... Maybe this new update wipl alleviate some of my concerns..
I have to admit, Tiger never really felt finished, but I haven't had too much of a problem with random crashing. I seem to hear the most complaints from Intel owners-- I wonder if it has something to do with the fact that Intel support came in midstream with Tiger and never got as stable as it should have...

twoodcc
Aug 1, 2007, 03:09 PM
great! i bet it will be released next week

offwidafairies
Aug 1, 2007, 03:19 PM
With all of these recent updates, seems Apple is starting to tie up all the loose ends. Although the testers here have reported 10.5 is still buggy, progress is obviously being made. So hopefully no more delays, and I can by that new MacPro in October.

Ditto :D

I was having trouble with bluetooth just days ago....
I hope this fixes that!

Roadstar
Aug 1, 2007, 03:22 PM
Is this going to fix that debilitating wireless-signal-dropping bug on 10.4.10 MacBooks?

I had to downgrade to 10.4.9 and delete 10.4.10 from my Software Update just to avoid this.

No need to wait for 10.4.11, mate. Airport Update 2007-004 has been available on Software Update since yesterday. Fixed it for me.

InLikeALion
Aug 1, 2007, 03:39 PM
No need to wait for 10.4.11, mate. Airport Update 2007-004 has been available on Software Update since yesterday. Fixed it for me.

Did this update apply to powerbooks, too? Ours has had terrible wifi connectivity consistency issues for a month or so now, and I hadn't realized until a few posts ago that this could have coincided with the update to 10.4.10.

Has anyone else been having PPC airport problems since the last Tiger update?

Jim Campbell
Aug 1, 2007, 04:01 PM
I hope this gets fixed too. My Powerbook g4 has been doing that since I upgraded to 10.4.10. It is annoying as hell.

Likewise. Damn thing is practically unusable!

(On that note - if this message appears more than once, my apologies ... that'll be the MacBook timing out and me trying to unfreeze it.)

It seems to have also affected direct Mac-to-Mac Airport connections, because the MacBook is normally rock-solid at seeing the other machines in our house as well, but this too has been somewhat flaky since the 10.4.10 upgrade ... :(

Cheers!

Jim

circusbass
Aug 1, 2007, 04:12 PM
Did this update apply to powerbooks, too? Ours has had terrible wifi connectivity consistency issues for a month or so now, and I hadn't realized until a few posts ago that this could have coincided with the update to 10.4.10.

Has anyone else been having PPC airport problems since the last Tiger update?


My powerbook was rock solid at finding my signal at home as well. Now it ittermittently disconnects and reconnects a few minutes later. It all began a month ago for me as well. The update above was not for powerbooks it was for intel machines. I am crossing my fingers this update fixes this. If not I have no idea what to do.

fahlman
Aug 1, 2007, 04:14 PM
Is this true to Apple aswell, seems that support for Panther stoppen at .9?

Panther was updated yesterday when Apple patched a number of issues with Security Update 2007-007 (http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=306172).

parapup
Aug 1, 2007, 04:34 PM
Oy! Hadn't heard about that one! Wish I had though...

More details here (http://www.unsanity.org/archives/2007_03.php) . See the post titled "Shock and Awe: How Installing Apple's Updates can Render Your Mac Unbootable and How You Can Prevent it ". It's scary.

phillipjfry
Aug 1, 2007, 04:37 PM
Yeah, I sure hope they mean to fix the nasty dyld/prebinding bug - that one has eaten up various of people's files leaving unstartable apps. (This occurs when updating OSX - If you are say, using Mail.app at the time when it does "Optimizing Performance" you are in bad luck - Mail.app will no longer start next time.)

This bug has impacted me recently during the 10.4.9 update.

omg is that when u update or do something, and later on ur system just flat out crashes and burns because some weird system folder is missing all the files?? :(
That has happened to me i hate that!

GusR9
Aug 1, 2007, 04:42 PM
I hopo they can fix the airport issue with the macbooks, I recently made the update to 10.4.10 in my brand new MacBook and I sufferd a lot of kernel panics, I restored my system and I'm still with the version 10.4.9

theBB
Aug 1, 2007, 04:48 PM
Intel-based Macs: Built-in display dims before sleep (http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=304092)
That article is more than a year old. I guess they just gave up on fixing it. I'd think it would be pretty easy to fix. It is just a simple setting.

USB issues sound like a much bigger deal and I did not upgrade to 10.4.10 out of fear I'll hit by that bug. It is quite ironic that one of 10.4.10 bug fixes was USB issues. It sounds like that made things even worse.

Right now, Finder is the weakest link for me. It crashes every now and then, but it happens very quickly without freezing the whole computer, so it is not a big deal. I get annoyed more

1) when I drag and drop a large number of files and almost all of them end up sitting on top of each other until I sort them by name or something of that sort.

2) Sometimes items refuse to cling to the grid. This one is infrequent, but still annoying.

3) The "View Options" default to "all windows". How many times do you change your icon size or displayed columns types for all of your windows vs. change them for that particular window?

4) I also don't know how to change the default size of the new Finder windows.

For a piece of OSX that get used every day, Finder is definitely not Apple worthy. I hope Leopard version is better. Does anybody know?

parapup
Aug 1, 2007, 05:05 PM
omg is that when u update or do something, and later on ur system just flat out crashes and burns because some weird system folder is missing all the files?? :(
That has happened to me i hate that!

Yep, what file goes missing (becomes zero in size) depends on how lucky/unlucky you are - if you make sure no apps are running when Software Update runs and finishes you have a chance of being safe.

One would think with so many updates flowing they would fix this bug as priority #1 - but better late than never, let's hope that it gets fixed in 10.4.11.

Glenny2lappies
Aug 1, 2007, 05:06 PM
The one bug that is a right PITA is the bluetooth/wireless mouse driver crash. This is where you're using the wireless Mightymouse, close the lid of the Macbook or MBP and take it home. Then you discover it's not suspended and has been slowly cooking in your bag - not to mention consuming all the battery.

Once it's done this it won't even reboot on shutdown as it just sits there with a blue/whatever screen. The only way to complete the shutdown is to hold the button for 5 seconds.

Happens to my MBP quite often and also on a friend's Blackbook.

Best workaround is to remember to use the wireless Mightymouse to turn off Bluetooth. Even that's not guaranteed to work every time.

Damn frustrating - it's the sort of thing you'd expect from MS, not Apple. I do hope they fix this.

Glenny2lappies
Aug 1, 2007, 05:11 PM
... Finder is the weakest link for me...
...
For a piece of OSX that get used every day, Finder is definitely not Apple worthy. I hope Leopard version is better. Does anybody know?

Totally agree.

Could add to that a whole bunch of annoyances about Finder:
- searching for Entourage emails shows some filename corruption
- searching doesn't show the filesize
- maximum size for columns (there's some very big filenames I need to know about!)
- Wish there was a way of collecting all folders together a-la Windows 'splorer
- slideshow sometimes doesn't show all selected files

Sure I could go on.

Krevnik
Aug 1, 2007, 05:17 PM
For a piece of OSX that get used every day, Finder is definitely not Apple worthy. I hope Leopard version is better. Does anybody know?

Anyone who knows for sure is under NDA, and their opinion is subjective anyways. As for if bug fixes made it, that depends on if the other people using Leopard have the same usage patterns that bring out the bug.

mathwhiz90601
Aug 1, 2007, 05:52 PM
<blah blah rant from a laptop user> and I already have a cat that likes to climb on my head while I'm trying to write.

LOL funny:D. My cat just goes in my lap and bites my hand when I use it to move the mouse.

It's great to see Apple still fully supporting Tiger, and still fixing it, eventhough Leopard is around the corner.

Heck, they still support Panther. They came out with a 10.3.9 update too.

Nah, 10.4.10 should have been 10.4.A and now .11 .B ;)

Ooooh hex! I like.

From Reboot, the TV show:

... face to face to face to face to face with Hexadecimal!

Not really. Not all people switch to the next new OS once it is released. I bet there are still many Panther and OS 9 :eek: users out there .

Hi there, OS 9 user coming out of the woodwork. I have 2 machines with OS 9, one slowly and buggily emulated, the other with a mostly broken keyboard. Have to use Windows for most everything. :(

But new iMacs on Tuesday, so I'm good :D:D:D

daneoni
Aug 1, 2007, 06:04 PM
Totally agree.

Could add to that a whole bunch of annoyances about Finder:
- searching for Entourage emails shows some filename corruption
- searching doesn't show the filesize
- maximum size for columns (there's some very big filenames I need to know about!)
- Wish there was a way of collecting all folders together a-la Windows 'splorer
- slideshow sometimes doesn't show all selected files

Sure I could go on.

Might i recommend Path Finder (http://cocoatech.com/pf4/), it even seems to be faster than Finder when transferring files between volume amongst other tons of goodies. Great app.

tyr2
Aug 1, 2007, 06:08 PM
Networking and Cisco VPN

If it does bring stability to Cisco VPNs connections then it can't come soon enough for me.

Kawasaki
Aug 1, 2007, 06:36 PM
IT is good to hear this news.

theBB
Aug 1, 2007, 06:47 PM
Anyone who knows for sure is under NDA, and their opinion is subjective anyways. As for if bug fixes made it, that depends on if the other people using Leopard have the same usage patterns that bring out the bug.
True. I did not think of the NDA.

agore
Aug 1, 2007, 06:52 PM
The one bug that is a right PITA is the bluetooth/wireless mouse driver crash. This is where you're using the wireless Mightymouse, close the lid of the Macbook or MBP and take it home. Then you discover it's not suspended and has been slowly cooking in your bag - not to mention consuming all the battery.

This is default behavior. To prevent it from happening, just turn off your Bluetooth mouse before closing the lid. OR... disable the behavior in System Preferences | Bluetooth pane, by unchecking "Allow Bluetooth devices to wake this computer"

daneoni
Aug 1, 2007, 07:36 PM
Speaking of 8600 drivers, can someone pleas clarify if the G8600GT is a DX10 card or not?

bananas
Aug 1, 2007, 07:39 PM
Speaking of 8600 drivers, can someone pleas clarify if the G8600GT is a DX10 card or not?

I believe the whole 8XXX-series is DX10

Glenny2lappies
Aug 1, 2007, 07:45 PM
This is default behavior. To prevent it from happening, just turn off your Bluetooth mouse before closing the lid. OR... disable the behavior in System Preferences | Bluetooth pane, by unchecking "Allow Bluetooth devices to wake this computer"

Unfortunately my system has this setting on and it still happens.

The problem is that it's very easy to just close the lid, stick the lappie in the bag and go. Then the mouse is on the desk and the lappie miles away.

It's even crashed with the mouse sitting beside it.

Has anyone else had problems with Bluetooth and mice crashing?

agore
Aug 1, 2007, 08:39 PM
Unfortunately my system has this setting on and it still happens.

The problem is that it's very easy to just close the lid, stick the lappie in the bag and go. Then the mouse is on the desk and the lappie miles away.



My machine is a new SR MBP from this recent revision. If I awaken it with the lid closed by clicking the mouse, it automatically goes bck to sleep after a few seconds, unless I reawaken it with more mouse clicks. Since Bluetooth is a short-range link, it won't reawaken if I take the machine and leave the mouse behind.

Analog Kid
Aug 1, 2007, 08:47 PM
More details here (http://www.unsanity.org/archives/2007_03.php) . See the post titled "Shock and Awe: How Installing Apple's Updates can Render Your Mac Unbootable and How You Can Prevent it ". It's scary.
Ohhhhhh crap...

Can't believe this wasn't fixed in 10.4.10. Really wish I'd known this before the bunch of updates I did yesterday and today. Oh well-- nothing horrible yet...

DesignerOnMac
Aug 1, 2007, 09:16 PM
I agree with you there, this feature hasn't worked without problems for ages in my experience. First it didn't work at all when you clicked it once (like Mitthrawnuruodo stated, you had to click it twice to make it effective) and now with 10.4.10 it does work for me, until I restart the computer... what's up with that. My iMac doesn't need screen dimming, it's really annoying when watching YouTube videos...

I also would like to see this Safari (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=238911) bug fixed. And yes, it is a bug, I filed it at Apple and I got the response that Apple Engineering knew about the problem and was investigating it. :)

I come to this site everyday and other sites and I read how bad Safari is etc., or read about every other bug that people have problems with....Safari won't open any pages, or it quits all the time, or there is a sleep issue...

I guess I am one of the lucky ones, Safari never quits on me, I have no problems with sleep, or with OS X at all. IT has been a very very smooth ride for a long time now!

iBookG4user
Aug 1, 2007, 10:24 PM
Maybe they'll finally fix the memory leaks that plague Safari.

Platform
Aug 1, 2007, 11:15 PM
I hope this fixes the Finder issues I have been having.

The Finder takes all my CPU power then if I relaunch, it won't and only way out is a hard re-boot. :mad:

Mitthrawnuruodo
Aug 2, 2007, 12:08 AM
That article is more than a year old. I guess they just gave up on fixing it. I'd think it would be pretty easy to fix. It is just a simple setting.
I know. It came up around the time I got my MacBook in May last year, and they haven't even bothered to add the iMacs, some of which seems to have the same bug...

Well, well, if 10.4.11 doesn't fix it, there's always 10.4.12 or Leopard... :rolleyes:

Stridder44
Aug 2, 2007, 12:38 AM
I guess no one care but I reported 10.4.11 already on July 11th on my Blog (http://www.maccast.de/).


Dude, no one cares about blogs period.

Jaunty
Aug 2, 2007, 01:32 AM
Unfortunately my system has this setting on and it still happens.

The problem is that it's very easy to just close the lid, stick the lappie in the bag and go. Then the mouse is on the desk and the lappie miles away.

It's even crashed with the mouse sitting beside it.

Has anyone else had problems with Bluetooth and mice crashing?

There are reported issues with Bluetooth:

http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1057632&tstart=0

http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=4946968�

I hope this release fixes them

Jim Campbell
Aug 2, 2007, 02:11 AM
No need to wait for 10.4.11, mate. Airport Update 2007-004 has been available on Software Update since yesterday. Fixed it for me.

Installed it. Doesn't appear to have made much difference, to the extent that I'm having to post this reply from a different machine because the MacBook can't hold the internet connection over Airport long enough to submit this post!

Really, really hoping this gets fixed soon ...

Cheers

Jim

AidenShaw
Aug 2, 2007, 08:24 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 4.01; Windows CE; PPC; 240x320))

I like the fact that Apple are prepared to fix the current operating system knowing they are soon to release a new one. Unlike MS whose attitude differs somewhat on how to get a fix for a software problem, they force you to buy the new version!
What the hell are you carrying on about? Microsoft supports their OS's for at least ten years. There are STILL updates to XP and Vista is out. There are even STILL updates for Windows 98 released! The MAC community in large is so disillusioned to anything outside of Apple it makes me feel sick sometimes to be a part of it.

Even the forum shows that attitude - I've been reading and posting from my phone for years (at 3G broadband speeds with cut-and-paste), but now that Apple has a semi-smart phone the forum has been updated and we see the "wirelessly posted" header....

dejo
Aug 2, 2007, 09:18 AM
...but now that Apple has a semi-smart phone the forum has been updated and we see the "wirelessly posted" header....
Yeah, what's up with that? I was inspired to start a new thread and poll on that very topic:
Do you care if someone "wirelessly posted"? (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=336666)

iJawn108
Aug 2, 2007, 12:15 PM
It's the bug where when you set the screen to not automatically dim to save power, but when you restart the computer it switches back to dimming.
The bug I want fixed is when you change your junk mail to automatically delete the junk when mail is quit it only works once, the next time you start mail it is back to do nothing.

might i suggest a reinstall, as mine no longer does that.

DaBrain
Aug 2, 2007, 06:11 PM
Yeah, what's up with that? I was inspired to start a new thread and poll on that very topic:
Do you care if someone "wirelessly posted"? (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=336666)

Nope! See no reason other than a status symbol to feed their ego--))) :D

STEPHEN SNELL
Aug 2, 2007, 06:39 PM
OH YES, I'M VERY SURPRISED THAT "APPLE INC." IS DOING AN MAC OS X (10.4.11) UPDATE. MY "MAIL.APP" IS DEAD EVEN BEFORE I WENT UP TO THE MAC OS X (10.4.10) UPDATE. IF YOU GUYS ARE HAVING MAIL PROBLEMS, THEN DO WHAT I DID, SWITCH TO "THUNDERBIRD". TO BE HONEST WITH YOU GUYS, I DON'T THINK THAT "MAIL.APP" WILL WORK UNTIL "LEOPARD" GETS OUT LATER THIS YEAR. AND "SAFARI" (3) IS A COMPLETE JOKE BECAUSE IT'S DEAD EVEN WITH THE UPDATES. GOTO:
HTTP://WWW.MOZILLA.COM FOR "THUNDERBIRD" AND THEY UPDATE THAT PROGRAM WAY MORE OFTEN THAN "APPLE MAIL"!!!:):):):):):):)

Eidorian
Aug 2, 2007, 06:48 PM
OH YES, I'M VERY SURPRISED THAT "APPLE INC." IS DOING AN MAC OS X (10.4.11) UPDATE. MY "MAIL.APP" IS DEAD EVEN BEFORE I WENT UP TO THE MAC OS X (10.4.10) UPDATE. IF YOU GUYS ARE HAVING MAIL PROBLEMS, THEN DO WHAT I DID, SWITCH TO "THUNDERBIRD". TO BE HONEST WITH YOU GUYS, I DON'T THINK THAT "MAIL.APP" WILL WORK UNTIL "LEOPARD" GETS OUT LATER THIS YEAR. AND "SAFARI" (3) IS A COMPLETE JOKE BECAUSE IT'S DEAD EVEN WITH THE UPDATES. GOTO:
HTTP://WWW.MOZILLA.COM FOR "THUNDERBIRD" AND THEY UPDATE THAT PROGRAM WAY MORE OFTEN THAN "APPLE MAIL"!!!:):):):):):):)Mail.app works on my Mac and all of my imaged machines. Apple also pushes application updates with operating system updates.

I think you should check your Caps Lock as well.

CRAZYBUBBA
Aug 2, 2007, 06:53 PM
Mail.app works on my Mac and all of my imaged machines. Apple also pushes application updates with operating system updates.

I think you should check your Caps Lock as well.

Haha. I agree. Mail works splendidly on my mac. Do you have any other unresolved issues?

Jim Campbell
Aug 3, 2007, 02:18 AM
No need to wait for 10.4.11, mate. Airport Update 2007-004 has been available on Software Update since yesterday. Fixed it for me.

Hmmm. In addition to not fixing the problem with my MacBook's Airport internet connection, the update now means that my Mini doesn't see the Bluetooth keyboard on startup and I have to switch the keyboard off and on again.

I appreciate that, in the grand scheme of things, this is not exactly a catastrophe, but it is a minor pain, and I don't expect bug fixes to make things worse.

Amazingly, in 14 years of Mac use, I've never had to uninstall a system upgrade, but I think I'm going to put these two machines back onto 10.4.9 ... presumably, I need to re-install the original system, and then download a 10.4.9 update from Apple ...?

Cheers

Jim