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Rezet
Aug 8, 2003, 09:39 PM
You know, I bought myself a 750 Mbs zip drive for USB 2.0.
Sales person was implying that those are practically dead and that I should get those usb memory sticks.
Well, I went with zip, and I think it's a kick-ass thingy.
I mean it copies 7 Mbs in around 2-3 seconds. It seems to be quite reliable and one 750 disc is 10-15 bucks.

So, I was just wondering what you guys thinnk about those.
I just don't get why is it everyone thinks that cdrw that can die any second and are quite bulky are considered great competitors to zips.
Or DVD-RW that cost a bunch and take forever to burn while reliability is also questionable. Memory sticks dont seem to hold enough space and aren't cheap at all.

???

bennetsaysargh
Aug 8, 2003, 09:53 PM
i think ZIP is good, but dying. it just is. there's no explanation except for better technologies, and soon they will be obsolete.

G5orbust
Aug 8, 2003, 09:58 PM
Originally posted by Rezet
You know, I bought myself a 750 Mbs zip drive for USB 2.0.
Sales person was implying that those are practically dead and that I should get those usb memory sticks.
Well, I went with zip, and I think it's a kick-ass thingy.
I mean it copies 7 Mbs in around 2-3 seconds. It seems to be quite reliable and one 750 disc is 10-15 bucks.

So, I was just wondering what you guys thinnk about those.
I just don't get why is it everyone thinks that cdrw that can die any second and are quite bulky are considered great competitors to zips.
Or DVD-RW that cost a bunch and take forever to burn while reliability is also questionable. Memory sticks dont seem to hold enough space and aren't cheap at all.

???

You want to know why ZIP disks are dead? CD burning is faster, cheaper and easier. If you want to protect your data, buy a jewel case. ZIP disks have zero compatability with anything else besides themselves (and sometimes that isnt even true), while CD's have almost universal compatability.

Also, that price is atrocious! 15 dollars for one disk! I found, for $17.00, a 50 pack of Memorex, 48x CD-R media. (source (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=manufactory&catalog=71&manufactory=1724&DEPA=1&sortby=14&order=1)) thats 35 GB of storage for the price of one, 750MB ZIP disk.

Now, I hope you see why ZIP really is dead.

Rezet
Aug 8, 2003, 10:19 PM
Originally posted by G5orbust
You want to know why ZIP disks are dead? CD burning is faster, cheaper and easier. If you want to protect your data, buy a jewel case. ZIP disks have zero compatability with anything else besides themselves (and sometimes that isnt even true), while CD's have almost universal compatability.

Also, that price is atrocious! 15 dollars for one disk! I found, for $17.00, a 50 pack of Memorex, 48x CD-R media. (source (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=manufactory&catalog=71&manufactory=1724&DEPA=1&sortby=14&order=1)) thats 35 GB of storage for the price of one, 750MB ZIP disk.

Now, I hope you see why ZIP really is dead.


Most of the things you stated aren't true.
First off, I think most agree that CDRWs aren't reliable. And your pack of CDRs arent re-recordable.
And please, FASTER? WHAT? Show me a CDRW that can copy 7 mbs in 2 seconds and we will talk.
And it's not that much easier dude, I burn cds and stuff and i encounter some sort of an error with it much more often than with any other recording device.
Plus cds are bulky. And I'm always afraid that I will scratch it so it won't work. Besides CDRWs are only 550mbs when formatted.
The big drawback of Zips is that you need a zip drive to the place you go to, but 750 drive is size of 2cds in jewel cases, so it's not a problem to grab it along if a person doesn't have a zip drive.

Powerbook G5
Aug 8, 2003, 10:45 PM
I have yet to burn a CD on a Mac, but I'll tell you one thing, burning a CD on a Windows computer is one of the most unreliable things you can do. I cannot tell you how many CDs I've wasted trying to burn a CD on both Windows ME (horrible, horrible OS) and Windows XP...it's a pure headache. I only have a Zip 100 (external USB) but it is fast, easy, and works perfectly every time.

iJon
Aug 8, 2003, 10:51 PM
hell, i think zips are dead as well. first of all 17 dollars is a little high in my opinion for a 50 pack of cd's. if you look in the right place you can get 50-100 free with rebates. 10-15 dollars for 1 750 disc is pricey in my opinion. and since it is still a disk like a floppy, it can get corrupted easily. i moved our whole newspaper department to cd's just because zips we clunky, you had to have this huge drive to carry around if you wanted to use it. and there are no hybrid discs. sure you can format a zip disc to pc, but it is slower transferring stuff on a mac vs a pc unless you have it formatted to the right format. i just feel you spent a lot of money for old technology, zips were never popular enough to replace floppies. but its your money and thats all that counts.

iJon

Rezet
Aug 8, 2003, 11:06 PM
Originally posted by iJon
hell, i think zips are dead as well. first of all 17 dollars is a little high in my opinion for a 50 pack of cd's. if you look in the right place you can get 50-100 free with rebates. 10-15 dollars for 1 750 disc is pricey in my opinion. and since it is still a disk like a floppy, it can get corrupted easily. i moved our whole newspaper department to cd's just because zips we clunky, you had to have this huge drive to carry around if you wanted to use it. and there are no hybrid discs. sure you can format a zip disc to pc, but it is slower transferring stuff on a mac vs a pc unless you have it formatted to the right format. i just feel you spent a lot of money for old technology, zips were never popular enough to replace floppies. but its your money and thats all that counts.

iJon

Well, iJon that all seems to be your bias. You don't give any specifcs on how is that cds are much better. CDRWs always die. I had 4 dead on me. And I'm greatful I had them backed up.
My friend also lost a cdrw with all his financial files. He backed it up, but most recent file changes were lost.
I'm not talking about CDRs. CDRs are one thing, CDRWs is another. On pcs, it's ridicuolus that you actualyl have to buy a program for like 80-100 bucks before you can burn cds normally.
And yes, old zips (100, 250) were slow and not very reliable.
But 750 are powered by usb 2.0 or firewire 400. they are probably 6 times faster than cdrws. I just dont really see what's better.

iJon
Aug 8, 2003, 11:14 PM
Originally posted by Rezet
Well, iJon that all seems to be your bias. You don't give any specifcs on how is that cds are much better. CDRWs always die. I had 4 dead on me. And I'm greatful I had them backed up.
My friend also lost a cdrw with all his financial files. He backed it up, but most recent file changes were lost.
I'm not talking about CDRs. CDRs are one thing, CDRWs is another. On pcs, it's ridicuolus that you actualyl have to buy a program for like 80-100 bucks before you can burn cds normally.
And yes, old zips (100, 250) were slow and not very reliable.
But 750 are powered by usb 2.0 or firewire 400. they are probably 6 times faster than cdrws. I just dont really see what's better.
hell, when i can buy 50-100 cdr's for free why do i need cd-rw's they are slow and a waste of time. i burn cds all the time for a single file without a flinch. on windows i never bought software to burn cd's on windows. xp comes with all that, just like mac os x. another thing about zips, if you come over to my house it useless. now if you have the cash to put a zip on every computer you use it on then be my guest. i would rather use the dirt cheap cds that i can buy by the bundles, and plus with my same drive i can burn dvd's, which cost about a couple of dollars for me, and they hold 4.7gb.

iJon

Rezet
Aug 8, 2003, 11:25 PM
Even if I could get CD-Rs free, why in the world would I use one disc for one file that I will have to modify in 20 minutes?
This is ridiculous! I'll have a pile of useless CDRs that will rather confuse me, than help me. Besides, it's all talk. Let me see some offers where you get 50-100 discs for free.
And dvd-r? Please, that also isn't an option. First off, DVDRs cost a bundle. And it's rare I have to back up the whole 5 gig of data.
Second they take forever to burn. And using 4.5 gig disc if you have to back up 200 mbs file is also stupid.
And also, many many people do not have dvd-roms on their computers still. So unless you bought a computer within 2 years, you are just as screwed as as those with zips.
Besides, external Zip is very, very small, so i can take it with me - no problem.

As for windows burning, PLEASE! Not everyone has XP to begin with, nor does everyone has OSX. Second, WIndows burning is very crappy and only burns one way. There practically no custom burning allowed. IF I thought Windows xp built-in cd burning feature is good, i wouldnt get Roxio EZ cd creator.
(It's good if your computer comes with one of those, but some, like mine didn't)...

iJon
Aug 8, 2003, 11:41 PM
Originally posted by Rezet
Even if I could get CD-Rs free, why in the world would I use one disc for one file that I will have to modify in 20 minutes?
This is ridiculous! I'll have a pile of useless CDRs that will rather confuse me, than help me. Besides, it's all talk. Let me see some offers where you get 50-100 discs for free.
And dvd-r? Please, that also isn't an option. First off, DVDRs cost a bundle. And it's rare I have to back up the whole 5 gig of data.
Second they take forever to burn. And using 4.5 gig disc if you have to back up 200 mbs file is also stupid.
And also, many many people do not have dvd-roms on their computers still. So unless you bought a computer within 2 years, you are just as screwed as as those with zips.
Besides, external Zip is very, very small, so i can take it with me - no problem.

As for windows burning, PLEASE! Not everyone has XP to begin with, nor does everyone has OSX. Second, WIndows burning is very crappy and only burns one way. There practically no custom burning allowed. IF I thought Windows xp built-in cd burning feature is good, i wouldnt get Roxio EZ cd creator.
(It's good if your computer comes with one of those, but some, like mine didn't)...
well i use the trash can to discard all my cd's. and about the free cd's, ill show you where. this sunday open up your paper and get the best buy, office max, office depot, circuit city, and all those others annd youll find some free ones in there somewhere, my mom has about 1000 cd's she has bought this year and recieved all her rebates, thats a thousand free cd's we have now. i know not everyone has os x or windows xp. but i bet you more people have xp and os x than 750mb zip drives. thats great if its portable, but you still gotta take it with you. if i burn a file on a cd i can take it to my buddies and he can look at it, i dont have to take anything to him besides a jewl case. and those zip drives are only good for data backup. with my cd burner i can burn sotware, games, data, music, movies, vcd's, mp3 cd's. its the standard. and i can go buy a single apple dvd for about a couple of bucks, or i can get 5 for even cheaper. by all means if you like your zip drive, congrats, i will throw a party for you. i just think cd's better, and i think most people would agree with me. thats why no one offers built in zip drives anymore. i would rather save my money and buy myself a nice little potable firewire hard drive.

iJon

Mac til death
Aug 8, 2003, 11:43 PM
Originally posted by Rezet
This is ridiculous! I'll have a pile of useless CDRs that will rather confuse me, than help me.

Confused? Buy a Sharpe. :)


Anyway... no one is calling you an idiot or anything for buying a Zip drive... You asked people for their opinion of Zip and they gave it. No reason to be defensive.

lighten up. :D

Powerbook G5
Aug 8, 2003, 11:44 PM
My advice to you is enjoy your new Zip drive. I have used many zip and jazz drives and they have all been more than useful over the years. CDRs are good for some things, but for lots of quick files and data you need to change and move around on a regular basis, I don't see how CDs or DVDs could compete with that kind of ease of use. I for one am jealous :)

Kwyjibo
Aug 8, 2003, 11:46 PM
dude, if you like it keep using it who cares about everyone else. I mean your a mac user, its not like your worried about being like everyone else already. This is probably one of those things you shoudl enjoy but not become a zealot about. I think they are fine, very similar to the ext. hard drive I use in many ways except the media is much more portable and easier to detach.

Rezet
Aug 8, 2003, 11:48 PM
Originally posted by iJon
well i use the trash can to discard all my cd's. and about the free cd's, ill show you where. this sunday open up your paper and get the best buy, office max, office depot, circuit city, and all those others annd youll find some free ones in there somewhere, my mom has about 1000 cd's she has bought this year and recieved all her rebates, thats a thousand free cd's we have now. i know not everyone has os x or windows xp. but i bet you more people have xp and os x than 750mb zip drives. thats great if its portable, but you still gotta take it with you. if i burn a file on a cd i can take it to my buddies and he can look at it, i dont have to take anything to him besides a jewl case. and those zip drives are only good for data backup. with my cd burner i can burn sotware, games, data, music, movies, vcd's, mp3 cd's. its the standard. and i can go buy a single apple dvd for about a couple of bucks, or i can get 5 for even cheaper. by all means if you like your zip drive, congrats, i will throw a party for you. i just think cd's better, and i think most people would agree with me. thats why no one offers built in zip drives anymore. i would rather save my money and buy myself a nice little potable firewire hard drive.

iJon


Well, We are talking about data backup man. I do have cd burners for music etc. It's not like I don't burn cds because of it.
Although I dont see any "free" cd-rs in the stores, it makes little difference for me, since i find idea of burning 1 file on a cd-r not very convinient. Hard drives is a no no for me because of network security thingy.... but still...
I think iJon, you never actually used or seen 750 zip in action. You are obviously making judgement about those from something you saw back 5 years ago.
Well iJon, I do appreciate your oprion. That was a fun little discussion, and thanx for coming. :)

LethalWolfe
Aug 8, 2003, 11:49 PM
I think the ZIP format is on it's last leg. I think the biggest detractors are cost and compatibility. I can burn data to a CD and give it to someone and they are set. If I dump something to a ZIP I have to make sure they have a ZIP and that our models of ZIPs are compatible. Or I have to let them borrow my ZIP drive and wait for them to return it. ZIPs were great when I was in college 'caue all of the campus PCs had zip drives built in. But since then I've haven't used my ZIP at all (that's over 2 years ago). I've burned hundreds of CDs over the past 4 years or so and only 1 has gone bad on me. As long as you don't buy crappy media you'll be fine. Of course you could have purchased a defective CD/batch of CD's but defects happen w/all products.

W/DVD burners working their way into the mainstream (and blu-ray dics on the horizon), USB "thumbdrives" and Firewire/USB HDDs getting cheapper the niche ZIP once filled is quickly closing. We used to use JAZ drives at work for xfering files but we recently switched to "pocket sized" external FW drives. $180 can get you an external FW ZIP 750 (w/o media) or a 20gig SmartDisk FW firelight HDD for the same price.


Lethal

iJon
Aug 8, 2003, 11:54 PM
fair enough, but yes i have used them. i used just about everything of that nature, ill sell them at work and ive played with them all, and not too many people are interested in them. thats great that you like it and in no way was i trying to put you down, just having a fun argument. i just dont see them having enough pro's to jusify a purchase, and many of my customers feel the same way with having a cd burner do what they need most.

iJon

Peyote
Aug 9, 2003, 12:11 AM
I think zip drives still have some life left in them. I love using them for everyday file moving etc. Zip drives won't become obselete until the day when a burning a CDRW is even close to copying files to a zip, or until a new media is developed. USB "thumbdrives" aren't viable as they are too limited by their capacity. Next is firewire/USB2 drives. There are some small ones out there, but they're expensive. I think the next logical step is a VERY small portable HD. The size of a credit card and no more than 1/4" thick would be nice. The data is protected, the HD is portable and uses 1 cord, and can hold a lot. The capacity should be around 1 gig to keep the price and size down. Sell it for $75 and I would snap that up in a heartbeat. Until I can buy something like that, I'll stick with the quick transfer of files on my zip.

bousozoku
Aug 9, 2003, 12:16 AM
I use Zip 100 disks all the time for school and I also have a USB bus-powered drive at home.

They seem perfectly acceptable for temporary storage. However, they have been dying ever since the first went on sale. There have been plenty of removable drive types available but the idea of using floppy disk-type technology is not that great an idea. I have seen many of these die, taking along someone's homework. "The Zip disk ate my homework!"

Your best bet is to copy your project from the Zip disk to the hard drive, work on it, and copy it back to the Zip disk when done. It will last longer that way. If you're really considering backing up data, I don't think they're reliable enough but you'll find that out soon enough.

Good luck!

LethalWolfe
Aug 9, 2003, 12:23 AM
Originally posted by Peyote
I think zip drives still have some life left in them. I love using them for everyday file moving etc. Zip drives won't become obselete until the day when a burning a CDRW is even close to copying files to a zip, or until a new media is developed. USB "thumbdrives" aren't viable as they are too limited by their capacity. Next is firewire/USB2 drives. There are some small ones out there, but they're expensive. I think the next logical step is a VERY small portable HD. The size of a credit card and no more than 1/4" thick would be nice. The data is protected, the HD is portable and uses 1 cord, and can hold a lot. The capacity should be around 1 gig to keep the price and size down. Sell it for $75 and I would snap that up in a heartbeat. Until I can buy something like that, I'll stick with the quick transfer of files on my zip.


The SmartDisk Firewire HDD I mentioned are 3 1/4 inches x 5 inches x 3/4 inch, are bus powered (so only 1 cable needed), have 2 FW ports and a 20 gig version costs as much as a ZIP 750 drive (w/o media). And you can buy 1gig "thumbdrives."


Lethal

SLJ
Aug 9, 2003, 12:26 AM
ZIP was great when it was first introduced... but when the ZIP250 came out.. i brought one.. but no one support it much... these days, is all about those USB memory and CDRW/DVDRW...
who want to carry a ZIP disk around anymore? I haven't touch m y ZIP250 for X months... very dusty... but my 128MB USB memory stick.. is in my pocket everyday...

Rezet
Aug 9, 2003, 12:32 AM
I know that 100 Zips are not reliable. But 750 and even 250 is a whole different story. If you look at reviews at sites like amazon, circuit city, buy.com etc, most people give them perfect scores.
Thing about them is that they are easy to use. ME, my friend, my school and my work have them. And that is what i care about. I can transfer hundred megabytes files literally in seconds. Put the disc in my pocket and knowing that I can do it over and over again withiout worrying about losing information.
I do not exclude CD burning. If I know that a person that wants the file does not have a Zip drive or i'm simply concerned if I will ever get my Zip disc back, of course I'll just burn a cd for him.
CDRWs lag behind in just about everything comparing to Zip. While CDRs are great things and certainly very useful, having no option to rewrite the disc, bites in the ***.

tazo
Aug 9, 2003, 12:47 AM
Originally posted by Powerbook G5
I have yet to burn a CD on a Mac, but I'll tell you one thing, burning a CD on a Windows computer is one of the most unreliable things you can do. I cannot tell you how many CDs I've wasted trying to burn a CD on both Windows ME (horrible, horrible OS) and Windows XP...it's a pure headache. I only have a Zip 100 (external USB) but it is fast, easy, and works perfectly every time.

Then its probably your cd burner's fault...I have had an LG cd burner for about 3 years now and I have used it on 98SE, ME, and 2Kpro and I have probably burned 8 coasters. Not bad for 3 years....


Like I said if you are having such immense problems with cd burning it is probably the cd burner itself not the platform...

Rezet
Aug 9, 2003, 12:54 AM
You know what I just love?
Ohh man!
I love that this post is followed by this one:

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=32801

I'm so in love, I might as well get married to it...

UMM... what the hell am I talking about!!!???

CrackedButter
Aug 9, 2003, 12:56 AM
DVD drives have been out for at least 5 years...not 2.

I remember buying a P2 350 in 1998 with a 8x DVD drive.

Rezet
Aug 9, 2003, 02:42 AM
AAH. In 1998, P2 333MHZ (350 Mhz) was the top line of the PCs.
Which was over priced to hell. I don't remember seeing any DVD-ROMs back then. Even if they were there, I'm sure their cost wouldn't be very appealing for the consumers.

andrewh
Aug 9, 2003, 03:53 AM
Maybe I missed it, but hasn't anybody here heard of the iPOD? I've been using a 10 gig iPod for over a year to transfer huge files back and forth from my office every day. Firewire transfer rates have got to be at least as fast or faster than a zip drive. Sure the iPod is more expensive, but it is also a music player (obviously...) and is a whole lot cooler and smaller than a clunky zip drive. When I need to drop off files to the printer I burn CD's. I back up important data to DVD's or CD's. I don't know what kind of CDR's people are using, but I've burned hundreds without a single one failing on me. Call me lucky I guess.

Zip's had their day. Nobody should be using those unless you're using a PC, and a cheap one at that. I used Zip's for years, up until about 2000. I've had about 3 of them break on me, including the "Iomega Click of Death" for those that know about it. They suck big time.

I don't want to insult anybody's buying intelligence or budget, but zip's are a waste of time and money. Get an external HD (or iPod) and a CD burner and you're set. Get with the times!

NavyIntel007
Aug 9, 2003, 09:50 AM
I have a Zip 250 drive. I don't use it all that often, I think something is not right with it because if you nudge it or plug it in it acts like it's trying to read something even without a disk in it. But it works when I need it, even though it's slow. I really only use it to backup files when i'm reinstalling OS X.

IN short, it's like the superdrive. It's not all that useful for the consumer but it's nice to have.

NavyIntel007
Aug 9, 2003, 09:51 AM
Originally posted by andrewh
Maybe I missed it, but hasn't anybody here heard of the iPOD? I've been using a 10 gig iPod for over a year to transfer huge files back and forth from my office every day. Firewire transfer rates have got to be at least as fast or faster than a zip drive. Sure the iPod is more expensive, but it is also a music player (obviously...) and is a whole lot cooler and smaller than a clunky zip drive. When I need to drop off files to the printer I burn CD's. I back up important data to DVD's or CD's. I don't know what kind of CDR's people are using, but I've burned hundreds without a single one failing on me. Call me lucky I guess.

Zip's had their day. Nobody should be using those unless you're using a PC, and a cheap one at that. I used Zip's for years, up until about 2000. I've had about 3 of them break on me, including the "Iomega Click of Death" for those that know about it. They suck big time.

I don't want to insult anybody's buying intelligence or budget, but zip's are a waste of time and money. Get an external HD (or iPod) and a CD burner and you're set. Get with the times!

Must be nice. I remember when I could do that with my 5 GB ipod. Those were the days... :rolleyes: :cool: :D

DeadlyBreakfast
Aug 9, 2003, 09:55 AM
CDRW's unreliable? - Hmm...never had one fail one me yet. And given that ZIP's use similar technology as 3.5 floppies I'd never trust a zip.

As far as burning coasters.....Its the quality of the drive and the ability of the user to read the requirements of the burner and make sure that the PCee they are using match / meet them. I use a Plextor on SCSI for backup every day and NEVER have I burned a coaster. Ive had HP branded drives (toshibias iI think) and I have made a ton of coasters...That burner now sits..

MacBoyX
Aug 9, 2003, 10:01 AM
Rezet,

I think to answer your original question...

Zips are useful but as a major way of backing up and storage, they aren't as useful as some other choices.

I have never experienced a Buffer overurn or lost a cd on my Mac. I have also never had a CDR NOT RW but R go bad on me or lose data.

My back solution is mulitfaceted which goes to show that any mechanism for back up is viable..

At home I use a 60GB external FW HD to store stuff that is connected to my iMac and served over my entire network.

I back up important stuff to CDs (I can fit 700mb of stuff on them I dont know where you get 550mbs when formatted).

CDs use CDFS which is cross compatible btwn my Macs and my PC at work.

For temporary storage of a file I am going to modify in 20 minutes (one of your other rants) I use my 256MB FlashHopper USB FlashDrive. It 's smaller than a Pen and I copied 7mb in abt 9 seconds to it over a USB 1.0 port. So at 11Mbps vs 480Mbps for the USB 2.0 port you will need for ur Zip 750. I'd like to know what your rate would be on a USB 1.0 instead of the 2.0 since most Macs and PCs you have to carry your drive to wont have USB 2.0.

And on top of it, you must admit carrying my FlashHopper (http://www.smartdisk.com/Products/USBFlashDrives/FlashHopper.asp) with no external power cords or interface cords, vs. the Zip 750 with it's larger foot print and cables has got to be more convient.

I'd also like to add just one more comment to this post, although I love your passion and enthusiasm (you and I have had a go around on thread before) you should be just a touch less defensive when you ask a question (Is Zip Dead?) and people give you there opinions.

I hope that you are happy with your Zip and it lasts you for years...

As someone else pointed out..as Mac users we take pride in not being like everyone else so Zip long and Prosper!

macboyx

bennetsaysargh
Aug 9, 2003, 10:25 AM
has anyone ever burned a session cd? you can keep adding to it untill it's full. that's what i did for school when i had to write papers and i didn;'t have a printer i could use.

blogo
Aug 9, 2003, 10:39 AM
I use my ipod instead of using a zip-disk, and i also got a cd-rw burner.

LethalWolfe
Aug 9, 2003, 10:48 AM
Originally posted by Rezet
AAH. In 1998, P2 333MHZ (350 Mhz) was the top line of the PCs.
Which was over priced to hell. I don't remember seeing any DVD-ROMs back then. Even if they were there, I'm sure their cost wouldn't be very appealing for the consumers.

I bought a middle of the road Gateway in late '98 or early '99 and it came w/a DVD-ROM. In fact, that DVD-ROM is still being used in my current PC (although the rest of the Gateway was trashed about 2.5 years ago).


Lethal

iGav
Aug 9, 2003, 11:18 AM
I think the main problems with ZIP 750 with regards to it's commercial use is client compatibility. I personally don't know of any company that I deal with that use them, so in this respect it's not even a valid suggestion!

Personally I find CD-R and DVD-R are the better alternative for both myself and my clients.

CD-R's are a great way of getting work over to a client and not have to worry about not having an expensive ZIP returned, no matter how many times you ask a client to return a ZIP they never do... :rolleyes: but then again, it's an added and unnecessary expensive so why should they when I can send them a CD and be done with it? When you're having to courier media accross London, the less amount of times you have to do that the better!

If I visit a client at their studio's, I'm fortunate to have a SuperDrive enabled PowerBook... so why would I want to lug around a ZIP drive (as well as the necessary ZIP disks because my clients don't use them and won't have them in their studio's) around London??

In the cases where a CD-R is not large enough, that's when DVD-R comes in handy, even though they're more expensive than CD-R's, if you buy in bulk they work out significantly cheaper than having to replace the non-returned ZIP 's.

CD-R and DVD-R also has the added advantage that it's also a global commercial standard for the deployment of interactive media, and as such you can dev. interactive products and test them on every platform for compatibility exactly as they are going to be mastered, ZIP's are useless for this role.

Also we should consider that almost every PC shipped comes with a CD drive and most now have some kind of DVD drive, so you instantly have access to an enormous installed user base where your media can be accessed pretty much by anyone of these.

This is where ZIP suffers, it may be fine within your circle of friends who each own one and the company you work for, but what about the other thousands of potential clients, users, friends etc. that don't have access to one?

I don't think ZIP's are dead as such, but then again I suppose there're many out there that believe that the floppy isn't dead either... :p

But personally I and my clients have no use for them, when we have access to a more flexible, cheaper and universally accessble media format.

G

P.S. You don't work for Iomega do you??
:p :p :p

sparks9
Aug 9, 2003, 02:04 PM
Originally posted by Powerbook G5
I have yet to burn a CD on a Mac, but I'll tell you one thing, burning a CD on a Windows computer is one of the most unreliable things you can do. I cannot tell you how many CDs I've wasted trying to burn a CD on both Windows ME (horrible, horrible OS) and Windows XP...it's a pure headache. I only have a Zip 100 (external USB) but it is fast, easy, and works perfectly every time.

LOL, you must SUCK at burning CDs or have a really old and ugly burner. I have burned loads and loads of CDs at 32x speed in winXP, with no faults at all! It only takes a couple of minutes.

ZIP is DEAD, and has been dead for years.

ColdZero
Aug 9, 2003, 02:22 PM
Originally posted by Rezet
As for windows burning, PLEASE! Not everyone has XP to begin with, nor does everyone has OSX. Second, WIndows burning is very crappy and only burns one way. There practically no custom burning allowed. IF I thought Windows xp built-in cd burning feature is good, i wouldnt get Roxio EZ cd creator.
(It's good if your computer comes with one of those, but some, like mine didn't)...

Have you even tried custom burning on Windows? Its lightyears ahead of anything that OS X can offer or any 3rd party program can offer to OS X. Try some of these programs for Windows. Blindwrite, CDRWIN, Nero, Fireburner. Blindwrite allows you to actually record the physical layout of the disk you are copying and allows a perfect copy. They are far ahead of Toast or anything on OS X. I don't understand "burns one way". They burn it with a laser, what does apple burn a cd with, a flashlight? :rolleyes:
Easy CD Creator is one of the crappiest burning programs for Windows. It is foolproof, but it only allows a limited set of options. Try any of those other programs I mentioned, they are much much better.

BigJayhawk
Aug 9, 2003, 02:38 PM
Originally posted by Peyote
I think zip drives still have some life left in them. I love using them for everyday file moving etc. Zip drives won't become obselete until the day when a burning a CDRW is even close to copying files to a zip, or until a new media is developed. USB "thumbdrives" aren't viable as they are too limited by their capacity. Next is firewire/USB2 drives. There are some small ones out there, but they're expensive. I think the next logical step is a VERY small portable HD. The size of a credit card and no more than 1/4" thick would be nice. The data is protected, the HD is portable and uses 1 cord, and can hold a lot. The capacity should be around 1 gig to keep the price and size down. Sell it for $75 and I would snap that up in a heartbeat. Until I can buy something like that, I'll stick with the quick transfer of files on my zip.

You can get 1 GIG SmartDisk media (great for using with cameras too) for $116 Shipped (check out dealmac). This is the same price structure for other types of RAM-based media. Throw it in your pocket with a USB or Firewire adapter and you have the pocket drive you are talking about. As for price -- it is getting closer to the sub-$100 range than most people think and it is CERTAINLY cheaper than a Zip Drive set-up.

VIREBEL661
Aug 9, 2003, 02:53 PM
I have an internal Zip 100 and an external SCSI for use with my old Mac... I love them! they also play well with music equipment (keyboards, digital recorders, etc.), whereas CD burners do not... It's like the evolution of the floppy... I've had like 6 Zip discs for years, and, I must agree, the media is expensive, but how many Zip discs do you really need? I use it as a floppy - temporary solution, or to get large amounts of data from one system to another, without wasting a CD... Also BOOTABLE from older Macs! Totally awesome... Know what I really liked, though, Superdisk! I guess it didn't do that well, but I still use it all the time on my G3 - it reads and writes normal floppies also!

VIREBEL661
Aug 9, 2003, 02:55 PM
Originally posted by ColdZero
Have you even tried custom burning on Windows? Its lightyears ahead of anything that OS X can offer or any 3rd party program can offer to OS X.

Isn't this the same as creating a disc image in Toast? Just a question...

Vlade
Aug 9, 2003, 02:55 PM
Originally posted by Rezet
Most of the things you stated aren't true.
First off, I think most agree that CDRWs aren't reliable. And your pack of CDRs arent re-recordable.
And please, FASTER? WHAT? Show me a CDRW that can copy 7 mbs in 2 seconds and we will talk.
And it's not that much easier dude, I burn cds and stuff and i encounter some sort of an error with it much more often than with any other recording device.
Plus cds are bulky. And I'm always afraid that I will scratch it so it won't work. Besides CDRWs are only 550mbs when formatted.
The big drawback of Zips is that you need a zip drive to the place you go to, but 750 drive is size of 2cds in jewel cases, so it's not a problem to grab it along if a person doesn't have a zip drive.

My CD Burner burns at 52X, which is 7.6 MB a second. Thats twice the speed as ZIP.

CDs are 695 megs after being formatted for the mac, and 700-702 with a PC format.

VIREBEL661
Aug 9, 2003, 03:31 PM
Originally posted by DeadlyBreakfast
As far as burning coasters.....Its the quality of the drive and the ability of the user to read the requirements of the burner and make sure that the PCee they are using match / meet them.

I've found that I burn a lot of coasters using cheap ass media... When I started using TDK's, never a bad disc!

simX
Aug 9, 2003, 05:15 PM
I'd like to point out that while Mac OS X does indeed have great built-in CD burning, Mac OS 9 had just about the same capabilities. You insert a CD, "prepare" it, copy all the files to the prepared to CD, and then burn the CD; just as you do with Mac OS X. So easy CD burning isn't limited to Mac OS X only (I have no experience with burning CDs in Windows).

I'd also like to chime in that I have made very few CD coasters -- I actually can't recall any that I've done in recent memory. I also am a packrat: I archive all the installers I use and burn them to CDs, so the rare time I need one of those old apps, they're on CD. A few of the CDs I've burned were from way back in 1999, and guess what? They still work. Calling burnable CDs unreliable is a ridiculous argument.

Lastly, I'd like to second the fact that you can do session burning. While that feature is dubious for things like burning a single document, it really comes in handy when you want to burn 700 MB in 3 segments. It's a far cry from the abilities of a zip/floppy disk, but I'd venture to say that CDs are much more reliable: I haven't had a CD-RW fail on me, either.

Zips fail because of a number of factors:

1) The perception is that they're unreliable. Because they use the same style of technology as a regular 3.25 inch floppy disk, which were notoriously unreliable, people are hesitant to use Zip disks.

2) The size of the media. With 1 GB keychain firewire drives, 30 GB iPod-size FireWire drives, and DVD-Rs becoming standard, the capacity of the Zip disk is far becoming eclipsed by other methods of data storage.

3) Price. For the price of a zip drive, I can buy a FireWire drive that has more capacity for less money, as someone pointed out earlier. The advantages in how you write to Zip disks over CDs is nonexistent in the face of these kinds of FireWire drives. Plus, you actually have to buy media, whereas with FireWire drives, you don't.

4) Compatibility. As many other people pointed out, you actually have to carry around a Zip drive if you want to ensure compatibility with other computers, and you have to make sure you have the right cables. With CD-Rs, and to a lesser extent DVD-Rs, you only have to bring the media and you can basically be assured that the person can read the media.

I don't really see any advantage of a Zip drive when compared to a FireWire drive or a SuperDrive (DVD/CD burner). It just doesn't make any sense anymore. My iPod (first generation 5 GB) is more reliable, can store more data, and is smaller than any Zip drive I've seen.

alia
Aug 9, 2003, 05:42 PM
Originally posted by Rezet
And also, many many people do not have dvd-roms on their computers still. So unless you bought a computer within 2 years, you are just as screwed as as those with zips.


I don't want to get in the middle of this argument, but I want to note that my PC is 4 years old, and it shipped with a DVD-Rom, so that no DVD-Rom thing is BS.

Also, burning on PC using DirectCD on Win XP is like moving to another hard drive. You can burn the files in whatever folder configuration you want.

Regardless, I don't see why you are arguing about this. You wanted people's opinions on why the ZIP drives were dying out, and they gave them to you. If you didn't want to know, you shouldn't have started this thread. Arguing about it over and over isn't going to change people's minds.

Alia

tjwett
Aug 9, 2003, 05:54 PM
Just to throw my 2 cents into this mess. It seems that the original poster liked his Zip drive just fine to begin, why ask what everyone else thinks, who cares? If it works for you then go with it. I used Zips for years and loved them. Right now I use my 5 Gig iPod for backing up files, transfering stuff, etc and it's the best. Just this week I was working on a client's iMac and I had to wipe the HD so I plugged in my iPod and backed up her whole User folder and documents in a matter of seconds. I hate burning CDs too. I always end up with a binder full of CDRs that are not labled and I can't tell what they are. It m akes me nuts. And burning is just slow. I'll never go back to disks for backing up anything.

shadowfax
Aug 9, 2003, 06:01 PM
compared to selling the family farm to make everyone get a ZIP drive on their computer, i would much rather sell my soul to get an iPod. fortunately, someone gave me one for graduation.

i have to say, the ultimate reason that ZIP is not a standard is probably the fact that they don't ship with most computers. can you imagine a zip drive on my tibook? that would be so hilarious... i'd have to take my hard drive and battery out to fit it in, but i could probably get some custom work done.. yeah.

also, i think they have 40 or 48x CDROMs... that's 700 MB per... hang on, let me get my calculator... 700 MB per 1.5 minutes, which is pretty nigh on 8 MB/s. so yes, CDRs can be faster than ZIP, fo' sho. of course, most of us just have the 24x, or, for us poor laptop users, 8-12x, writers...

i dunno, i am happy petting my iPod and laughing at everyone. if you like to pet your zip disk drive/disks and laugh at everyone, we won't steal your liquor. but don't get mad when we laugh back ;)

Powerbook G5
Aug 9, 2003, 06:27 PM
I don't get why everyone is so rabid about CDR vs Zip drives. It sounds like a bunch of PC users slamming Macs...if the guy likes his Zip drive, then more power to him. I have a zip drive I bought for my PowerBook back in 99 and it works great for backing up files quickly. I actually know lots of friends who have them and all the computers at my college have them, along with most of them at my high school. For this reason, I found that having my Zip drive was invaluable for transfering stuff from home to school and back. I know there are other types of drives and a lot are cool. Who can dispute the coolness of holding nearly a gig on your keychain that you can plug into your computer or backing up onto your iPod? But that isn't the point...the poster likes his Zip750 and on its own merits, it gets the job done quickly and easily. If I had one, I'd be happy with it, too. Personally, I'd probably get an external FW/800 HDD when I get my new PowerBook just for the ability of having a high performance HD I can use for extra space and backing up when needed. It's all personal opinion. I just think it's easier and quicker to drag a bunch of files onto the Zip drive icon than to prepare a CD to burn when I want to quickly copy or move files. And if all of you are unhappy with your Zip drives, then by all means, you can give them to me. :)

shadowfax
Aug 9, 2003, 07:09 PM
i don't feel rabid, i am just advocating my right to laugh my ass off at whomever i please. i don't see why anybody should get bent out of shape about that. you can laugh about me with my Combo drive and 30 GB iPod as much as you want, and then some. in fact, if you laugh hard enough, you may just foam at the mouth, and then who'd be rabid.

i also laugh at anyone who's taking this seriously enough to get bent out of shape. ZIPs are cool. so is Latin. it's still dead though. sure, plenty of people use ZIPs. plenty of people use latin, too. but it's not ubiquitous, which CDRs very much are. this is fact. now, if you want to be all cool and grab yo'self a bite of history and use ZIP discs and speak latin, you go grrrrl, or boy. it is, as all us extremist psycho jerks have confessed right up front, your money, at the end of the day, which we charge you in the name of your own life to use to exact your own happiness.

ColdZero
Aug 9, 2003, 07:28 PM
Originally posted by VIREBEL661
Isn't this the same as creating a disc image in Toast? Just a question...

There are disk images with just files, and then there are ones which actually record the subcodes, or physical layout of the disk and stuff. I haven't seen anything on OS X that does that yet.

tjwett
Aug 9, 2003, 07:38 PM
Originally posted by Shadowfax
i don't feel rabid, i am just advocating my right to laugh my ass off at whomever i please. i don't see why anybody should get bent out of shape about that. you can laugh about me with my Combo drive and 30 GB iPod as much as you want, and then some. in fact, if you laugh hard enough, you may just foam at the mouth, and then who'd be rabid.

i also laugh at anyone who's taking this seriously enough to get bent out of shape. ZIPs are cool. so is Latin. it's still dead though. sure, plenty of people use ZIPs. plenty of people use latin, too. but it's not ubiquitous, which CDRs very much are. this is fact. now, if you want to be all cool and grab yo'self a bite of history and use ZIP discs and speak latin, you go grrrrl, or boy. it is, as all us extremist psycho jerks have confessed right up front, your money, at the end of the day, which we charge you in the name of your own life to use to exact your own happiness.

i like your attitude.

Powerbook G5
Aug 9, 2003, 07:41 PM
My Latin is a bit rusty... habeo saltatium squirrelum sub mii tunicam *coughs* damn, 3 years of not using Latin sure leaves you blank, but since I spoke some Latin and have a Zip drive next to me, I think I'll ride off into the sunset feeling secure in my coolness. :cool: But at any rate, I love both using removable media and CDR, they both have their purpose and usefulness. I love being able to just burn myself a CD whenever I am in the mood for a certain musical taste while driving to work or home during breaks. Plus, it's cool putting those failed CDs or otherwise unneeded ones in the microwave and see them spark...I never did that for myself, but my roommate would spend hours doing things like that (with his own microwave, mind you) I am sure Zip drives will become out of date beyond exsistance just as floppies are about as dead as the dinos right now. I've seen some cool storage devices and even cooler future products coming out. I have myself a keychain USB storage device, a superdisk drive, a zip drive, and once I get my new PowerBook, I'll have a superdrive and possibly get a firewire HD, too. I haven't used the superdisk drive in forever, but it was handy about 5 years ago when my PC friends or teachers woul give me a floppy disk. Same with the Zip drive, it has given me years of reliable backup service and all the computers at school have Zip drives to use but not always a CD rom drive. It's all about options and as Mac users, we have tons of them.

Rezet
Aug 9, 2003, 10:40 PM
Well, nice input everyone. Just to make it clear, I wasn't trying to be defensive, well maybe I was, but It was only to make an argument more fun. I still don't think buying an ipod for file transfer is the best way to go. I don't exclude CD-Rs as they serve many purposes and are useful, but CDRWs are garbage in my opinion. Memory sticks are good i guess, but again, one costs like 200 bucks +. WHat If I need more than 500 MBS? buy another?
External HDDs are still kind of bulky and there is a security thing at my college that wont let it get hook up hdd very easily. So i guess it's out of question.
I'm happy with my zip and no matter what you said wouldn't change my mind because obviously there is tons of bias present here.
I was just interested what people thought of Zips. Why they say zips are dead, and what competes with zips.
I got the answer pretty much I expected all along.

So thanks for your input everyone. I'm off this topic.

shadowfax
Aug 9, 2003, 11:46 PM
Originally posted by Rezet
I got the answer pretty much I expected all along.

So thanks for your input everyone. I'm off this topic.
it's always nice to have confirmation of suppositions. i'm certainly glad that you called us right. it strengthens my faith in your judgment. i have to agree with you about the iPod; it's not a very practical method of mobile storage, if that's all you want. you can get a regular pocket FW hard drive for much less money... but it won't be nearly as cool or useful at so many other things. ultimately though, we're all glad you're happy with your own opinions. if i weren't happy with mine, i would kill myself. or change them. or something.

BigJayhawk
Aug 9, 2003, 11:55 PM
Originally posted by Rezet
External HDDs are still kind of bulky and there is a security thing at my college that wont let it get hook up hdd very easily. So i guess it's out of question.


Considering a Zip Drive is simply seen by the system as a removable HARD DRIVE whether it is plugged in via USB or Firewire or built-in, WHAT IS THE SECURITY DIFFERENCE? Confusing a bit here.

As for the SIZE -- as mentioned MANY times before, there are HD/iPods/etc. that are much smaller than Zip Drives.

WHY did you even ASK the question if the logical answers were to be ignored.

Just -- "I like Zip drives" in your signature would have served the same purpose with MUCH LESS bandwidth wasted here.

macphoria
Aug 10, 2003, 02:36 AM
Zip costs more than CD.
Zip corrupts easily.

BUT!

CD's are not as easily reusable. Sure there are rewritables, but it's not the quite same thing as Zip or Magneto Optical disc or even older floppies.

So, no, I don't think Zip is dead yet. Until data storage device that is cheap and also easy to use comes along, CD and Zip (or at least Zip-like device) will stick around.

But I do think Zip 750 is over priced. I see plenty of people doing just fine with Zip 100 or 250.

Squire
Aug 10, 2003, 02:54 AM
First, I apologize if this was already posted.

While the Zip drives we knew may be dead, it seems the company is trying to re-vitalize the brand. Here's a Forbes article about new "matchbook-sized" zip drives.

http://forbes.com/2003/07/24/cx_ah_0724tentech.html

Squire

macphoria
Aug 10, 2003, 03:11 AM
First, I apologize if this was already posted.

While the Zip drives we knew may be dead, it seems the company is trying to re-vitalize the brand. Here's a Forbes article about new "matchbook-sized" zip drives.

http://forbes.com/2003/07/24/cx_ah_0724tentech.html

Squire
Yeah, I saw that article. Looks kind of like earlier iOmega product, pocket drive or something.

That does look promising.

That reminds me of Minidisc. I don't know why Minidisc wasn't pushed for data storage device.

Vlade
Aug 10, 2003, 09:30 AM
Originally posted by Rezet
Well, nice input everyone. Just to make it clear, I wasn't trying to be defensive, well maybe I was, but It was only to make an argument more fun. I still don't think buying an ipod for file transfer is the best way to go. I don't exclude CD-Rs as they serve many purposes and are useful, but CDRWs are garbage in my opinion. Memory sticks are good i guess, but again, one costs like 200 bucks +. WHat If I need more than 500 MBS? buy another?
External HDDs are still kind of bulky and there is a security thing at my college that wont let it get hook up hdd very easily. So i guess it's out of question.
I'm happy with my zip and no matter what you said wouldn't change my mind because obviously there is tons of bias present here.
I was just interested what people thought of Zips. Why they say zips are dead, and what competes with zips.
I got the answer pretty much I expected all along.

So thanks for your input everyone. I'm off this topic.

Good, if a zip is best for you than buy it, don't let what's best for others stand in your way.

abdul
Aug 10, 2003, 11:25 AM
my mate got a usb memory stick for 1gb for 25 and works a charm. its also is just as big as a thumb, not very then

Abstract
Aug 10, 2003, 03:17 PM
Topic: Is ZIP Really Dead?

As Dead as Elvis. :cool:

Rezet
Aug 10, 2003, 03:58 PM
Originally posted by abdul
my mate got a usb memory stick for 1gb for 25 and works a charm. its also is just as big as a thumb, not very then

OMG. So you got a good 1 gb memory stick for around $40?
Why don't you back it up and let us see some links.
From What I see is that 512Mbs ThumbDrive costs 200+ bucks. So please....

Rezet
Aug 10, 2003, 04:01 PM
Originally posted by Abstract
As Dead as Elvis. :cool:

Elvis is dead? MY god. when did it happen?

Vlade
Aug 10, 2003, 04:07 PM
Originally posted by Rezet
OMG. So you got a good 1 gb memory stick for around $40?


40 pounds != 40 dollars

iMook
Aug 10, 2003, 04:34 PM
Vlade: Dude, I do believe 25 pounds ~ 40 bucks.

abdul: OMG! Gimme a link! 1 GB keychain drive for $40?!?! Wow.

Back to the topic at hand...

I think that Zip, at its inception filled a niche that was unique. Namely, it provided high-capacity portable storage. When CD burners came along, Zip was still very useful as a portable rewritable format. But, with the inception of USB keychain drives, ultraportable HDDs, and dirt-cheap CD-Rs, I think Zip's powerful hold on the market it created has been slipping.

Before, Zip was the middle ground between floppies and CDs. Now, we're seeing all of these self-contained (read: plug-and-play, no special readers) devices flooding the market. As USB keychain & portaHDD memory capacities increase and prices drop, I believe that those who used Zip as a convenient file storage solution for shuttling their own files to and fro may ditch Zip.

IMHO, Zip is past its prime, but we can't say that it is dying. In time, USB keychain drives and portaHDDs (and maybe network data archives) will take over Zip's market, but for now, it still occupies a niche filled by no other device.

To think fancifully for a moment, the increasing integration of Bluetooth into portable consumer devices may accelerate Zip's doom, as wireless communication means that isolated storage solutions (like keychain drives and portaHDDs) will become increased connected, and wireless transfers (Bluetooth2? high-speed PANs?)between such devices may replace handing your friend a Zip disk or a CD.

Vlade
Aug 10, 2003, 07:01 PM
Originally posted by iMook
Vlade: Dude, I do believe 25 pounds ~ 40 bucks.


Wow... I'm an idiot, for some reason I thought that the original poster said 40 pounds, not 25. Sorry, My bad:rolleyes:

Anyways... thats a good deal!

BigJayhawk
Aug 10, 2003, 08:02 PM
Originally posted by Rezet
OMG. So you got a good 1 gb memory stick for around $40?
Why don't you back it up and let us see some links.
From What I see is that 512Mbs ThumbDrive costs 200+ bucks. So please....

I use Compact Flash in my Nikon and as a portable drive (with a USB adapter -- firewire also available I think). I love the portability and the ability to use it on PeeCees and Macs.

Some pretty good prices these days too.

$89.99 shipped for 512 MEG (http://dealmac.com/articles/54518.html)

$175.95 shipped for 1 GIG Compact Flash (http://dealmac.com/articles/54503.html)

Rezet
Aug 10, 2003, 08:14 PM
Originally posted by BigJayhawk
I use Compact Flash in my Nikon and as a portable drive (with a USB adapter -- firewire also available I think). I love the portability and the ability to use it on PeeCees and Macs.

Some pretty good prices these days too.

$89.99 shipped for 512 MEG (http://dealmac.com/articles/54518.html)

$175.95 shipped for 1 GIG Compact Flash (http://dealmac.com/articles/54503.html)

Well, it still isnt 40 bucks and it stll isnt a thumbdrive. You still need to buy a "drive" to copy stuff from coputer. And IF other person doesnt have it, you are screwed. WHats good about it?
Link you gave me for $175.95 is actually $229.99 and that is not including a drive. Compare at 750 zip disc at 10 bucks, how is this a good deal?

Powerbook G5
Aug 10, 2003, 08:27 PM
That sounds like a good deal. Back in 1999 I was paying $15 for 100 MB Zip disks and now you are paying $10 for 750 MB disks. I still think Zip drives are useful, too. I have seen them in both my colleges, my sister's college, and at high school. It makes things pretty convenient to stay on the same page as everyone else at school.

LethalWolfe
Aug 11, 2003, 12:40 AM
Originally posted by Rezet
Well, it still isnt 40 bucks and it stll isnt a thumbdrive. You still need to buy a "drive" to copy stuff from coputer. And IF other person doesnt have it, you are screwed. WHats good about it?

I really hope that was a tongue-in-cheek comment. Or at the very least you see the irony. :)

BTW, welcome back to the thread. ;)


Lethal

andrewh
Aug 11, 2003, 02:12 AM
Originally posted by Rezet
Well, nice input everyone. Just to make it clear, I wasn't trying to be defensive, well maybe I was, but It was only to make an argument more fun. I still don't think buying an ipod for file transfer is the best way to go. I don't exclude CD-Rs as they serve many purposes and are useful, but CDRWs are garbage in my opinion. Memory sticks are good i guess, but again, one costs like 200 bucks +. WHat If I need more than 500 MBS? buy another?
External HDDs are still kind of bulky and there is a security thing at my college that wont let it get hook up hdd very easily. So i guess it's out of question.
I'm happy with my zip and no matter what you said wouldn't change my mind because obviously there is tons of bias present here.
I was just interested what people thought of Zips. Why they say zips are dead, and what competes with zips.
I got the answer pretty much I expected all along.

So thanks for your input everyone. I'm off this topic.


Yeah, it sucks realizing you made a bad purchase decision. Don't worry, most of us have done it at one point in our lives. I feel your pain. Well, when your zip breaks, and it will eventually, you can pick up a firefly type HD or the iPod which is a little more bang for your buck. Enjoy using your zip drive. Get your money's worth out of it! Also, many people here have posted their opinions based on experiences. Sorry if you're confusing that with "bias".

andrewh
Aug 11, 2003, 02:42 AM
One last thought. For those that think iPod's are not the way to go... If you do the standard $/megabyte of storage comparison they're not such a bad deal.

30 Gig iPod = 30000 megs for $500

that is the equivalent storage of:

40 750 meg zip disks = 30000 megs
40 zips @ $15 each = $600
PLUS THE COST OF THE DRIVE. ($179.99)

For $280 less you can buy an iPod and whatever portion of it you're not using for data you can throw a couple hundred CD's worth of music and carry it around in your pocket. It's a dual usage device. If anyone thinks that's not a good way to go they are in serious denial.

iJon
Aug 11, 2003, 02:48 AM
Originally posted by andrewh
One last thought. For those that think iPod's are not the way to go... If you do the standard $/megabyte of storage comparison they're not such a bad deal.

30 Gig iPod = 30000 megs for $500

that is the equivalent storage of:

40 750 meg zip disks = 30000 megs
40 zips @ $15 each = $600
PLUS THE COST OF THE DRIVE. ($179.99)

For $280 less you can buy an iPod and whatever portion of it you're not using for data you can throw a couple hundred CD's worth of music and carry it around in your pocket. It's a dual usage device. If anyone thinks that's not a good way to go they are in serious denial.
for people who want small but no ipod i recommend the firefly drives, i think they use the same drive.

iJon

Rezet
Aug 11, 2003, 02:01 PM
Originally posted by andrewh
One last thought. For those that think iPod's are not the way to go... If you do the standard $/megabyte of storage comparison they're not such a bad deal.

30 Gig iPod = 30000 megs for $500

that is the equivalent storage of:

40 750 meg zip disks = 30000 megs
40 zips @ $15 each = $600
PLUS THE COST OF THE DRIVE. ($179.99)

For $280 less you can buy an iPod and whatever portion of it you're not using for data you can throw a couple hundred CD's worth of music and carry it around in your pocket. It's a dual usage device. If anyone thinks that's not a good way to go they are in serious denial.

Yeah, had to comment on the one with flash memory one. Just couldn't resist :)
And as for you, If we are talking about just raw numbers, tnen ofcourse its cheaper to just get external HDD, not ipod.
I can get 80GB Hdd for like 100 bucks. Why get Ipod then hehe.
And you forget important thing. If I pod breaks you are screwed. You will have to cash out another 500 bucks. STOLEN? DROPPED? If Zip disc breaks you have to cash out another 10-15 bucks, as I doubt all "40" discs will break. And I don't need that many, maybe 2-3.
Besides, witch cheap stuff like cds or even zips you dont have to be afraid that you may damage them by doing something like breathing on them or something.
If apple thought iPods were also designed to transfer stuff, they would market it as "that" as well. BUt they only market it as Music player.

andrewh
Aug 11, 2003, 02:18 PM
Originally posted by Rezet
Yeah, had to comment on the one with flash memory one. Just couldn't resist :)
And as for you, If we are talking about just raw numbers, tnen ofcourse its cheaper to just get external HDD, not ipod.
I can get 80GB Hdd for like 100 bucks. Why get Ipod then hehe.
And you forget important thing. If I pod breaks you are screwed. You will have to cash out another 500 bucks. STOLEN? DROPPED? If Zip disc breaks you have to cash out another 10-15 bucks, as I doubt all "40" discs will break. And I don't need that many, maybe 2-3.
Besides, witch cheap stuff like cds or even zips you dont have to be afraid that you may damage them by doing something like breathing on them or something.
If apple thought iPods were also designed to transfer stuff, they would market it as "that" as well. BUt they only market it as Music player.

Yes, good points. The iPod can be kind of flakey -- I'm on my second one already. Started with a 10 gig and got a 30 gig replacement from CompUSA. You're right, you shouldn't use something like that as your only storage of critical data. I'm lucky enough to have mulitple internal hard drives and a Superdrive. The iPod is designed to transfer stuff, it's a standard HD inside it like the firefly. They don't market it that way because they don't want to confuse the marketing and product branding. An MP3 player is sexy, and external HD by itself is not.

I was just using general numbers above. And hey, I didn't mean to attack you personally or anything, just adding to the debate in here. I can't believe the original question could spawn such a long thread. Seriously, your zip will work just fine for you.

Powerbook G5
Aug 11, 2003, 02:22 PM
The iPod thing made me think of that iPod RAID system I remember reading about online a while back...expensive, but how cool is that?

Powerbook G5
Aug 11, 2003, 02:23 PM
How fast is the HD in the iPod, anyway? It seems like it wouldn't be as fast as a normal FW HD would be due to its compact nature, either.

andrewh
Aug 11, 2003, 02:34 PM
Originally posted by Powerbook G5
How fast is the HD in the iPod, anyway? It seems like it wouldn't be as fast as a normal FW HD would be due to its compact nature, either.

I don't know the specs but it's really, really fast. I drag and drop folders with over a gig in them and it copies over in no time. I've never timed it. I wouldn't think it's crippled in any way just because there is mp3 circuitry loading files off of it. Half of the selling feature is fast music transfers and large capacity, and we all know how big MP3 files are. But yeah, the RPM of the disk probably is lower than a full size internal drive. It's definitely fast enough though.

shadowfax
Aug 11, 2003, 02:55 PM
Originally posted by andrewh
I don't know the specs but it's really, really fast. I drag and drop folders with over a gig in them and it copies over in no time. I've never timed it. I wouldn't think it's crippled in any way just because there is mp3 circuitry loading files off of it. Half of the selling feature is fast music transfers and large capacity, and we all know how big MP3 files are. But yeah, the RPM of the disk probably is lower than a full size internal drive. It's definitely fast enough though. yes, i bet those platters have a higher density than my powerbook's hard drive, which itself runs at 4200 rpms but still outperforms many 5400 rpm drives because of the increased density of info. i would expect the iPod to aactually spin at less than 4200 rpm, but i bet the density of data on the platters makes up for a lot of it.

macphoria
Aug 11, 2003, 03:19 PM
Since we are talking about HD and data storage, check out this article about HD development.

http://news.com.com/2100-1008_3-5061923.html?tag=fd_top

Vlade
Aug 11, 2003, 06:37 PM
Originally posted by Powerbook G5
How fast is the HD in the iPod, anyway? It seems like it wouldn't be as fast as a normal FW HD would be due to its compact nature, either.

I think its about 40% the speed of a normal hard drive, i'm not 100% sure though.

G5orbust
Aug 11, 2003, 06:53 PM
I believe the ipod HD rotates at 3400 RPM, though Im not positive.

Mudbug
Aug 11, 2003, 07:20 PM
wow this thread veered off topic...

I haven't used a ZIP disk in at least 2 years, maybe longer. With the installation of a CD burner in the office, I have eliminated both Zip disks and floppies with one device, with 6x the storage space of a zip at around the cost per disk of a floppy (which I threw away at will anyway). In terms of business and sending files out to different places, most of which wouldn't bother to return the zips, the CD's are immeasureably cheaper to use. And if the data transfer to the CD screws up, you just burn another, instead of running out and getting another $10 disk when the store is open.

Like I said - 2 years, maybe more. Anyone want to buy used Zip disks cheap? I'll reformat...

Powerbook G5
Aug 11, 2003, 08:10 PM
Well, Zip may not be dead quite yet, but I believe this thread basically is... :)

abdul
Aug 12, 2003, 06:01 AM
Originally posted by Rezet
OMG. So you got a good 1 gb memory stick for around $40?
Why don't you back it up and let us see some links.
From What I see is that 512Mbs ThumbDrive costs 200+ bucks. So please....
just sent him an email asking, will let you know where he got it from or if he exaggerated it.

dxp4acu
Aug 12, 2003, 08:27 AM
I would get an iPod. It is an easy to use portable hard drive that can go just about any where.
Zips can RIP.

vollspacken
Aug 12, 2003, 12:00 PM
for ME, Zip is not dying...

why, well I use Zip100 disks to transfer .wav-files and midi-stuff from my powerbook to my Akai MPC-sampler and back.

I actually use an Iomega Mac SCSI-Zip 100 drive hooked up to the MPC and an Iomega USB-Zip 250 drive (PC or Mac, I don't know...) hooked up to the titanium... works well and is much better than an heavy external SCSI hard disk (and less hazzle!)

I have tons of Zip-disks and sometimes friends of mine give me some of theirs (they: "I don't need that stuff anymore..." me:"well, I sure can use them..!")

comes very handy when you want to keep your samples in order...

the SCSI-Zip might even work on my SE/30, but I haven't tried yet...

vSpacken